> > > My views of him are not contradictory and are pretty easy to pick up. I > don't know how anyone can even began to come to that conclusion. >
Apparently not. Let me ask this: In your opinion, who was Alinsky trying to help and did > it work? > Who knows? Depends on what communities it was applied in, and how well. When we used his methods, a problem got solved that the community thought was a problem. Some people were unhappy and I myself would have preferred another outcome, but it's about the community discovering that it *can* solve its own problems. But this process necessarily happens one problem at a time and depends on who else doesn't like the proposed solution, shrug. Getting speed bumps or a stop sign is a nice beginning project. The group I worked with doesn't seem to be around any more, but the community, which was blighted and racially troubled at the time, has apparently gentrified. So huh, Alinsky's ideas do seem to have improved things in that community, a little at least. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Rainier,_Maryland But possibly this mainly happened because nobody that didn't live there cared too much. But they people who lived there *did* and hey, local values, right? This is what I worked on as a VISTA volunteer, by the way. Using Alinsky's book. Ayup. Sorry if that disturbs your worldview. At a minimum the whites and the blacks started talking, and together solved one big problem in that part of the world at the time -- all the hearings happened in Upper Marlboro, which was unreachable without a car and maybe still is. The problem I referred to above was a badly deteriorated boarded up old house, the problem the neighborhood I was working it picked to work on. I would have liked to see it rehabbed but that wasn't in the cards and structurally iit was probably too far gone anyway. And the community -- key point -- wanted it gone and could make that happen, and on the other hand had neither the means nor the desire to fix it had that even been possible, shrug. You should clarify and say that nobody you know had heard of him. He's > actually old news to those who pay attention. I first heard of him when > the Clinton's where in the White House. In fact, there is another missing > document issue with Hilary. Her senior thesis was on Alinsky. She > asked Wellesley > not to release the thesis. Her opponents wanted the thesis in order to > prove her socialist creds. In the end, it was a wild goose chase for her > opponents. On the contrary, see above. But I used to get a lot of blank stares when I talked about this. As for the rest of what you say here, I have no information, but it sounds pretty wild-eyed to me. > > When I think crazy, I think of MSNBC or the Huffington Post and I certainly > don't utilize those. I don't read the National Standard. I don't like > William Kristol or Fred Barnes (who seem to be frequent Fox contributors). > I can't stand Michael Savage. So, you're right, whatever Well, you're still not saying where you *do* get your information. But it doesn't seem to have been from reading the actual book. "Less than, lol. You're the neo-liberal here ;) " > > More than you know, if you consider the original definition of "liberal" ( > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_liberalism ) and not the current > definition. > Good! Now look up "neo-liberal." Classical liberalism is the philosophy committed to the ideal of limited > government, constitutionalism, rule of law, due process, and liberty of > individuals including freedom of religion, speech, press, assembly, > and free markets. I am on board for that. > "I think we seriously disagree on the meaning of the word conservative. In > my world, conservatives don't squander lives and money on ventures that > work against the interests they are supposed to be managing." > > > Mine either. > Even better. > > I think you are equating Republicans with conservatives. They are not the > same. There are actually very few Republicans who are conservative. If > you are equating the two, then it sounds like you are accusing Republicans > of warmongering for profit. That's fine. However, the Democrats are just > as guilty, if not more so. Right now, it looks like Obama is ramping up > for a nice Middle East action to protect/expand oil interests. No, but most people do. If you don't that's great. I *am* saying that warmongering for profit did happen, and I do not agree with it. Doesn't matter who does/did it. > "Eh. They've learned to gerrymander and sell out to big business, > especially in Ontario. But they are still a nanny state -- they just let > people destroy the environment as well." > > Then welcome to Canada Part Deux. > Not sure what you mean by that, but if you are expecting me to defend the Canadians, I dunno... try Larry. It's not my thing. > > Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: > If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops > moving, subsidize it. - Ronald Reagan > > From an early age, smart people are reminded of their intelligence, > separated from their peers in gifted classes, and presented with > opportunities unavailable to others. For these and other reasons, > intellectuals tend to have an inflated sense of their own wisdom. It is > thus arrogance, and not intelligence, that leads them into trouble. Theyre > so smart, hubris compels them to believe, that they can run everyone elses > life. But no one is that smart. Whats more, theorists devising systems for > the rest of us to live under often have a difficult time running their own > lives. Mundane tasks are to them what quantum physics is to the rest of us. > - Daniel J Flyn > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:346093 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
