Sterling Hughes wrote:
In what country can you walk onto the floor of the congress
(parliament) without sponsorship?
OTOH in which country do you *trust* your parliament?
--
Six Offene Systeme GmbH http://www.six.de/
i.A. Hartmut Holzgraefe Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel.:
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one of those generated a 5 email thread about not
posting to wrong mailing list. (counting this one :)
So I suggest we finally make this list MODERATED.
--Jani
--
PHP Development Mailing List
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Jani Taskinen wrote:
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one of those generated a 5 email thread about not
posting to wrong mailing list. (counting this one :)
So I suggest we finally make this list MODERATED.
+1
I think this is just a bad day :)
Andrey
- Original Message -
From: Jani Taskinen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 6:59 PM
Subject: [PHP-DEV] Moderate PHP-DEV
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Jani Taskinen wrote:
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one of those generated a 5 email thread about not
posting to wrong mailing list. (counting this one :)
So I suggest we finally make this list MODERATED.
-1.
On Wed, 2003-03-12 at 12:01, Derick Rethans wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Jani Taskinen wrote:
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one of those generated a 5 email thread about not
posting to wrong mailing list. (counting this one :)
wrote:
I think this is just a bad day :)
Andrey
- Original Message -
From: Jani Taskinen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 6:59 PM
Subject: [PHP-DEV] Moderate PHP-DEV
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one
| -1.
|
| The list could be renamed so that it is less confusing for
| newbie PHP developers.
|
| - Sascha
I agree.
Brian.
dealnews.com
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PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:07 PM
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Moderate PHP-DEV
It was a 7 hour period. And not only today,
this happens daily. (maybe not in this scale)
For me, even 1 OT email is too much.
(But it's propably just me
be the change of the list name is good idea.
For a day or two? :)
--Jani
Andrey
- Original Message -
From: Jani Taskinen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Andrey Hristov [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 7:07 PM
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Moderate PHP-DEV
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
The list could be renamed so that it is less confusing for
newbie PHP developers.
What is confusing with this description?
Internals list
A medium volume list for those who want to help out with the development
of PHP
(from
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Jani Taskinen wrote:
It was a 7 hour period. And not only today,
this happens daily. (maybe not in this scale)
For me, even 1 OT email is too much.
(But it's propably just me, who is stupid enough to read
EVERY email coming here.)
I'm so
if even that description doesn't work, then nothing would work, not even
changing the name.
Well, it is obvious that some folks don't read that
description and simply move forward, because php-dev sounds
about right. They are PHP developers and so a list called
php-dev makes
On Wednesday, March 12, 2003 12:41 PM, Derick Rethans wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
The list could be renamed so that it is less confusing for
newbie PHP developers.
What is confusing with this description?
Internals list
A medium volume list for those who
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
if even that description doesn't work, then nothing would work, not even
changing the name.
Well, it is obvious that some folks don't read that
description and simply move forward, because php-dev sounds
about right. They are PHP
php-dev-team might lose a few..
- Original Message -
From: Sascha Schumann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Derick Rethans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: Jani Taskinen [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 5:46 PM
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Moderate PHP-DEV
if even
Let's ask the mysql guys, they did change the name too. (I think that we
atleast agree that the noise is annoying, right?)
Not really. Maybe I'm more used to skipping noise.
- Sascha
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PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/
To unsubscribe, visit:
Hi,
Derick Rethans wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
if even that description doesn't work, then nothing would work, not even
changing the name.
Well, it is obvious that some folks don't read that
description and simply move forward, because php-dev sounds
about right.
Sascha Schumann wrote:
if even that description doesn't work, then nothing would work, not even
changing the name.
Well, it is obvious that some folks don't read that
description and simply move forward, because php-dev sounds
about right. They are PHP developers and so a list
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Shane Caraveo wrote:
Aside from renaming the php-dev list, we should remove the 'PHP and Zend
Engine internals lists' from the regular mailing list page, put them in
a 'developers' section (name isn't important) that describes cvs access,
dev email lists, how to build
A couple thoughts
Aside from renaming the php-dev list, we should remove the 'PHP and
Zend
Engine internals lists' from the regular mailing list page, put them
in
a 'developers' section (name isn't important) that describes cvs
access,
dev email lists, how to build (ie. win32 libraries),
Aside from renaming the php-dev list, we should remove the 'PHP and Zend
[snip]
Sounds good.
