Don, I just wanted to add that I have seen sidewalls and pendants for column protection accepted also. I suppose the reasoning is that the columns are not the building contents determining the hazard classification. And sprinklers are just one of a few methods for protecting the columns.
good catch by the way with your clip, Brad On Aug 10, 2016 2:13 PM, "IPA" <[email protected]> wrote: > There we go... the justification for the horizontally mounted pendants. > Thank you! > > > On Wed, Aug 10, 2016 at 11:11 AM, Don Casey <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> >> >> Heads get used in ways they haven’t been listed in multiple scenarios. >> >> >> >> One easy one is for protecting steel columns when working with NFPA 15. >> I’ve used both pens and sidewalls depending on the configuration. >> >> >> >> In a duct, we’re typically looking to dump a certain amount of water into >> the duct which can be achieved using a sidewall or a pendant. >> >> >> >> Side note: a pen in a vertical duct would not be installed per it’s >> listing and in a horizontal duct, it won’t meet the obstruction rules >> unless the duct diameter was greater than 18inches. >> >> >> >> As long as you can calculate the head(s) to deliver/operate at the >> flows/pressures stated by the applicable Standard (13 or 33 in this case) >> and is designed to operate at the minimum pressure as specified by the >> head’s listing (okay….not likely to come into play unless you wanted to use >> a K25 head and even then). >> >> >> >> Lastly, if you’re a stamping professional, you can come up with any >> design you think will work (which you’ve presumably based on data, >> experience, calculations, etc.). >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-bounces >> @lists.firesprinkler.org] *On Behalf Of *[email protected] >> *Sent:* 2016/08/10 1:46 PM >> >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* RE: Paint spray application >> >> >> >> Ductwork is like protecting specialty equipment, there isn’t necessarily >> a box you can put it in when it comes to NFPA 13 occupancies. You have to >> be able to analyze the process and determine the hazard before you can >> assign a protection scheme for things such as this. >> >> >> >> One additional tool in the designer’s toolbox is the FM Global data >> sheets. NFPA 13 doesn’t always address every single possible protection >> scheme where a water based sprinkler would be beneficial. If you have >> questions about a particular application you can refer to other recognized >> industry Standards for additional information and insight. >> >> >> >> The owner doesn’t have to be FM insured to be able to use this data to >> defend or establish a design criteria for unique applications that NFPA may >> not address. I have yet to run across an AHJ that rejected the use of FM >> Global criteria when NFPA didn’t address the situation. >> >> >> >> >> *Craig L. Prahl* >> Fire Protection Group Lead/SME >> *CH2M* >> 200 Verdae Blvd. >> Greenville, SC 29607 >> Direct - 864.920.7540 >> >> Fax - 864.920.7129 >> >> CH2MHILL Extension 77540 >> [email protected] >> >> >> >> *From:* Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-bounces >> @lists.firesprinkler.org <[email protected]>] >> *On Behalf Of *Brad Casterline >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 10, 2016 1:03 PM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* RE: Paint spray application [EXTERNAL] >> >> >> >> Well, it's all I got. >> >> >> >> I think there is a little wiggle room regarding occupancy classification. >> For example, in the duct we can be max 12'-0" whilst outside the duct it is >> 10' max. >> >> That's a little weak, but, seeing as how I am a NICET certified >> engineering technician I see no wiggle room in using a sprinkler outside >> it's listing. I believe like you that deflector orientation in a duct is a >> non-issue due to deflectors determine the pattern at the floor, butt.... >> >> >> >> see "Ken's well known aversion to courtrooms" for details :) >> >> >> >> Brad >> >> >> >> ps, thank you, and you too Bob, for helping me out of the doldrums >> yesterday >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-bounces >> @lists.firesprinkler.org <[email protected]>] >> *On Behalf Of *[email protected] >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 10, 2016 7:44 AM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* RE: Paint spray application >> >> >> >> How do you know the quantity of combustibles? >> >> >> >> Typically the issues with ductwork is based on a hazardous environment >> (transporting flammable or combustible vapors or combustible particulate) >> that’s the whole reason behind the requirement of protection of the >> ductwork. The other condition is that there is accumulation of the same >> material on the interior of the duct over time creating a hazardous >> environment. >> >> >> >> So in either case there is no way to call it an ordinary hazard >> environment. >> >> >> >> >> *Craig L. Prahl* >> Fire Protection Group Lead/SME >> *CH2M* >> 200 Verdae Blvd. >> Greenville, SC 29607 >> Direct - 864.920.7540 >> >> Fax - 864.920.7129 >> >> CH2MHILL Extension 77540 >> [email protected] >> >> >> >> *From:* Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-bounces >> @lists.firesprinkler.org <[email protected]>] >> *On Behalf Of *Brad Casterline >> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 10, 2016 8:40 AM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* RE: Paint spray application [EXTERNAL] >> >> >> >> To be completely formal, is it possible to consider the duct to be an OH >> portion of the EH Classification? Not much quantity of combustible there. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum- >> firesprinkler.org >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler. > org > >
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