Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-23 Thread Bart Smaalders
Frank Cusack wrote: yes I am an experienced Solaris admin and know all about devfsadm :-) and the older disks command. It doesn't help in this case. I think it's a BIOS thing. Linux and Windows can't see IDE drives that aren't there at boot time either, and on Solaris the SATA controller runs

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Frank Cusack
yes I am an experienced Solaris admin and know all about devfsadm :-) and the older disks command. It doesn't help in this case. I think it's a BIOS thing. Linux and Windows can't see IDE drives that aren't there at boot time either, and on Solaris the SATA controller runs in some legacy mode s

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Peter Karlsson
Hi Frank, try man devfsadm, it will update devfs with your new disk drives. disks is an older command that does about the same thing. Cheers, Peter Frank Cusack wrote: On January 22, 2007 12:12:19 PM -0600 Brian Hechinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Mon, Jan 22, 2007 at 09:39:19AM -0800,

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Frank Cusack
On January 22, 2007 12:12:19 PM -0600 Brian Hechinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Mon, Jan 22, 2007 at 09:39:19AM -0800, Frank Cusack wrote: On January 21, 2007 12:15:22 AM -0200 Toby Thain <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > To be clear: the X2100 drives are neither "hotswap" nor "hotplug" under > S

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Dan Mick
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That said, this definition is not always used consistently, as is the case with the x2100. I filed a bug against the docs in this case, and unfortunately it was closed as "will not fix." :-( In the context of a hardware platform it makes little sense to distinguish be

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Toby Thain
On 22-Jan-07, at 4:03 PM, Richard Elling wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That said, this definition is not always used consistently, as is the case with the x2100. I filed a bug against the docs in this case, and unfortunately it was closed as "will not fix." :-( In the context of a har

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Toby Thain
On 22-Jan-07, at 5:28 PM, Frank Cusack wrote: > In short, the release note is confusing, so ignore it. Use x2100 > disks as hot pluggable like you've always used hot plug disks in > Solaris. Won't work - some of us have tested it. Again, NO these drives are not hot pluggable and the relea

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Jason J. W. Williams
Hi Guys, The original X2100 was a pile of doggie doo-doo. All of our problems with it go back to the atrocious quality of the nForce 4 Pro chipset. The NICs in particular are just crap. The M2s are better, but the MCP55 chipset has not resolved all of its flakiness issues. That being said Sun des

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Frank Cusack
> In short, the release note is confusing, so ignore it. Use x2100 > disks as hot pluggable like you've always used hot plug disks in > Solaris. Again, NO these drives are not hot pluggable and the release note is accurate. PLEASE get a system to test. Or take our word for it. hmm I think I

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Frank Cusack
I certainly did NOT mean any hostility whatsoever. I highly value what Richard offers in this forum. I'm just frustrated at the misinformation which is being presented as authoritative. Repeatedly. But to be clear, in my mind Richard is one of the "good ones" and I eagerly read what he has to

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Jason J. W. Williams
Hi Frank, I'm sure Richard will check it out. He's a very good guy and not trying to jerk you around. I'm sure the hostility isn't warranted. :-) Best Regards, Jason On 1/22/07, Frank Cusack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On January 22, 2007 10:03:14 AM -0800 Richard Elling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wro

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Frank Cusack
On January 22, 2007 10:03:14 AM -0800 Richard Elling <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Toby Thain wrote: > To be clear: the X2100 drives are neither "hotswap" nor "hotplug" under > Solaris. Replacing a failed drive requires a reboot. I do not believe this is true, though I don't have one to test. W

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Richard Elling
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That said, this definition is not always used consistently, as is the case with the x2100. I filed a bug against the docs in this case, and unfortunately it was closed as "will not fix." :-( In the context of a hardware platform it makes little sense to distinguish be

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-22 Thread Frank Cusack
On January 21, 2007 12:15:22 AM -0200 Toby Thain <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: To be clear: the X2100 drives are neither "hotswap" nor "hotplug" under Solaris. Replacing a failed drive requires a reboot. Also, adding a drive that wasn't present at boot requires a reboot. -frank __

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-21 Thread Casper . Dik
>That said, this definition is not always used consistently, as is the case >with the x2100. I filed a bug against the docs in this case, and unfortunately >it was closed as "will not fix." :-( In the context of a hardware platform it makes little sense to distinguish between hot-plug and hot-s

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Toby Thain
On 21-Jan-07, at 12:12 AM, Rich Teer wrote: On Sat, 20 Jan 2007, Richard Elling wrote: To be clear, Sun defines "hot swap" as a device which can be inserted or removed without system administration tasks required. Sun defines "hot plug" as a device which can be inserted or removed withou

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Toby Thain
On 20-Jan-07, at 8:48 PM, Erik Trimble wrote: Frank Cusack wrote: On January 20, 2007 1:07:27 PM -0800 "David J. Orman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On that note, I've recently read it might be the case that the 1u sun servers do not have hot-swappable disk drives... is this really true?

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Rich Teer
On Sat, 20 Jan 2007, Richard Elling wrote: > To be clear, Sun defines "hot swap" as a device which can be inserted or > removed without system administration tasks required. > > Sun defines "hot plug" as a device which can be inserted or removed without > causing damage or interruption to a runni

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Richard Elling
Frank Cusack wrote: On January 20, 2007 1:07:27 PM -0800 "David J. Orman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On that note, I've recently read it might be the case that the 1u sun servers do not have hot-swappable disk drives... is this really true? Yes. Only for the x2100 (and x2100m2). It's not th

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Erik Trimble
Frank Cusack wrote: On January 20, 2007 1:07:27 PM -0800 "David J. Orman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On that note, I've recently read it might be the case that the 1u sun servers do not have hot-swappable disk drives... is this really true? Only for the x2100 (and x2100m2). It's not that the

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Frank Cusack
On January 20, 2007 1:07:27 PM -0800 "David J. Orman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On that note, I've recently read it might be the case that the 1u sun servers do not have hot-swappable disk drives... is this really true? Only for the x2100 (and x2100m2). It's not that the hardware isn't hot-sw

Re: [zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Marion Hakanson
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: > I was talking about the huge gap in storage solutions from Sun for the > middle-ground. While $24,000 is a wonderful deal, it's absolute overkill for > what I'm thinking about doing. I was looking for more around 6-8 drives. How about a Sun V40z? It's available with up

[zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread David J. Orman
> On Fri, 19 Jan 2007, Frank Cusack wrote: > > > But x4100/x4200 only accept expensive 2.5" SAS > drives, which have > > small capacities. [...] > > ... and only 2 or 4 drives each. Hence my blog entry > a while back, > wishing for a Sun-badged 1U SAS JBOD with room for 8 > drives. I'm > amaze

[zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread David J. Orman
> Hi David, > > I don't know if your company qualifies as a startup > under Sun's regs > but you can get an X4500/Thumper for $24,000 under > this program: > http://www.sun.com/emrkt/startupessentials/ > > Best Regards, > Jason I'm already a part of the Startup Essentials program. Perhaps I shou

[zfs-discuss] Re: External drive enclosures + Sun Server for massstorage

2007-01-20 Thread Anton B. Rang
> To me, hard drives today are as much a commodity item as network cable, > GBICs, NICs, DVD drives, etc. They are and they aren't. Reliability, particularly in high-heat & vibration environments, can vary quite a bit. > For sun to charge 4-8 times street price for hard drives that they order j