Your in danger of falling off your high horses.
No one is making any judgmental assumptions about anyone (specifically). In
fact, this reader would not have known who posted the comment about Paul
until others mentioned specific names. This comment was made:
Yes, this is one of the
Dear james
you write: internet lists have, at times, raised eyebrows precisely because someone makes a comment that is derrogatory about an institution or individuals on an institution. IMO, to make such a comment is never acceptable. The internet, however, seems to breed it and that, I feel,
I am very sensitive when people start throwing doubts on other peoples motives publicly. To me it is slander. And I will continue to say so. And I have nothing against this person Steve. But anybody who makes a slanderous remark will hear something in protest from me. Even if that person is my
I will only comment that what most Bahais call firesides are not firesides in my view at all. And I have noticed that I become less clear in teaching the more I use my own understanding of the faith, and that my words have more impact if i use in a natural way quotes from the writings when I tell
Janine and James et al,
Your in danger of falling off your high horses. I never suggested any actual
impropriety, what I asked for was that the Ruhi Institute materials be
placed in the public digital domain, in order to avoid/mitigate any
semblance of impropriety, any possibility of pecuniary
I never suggested any actual
impropriety, what I asked for was that the Ruhi Institute materials be
placed in the public digital domain, in order to avoid/mitigate any
semblance of impropriety,
The problem Steve, is that I don't think anyone saw any semblance of
impropriety until you suggested
Book 6 gave me a scenario for the subjects which are
most important to be brought up in talking to another
about the bahai faith (I happen to agree with the
importance of the subjects book 6 suggest) and also
gave me a manner, a way of speakign and being with a
person one wants to tell about the
I thought there is Core in the USA. Is that not considered an alternative?
Dear Janine,
The Fundamental Verities portion of the Core Curriculum existed prior to the
Study Circles and was then modified to meet the House's criteria for a basic
sequence of courses. But Ruhi got a head start here
I remember when I did book 6, I had a problem with one of the editorial
comments about one of the quotations.
Dear Firouz,
I've had problems this way as well, though I've never done Book 6. But one
Baha'i insisted I wasn't giving firesides right because I wasn't keeping it
simple like Book 6
Dear Susan,
you are right I have not seen any statistics ;o)
I think a devotional meeting is not passing the prayer book around. I think it is creating a devotional atmosphere. I usually print out some quotes and prayers and try to make it as diverse as possible, with prayers from different
So, why not ask your NSA directly? Or the UHJ?
You see, I think fundamentalism is the last thing the world needs. It has been overemphasis of one aspect which lead religions into acts unworthy of the religion. I am quite viligant that this should not happen in the Bahai faith. So if I was
I think some people are more interested in a small group than others. It
may be that in your area a devotional in a house does not work, but one
cannot know that for certain until at least 4 or 5 people have tried it on a
regular basis.
Dear Janine,
We don't have much choice where I live
So, why not ask your NSA directly? Or the UHJ?
Dear Janine,
I nearly did that recently when I wrote the House regarding another matter.
But a Counsellor wisely advised me against dumping all the gripes I had
collected over the last five years on them that way. ;-}
I stuck to the original
Yes, this is one of the difficulties I find and that is that one of the
principal publishers of the Ruhi materials is Palabra Publications which is
associated with Paul Lample who is one of the staunchest supporters and
promoters of the Study Circle engine on the ITC. I wonder too if there
are
Susan, it could be argued that our efforts, in general, have been less
effective in urban areasOne cannot be sure that Ruhi, itself, is less
effective than any other approach in urban areas.
Dear James,
Yes, if effectiveness is measured by an increase in human resources or entry
by troops,
Both gentlemen support the
process and understand its potentialand both are quite open to other
materials
they have just seen the success that this process can have
and, therefore, encourage what is available and useful.
Dear James,
I have heard Dr. Arbab make remarks to this effect,
The opposite would also be true. Areas where Baha'is are very active in
study circles might experience large-scale growth just because they have
active Baha'is to begin with, not because of Ruhi. I expect to see high
growth, for instance, in the triangle area of North Carolina which is very
In a message dated 1/18/2005 11:28:41 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I think it would be more precise to say that Study Circles are about aProcess. Ruhi represents certain materials designed to further that process
I agree. Ruhi is a curriculum. I have done four books so
James wrote:
Paul is very aware of the tendency for the American community to become
gemicky.he seeks a sustained process. Let's start out by focusing on
one set of materials; after we have mastered that, then we move on.
Gimicky?
Work had been done on the Fundamental Verities program long
In a message dated 1/18/2005 5:37:32 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Also, I've heard Counsellor insist that tobe a homefront pioneer requires that one be prepared to set up studycircles, and in the absence of an alternative curriculum, that means Ruhi.