Then another item that might be considered if it is not already done,
allowing posts only from those that have cvs access. A second
conditional list of allowed posters can be added that are
I propose a rename to php.c-internals.dev
This leaves no confusion, it is about developing in C and C++ the
language of PHP.
I think restricting to those with cvs accounts is not the best solution.
It excludes first-time users who have a useful patch from posting a
message.
Regards,
Greg
Then another item that might be considered if it is not already done,
allowing posts only from those that have cvs access. A second
conditional list of allowed posters can be added that are people who do
not have cvs access, but we want to allow to post. Otherwise, the list
can be
On Wed, 2003-03-12 at 12:50, Sascha Schumann wrote:
Let's ask the mysql guys, they did change the name too. (I think that we
atleast agree that the noise is annoying, right?)
Not really. Maybe I'm more used to skipping noise.
*exactly* my point btw. We skip noise, skip noise, skip
At 18:50 12.03.2003, Steph wrote:
php-dev-team might lose a few..
...think f..ing hard..read.oh php-dev-team...thinkCOOL, they solve my
problem, i'm getting better at it and finally a team member COOL
what ever name we give this list draws attention to newbies as long as it
contains the
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sterling Hughes wrote:
It doesn't. They are free to send the mail to whomever they like, even
put up a website with their ideas. They are not censured, they are
restricted. In what country can you walk onto the floor of the congress
(parliament) without sponsorship?
A couple thoughts
Aside from renaming the php-dev list, we should remove the 'PHP and Zend
Engine internals lists' from the regular mailing list page, put them in a
'developers' section (name isn't important) that describes cvs access, dev
email lists, how to build (ie. win32 libraries),
So how about a first post response system, similar to the subscription
response. That first post would not actually be posted to the email
list, but rather an email would be sent back to the poster stating the
purpose of the email list, and what kind of materials are expected on
the list.
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 10:47:27 -0800
Shane Caraveo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
So how about a first post response system, similar to the subscription
response. That first post would not actually be posted to the email
list, but rather an email would be sent back to the poster stating the
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Magnus [ISO-8859-1] M ![ISO-8859-1] gnus X^B wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 10:47:27 -0800
Shane Caraveo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
So how about a first post response system, similar to the subscription
response. That first post would not actually be posted to the email
This worries me somewhat. I do not have a CVS account. I do not
actively develop and contribute to the PHP sourcecode right now,
however my company uses php very very much. I would like to keep up to
date on what is happening with the development team and figuring out
what directions they are
snip
If the post does not match this criteria, please send it to
on of the other lists, otherwise respond to this email and your
original
message will go out.
And they would probably not read it, just read the part how to get the
email
to the list. They don't read the comment what purpose
On Wed, 2003-03-12 at 14:00, Weston Houghton wrote:
This worries me somewhat. I do not have a CVS account. I do not
actively develop and contribute to the PHP sourcecode right now,
however my company uses php very very much. I would like to keep up to
date on what is happening with the
This worries me somewhat. I do not have a CVS account. I do not
actively develop and contribute to the PHP sourcecode right now,
however my company uses php very very much. I would like to keep up to
date on what is happening with the development team and figuring out
what directions they are
A secondary followup, as I do work on php extensions, I do think that
questions regarding those would fall to this list, but again might not
require a cvs account?
Just playing Devil's Advocate to some extent here.
Wes
On Wednesday, March 12, 2003, at 01:45 PM, Sterling Hughes wrote:
On
Shane Caraveo wrote:
Then another item that might be considered if it is not already done,
allowing posts only from those that have cvs access. A second
conditional list of allowed posters can be added that are people who
do not have cvs access, but we want to allow to post. Otherwise, the
Yes, because getting a cvs account is just *s* hard.
The problem is that you easily lose valuable postings when
you force people to go through some restrictive system.
I'm especially worried about inter-group communication. E.g.
where php-dev is involved in a discussion
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Shane Caraveo wrote:
But for the sake of writing...here's another idea.
So how about a first post response system, similar to the subscription
response. That first post would not actually be posted to the email
list, but rather an email would be sent back to the
At 20:00 12.03.2003, Weston Houghton wrote:
This worries me somewhat. I do not have a CVS account. I do not actively
develop and contribute to the PHP sourcecode right now, however my company
uses php very very much. I would like to keep up to date on what is
happening with the development
You lose:
You lose time for implementing and maintaining this system,
and you lose time for moderating emails. You also reduce the
incentive to contribute.
Again, let's take the less intrusive steps first and leave
the heavy handed ones as a last resort.
