- Original Message -
From: "frank theriault"
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
You'd think he would believe in subsidies, living in Quebec and
all.
He's been pretty quiet on the subject.
William Robb
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 09:16:10 -0600, William Robb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> You mean they are SUBSIDIZING a product line with something else?
> For shame.
> Cave boy will be singing another tune pretty quick now.
> He doesn't believe in subsidies.
You'd think he would believe in subsidies, l
From: "John Francis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sam Jost mused:
Yup, some just have too much money. This had been a question in a local
pentax forum a few days ago, too, someone who asked if the *istD could
not
show a live preview.
Indeed. I'm sure it's going to be a common question from first-time
DSL
; From: "Rob Brigham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 7:17 PM
> Subject: RE: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
>
>
> > Read this:
> > http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/read_opinion_text.asp?prodkey=canon_eos2
> > 0d&opinion=23637
> >
> > Har!
>
He'll have the same problem with the Nikon to.
LOL
Dave
> - Original Message -
> From: "Rob Brigham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 7:17 PM
> Subject: RE:
A case of the brain drain, his brain is draining...
Rob Brigham wrote:
Read this:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/read_opinion_text.asp?prodkey=canon_eos2
0d&opinion=23637
Har!
--
I can understand why mankind hasn't given up war.
During a war you get to drive tanks through the sides of buildin
ernet shop who was way cheaper and knew a lot more about
what he sold.
Sam
- Original Message -
From: "Rob Brigham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 7:17 PM
Subject: RE: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D br
ROTFLMAO
Shel
> [Original Message]
> From: Rob Brigham <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Read this:
>
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/read_opinion_text.asp?prodkey=canon_eos20d&o
pinion=23637
Read this:
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/read_opinion_text.asp?prodkey=canon_eos2
0d&opinion=23637
Har!
' ie (be)(spoke).
-Original Message-
From: Doug Franklin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 12 November 2004 00:34
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OT: Bespoke (was RE: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief
comparison)
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 16:08:52 -, Rob Brigham wrote:
> [...] f
-
Fra: Doug Franklin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sendt: 12. november 2004 01:34
Til: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Emne: OT: Bespoke (was RE: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief
comparison)
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 16:08:52 -, Rob Brigham wrote:
> [...] felt like it was bespoke built for me [...]
Ok, t
I guess it all comes down to whether you believe the manufacturers
define the marketplace, or whether they design what they can sell.
There's more than a little truth on both sides, of course.
I don't recall there ever being a shortage of products aimed at a
lower price point than those from the
Caveman wrote:
Peter J. Alling wrote:
The Pentax cameras feel like quality devices, weather they are or not
may be another story.
Alan Chan knows.
;-)
Alan is the unluckiest man in the world...
--
I can understand why mankind hasn't given up war.
During a war you get to drive tanks through the
I don't know how to say this any more politely, but someone who owns a
80-200 f2.8 auto focus lens
is hardly a typical SLR user let alone a typical photographer, (in the
broadest sense of the word). Sure
Canon's best equipment is world beating but most people can only aspire
to such lofty heigh
Peter J. Alling wrote:
The Pentax cameras feel like quality
devices, weather they are or not may be another story.
Alan Chan knows.
;-)
- Original Message -
From: "John Francis"
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Do they fund this by selling cheap junk to the masses? Sure.
And why not? If this means they can make top-of-the-line stuff
like the L-series lenses and the 1Ds II
HGP> At the risk of starting a heated discussion (really really please that's
HGP> not what I want!!), it seems to me that most people on this list that
HGP> talk about going to the "dark side" use that phrase to mean "switch to
HGP> Canon". Is there any particular reason that there's not as much
> On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:40:35 -0500,
Chris
Brogden said>
> The D2H is still only a 1.5x. Most Canons are 1.6x, though. To be
> fair, the D2H wasn't designed to produce extremely high quality
> images; that's what the D100 and D1X were for. The D2H gave
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OT: Bespoke (was RE: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief
comparison)
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 16:08:52 -, Rob Brigham wrote:
> [...] felt like it was bespoke built for me [...]
Ok, this is probably one of those "American English versus H.M.
English&q
On 12/11/04, Bob W, discombobulated, unleashed:
>Yes. It means made to measure. We also use it when we're talking about
>software that's developed especially for the customer, as opposed to
>so-called COTS - commercial off-the-shelf - software.
Oi!
