On Sat, 2005-09-03 at 06:54 -0700, Dave Laird wrote: > Good morning, Bill... > > Bill Anderson wrote: > > > On Tue, 2025-09-02 at 21:53 -0700, Frank Reichert wrote: > > > How many congresscritters left their vacation? Oh yeah, only those who > > had homes there and lost their homes. And why should *any* president go > > about mugging up funerals? > > <laughing dryly to myself> Yes, I did note that Trent Lott, who owns a > home in the area, hopped one of the first flights into the impact area.
Yup his what, 200 year old home is now a slab. Why do I suspect you and I will be paying for at least some of it's reconstruction? > >> This is a den of vipers where he sits idly by watching his > >> > butt-buddy bureaucrats intone pious-sounding phrases, moving their lips > >> > but not their hearts. > > > > Good to know you can see into the hearts of people you don't know or > > have the opportunity to be around. ;) > > I just judge the people by their actions. At one point the ratio of press > conferences to on-site visits were running at 6-to-1, based upon CNN's > coverage. That is why so many of the statements being made by the > bureaucrats weren't even close to being in line with the harsh facts. As > of this morning, it is the FIRST time in six days that anyone at the FEMA > level even knew that there were thousands of starving people huddled at > the Convention Center. Funny, I heard FEMA people talking about it and mentioning it in the early days. > Yesterday was the first time that helicopter > transportation was being provided for nursing home and hospital patients, > some of whom had been without food or water for FIVE days. Funny, I saw this going on as well during the early days. I even saw complaints about the choppers not getting back to them. That said, you can't just up and airlift people in hospitals who were not evacuated. Largely because transportation is a tremendous risk to most hospital patients who are not evacuated. Much of the lack of press about this is because they simply were not there. The press was also severely hampered in their mobility and ability to communicate. Though it being their lifeblood they had made better investments. I saw coast guard choppers visiting hospitals and taking who they could in slings in the first 48 hours. Remember that most hospitals do not have helipads on the roof. Most with helipads have them on the ground. That means sling loading people, and that ain't easy. > >> I notice that CBS News tonight reflected on the fact that not > >> many of those who were enduring this catastrophe were white. > >> Most of the white population had either already evacuated, or > >> made arrangements early on to to avoid the worst. > > > > So what are you saying? Surely you don't suggest racism on the part of > > the hurricane? And those who chose to stay chose to stay. > > NO. Most of those who stayed behind were *unable* to escape for a variety > of reasons. True, a certain percentage of those who stayed behind CHOSE > their options, but the vast majority, including hospital patients, nursing > home patients and others incapable of exercising any options, were capable > of choosing a way out. I remember the press interviews and reports from before it hit. That percentage is quite high. > You have to remember, 24 hours BEFORE Katrina hit > New Orleans, all airlines and other methods of public transit were shut > down, there were no rental cars left to flee the area and most highways > were already closed. Yeah, you'd think after what, 5 days or so that you'd expect people who are going to leave to have left. Including those who drive the buses. Naturally, airlines and buses will shut down 24 hours before a cat4/cat 5 hurricane hits. IIRC, Katrina hit Florida about 2-3 days before Louisiana. Evacuations and recommendations for such were going out a couple days before Kat-1 hit the FL coast. It stalled and slowed, gaining water and strength, yet still *many* were telling reporters of all walks "We'll wait this one out". > I was astounded when, 24 hours before Katrina hit > Biloxi, when a friend of mine was forced into hitching a ride with a > trucking company's rig heading north, and first called me from > Hattiesburg. Ultimately, going to Hattiesburg wasn't that much of an > improvement, but then their business and home in Biloxi were completely > lost. > > > Well, those places are not storehouses for such items. While it is no > > great secret it is also not well know that most of our MRE and water > > resources are in fact stored at sea, not in every base in the US. > > So much for the vast planning capabilities of Homeland Security. Heheh, no kidding. However, that isn't their job. Remember they are just "to coordinate". ;) DHS