Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Steve Jones]

I wish powerinjectors had software select. Packetflux FTW. If the big dogs
ever found out about the little wisp gem called packetlux, we'd all be SOL.
Old Forrest would be a bazillionaire and forget about us plebs

On Sep 17, 2018 10:12 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:

Packetflux power injectors. Feed them with a 24v and a 48v powers supply
(or use one or the other, and a DC-DC converter), and you can power
anything you want to. or there are lots of other ways to do it too... of
course you have to change jumpers (or switch to a different port) to go
between 24v and 48v, but being able to do that in software seems kind of
undesirable to me anyway.

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:56 PM David Coudron 
wrote:

> Of all the devices on our network, we lose Ubiquiti Nanos (our relays for
> large farm sites), and Netonix switches in our towers the most.   The
> Cambium equipment can double as a hammer when needed, you almost can’t get
> em to break.   The Mimosas do OK, but have their share of ethernet port
> problems.   As Steve mentioned, you expect the Ubiquitis to fail given
> their price, but the Netonix devices are surprisingly fragile.  If it
> lightnings in the middle of South Dakota it seems like we are replacing
> switches in our Minnesota tower cabinets.  I have a box of 8 of them
> sitting here that have all been replaced.  In the same cabinets we have
> never replaced one Cambium AP and only 4 Mimosa backhaul radios (we have
> about 4 to 1 more Mimosas deployed than Netonix).   I am sure there is
> something that can be replaced on the Netonix, but we just don’t have the
> time to become Netonix repair guys.
>
>
>
> We are seriously looking at the Mikrotik Cloud Router Switch as a
> replacement for Netonix.   The only issue is getting both 24V and 48V to
> the device at the same time, but I think we can get that figured out.
> Anyone have any practical experience with these they care to share?
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David  Coudron
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 9:38 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
>
>
> Out of curiously, and this is a real question, how did netonix pick of the
> market share they did while offering utter garbage? It's not even like
> they're garbage ubnt cheap, that I understand, I poke the 3 am Ubnt fat
> girl at the end of the bar regularly, cause she's cheap and fat so not
> going to be a problem. But netonix is like 90 percent problem from what I
> read. You never hear about a high maintenance fat chic because there's no
> interest. How's this tubby broad even in the discussion?
>
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018, 7:57 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
> PTC fuses are not fast enough to protect Netonix.  It actually has them
> inside.
>
> That is why I build the POE fuse product.  It does blow fast enough to
> protect the switch.
>
>
>
> *From:* Mark Radabaugh
>
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 1:12 PM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
>
>
> Chuck,
>
>
>
> We have had really good luck with putting PTC fuses in front of the POE
> power on the Mimosa radios in order to avoid blowing the fuses in the
> rectifier shelf when the gas tubes in the Mimosa short the POE.   I’m
> thinking maybe you want to look at putting some of those on the SS for the
> power coming from the Netonix?Let the gas tubes (or whatever surge
> suppressor you are using) short all the lines together and let the PTC fuse
> cut the power briefly?   Might be a little tricky to get the values right
> but might be able to save the POE from blowing.
>
>
>
> Or talk Netonix into including them internally so that they survive a POE
> short circuit.
>
>
>
> For those of you scratching your head… we routinely power Mimosa B5’s
> using Packetflux DC injectors from the -48V rectifier.  The surge
> suppression in the B5’s will short the power supply during a surge event
> long enough to blow the 2 or 5A telecom fuse.   All the equipment lives but
> we have to go replace the fuse - which we don’t want to do since it causes
> an outage until we get there.  The PTC fuse inline avoids the fuse blowing.
>
>
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:33 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
>
>
> Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short
> everything to ground.
>
> Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted.
>
>
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
>
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
>
> *To:* AFMUG
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
>
>
> Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and
> surge card.
>
>
>
> What's the Netonix problem?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM  wrote:
>
> If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have 

Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Steve Jones]

Out of curiously, and this is a real question, how did netonix pick of the
market share they did while offering utter garbage? It's not even like
they're garbage ubnt cheap, that I understand, I poke the 3 am Ubnt fat
girl at the end of the bar regularly, cause she's cheap and fat so not
going to be a problem. But netonix is like 90 percent problem from what I
read. You never hear about a high maintenance fat chic because there's no
interest. How's this tubby broad even in the discussion?

