Right but you have another 6db to get a stronger signal. On 11/22/09, Jayson Baker <jay...@spectrasurf.com> wrote: > Yes, you get more signal, but you have much less spectrum for your spread > spectrum radio to operate in. > Spread spectrum doesn't always use the full 20MHz, it will skip around -- > that's the "spread" part of it. > So if you lower that to 5MHz, then you have virtually no "spread" and > anything that may be inside that 5MHz > will cause you a much more deteriorated performance than if it was in your > 20MHz. > > On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Mike <m...@aweiowa.com> wrote: > >> I should think the opposite is true. Halve the signal, improve >> signal to noise 3 dB. Half it again and the improvement is 6 dB >> signal to noise. Should give you way more margin. My tests prove that >> out. >> >> >> At 08:44 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote: >> >IIRC, 5MHz and 10MHz is more sucepstible to interference than 20MHz. >> > >> >On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS < >> >ilopezli...@sandboxitsolutions.com> wrote: >> > >> > > I'm gonna have to set up the environment again. Only thing I cant >> > > simulate right now is distance. >> > > >> > > As long as it wasnt some voodoo config setting that made it work >> better, >> > > I might have to play with the Mobile NS2's settings for it to play >> nicely. >> > > >> > > OT: What is CCQ? >> > > >> > > -Israel >> > > >> > > Josh Luthman wrote: >> > > > It is very weird isn't it? >> > > > >> > > > Vi is better the Emacs. >> > > > >> > > > On 11/22/09, Mike <m...@aweiowa.com> wrote: >> > > > >> > > >> Josh: >> > > >> >> > > >> I thought that too. I have a handful of customers on a 5 MHz >> > > >> sector. Winbox shows this: >> > > >> >> > > >> Emacs! >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> Mike >> > > >> >> > > >> At 07:32 PM 11/22/2009, you wrote: >> > > >> >> > > >>> I believe when you half the channels the rates also get halved - >> from >> > > >>> 54mbit >> > > >>> to 27mbit max (that is from 20mhz to 10mhz channels). >> > > >>> >> > > >>> I also can't see why you're voice would be having problems in half >> or >> > > >>> quarter channels unless there is a software bug. It should only >> > > improve >> > > >>> unless you're using all available bandwidth. >> > > >>> >> > > >>> Josh Luthman >> > > >>> Office: 937-552-2340 >> > > >>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >> > > >>> 1100 Wayne St >> > > >>> Suite 1337 >> > > >>> Troy, OH 45373 >> > > >>> >> > > >>> "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources." >> > > >>> --- Albert Einstein >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>> On Sun, Nov 22, 2009 at 8:08 PM, Chuck Hogg <ch...@shelbybb.com> >> > > wrote: >> > > >>> >> > > >>> >> > > >>>> First, you should have a better signal than -70 at <5Miles away >> with a >> > > >>>> 24dB/NS2 antenna and a B2HP/9dB omni. I get 65 or better with a >> 19dB >> > > >>>> panel. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Don't forget, 10MHz channel is 1/2 available bandwidth and 5MHz >> > > >>>> is >> 1/4 >> > > >>>> available bandwidth. Really, you will get about 7-10MBit >> aggregate >> > > >>>> (depending on how many customers) on a 5MHz channel connected at >> > > 54MBit, >> > > >>>> which requires signals at -74dBm with a good fade margin (10dB). >> > > Also, >> > > >>>> the TX power is significantly less for 54MBps (23dBm) vs >> > > 24MBps(28dBm), >> > > >>>> less than half. Likely, you are connecting at 48MBps or 36Mbps, >> which >> > > >>>> at that rate your total available "real case" bandwidth is as >> little >> > > as >> > > >>>> 4MBps, while at 20MHz you are at 15+. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> A narrower channel should not affect your transmission, likely >> will >> > > make >> > > >>>> signals better, roughly double (+3dBm) from 20-10, and double >> > > >>>> from >> > > >>>> 10-5(total +6dBm). >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Regards, >> > > >>>> Chuck Hogg >> > > >>>> Shelby Broadband >> > > >>>> 502-722-9292 >> > > >>>> ch...@shelbybb.com >> > > >>>> http://www.shelbybb.com >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> -----Original Message----- >> > > >>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: >> wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >> > > On >> > > >>>> Behalf Of os10ru...@gmail.com >> > > >>>> Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2009 6:20 PM >> > > >>>> To: WISPA General List >> > > >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 10MHz, 5MHz - unstable for voice? >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Well next time definitely bring more food! Beef jerky and granola >> > > bars. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> In my testing the narrower channels just made things slower. I >> > > >>>> was >> > > >>>> testing in a pristine area where there was no other 5.8GHz going >> on. >> > > >>>> >From what I hear if the environment had been polluted >> > > >>>> performance >> > > might >> > > >>>> have actually gone up with the narrower channels. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >From what I've read narrower channels doesn't effect packet size >> or >> > > >>>> transport. But switching to WDS bridged does. