Re: [Talk-transit] How to map named bus stop platform/positions

2010-09-01 Thread Steven Chamberlain
On 31/08/10 19:17, Magnus Bäck wrote: In the Skånetrafiken public transport network in southmost Sweden, bus stops are identified not only by name but also by a capital letter that identifies this particular platform (or stop position, if you will). In most cases you have an A platform for one

Re: [talk-ph] charitable institutions?

2010-09-01 Thread Rally de Leon
maybe these private orgs / foundations / charities can be temporarily classified all under NGO classification (or a more general term). not all foundations / NGO's are charitable. Maybe, charity should just be a sub-category of foundation or NGO(?) Charitable institutions are most likely a

Re: [talk-ph] better ways to coordinate coastline mapping?

2010-09-01 Thread Eugene Alvin Villar
Hmmm... I guess we can declare this coastline correction task complete? There are still red spots in the webmap but I think these are all residual errors and I'm guessing there are no more SRTM-based coastlines remaining. I think all are now based on Landsat or PGS (which has small sawtooth coasts

[talk-ph] Vigan

2010-09-01 Thread tutubi
hi all! i'm doing a trip pre-planning to Sta. Cruz, Ilocos Sur with a highly-probable side-trip to Vigan and noticed OSM needs some sort of a Vigan mapping party. the tourist place needs lots of mapping works to do; I expected the opposite though. I remember the calesa route merely circled the

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 1:12 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: On 1 September 2010 07:21, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: I think that most people would say that's a feature, not a problem. But you aren't asking most people since you don't want to know the true answer.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
2010/8/31 Dirk-Lüder Kreie osm-l...@deelkar.net Am 31.08.2010 12:30, schrieb Liz: I was referring to user-mapped data. Imports have to fit the license, not the other way around. At the time of import the data imported fitted the licence. Perhaps you had better look back at the archives

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] 80m Manifesto

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
You would have had more luck sticking to one alias (Jane Smith), now you're just making it obvious as to your goals. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that some are now stooping to questionable tactics, but it just re-enforces the fact that I no longer have any faith in those that are pushing

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 16:16, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: But we know that his boks should be burnt. How can we allow Fredderik to spread the gospel in his books when we know the 'new license' should be brought down? Tip for next time, be less overt, it allows the ruse to go on for

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] 80m Manifesto

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 6:55 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: You would have had more luck sticking to one alias (Jane Smith), now you're just making it obvious as to your goals. John you are correct. The more we use our aliases the better. But no I am not 80n or 80 m. The

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 6:59 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: On 1 September 2010 16:16, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: But we know that his boks should be burnt. How can we allow Fredderik to spread the gospel in his books when we know the 'new license' should be

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] 80m Manifesto

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 17:00, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: The longer we keep our secret about BigTinCan John Oh goody a juicy secret... do tell, or should be have a sleep over and play truth or dare? ___ legal-talk mailing list

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 17:06, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: I need to gt my Dinner here in Sydney, but back later! Did you have a good flight from Germany? ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] 80m Manifesto

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 7:09 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: On 1 September 2010 17:00, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: The longer we keep our secret about BigTinCan John Oh goody a juicy secret... do tell, or should be have a sleep over and play truth or dare? But

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 7:10 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: On 1 September 2010 17:06, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: I need to gt my Dinner here in Sydney, but back later! Did you have a good flight from Germany? Yar I ist eating mine fritter John. can you

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, John Smith wrote: On 1 September 2010 16:04, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: John Smith and I know the Truth. Frederik's books should be burnt. He is an Apostle of the 'new license'. I would have said apostle of the CT because I highly doubt he'll be content with the license...

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Richard Weait
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 3:35 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 September 2010 17:30, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: only the most presumptuous person would believe that a license they choose today will automatically be the best license for the project for all time.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 17:58, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: That you claim that Frederik, or LWG, or OSMF Board are are trying to speak for both people now and people in the future in the very same breath is bold. You know perfectly well that term three gives the decision on future

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, John Smith wrote: On 1 September 2010 17:30, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: only the most presumptuous person would believe that a license they choose today will automatically be the best license for the project for all time. The sheer arrogance of all this is astounding, you

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 18:03, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: I think it is nothing but selfish. You don't even know if you'll be in OSM As I've stated in the past, which you conveniently keep ignoring, over looking or misunderstanding... You are putting end users of the data ahead of

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread 80n
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 8:58 AM, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 3:35 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 September 2010 17:30, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: only the most presumptuous person would believe that a license they choose

