compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-21 Thread Eric Engle
Is there any chance that Heizer/Royalsoft (or anyone else for that matter) will make a script compiler for revolution like compileIt? __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com _

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-21 Thread Dan Shafer
I think perhaps you haven't yet understood Revolution very well. That's cool; it takes a while. With Rev, we don't need CompileIt! because Rev produces stand-alone, compiled applications for multiple platforms as part of its way of doing business. On Jun 21, 2005, at 6:48 PM, Eric Engle

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-21 Thread MisterX
y much so i would say - we all have these uses for it where Rev just doesn't can't perform fast enough. cheers Xavier > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Dan Shafer > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 06:10 &

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-21 Thread Pat Trendler
Do you have Revolution Dreamcard? You need Revolution Studio, or better, and you can then make a standalone compiled app. Pat [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "Eric Engle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 11:48 AM Subjec

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-21 Thread Dan Shafer
it where Rev just doesn't can't perform fast enough. cheers Xavier -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dan Shafer Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 06:10 To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? I think perhaps

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-21 Thread Brian Yennie
--- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dan Shafer Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 06:10 To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? I think perhaps you haven't yet understood Revolution very well. That's cool; it takes a while. With Rev,

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Alex Tweedly
MisterX wrote: [ about the need for more speed for some things ] Example: The HotKeyN2O stack stores all properties of all controls in a card when the user opens the card. The props are all in array form which cannot be stored into another array (time based array of object changes). So for e

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dennis Brown
Dan, I also would like to speed up array processing. It kills me that my friend won't move from VB to Rev because when I write the same array processing problem that he uses, VB runs 10+ times faster than Rev. I also have had to jump through hoops trying to figure out ways to make my ar

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Gordon Webster
I would absolutely echo what Dennis has just said. I was initially really impressed with rev and I should say I still am in certain respects - comfort and ease of use, the elegant and intuitive language and stack/card paradigm etc. etc. But I have been unable to get rev to do what I want it to do

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Derek Bump
I have spoke with a few individuals in regards to creating a utility for Revolution that would convert Transcript to C. Unfortunately, I know little of C and the individuals I talked with were not ready to start a project such as what you want. But...it is possible. If one who knows C and co

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
005 12:21 > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; How to use Revolution > Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? > > MisterX wrote: > > >[ about the need for more speed for some things ] > >Example: The HotKeyN2O stack stores all properties of all > controls in a > >card wh

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Jon
; To: Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 11:48 AM Subject: compileIt for revolution? Is there any chance that Heizer/Royalsoft (or anyone else for that matter) will make a script compiler for revolution like compileIt? __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Y

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Peter T. Evensen
in an image). Jon Pat Trendler wrote: Do you have Revolution Dreamcard? You need Revolution Studio, or better, and you can then make a standalone compiled app. Pat [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "Eric Engle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Wedne

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
nal Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Dennis Brown > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 15:40 > To: How to use Revolution > Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? > > Dan, > > I also would like to speed up array processi

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Jon
Dan Shafer wrote: How in the world would you expect a compiled script or handler -- if such a thing were possible -- to then be smoothly integrated into a stand-alone app? Seems trivial to me: that's what traditional object code libraries and DLLs are for. As for performance, tuning f

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
f > Derek Bump > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 16:19 > To: How to use Revolution > Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? > > I have spoke with a few individuals in regards to creating a > utility for Revolution that would convert Transcript to C. > Unfortunately, I k

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Jon
Total agreement... Gordon Webster wrote: I would absolutely echo what Dennis has just said. I was initially really impressed with rev and I should say I still am in certain respects - comfort and ease of use, the elegant and intuitive language and stack/card paradigm etc. etc. But I have been

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Glen Bojsza
ed to #include > axtalk.c library in your code. But this is still "vapor" as i hate the c > debugging. > > cheers > Xavier > > > -Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > > Derek Bump &g

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Rob Cozens
Mr. X, et al: The whole compileIT is not required but an internal module to create ultra-fast native code would be great. Now that would be a programmer's tool worth any eye candy in RunRev. Add access to system calls, and you have my support. Rob Cozens Wisdom entereth not into a malicious

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dan Shafer
into a real-compiled external. So CompileIt is needed - and very much so i would say - we all have these uses for it where Rev just doesn't can't perform fast enough. cheers Xavier -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dan Shafer

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
-Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Gordon Webster > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 16:14 > To: How to use Revolution > Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? > > I would absolutely echo what Dennis has just said.

