That's what I was thinking. Isn't a Grand Slam usually four events?
Alan
From: magpie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: magpie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Mike Prizy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Track List
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: t-and-f: [Fwd: Press Release: El Mouaziz to Challenge
Khannouchi]
Dat
riginalArrivalTime: 09 Jul 2003 19:07:54.0656 (UTC)
FILETIME=[66BC7A00:01C3464D]
and, more relevant (among men), so did Steve Jones
-Original Message-
From: Jim Gerweck [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, July 09, 2003 2:15 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: [Fwd:
Drugs and our sport:
If drug scandal's have taken fans away from this sport it is because we let
them. Pro baseball, football, etc don't have drug scandals (aside from the
recreational use of cocaine) because the governing bodies simply don't care
what their athletes are on as long as money kee
What other "boring" sports are popular in the US? Cycling: Only the TdF and
only because people want to see Lance succeed. Take away Lance and the TdF
and cycling in general would fade quickly in popularity. Golf: Tiger Woods.
People want to see him beat everyone and run away with the record boo
Can I join the betting pool?
When someone closes in :25 or 12:57 it has little to do with pure speed.
It's all about slowing down the least. Let's say a normal elite runner can
run a 10k race going through the 5k mark 5% slower than his/her all out 5k.
How would you train in order to drop that
Mike, a lot of Americans are doing this. Check out Rod Dehaven's log:
www.allsportrunning.com/rodscorner. Check out the Hanson's Runners and
their training: http://www.hansons-running.com/ecom/sp/cat=Training+Log I
don't think it has been shown anywhere that the top US runners are running a
as much as I should
have (Coach Hadsell... if you're out there... here's a shout-out). He
would have us do a hill workout one day followed by a tempo the next and
fartleks on the 3rd. I thought I was being over-trained. Turns out I was
just a wimp.
M
From: "alan tobin"
h an oxygen debt headache, and wiped out for 2
days.
If you can do 10x200 every day, you're not doing 10x200 correctly. I'll
never forget the 12x200 in 25 I did on the indoor track at Columbia. Damn
thing nearly killed me.
M
From: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
T
t in there I believe as well. After the five
days hard, they'd take 1-2 days easy and then start again. They did this
for 10 weeks or so and several people got huge marathon PR's.
- Ed
- Original Message -
From: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL P
D94]
Alan -
My understanding was that they did those four workouts in five days,
they
called it "survive the five"
- Ed Parrot
- Original Message -
From: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday,
Mike. I've done both. Less recovery is MUCH harder. You might run it like a
fartlek, but the way I ran it was 200 meters in around :32 100 meters slow
slow jog. The workout with 200 meter recover was 200 meters in about :28-30
with 200 meters slow slow jog. My best 200 is a flying start high :26
was banned from pro cycling for providing
drugs to athletes." I believe John is talking about Dr. Gabriele Rosa, an
Italian
sports medicine specialist who coaches a large number of athletes, mainly
Kenyans, under the sponsorship of Fila. I've defended Rosa against doping
accusations
God forbid a record not be in line with mathematic lab rat equations.
Alan
From: "Tom Derderian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: "Tom Derderian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Post, Marty" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'[EMAIL PROTECTED] uoregon.
edu' \(E-mail\)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: t-and-f: 'so
Curiousanyone ever think that maybe the marathon record has always been
behind the prediction equations? What does that say?
Alan
From: "edndana" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: "edndana" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "\"Athletics\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: t-and-f: 'soft' marathon record
Why would we Mike? It's not like there is a lot of money at stake or that
other sports are filled with cheats. In my world the sky is always clear and
people help old ladies cross the street.
Alan
From: Mike Prizy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Mike Prizy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Michael Contopou
track and field and road
racing has enough money in it that many people will cheat to win that money.
Alan
From: Mike Prizy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: alan tobin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: Lgat's B
No one is saying you have cheat to be good. You only have to cheat to win.
Big difference.
Alan
From: "Andrew Owusu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'alan tobin'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: <[EM
an behind
the curtain if you still at the front door.
Alan
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Andrew Owusu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,"'alan tobin'"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
S
an opinion. It just
makes it easier to accept when the ax comes crashing down. Carl freakin
Lewis was dirty for christs sakes. Isn't he the saint of US track and field?
Alan
From: "Conway Hill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: "Conway Hill" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"Neither Bernard nor Coach Li nor I knew much about EPO testing when all
this
happened. "
That's total and complete bullshit. If you're at the top of the distance
running game then it is one of your responsibilities to know about testing
procedures especially if you're an agent or manager. Plea
>Sprinters and throwers are dirtier than distance runners.
Probably true in the United States.
If American distance runners are doping, they ought to sue
their pharmacist for malpractice.
RT
Also, it goes back to my original statement about the lack of top level US
distance runners. In the world
In those same studies a similar question was asked but without it causing
death. Somewhere around 75-80% said yes.
Alan
From: "edndana" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: "edndana" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: t-and-f: who would use drugs?
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 14:19:05 -0400
The original question was too inclusive. I said as a broad statement that in
order to win a major championship you must be doped. That statement is
likely wrong, but the general idea remains the same. I'm sure there are a
couple athletes out there who are winning and not doped, but they are not
There's my story. I've been trying to find a copy of that article for the
longest time.