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Richard Weait
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:01 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 September 2010 17:58, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: That you claim that Frederik, or LWG, or OSMF Board are are trying to speak for both people now and people in the future in the very same breath is

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Rob Myers
On 09/01/2010 09:15 AM, 80n wrote: Nobody is saying that CC-BY-SA is perfect. But they are saying that it is unsuitable. It isn't but it works. Look at how quickly Waze reacted. Not bad for a broken license, eh? Rely on people's good intentions is not a general solution. The great

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 18:30, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: Still in OppositeLand, JohnSmith? Can't figure out any better insults? The Contributor Terms trust future OSM contributors to make the right choices for future OSM licenses. Do you trust current and future OSM At least be

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Richard Weait
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:15 AM, 80n 80n...@gmail.com wrote: Frederik's argument that we cannot predict what future generations will want is quite fallacious. Really? What will future generations want, 80n? I predict that future generations will want Flying cars sure, but we were promised

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 18:46, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On the other hand, six-ish years ago there was no concern that we would have to be compatible with OS data. Now, they publish open data And how compatible will the CTs be with OS data exactly?

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Richard Weait
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:37 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, we contributors are being treated with contempt alright, besides not being asked what we contributors want, since this whole thing started it's been nothing but dirty tricks to try and get the license changed.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 19:07, Rob Myers r...@robmyers.org wrote: If you don't want the effects of a PD OSM for geodata, ODbL is a better way of ensuring this than BY-SA The devil you know is better than the devil you don't At this stage I have every reason to believe the CT and now possible the

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Andy Allan
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 10:12 AM, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:37 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, we contributors are being treated with contempt alright, besides not being asked what we contributors want, since this whole thing started

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 19:12, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: Every time OSM contributors have been asked, they have supported ODbL Is this like all the laywers that think the ODBL is great too? about 12,500 contributors make up about 99% of the data, how many of those agree with your point

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Maarten Deen
On Wed, 1 Sep 2010 05:12:21 -0400, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:37 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, we contributors are being treated with contempt alright, besides not being asked what we contributors want, since this whole thing

[OSM-legal-talk] Sock puppetry is not welcome here

2010-09-01 Thread Andy Allan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_%28Internet%29 A sockpuppet is an online identity used for purposes of deception within an online community. The rash of posts by Jane Smith and 80 m are examples sockpuppetry at its worst. If you care for this kind of thing, take it elsewhere. It's not

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] STOP Re: 80m Manifesto

2010-09-01 Thread Emilie Laffray
On 1 September 2010 09:53, Mikel Maron mikel_ma...@yahoo.com wrote: PLEASE Indeed. Emilie Laffray ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Andy Allan
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 10:31 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 September 2010 19:22, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: And wage a campaign of reverting pages on the wiki[1], or hiding major Shhh don't mention the thread on the tagging list about this, it might

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Sock puppetry is not welcome here

2010-09-01 Thread Emilie Laffray
On 1 September 2010 10:36, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_%28Internet%29 A sockpuppet is an online identity used for purposes of deception within an online community. The rash of posts by Jane Smith and 80 m are examples sockpuppetry at its

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 19:38, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: Please, stop being so childish about all this. Most people would be mortified if they realised how much trouble they were causing, even inadvertently. Whereas you seem to be relishing it, and egging yourself on to annoy

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Albertas Agejevas
On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 09:22:12PM +0200, jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote: On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Albertas Agejevas a...@pov.lt wrote: On Sun, Aug 29, 2010 at 01:12:16AM +0200, jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote: Want an example of a use case DB integration?  Consider

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 19:59, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: My comments have nothing to do with the debate or any issues you Then perhaps you should have used another thread with a more appropriate subject line to avoid confusion? My comments are intended to address your disruptive

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Liz
On Wed, 1 Sep 2010, Richard Weait wrote: The OSMF are OpenStreetMap contributors. However OpenStreetMap contributors != OSMF because OSMF is a subset of contributors (although being a contributor is not a prerequisite, so this may not be completely true).

