Dear Bernhard,
Thank you for this suggestion. The question is: who outside the US can
be "in"? I would be most happy to contribute to arguing the scientific case
(in the broadest sense) for the benefits of such an initiative, and to play
whatever role I can in getting (other people to put ...) the nuts and bolts
in place. Could you broadcast the information about this kind of grant?
With best wishes,
Gerard.
--
On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 04:24:18PM -0700, Bernhard Rupp wrote:
> All right: How about then putting in a NIH challenge grant (due April 27)
> for image archiving? Who is in?
>
> BR
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gerard Bricogne [mailto:g...@globalphasing.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 4:12 PM
> To: Bernhard Rupp
> Cc: 'Gerard Bricogne'; CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK
> Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] images
>
> Dear Bernhard,
>
> Re-reading your previous message, I can see that I did indeed misread
> it, and I apologise for that. Perhaps it was the expression "put to rest" in
> relation to a topic where so much action is needed that made me charge in
> the wrong direction.
>
> Although this "thread" is now attracting additional suggestions about
> what else it might be a good thing to archive, this should not result in a
> dilution of the urgency of this particular item. As for the argument that
> any new task can only be done if there is extra money, then isn't this the
> ideal time to argue that we need a "PDB stimulus package"? After all, the
> PDB is a bank ... .
>
>
> With best wishes,
>
> Gerard.
>
> --
> On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 12:14:29PM -0700, Bernhard Rupp wrote:
> > Maybe I was misunderstood. There is no doubt in my opinion and that of
> those
> > that have put effort into image conservation issues years ago that
> > keeping and archiving the images is more than desirable, for precisely
> > the reasons mentioned.
> >
> > Nail my nauseating spell checker for the nausea that may have caused you.
> >
> > Cheers, BR
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:ccp...@jiscmail.ac.uk] On Behalf Of
> Gerard
> > Bricogne
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 11:03 AM
> > To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK
> > Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] images
> >
> > Dear Bernhard,
> >
> > I suppose you meant "ad nauseam" ;-) .
> >
> > In any case, what is the use of discussions and recommendations that
> > are not followed by action, and only result in making their contributors
> > themselves nauseated to the point of wanting to "put this to rest"?
> >
> > As Ethan has nicely stated in his reply to Garib's double-check of
> > whether we do need images, this matter should NOT be put to rest: it
> should
> > be dealt with. As was argued at the end of the paper by Joosten, Womack et
> > al. (Acta Cryst. D65, 176-185), the main advantage of depositing images
> > would be that it would enable and stimulate the further developement and
> > testing of image integration and data processing software, to the same
> > degree that the deposition of structure factors has stimulated progress
> and
> > testing for structure refinement software.
> >
> > Far from a boring issue only capable of giving headaches to Standards
> > Committee members, this is a vital issue: with each undeposited set of
> > images that contributed in one way or another to the determination or
> > refinement of a deposited structure, there disappears an opportunity to
> test
> > improvements in methods and software that would be likely to improve that
> > deposited entry (and most others) at a future stage. I think we need to
> take
> > a long view on this, and abandon the picture of the PDB as a static
> archive
> > of frozen results: instead, it should be seen as a repository of what is
> > required not only to validate/authenticate the deposited models, but to
> feed
> > the continued improvement of the methods used - and hence, at the next
> > iteration, the constant revision and improvement of those very models. In
> > what way can this topic be a source of nausea?
> >
> >
> > With best wishes,
> >
> > Gerard.
> >
> > --
> > On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 10:16:42AM -0700, Bernhard Rupp wrote:
> > > As Herb will attest, the need for keeping images and the various reasons
> > > for it have been discussed ad nauseum and agreed upon in various imgCIF
> > > meetings - I am sure Herb or Andy Howard can provide links to the
> > > documents/recommendations, to put this to rest.
> > >
> > > Best, BR
> > >
> > > Past ACA Data Standards Committee serf
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:ccp...@jiscmail.ac.uk] On Behalf Of
> Kay
> > > Diederichs
> > > Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 10:02 AM
> > > To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK
> > > Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] images
> >
> > --
> >
> > ===============================================================
> > * *
> > * Gerard Bricogne g...@globalphasing.com *
> > * *
> > * Global Phasing Ltd. *
> > * Sheraton House, Castle Park Tel: +44-(0)1223-353033 *
> > * Cambridge CB3 0AX, UK Fax: +44-(0)1223-366889 *
> > * *
> > ===============================================================
> >