does not and should not have anything to do with natural disaster recovery. The missions are entirely distinct and trying to combine them is a sure way to abysmal failure. Indeed my first reaction to reports from local DHS bureaucrats was "WTF is he talking about?!". It ain't their job, nor should it be. > > > News flash: pretty much all of the equipment that would be useful in > > this disaster would be useless in Iraq and thus not shipped there. Iraq > > isn't exactly wet. > > Granted, but then you HAVE to consider that the National Guard wasn't even > in-theater until the third day after Katrina passed through. It > sounds to me, based upon that fact, as if someone REALLY was asleep at > the switch. Then how do you explain people reporting they saw the NG soldiers on the first day but then not for a day or two more? The fact is when you are talking an area of this magnitude, a few thousand troops are not going to be seen very often, if at all by many. NG was in fact in theater on "day one". Were there enough of them? Nope. Were they there? Yup. Remember, the guard is not a naval force. They are not prepped for floods such as this. On coastal areas the primary point of relief is the Coast Guard. And they did splendidly with what they had. Overloading the Guard with two primary responsibilities is a recipe for failure in both. > > Also, while you don't hear about it on the press because they don't get > > to whine about it, guardsmen were stranded and out of communication when > > the storm and flood destroyed communication lines as well as > > transportation routes. > > Well, isn't THAT one of the most-critical lessons we learned in 9/11? Yes, > one of the harshest criticisms levied about the 9/11 response was that > police and fire officials were totally unable to effectively communicate > with one another, let alone FEMA and other federal officials. The official > report on 9/11 gave the government terrible points for effective > leadership, mostly because of how communications and infrastructure were > handled. We DID NOT learn anything, it seems, from our mistakes. Apples and orangutans. 9/11's inability to intercommunicate was mismatched (*cough*proprietary*cough*) equipment protocols. In this event it was the loss of the equipment and the infrastructure that lead to the loss of communications. We both know the government can only work on one such change at a time. Even then, what do you do when your radio doesn't work? I was forward recon, the radio was my lifeblood. Trust me, when it goes, you are royally screwed. That's why we had several. But when they are all inoperable, or the other party's are inoperable, you are still royally screwed. So you do what you can when you can. I'm sure we'll eventually hear about these stories. I've heard a few already. > >> You're right about one important thing as well. As you just > >> pointed out, this amounts to a failure on the magnitude and scale > >> of most third world countries, that even respond much more > >> quickly, and seem to have more energy to save the living than our > >> own Federal government displayed in this tragedy. > > > > So uhh how fast was the response to the Tsunami then? Oh that's right it > > took weeks. > > NOT ENTIRELY TRUE. U.S. resources were on the ground within 5 days. Most > of the official shortwave radio stations in the area were brought back > online using American generators within two or three days, in most cases. They did have an aircraft carrier group just outside of the area. There are shall we say, a few resources to be had there? This is one of the reasons I argue for a small to nonexistent ground force consisting of primarily Marines, no Air Force whatsoever, and a Navy with perhaps double the carrier fleet. Carrier groups are truly impressive. That said, your memory is a bit faulty. The quake and resulting tsunami happened at 0800-ish Dec 25 local time (all dates below are localtime to keep consistency). On 27 December, Pacific Command ordered the deployment of 5-8 C-130's and 3 P-3 reconnaissance craft to Utapao. [Note: they had somewhere to land in the area.] That same day the USS Lincoln steamed out of port in Hong Kong. It began operations on Dec 28th/29th after traveling approximately 1700 miles. Also on December 27th the Bonhomme Richard amphibious assualt ship was diverted to the area. December 29th the first P-3 recon flight is initiated, and the C-130's depart Japan for Thailan. The DRAT-T (Disaster Recovery Assessment Team) and DRAT-SL are on deck on the 29th as well. December 30 the DRAT-I is on deck. The first C-130 relief flight lifted off on 30 December. Five days after the incident. December 31st the first CSG relief helicopter flights