Cheers,
Cotty
___/\__
|| (O) | Pe
Peter J. Alling mused:
>
> Canon's R&D is no better than anyone elses. Pentax quiet likely has
> just as many or more imaging patents. Canon can bring more products to
> market weather there is a need for them or not. Some are truely
> superior products, but I've felt they were inferior sinc
Rob Studdert wrote:
On 12 Nov 2004 at 1:11, Peter J. Alling wrote:
Canon's R&D is no better than anyone elses. Pentax quiet likely has
just as many or more imaging patents. Canon can bring more products to
market weather there is a need for them or not. Some are truely
superior products,
On 12 Nov 2004 at 1:11, Peter J. Alling wrote:
> Canon's R&D is no better than anyone elses. Pentax quiet likely has
> just as many or more imaging patents. Canon can bring more products to
> market weather there is a need for them or not. Some are truely
> superior products, but I've felt t
Canon's R&D is no better than anyone elses. Pentax quiet likely has
just as many or more imaging patents. Canon can bring more products to
market weather there is a need for them or not. Some are truely
superior products, but I've felt they were inferior since the days of
the AE1, they were
Unlike their competitors, they decided that with a fastly changing
technology there should be some serious money spent in R&D. It's a
moving target game and it's Canon who ownz it.
Peter J. Alling wrote:
Canon is the Evil empire,
, 2004 5:05 PM
Subject: FW: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
I'm so thankful that not all manufacturers are following this
"tiny" trend. The *istD felt way to light to me as well as to
small to get my hands around. The 20D fit's my hands well in
this
FWIW, i think the *istD is too large, even without the battery grip.
Herb...
- Original Message -
From: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "[EMAIL PROTECTED] Net" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 5:05 PM
Subject: FW: Over to the Dark side
Um. Ok, you win, I got nuthin...
Bob W wrote:
Hi,
Them wimpie Canadians wouldn't know how to spank someone...
I heard they like to spank their monkeys though.
--
I can understand why mankind hasn't given up war.
During a war you get to drive tanks through the sides of buildings
and s
Hi,
> Them wimpie Canadians wouldn't know how to spank someone...
I heard they like to spank their monkeys though.
--
Cheers,
Bob
Remember a Canadian spank is only about 62% of an American spank - they're
into metric remember.
Kenneth Waller
- Original Message -
From: "Doug Franklin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:44 PM
Subject: Re: Over
Hi,
> Ok, this is probably one of those "American English versus H.M.
> English" things. I've seen the term "bespoke" used in this way before,
> usually in reference to clothes. It has always sounded like it means
> something along the lines of "custom tailored". But I've never found
> an (Amer
I'd like to see that...
Mark Roberts wrote:
Cotty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On 11/11/04, Mark Roberts, discombobulated, unleashed:
When Canon announced the 1D-II I was sorely tempted. 8 megapixels is
very attractive and I'd settle for the 1.3x FOV crop over full-frame,
considering the pric
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 21:58:49 +, Cotty wrote:
> Is that the North American Spank or the full-on Canadian spank?
So the Canadians finally did secede from North America? :-)
TTYL, DougF KG4LMZ
Them wimpie Canadians wouldn't know how to spank someone...
Cotty wrote:
I think the *ist D is a beautiful and well-crafted piece of kit.
But am I
the only one on the planet who doesn't like it's small size? I love
the
weight and size of bigger bodies. (cue WW)
On 11/11/04, William Rob
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 16:08:52 -, Rob Brigham wrote:
> [...] felt like it was bespoke built for me [...]
Ok, this is probably one of those "American English versus H.M.
English" things. I've seen the term "bespoke" used in this way before,
usually in reference to clothes. It has always sounde
Comments in text
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Ryan Lee [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 10:46 AM
> > To: PDML
> > Subject: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
> >
> >
> > So, time
On Nov 11, 2004, at 6:37 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I think your right here.
Nikon sems to have a bad customer service attitude(which i just found
out myself)and Canon
seems to
have a more owner friendly attitude to comments on the products.
Also i think Canon stands out more in public,with thos
Cotty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>On 11/11/04, Mark Roberts, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>When Canon announced the 1D-II I was sorely tempted. 8 megapixels is
>>very attractive and I'd settle for the 1.3x FOV crop over full-frame,
>>considering the price difference. But thing's simply too enorm
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:40:35 -0500, Mark Roberts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> "Peter J. Alling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >Canon is the Evil empire, they are cleaning Nikon's clock, eating their
> >lunch, kicking Nikon's dog, (I seem to have run out of inappropriate
> >metaphors, oh well).