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Gordon Webster
always another way to > do it! > > cheers > Xav > > > -Original Message- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of > > Gordon Webster > > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 16:14 > > To: How to use Revolu

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dennis Brown
I think the issue here is an elegant and efficient way to interface with externals. If we had this, it would solve both problems. When I say efficient, I don't mean pass a 100MB array as a text string to an external that converts it to numbers than does some processing and converts back t

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
> Transcript/Rev aren't a general-purpose environment. There's > a whole class of apps for which they are ideally suited. > There are also many for which it's not the right tool. I'm in > favor of continuing to make it do what it does do better and better. > > I suspect you are, too, so I'm no

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dr . John R . Vokey
The simplest possibility for the external route would be to be able to pass (and use) to and from the external, handles to large RAM-based sets of floating-point numbers; that was the solution I used in Hypercard back when the Earth was still cooling, and it worked very well. On 22-Jun-05, at

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dennis Brown
John, I actually had a complete matrix algebra package as an external for Hypercard. I know how to use it, because I cut my teeth on APL. I implemented my complex algorithms and state machines in it. The coding was cumbersome, and it was difficult to debug and handle edge conditions, s

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dr . John R . Vokey
If you are mostly writing for yourself, you can, of course, use RR to produce a nice GUI, but pass all the time critical computations to, say Matlab (or Octave, Matlab's GNU equivalent) using the shell commands. But then, if that were the case, why not just use Matlab (or Octave) directly? Inc

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dar Scott
On Jun 22, 2005, at 1:45 PM, Dr.John R.Vokey wrote: The simplest possibility for the external route would be to be able to pass (and use) to and from the external, handles to large RAM-based sets of floating-point numbers; that was the solution I used in Hypercard back when the Earth was stil

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Brian Yennie
Not forgetting, Brian, just discounting. :-D Fair enough. For me, that was the only reason to use CompileIt. Speed of ordinary scripts felt like something I wanted to deal with algorithmically rather than by compiling. After all, compiling the same algorithm was probably going to have less im

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dan Shafer
Dennis. You may well be right. But the definition of "this Achilles heel" varies all over the map. Revolution is not the best programming language for all classes of problem. Those who choose not to see it as a "real" programming language because of one perceived lack will often just

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dennis Brown
John, I am not writing just for myself, I use a Mac and my friend uses a PC and he also has to be able to run my stuff. I do not have the budget for Matlab, etc., etc. I buy everything out of my own pocket. I am constrained to exactly what is good about Rev. Dennis On Jun 22, 2005, at

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dan Shafer
Precisely my earlier point. Rev is not for everything. If you have an app that needs to engage in this kind of esoteric processing, then you probably need to pick a different tool either for the entire app or to create a whiz-bang external that does this kind of processing fast enough for

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dan Shafer
I support the notion of making integration of non-platform-specific externals easier. But Rev's biggest win for me other than high-performance coding is cross-platform compatibility and I'm opposed to platform-specific extensions that either break or cause me to write painful conditional

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dan Shafer
This whole discussion has been revealing and intriguing to me. My favorite programming language is Smalltalk. But before it was possible to create UIs for Smalltalk without writing code, I found it cumbersome. When a product called WindowBuilder came along, I felt like we'd achieved the ult

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dr . John R . Vokey
Yes, as long as the constant conversion isn't required; I used handles both within Hypercard and in the XTHNGs, along with two conversion routines (compile hc variables into a floating-point array, and convert a floating-point array into a hc variable); the conversion routines were used sparing

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Mark Wieder
Dan- Wednesday, June 22, 2005, 3:11:38 PM, you wrote: DS> Two aphorisms came to mind as I read this entire thread again today. DS> One is, "No good programmer uses only one tool for everything." DS> The other is, "It's a poor workman who blames his tools." Or, possibly more apropos, "No good

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Mark Wieder
Dan- Wednesday, June 22, 2005, 3:05:06 PM, you wrote: DS> The way rev implements the OS X-specific stuff is right. On Windows, DS> it is just ignored. It doesn't break and the app still runs. Here's where I think you're off base on this, Dan. I'd like to see runrev spend their time fixing bugs

