Well said Vetri. Walking without cane, unescorted, is surely folly. However, using one's residual sight for mobility purposes instead of wasting it on reading and writing print as some folks do, is also a sound idea I have given to a few who have made a good use of it. But, for totally blind, apart from white cane, can echolocation be taught and practiced as a supplemental mobility aid, as some folks in US claim to do? Are they exceptions, or it can be cultivated as a technique? Would have been interesting to grapple with all these issues practically at AI convention, which I would regretfully miss.
Anyway, I don't push away sometimes even unrequired mobility assistance by sighted, for who knows, lest they be repelled from assisting anybody. -----Original Message----- From: accessindia-boun...@accessindia.org.in [mailto:accessindia-boun...@accessindia.org.in] On Behalf Of Adhimoolam Vetrivel Murugan Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2011 11:56 AM To: accessindia@accessindia.org.in Subject: Re: [AI] Tips to manage without escort? But if you are looking for tips without white cane, then I am afraid that you are out of luck. Especially for someone with little or no vision, nothing can supstitute mobility aids like cane. If you are looking for tips with white cane, then that's a reasonable expectation and fokes here can provide tips to minimise the reliability on escorts. I would also like to bring another misconception to the forefront. Some fokes even among visually challenged consider someone walking around without cane being smart. I can say that there's nothing smart about it and it's actually stupid and such attitudes put himself or herself in danger. Vetri. On 24/09/2011, Renuka Warriar <eren...@gmail.com> wrote: > Sorry, in spite of all the views expressed in this thread, I could > not find any tips to manage without escort, except using the white > cane, and that too is not well explained. > Renuka. > > > On 9/24/11, jignesh thakur <jigneshthaku...@gmail.com> wrote: >> Friends, >> First of all, I respect each views, and expect the same from all. >> Somebody rightly said that this topic is more important then screen >> readers. >> What is social dignity? If I am given 2 choices of so called social >> dignity, and my independence, I would like to choose the second one. >> Though I am not good enough as far as mobility is concern yet for me >> personal satisfaction matters most. >> Of course while you go with white can people will ask ridicules >> questions, but I think it would happened more or less if you would go >> with sighted escort. And one can reduce risk factor by developing good >> mobility. >> I have seen many visually impaired people who manage very well without >> sighted escort. >> Above all, self satisfaction is really important. >> Though it's tough to manage without escort but with confidence it is >> possible. >> I don't want to say that we should not use escort, its necessary >> sometime to have sighted person with you. But we should honestly try >> to reduce sighted assistance as much as possible. >> let me thanks rajesh sir for this topic on the list. >> Thanks... >> >> >> On 9/23/11, Rahul Bajaj <rahul.bajaj10...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> Hi all, >>> >>> First of all, I'm glad to see this thread. >>> I think that this matters more than all other screen readers, >>> assistive devices and all such other things. >>> >>> Even I fail to comprehend how totally blind people are able to move >>> on their own. >>> I have always taken the help of sighted guides for moving around. >>> Many people also feel that those who require sighted assistance are >>> more dependent on others than those who use white canes are. >>> >>> I personally feel that it's better to take the help of a sighted guide >>> instead of fumbling around just to prove that you are not dependent on >>> others. >>> Of course, there are people who are truly independent and do not >>> require much sighted assistance, but, like I said earlier, I really >>> don't know how they actually manage it. >>> >>> I feel that people, in general, have a very negative attitude towards >>> those who use white canes. >>> I'm not saying that they hate blind people, but there is a drastic >>> change in their behavior. >>> They start interfering unnecessarily in order to assist you, or they >>> start asking ridiculous questions. >>> All this also happens if you move around with a sighted guide, but I >>> believe that it happens more if you use a white cane. >>> Of course, this method also has its flaws, but what other option do we >>> have? >>> >>> On 23/09/2011, Mahesh Panicker <maheshspanic...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> The over emphasis placed on independent living is the result of the >>>> disability rights movement, in its social model version, simply >>>> accepting the liberal-modern notion of the individual as rational, >>>> free and independent. >>>> We need to may be think further in lines of human interdependence >>>> rather than any utopian notion of independent living, its a myth, not >>>> only for the disabled, but also for the non-disabled. >>>> When faced with a disadvantageous and dangerous environment, I would >>>> rather prefer an escort, than getting injured. >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> On 9/23/11, Anirban Mukherjee <sparsha.anir...