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> Greg >> > > >>>> On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:15 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote: >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>> Its not in the field, but it is sitting here in my bedroom >> looking >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> cool :). >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>> I was thinking that using the 10/5MHz bandwidth required one to >> setup >> > > >>>>> something else. I'm not that familiar with the use of >> half/quarter >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> rate >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>> channels and how that affects the frame transport/packet size >> etc,. >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> I wonder if it was environment based rather than >> > > >>>>> 'software/configuration' based. If I get some time this evening >> I >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> might >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>> setup the gear again for more focused testing (Testing in the >> field >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> with >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>> volunteers who are cold and hungry dont usually respond well to >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>> testing >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>> plans). >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> -Israel >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>> os10ru...@gmail.com wrote: >> > > >>>>> >> > > >>>>>> Just for kicks I'd try WDS bridged. Do you have control from >> where >> > > >>>>>> >> > > >>>> you're at now? Is the equipment still set up? >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>> Greg >> > > >>>>>> >> > > >>>>>> On Nov 22, 2009, at 6:02 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote: >> > > >>>>>> >> > > >>>>>> >> > > >>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>> @Travis Johnson - Yes Upgraded to newest firmware for the two >> units >> > > >>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>> @os10rules - Nope, Fixed was simple AP and Mobile was Station >> modes >> > > >>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>> os10ru...@gmail.com wrote: >> > > >>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> Running WDS bridged? >> > > >>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> Greg >> > > >>>>>>>> On Nov 22, 2009, at 5:37 PM, Israel Lopez-LISTS wrote: >> > > >>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Hey All, >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> I did some field tests (for overseas volunteer project) with >> some >> > > >>>>>>>>> Ubituiti gear; Nanostation2 & Bullet2HP. >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> One thing that was surprising was the performance >> > > >>>>>>>>> degradation >> > > when >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> switching from 20MHz to 10MHz/5MHz. Our tests were Raw >> Bandwidth >> > > >>>>>>>>> Tests(AirOS), Video (VLC UDP Stream), Voice (Trixbox G711 >> Voice >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> Call), >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> and MTR (Latency, Jitter) >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> I still have data to collect and prepare a report for the >> tech >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> team, but >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> we did notice that when we switched to 10 or 5MHz bandwidth >> our >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> voice >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> calls was greatly degraded. Only one way; from Fixed to >> Mobile I >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> could >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> hear the Fixed station easily. Mobile to Fixed the voice >> > > >>>>>>>>> was >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> choppy. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> We started to get packet loss & massive jitter on 10MHz, >> > > >>>>>>>>> just >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> going back >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> to 20MHz made the links stable. >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Fixed Station: On a mountain side - HPOL 9dBI Omni >> Directional >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> with a >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Bullet2HP @400mW >> > > >>>>>>>>> Mobile Station: 8km away near large body of water - >> > > >>>>>>>>> Bullet2HP >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> @400mW w/ >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> 24dBi Directional (HPOL Alignment) -70dbm RSSI >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Any ideas? We are planning on using 10MHz channels & H-Pol >> to >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> combat >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> any future spectrum pollution and voice calls over this >> network >> > > is >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> expected. >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> -Israel >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> > > >>>> -------- >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> > > >>>>>>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> > > >>>> -------- >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> > > >>>>>>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> > > >>>> -------- >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! 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-- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources." --- Albert Einstein -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
