tenebroust said,
>>I do not want to see anyone here attacking other list members BELIEFS. <<
I couldn't agree more... However,
shouldn't that be clarified further to include a more indepth definition...?
For we all believe something, even if it is disbelief, because we all post
articles, comments, and opinions, regularly. What I'm saying is, the
definition here, that I'm *assuming* you are trying to get across, is that
you
do not want to see people attacked for their RELIGIOUS or SPIRITUAL BELIEFS?
Correct me if I'm wrong in this...
BUT, there is still a loophole; for all religious beliefs and tenents, if
taken seriously, are a way of life for those people who do. It is not
opinion or
comment, but rather when they disagree, they would be contending for their
beliefs. As a Christian, I am instructed to 'contend' for the faith...
(Jude v3).
To sit back and say nothing is worse, in my opinion, than attempting to
expose, what I would believe, is a lie.
To censor someone for their religious beliefs, and disallow them to
comment,
is like saying, it's okay for you to perfectly agree with the homosexuals
agenda (using this strictly as a scenario), but because I may disagree
because
of my religious or spiritual beliefs. I am to say nothing??? Am I not
allowed
to contend for my beliefs, because it infringes on YOUR rights to believe a
certain way, but not for me?
With this I totally disagree.
tenebroust also said,
>>The Talmud business, the Protocals, etc., are all part of a systematic
concocted "history" that has been perpetrated by the Catholic Church, and
other prominent European (and now American) groups to place the "Jew" in the
context of evil, cheapskate, cheat, etc.<<
This is simply not true...
Judah has wrongly taken the rap for those who "say" they are Jews (God's
chosen)
for hundreds of years... There is more than religiosity involved in this.
You must
calculate the number of the beast... The word calculate in the Greek means
to 'ennumerate the smooth stones over a long period of time'. The only way
to calculate this is to follow the bloodline and historical record. You can
find
easily in the Hebrews history of the Chronicles where there are those who
came in as bedouines and took over the bookkeeping, the scribeship, and
the priest duties... By Jesus' time, they were known as Pharisees, and
continue today in various communities and cultural statures.
THESE have also taken on the title "JEW".... when they
actually have no inheritance, heritage or bloodline to sustain their claim.
These are those that are spoken of in Revelation 2:9 and 3:9... "those who
say they are Jews, but are not..." Once you find out WHO these are, you
can clearly see how, over the past, that Christians have mistaken
and stereotyped these in with the true Jews and how the confusion has come
around to the present day. True Jews of the tribe of Judah have been blamed
for way too much evil and cataclysmic atrosities!!!
If you want to blame someone for propagating this information, go to the
priests, preachers and teachers... they are the ones who teach ignorantly
and
continue to keep the pot stirred and boiling. I suppose this is why it is
taught in
Ezekiel ch 34 that God will start his judgment in the pulpit, with the
shepherds...
People need to do their homework and find out just exactly WHO they are
speaking of here... and quit believing lies and gossip. Jews of the
tribe
of Judah *ARE innocent* as charged. But tell me... how do you tell the
tares
from the wheat? While maturing, or coming of age, one cannot tell, and
this is why the lessons were taught throughout the gospels to leave the
tares
alone.
I have absolutely nothing against the true Jews of Judah... and am actually
very sympathetic with their plight. But, it is written that there were
those
who came in and took their identity and claim to be Jews, but are not.
THESE are those that we should be concerned about, and when the truth
comes out in the end... I believe that you will find that even these false
ones
are the very ones who wrote the protocols... and started all the other
ugliness
regarding the Jews, so as they could develop a sympathy and blend in to
absorb that sympathy they created. And yes, there is also blood on the
Catholic Church's hands regarding some of this... but the blame cannot
be placed completely there. They too, by utilizing certain religious
tenents
and by brainwashing have their congregation believing that their faith is
the
only one... it is also a door that revolves in continuum with the same song
second verse. But they are also in error to make this claim.