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Robert Kaiser
Anthony schrieb: On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 11:00 AM, Robert Kaiserka...@kairo.at wrote: Actually, IMHO, it's was wrong of the OSM project to do neither a copyright assignment nor a license that has a clear clause on automatic possibility of upgrade to a newer license in the same spirit (i.e. and

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Robert Kaiser
Francis Davey schrieb: Agreeing with the person you assign to that they will only use the copyright in certain ways won't protect you against a subsequent assignee of the copyright (eg OSMF assigns to XXX Ltd), subject to certain exceptions. While that may be true, anyone not trusting the

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 3:30 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Contrary to what John seems to believe, I would be quite content with the new license - not exactly in love with it, but content is a good word I think When did you come to that conclusion, and why? Weren't you opposed

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:03 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: I think there may be a misunderstanding here. The clause 3 in the contributor terms is precisely there because we want to *avoid* speaking for people in the future. Anyone arguing against that basically says: Well of

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Frederik Ramm
John, there's hardly a single message of yours in which I fail so find something inappropriate. For example this: John Smith wrote: On 1 September 2010 21:21, Rob Myers r...@robmyers.org wrote: The devil is in the details. CT+ODBL has a lot of fine print... is just unsuitable for a

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Emilie Laffray
On 1 September 2010 20:52, andrzej zaborowski balr...@gmail.com wrote: Also I don't see how CC-By-SA 3.0 explicitly does not apply to databases more than 2.0. It explicitly applies to things like maps however (possibly this only means maps as images though) It is my understanding that they

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 3:55 PM, Emilie Laffray emilie.laff...@gmail.com wrote: On 1 September 2010 20:52, andrzej zaborowski balr...@gmail.com wrote: Also I don't see how CC-By-SA 3.0 explicitly does not apply to databases more than 2.0.  It explicitly applies to things like maps however

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Noise vs unanswered questions

2010-09-01 Thread SteveC
On Sep 1, 2010, at 3:17 PM, Liz wrote: The complete lack of any arguments left in the brains of the pro-ODbL lobby shows in the complete falling apart of any discussion on this list, with previously thoughtful people concentrating on personal attacks on others, mostly claiming that they

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Noise vs unanswered questions

2010-09-01 Thread Richard Weait
Well we try to answer questions as quickly as possible. Some answers depend on further meetings, others depend on replies from busy professionals. Some answers get lost in the mundane reality of day to day life. Here are a couple of answers for questions that were asked a few weeks back. Not

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Francis Davey
On 1 September 2010 22:41, Anthony o...@inbox.org wrote: I'm not even sure what maps as images means.  If a map is described in XML (say, as an svg file), would that file be a map as an image? Let's assume any of the individually copyrightable graphics (like

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Noise vs unanswered questions

2010-09-01 Thread Rob Myers
On 09/01/2010 10:17 PM, Liz wrote: 1. From where does OSMF get the mandate to choose the licence? OSMF mandate is to own and run the servers . I got that from the OSMF website. The OSMF's Memorandum of Association, which is the legal expression of the Foundation's purpose, states: 3. The

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 2 September 2010 05:14, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: there's hardly a single message of yours in which I fail so find something inappropriate. I've made several comments that you do like wise, you keep claiming this change is needed to make OSM more free, but that's dishonest

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 6:04 PM, Francis Davey fjm...@gmail.com wrote: maps are expressly treated as artistic works by s.4(2)(a) of the Copyright Designs and Patents Act 1988 (to give a UK perspective). Pretty much the same thing in the US. pictorial, graphic, and sculptural works are included

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread andrzej zaborowski
On 2 September 2010 03:25, Anthony o...@inbox.org wrote: On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 6:04 PM, Francis Davey fjm...@gmail.com wrote: maps are expressly treated as artistic works by s.4(2)(a) of the Copyright Designs and Patents Act 1988 (to give a UK perspective). Pretty much the same thing in the

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Noise vs unanswered questions

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 5:59 PM, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: Also proceeding is the discussion of exactly what edits should be treated in what way during the license change[1].  So if you care one way or the other if a spell-check 'bot that changes tag spelling should be considered

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Eric Jarvies
On Sep 1, 2010, at 9:55 AM, Anthony wrote: If ODbL were CC-BY-SA for databases, I'd be in favor of it. +1 ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk

[OSM-talk] Correlated photos on GPS traces - fine adjusted on OSM maps under CC-0?

2010-09-01 Thread Niklas Cholmkvist
Hi, One of my sources(source=*) that I use for streets are geotagged photos, which I link to directly at the website where they are hosted. Sometimes when I see that the photo geoposition isn't the way I want it(knowing that the street sign in my city is on the corner of a building usually), I

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 6:10 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.comwrote: On 1 September 2010 16:04, Jane Smith janesmith...@gmail.com wrote: John Smith and I know the Truth. Frederik's books should be burnt. He is an Apostle of the 'new license'. I would have said apostle of the CT

Re: [OSM-talk] Can OSM sources be public domain CC-0(zero)?