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018, 7:57 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

> PTC fuses are not fast enough to protect Netonix.  It actually has them
> inside.
> That is why I build the POE fuse product.  It does blow fast enough to
> protect the switch.
>
> *From:* Mark Radabaugh
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 1:12 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
> Chuck,
>
> We have had really good luck with putting PTC fuses in front of the POE
> power on the Mimosa radios in order to avoid blowing the fuses in the
> rectifier shelf when the gas tubes in the Mimosa short the POE.   I’m
> thinking maybe you want to look at putting some of those on the SS for the
> power coming from the Netonix?Let the gas tubes (or whatever surge
> suppressor you are using) short all the lines together and let the PTC fuse
> cut the power briefly?   Might be a little tricky to get the values right
> but might be able to save the POE from blowing.
>
> Or talk Netonix into including them internally so that they survive a POE
> short circuit.
>
> For those of you scratching your head… we routinely power Mimosa B5’s
> using Packetflux DC injectors from the -48V rectifier.  The surge
> suppression in the B5’s will short the power supply during a surge event
> long enough to blow the 2 or 5A telecom fuse.   All the equipment lives but
> we have to go replace the fuse - which we don’t want to do since it causes
> an outage until we get there.  The PTC fuse inline avoids the fuse blowing.
>
>
> Mark
>
> On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:33 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short
> everything to ground.
> Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
> *To:* AFMUG
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
> Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and
> surge card.
>
> What's the Netonix problem?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM  wrote:
>
>> If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done
>> that.
>> Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem.
>>
>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>
>> I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it
>> for sure.
>>
>> The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now,
>> happily.  The POE and surge card are in the trash.
>>
>> I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on
>> Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM,  wrote:
>>
>>> You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means
>>> the POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding
>>> the situation.
>>>
>>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>>
>>> I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM,  wrote:
>>>
 Do you have a spare POE to try ?

 *From:* Josh Luthman
 *Sent:* Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

 Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After
 several cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced those
 two at the same time.

 Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or
 more sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in
 the office for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

> It resets immediately if it is going to 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Steve Jones]

You can get a Ford in any color you want as long as it's black

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018, 4:38 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:

> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path as
> their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti products or
> services in my business model.
>
> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti would
> be for them to change their business model.
>
> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you
> outside of my vendor list.
>
> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other than
> the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of like Ford
> in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything else besides
> exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me privately."  The lawsuit is
> both a symptom and a cause to problems at Ubiquiti and you can't just brush
> the elephant in the room under the rug.
>
> 2 cents
>
> -Sean
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum  wrote:
>
>> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given
>> the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company
>> (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for
>> ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in
>> discussions about them unless I see something grossly in error. I would
>> actually rather keep that side of things separate from this group as I
>> value the relationships here above any employment scenario. My job at ubnt
>> is actually to engage with operators and try to find a better way to create
>> and maintain relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures
>> and criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
>> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is what I
>> can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this to turn into a
>> discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about products or
>> anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately. I
>> just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Cameron
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.
>>>
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, he is missed.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:
>>>
 Harass, welcome.
 I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.

 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

 Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume...
 but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty
 anonymous anyway.

 I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give
 us an opportunity to harass new people.

 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

> Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list
> members but only about 10% post.
>
> *From:* Mathew Howard
> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
> *To:* AFMUG
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post
> anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...
>
> I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they
> aren't going to every post anything anyway, do we care?
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron <
> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>
>> I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant
>> folks being identified as recipients of the information.   If I were
>> signing up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be identified as
>> being a part of the list given the value of the discussions on the list.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> David Coudron
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>
>>
>>
>> A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a
>> government rep.
>>
>> Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some
>> would prefer it.
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>
>> xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF.
>>
>> I am thinking of posting this when new people join.
>>
>> Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out
>> themselves?
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Robert]

Hmmm, where we like to locate gear typically finds winds into 70-80 mph. 
  Wind does really interesting things to water at those speeds..


On 9/17/18 5:13 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
Wind & rain can go "up" in hurricanes and other high wind/rain 
conditions. Especially if you're at the top of a hill or mountain.


We have that all the time around here, even without hurricanes.


bp


On 9/17/2018 5:03 PM, Matt Hoppes wrote:
How does water enter the unit through the Ethernet port?  The Ethernet 
port is about the lowest part of the unit and would require water to 
flow upwards.


On Sep 17, 2018, at 16:53, Mike Meluskey > wrote:



Water entering the units, primarily through the Ethernet ports.
$5 worth of gasket material would have engineered it correctly.

On 17 Sep 2018, at 19:43, Mike Hammett wrote:

What kind of failures?



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 


Midwest Internet Exchange 


The Brothers WISP 





*From: *"Mike Meluskey" mailto:m...@broadband.vi>>
*To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Sent: *Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards
that
plugged into MT RB532.
The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the
Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5%
Cambium
450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.

