Hi all. Just some raw ideas below. It several months I haven't coded in pharo. And I really miss it.
Meanwhile I've been lurking in iOS and recently meteor. I think the latter is great. We might take ideas from it... But it has to be adapted to the smalltalk way. What I find great: - reactive data and DDP is great to me => we need an equivalent tech. Sure it's a piece of cake for Sven :-) => having standard data storage as files/nosql/gemstone working out of the box => controled replication of data on client to avoid latency is a very good idea too to me - smart package are cool too => st and js have already a close relationship, we should enforce and simplify it as with C One killer app would be to have bridges to meteor BUT I would dream of an inspired version of/for Pharo. Meteor core language is js + css + mongo + lots of conventions. It's a full stack. Problem of meteor: no live debugging sessions (whereas it seems live!) and whereas it seems damn simple (3 files), it has hundreds of MB hidden for each installed apps ! I would see mini pharo images (without UI) acting as web client/server interchangabily. A separate data layer (probably an image too) with full access on the server and controlled replication on clients. Then a connection with a classic pharo image to develop/debug the mini images. Just some cents. I know this is quite naive and not easy to do... But we might take some inspiration: -DDP (easy for Sven) :-) -grid style client/server easy setup/deployment/control for casual developers ... Cheers, Cedrick > Le 17 mai 2014 à 13:13, kilon alios <kilon.al...@gmail.com> a écrit : > > I don't get why C is not old / deprecated / obsolete . Afterall its as old as > Smalltalk > > Who really uses modern languages ? > > C - 1972 > > Python - 1991 > > C++ - 1983 > > Pascal - 1970 > > .NET - 2002 > > Lisp - 1958 > > Java - 1995 > > Ruby - 1995 > > Perl - 1987 > > Visual Basic - 1991 > > Javascript - 1995 > > Objective C- 1983 > > PHP - 1995 > > > The vast majority of all popular languages out there are at least 20 years > old. Thats ancient history. They are not old, they are dinosaurs. Even > Clojure is 7 years old. > > The problem I see here is that the vast majority of things people are going > to like in Pharo on a basic level are Smalltalk features. Implementation wise > Pharo has improved a lot of things, added new stuff etc etc. But if you take > a look at for example Python back in 1991 and you compare it with a recent > version of Python you will find tons of diffirences. Yet its still Python. > > Actually its impossible to run a hello world of an old python (anything > previous to version 3) that will run in the recent Python. Cause they changed > print "hello World" to print( "hello World") , we are talking here about > fundamental changes. > > Personally I don't see how Pharo being 100% Smalltalk makes it unable or > difficult to implement super modern and efficient new features. Languages and > Software is not written in stone, it continuously evolves and improves or > else people stop using it. Vim was created back in 1991 people still find > awesome, modern, extremely powerful. > > this is from Ruby's website -> "Ruby is a language of careful balance. Its > creator, Yukihiro “Matz” Matsumoto, blended parts of his favorite languages > (Perl, Smalltalk, Eiffel, Ada, and Lisp) to form a new language that balanced > functional programming with imperative programming." Ruby has the right to be > called Smalltalk-inspired. because thats what it is. > > You got every right to describe Pharo any way you like but for me Pharo is "a > modern implementation of Smalltalk. A visual environment for easy direct live > coding" . > > >> On Sat, May 17, 2014 at 12:30 PM, Hilaire Fernandes >> <hilaire.fernan...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> Le 16/05/2014 20:18, p...@highoctane.be a écrit : >> > >> > Back to the future after 30 years of spinning your wheels >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > >> > Wanting to code at the speed of tought? >> > Wishing the machine was your friend and not a roadblock? >> > Want to burn cash as slow as possible while maximizing your output? >> > >> > If so, get a copy of Pharo! It is not your (grand) daddy's Smalltalk! >> >> That's why I understand this argument about not advertising Smalltalk in >> Pharo. >> >> Whatever we do or say, this huge mass of followers, once they heard >> Smalltalk they fill their head with red light warning, Smalltalk = >> old/deprecated/obsolete. >> >> For Pharo willing to socially scale = need to take this in consideration. >> >> Hilaire >> -- >> Dr. Geo http://drgeo.eu >