>
"Peter J. Alling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Canon is the Evil empire, they are cleaning Nikon's clock, eating their
>lunch, kicking Nikon's dog, (I seem to have run out of inappropriate
>metaphors, oh well).
Metaphors or no, you've got it right. I've tried out a D2h and it's
certainly a wonde
>> I think the *ist D is a beautiful and well-crafted piece of kit.
>> But am I
>> the only one on the planet who doesn't like it's small size? I love
>> the
>> weight and size of bigger bodies. (cue WW)
On 11/11/04, William Robb, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>You probably like getting span
- Original Message -
From: "Cotty"
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
I think the *ist D is a beautiful and well-crafted piece of kit.
But am I
the only one on the planet who doesn't like it's small size? I love
the
weight and s
On 11/11/04, Peter J. Alling, discombobulated, unleashed:
>I suppose you're right in the strictly Judeo-Christian sense, but I
>think Cotty expressed my nuance in his post...
Just call me Bealzebub.
Cheers,
Cotty
___/\__
|| (O) | People, Places, Pastiche
||=|http://www.co
On 11/11/04, Mark Roberts, discombobulated, unleashed:
>When Canon announced the 1D-II I was sorely tempted. 8 megapixels is
>very attractive and I'd settle for the 1.3x FOV crop over full-frame,
>considering the price difference. But thing's simply too enormous for me
>to even consider it. This m
Tom C wrote:
You apparently possess faith that your belief is correct. :)
Funny how that works, isn't it. We're both right, absent contrary
proof. Meanwhile, we're both happy!
Best wishes, keith
Tom C.
However, if you choose to cling to that belief, it's a perfectly
innocuous creed and ce
You apparently possess faith that your belief is correct. :)
Tom C.
However, if you choose to cling to that belief, it's a perfectly innocuous
creed and certainly acceptable to everyone.
Best,
keith whaley
OTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2004 11:52:14 -0500
God has nothing to do with it...
Tom C wrote:
Yep... you've gone over. :)
May God rest his soul.
Tom C.
From: "Ryan Le
ot;Peter J. Alling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2004 11:52:14 -0500
God has nothing to do with it...
Tom C wrote:
Yep... you've gone over. :)
May God rest his soul.
Tom C.
Oh silly me... I thought God had something to do with just about
everything... indirectly at least. :)
Tom C.
From: "Peter J. Alling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Date:
.. please, no Canon vs. Pentax vs. Nikon and all possible
permutations thereof flamewar!
-Original Message-
From: Mark Roberts [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:02 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Th
> Pentax seems to put such emphasis on
> design and ergonomics, and my personal opinion is that in these areas,
> Nikon stands out compared to Canon.
>
> Just wondering... please, no Canon vs. Pentax vs. Nikon and all possible
> permutations thereof flamewar
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004, Haynes, Grady (PPC) wrote:
> At the risk of starting a heated discussion (really really please that's
> not what I want!!), it seems to me that most people on this list that
> talk about going to the "dark side" use that phrase to mean "switch to
> Canon". Is there any partic
Original Message-
From: Mark Roberts [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:02 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Ryan.
I too have toyed with the idea of going over to the d
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Ryan.
I too have toyed with the idea of going over to the dark side. Oddly
enough, what's stopped me from doing so has been the relative size and
weight differences between Pentax and Canon offerings. Any of the
unfortunate souls who accompanied me on my "short, ea
God has nothing to do with it...
Tom C wrote:
Yep... you've gone over. :)
May God rest his soul.
Tom C.
From: "Ryan Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Date
Butch Black wrote:
Previously, Ryan wrote:
So, time to make the announcement. After returning my ist D, I now find
myself with a C***n 20D, 17-85 f4-5.6IS USM, a 580EX speedlite, a BG-E2
battery grip, an E1 hand strap, an extra battery and a B+W MRC UV filter.
I miss my kidneys.
One
t they don't sell as well. It's all in
the marketing..
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:55 PM
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
> With the battery grip
OTECTED]
Sent: 11 November 2004 15:45
To: pentax list
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
On 11/11/04, Ryan Lee, discombobulated, unleashed:
>I completely agree with you about feels and looks; the ist D is a
gorgeous
>little thing, and it's not too shabby
With the battery grip attached, the *istD is a nice size for me. Without the
grip, it's too small for real work, but perfect for social affairs.