On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:

> +100
>
> On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit
path
>> as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti
>> products or services in my business model.
>>
>> The only way for me to change my business model to include
Ubiquiti
>> would be for them to change their business model.
>>
>> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm
puts you
>> outside of my vendor list.
>>
>> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or
anything other
>> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is
kind of
>> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about
anything
>> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me
>> privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to
problems at
>> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room
under the
>> rug.
>>
>> 2 cents
>>
>> -Sean
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum
mailto:cc...@murcevilo.com>
>> > wrote:
>>
>>     In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't
know,
>> and
>>     given the current environment, when I joined the group I
had my
>> own
>>     company (still do, just not doing much with it currently),
but
>> now
>>     also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for
them nor
>> will
>>     I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see
something
>>     grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of
>> things
>>     separate from this group as I value the relationships here
above
>> any
>>     employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
>>     operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
>>     relationships with them. I hope to take all the past
failures and
>>     criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be
better at
>> that
>>     side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as
that
>> is
>>     what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want
>> this
>>     to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you
want to
>> talk
>>     about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel
free to
>>     reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the
>> enemy
>>     lurker.
>>
>>     Best,
>>
>>     Cameron
>>
>>     On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince
>> mailto:part15...@gmail.com>
>>     > wrote:
>>
>>         

Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Chuck McCown]

PTC fuses are not fast enough to protect Netonix.  It actually has them inside.
That is why I build the POE fuse product.  It does blow fast enough to protect 
the switch.  

From: Mark Radabaugh 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 1:12 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

Chuck, 

We have had really good luck with putting PTC fuses in front of the POE power 
on the Mimosa radios in order to avoid blowing the fuses in the rectifier shelf 
when the gas tubes in the Mimosa short the POE.   I’m thinking maybe you want 
to look at putting some of those on the SS for the power coming from the 
Netonix?Let the gas tubes (or whatever surge suppressor you are using) 
short all the lines together and let the PTC fuse cut the power briefly?   
Might be a little tricky to get the values right but might be able to save the 
POE from blowing.

Or talk Netonix into including them internally so that they survive a POE short 
circuit.

For those of you scratching your head… we routinely power Mimosa B5’s using 
Packetflux DC injectors from the -48V rectifier.  The surge suppression in the 
B5’s will short the power supply during a surge event long enough to blow the 2 
or 5A telecom fuse.   All the equipment lives but we have to go replace the 
fuse - which we don’t want to do since it causes an outage until we get there.  
The PTC fuse inline avoids the fuse blowing.


Mark



  On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:33 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

  Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short 
everything to ground.
  Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted.  

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
  To: AFMUG 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

  Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and surge 
card. 

  What's the Netonix problem?


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM  wrote:

If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done that.
Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem.  

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it 
for sure. 

The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now, 
happily.  The POE and surge card are in the trash.

I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on 
Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM,  wrote:

  You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means 
the POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding the 
situation.  

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

  I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM,  wrote:

Do you have a spare POE to try ?

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After 
several cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced those two 
at the same time. 

Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or 
more sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in the 
office for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  It resets immediately if it is going to reset.  
  Sounds like it took a hit.  

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2018 12:45 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

  How long does it need to be cold for it to be self reset?  The one I 
took down this morning looks perfectly clean and I can't get pins 7/8 through 
it.  At this point I'm thinking the (AC) POE is the cause of all our issues 
(Cambium, so that pair is positive 24v and data).


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Wind & rain can go "up" in hurricanes and other high
  wind/rain conditions. Especially if you're at the top of a hill or
  mountain.
We have that all the time around here, even without hurricanes.


bp



On 9/17/2018 5:03 PM, Matt Hoppes
  wrote:


  
  How does water enter the unit through the Ethernet port?  The
Ethernet port is about the lowest part of the unit and would
require water to flow upwards. 
  
On Sep 17, 2018, at 16:53, Mike Meluskey 
wrote:

  
  

  
  

  Water entering the units, primarily through
the Ethernet ports.
$5 worth of gasket material would have engineered it
correctly.
  On 17 Sep 2018, at 19:43, Mike Hammett
wrote:


  
What kind of
  failures?
  
  

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent
  Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet
  Exchange

The Brothers WISP

  
  

  
  
  From:
"Mike Meluskey" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription
notification

I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR
wireless cards that 
plugged into MT RB532.
The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure
rate in the 
Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon
IP-20 and 5% Cambium 
450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.

On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:

> +100
>
> On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down
the frivolous lawsuit path 
>> as their business model i've decided to
never use any Ubiquiti 
>> products or services in my business model.
>>
>> The only way for me to change my business
model to include Ubiquiti 
>> would be for them to change their business
model.
>>
>> Suing your customers and inflicting our
industry with harm puts you 
>> outside of my vendor list.
>>
>> Also saying "but if you want to talk about
products or anything other 
>> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to
me privately." is kind of 
>> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want
to talk about anything 
>> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to
reach out to me 
>> privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom
and a cause to problems at 
>> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the
elephant in the room under the 
>> rug.
>>
>> 2 cents
>>
>> -Sean
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron
Crum > >
wrote:
>>
>>     In the interest of full disclosure, for
those that don't know, 
>> and
>>     given the current environment, when I
joined the group I had my 
>> own
>>     company (still do, just not doing much
with it currently), but 
>> now
>>     also work for ubnt although I am not
here to shill for them nor 
>> will
>>     I involve myself in discussions about
them unless I see something
>>     

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Mathew Howard]

I imagine that during a hurricane, water basically does flow upwards. I
wonder if that's the reason why UBNT is including that extra gasket
doohickey with the AF-5xHD...