2010-09-01 Thread Jane Smith
On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 10:00 PM, Aun Yngve Johnsen li...@gimnechiske.orgwrote: I believe if you are the owner of the data, But what is an owner? Ownership is the lash of the bourgoise. What you own is owned by us all. Properety is theft. Therefore those who steel the map from us the mappers

[OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread John Harvey
OSMDoc is great - it's a shame it's a year out of date. I needed a more modern breakdown of tag statistics so I decided to write a report myself - very quick and dirty (no where near as cool as OSMDoc), but functional to get a breakdown of tag usage. I figured someone else might like to

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread paul youlten
Noam, I am curious to know why you don't simply give OSM attribution and carry on using the maps? PY On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 4:04 AM, Julio Costa Zambelli julio.co...@openstreetmap.cl wrote: Noam, Thank you for taking this as seriously as it needs, and solving the whole issue this fast.

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread Iván Sánchez Ortega
On Wednesday 01 September 2010 09:05:18 paul youlten wrote: I am curious to know why you don't simply give OSM attribution and carry on using the maps? If you read the blog post carefully, you'll find a hint: We are huge fans of OSM and hope to collaborate with OSM through the new license

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen
But what a shame that so much crowd generated data had to be erased because of a stupid license ! Nobody of the OSMF board thought of that ? Regards, Gert Gremmen -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Iván

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread Claudius
You seem to be misunderstanding something here. No data has been deleted. Waze is looking forward to use OSM data after the license change, because the current one doesn't allow them to use the OSM data (even including attribution) the way they do. Claudius Am 01.09.2010 11:13, ce-test,

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Liz
On Wed, 1 Sep 2010, Richard Weait wrote: Every time OSM contributors have been asked, they have supported ODbL (or license change before ODbL had a name). All the way back to SotM Manchester. And all the way forward through polls and surveys and more SotM conferences. All the time,

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 20:33, Claudius claudiu...@gmx.de wrote: You seem to be misunderstanding something here. No data has been deleted. Waze is looking forward to use OSM data after the license change, because the current one doesn't allow them to use the OSM data (even including attribution)

[OSM-talk] problems with the josm-latest.jar downloads

2010-09-01 Thread maning sambale
Hi, I just downloaded josm-latest.jar and got the following errors: Exception in thread main java.lang.UnsupportedClassVersionError: Bad version number in .class file at java.lang.ClassLoader.defineClass1(Native Method) at java.lang.ClassLoader.defineClass(ClassLoader.java:676)

Re: [OSM-talk] Can OSM sources be public domain CC-0(zero)?

2010-09-01 Thread Jukka Rahkonen
Niklas Cholmkvist towardsoss at gmail.com writes: Hello, When I map, sometimes I add sources to my contributions. It could be a bus route relation where I may add the GPS trace I took while riding the bus as the source for the route. Other times if I name a street I may use a

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen
Claudius, You seem to be misunderstanding something here. No data has been deleted. Waze is looking forward to use OSM data after the license change, because the current one doesn't allow them to use the OSM data (even including attribution) the way they do. [GG] Citation:

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 21:06, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen g.grem...@cetest.nl wrote: OSM: go to shame ourselves. Most OSM software is GPL'd are you telling those authors they should be ashamed of themselves for not publishing under a BSD license instead?

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread Dave Stubbs
This is a direct consequence of OSM not being PD ! From our Homepage: The project (OSM) was started because most maps you think of as free actually have legal or technical restrictions on their use, holding back people from using them in creative, productive, or unexpected ways. This is

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Rob Myers
On 09/01/2010 10:14 AM, John Smith wrote: On 1 September 2010 19:07, Rob Myersr...@robmyers.org wrote: If you don't want the effects of a PD OSM for geodata, ODbL is a better way of ensuring this than BY-SA The devil you know is better than the devil you don't The devil is in the details.

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread Stefan de Konink
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Op 01-09-10 13:14, John Smith schreef: On 1 September 2010 21:06, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen g.grem...@cetest.nl wrote: OSM: go to shame ourselves. Most OSM software is GPL'd are you telling those authors they should be

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 21:21, Rob Myers r...@robmyers.org wrote: The devil is in the details. CT+ODBL has a lot of fine print... But going from these reasonable objections to accusing the actions of the part of the community that you don't agree with of being dishonest, immoral and detrimental

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread John Smith
On 1 September 2010 21:26, Stefan de Konink ste...@konink.de wrote: GPL is not the problem here. None of the software has to be distributed to the end user. No distribution = No license violation. http://svn.openstreetmap.org/LICENSE ___ talk mailing

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread Stefan de Konink
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 Op 01-09-10 13:33, John Smith schreef: On 1 September 2010 21:26, Stefan de Konink ste...@konink.de wrote: GPL is not the problem here. None of the software has to be distributed to the end user. No distribution = No license violation.