This is a subject (i.e. the Jews) that cannot be ignored or overlooked,
because most people have been brainwashed either by religious tendencies or
by cultural differences that go back generations. It is a subject that is
not going to go
away just because you want it to.
eagle 1
http://www.lambsheart.com/fourwinds/cain.html
----- Original Message -----
From: "tenebroust" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2000 10:44 PM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] Talmud Exposed
> There is a good reason that the only writers which comment on this issue
are Christian, and not Islamic, or Buddhist, etc. It's because the whole
subject is invented by, and propagated by CHRISTIANS. No other group gives
a damn. I do not want to see anyone here attacking other list members
BELIEFS. You are totally free, and have my blessing, to believe what you
will. I, and everyone else here is free to challenge information brought
here. The Talmud business, the Protocals, etc., are all part of a
systematic concocted "history" that has been perpetrated by the Catholic
Church, and other prominent European (and now American) groups to place the
"Jew" in the context of evil, cheapskate, cheat, etc. This has led to and
been used to kill and imprison them, as well as take their land and
property.
> Sadly they aren't the only group to be so affected, just the one that most
consistently is targetted, because they haven't yet been wiped out (despite
many attempts to do so) like the others (Cathars, Anabaptists, etc.).
>
>
> On Wed, 21 June 2000, Nicky Molloy wrote:
>
> >
> > Josh,
> >
> > You've hurt my feelings now, to think I'm in your tribe too. So we take
it
> > that you endorse the Talmud then? I'd like to know why it isn't
available in
> > the public library, I think we all know why. Perhaps I could find some
> > better writings on the Talmud, written by Jews. Would that appeal? I
> > wouldn't want you to think I was only writing the Christian view.
> >
> > Perhaps the Kaballa? If I send something on that written by Christians
would
> > you say I particularly am deluded?
> > Ahh if I send something on the Protocols written by a Christian will you
> > also cut me down?
> >
> > I'm not particularly looking for Christian writers but bud you are
> > outnumbered in USA. the chances of finding someone other than a
Christian
> > writer on this is slim. I have never seen a Moslem, Buddhist, Hindu ever
> > take the trouble to write on these tabu subjects. Yet you particularly
enjoy
> > slandering Christians and Christianity and that's supposed to be Ok
tarring
> > everyone with the same brush.
> >
> > I posted it because it makes a change from always hearing bad things
about
> > Christianity and I thought it may be valuable to some. I'm not anti
Jewish.
> > Even some Jews don't know what's in the book. Just pick out what you
want
> > and leave the rest, if you don't then you are reduced to not sending
stuff
> > and commenting endlessly and tediously on those people's that do
send..Its
> > getting like a flock of seagulls pouncing on a tidbit to tear a piece
for
> > themselves.
> >
> > My posts are generating too many arguments. I haven't got time to pander
to
> > people's egos, its just information. I am interested in religious views
of
> > all kinds among other things.Pick on someone yer own size you big bully!
> >
> > Nicky
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Nurev Ind Research <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date: Tuesday, 20 June 2000 03:07
> > Subject: Re: [CTRL] Talmud Exposed
> >
> >
> > Nicky Molloy wrote:
> > >
> > > Talmud Exposed
> > > http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/talmud.htm#Talmud Exposed
> >
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > --
> > > ----
> > > http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/natural.htm
> > >
> > > Contents:
> > > The Talmud is Judasim's Holiest Book
> > > Some Teachings of The Jewish Talmud
> > > Insults Against The Blessed Virgin Mary
> > > Talmud Attacks Christians
> > > Christian Book Burning
> > > Sick and Insane Teachings of the Jewish Talmud
> > > Tales of a Roman Holocaust
> > > A Revealing Admission
> > > Pharisiac Rituals
> > > A Great Rabbi Deceives A Woman
> > > Genocide Advocated by The Talmud
> > > Jewish Talmudic Doctrine: Non-Jews are Not Humans
> > > The Teachings of Maimonides
> > > Deception and Dissimulation
> > > Judean-Christian Response to The Talmud
> > >
> > > The Talmud is Judaism's Holiest Book
> >
> > Wrong! No Jew who ever lived thought that. EVER!
> >
> > > The Talmud is Judaism's holiest book (actually a collection of books).
Its
> > > authority takes precedence over the Old Testament in Judaism.
> >
> > Wrong! No Jew in all of history ever thought that.
> >
> > > Evidence of
> > > this may be found in the Talmud itself, Erubin 21b (Soncino edition):
"My
> > > son, be more careful in the observance of the words of the Scribes
than in
> > > the words of the Torah (Old Testament)."