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> i entirely agree with what Himanshu sir has said. i work in a rural >>>>> area in pashchimbanga and day in and day out have to encounter >>>>> difficulties like coliding with someone or with some object which >>>>> really hurt due particularly to the irresponsibility of some persons >>>>> without visual impairment. the rail station where i usually board my >>>>> train from becomes almost inaccessible in the evenings because of the >>>>> abundance of small shops where things of use are sold. there were >>>>> times when i nearly fell to the railway tracks. >>>>> >>>>> moreover many people don't know how to use a pavement. pavements in >>>>> larger cities here are dangerous to say the least for even a sighted >>>>> person; for a visually challanged person it is almost a nightmare. in >>>>> rural roads, there are no pavement or anything. so escort becomes a >>>>> necessity. but undoubtedly, moving alone is the most satisfying thing >>>>> irrespective of fumbling or no fumbling. but there is no heroism in >>>>> falling down and injuring oneself. >>>>> >>>>> we can enough philosophise regarding independence. but under the >>>>> present circumstance it is an illusive thing for us. hope one day will >>>>> come when this topic itself will become redundant. >>>>> >>>>> with thanks and regards, Anirban Mukherjee. >>>>> cell: 09433305139 >>>>> >>>>> On 9/23/11, BHAWANI SHANKAR VERMA <bsvermad...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> if a word hold is objectionable, the word grip can be replace withit. >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "Raj Debbarma" <rdbbarma...@gmail.com> >>>>>> To: <accessindia@accessindia.org.in> >>>>>> Sent: Friday, September 23, 2011 8:58 AM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [AI] Tips to manage without escort? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> hi sir, >>>>>>> i agree with all your point. >>>>>>> i don't find anything wrong to use cane specially in new surrounding >>>>>>> and also belief nothing wrong to ask direction to find our way. >>>>>>> in >>>>>>> terms of holding hand, what i think there might be cultural >>>>>>> differences reguarding this. but if you are caring cane its >>>>>>> automatically represent your blindness twards the society that point >>>>>>> of time if anyone hold your hand, i don't think anybody should have >>>>>>> any sort of problem. >>>>>>> its raj, have a nice day ahead to all of you. cheers >>>>>>> thank you.. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 9/22/11, Adhimoolam Vetrivel Murugan <vadhimoo...@gmail.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This is an interesting subject and here are my views: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> First, It does not matter whether we fumble around to find our ways >>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>> not. What matters is our ability to reach our destination on time >>>>>>>> without hurting our-self. In relation to that, who cares about >>>>>>>> others >>>>>>>> thinking when we fumble around to find our ways? Ones we adopt that >>>>>>>> mentality, then words like social dignity will make very little >>>>>>>> sense. >>>>>>>> Second, I would like to draw the attention to the point that Jean >>>>>>>> made. There is a significant cultural difference in terms of holding >>>>>>>> someone else's hand. I am sure that visually challenged people in >>>>>>>> India will agree with the fact that we don't mind holding hands not >>>>>>>> only in terms of sighted assistance, but also among friends who may >>>>>>>> be >>>>>>>> visually challenged. but among the blind people here in the US there >>>>>>>> is a slight difference in terms of holding hands as if holding >>>>>>>> others >>>>>>>> hands is undesirable or something like that. So one has to be aware >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> such cultural differences in this regard. My final point is to do >>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>> mobility during conference. As Jean pointed out, we should certainly >>>>>>>> make use of the cane since it will be a new surrounding, but at the >>>>>>>> same time there is nothing wrong in asking for directions. Just a >>>>>>>> passing comment about my attitude towards others assistance: Either >>>>>>>> guide me by holding my hands or leave me alone. I am intelegent >>>>>>>> enough >>>>>>>> to find my ways around. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Vetri. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 22/09/2011, Anirban Mukherjee <sparsha.anir...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> actually, escort becomes necessity at some times as far as i'm >>>>>>>>> concerned. but, i agree, that we must look for self-reliance. but >>>>>>>>> what >>>>>>>>> i would like to draw every body's attention is that the point that >>>>>>>>> Mr >>>>>>>>> Rajesh sir made regarding escort in the other thread is absolutely >>>>>>>>> valid. it is insulting to say the least. there should be discretion >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> making my own choices for me. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 9/22/11, mahendra <gal...@chello.at> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Dear Rajesh >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> i only agree with your thurd point, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> to think that escort is there, and we don't need mobility is very >>>>>>>>>> much >>>>>>>>>> wrong. >>>>>>>>>> sighted people can also put your life in to denjare, we must take >>>>>>>>>> responsibility >>>>>>>>>> for our life, and not totaly put responsibility on the shoulders >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> others. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> secondly because of dependence on sighted, social dignity is >>>>>>>>>> compromised, >>>>>>>>>> and not because you have to fumble around, it shows you are trying >>>>>>>>>> your >>>>>>>>>> best. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> At 09:21 AM 9/22/2011, you wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Srinivasu >>>>>>>>>>>Rightly said that low vision people don't face as much problems in >>>>>>>>>>>mobility as totally blind do. >>>>>>>>>>>It is not impossible to manage without escort, I have done it >>>>>>>>>>>myself, travelling on Nagpur Roads in student days, and even >>>>>>>>>>>travelling all alone in trains in UP, bringing my elder sister who >>>>>>>>>>>is herself blind with her kids from Lucknow to Nagpur, all by >>>>>>>>>>> myself. >>>>>>>>>>>My point is, without escort, >>>>>>>>>>>1. The mobility is fraught with inherent risks, sometimes of life. >>>>>>>>>>>2. More often than not, social dignity is compromised, as you have >>>>>>>>>>>to fumble around. >>>>>>>>>>>3. Your freedom, particularly in new surroundings, is greatly >>>>>>>>>>>curtailed. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>As a result, one should opt for an escort, if one is able to >>>>>>>>>>> afford, >>>>>>>>>>>and escort is available, except in situations where privacy is of >>>>>>>>>>>utmost importance. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>-----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>>From: accessindia-boun...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>>>[mailto:accessindia-boun...@accessindia.org.in] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>>>>Srinivasu Chakravarthula >>>>>>>>>>>Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2011 1:25 PM >>>>>>>>>>>To: accessindia@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>>>Subject: [AI] Tips to manage without escort? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Hi All, >>>>>>>>>>>Honestly, I got this curiosity with recent thread raised by >>>>>>>>>>> Rajesh. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>I know, there area lot of members in the group, who widely travel >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>> see >>>>>>>>>>>them traveling all alone. I even see people like Jean, who never >>>>>>>>>>> ask >>>>>>>>>>>for >>>>>>>>>>>help at the venues. I am curious how would people with total >>>>>>>>>>> blindness >>>>>>>>>>> can >>>>>>>>>>>manage to be alone at conferences etc.Also, any of you come across >>>>>>>>>>> tips >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>>network with the people in the events.I don't consider myself to >>>>>>>>>>> answer >>>>>>>>>>> any >>>>>>>>>>>of the above, although I travel a lot, but I could fairly see. So >>>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>>don't >>>>>>>>>>>think, this would be of any problem to people with low vision. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Any tips would also help me to share with our students at NAB. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Thanks a lot, >>>>>>>>>>>-Srinivasu >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>-- >>>>>>>>>>>Best regards, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Srinivasu Chakravarthula >>>>>>>>>>>Mobile: +91 990 081 0881 >>>>>>>>>>>Website: http://www.srinivasu.org | >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.learnaccessibility.org >>>>>>>>>>>Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/VasuTweets >>>>>>>>>>>Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>>>>>>>http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Search for old postings at: >>>>>>>>>>>http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>>>>>>>accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>>>with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other >>>>>>>>>>>changes, please visit the list home page at >>>>>>>>>>>http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Notice: This email and any files transmitted with it are >>>>>>>>>>>confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or >>>>>>>>>>>entity to whom they are addressed. If you are not the intended >>>>>>>>>>>recipient, any dissemination, use, review, distribution, printing >>>>>>>>>>> or >>>>>>>>>>>copying of the information contained in this e-mail message and/or >>>>>>>>>>>attachments to it are strictly