Vào lúc 00:59 2023-01-03, Simon Poole đã viết:
Not quite unexpected this discussion has already gone off on a tangent
about stable ids. My question on the other hand would be: what do you
actually want to achieve and what would you expect an application to do
with the parameter?
Furthermore,
On Tue, 2023-01-10 at 08:39 +0100, Yves wrote:
>
>
> Le 10 janvier 2023 08:12:43 GMT+01:00, Snusmumriken
> a écrit :
> > On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 23:06 +, Andy Townsend wrote:
> > > On 09/01/2023 20:17, Snusmumriken wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 08:21 -0500, Greg Troxel wrote:
> > > > >
Le 10 janvier 2023 08:12:43 GMT+01:00, Snusmumriken
a écrit :
>On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 23:06 +, Andy Townsend wrote:
>> On 09/01/2023 20:17, Snusmumriken wrote:
>> > On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 08:21 -0500, Greg Troxel wrote:
>> > > You seem unwilling to understand that defining a way to refer to
On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 23:06 +, Andy Townsend wrote:
> On 09/01/2023 20:17, Snusmumriken wrote:
> > On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 08:21 -0500, Greg Troxel wrote:
> > > You seem unwilling to understand that defining a way to refer to
> > > ids
> > > will cause social pressure not to change ids,
> > Is
Snusmumriken writes:
> On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 08:21 -0500, Greg Troxel wrote:
>>
>> You seem unwilling to understand that defining a way to refer to ids
>> will cause social pressure not to change ids,
>
> Is there actually evidence that would corroborate this claim?
Do you mean like actually
On 09/01/2023 20:17, Snusmumriken wrote:
On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 08:21 -0500, Greg Troxel wrote:
You seem unwilling to understand that defining a way to refer to ids
will cause social pressure not to change ids,
Is there actually evidence that would corroborate this claim?
There have
On Mon, 2023-01-09 at 08:21 -0500, Greg Troxel wrote:
>
> You seem unwilling to understand that defining a way to refer to ids
> will cause social pressure not to change ids,
Is there actually evidence that would corroborate this claim?
___
talk
Le 9 janvier 2023 16:19:14 GMT+01:00, Niels Elgaard Larsen a
écrit :
>
>I sometimes do get annoyed at especially new mappers that often
>excessively delete and recreates objects. Because it obscures the
>history.
>
If it is a trend for new mappers, which I understand well because sometimes it
On Mon, 09 Jan 2023 08:21:42 -0500
Greg Troxel wrote:
>Sören Reinecke writes:
>
>> Using osm id is far from ideal but it is sufficient enough. If POI
>> owners are using OSM data, they will likely also pay attention to the
>> osm entry they have to keep it updated. So they will notice any
>>
On Mon, 2 Jan 2023 at 17:57, Sören Reinecke wrote:
> It came into my mind to get IETF to standardize a parameter explicitly
> linking to
> osm objects with their corresponding type and id.
1) Do we have any indication that IETF would be willing to
"standardize a parameter" for an ID scheme
Sören Reinecke writes:
> Using osm id is far from ideal but it is sufficient enough. If POI
> owners are using OSM data, they will likely also pay attention to the
> osm entry they have to keep it updated. So they will notice any
> change.
You seem unwilling to understand that defining a way to
sent from a phone
> On 6 Jan 2023, at 23:34, Niels Elgaard Larsen wrote:
>
> Maybe we could maintain a list of tags that are practical permanent unique
> identifiers. And then have a tool that for most objects could generate a url
> (https or geo) that references that object using that tag.
Sören Reinecke:
> way/node/relation ids in OSM are unstable, not promised to be stable
and anything relying on their stability can break at any point
Right, I know that OSM ids are not stable. The same applies to
coordinates too. If a restaurant puts a 'geo' link on their online pdf
menu card
Le 6 janvier 2023 15:49:53 GMT+01:00, "Sören Reinecke" a
écrit :
>
>Better would be to have a separate FOSS platform for storing POI information
>using a permanent identifier connected to OSM somehow e.g. by a key
>"somepoiplatformid". But no one created such a platform yet.
>
Probably
Ok, sry. I messed up with my example. I wanted to explain that using
coordinates is not stable either because they don't point directly to the POI,
they just point to the physical reference of the ground on earth.
But at the end we may clarify strongly that osm ids are not stable and keep
On Fri, 2023-01-06 at 13:47 +, Ed Loach wrote:
> > Good point. Also consider that OSM ids have an advantage over
> > coordinates, because if an OSM object gets deleted then a query for
> > that id will return "Not found". That in itself is valuable
> > information
> > to a data consumer.