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 7:05 PM Matt Hoppes <
mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote:

> How does water enter the unit through the Ethernet port?  The Ethernet
> port is about the lowest part of the unit and would require water to flow
> upwards.
>
> On Sep 17, 2018, at 16:53, Mike Meluskey  wrote:
>
> Water entering the units, primarily through the Ethernet ports.
> $5 worth of gasket material would have engineered it correctly.
>
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 19:43, Mike Hammett wrote:
>
> What kind of failures?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Mike Meluskey" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that
> plugged into MT RB532.
> The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the
> Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium
> 450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.
>
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:
>
> > +100
> >
> > On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
> >> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path
> >> as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti
> >> products or services in my business model.
> >>
> >> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti
> >> would be for them to change their business model.
> >>
> >> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you
> >> outside of my vendor list.
> >>
> >> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other
> >> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of
> >> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything
> >> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me
> >> privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at
> >> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the
> >> rug.
> >>
> >> 2 cents
> >>
> >> -Sean
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum  >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know,
> >> and
> >> given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my
> >> own
> >> company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but
> >> now
> >> also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor
> >> will
> >> I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
> >> grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of
> >> things
> >> separate from this group as I value the relationships here above
> >> any
> >> employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
> >> operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
> >> relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
> >> criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at
> >> that
> >> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that
> >> is
> >> what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want
> >> this
> >> to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to
> >> talk
> >> about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
> >> reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the
> >> enemy
> >> lurker.
> >>
> >> Best,
> >>
> >> Cameron
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince
> >>  >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at
> >> least.
> >>
> >>
> >> bp
> >> 
> >>
> >> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
> >>> Yes, he is missed.
> >>>
> >>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Harass, welcome.
> >>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
> >>> *From:* Mathew Howard
> >>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
> >>> *To:* AFMUG
> >>> *Subject:* Re: 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Lewis Bergman]

I think there were some high winds. Once hgh winds gets into the structure
all kinds of funny things happen.

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 7:05 PM Matt Hoppes <
mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net> wrote:

> How does water enter the unit through the Ethernet port?  The Ethernet
> port is about the lowest part of the unit and would require water to flow
> upwards.
>
> On Sep 17, 2018, at 16:53, Mike Meluskey  wrote:
>
> Water entering the units, primarily through the Ethernet ports.
> $5 worth of gasket material would have engineered it correctly.
>
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 19:43, Mike Hammett wrote:
>
> What kind of failures?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Mike Meluskey" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that
> plugged into MT RB532.
> The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the
> Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium
> 450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.
>
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:
>
> > +100
> >
> > On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
> >> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path
> >> as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti
> >> products or services in my business model.
> >>
> >> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti
> >> would be for them to change their business model.
> >>
> >> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you
> >> outside of my vendor list.
> >>
> >> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other
> >> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of
> >> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything
> >> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me
> >> privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at
> >> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the
> >> rug.
> >>
> >> 2 cents
> >>
> >> -Sean
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum  >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know,
> >> and
> >> given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my
> >> own
> >> company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but
> >> now
> >> also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor
> >> will
> >> I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
> >> grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of
> >> things
> >> separate from this group as I value the relationships here above
> >> any
> >> employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
> >> operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
> >> relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
> >> criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at
> >> that
> >> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that
> >> is
> >> what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want
> >> this
> >> to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to
> >> talk
> >> about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
> >> reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the
> >> enemy
> >> lurker.
> >>
> >> Best,
> >>
> >> Cameron
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince
> >>  >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at
> >> least.
> >>
> >>
> >> bp
> >> 
> >>
> >> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
> >>> Yes, he is missed.
> >>>
> >>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Harass, welcome.
> >>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
> >>> *From:* Mathew Howard
> >>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
> >>> *To:* AFMUG
> >>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
> >>> Well, it 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Matt Hoppes]

How does water enter the unit through the Ethernet port?  The Ethernet port is 
about the lowest part of the unit and would require water to flow upwards. 