> >
> > Total bullshit.
> >
> > > The supremacy of the Talmud over the Bible in the Israeli state may
also
> > be
> > > seen in the case of the Black Ethiopian Jews. Ethiopians have more
> > knowledge
> > > of the Old Testament than the Israelis.
> >
> > Wrong! The Talmud is only studied by the ultra ortodox. Just about
everyone
> > in
> > Israel has studied the actual Bible because the Bible is Jewish national
> > history and part of school studies in the same way we learn about
American
> > history in schools here.
> >
> > Ethiopian Jews, with very few exceptions, know very little about their
> > Jewish
> > roots because they were isolated and forced into conversion to
Christianity.
> > Many knew they were Jews but had little reason to practice their
herritage
> > in the face of their neighbor's oppression. When they got to Israel they
> > caught up. Today they are full integrated into the general society.
> >
> > > However, their religion is so
> > > ancient it pre-dates the Scribes' Talmud, of which the Ethiopians have
no
> > > knowledge. According to the N.Y. Times of Sept. 29, 1992, p.4:
> > >
> > > "The problem is that Ethiopian Jewish tradition goes no further than
the
> > > Bible or Torah; the later Talmud and other commentaries that form the
> > basis
> > > of modern traditions never came their way."
> >
> > This is true.
> > >
> > > Because they don't traffic in Talmudic traditions, the Black Ethiopian
> > Jews
> > > are discriminated against and have been forbidden by the Zionists to
> > perform
> > > marriages, funerals and other services in the Israeli state.
> > >
> > > Rabbi Joseph D. Soloveitchik is regarded as one of the most
influential
> > > rabbis of the 20th century, the "unchallenged leader" of Orthodox
Judaism
> > > and the top international authority on halakha (Jewish religious law).
> > > Soloveitchik was responsible for instructing and ordaining more than
2,000
> > > rabbis, "an entire generation" of Jewish leadership.
> > >
> > > N.Y. Times religion reporter Ari Goldman described the basis of the
> > rabbi's
> > > authority:
> > >
> > > "Soloveitchik came from a long line of distinguished Talmudic
> > > scholars...Until his early 20s, he devoted himself almost exclusively
to
> > the
> > > study of the Talmud...He came to Yeshiva University's Elchanan
Theological
> > > Seminary where he remained the pre-eminent teacher in the Talmud...He
held
> > > the title of Leib Merkin professor of Talmud...sitting with his feet
> > crossed
> > > in front of a table bearing an open volume of the Talmud." (N.Y.
Times,
> > > April 10, 1993, p. 38).
> > >
> > > Nowhere does Goldman refer to Soloveitchik's knowledge of the Bible as
the
> > > basis for being one of the top world authorities on Jewish law. The
> > rabbi's
> > > credentials are all predicated upon his mastery of the Talmud. All
other
> > > studies are clearly secondary. Britain's Jewish Chronicle of March 26,
> > 1993
> > > states that in religious school (yeshiva), Jews are "devoted to the
Talmud
> > > to the exclusion of everything else."
> >
> > Everything you've read up to this point is wrong. I know this for a FACT
> > because I am especially familiar the subject.
> >
> > If you think that you are going to get any sensible information about
the
> > Talmud from an outfit called - biblebelievers.org.au -, then you would
be
> > as deluded as poor Nicky. If you want good info about the subject, there
> > are many books put out by Catholic and Protestant scholars who actually
> > know something about the subject at hand.
> >
> > > The Jewish Scribes claim the Talmud is
> > > partly a collection of traditions Moses gave them in oral form. These
had
> > > not yet been written down in Jesus' time. Christ condemned the
traditions
> > of
> > > the Mishnah (early Talmud) and those who taught it (Scribes and
> > Pharisees),
> > > because the Talmud nullifies the teachings of the Holy Bible.
> >
> > This is such a ridiculous statement, only a really ignorant bigot could
make
> > it and only really really ignorant bigots believe it. This is like
saying
> > that
> > christians don't really worship Jesus, but do worship a wafer they eat
in
> > church.
> >
> > This is the quality of information that consistently gets spewed out by
> > Nicky. Wrong, stupid, and insane drivel.
> >
> > Joshua2
> >
.
<A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/">www.ctrl.org</A>
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