"Nor is the testing itself as stringent as Olympic testers would have the
public believer. The IOC tolerates startlingly high levels of testosterone
in both male and female athletes. Olympic testing guidelin
The article was "Over the Edge" and I think it was in 1995 or 1996. Great
timing, right before the Atlanta Olympics.
Alan
From: Dan Kaplan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Dan Kaplan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: who would use drugs?
Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2003 17:29:12
Could also be psychological differences between men and women. Men are more
aggressive and therefore would be more inclined to cheat. Women tend to look
internally instead of externally for success. When women cheat it's usueally
because of an overbearing male presence (Eastern Bloc government,
se Running USA
teams and more money to be won at races yet we still fail to succeed in the
depth we did 20 years ago when Boston Billy was working 40 hours a week and
running 2:09
Alan
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Precedence: bulk
Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Oct 2003 06:26:33.0444 (UTC)
FILETIME=[73077240:01C38EF7]
But, I guess that proves something. If a guy will give his left and right
ones for $2500, surely
he'll dope up for $60,000.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
essage-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Richard McCann
Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 10:41 AM
To: alan tobin
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: The Study was a 1995 poll
The stagnation of men's throwing marks since the mid 1980s runs counter to
th
ly an
idiot would get caught. The problem is that the penalty for being caught
with steroids is more than just a 2 year ban as it is a federal offense.
Alan
From: Richard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: Richard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PR
The same observations have been made regarding Olympic medalists. You can
find a similar study at Peak Performance Online and on numerous messages
boards (mariusbakken.com comes to mind). 5'7' 140lb for the steeple? Those
guys are huge! Maybe I should switch events. In the marathon you must have
When a runner I barely heard of runs his first ever marathon 8 seconds off a
record that was just broke I start to wonder. 27:30 10k 2:05:50 marathon.
Call me a pessimist if you want. Icing on the cake would be if he's a part
of Dr. Rosa's camp. Anyone know?
Alan
From: Richard McCann <[EMAIL
cally at first and then level off unless there are
major training breakthroughs (late 60s) or very gifted individuals (Peters,
Clayton, KK) who break the record multiple times. What I don't buy is the
record being broken by a different person every year or every week.
Alan
From: Richa
nn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: fwd: Marathon debutant Rutto, Boston champ Zakharova
win at Chicago
Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2003 09:40:56 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: from velocipede.dcn.davis.ca.us ([168.150.
Can you blame me for being suspicious? A negative split sub 2:06 in his
DEBUT. I don't like the taste of that kool-aid.
Alan
From: peter watson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: peter watson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: t-and-f: rutto
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2003 14:48:17 -0700 (PDT
How about KK? Sure he hasn't touched a track race in a long while, but I'm
sure he could take down a few of his PRs if he chose to do so.
Alan
From: Richard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: (T&FMail List) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ago dance) are broken every year in the same event then I
question every one of those results. The state of the sport leads to such
uncredibility.
Alan
From: Richard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
<[
If the state of this sport was different I wouldn't be so suspicious. Don't
blame me, blame the sport.
alan
From: peter watson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: peter watson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: t-and-f: rutto
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 05:49:27 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1
lth
reasons"
Alan
From: "Post, Marty" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 'alan tobin' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Re: t-and-f: fwd: Marathon debutant Rutto, Boston champ
Zakharova win at Chicago
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 10:57:20 -040
H...apparently I've been trumped. I'll go back to my cave now.
Alan
From: "Post, Marty" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 'alan tobin' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Re: t-and-f: fwd: Marathon debutant Rutto, Boston
"but if the statement comes down to "he ran fast, so he must be on drugs"
then these type of statements have two problems. First, they border on
libel, which may expose the writer to legal actions."
It doesn't boil down to "he ran fast, so he must be on drugs". Do I have
proof that he or anyon
Exactly. That's my point. The fact that I have these opinions says something
about our sport that needs to be fixed.
Alan
From: "Martin J. Dixon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: "Martin J. Dixon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: rutto
Date: Wed, 15 Oct 2003 14:42:57
This is not 1954. HUGE difference in training between now and then. HUGE
difference in tracks between now and then. HUGE difference between mindset
between now and then.
Alan
From: vincent duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: vincent duncan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'John Molvar'" <[EMAIL PROTE
#x27;t be suspicious.
Alan
From: Richard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: rutto
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 10:10:12 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: from velocipede.dcn.davis.ca.us ([16
http://www.letsrun.com/2003/usadastatement.php
Exactly what I've said in the past. Steroids are still the drug of choice:
USADA STATEMENT (Oct. 16, 2003) -
Early in the summer, USADA received a call from a person represented to be a
high-profile track and field coach, who provided the names of
ard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: t-and-f: rutto
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 11:39:18 -0700
And I say that this is a public forum where if you have suspicions, you
either need to keep them to you
t;, but a less snooty way of saying
the same thing would be "tasteless". In fact this listserv has gone the way
of the Dodo since I first signed on in 1996 when actual college runners
*shock* frequented the list.
Alan
From: Richard McCann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin&
AIL PROTECTED]>
To: "alan tobin"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: t-and-f: Lazy Marathoners Before 2002
Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:42:26 -0500
Alan, you were born in 1978 and have never run in a world class
competition.
How do you KNOW all of these thing
Some people on this list need to lighten up. Some people are way too stuffy
and proper. Even serious media outlets sometimes fail to provide anying new
or interesting as they rehash old stories and ideas. Stop pretending the
list is god.
Alan
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