But how do you have something like that without a requirement to join? Why should workers who do not join benefit from the workers that did join and thus got the benefits of collective bargaining??
------------------------------------ Three Ravens Consulting Eric Roberts Owner/Developer ow...@threeravensconsulting.com tel: 630-486-5255 fax: 630-310-8531 http://www.threeravensconsulting.com ------------------------------------ -----Original Message----- From: LRS Scout [mailto:lrssc...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:08 AM To: cf-community Subject: Re: Mandatory Union Tax Ending in Michigan? But we're talking about the government forcing a third party into the process of two parties negotiating compensation. Like I said I don't have any problem having unions, we need collective bargaining, hell several years ago I suggested starting an IT union on this very list to represent the interests of "exempt salaried" employees who regularly get screwed over. I just don't want to see it forced on anyone. when the government becomes involved in that process to my mind it steps far outside the bounds of it's responsibilities and powers. On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:59 AM, Judah McAuley <ju...@wiredotter.com>wrote: > > Well, hell, if you are just going to take an arbitrary Libertarian > stand point, then you have perfect free and voluntary association even > with union representation because no one is requiring you to apply for > or take a union-represented job. If the notion of a union is too > odious to you, then don't apply for a union job. You still have self ownership. > > Personally, I think that taking it that far is kinda ridiculous. But > it is exactly true in the same reductive Libertarian logic as the rest of it. > > Judah > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:54 AM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > My statement is based on the fact that ALL LAW is based on the > > monopoly > on > > the initiation and use of force in order to enforce said law. > > > > Every law on the books is only backed by someone with a gun and a > > jail cell. We need to be more careful about what we decide rises to > > that > level. > > > > What about free and voluntary association, and self ownership? > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Judah McAuley > > <ju...@wiredotter.com > > >wrote: > > > > > > > > No one said anything about force, dude. I was talking about the > structure > > > of labor law. > > > > > > I do have some mad respect for the old Wobblies though. They were > > > some > > hard > > > mofos. I don't think we need that now, I do think that things have > > evolved > > > to the point where union structure and power needs to be looked at. > > > > > > That's not what these laws are intended for, however. If you start > > > with > > the > > > premise that unions are bad, you aren't going to do a good job of > > enacting > > > reforms that make unions better. That simple. If you want to start > > > from > > the > > > premise that unions are a good thing but need to be reigned in and > > > make sure that they continue to be a force for good rather than > > > evil, that's another matter. > > > > > > I feel the same way about corporations. Corporations are > > > fundamentally > a > > > good thing. Left unchecked, however, the things that make them > > > good can morph into structures that are capable of a great deal of > > > harm. Unions > > are > > > much the same. > > > > > > Judah > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:40 AM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Yes those things can suck man, but is force really the way to > > > > fight > it? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:359105 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