begin. Six days after. US forces landed 5 days after the event, so they could not have been bringing things online in 2-3 days. That said, how do you bring a generator on line when it is under 6-12 feet of water? This is a crucial difference between the Tsunami and New Orleans. The tsunami came and went .. like freight train. Katrina and the resulting floods are like a drunk Mike Tyson in a bar - hanging around continuing to dish out punishment. Further, who expects the Army NG to have amphibious craft? nobody in their right mind, that's who. That's the realm of the Navy and Marines. > > >> It was mentioned just earlier tonight on a documentary, that the > >> paltry sum appropriated by Congress for immediate aid to the > >> victims in this tragedy is about as much as it takes to float the > >> US invasion of Iraq for one week! I guess we know where the > >> hearts and minds of the current Administration lie. > > > > Sure, they knew a disaster of this magnitude was coming and chose to not > > do anything about it. Pshaw. > > There have been studies done which described in GREAT detail of the losses > that a Cat-4 or Cat-5 hurricane could do in the Gulfport-to-Slidell areas. > I've been closely following most of the disaster preparedness studies for > Slidell, Louisiana since 1999 because I have intimate knowledge of the > area. Nearly every study that has ever been done about the Cat-5 scenario > hitting Slidell has specifically mentioned a wall of water 25 feet high, a > total loss of all electrical power and unprecedented wind damage. I > believe there were a total of *five* studies done since 1999. Yes, both > federal and state disaster preparedness teams *SHOULD* have been fully > aware of the scope of the disaster long before Katrina. *LOCAL* agencies and the ACE, sure. And they've been requesting it since *1965*. How exactly can you fault the current or even the previous administration for that? > > Actually, the Army CoE *wanted* to build those levees to support a cat5 > > hurricane but years and years and years ago (you know when they were > > built) they were told that a cat 3 build was sufficient. It would have > > cost many billions more back then. This was in the late sixties. I'm > > sure somehow though you'll blame the current administration for it. > > No, I don't have blame. I have *contempt* for the entire bureaucratic > process, ranging from local, state and federal officials who either chose > to ignore the warnings, or failed to properly engineer the infrastructure. > One case in point is that, as of this morning, despite nearly total > destruction, power has been restored to much of the Port of New Orleans > and the four huge Slidell dock areas, including the pipeline. How? Why? > They were re-engineered to withstand a Cat-4 in 2001. Excellent, several days later power is restored to some places. While I applaud the upgrading of that part of the infrastructure, I also must note that it is a far less daunting and challenging, not to mention costly, undertaking than the levee and flood control ones. > > [Interesting, and in most cases, accurate information on the levees > snipped to save space and time, the latter of which I am short of this > morning.] > > > The project (for the area where the main breach occurred) was not > > targeted for completion until 2018, it was 80% complete. > > Actually, the *entire* canal sub-system was slated for completion. But only for the SPH, and still not for another dozen years or so (assuming they completed on time. ;) Even if complete it still would have done nothing to stop this. > > > Why? Because certain countries have increased their output as a result > > of the storm, because more than the US has/is/is considering releasing > > crude from it's reserves, and because the price was artificially high > > due to speculation. Remember, oil is a commodity and is traded just like > > other commodities on the futures market. Oil has been prepped for a fall > > for a while now. Its price was/is artificially high in that it was not > > representative of the relationship between supply and demand. Germany is > > considering releasing 2 million barrels per day for the next 30 days, > > and that is just crude. > > Let me summarize a few facts which I am, in particular, aware about the > vast Sunoco, Shell and Amoco refineries located along the Mississippi > Delta region. For example, by late Sunday night, the database servers for > most of the refineries will be back online, largely due to advance > planning done last year. Data was uploaded offsite before Katrina made > landfall, and nearly *everything* in Slidell is powered by underground > fiber optic cables with multiple redundancies. All they had to do