How about just fire extinguishers. I have yet to personally conduct a thorough code research on the topic but I have dug into a few codes including those mentioned earlier. I haven't found anything definitive.
Given there are sooo many safety precautions, automatic shutoffs, and regulations instilled with the transfer of the fuel, this may be a case where IF there is an issue after ALL the precautions fail, let the trained emergency personnel take care of it. I have yet to see any motor fuel dispensing facilities be equipped with any fire protection other than extinguishers. There must be a code t back this up. They do appear to have sensors/detectors however. I am not talking about fuel farms...that is something different. Duane Johnson Strickland Fire Protection Sent from my iPhone > On Dec 8, 2015, at 5:11 PM, Steve Leyton <[email protected]> wrote: > > EXACTLY. None of us has ever seen a gas station fire in all likelihood > because the equipment is equipped with so many fail-safety devices and so > long as idiots aren't smoking or lighting incense as they refuel, it's very > low risk, empirically speaking. If there's a fire on the ground, how well > does a canopy trap heat? With no walls, the horizontal movement of > byproducts is going to be fairly high-velocity, no? Unless you have some > fire modeling or test data in hand, your and my guesses are the best we're > going to have with regard to the chances of sprinklers skipping or even > operating at all. The AHJ is probably requiring sprinklers for the reason > you state - so he/she can sleep at night, so give them sprinklers. > > As to the use of foam by responders, I think everyone would agree that > there's a significant difference in the metrics of programming operations in > a muni fire department than in the cost-benefit analysis of a fixed foam > extinguishing system and the impact it would have on the design of the > protected premises. Water has been successfully fire tested in flammable > liquids fires, from mist to ESFR. So if the AHJ wants sprinklers, give them > "sprinklers". > > SL > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf Of [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2015 2:04 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Canopies Over gas Pumps > > Wow, really? What is that stuff the guys in the red trucks spray on liquid > fuel spills and over car fires? > > Hate to disagree but OH I is even questionable for a parking garage > regardless of what NPFA says and for a gas station well it's just silly. > I've never seen a little gas station fire. > > But at the end of the day you do what allows you to sleep at night. > > Craig L. Prahl > Fire Protection Group Lead/SME > CH2MHILL > Lockwood Greene > 1500 International Drive > Spartanburg, SC 29303 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > CH2MHILL Extension 74102 > [email protected] > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf Of Steve Leyton > Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2015 4:51 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Canopies Over gas Pumps > > Please, stop. This is NOT flammable liquids storage. Foam and wind effect > and all this other stuff is Henny-Penny-the-sky-is-falling distraction > (IMHO). 7.3.5.2 of 30A states, " Where required, an automatic fire > suppression system shall be installed in accordance with the appropriate NFPA > standard, manufacturer's instructions, and the listing requirements of the > systems. Obviously, NFPA 13 doesn't have a prescriptive for fuel island > canopies, so let's use some common sense. The fuel is stored in UG tanks > away from the islands and retail store or cashiers hut. NFPA 30 doesn't > apply as this isn't storage, but Chapter 18 states that when a hose is used > in the transfer of F/C liquids as part of an "incidental operation", it shall > be equipped with a self-closing valve. That's what a automotive fuel hose > does - it's a dead man that kicks off from several triggers including back > pressure and impact. So the movie scene of a guy having a heart attack and > squirting a steady stream of fuel into the air as a crow drops a burning > cigarette butt into the pool is ... far-fetched. At most, we can reasonable > expect that there could be a quart of gasoline on the ground if there's an > accident, so we would be protecting for that and the cars at the island that > are ostensibly full or nearly full of fuel. Just like in an OH 1 parking > garage. > > OH 2 if it's a month ending in Y ... my 3ยข. > > SL > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf Of [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2015 10:25 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Canopies Over gas Pumps > > This is outside the purview of NFPA 13. > > You're dealing with flammable and combustible liquids, hydrocarbons on which > water alone will have limited affect. > > For fuel loading/unloading stations it is common to employ foam-water deluge > for the area below the canopy. > > Also an option is dry chemical. Pyrochem has a system called ATTENDANT II > (distributed by Tyco) > > The HAJ would have to approve either one but more tend to lean towards a > sprinklered solution than a one-shot gaseous system. A very windy day could > totally render a gaseous extinguishing system useless. > > For design you do need to consider wind effect on your system discharge. > Don't get swayed into the minimum .16 gpm/sf permitted on foam-water systems. > You can have coverage issues again due to wind influences. > > NFPA 30, NFPA 30A, NFPA 16 and NFPA 2001 are good places to start. > > Good luck and have fun! > > Craig L. Prahl > Fire Protection Group Lead/SME > CH2MHILL > Lockwood Greene > 1500 International Drive > Spartanburg, SC 29303 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > CH2MHILL Extension 74102 > [email protected] > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf Of James Crawford > Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2015 1:04 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Canopies Over gads Pumps > > Looking for some direction on the protection of a Gas Service station canopy > over the gas pumps. > > > > We have an AHJ that want the canopy protected, but I can't find anything that > outlines the protection requirements for this area. My first thought is Extra > Hazard group 1. > > > > Can someone point me in the right direction > > > > > > Thank you > > > > > > James Crawford > > Phaser Fire Protection Ltd. > > Phone 604-888-0318 > > Fax 604-888-4732 > > Cel 604-790-0938 > > Email [email protected] > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