The Southern Regiona
suggest
to me that even when we are finished we just start
the whole thing over
again, which again, takes up all our resources.
The study circles are first and foremost something to
offer to the community. We are talking about
multiplying the study circles, and at this moment in
Ireland the ruhi
:o)
I must admit i was in a slightly provocative mood when
I made that statement.
The thing is, what I often see people call a fireside
I don't think is a fireside at all. It is an official
talk about what one person thinks the bahai faith is
saying about a certain topic.
But then, I am a
Hi Susan,
My take on it is this.
Book 2 offered me the idea of introducing Baha'u'llahs
words in a natural way in my speech. It gave me the
practice and confidence to talk more freely than ever
before about the Bahai teachings.
Book 6 gave me a scenario for the subjects which are
most
Dear Susan,
One does not exclude the other. I also feel that your
interpretation of what Abdu'l-Baha is trying to do is
too narrow. I think it does apply not only to assembly
members, but to all of the community. I will later
post some quotes for the reason why I think this, when
I am back at a
Can I beg you all most humbly most supplicatingly to leave this sort of
discussion about discussion about slander about Ruhi? I have noted such
discussions become rapidly very very divisive. It can sunder and divide a
most dear friend from a post code in nz from one in Ireland...or one from
What is a fireside? Getting a
couple of friends together and talk about the Bahai
faith.
Dear Janine,
When the Guardian said it was the best teaching method he gave as his reason
that it allows the seeker to ask all of the questions in their hearts.
What did it turn into? official talks about
Janine,
At 10:31 PM 1/16/2005, you wrote:
and it is too fundamentalistic in approach.
You hit on one of my pet peeves. The Ruhi method, as I have seen it conducted
(and as I have heard from most other people), *is*, IMO, fundamentalist, and I
am concerned it is being promoted by the
Hi Mark,
Oh dear. This could easily end in a pro-contra ruhi debate. When I hear objections to things I always want to try to assess how much of these objections are based in truth. The same when I hear glorification of things.
how many people OUTSIDE the USA do you know who have gone through
In a message dated 1/17/2005 10:37:49 A.M. Central Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
The same when I hear glorification of things.
how many people OUTSIDE the USA do you know who have gone through the
ruhi books, who have done more than one?
Dear Janine,
If most people are
Hi Susan,
well, I am not sure that most people are turned off by book one here in Ireland for a start. I am sure that a lot of people who are bahais for a while initially have a bias against book one, until the method is explained to them. and why the repetition is. That is so in Europe, that is
I forgot one thing.
I want to ask you all, both in favour and those not in favour of ruhi, how sure you are you are objective, you follow the tablet of the true seeker in this and how ready you are to throw preconceived ideas and notions overboard. It is a question I invite you to ask yourself.
Chuckle!
No Ruhi is not academic. I omitted something there. What I intended was: if you live in a culture whihc has a strong subculture of anti-intellectualism and then a method is introduced which is not appealing to the intellect, it can create a strong bias against that method.
You say it
What I intended was: if you live in a culture whihc has a strong
subculture of anti-intellectualism and then a method is introduced which is
not appealing to the intellect, it can create a strong bias against that
method.
Dear Janine,
Ah yes, then we are on the same wave length. In fact I was
In a message dated 1/17/2005 12:21:51 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Maybe it is a good thing that firesides have stopped,
The NSA has made cleaqr over and over in the U.S. that the institute process should NOT make firesides and deepenings stop. If it is, then attitudes
The NSA has made cleaqr over and over in the U.S. that the institute
process should NOT make firesides and deepenings stop. If it is, then
attitudes need adjustment to comply with the guidance on the issue.
Dear Scott,
I don't think it is a matter of 'attitude' it is a matter of energy. There
is
Dear Scott,
What Abdu'l-Baha was trying to do was make sure that individual Assembly
members did not undermine the authority of the institution as a whole by
opposing the decision that body made. For them not to act in unity under
these circumstances is rather like parents arguing discipline
In fact, even our NSA seems to have largely been shut out of the process.
It mostly came down from the ITC, which as you know, is not an elected
institution.
Yes, this is one of the difficulties I find and that is that one of the
principal publishers of the Ruhi materials is Palabra Publications
Dear all,
I read some of the posts on ruhi on this list with
interest.
From what I am getting from the USA Bahais at various
places on the internet it seems that in the USA Ruhi
is tutored in quite a strict way, with a lot of
emphasis on 'how it is supposed to be taught'.
In Ireland we
38 matches
Mail list logo
