Greetings,
the 2004 paper of mine cited by Andrew is available online here
https://books.openedition.org/ifp/7801
« Ideophones in Tamil: a Historical Perspective on the X-eṉal
expressives (Olikkuṟippu Āṟṟuppaṭai) »
Best wishes
அன்புடன்
-- Jean-Luc
https://htl.cnrs.fr/equipe/jl-chevillard/
On 13/11/2022 22:32, Andrew Ollett via INDOLOGY wrote:
Since Matthew mentioned MIA, I suppose I can share this presentation on
clausal complements in Middle Indic, which also contains some
observations on the use of iti in Sanskrit (and eṉ- and its cognates in
Dravidian languages):
https://www.dropbox.com/s/t6kq9y55x3oj6k8/presentation.pdf?dl=0
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/t6kq9y55x3oj6k8/presentation.pdf?dl=0>
This is a talk I gave at Chicago in 2018. The work is still unpublished.
Andrew
On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 3:26 PM Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan via INDOLOGY
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Indology list archive is a valuable repository of knowledge. But the
lack of proper search facility makes the information as good as lost
and we have to repeat questions/discussions that are already in the
archive. See
https://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology/2015-July/041594.html
<https://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology/2015-July/041594.html>. If a
good search feature is enabled, all the past discussions will become accessible.____
__ __
Regards,____
Palaniappan____
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*From: *INDOLOGY <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> on behalf of Indology
List <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
*Reply-To: *"George L. HART" <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*Date: *Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 1:12 PM
*To: *Indology List <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*Subject: *Re: [INDOLOGY] iti in Sanskrit____
__ __
V.S. Rajam’s book is an essential one for students of classical
Tamil, covering syntax, meter, morphology, etc. What I meant is that
to my knowledge no one has made a substantial study of every use of
eṉ in Sangam literature. Such a study might include uses of iti in
early Sanskrit. For example, in modern Tamil we often find ēṉ eṉṟāl,
“If you ask why,” which corresponds exactly to Sanskrit "kuta iti
cet.” One wonders how old this usage is in both languages. George
Hart____
____
On Nov 12, 2022, at 6:07 PM, rajam <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:____
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Dear List Members, ____
__ __
George Hart said: ____
__ __
/// I am sure many have noted that in Tamil, the word eṉ, which
has equivalents in other Dravidian languages (an in Telugu, for
example), is far more productive than Sanskrit iti. It occurs in
various forms — adjective (eṉṉum), adverb (eṉṟu), noun (eṉpatu),
finite verb (e.g. eṉkiṟārkaḷ), while in Sanskrit iti is only
adverbial. It would be interesting to analyze the uses of eṉ in
Sangam literature — I’m not sure anyone has done this. /// ____
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Just to kindle your memory … ____
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Please look into my book “A Reference Grammar of Classical Tamil
Poetry, V.S. Rajam, American Philosophical Society, 1992” ____
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Thanks and regards,____
V.S. Rajam ____
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__ __
____
On Nov 12, 2022, at 12:54 PM, George L. HART via INDOLOGY
<[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:____
__ __
I am sure many have noted that in Tamil, the word eṉ, which
has equivalents in other Dravidian languages (an in Telugu,
for example), is far more productive than Sanskrit iti. It
occurs in various forms — adjective (eṉṉum), adverb (eṉṟu),
noun (eṉpatu), finite verb (e.g. eṉkiṟārkaḷ), while in
Sanskrit iti is only adverbial. It would be interesting to
analyze the uses of eṉ in Sangam literature — I’m not sure
anyone has done this. Of course, the use of this
construction could be an areal phenomenon — it is not
necessarily true that its presence in early Sanskrit is due
to Dravidian, though I think it is highly likely, given its
richness in Dravidian languages. George Hart____
____
On Nov 12, 2022, at 1:08 PM, Tieken, H.J.H. (Herman) via
INDOLOGY <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:____
__ __
I do not know if the question was about /iti/as an areal
phenomenon. If so, see F.B.J. Kuiper, "The Genesis of a
Linguistic Area", IIJ 1968, where, if I remember well,
he compares Skt/iti/ with Tamil/eṉṟu/.____
Herman____
__ __
Herman Tieken____
Stationsweg 58____
2515 BP Den Haag____
The Netherlands____
00 31 (0)70 2208127____
website:hermantieken.com <http://hermantieken.com/>____
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Van:*INDOLOGY <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> namens
Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY
<[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*Verzonden:*zaterdag 12 november 2022 17:34
*Aan:*Olivelle, Joseph P <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*CC:*[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]><[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
*Onderwerp:*Re: [INDOLOGY] iti in Sanskrit____
____
If I remember correctly, the possibility of the "iti"
constructions being an areal phenomena have been
discussed for many decades. The best person to provide
information regarding this topic may be Hans Hock. I
will see if I can locate any of these older
publications.____
____
Madhav M. Deshpande____
Professor Emeritus, Sanskrit and Linguistics____
University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA____
Senior Fellow, Oxford Center for Hindu Studies____
Adjunct Professor, National Institute of Advanced
Studies, Bangalore, India____
__ __
[Residence: Campbell, California, USA]____
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On Sat, Nov 12, 2022 at 6:28 AM Olivelle, Joseph P via
INDOLOGY <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:____
See the many explanations of ‘iti’ in Gary Tubb and
Emery Boose’s book “Scholastic Sanskrit”.
Patrick
> On Nov 12, 2022, at 8:10 AM, Brendan S. Gillon, Prof. via
INDOLOGY <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
>
> Dear colleagues,
>
> I am wondering if any of you know of articles on the use
of `iti' in
> Sanskrit.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Brendan
>
> --
>
> Brendan S. Gillon
email:[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>
> Department of Linguistics
> McGill University tel.: 001 514
398 4868
> 1085, Avenue Docteur-Penfield
> Montreal, Quebec fax.: 001 514
398 7088
> H3A 1A7 CANADA
>
>
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