also the ability to play .swf files in the MediaElement would be really cool
On 4/4/08, .net noobie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > yes, but you cannot use it everywhere > > On Thu, Apr 3, 2008 at 10:55 PM, Jonathan Parker < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > - the ability to use % values for heights and widths would be nice > > > > You mean the star (*) syntax? It is supported by the Grid. > > > > I.e. > > > > > > > > <Grid x:Name="LayoutRoot" Background="White" > > > > > <Grid.ColumnDefinitions> > > > > <ColumnDefinition > > Width="0.5*"/> > > > > <ColumnDefinition > > Width="0.5*"/> > > > > </Grid.ColumnDefinitions> > > > > <Grid.RowDefinitions> > > > > <RowDefinition > > Height="0.5*"/> > > > > <RowDefinition > > Height="0.5*"/> > > > > </Grid.RowDefinitions> > > > > > > > > Just divide by 100! > > > > > > > > Some other things: > > > > > > > > Virtical support for the grid splitter. > > > > A wrap panel. > > > > Incremental search in Blend and VS. Long overdue. > > > > Horizontal split of Design/XAML in Blend to support dual-monitor setup. > > > > Multimonitor support. i.e be able to expand a video control inside a SL > > app. to fit the monitor it is on not both monitors. > > > > > > > > Jonathan > > > > > > > > *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto: > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *.net noobie > > *Sent:* Thursday, 3 April 2008 1:15 PM > > *To:* listserver@ozsilverlight.com > > *Subject:* Re: OT: Silky vs Microsoft was RE: [OzSilverlight] > > Silverlight 3.0 wishlist, now's your chance. > > > > > > > > - the ability to use % values for heights and widths would be nice > > - proper UIElement Property Binding like in WPF & better support > > for it in Blend > > - Support for the designer in VS2008 so so you can drop and drag > > controls on to the design surface > > - alot better support for debugging, it is currently a potential > > nightmare if you have not played with silverlight for a while > > - decent combobox control, and more controls in general, the > > current ones are pretty cool, but more is better :) > > - ability to update the "VisualRoot" control would be good > > - more and better documentation, with more and better code samples > > for both C# and *VB* plus xaml > > - new section in the silverlight forums for silverlight 2.0, and > > 3.0 etc... currently it is a real drag to have to weed out all the > > silverlight 1.0 & 1.1 posts when your looking for a Silverlight 2.0 Beta > > 1 > > answer > > - more Video demos, and some more complex ones > > > > But from playing with silverlight 2.0 Beta 1, it is a really cool > > product and getting better :) > > > > On 4/3/08, *Jonathan Parker* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > My list: > > > > 1. Better clipboard support. I don't get why you can't just copy/paste > > to/from the clipboard in SL when this is allowed with HTML/Javascript. > > I would expect that SL would have a superset of the features of HTML and > > not > > be more limited in security. I can understand that SL shouldn't be > > allowed > > direct access > > to the clipboard by default but that doesn't mean that you can't make a > > textblock selectable and have a context menu so you can copy the text. > > > > 2. Right and middle mouse click events on controls and context menu > > control. > > > > 3. Rich text is a tricky one as when it comes to copy/paste to/from the > > clipboard problems arise. If you can solve this x-platform that would be > > something awsome. > > > > 4. Make unit testing easy to automate without a browser (if not already > > possible). > > > > 5. I don't know exactly how the deployment of the SDK bits works at the > > moment but it would be good if they only needed to be downloaded once > > for > > each client > > instead of once for each client per each app. that references them. This > > would mean that the SDK would be kind of like an optional service pack. > > Those who don't want the > > big foot print can leave it out by not referencing it and those that > > need it > > can reference it and it will be pulled from the MS server the first time > > only. > > The SDK could still be open source/codeplex and any changes that people > > want > > to make they can reference as their own DLL instead of the one provided > > by > > MS. > > This would also allow more flexibility in the control of upgrades to the > > SDK. You could choose to either wait for the MS upgrade or control the > > upgrade yourself if you're using your own copy. > > > > This would create more vesion issues than normal but SL devs. are > > smarter > > than plain old .NET devs. right? ;) We can handle it! > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > On Behalf Of Scott Barnes > > > Sent: Tuesday, 1 April 2008 12:11 PM > > > To: listserver@ozSilverlight.com > > > Subject: RE: OT: Silky vs Microsoft was RE: [OzSilverlight] > > Silverlight > > 3.0 wishlist, > > > now's your chance. > > > > > > *sigh* :) This one's going to be a long one, so bare with me. > > > > > > -- > > > > > > 1) Silky is just vocal and yeah he may go against the grain, but in > > the > > end he is a > > > customer of Microsoft and whether I agree or disagree with his views, > > I'll > > still give > > > him the time/day to voice