> On Sep 17, 2018, at 16:53, Mike Meluskey  wrote:
> 
> Water entering the units, primarily through the Ethernet ports.
> $5 worth of gasket material would have engineered it correctly.
> 
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 19:43, Mike Hammett wrote:
> 
> What kind of failures?
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange
> 
> The Brothers WISP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: "Mike Meluskey" 
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
> 
> I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that 
> plugged into MT RB532.
> The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the 
> Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium 
> 450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.
> 
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:
> 
> > +100
> >
> > On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
> >> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path 
> >> as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti 
> >> products or services in my business model.
> >>
> >> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti 
> >> would be for them to change their business model.
> >>
> >> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you 
> >> outside of my vendor list.
> >>
> >> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other 
> >> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of 
> >> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything 
> >> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me 
> >> privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at 
> >> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the 
> >> rug.
> >>
> >> 2 cents
> >>
> >> -Sean
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum  >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, 
> >> and
> >> given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my 
> >> own
> >> company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but 
> >> now
> >> also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor 
> >> will
> >> I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
> >> grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of 
> >> things
> >> separate from this group as I value the relationships here above 
> >> any
> >> employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
> >> operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
> >> relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
> >> criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at 
> >> that
> >> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that 
> >> is
> >> what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want 
> >> this
> >> to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to 
> >> talk
> >> about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
> >> reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the 
> >> enemy
> >> lurker.
> >>
> >> Best,
> >>
> >> Cameron
> >>
> >> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince 
> >>  >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at 
> >> least.
> >>
> >>
> >> bp
> >> 
> >>
> >> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
> >>> Yes, he is missed.
> >>>
> >>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Harass, welcome.
> >>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
> >>> *From:* Mathew Howard
> >>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
> >>> *To:* AFMUG
> >>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
> >>> Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, 
> >>> I
> >>> assume... but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email
> >>> address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway.
> >>> I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...   
> >>>   other than give us an opportunity to harass new people.
> >>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are 
> >>> about
> >>> 500 list members but only about 10% post.
> >>> *From:* Mathew Howard
> >>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
> >>> *To:* AFMUG
> >>> *Subject:* 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Mike Meluskey]

Water entering the units, primarily through the Ethernet ports.
$5 worth of gasket material would have engineered it correctly.

On 17 Sep 2018, at 19:43, Mike Hammett wrote:

> What kind of failures?
>
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>
> Midwest Internet Exchange
>
> The Brothers WISP
>
>
>
>
> - Original Message -
>
> From: "Mike Meluskey" 
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that
> plugged into MT RB532.
> The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the
> Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium
> 450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.
>
> On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:
>
>> +100
>>
>> On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path
>>> as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti
>>> products or services in my business model.
>>>
>>> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti
>>> would be for them to change their business model.
>>>
>>> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you
>>> outside of my vendor list.
>>>
>>> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other
>>> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of
>>> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything
>>> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me
>>> privately." The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at
>>> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the
>>> rug.
>>>
>>> 2 cents
>>>
>>> -Sean
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know,
>>> and
>>> given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my
>>> own
>>> company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but
>>> now
>>> also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor
>>> will
>>> I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
>>> grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of
>>> things
>>> separate from this group as I value the relationships here above
>>> any
>>> employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
>>> operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
>>> relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
>>> criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at
>>> that
>>> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that
>>> is
>>> what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want
>>> this
>>> to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to
>>> talk
>>> about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
>>> reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the
>>> enemy
>>> lurker.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Cameron
>>>
>>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince
>>> >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at
>>> least.
>>>
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
 Yes, he is missed.

 On Saturday, September 15, 2018, >>> > wrote:

 Harass, welcome.
 I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
 Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed,
 I
 assume... but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email
 address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway.
 I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...
 other than give us an opportunity to harass new people.
 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

 Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are
 about
 500 list members but only about 10% post.
 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
 I assume most of the subscribers to this list never
 actually post anything. It might be kind of
 interesting to see who's watching us...
 I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like
 it,
 but if they aren't going to every post anything
 anyway, do we care?
 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron
  wrote:

 I think enough information is shared feely in
 this
 group to warrant folks being identified as
 recipients of the information. If I were signing
 up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to
 be
 identified as being a part of the list given the
 value of the discussions 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Matt Hoppes]

What failed in the Hurricane?  Water incursion?

On 9/17/18 4:34 PM, Mike Meluskey wrote:
I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that 
plugged into MT RB532.
The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the Hurricanes 
(compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium 450m) have 
put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.


On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:


+100

On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path 
as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti 
products or services in my business model.


The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti 
would be for them to change their business model.


Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you 
outside of my vendor list.


Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other 
than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of 
like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything 
else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me 
privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at 
Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the 
rug.


2 cents

-Sean




On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum > wrote:


    In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and
    given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own
    company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now
    also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will
    I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
    grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of things
    separate from this group as I value the relationships here above any
    employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
    operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
    relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
    criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
    side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is
    what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this
    to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to talk
    about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
    reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the enemy
    lurker.

    Best,

    Cameron

    On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:

    Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.


    bp
    

    On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:

    Yes, he is missed.

    On Saturday, September 15, 2018, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:

    Harass, welcome.
    I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
    *From:* Mathew Howard
    *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
    *To:* AFMUG
    *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
    Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I
    assume... but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email
    address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway.
    I'm not sure what good it would really do us though... 
  other than give us an opportunity to harass new people.