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Mark Wieder
Dennis- Wednesday, June 22, 2005, 1:47:25 PM, you wrote: DB> John, DB> I actually had a complete matrix algebra package as an external for DB> Hypercard. I know how to use it, because I cut my teeth on APL. I DB> implemented my complex algorithms and state machines in it. The DB> coding was

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Alex Tweedly
Derek Bump wrote: If one who knows C and could figure out some sort of Transcript wrapper, then it would be possible. There are many freeware and public domain compilers out there, but finding one that successfully compiles DLLs for Revolution is seemingly difficult. I've been trying for a

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Richard Gaskin
MisterX wrote: Gordon, Beware that even i surprise myself with newby tricks. I just posted a "slow" fractal moire maker. It creates beautiful patterns and the detail is amazing but it does so creating some 4 graphics in a card. For the truely beautiful patterns, it took 30 graphics! Th

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Scott Rossi
Recently, Richard Gaskin wrote: >> i have the patience to create these graphics and see them rendered. But when >> it comes to getting rid of them, no way! And the clearGraphics routine took >> foreever! 200 graphics per second... You do the math - many minutes wasted >> waiting to create a bette

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Richard Gaskin
Scott Rossi wrote: Recently, Richard Gaskin wrote: i have the patience to create these graphics and see them rendered. But when it comes to getting rid of them, no way! And the clearGraphics routine took foreever! 200 graphics per second... You do the math - many minutes wasted waiting to cre

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Trevor DeVore
On Jun 22, 2005, at 4:15 PM, Alex Tweedly wrote: What I now do (having got it wrong often enough, including right now when I was writing down the step-by-step) is to start the stack up, set the externals, save it, quit Rev. Restart Rev, open the stack, run the script that sets externals agai

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Richard Gaskin
Dennis Brown wrote: I don't think compiling scripts is the answer. It wasn't with CompileIt! either. ;) Yes, it was *possible* to compile straight HyperTalk, but that rarely ran significantly faster than it did in HC's own interpreter, mostly due to the need for callbacks to the engine. So

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Richard Gaskin
Derek Bump wrote: If one who knows C and could figure out some sort of Transcript wrapper, then it would be possible. There are many freeware and public domain compilers out there, but finding one that successfully compiles DLLs for Revolution is seemingly difficult. I've been trying for a fe

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Derek Bump
Richard Gaskin wrote: What aspects have you found confusing? Well, for me it's confusing due to how I've learned every language in the past. I learned HyperTalk, Transcript, Perl, PHP and ASP by simply looking at examples and then trying to make them work. Then slowly I would add in other

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dennis Brown
Dan, I used to believe that too, Then I decided to spend twice a much on a table saw as I ever had before. The quality of my work doubled. The saw was heavy and stable, the blade did not wobble, and the fence was solid. My cuts were fast and accurate. Then I decided to buy the higher

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Alex Tweedly
Richard Gaskin wrote: Derek Bump wrote: If one who knows C and could figure out some sort of Transcript wrapper, then it would be possible. There are many freeware and public domain compilers out there, but finding one that successfully compiles DLLs for Revolution is seemingly difficult.

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dennis Brown
Mark, I did not write the external, I just bought it and used it. Dennis On Jun 22, 2005, at 7:04 PM, Mark Wieder wrote: Dennis- Wednesday, June 22, 2005, 1:47:25 PM, you wrote: DB> John, DB> I actually had a complete matrix algebra package as an external for DB> Hypercard. I know how t

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Jerry J
From: Richard Gaskin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? This is not to suggest that I believe all Rev fans should learn C, so let me please dispel that hyperbole before it arises. All I'm suggesting is that CompileIt! was no panacea, and the effort of usin

re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Eric Engle
> Message: 7 > Date: Wed, 22 Jun 2005 17:24:18 -0400 > From: Mikey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: the := operator (affectation) > To: How to use Revolution > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > How is this even a continuing topic of discussion?