Paul
> On 11/11/04, Ryan Lee, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
> >I completely agree with you about feels and looks; the ist D is a gorgeous
> >little th
On 11/11/04, Tom C, discombobulated, unleashed:
>May God rest his soul.
He'll be joining me and one or two others in the Howling Hells mate, you
better believe it.
Cheers,
Cotty
___/\__
|| (O) | People, Places, Pastiche
||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com
___
Yep... you've gone over. :)
May God rest his soul.
Tom C.
From: "Ryan Lee" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2004 23:41:44 +0800
Well Tom, i
On 11/11/04, Ryan Lee, discombobulated, unleashed:
>I completely agree with you about feels and looks; the ist D is a gorgeous
>little thing, and it's not too shabby specwise either. However, I'm not
>deeply invested in Pentax glass, and my love affair is more with the mz5n or
>the mz3 bodies (sam
ROFL! It's so true :-( I've limited myself to one ice cube a day!
Cheers,
Ryan
- Original Message -
From: "Butch Black" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side
decently close to film
quality) 2 extra megapixels- all bonuses :-)
Cheers,
Ryan
- Original Message -
From: "Tom C" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 1:44 PM
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
the country soon, which more or less makes it more
awkward for them if they wanted to hold their position.
Cheers,
Ryan
- Original Message -
From: "William Robb" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:55 AM
Subject: Re: Ove
Paul Stenquist wrote on 11/11/2004, 6:17 AM:
> My first *istD didn't work, and B&H replaced it with a new camera, no
> questions asked. However, they did require that it be returned in the
> original box Pentax with all the packing material.
> On Nov 10, 2004, at 10:55 PM, William Robb wrote
Previously, Ryan wrote:
>So, time to make the announcement. After returning my ist D, I now find
> >myself with a C***n 20D, 17-85 f4-5.6IS USM, a 580EX speedlite, a BG-E2
> >battery grip, an E1 hand strap, an extra battery and a B+W MRC UV filter.
I miss my kidneys.
One question. Why? Please answ
n Lee"
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Or perhaps because CR Kennedy had one of my ist D's for a month, 7
days
after I bought it,
That's amazing.
In Canada, the customer would make a case to the seller that the
product sold was not suited to the
Comments in text
> -Original Message-
> From: Ryan Lee [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 10:46 AM
> To: PDML
> Subject: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
>
>
> So, time to make the announcement. After returning my is
a tool that fits my hands and mindset.
Just my 2 cents.
Tom C.
From: "William Robb" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2004 21:55:00 -0600
- Orig
- Original Message -
From: "Ryan Lee"
Subject: Re: Over to the Dark side.. ist D vs 20D brief comparison
Or perhaps because CR Kennedy had one of my ist D's for a month, 7
days
after I bought it,
That's amazing.
In Canada, the customer would make a case to the sell
> >So, time to make the announcement. After returning my ist D, I now find
> >myself with a C***n 20D, 17-85 f4-5.6IS USM, a 580EX speedlite, a BG-E2
> >battery grip, an E1 hand strap, an extra battery and a B+W MRC UV filter.
I
> >miss my kidneys.
>
> One question. Why? Please answer truthfully.
--- Ryan Lee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Anyway, having had a chance to play with both, here
> are some comparisons.
>
> 1. The most obvious one, I miss the sleekness of the
> tiny ist D (even with a
> grip) holding the 20D and grip. It's chunky. A
> monstrous monstrosity. And no
> matter wh
On 10/11/04, Ryan Lee, discombobulated, unleashed:
>So, time to make the announcement. After returning my ist D, I now find
>myself with a C***n 20D, 17-85 f4-5.6IS USM, a 580EX speedlite, a BG-E2
>battery grip, an E1 hand strap, an extra battery and a B+W MRC UV filter. I
>miss my kidneys.
One q
Very interesting, Ryan. Thanks for posting. As much as I hate to admit it,
the 20D sure looks attractive on paper, but that has to be balanced against
real world experience.
t
On 11/10/04 7:45, Ryan Lee wrote:
> So, time to make the announcement. After returning my ist D, I now find
> myself wi
So, time to make the announcement. After returning my ist D, I now find
myself with a C***n 20D, 17-85 f4-5.6IS USM, a 580EX speedlite, a BG-E2
battery grip, an E1 hand strap, an extra battery and a B+W MRC UV filter. I
miss my kidneys.
Anyway, having had a chance to play with both, here are some
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