What could ever make anyone think that just because its digital, it doesn't need to be calibrated? At some point there is an interface that reacts to a Force, and creates an electrical signal. (Transponder) That may mean it either works or it doesn't, or it may mean that it is correct or it isn't. If it's number 2, you'll still be calibrating.
Thom McMahon, SET Firetech, Inc. 2560 Copper Ridge Dr P.O. Box 882136 Steamboat Springs, CO 80488 Tel: 970-879-7952 Fax: 970-879-7926 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Fletcher, Ron Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 10:59 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Gauge Calibration I'm looking forward to the day when all the gauges are digital and we won't have to guess if the pitot pressure from the 4" hydrant butt is 28.4 or 28.8 (lmao). It could be critical if your local sprinkler scientist won't let you slide on 31 gpm. Happy Friday everyone, Ron Fletcher Aero Automatic Phoenix, AZ -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thom McMahon Sent: Friday, August 01, 2008 8:59 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Gauge Calibration RE-testing a fire pump for not using calibrated gauges, is an AHJ issue. Calibration is only required once a year as far as I can see, for any testing device. By doing that it doesn't mean that your gauges are correct or in spec.(it means they were when they were tested.) Just as with BFP you can test and pass a device, and then disconnect and re-connect your gauge, and it will fail. Was the first test wrong or a failure? NO. At the time of the test it passed. Does that indicate or mean anything about any other time? NO. Calibration for Fire protection is more Just A "Warm Fuzzy" than an indication of the exacting science of our profession. As you said on a fire pump test your matching a pre-determined curve, any large variation would alert you to an issue such as a bad gauge. Thom McMahon, SET Firetech, Inc. 2560 Copper Ridge Dr P.O. Box 882136 Steamboat Springs, CO 80488 Tel: 970-879-7952 Fax: 970-879-7926 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ken Holsopple (forum) Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 8:20 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Gauge Calibration Tom, Fortunately it was a small pump and the gauge in question was the one used on the single hose monster. Fortunate our pump rep. had one in his van with the calibration paperwork. Why would I need to re-test when the calibration is not required by NFPA 20 (03)? Ken -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thom McMahon Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 6:12 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Water Supply Ken if you're doing BFP testing you get your test sets calibrated each year, you can send your gauges in at the same time. Personally we keep two sets and that way we are never without one as they expire one month apart. Additionally if you run into this problem at test, I would offer to run the test, then insert the gauge in an envelope addressed to the calibration co, record the serial # of the gauge. (If it doesn't have one write one on it in marker. Note that # on the test report. Offer to let the AHJ stick it in the mail, and include a request that the AHJ be copied on the Calibration report. When it comes back, if it's within 1% your test is complete, if not you may have to re-test, which it sounds like you have to do anyway. Thom McMahon, SET Firetech, Inc. 2560 Copper Ridge Dr P.O. Box 882136 Steamboat Springs, CO 80488 Tel: 970-879-7952 Fax: 970-879-7926 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ken Holsopple (forum) Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 2:41 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Water Supply Ok guys and gals.....here's one for ya. Just did a pump acceptance test under 2003 edition of NFPA 20. The inspector shows up on site and asks for calibrated gauges. Even though we pulled out a gauge that came from the factory 3 months ago, he wanted to see the paperwork. (I guess he didn't like the dirt that was on the gauge either from a previous diesel pump flow test. Turns out things get muddy when you do those) After reviewing NFPA 20 (03) I see that there is not a requirement for gauge calibration except in the appendix, to which no tolerance for the gauges is given. I questioned the inspector on the requirement and asked for a code reference. What I got back was the re-write that appears in the 2007 edition of the acceptance procedure that does note that gauges must be calibrated and within +/- 1%. I'm fine with that, except for the fact that here in Pennsyltucky and in his jurisdiction, the 2003 is the applicable standard. Now to take it one step further, the new NFPA 20 (07) mentions that the gauges must be calibrated annually (depending on use...kinda open ended don't ya think?). In speaking with some folks that supplied our shiny 4 1/2" Glycerine filled gauges, they mentioned that we could get them calibrated, but "what are you gonna do, get them calibrated after every use?" They do mention in the literature for our gauges (that I sent to the AHJ) that they are calibrated at the factory. Keeping in mind that scientists are probably using their "top of the line" gauges to measure the force of an atom bouncing of a cow's butt. I mentioned to the AHJ that in the meantime (till the 2007 ed comes around), the township could purchase a calibrated gauge and use that as a benchmark and throw the contractor's gauge(s) on a static point of the system if they think something was tampered with. I would be curious to see how others would handle this. AHJs especially. You'ins keep my life interesting. Getting calibrated gauge paperwork isn't a big deal (well it is if they spring this on you at the time of test), but trying to enforce rules that haven't been adopted yet kinda crosses the line in my book. By the way, I did check out NFPA 291 (forgot the edition), there was mention of calibration, but no mention of tolerance. I have a headache from bouncing my head off the soapbox. Ken Holsopple Design Manager & Gauge Calibration Coordinator Rowe Sprinkler Systems _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.10/1584 - Release Date: 7/31/2008 12:00 PM _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.10/1585 - Release Date: 8/1/2008 6:39 AM _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.5.10/1585 - Release Date: 8/1/2008 6:39 AM _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