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dar Scott
On Jun 22, 2005, at 8:46 PM, Eric Engle wrote: So why use := ? Some people prefer pre-fixing affectation, and as I said, it is supported in lingo which is also a pascal derived language. In fact, I know of no other language that post-fixes affectation (put value into variable as opposed to af

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Dan Shafer
Mark I have a hard time seeing where you and I disagree here. I think we're saying the same thing differently. Dan On Jun 22, 2005, at 3:52 PM, Mark Wieder wrote: Dan- Wednesday, June 22, 2005, 3:05:06 PM, you wrote: DS> The way rev implements the OS X-specific stuff is right. On W

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
o know! cheers Xavier > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Richard Gaskin > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 01:53 > To: How to use Revolution > Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? > > MisterX wrote: > > G

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread MisterX
n Behalf Of > Alex Tweedly > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2005 03:23 > To: How to use Revolution > Subject: Re: compileIt for revolution? > > Richard Gaskin wrote: > > > Derek Bump wrote: > > > >> If one who knows C and could figure out some sort of Transcr

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-22 Thread Mark Wieder
Dan- Wednesday, June 22, 2005, 8:38:36 PM, you wrote: DS> I have a hard time seeing where you and I disagree here. I think DS> we're saying the same thing differently. Ah... that may be. But I'm pushing *for* a generic external interface, and you're arguing against it. -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Rob Cozens
Dan, et al, programming language that is everything to everyone is nothing to anyone. Not if it does the job. (You'd really like to switch between different programming environments to create bits and pieces of an application?) Isn't C a programming language that is everything to everyon

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Rob Cozens
Richard, et al: So instead CompileIt! had its own unique syntax and hundreds of symbols one could use to implement things that were algorithmically very much like one would do in Pascal or C. Of course this required a whole other level of knowledge, and for those symbols related to the Mac Too

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Mikey
> Try not to get your knickers in a twist. In case you haven't noticed, > hypertalk/transcript is clearly a Pascal derived language, they just got rid > of > begin/end, loosely typed it, and made the operator of affectation verbose. OMG that's funny. Don't forget scoping, and the overarching pa

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Jim Bufalini
tion? 3. Now write your code. If you find yourself writing spaghetti code, STOP, go back to step 1. Jim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Dan Shafer Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 12:12 PM To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: compileIt for revoluti

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Richard Gaskin
Mikey wrote: Try not to get your knickers in a twist. In case you haven't noticed, hypertalk/transcript is clearly a Pascal derived language, they just got rid of begin/end, loosely typed it, and made the operator of affectation verbose. OMG that's funny. FWIW, I've read that description al

re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Eric Engle
> Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:15:28 -0400 > From: Mikey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: compileIt for Revolution? > To: How to use Revolution > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > > Try not to

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Jerry Daniels
CompileIt! lovers and haters... YESTERDAY I would have to agree with Rob, here. I used CompileIt! to the point where I made a small C app that RAN externals only and I would get CompileIt! to compile into that app (called HyperApp). I then wrote a front end (in CompileIt!) to write and manage

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Mark Wieder
Eric- Thursday, June 23, 2005, 11:20:16 AM, you wrote: EE> There's even an entire article on macTech "Comparing HyperTalk to Pascal" which EE> says, EE> "Both Pascal and HyperTalk provide powerful if-then-else control structures EE> with very similar syntax." EE> "The specification and calling

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread SimPLsol
Jerry, Assuming there is sufficient interest what is the first step, and what would THAT cost? I'm thinking that the initial ScriptCompiler (or some better name) would just turn Transcript into machine code. This would be of interest to me (hopefully others) who want to put guarded code in

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Dan Shafer
Maybe that's what I ended up doing but it was accidental! Maybe I fell asleep at some point. My argument is NOT against the ability to build externals to do whatever one wishes to do, including platform-specific things if you want to make your life more complicated and miserable or if you on

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Dan Shafer
If you can write externals in Transcript syntax and NOT over-extend the language to accommodate this demand, I don't have an issue. But that is not generally the case. When people talk about writing externals they generally (in my experience at least) mean they want to make the tool do some

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Dennis Brown
Dan, Rev is chock full of stuff that I will never use. Perhaps half or more of the commands are irrelevant to my needs. However, I see on this list folks that love those irrelevant things in their applications. You have your ideas about the kind of applications you want to use Rev for.