    On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

    Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are about
    500 list members but only about 10% post.
    *From:* Mathew Howard
    *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
    *To:* AFMUG
    *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
    I assume most of the subscribers to this list never
    actually post anything. It might be kind of
    interesting to see who's watching us...
    I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it,
    but if they aren't going to every post anything
    anyway, do we care?
    On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron
     wrote:

    I think enough information is shared feely in this
    group to warrant folks being identified as
    recipients of the information. If I were signing
    up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be
    identified as being a part of the list given the
    value of the discussions on the list.

    Regards,

    David Coudron

    *From:*AF  *On Behalf Of
    *Adam Moffett
    *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
    *To:* af@af.afmug.com
    *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Mike Hammett]

What kind of failures? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Mike Meluskey"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:34:13 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 

I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that 
plugged into MT RB532. 
The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the 
Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium 
450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list. 

On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote: 

> +100 
> 
> On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote: 
>> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path 
>> as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti 
>> products or services in my business model. 
>> 
>> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti 
>> would be for them to change their business model. 
>> 
>> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you 
>> outside of my vendor list. 
>> 
>> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other 
>> than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of 
>> like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything 
>> else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me 
>> privately." The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at 
>> Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the 
>> rug. 
>> 
>> 2 cents 
>> 
>> -Sean 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum > > wrote: 
>> 
>> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, 
>> and 
>> given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my 
>> own 
>> company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but 
>> now 
>> also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor 
>> will 
>> I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something 
>> grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of 
>> things 
>> separate from this group as I value the relationships here above 
>> any 
>> employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with 
>> operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain 
>> relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and 
>> criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at 
>> that 
>> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that 
>> is 
>> what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want 
>> this 
>> to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to 
>> talk 
>> about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to 
>> reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the 
>> enemy 
>> lurker. 
>> 
>> Best, 
>> 
>> Cameron 
>> 
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince 
>> > > wrote: 
>> 
>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at 
>> least. 
>> 
>> 
>> bp 
>>  
>> 
>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote: 
>>> Yes, he is missed. 
>>> 
>>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018, >> > wrote: 
>>> 
>>> Harass, welcome. 
>>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up. 
>>> *From:* Mathew Howard 
>>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM 
>>> *To:* AFMUG 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 
>>> Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, 
>>> I 
>>> assume... but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email 
>>> address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway. 
>>> I'm not sure what good it would really do us though... 
>>> other than give us an opportunity to harass new people. 
>>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote: 
>>> 
>>> Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are 
>>> about 
>>> 500 list members but only about 10% post. 
>>> *From:* Mathew Howard 
>>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM 
>>> *To:* AFMUG 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 
>>> I assume most of the subscribers to this list never 
>>> actually post anything. It might be kind of 
>>> interesting to see who's watching us... 
>>> I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like 
>>> it, 
>>> but if they aren't going to every post anything 
>>> anyway, do we care? 
>>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron 
>>>  wrote: 
>>> 
>>> I think enough information is shared feely in 
>>> this 
>>> group to warrant folks being identified as 
>>> recipients of the information. If I were signing 
>>> up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to 
>>> be 
>>> identified as being a part of the list given the 
>>> value of the discussions on the list. 
>>> 
>>> Regards, 
>>> 
>>> David Coudron 
>>> 
>>> *From:*AF  *On Behalf 
>>> Of 
>>> *Adam Moffett 
>>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM 
>>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com 
>>> *Subject:* Re: 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Mike Meluskey]

I was one of Ubiquiti’s first customers, their SR wireless cards that 
plugged into MT RB532.
The lawsuit combined with the AF24’s 95% failure rate in the 
Hurricanes (compared to the 0% failure of Ceragon IP-20 and 5% Cambium 
450m) have put Ubiquiti on our former vendor list.


On 17 Sep 2018, at 18:14, Robert Andrews wrote:


+100

On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path 
as their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti 
products or services in my business model.


The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti 
would be for them to change their business model.


Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you 
outside of my vendor list.


Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other 
than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of 
like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything 
else besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me 
privately."  The lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at 
Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in the room under the 
rug.


2 cents

-Sean




On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum > wrote:


In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, 
and
given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my 
own
company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but 
now
also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor 
will

I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of 
things
separate from this group as I value the relationships here above 
any

employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at 
that
side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that 
is
what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want 
this
to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to 
talk

about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the 
enemy

lurker.

Best,

Cameron

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince 

> wrote:

Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at 
least.



bp


On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:

Yes, he is missed.

On Saturday, September 15, 2018, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:

Harass, welcome.
I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
*From:* Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
*To:* AFMUG
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, 
I

assume... but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email
address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway.
I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...   
  other than give us an opportunity to harass new people.