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
John Harvey j...@johnharveyphoto.com wrote: OSMDoc is great - it's a shame it's a year out of date. I needed a more modern breakdown of tag statistics so I decided to write a report myself - very quick and dirty (no where near as cool as OSMDoc), but functional to get a breakdown of tag

Re: [OSM-talk] problems with the josm-latest.jar downloads

2010-09-01 Thread Peter Wendorff
Hi. Since end of July JOSM requires Java 6. Perhaps that's the reason for the exception. I would say: check your Java version ;) regards Peter On 01.09.2010 12:41, maning sambale wrote: Hi, I just downloaded josm-latest.jar and got the following errors: Exception in thread main

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Jörg Ehrichs
John Harvey j...@johnharveyphoto.com wrote: OSMDoc is great - it's a shame it's a year out of date. ... Am Mittwoch, 1. September 2010, 13:40:23 schrieb Pierre-Alain Dorange: In cas you don't know it, there is tagstat, a little bit slow but more accurate and with updated data :

Re: [OSM-talk] problems with the josm-latest.jar downloads

2010-09-01 Thread maning sambale
Thanks Peter. I switched to JAVA 6. All is fine. On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Peter Wendorff wendo...@uni-paderborn.de wrote:  Hi. Since end of July JOSM requires Java 6. Perhaps that's the reason for the exception. I would say: check your Java version ;) regards Peter On

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Dave F.
On 01/09/2010 12:56, Jörg Ehrichs wrote: And just to get a full list. There is also the older, but still working and updated Tagwatch http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tagwatch http://tagwatch.stoecker.eu/ I maybe missing something, but is there a search facility? Cheers Dave F.

Re: [OSM-talk] Can OSM sources be public domain CC-0(zero)?

2010-09-01 Thread Niklas Cholmkvist
Hi, take the coordinates from Google Earth/Maps. I will not. That is a non-free source, the same reason I do not look/consider Wikimapia(google maps based) or any other proprietary maps. OSM may currently be the freest data collection that exists (since CC-BY-SA-3.0 is legally invalid for OSM

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Lars Francke
OSMDoc is great - it's a shame it's a year out of date.  I needed a more modern breakdown of tag statistics so I decided to write a report myself - very quick and dirty (no where near as cool as OSMDoc), but functional to get a breakdown of tag usage.  I figured someone else might like to read

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Rob Myers
On 09/01/2010 12:30 PM, John Smith wrote: On 1 September 2010 21:21, Rob Myersr...@robmyers.org wrote: The devil is in the details. CT+ODBL has a lot of fine print... So does BY-SA. And you should see GNU's GPL/copyright waiver/copyright assignment combination. They are all trying to be

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Peter Körner
Am 01.09.2010 15:15, schrieb Lars Francke: OSMDoc is great - it's a shame it's a year out of date. I needed a more modern breakdown of tag statistics so I decided to write a report myself - very quick and dirty (no where near as cool as OSMDoc), but functional to get a breakdown of tag usage.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] 80m Manifesto

2010-09-01 Thread Robert Kaiser
Jane Smith schrieb: The longer we keep our secret about BigTinCan John, the longer we can disrupt things! Thanks for stating in a very obvious way what you are here for. And what this community needs is collaboration, not disruption, so either try working together with everyone else or go

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
2010/9/1 Peter Körner osm-li...@mazdermind.de: What is the problem in running the import, that you did once, again, completely replacing the outdated data. he wrote on the German ML that he lost the program which did the import. cheers, Martin ___

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Dave F.
On 01/09/2010 14:15, Lars Francke wrote: Well thank you very much. Cheers, Lars (author of OSMdoc) Hi Lars The search facility appears to only search the key tag not the values tag. Is there a way to overcome this? For instance - parking. It doesn't list amenity=parking or any other

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Francis Davey
On 1 September 2010 14:42, Robert Kaiser ka...@kairo.at wrote: Francis Davey schrieb: Agreeing with the person you assign to that they will only use the copyright in certain ways won't protect you against a subsequent assignee of the copyright (eg OSMF assigns to XXX Ltd), subject to certain

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] ODbL vs CC-by-SA pros and cons

2010-09-01 Thread Rob Myers
On 09/01/2010 03:05 PM, Francis Davey wrote: Bear in mind that OSMF may cease to exist and its assets be transferred to someone else who you may trust less. I'm not saying it will happen or is even likely to happen, but I'm afraid as a lawyer I'm inclined to be cautious about the far future.