them. > > > > > > As for the snowflake comment. We are in what, year 2? And already we > > are > > > exceeding our critics expectations and more over, our competitors. The > > story with > > > Silverlight will continue to get better as we aren't being reactive, > > we > > are keeping > > > calm and pushing forward with what we think is a good bet. Our > > competitor > > has > > > been reactive and are busy fighting fires on many fronts, and all the > > power to > > > them. As from growing ground swell from 0 to where we are today, that > > has > > been > > > an enormous effort undertaken and lists like this are a testament to > > this. > > The > > > community and technology is growing, but we aren't just building a > > runtime > > - we > > > are building a UX Platform all with interconnecting pieces (Tools, > > Services, > > > Communities etc) and there is no "instant deploy" button (wish there > > was). > > > > > > 2) I need to pick my wording more carefully around you :) - It's not > > that > > "I don't get > > > it" I disagree with it. There is millions upon millions of .NET > > friendly > > folks from > > > around the world who are keen to explore/adopt the new Sivlerlight > > ecosystem as > > > well as many thousands of folks whom are also keen to use both Flash > > and > > > Silverlight. Right now, it's much easier conversation to work with the > > folks whom > > > understand Microsoft tools & culture - or have invested in Microsoft > > technology > > > already - than it is to worry about convincing the folks loyal to the > > Adobe brand that > > > we have just as strong offering. Doesn't mean we won't spend our > > energy > > and time > > > doing so, just that our existing customers are just as important as > > new > > customers. > > > That's the simplicity of it all, grow but don't lose sight of the > > customers that gave > > > you success in the first place. > > > > > > The overarching message is that this is not a zero sum game, you can > > use > > BOTH. > > > If you don't like Silverlight or you think based on your own > > investment, > > skill set and > > > resources made available that Flex is a better solution - then choose > > Flex. I'd > > > rather you pick a solution that best suits your skills, budget and > > long > > term plans > > > then one that is a forced fit. As this is a short term win, massive > > long-term loss. > > > > > > To put it in perspective, Barry you're in the top 1% of the Adobe > > developer pyramid, > > > in that you have skills that have been nurtured and cultivated because > > you've > > > spent time with the right people over the years (I know as I was also > > there > > > alongside you). The trick isn't so much "why did company xyz choose > > Flex", > > I > > > suspect you influenced the discussion or will influence it, but the > > real > > hurdle you > > > will face is simple, finding another Barry as you don't scale. How > > many > > > ActionScript 3.0 developers exist in Brisbane? How many .NET > > developers > > exist in > > > Brisbane? This is where we see our difference, in that we aren't > > focused > > just on > > > the runtime, we are also focused on ensuring there is a vibrant > > ecosystem. > > > Silverlight's coming from behind, that's ok.. we'll get there > > eventually, > > especially > > > when we have partners like Readify whom are teaching troops in > > multiple > > cities as > > > well as whom foster this list. > > > > > > Flash has a lot of pro's and con's associated to it, you know I know > > them > > much > > > better than most and if I weren't a Microsoft employee, I'd unload a > > blog > > post or two > > > on what these are and where they sit. The fact is, I'm a blue badge > > and > > have to > > > watch what I say and when - especially being a Product Manager now. > > I'd > > love to > > > get knee deep into a compete debate, but it creates to much > > controversy > > and folks > > > at times simply see it as "Microsoft vs Adobe" (not to mention Adobe > > staffers just > > > got nuts at it) and it detracts away from the intent to air the > > > concerns/misinformation associated to the technology. > > > > > > I will say this however, the experiences aren't always the same and we > > also have a > > > platform agnostic approach. Silverlight IS x-platform and will > > continue to > > grow > > > beyond the operating systems and into other areas (i.e. devices etc). > > Our > > intent is > > > to not just be platform agnostic but also provide developers the > > ability > > to actually > > > write once and deploy to many (do I need to remind you of the actual > > workflow in > > > design to develop with Adobe technology). Flash, Flex, Flash Lite, AIR > > etc > > all don't > > > offer this. It's still a fragmented conversation and even with Breeze > > / > > aka Adobe > > > Connect it's still skewed. Our tools like Visual Studio 2008, will > > enable > > this to > > > happen alongside Expression Studio, if it doesn't .. tell us as I > > guarantee you there > > > are many ears keen to cover off blind spots we may have. > > > > > > 3) Why would we? Flex Framework maybe open source, but the runtime > > isn't, > > and > > > so given our intent to fix the entire UX story around Microsoft > > technology, we are > > > now building a platform to suite. In doing so, hitching our