>
>
> Good point. Also consider that OSM ids have an advantage over
> coordinates, because if an OSM object gets deleted then a query for
> that id will return "Not found". That in itself is valuable information
> to a data consumer.
But rather than being deleted, they may become a different thing,
Jan 6, 2023, 11:50 by valin...@gmx.net:
> To sum up: Coordinates can be used in the same wrong way as OSM id as
> they're both not sufficient enough for the use case most people are
> using it (indirectly).
>
But coordinates can be used correctly (shop updating their location
when their
On Fri, 2023-01-06 at 11:50 +0100, Sören Reinecke wrote:
> To sum up: Coordinates can be used in the same wrong way as OSM id as
> they're both not sufficient enough for the use case most people are
> using it (indirectly). Coordinates are already part of the 'geo' URI
> scheme. There is no
Hi,
On 06.01.23 11:50, Sören Reinecke wrote:
Right, I know that OSM ids are not stable. The same applies to
coordinates too. If a restaurant puts a 'geo' link on their online pdf
menu card with the coordinates to their shop then this is in the same
manner unstable as osm id.
No. The
> way/node/relation ids in OSM are unstable, not promised to be stable
and anything relying on their stability can break at any point
Right, I know that OSM ids are not stable. The same applies to
coordinates too. If a restaurant puts a 'geo' link on their online pdf
menu card with the
Hello,
Le 02.01.23 à 18:57, Sören Reinecke a écrit :
It allows (web) developers to direct their users to their map browser of
use e.g, Organic Maps, Google Maps, Apple Maps
if it allow to open an osm editor from an "osm datauser app",
that look fine.
for ex I use Organic Maps, I see an error
stevea writes:
> I'll state even more strongly than Frederik just did: "linking to an
> OSM object by ID and expecting the ID to remain constant is asking for
> trouble" is putting it mildly. It IS trouble. All it takes is one
> single change to one single datum and boom, the assumption that
Jan 2, 2023, 21:59 by ajt1...@gmail.com:
> On 02/01/2023 20:44, Mateusz Konieczny via talk wrote:
>
>> way/node/relation ids in OSM are unstable, not promised to be stable and
>> anything relying on their stability can break at any point
>>
> Unfortunately, that sort of "black and white"
I am “with” Andy here, yet I am also “with" Frederik here: you might be able
to get away with this “most of the time,” but when it fails (and it will),
you’ll be disappointed and perhaps even upset with OSM. There is simply no
reason why we should be suggesting or supporting this. Because it
Hi,
On 02.01.23 21:59, Andy Townsend wrote:
It's certainly possible (as I've said in that discussion) to use OSM IDs
as "stable enough to do real work with" - I do it all the time.
But establishing a "standard" to do it would likely exert pressure on
mappers not to do anything that would
Not quite unexpected this discussion has already gone off on a tangent
about stable ids. My question on the other hand would be: what do you
actually want to achieve and what would you expect an application to do
with the parameter?
It should be noted that we already have a couple of URI
Am Mo., 2. Jan. 2023 um 22:03 Uhr schrieb Andy Townsend :
> It's certainly possible (as I've said in that discussion) to use OSM IDs
> as "stable enough to do real work with" - I do it all the time.
>
> Can I guarantee that the shop at "No 55 Main Street" will always have
> the same OSM ID? No,
On 02/01/2023 20:44, Mateusz Konieczny via talk wrote:
way/node/relation ids in OSM are unstable, not promised to be stable and
anything relying on their stability can break at any point
Unfortunately, that sort of "black and white" answer doesn't really
answer the question of whether it's
On 1/2/23 11:57, Sören Reinecke wrote:
Hey,
It came into my mind to get IETF to standardize a parameter explicitly
linking to osm objects with their corresponding type and id.
[...]
Would it make sense for Google Maps, Bing Maps, etc to have similar
schemes under the geo URI scheme? I don't
I'll state even more strongly than Frederik just did: "linking to an OSM
object by ID and expecting the ID to remain constant is asking for trouble" is
putting it mildly. It IS trouble. All it takes is one single change to one
single datum and boom, the assumption that doing so can work is
Jan 2, 2023, 18:57 by valin...@gmx.net:
>
> Our own parameter could have the following syntax:
>
>
>
>
> osmid=(N|W|R)
>
>
>
>
> What do you think?
>
>
way/node/relation ids in OSM are unstable, not promised to be stable and
anything relying on their stability can break at any point
Hi,
On 1/2/23 18:57, Sören Reinecke wrote:
As OpenStreetMap is
playing an important part in the geospatial world, the OSMF should try
to get IETF convinced.
Until now we've concentrated on making a good map, rather than
convincing others that our map is good ;)
I think that linking to OSM
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