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Thomas McGrath III
Dan, That's what I got from the first post, exactly. I tend to agree with your statement and your logic is sound. (not that you need me to say so) I just wanted to agree to this and don't want to see Rev changed in another direction. Thanks Tom On Jun 23, 2005, at 8:20 PM, Dan Shafer wr

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Richard Gaskin
Rob Cozens wrote: I'm really sorry your experience with CompileIt! was such that you didn't get it. I believe got it: I wrote a few dozen externals with it, bundled 'em up into a commercial product, and they paid my rent for a year. While I enjoyed it (or more specifically, Mark Hanrek's so

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Dan Shafer
Dennis. You make some excellent points. I don't think that *my* programming needs should drive the direction of the language or the tool. And I'm certainly not opposed even to *major* extensions and enhancements of the language. My only real sticking point is that if and when new thin

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Mark Wieder
Dan- No argument from me on that. Maybe I was the one who fell asleep, but I didn't think anyone was arguing for features that would break the cross-platform functionality in that way. If so, that's one of those threads I'm not even going to bother getting involved in. -- -Mark Wieder [EMAIL PR

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-23 Thread Geoff Canyon
How about this: on eq @x,y -- note x is by reference put y into x end eq You can use that in the order you asked for like this: on mouseUp put 0 into b eq b,7 put b -- puts 7 eq b,b+3 put b -- puts 10 end mouseUp ___ use-revolution mailin

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Geoff Canyon
On Jun 22, 2005, at 4:52 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: And as Geoff Canyon discovered, you can go one step further by drawing all polygons as a single object, but just including a blank line in the points property wherever you want a discontiguous object. Actually, I think Tuviah told me that

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Richard Gaskin
Geoff Canyon wrote: On Jun 22, 2005, at 4:52 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: And as Geoff Canyon discovered, you can go one step further by drawing all polygons as a single object, but just including a blank line in the points property wherever you want a discontiguous object. Actually, I thin

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Langers Christian
Hello, Slow code can be written in any language. Transcript makes it very easy to write code, but also very easy to write slow code. Could you, please, give us (newbies/intermediate scriptesr) some examples of fast/slow script code ? Thanks, Christian L. Le 24 juin 05 à 09:27, Geoff

re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Eric Engle
How about this: on eq @x,y -- note x is by reference put y into x end eq You can use that in the order you asked for like this: on mouseUp put 0 into b eq b,7 put b -- puts 7 eq b,b+3 put b -- puts 10 end mouseUp Does Transcript allow pointers?!? If so, big news to me (new in

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Jon
tion? 3. Now write your code. If you find yourself writing spaghetti code, STOP, go back to step 1. Jim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Dan Shafer Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2005 12:12 PM To: How to use Revolution Subject: Re: compileIt for revo

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Jon
that some people who write books are clueless. Jon, in hyper-curmudgeon mode Eric Engle wrote: Message: 2 Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2005 10:15:28 -0400 From: Mikey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: compileIt for Revolution? To: How to use Revolution Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Content

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Eric Chatonet
Le 23 juin 05 à 20:20, Eric Engle a écrit : xTalk is a scripting language which is clearly derived from Pascal. I never think of that... Is it a real scoop I missed since 20 years, only bad news or a weird analysis from some keyhole journalism? :-) Best regards from Paris, Eric Chatonet.

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Jon
Geoff: If anyone wants to try to help me speed optimize my image processing loops, download the obvious program from my user space. Load an image of your choice (but hopefully larger than your screen, to be realistic), then select Brightness, then Linear. Let the optimization wars begin! :

RE: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Jim Bufalini
our data, whether your language is in pcode or machine compiled, results in only milliseconds of difference. Believe me, over 25 years of programming experience bears this out. Jim -Original Message- From: Jon [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 24, 2005 1:27 AM To: [EMAIL PROT

Re: compileIt for Revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Geoff Canyon
On Jun 24, 2005, at 2:19 AM, Eric Engle wrote: on eq @x,y -- note x is by reference put y into x end eq You can use that in the order you asked for like this: on mouseUp put 0 into b eq b,7 put b -- puts 7 eq b,b+3 put b -- puts 10 end mouseUp Does Transcript allow pointers?