carriage > > behind a > > > runtime that we have no control over or influence is simply too > > dangerous > > (both for > > > us and our customers). Given Adobe/Macromedia mistakes of the past, we > > in > > turn > > > are held hostage to the runtime's future evolution which in turn means > > our > > > customers are as well. It doesn't stop with the runtime either, the > > actual > > SWF itself > > > is owned by Adobe and they also decide its fate / future. Given the > > Software + > > > Service strategy we have painted for our future, it just doesn't fit. > > We > > are committed > > > to interoperability and with formats like OOXML & XAML it's clear we > > mean > > it. > > > Some will disagree, that's fine, but we will push on head just the > > same as > > in the > > > end these are ways to ensure that folks don't end up with past > > mistakes, > > like > > > having binary .doc files that take a lot of effort to deserialize. > > Today, > > you get a docx > > > file which is a zip file that can be leveraged by anyone - even Adobe > > are > > using > > > docx with their acquired product - Buzzword. > > > > > > That's what makes us different, we are committed to interoperability > > and > > Adobe > > > isn't. Adobe are welcome to use our technology and the bulk of their > > sales > > come > > > from customers using Microsoft products, it's nice to on one hand > > denounce > > us > > > while at the same time use us. We are annoyed yet delighted and that's > > the > > beauty > > > of Microsoft, we have many faces to our products/services and don't > > buy > > into the > > > "Us or Them" arguments. > > > > > > In the end Barry, this is a much bigger Petri dish and the Adobe > > community > > are > > > measured in thousands. Microsoft community is measured in millions, > > it's > > the raw > > > facts and it's not because we tricked the world into buying our > > products > > year after > > > year. We do a lot of good along with our customers who exceed our > > expectations > > > year after year. It's simply because we approach things with long term > > vision and > > > never with a short term focus. If we make mistakes, we regroup, fix > > and > > get a > > > release out the door as fast as humanly possible while keeping quality > > assurance > > > as close to perfect as we can. You win some battles, and you lose some > > but > > you > > > keep moving forward. > > > > > > Adobe and Microsoft will eventually go separate paths in this > > Silverlight > > vs. Flash > > > debate. You saw hints of this at MIX08 where we went out of our way to > > show > > > what you can't do with Flash. We will have a set of features that have > > "Me > > to" > > > associated to it, but we're more excited about innovation and putting > > things right in > > > this space, as that's where the true fun begins. 3D inside Flash is > > over-rated, as in > > > the end only a handful understand how to use it and those that do, > > aren't > > doing > > > much with it. Outsmart is probably the only company worldwide that has > > done > > > something significant with 3D but could a mining company use Fake 3D > > to > > > explode schematic diagrams for parts ordering? - nope. Let's talk > > about > > real 3D > > > instead? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > On Behalf Of Barry Beattie > > > Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 6:43 AM > > > To: listserver@ozsilverlight.com > > > Subject: Re: OT: Silky vs Microsoft was RE: [OzSilverlight] > > Silverlight > > 3.0 wishlist, > > > now's your chance. > > > > > > ya poor bugga' Scott - you've really got your work cut out for you... > > > > > > 1) it's a shame that all the nice Silverlight folks on this list (yeah > > > I've been lurking since it started) will have their passion undermined > > > by short-sighted tossers like Silky. > > > > > > Sadly, while the numbers are small, there's still too many "Silky's" > > > in the MS sphere with a blood-sucking mentality: too interested in get > > > rich quick instead of growing the pie. These Silverlight ppl here get > > > it - elsewhere most don't. > > > > > > (present company excepted) too busy to sell you controls instead of > > > getting off collective backsides and just making it happen - many > > > hands make light work of the sourcecode: > > > http://code.google.com/p/flexvizgraphlib/ (**see below) > > > > > > I'm starting to think you haven't got a snowflakes chance in hell at > > > the moment in trying to establish the same sort of web 2.0 > > > collaboration and groundswell that Patrick and Downey and Stewart are > > > tapping into - don't get me wrong, those guys are no angels nor > > > towering intellects - but I am saying core ethos just isn't there in > > > the same way as the ground-troups evangelism that sourounds Flex and > > > AIR. > > > > > > I can say this coming from MS land - from VB5, VB6, ASP (classic), > > > ASP.net... I offered to help turn this around - strengths and > > > weaknesses from both camps, as you know, but time marches on and I > > > gotta get back to the core and move on - the situation demands it. > > > Good luck, man, you're gonna need it. > > > > > > 2) Silverlight features: you and I have been having the same argument > > > for a year now, and I swear you still don't get it. you keep going on > > > about