to > restore functionality is restore power to a limited number of switches. > > By comparison, it may take MONTHS before Bellsouth can restore service to > any of their customers, let alone other ISP's. The building that once > housed the main switches in Biloxi simply isn't there anymore, and the big > honking switch room in New Orleans is flooded. However, don't despair. Due > to their design, data for Bellsouth customers is being temporarily held > outside the area. Ah the wonders of private companies who depend on these things. ;) > > > I sincerely hope everyone reconsiders a lot of things. Among the the > > wisdom of building a major city in a bowl that sits below sea level on > > the hurricane coast. Not to mention living there. > > Can you or I change hundreds of years of history? Of course they will > rebuild. I don't want to imagine the hue and cry that would come about if > they did not. I've actually been quite suprised by the talk of many in the area (officials, people and reporters) who are questioning the sanity of doing so. That it is even being discussed is progress IMO. Sure, as Bush said "the south will rise again" err I mean "New Orleans will rise again". But then again, it may be quite some time before people move there in quantity. > > difference. We don't have detailed hi-res satellite surveillance of the > > US. So we had no realistic reconnaissance of the area. It took 3 days to > > get satellite images. That said, the Army did in fact ship and deploy > > drones as best they could. > > HUH? *I* had high-res satellite images of the entire area BEFORE Katrina > made landfall, courtesy of MapInfo. To their extreme credit, whoever owns > the satellites also tasked three of their five satellites with obtaining > updated high-res satellite images such as have been shown on TV by CNN > news. BEFORE is irrelevant when planning routes for AFTER. ;) Yes, more than day later. And not at resolutions enough to determine what routes are flooded. > > > New Orleans was a city of half a million people. Moving millions of MREs > > takes a lot more time than a few hours. Between roads not being > > traversable and not knowing in advance localized ground transport comes > > to worse than a standstill. It comes down to "crap go back and find > > another route". > > Conceded. > > >> When talking about the US Federal government, it is an oxymoron > >> to call it 'good'. > > SNORT!!!! > > > Again, immediate disaster relief is necessarily in the hand of the local > > government. I'll argue against the fed taking that over too. So should > > you, IMO. > > You mean we should dump FEMA? HELL YEAH! If nothing else it'd make my wife happy as I'd finally quit griping and bitching about FEMA. :) > > Another thing people need to and should take out of this (again), is > > that reliance on the government for such things is folly of monumental > > proportions. I'll say right now that if I were in Bush's shoes I'd have > > waited for the governor(s) to request the help. Hindsight be damned you > > likely would have done no different. > > I have copies of both the disaster assistance statements and request for > assistance from all three state governors, each of which were dated Monday > last. > > > Now, time for me to relay a little bit of media witness here. Last > > night, Bill O'Reilly had a woman from NO on. Was she complaining about a > > lack of food. No. She was complaining the food was cold. A lot. She was > > complaining about getting cold MREs. I was stunned. Absolutely stunned. > > I was not stunned that O'Reilly let it go, as he was too focused on > > attacking the response. > > Omigod. That is REPULSIVE. Yup. Tami heard it in teh kitchen and I heard "OMG SHE did *NOT&!" to which I had to respond "Yes, yes she most certainly did.". It still is under Tami's skin. In fairness the fellow next to here was literally stunned at it. When it came his turn to talk he just sat there and stared at her like she had a 3 foot booger hanging off her or something. They had to quit asking him questions as he had lost coherency. > > The primary goal of the rescue and disaster recovery persons is to get > > people out of the danger area first. Anything less is sheer stupidity. > > It is a form of triage - determining who is worst off, who can be saved > > and going from there. For battlefield medics (for example) and doctors, > > that sometimes means turning away from the sucking mortal chest wound to > > fix a compound fracture. > > I agree, to a point. > > > In this case, the priority was and should be, to people trapped on > > rooftops, people trapped under rooftops (where you can determine they > > are there), and so on. It does not go to looters, it does not go to > > shipping food instead of search and rescue equipment. This hurricane hit > > a massively large area. > > Let us add to your excellent list making reaching hospitals, nursing homes > and other long-term care providers, re-establishing supply lines for food, > water and medicines to them. Sure, but you have to start *somewhere*. And someone will *always* disagree with the decision made. Honestly, I'd be searching for people afloat and trapped on rooftops and in attics before going to hospitals. Of all the places in the area, the hospitals should have been the most prepared for these events. I'd also not go to the NG stations and police stations and other places likely to be faring better than the odd house either. Some will think that harsh, and some will disagree. But nonetheless it is my position and I stand by it. > An old familiar place, Charity Hospital, in > New Orleans on St. Charles, is a case where Lt-General Honore's impact > team of light cavalry units saved hundreds of lives. Migod, people were > dying on television until he personally redesigned the entire medivac > system to prioritize getting critically-ill patients out of Charity > Hospital to the triage center set up at New Orleans International Airport. > > > At best we'd have dismissed it as political pandering, as a massive > > pork barrel project. A Bush attempt to create more government jobs to > > prop up a sagging economy for political gain for the 2006 congressional > > elections. You know it to be true. > > Well, isn't Trent Lott running for re-election? <grin> HAH! :D Probably. Dammit I should have known he had a hand in this. I bet he really had his house secretly moved by the Prometheus just before Katrina hit. ;) > > So you see, it is a never ending struggle of (geometrically!) increasing > > intensity. Had the government not subsidized this, I seriously doubt the > > situation would have been as dire due to far less people being there, or > > people/industry being much smarter about their construction and > > preparedness. > > I agree again, in part, with you. All you have to do to prove or disprove > most of what you've said is look at what once was called "an extreme > disaster preparedness posture" right there in Slidell. They had massive > damages, too, but here we are five days an counting, and major portions of > the electrical and communications infrastructure in Slidell are already > coming back online in bits and pieces. A friend who lives in Slidell > already has cellular service back and working, and local management teams > are telling him that, subject to building inspections, by the end of next > week they might have electric power restored in over 60% of the livable > homes. They were prepared; they had multiple levels of building codes. I take it Slidell is not underwater, and thus not below sea level to an appreciable degree? > > Incessant government subsidization of living in areas that are not only > > at risk for extreme environmental and natural disasters, but experience > > them regularly, has lead to a false belief that "it is ok" to live in > > these areas. The Earthquake State, Hurricane States (The AKA Hurricane > > Coast), and "Tornado Alley" are all places that would have far less > > people living there if it were not for the government paying to rebuild > > all the time. > > Wait a minute here... You mean to suggest that people shouldn't rebuild > their homes in Tornado Alley? Now let's see here <Dave scratches his head > in frustration>, just how are we going to quantify what is and is not > tornado alley? Remember, I've lived there. <grin> I didn't know that, but pretty much, sort of. If they want to pay for it, let them rebuild. But I shouldn't have to. :D > > Now I am not claiming the government should say "don't live there", I'm > > just saying it should not pay for the losses that *will* be incurred. I > > am saying that those of us in Idaho, Alaska, Montana, Texas, etc. should > > not be paying for the rebuilding of New Orleans, or the other areas hit. > > That's a fair question you're raising there, but then you force people who > live there to develop a personal relationship with their insurance > company. Come to think of it, that is not such a bad idea, at that. :) > However, flood insurance should be *mandatory* for such places as New > Orleans. That would take responsibility for damage mitigation out of the > hands of the government, no? Nope. "What about the poor <insert minority> who can't afford the cost of flood insurance, you racist bastard?". > > > If the oil industry wants refineries there and the ports to supply them, > > they can build them. If the coffee industry wants a port there, they can > > pay for it. If Joe Six