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Dennis Brown
Dan, Perhaps we are in perfect agreement, just expressing it differently... I could not argue with the way you have expressed it here. Dennis On Jun 24, 2005, at 1:09 AM, Dan Shafer wrote: Dennis. You make some excellent points. I don't think that *my* programming needs should drive th

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Jerry Daniels
Paul, My thoughts pretty much mirror your own, Paul. First step is environment independent code for parsing, arrays, calculations. No timeline or cost on this yet. Still seeing who's interested. -JD On Jun 23, 2005, at 5:42 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jerry, Assuming there is suffic

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Jerry Daniels
Dan, I thought Tom Pittman did a very good job of maintaining the purity of HyperTalk when he did CompileIt! Any future efforts could stand on his shoulders in that regard. -JD On Jun 23, 2005, at 7:26 PM, Dan Shafer wrote: If you can write externals in Transcript syntax and NOT over-extend

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Richard Gaskin
Jerry Daniels wrote: I thought Tom Pittman did a very good job of maintaining the purity of HyperTalk when he did CompileIt! Any future efforts could stand on his shoulders in that regard. Just get an interface more like Mark Hanrek's please. :) So much faster, so much simpler -- Richar

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Joel Guillod
From: Dan Shafer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [...] Then my second favorite language was Python. The GUI-building tools for Python are pathetic to non-existent. But the language is powerful and elegant and extends naturally. If the PythonCard project I was engaged in before I discovered Revolution had been

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Geoff Canyon
On Jun 23, 2005, at 10:09 PM, Dan Shafer wrote: Verbosity is a virtue in my mind. Not only does it make code more readable and therefore maintainable, but I can't tell you how many times I've just sort of guessed at what command or property change might have some desired effect only to hav

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-24 Thread Geoff Canyon
On Jun 24, 2005, at 4:26 AM, Jon wrote: With all due respect, Jim, if you are trying to do even simple math on a large array of numbers (like computing a histogram of image data), Rev is simply too slow to use. It has nothing to do with data structures: it has to do with slow pCode trying

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-26 Thread Jon
I already posted the code and announced it on this list: look for my image processor in my user space, open a large image (at least 1000x1000), select Bright, and then Linear. I look forward to seeing what you optimists ... er ... optimizers come up with! :) Jon Geoff Canyon wrote: On

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-26 Thread Alex Tweedly
I sent this message Saturday, and it just came back to me as bounced (because the list-server was off-line). So here it is again - with an addendum ... Geoff Canyon wrote: On Jun 24, 2005, at 4:26 AM, Jon wrote: With all due respect, Jim, if you are trying to do even simple math on

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-27 Thread Alex Tweedly
Jon wrote: I already posted the code and announced it on this list: look for my image processor in my user space, open a large image (at least 1000x1000), select Bright, and then Linear. Jon - I got an error trying to download your stack from RevOnline. Did you try to upload it (or change i

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-28 Thread Jerry Daniels
Maybe there was one better than Mark's! On Jun 24, 2005, at 2:30 PM, Richard Gaskin wrote: Jerry Daniels wrote: I thought Tom Pittman did a very good job of maintaining the purity of HyperTalk when he did CompileIt! Any future efforts could stand on his shoulders in that regard. Just get

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-29 Thread Geoff Canyon
The file doesn't appear to be accessible within RevOnline. I get an error message file-not-found when I try it. If the code in question is of a manageable size and format (no really long lines) then posting it here is likely the best option. Otherwise (and in any case), can you re-upload th

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-29 Thread Jon
Geoff: I already posted a message saying that you can find the stack at www.jonbondy.com/jlbimage.rev. Another poster noted that the code has "errors" in it, and wondered if the code was current. I pointed out that I gave up on Rev for this particular application when it proved to be too sl

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-29 Thread Alex Tweedly
Geoff Canyon wrote: The file doesn't appear to be accessible within RevOnline. I get an error message file-not-found when I try it. If the code in question is of a manageable size and format (no really long lines) then posting it here is likely the best option. Otherwise (and in any case)

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-29 Thread Derek Bump
Alex Tweedly wrote: There's a problem with RevOnline. Here's the central part of Jon's code Right now I'm working on converting Jon's code to C to include within an external. But if anyone happens to know of an easier way, or of an External that already does this...and cares to share...then

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-29 Thread Jon
Derek: First off, thanks for your help. Secondly, why convert it to C? I have already written it in Delphi/Pascal. The whole point was to make something that was cross-platform. If you create an external on your platform (Window? Mac), would it automatically work on the other platforms?

Re: compileIt for revolution?

2005-06-29 Thread Derek Bump
Jon wrote: First off, thanks for your help. Not a problem. Secondly, why convert it to C? I have already written it in Delphi/Pascal. The whole point was to make something that was cross-platform. If you create an external on your platform (Window? Mac), would it automatically work on t

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