there being more .NET developers where Silverlight can offer the > > > part of the technology stack that Flash/Flex does while keeping it all > > > inhouse. and I say "so what" > > > > > > a f'r'instance: the place I'm working at right now (yeah, I've moved) > > > I'm developing a prototype for an app that will eventually be done in > > > Flex. Not Silverlight. > > > Why not? Apart from Silverlight not being ready for prime-time (for > > > what they want), the answer is in the "bitmap manipulation" suggestion > > > in the other thread. As soon as you make "some Silverlight runtimes > > > are more equal than others" compromise, you're lost. It's not just > > > pulling out the guts of the CLR for Silverlight - it's about making it > > > _platform_agnostic_. Their supported SOE is Windows/IE and yet it > > > makes more sense to go down a SWF path - not because of the fear of > > > introducing the first Mac into the organisation, but to start tapping > > > into the mobile space which they are now having to play catch-up on. > > > > > > with that little 1.something Mb runtime I can tap into everything from > > > client-side PDF generation, through rich apps to powerful > > > datavisualisations to Breeze videoconferencing/collaboration and on to > > > 3D rich interfaces. And it's not just the fact the Flash runtime is > > > everywhere - it's the assurance that the experiance will be identical > > > no matter where I am or what machine I'm using. *THIS* is the choice > > > I keep haranging you with. > > > > > > 3) an off-the-wall thought: (an analogy) some of the smartest > > > (Cricket) batsmen - when facing stupidly quick fast bowlers - use the > > > speed of the delivery to angle a shot for a cheap boundry - provide a > > > "value-add" to the momentum created by the bowler at little cost to > > > themselves... a la Sir Don Bradman. > > > ... so ... > > > ... for the life of me I can't work out why MS isn't using Adobe's > > > pace attack. There is (or soon will be) enough open-source/published > > > bits of the Flash/Flex runtime and libraries for MS to create their > > > own version of controls and server products leveraging on to the Flash > > > runtime. If you look at one way, Adobe are already leveraging off the > > > Windows platform. Why not MS leverage off an Adobe one? Beat them at > > > their own game providing better controls and development environment > > > to run on a ubiquitous platform. Borland (Delphi) was doing the same > > > leveraging off the Win32 runtime - It's nothing new. > > > > > > Will it sell more Windows licences? Man, that's a stale argument > > > growing colder. The soutions are winning, not the platforms. > > > > > > best of luck in Redmond. call me for a beer before you leave. > > > > > > cheers > > > barry.b > > > ASP.net/ColdFusion analyist/programmer > > > teacher/educational analyist > > > Adobe User Group Manager - Brisbane (mutimedia tools) > > > > > > PS: > > > > > > "as i took 3 steps back financially to move from Australia to US to > > > become a Product Manager for the Silverlight/WPF space." > > > > > > FWIW: While Scott and family won't starve, what he says is true. But > > > then again, for Scott it's never been about the money - he's a pretty > > > passionate guy where integrety is part of his ethos. > > > > > > b: over and out > > > > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > http://flexvizgraphlib.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/vgExplorer/bin/VGExplorer.ht > > ml# > > > or perhaps (model-view-controller code generator) > > > > > > > http://www.ericfeminella.com/blog/2008/03/31/cairngen-project-moved-to-googl > > e- > > > code/ > > > these are just a couple of (very) recent community projects I keep > > > tabs on/help out with. > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > OzSilverlight.com - to unsubscribe > > > from this list, send a message back to the list with 'unsubscribe' as > > the > > subject. > > > Powered by mailenable.com - List managed by www.readify.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > OzSilverlight.com - to unsubscribe > > > from this list, send a message back to the list with 'unsubscribe' as > > the > > subject. > > > Powered by mailenable.com - List managed by www.readify.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > OzSilverlight.com - to unsubscribe from this list, send a message back to > > the list with 'unsubscribe' as the subject. > > Powered by mailenable.com - List managed by www.readify.net > > > > > > > > > > -- > > .net noobie™ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > OzSilverlight.com - to unsubscribe from this list, send a message back to > > the list with 'unsubscribe' as the subject. > > Powered by mailenable.com - List managed by www.readify.net > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > OzSilverlight.com - to unsubscribe from this list, send a message back to > > the list with 'unsubscribe' as the subject. > > Powered by mailenable.com - List managed by www.readify.net > > > > > > -- > .net noobie™ -- .net noobie™ ------------------------------------------------------------------- OzSilverlight.com - to unsubscribe from this list, send a message back to the list with 'unsubscribe' as the subject. 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