On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are 
about

500 list members but only about 10% post.
*From:* Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
*To:* AFMUG
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
I assume most of the subscribers to this list never
actually post anything. It might be kind of
interesting to see who's watching us...
I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like 
it,

but if they aren't going to every post anything
anyway, do we care?
On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron
 wrote:

I think enough information is shared feely in 
this

group to warrant folks being identified as
recipients of the information. If I were signing
up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to 
be

identified as being a part of the list given the
value of the discussions on the list.

Regards,

David Coudron

*From:*AF  *On Behalf 
Of

*Adam Moffett
*Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription 
notification


A 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Seth Mattinen]

On 9/17/18 3:12 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:


anyway, Cameron brought it up and I'm not going to let this go because 
it really chaps my hide.  i'll shut up about it when Ubiquiti decides to 
actually do something good for our industry instead of trying to rip it 
apart.





I don't think that suing WISPs is a step in the right direction to 
improve relations with other WISPs. To me, UBNT comes off like a company 
chasing the next short term earnings report like an addict trying to 
score another hit.


~Seth

--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Robert Andrews]

+100

On 09/17/2018 02:36 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path as 
their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti products or 
services in my business model.


The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti 
would be for them to change their business model.


Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you 
outside of my vendor list.


Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other 
than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of 
like Ford in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything else 
besides exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me privately."  The 
lawsuit is both a symptom and a cause to problems at Ubiquiti and you 
can't just brush the elephant in the room under the rug.


2 cents

-Sean




On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum > wrote:


In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and
given the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own
company (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now
also work for ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will
I involve myself in discussions about them unless I see something
grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that side of things
separate from this group as I value the relationships here above any
employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with
operators and try to find a better way to create and maintain
relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures and
criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is
what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this
to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to talk
about products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to
reach out to me privately. I just don't want to seem like the enemy
lurker.

Best,

Cameron

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.


bp


On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:

Yes, he is missed.

On Saturday, September 15, 2018, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:

Harass, welcome.
I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
*From:* Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
*To:* AFMUG
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I
assume... but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email
address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway.
I'm not sure what good it would really do us though... 
other than give us an opportunity to harass new people.

On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are about
500 list members but only about 10% post.
*From:* Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
*To:* AFMUG
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
I assume most of the subscribers to this list never
actually post anything. It might be kind of
interesting to see who's watching us...
I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it,
but if they aren't going to every post anything
anyway, do we care?
On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron
 wrote:

I think enough information is shared feely in this
group to warrant folks being identified as
recipients of the information. If I were signing
up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be
identified as being a part of the list given the
value of the discussions on the list.

Regards,

David Coudron

*From:*AF  *On Behalf Of
*Adam Moffett
*Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk
and observeor a government rep.

Nobody is entitled to//privacy in a public forum,
but I'm sure some would prefer it.

-Adam

On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

xx...@.xxx has been 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Sean Heskett]

yeah i realize that Cameron realistically can't talk about the lawsuit
while it's on-going - he could, but his bosses and the attorneys probably
wouldn't like it...it's a civil case, not criminal case so there's actually
no law barring a discussion, it would just be un-wise from a legal
standpoint.

anyway, Cameron brought it up and I'm not going to let this go because it
really chaps my hide.  i'll shut up about it when Ubiquiti decides to
actually do something good for our industry instead of trying to rip it
apart.

-sean



On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 4:02 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> You do realize that people in lawsuits can't generally talk about them
> while in progress? Don't you?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Sean Heskett" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Monday, September 17, 2018 4:36:36 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path as
> their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti products or
> services in my business model.
>
> The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti would
> be for them to change their business model.
>
> Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you
> outside of my vendor list.
>
> Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other than
> the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of like Ford
> in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything else besides
> exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me privately."  The lawsuit is
> both a symptom and a cause to problems at Ubiquiti and you can't just brush
> the elephant in the room under the rug.
>
> 2 cents
>
> -Sean
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum  wrote:
>
>> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given
>> the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company
>> (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for
>> ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in
>> discussions about them unless I see something grossly in error. I would
>> actually rather keep that side of things separate from this group as I
>> value the relationships here above any employment scenario. My job at ubnt
>> is actually to engage with operators and try to find a better way to create
>> and maintain relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures
>> and criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
>> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is what I
>> can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this to turn into a
>> discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about products or
>> anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately. I
>> just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Cameron
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.
>>>
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, he is missed.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:
>>>
 Harass, welcome.
 I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.

 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

 Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume...
 but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty
 anonymous anyway.

 I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give
 us an opportunity to harass new people.

 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

> Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list
> members but only about 10% post.
>
> *From:* Mathew Howard
> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
> *To:* AFMUG
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post
> anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...
>
> I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they
> aren't going 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Mike Hammett]

If you want to talk about where Ubiquiti has gone wrong, clear your calendar. 
;-) 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Cameron Crum"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 10:27:02 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 


In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given the 
current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company (still do, 
just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for ubnt although I 
am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in discussions about 
them unless I see something grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that 
side of things separate from this group as I value the relationships here above 
any employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with operators 
and try to find a better way to create and maintain relationships with them. I 
hope to take all the past failures and criticisms and present them with a plan 
on how to be better at that side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad 
stuff as that is what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want 
this to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about 
products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me 
privately. I just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker. 


