On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:38 AM, Pascal Robert wrote: > > Le 2012-03-27 à 19:30, Mike Schrag a écrit : > >>>>> "I think we should use the funds to pay people to fix issues that the >>>>> majority of users are having. The issues will be voted by the community >>>>> and the most voted issues will become the highest priorities." >>>> >>>> >>>> That is not how Wonder was created and now how I expect that it will >>>> continue. If you have a problem, learn how to fix it. Then put it in >>>> Wonder. >>> >>> In the past, we had Apple sponsorship and most of the big additions to >>> Wonder between 2007 and 2010 came from Apple… We don't have that >>> sponsorship anymore, and personally I don't think we will survive if we >>> don't pay people for major stuff. I don't think we will survive anyway, but >>> that's another story… >> Apple funded a VERY small percentage of the contributions to Wonder. Almost >> all of the contributions I made came from mDimension donating their time, >> bandwidth, and hardware for the good of the community. Frankly, if Apple >> hadn't funded the things they did, I would have done them anyway, because I >> just enjoyed making things. >> >> This approach of paying for fixes seems like you're just going to end up >> with a collection of bounty hunters instead of a community. On top of that, >> there's no way you're going to be able to afford to pay the market cost for >> this work. mDimension easily donated a couple hundred thousand dollars of >> time if you applied their real hourly rate to the work. So on top of >> encouraging people to only give if they get paid, they're going to be paid >> crap, so why would anyone even bother? >> >> I really don't think things are stagnant because of the lack of money. >> They're stagnant because the remaining people in the community don't care >> enough to contribute. I don't buy any of the "I don't know how to do X" or >> "I don't have time to do X." You have to want it. I didn't know how to write >> nearly any of what was in WOLips before I started working on WOLips, and >> likewise with Wonder. I learned WebObjects working on Wonder. I'm would >> wager that everyone who worked on Wonder was in the same category. >> Contribution is also positive reinforcement. The coolest times in Wonder for >> me were always when one person contributing got someone else energized to >> contribute and amazing things were made. >> >> The real question is: Who is currently NOT contributing because they're just >> waiting for a payday to do so? If you're perfectly happy enjoying the fruits >> of the community while not giving back to the community, look in the mirror >> for the reason it's dying. Either give a shit, or don't be sad that it dies. > > I think reasons don't contribute are: > > 1) Some just don't care and are leachers. Yes, people you can blame me to > saying that. But anyway, any community are like that, no community have > everyone contributing, it's just plain impossible. > > 2) People are afraid of contributing. That's one of the reasons of why I > added the "integration" branch in Wonder, and doing a "Contributing to the > community" talk at WOWODC. > > 3) People don't have time. That's the answer I got from many WO experts. And > I can't do anything about that. > > So I really don't know how we can improve the situation… > >
There are two extra reasons that people do not contribute: the scale of the project is immense. It is really intimidating to have a look at the project and see what is available. This is not a place where people beginning to learn a framework would be happy with. Which leads me to another reason people do not contribute: people get stuck in a problem and there is no infrastructure to work together properly. I have started to build several things I would have liked to contribute to Wonder (some localized date-time D2W component and a print as pdf/excel D2W component) that i am sure with the help of some people would be fixed in half a day. Problem is that from where I am working, the nearest approachable WO-developer would be located in Germany, a few hundred miles away. I think an IRC channel, that once was setup, but never practically used, or some other 'live' channel that would be available at a specific time would get me a lot more productive in contributing stuff. On the other hand, I am a Casual WebObjects Developer, I spend a few hours/days a month tinkering with WebObjects projects, and sometime (like now) actually building some new stuff. That might also lead to my pitiful contributing situation. Sniff. Anyway, I think it might be a nice idea to have a place where one can find requests to improve Wonder, so that if there is interest, people can pool together to get something fixed or build. I think working side to side from experienced and less experienced people might lead to more contributions. For instance: I would like to have/use/build a localized time/date component, a GoogleMaps/OpenStreetMap component and a proper introduction in how to use OpenId version 2 with Wonder. If anybody is interested in working with me (some experience, bot not into the deepest bowls of the frameworks), please let me know. Something like that. (Did I just start something?) > _______________________________________________ > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/johan%40netsense.nl > > This email sent to jo...@netsense.nl Vriendelijke Groeten, Johan Henselmans jo...@netsense.nl _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to arch...@mail-archive.com