- Sascha
--
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
You lose:
You lose time for implementing and maintaining this system,
and you lose time for moderating emails. You also reduce the
incentive to contribute.
I lose time to reply to them now too and copy and pasting my stuff, I
lose
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 20:14:03 +0100 (CET)
Derick Rethans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Instead of this it might be a better idea to make somebody's first post
moderated, after it has been approved the poster is added to the allow
list, if not he gets back a message like I copypaste everytime now
We'll see who reads this, any responses are welcome.
I see a few different issues here:
1) People who want answers for a php-general message post it to the
development forum. This is clearly because they do not understand the
difference, as I doubt anyone wants to waste their own time posting a
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 15:31:56 -0500, John Coggeshall wrote:
In
any case, moderating this list would end up completely alientating
everyone but those who are significant developers.
I agree, I think changing the name is the way to go, and to remove it from
the public mailing lists (or put it
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
Yes, because getting a cvs account is just *s* hard.
The problem is that you easily lose valuable postings when
you force people to go through some restrictive system.
I'm especially worried about inter-group communication.
On Wednesday 12 March 2003 17:59, Jani Taskinen wrote:
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one of those generated a 5 email thread about not
posting to wrong mailing list. (counting this one :)
So I suggest we finally make this list MODERATED.
Aside from renaming the php-dev list, we should remove the 'PHP and
Zend
Engine internals lists' from the regular mailing list page, put them
in
a 'developers' section (name isn't important) that describes cvs
access,
dev email lists, how to build (ie. win32 libraries), etc.
As a newbie
This discussion itself is creating more spam than those emails people send.
I agree with Sascha that we shouldn't take drastic measures. We still want
to make it easy for people to join the PHP developer's community.
I think the most interesting idea so far was Shane's first post response
After reading all the comments, I came to conclusion that
we will do the following compromise:
1. Rename the list to php-group
2. Separate the list entries in mailing-lists.php [DONE!]
3. Apply the same system as is in use for
our @php.net addresses for
Jani,
1. Rename the list to php-group
bad name for obvious reasons. Georg's suggestion of
internals sounds ok to me. Or hackers from the FreeBSD
community.
2. Separate the list entries in mailing-lists.php [DONE!]
3. Apply the same system as is in use for
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
Jani,
1. Rename the list to php-group
bad name for obvious reasons. Georg's suggestion of
internals sounds ok to me. Or hackers from the FreeBSD
community.
internals,hackers,whatever, as long as it's not php-dev. :)
I wouldn't consider 3rd one that drastic.
It has worked very well for me, I haven't got any spam
to my php.net addy, but people who really wanted to send me
email got through..
Well, maybe I am an exception, but I usually don't bother to
register myself anywhere,
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 23:44:20 +0200 (EET), Jani Taskinen wrote:
1. Rename the list to php-group
And the newsgroup? since lots of the spam comes from NNTP directly, I would
think(?)
--
Tom Sommer, denmark
www.tsn.dk - www.dreamcoder.dk
--
PHP Development Mailing List http://www.php.net/
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Sascha Schumann wrote:
I wouldn't consider 3rd one that drastic.
It has worked very well for me, I haven't got any spam
to my php.net addy, but people who really wanted to send me
email got through..
Well, maybe I am an exception, but I usually don't
At 11:01 PM 3/12/2003 +0100, Sascha Schumann wrote:
I wouldn't consider 3rd one that drastic.
It has worked very well for me, I haven't got any spam
to my php.net addy, but people who really wanted to send me
email got through..
Well, maybe I am an exception, but I usually
We don't lose anything by giving the first two items some
time to prove their usefullness. On the other hand, it is
very likely that we will lose useful input, if we implement
the third item prematurely.
I disagree. Anyone here can handle replying because we already have
On Thu, 13 Mar 2003, Andi Gutmans wrote:
At 11:01 PM 3/12/2003 +0100, Sascha Schumann wrote:
I wouldn't consider 3rd one that drastic.
It has worked very well for me, I haven't got any spam
to my php.net addy, but people who really wanted to send me
email got
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Tom Sommer wrote:
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003 23:44:20 +0200 (EET), Jani Taskinen wrote:
1. Rename the list to php-group
And the newsgroup? since lots of the spam comes from NNTP directly, I would
think(?)
Some does, but not a lot.
Derick
--
I think, on web page is bad text. User's don't know if is it for PHP
developers or about _PHP_ developers..
Jan
On Wed, 12 Mar 2003, Jani Taskinen wrote:
Of about 20 emails today, 6 were posted to wrong mailing
list. And one of those
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