question then, why should I get the same benefits you're living on right now Tim? I never served in the US military, but by the logic used by the right to work legislation I should get the same benefits as you get for your service.
On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 5:13 PM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> wrote: > > It's called liberty. > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Eric Roberts < > ow...@threeravensconsulting.com> wrote: > >> >> But how do you have something like that without a requirement to join? Why >> should workers who do not join benefit from the workers that did join and >> thus got the benefits of collective bargaining?? >> >> ------------------------------------ >> Three Ravens Consulting >> Eric Roberts >> Owner/Developer >> ow...@threeravensconsulting.com >> tel: 630-486-5255 >> fax: 630-310-8531 >> http://www.threeravensconsulting.com >> ------------------------------------ >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: LRS Scout [mailto:lrssc...@gmail.com] >> Sent: Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:08 AM >> To: cf-community >> Subject: Re: Mandatory Union Tax Ending in Michigan? >> >> >> But we're talking about the government forcing a third party into the >> process of two parties negotiating compensation. Like I said I don't have >> any problem having unions, we need collective bargaining, hell several >> years >> ago I suggested starting an IT union on this very list to represent the >> interests of "exempt salaried" employees who regularly get screwed over. >> >> I just don't want to see it forced on anyone. when the government becomes >> involved in that process to my mind it steps far outside the bounds of it's >> responsibilities and powers. >> >> >> On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:59 AM, Judah McAuley <ju...@wiredotter.com >> >wrote: >> >> > >> > Well, hell, if you are just going to take an arbitrary Libertarian >> > stand point, then you have perfect free and voluntary association even >> > with union representation because no one is requiring you to apply for >> > or take a union-represented job. If the notion of a union is too >> > odious to you, then don't apply for a union job. You still have self >> ownership. >> > >> > Personally, I think that taking it that far is kinda ridiculous. But >> > it is exactly true in the same reductive Libertarian logic as the rest of >> it. >> > >> > Judah >> > >> > >> > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:54 AM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > > >> > > My statement is based on the fact that ALL LAW is based on the >> > > monopoly >> > on >> > > the initiation and use of force in order to enforce said law. >> > > >> > > Every law on the books is only backed by someone with a gun and a >> > > jail cell. We need to be more careful about what we decide rises to >> > > that >> > level. >> > > >> > > What about free and voluntary association, and self ownership? >> > > >> > > >> > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 11:48 AM, Judah McAuley >> > > <ju...@wiredotter.com >> > > >wrote: >> > > >> > > > >> > > > No one said anything about force, dude. I was talking about the >> > structure >> > > > of labor law. >> > > > >> > > > I do have some mad respect for the old Wobblies though. They were >> > > > some >> > > hard >> > > > mofos. I don't think we need that now, I do think that things have >> > > evolved >> > > > to the point where union structure and power needs to be looked at. >> > > > >> > > > That's not what these laws are intended for, however. If you start >> > > > with >> > > the >> > > > premise that unions are bad, you aren't going to do a good job of >> > > enacting >> > > > reforms that make unions better. That simple. If you want to start >> > > > from >> > > the >> > > > premise that unions are a good thing but need to be reigned in and >> > > > make sure that they continue to be a force for good rather than >> > > > evil, that's another matter. >> > > > >> > > > I feel the same way about corporations. Corporations are >> > > > fundamentally >> > a >> > > > good thing. Left unchecked, however, the things that make them >> > > > good can morph into structures that are capable of a great deal of >> > > > harm. Unions >> > > are >> > > > much the same. >> > > > >> > > > Judah >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > On Tue, Dec 11, 2012 at 8:40 AM, LRS Scout <lrssc...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > Yes those things can suck man, but is force really the way to >> > > > > fight >> > it? >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> >> >> >> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now! http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:359116 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/unsubscribe.cfm