prohibited. If you have received >>>>>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>>>>>email by error, please notify us by return e-mail or telephone >>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>>immediately and permanently delete the message and any >>>>>>>>>>> attachments. >>>>>>>>>>>The recipient should check this email and any attachments for the >>>>>>>>>>>presence of viruses. The Reserve Bank of India accepts no >>>>>>>>>>> liability >>>>>>>>>>>for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>>>>>>>http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Search for old postings at: >>>>>>>>>>>http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>>>>>>>accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>>>with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other >>>>>>>>>>>changes, please visit the list home page at >>>>>>>>>>>http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> with warm regards >>>>>>>>>> Mahendra Galani >>>>>>>>>> window's live ID mahendragal...@hotmail.com skype ID >>>>>>>>>> chintu3886 >>>>>>>>>> phone +4314943149 mobile +4369910366055, >>>>>>>>>> address Herbst strasse 101.16.1 Vienna Austria Europe >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>>>>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Search for old postings at: >>>>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>>>>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other >>>>>>>>>> changes, >>>>>>>>>> please >>>>>>>>>> visit the list home page at >>>>>>>>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>>>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Search for old postings at: >>>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>>>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other >>>>>>>>> changes, >>>>>>>>> please >>>>>>>>> visit the list home page at >>>>>>>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Search for old postings at: >>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other >>>>>>>> changes, >>>>>>>> please >>>>>>>> visit the list home page at >>>>>>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Search for old postings at: >>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>>>>> please visit the list home page at >>>>>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>>> >>>>>> Search for old postings at: >>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>>> >>>>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>>> >>>>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>>>> please >>>>>> visit the list home page at >>>>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>>> >>>>> Search for old postings at: >>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>>> >>>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>>> >>>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>>> please >>>>> visit the list home page at >>>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Mahesh S. Panicker >>>> Q1/5;2nd Floor; Left Portion ;Private Colony;Srinivas Puri; >>>> New delhi india. >>>> >>>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>>> >>>> Search for old postings at: >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>>> >>>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>>> please >>>> visit the list home page at >>>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >>> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >>> >>> Search for old postings at: >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >>> >>> To unsubscribe send a message to >>> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >>> with the subject unsubscribe. >>> >>> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >>> please >>> visit the list home page at >>> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >>> >>> >> >> Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: >> http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm >> >> Search for old postings at: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ >> >> To unsubscribe send a message to >> accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in >> with the subject unsubscribe. >> >> To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, >> please >> visit the list home page at >> http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in >> >> > > Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: > http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm > > Search for old postings at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ > > To unsubscribe send a message to > accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in > with the subject unsubscribe. > > To change your subscription to digest mode or make any other changes, please > visit the list home page at > http://accessindia.org.in/mailman/listinfo/accessindia_accessindia.org.in > > Register for AccessIndia convention 2011(November 12-13) at: http://www.accessindia.org.in/harish/convention.htm Search for old postings at: http://www.mail-archive.com/accessindia@accessindia.org.in/ To unsubscribe send a message to accessindia-requ...@accessindia.org.in with the subject unsubscribe. 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