pack wants to live there, he can pay for it. If > > they can't afford it, they can go elsewhere. In fact, I hear tell from > > friends down there that a massive portion of those who left are not > > going to return. > > Tongue in cheek here, but isn't this what one would call "hurricane > migration" ? Hehe. > > > Indeed, I'd say that outside of that most will not return. It will > > likely take a good 8 weeks to pump out the water. That is the earliest > > reconstruction could begin. Then there will be months before significant > > population needs and infrastructure can be established. By this time, > > most who evacuated or were evacuated will have found a home elsewhere. > > Texas just significantly grew in population. And remember, Hurricane > > season ain't over. While Lee and Maria are not currently threatening > > land or areas already hit, we still have much of the season left, and > > Katrina wasn't considered as dangerous as it became in it's last days. > > I've been watching both of them establish their storm tracks, and Maria is > definitely "wobbling" on its axis, which is not a good thing. It would be > wildly interesting, from a demographic point of view, mind you, what would > happen to the Southwest infrastructure if it decided to take the northern > track and hit Florida head-on as a Cat-4, then march up the East Coast > toward the Carolinas. I suspect the differences in the area would mitigate the damage and it would not be as "devastating", thought the press and government would make it seem like it. > > > Did you know that only half of the homeowners in New Orleans had flood > > insurance? In condos and apartment complexes, the insurance stuff is far > > trickier and they can take years to get sorted out. > > Yes, I was looking at that, and muttering beneath my breath about how much > that will cost US here in the Pacific Northwest. You and me both. > > Speaking of Texas ... Texas demonstrates exactly who you should fault if > > anyone. The State of Louisiana. They failed to prepare for such an > > eventuality. Texas has planned for *years* for the total obliteration of > > the port city of Galveston, just as has happened with New Orleans. That > > is why they have been able to respond the way they have. The cots, the > > infrastructure, the whole shebang was ready to go as soon as they were > > given the word. Was LA prepared for this possibility? Nope. Not even > > close. And they had/have a higher risk factor due to New Orleans being > > below sea level. > > Not only was and is Galveston prepared, you forget the massive local tax > levy that the citizens of Brownsville passed several years ago for > disaster preparedness. Both Galveston and Brownsville have shared the same > fates in the past with hurricane damages. > > [Side note: the French quarter will likely be the first rebuilt. > > Why?It's flooding was far, far less than the rest. Why? You guessed it, > > it's mainly above sea level.] > > Huh? The French Quarter is *below* sea level, I believe. Maybe I'm wrong. According to the reports and images, it isn't. Indeed one report on the potential looming rebuild has it that the FQ may become much of if not the new center of NO. > > On a side note, my SUV purchase is paying off even more about now. We > > run E85 in it. We are still paying $1.85 per gallon to fill it up. Last > > fill up was Tuesday. If the wholesale cost of gasoline doubles, the cost > > to drive the Suburban goes up 15%. Do I get to be a bit more smug now > > when I speak with environuts who think spending billions on the fallacy > > of Hydrogen or think that hybrids are the salvation? Yeah, I think I > > get to. : > > This makes a really INTERESTING side-note. Please tell us more, speaking > strictly for myself. Well, it's pretty damned cool IMO. I know I've posted on it here before (I tend to proselytize E85 ;) ). Basically, E85 is 85% ethanol, 15 percent petrogasoline. The ethanol we are using is locally produced from "potato waste". The remaining 15% is from domestic oil (which BTW is supplied by refineries in the Utah and GC area -and the Utah ones are down for maintenance- so in that respect it hits the Treasure Valley). So, on the one hand I can righteously claim that none of my driving is done on imported oil, and that our "guzzler" 85% of it is done on fully renewable fuel that is safer for the environment and burns cleaner. Sure, I get 9.8-10.3MPG on E85 compared to 11-12 (all in city driving) on 100gasoline. But I'm sure we'd all agree I'm ahead when the price of gasoline is nearly double my E85. :D In effect, I burn less gasoline than a Prius driving the same distance. At an average of 10MPG fuel consumption, E85 fuel burns 1.5 gallons of petrogas per hundred miles. That comes out to ... 