[OSM-talk] ethnio.com javascripts loaded on osm user registration page

2010-09-01 Thread Niklas Cholmkvist
Hi, Because I'm curious to read how new users see openstreetmap when they register (and also a curious chance to see the new contributor terms :) ) I went to the registration page of openstreetmap https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/new . Why does that page load scripts from ethnio.com? Those

Re: [OSM-talk] Waze using OSM Data

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 6:44 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: I'm curious as to what specifically is stopping them with the current license, because the current license hasn't stopped MS or MapQuest from using OSM's data... It's that pesky ShareAlike part, I'm sure. When looking

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Community vs. Licensing

2010-09-01 Thread Dave F.
On 01/09/2010 10:22, Andy Allan wrote: ...leading to simply unbelievable volumes of email[3]. Too whinge purely because you can't deal with a few emails is childishness in itself. Dave F. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org

Re: [OSM-talk] ethnio.com javascripts loaded on osm user registration page

2010-09-01 Thread Marco Lechner - FOSSGIS e.V.
I don't know why this script is included and when the target shows up, but it targets (whenever) to https://ethnio.com/remotes/62786/edit? May be anyone knows what's the reason for putting ethnio-recruting service on the page Marco Am 01.09.2010 16:07, schrieb Niklas Cholmkvist: Hi, Because

Re: [OSM-talk] ethnio.com javascripts loaded on osm user registration page

2010-09-01 Thread Tom Hughes
On 01/09/10 15:07, Niklas Cholmkvist wrote: Because I'm curious to read how new users see openstreetmap when they register (and also a curious chance to see the new contributor terms :) ) I went to the registration page of openstreetmap https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/new . Why does that

Re: [OSM-talk] Can OSM sources be public domain CC-0(zero)?

2010-09-01 Thread Anthony
On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 8:59 AM, Niklas Cholmkvist towards...@gmail.com wrote: Someone wrote: take the coordinates from Google Earth/Maps. I will not. That is a non-free source, the same reason I do not look/consider Wikimapia(google maps based) or any other proprietary maps. OSM may

Re: [OSM-talk] OSMDoc is awesome!

2010-09-01 Thread Lars Francke
What is the problem in running the import, that you did once, again, completely replacing the outdated data. he wrote on the German ML that he lost the program which did the import. Thank you Martin. He is correct. I don't have the script anymore that did the import and it didn't work very

[OSM-talk] Voting process

2010-09-01 Thread M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
I just noticed that someone changed some time ago the rules for voting. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Proposed_featuresaction=historysubmitdiff=424831oldid=422949 I cannot remember that there was any discussion about this. I believe that RFC and voting-announcements should go to

Re: [OSM-talk] Voting process

2010-09-01 Thread Dave F.
On 01/09/2010 17:12, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote: I just noticed that someone changed some time ago the rules for voting. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Proposed_featuresaction=historysubmitdiff=424831oldid=422949 I cannot remember that there was any discussion about this. I

Re: [OSM-talk] Voting process

2010-09-01 Thread Ed Loach
Martin wrote: I cannot remember that there was any discussion about this. I believe that RFC and voting-announcements should go to [talk], while [tagging] is for discussions about tags and tagging schemes. Perhaps I'm a bit jaded at the moment, but I think [tagging] is a better choice. If

Re: [OSM-talk] Tagging Scheme Recommendations: highway=path, footway, trail?

2010-09-01 Thread Alex Mauer
On 08/30/2010 10:41 AM, Graham Jones wrote: I think we might need some finer grained assessment of c, because as my son gets bigger (or I get older!) I am finding I give up on more tracks than I used to... Does anyone know if there is such a scheme in use already, or would we need to invent a

Re: [OSM-talk] Voting process

2010-09-01 Thread M∡rtin Koppenhoefer
2010/9/1 Dave F. dave...@madasafish.com:  On 01/09/2010 17:12, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote: I just noticed that someone changed some time ago the rules for voting. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Proposed_featuresaction=historysubmitdiff=424831oldid=422949 I cannot remember

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