It's called liberty.
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Eric Roberts < ow...@threeravensconsulting.com> wrote: > > But how do you have something like that without a requirement to join? Why > should workers who do not join benefit from the workers that did join and > thus got the benefits of collective bargaining?? > > ------------------------------------ > Three Ravens Consulting > Eric Roberts > Owner/Developer > ow...@threeravensconsulting.com > tel: 630-486-5255 > fax: 630-310-8531 > http://www.threeravensconsulting.com > ------------------------------------ > > -----Original Message----- > From: LRS Scout [mailto:lrssc...@gmail.com] > Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:08 AM > To: cf-community > Subject: Re: Mandatory Union Tax Ending in Michigan? > > > But we're talking about the government forcing a third party into the > process of two parties negotiating compensation. Like I said I don't have > any problem having unions, we need collective bargaining, hell several > years > ago I suggested starting an IT union on this very list to represent the > interests of "exempt salaried" employees who regularly get screwed over. > > I just don't want to see it forced on anyone. when the government becomes > involved in that process to my mind it steps far outside the bounds of it's > responsibilities and powers. > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:59 AM, Judah McAuley <ju...@wiredotter.com > >wrote: > > > > > Well, hell, if you are just going to take an arbitrary Libertarian > > stand point, then you have perfect free and voluntary association even > > with union representation because no one is requiring you to apply for > > or take a union-represented job. If the notion of a union is too > > odious to you, then don't apply for a union job. You still have self > ownership. > > > > Personally, I think that taking it that far is kinda ridiculous. But > > it is exactly true in the same reductive Libertarian logic as the rest of > it. > > > > Judah > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:54 AM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > My statement is based on the fact that ALL LAW is based on the > > > monopoly > > on > > > the initiation and use of force in order to enforce said law. > > > > > > Every law on the books is only backed by someone with a gun and a > > > jail cell. We need to be more careful about what we decide rises to > > > that > > level. > > > > > > What about free and voluntary association, and self ownership? > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Judah McAuley > > > <ju...@wiredotter.com > > > >wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > No one said anything about force, dude. I was talking about the > > structure > > > > of labor law. > > > > > > > > I do have some mad respect for the old Wobblies though. They were > > > > some > > > hard > > > > mofos. I don't think we need that now, I do think that things have > > > evolved > > > > to the point where union structure and power needs to be looked at. > > > > > > > > That's not what these laws are intended for, however. If you start > > > > with > > > the > > > > premise that unions are bad, you aren't going to do a good job of > > > enacting > > > > reforms that make unions better. That simple. If you want to start > > > > from > > > the > > > > premise that unions are a good thing but need to be reigned in and > > > > make sure that they continue to be a force for good rather than > > > > evil, that's another matter. > > > > > > > > I feel the same way about corporations. Corporations are > > > > fundamentally > > a > > > > good thing. Left unchecked, however, the things that make them > > > > good can morph into structures that are capable of a great deal of > > > > harm. Unions > > > are > > > > much the same. > > > > > > > > Judah > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:40 AM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes those things can suck man, but is force really the way to > > > > > fight > > it? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:359106 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