67 MPGP (miles per gallon petrogas). And I paid not a dime extra for that ability as it is standard on GM 5.3 litre engines as of last year, IIRC. It was a no-cost option prior to that. Ford and Chrysler also have vehicles like this but I don't know their details. I believe the new Dodge Charger is a flex-fuel. One of the niceties is that I don't *have* to run E85. I can 100% petrogas (often referred to as E0 ;) ), E85, or anywhere in between. Anyway, our local station runs E85 at 1.85/gallon. So as long as gasoline prices are at 2.20/gal or so, I'm even or ahead. But we run it even if they are priced the same. We believe that this is the best way to build the demand for better fuels. Not to mention I love the feeling of righteous gloating in response to pandering holier-than-thou environment hypocrites. Oh, and I run E10 in the Vette, running again on domestic oil and local potato waste. Something I've done some work on is researching TPC and it's applicability to the area. Rough calculations show that we put out enough garbage and ag-waste to provide enough ethanol for over 80% of Idaho if all vehicles ran E85, and all of our oil needs (from the conversion using TPC) ... and enough to export to local states. Indeed, we produce enough as a nation to supply about (IIRC) 18% more than our current needs. Costs are comparable to raw or "mined" crude, even without the economies of scale the petrocompanies enjoy. Given man's propensity toward disposable items and increasing consumption, I figure this technology is scalable and sustainable in the production sense. ;) I'd like to see more of it in use. Among the advantages of an ethanol/tpc-crude system is that they use existing technology and infrastructure. They are also decentralized making the infrastructure less nationally sensitive to regional disasters. > BTW, I apologize for snipping your fascinating discussion so severely. > There are many good points you have made, some of which may well become > later points of discussion, but for right now, I have to limit my personal > time as I have a number of business-related technical issues which are > waving frantically at me this morning. Business may come and business may > go, but the damned networks go on forever... No worries. I had the advantage of being at home and up all night to prepare for going back to work. Was on a vacation where I was up *gasp* during daylight hours. ;) Now I am back at my "day"(night) job. > Thanks for your perspectives... No problem. I mainly take objection to classifying the response as horrible when indeed it was likely the best imaginable given the situation. I also take offense when any sitting administration is faulted/blamed for stuff they could not possibly have affected one way or the other. The former one is the more sticking point with me though. I'm sick of wild ass exaggerations from area officials and reporters with an axe to grind making such statements as "it's been nearly a week since we've been hit and no troops yet" ... a day or two into the storm's aftermath. That said, I did love the video of the natural gas fire boiling and bursting out from the floodwaters. That was just too cool. :) There have also been some tough and heartfelt reports from reporters. Shepard Smith on FNC has a piece that will probably be replayed a year from now or longer. I piece where he found a dead old man laying on the side of the road with a blanket over him. The emotions he felt were clearly visible on him, just as the restraint he was demonstrating was. But above all, he kept saying he understands why it is that way, and he agrees with the decision to save the savable instead of worrying about picking up dead bodies but that is is just a helluva impact nonetheless. Sadly, now the gloryhounds are in there (Geraldo Rivera for example) and we'll see puff-me-the-reporter pieces. It will probably be several months before the real stories start surfacing (no pun intended) again. I suppose it comes from having been in some of these positions and seen in reality how the laws of physics and human interaction are so not in agreement with Hollywood. Libertarians should be ready to not stand with the group that are already literally blaming Bush for the disaster. We know better. Of all the political groups, we know better. If by some weird twist of fate Badnarik was in office, there would still have been no change in the outcome. Well, enough for now - got some coding to do. Cheers, Bill _______________________________________________ Libnw mailing list Libnw@immosys.com List info and subscriber options: http://immosys.com/mailman/listinfo/libnw Archives: http://immosys.com/mailman//pipermail/libnw