Best, 


Cameron 


On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince < part15...@gmail.com > wrote: 




Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least. 

bp
 


On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote: 


Yes, he is missed. 

On Saturday, September 15, 2018, < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






Harass, welcome. 
I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up. 




From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM 
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 


Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume... but yeah, 
if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway. 

I'm not sure what good it would really do us though... other than give us an 
opportunity to harass new people. 


On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are about 500 list members but only 
about 10% post. 




From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM 
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 



I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post anything. It 
might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us... 

I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they aren't going 
to every post anything anyway, do we care? 



On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron < david.coud...@advantenon.com > 
wrote: 





I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant folks being 
identified as recipients of the information. If I were signing up, I don’t 
think it would be unreasonable to be identified as being a part of the list 
given the value of the discussions on the list. 

Regards, 

David Coudron 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Adam Moffett 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM 
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 

A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a government 
rep. 

Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some would prefer 
it. 

-Adam 



On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: 


xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF. 

I am thinking of posting this when new people join. 

Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out 
themselves? 





-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 




-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 
-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 




-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 








-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 





-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Mike Hammett]

You do realize that people in lawsuits can't generally talk about them while in 
progress? Don't you? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Sean Heskett"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 4:36:36 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 




Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path as their 
business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti products or services in 
my business model. 


The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti would be 
for them to change their business model. 


Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you outside of 
my vendor list. 


Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other than the 
lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of like Ford in the 
1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything else besides exploding 
Pintos, feel free to reach out to me privately." The lawsuit is both a symptom 
and a cause to problems at Ubiquiti and you can't just brush the elephant in 
the room under the rug. 


2 cents 


-Sean 








On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum < cc...@murcevilo.com > wrote: 



In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given the 
current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company (still do, 
just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for ubnt although I 
am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in discussions about 
them unless I see something grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that 
side of things separate from this group as I value the relationships here above 
any employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with operators 
and try to find a better way to create and maintain relationships with them. I 
hope to take all the past failures and criticisms and present them with a plan 
on how to be better at that side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad 
stuff as that is what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want 
this to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about 
products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me 
privately. I just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker. 


Best, 


Cameron 


On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince < part15...@gmail.com > wrote: 




Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least. 

bp
 


On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote: 


Yes, he is missed. 

On Saturday, September 15, 2018, < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






Harass, welcome. 
I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up. 




From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM 
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 


Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume... but yeah, 
if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty anonymous anyway. 

I'm not sure what good it would really do us though... other than give us an 
opportunity to harass new people. 


On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 






Probably best to not out the lurkers. There are about 500 list members but only 
about 10% post. 




From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM 
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 



I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post anything. It 
might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us... 

I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they aren't going 
to every post anything anyway, do we care? 



On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron < david.coud...@advantenon.com > 
wrote: 





I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant folks being 
identified as recipients of the information. If I were signing up, I don’t 
think it would be unreasonable to be identified as being a part of the list 
given the value of the discussions on the list. 

Regards, 

David Coudron 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Adam Moffett 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM 
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification 

A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a government 
rep. 

Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some would prefer 
it. 

-Adam 



On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: 


xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF. 

I am thinking of posting this when new people join. 

Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out 
themselves? 





-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 




-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 
-- 
AF mailing list 

Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Sean Heskett]

Being as Ubiquiti has decided to go down the frivolous lawsuit path as
their business model i've decided to never use any Ubiquiti products or
services in my business model.

The only way for me to change my business model to include Ubiquiti would
be for them to change their business model.

Suing your customers and inflicting our industry with harm puts you outside
of my vendor list.

Also saying "but if you want to talk about products or anything other than
the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately." is kind of like Ford
in the 1970's saying "if you want to talk about anything else besides
exploding Pintos, feel free to reach out to me privately."  The lawsuit is
both a symptom and a cause to problems at Ubiquiti and you can't just brush
the elephant in the room under the rug.

2 cents

-Sean




On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 9:28 AM Cameron Crum  wrote:

> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given
> the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company
> (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for
> ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in
> discussions about them unless I see something grossly in error. I would
> actually rather keep that side of things separate from this group as I
> value the relationships here above any employment scenario. My job at ubnt
> is actually to engage with operators and try to find a better way to create
> and maintain relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures
> and criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is what I
> can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this to turn into a
> discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about products or
> anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately. I
> just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker.
>
> Best,
>
> Cameron
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince  wrote:
>
>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.
>>
>>
>> bp
>> 
>>
>>
>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>>
>> Yes, he is missed.
>>
>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:
>>
>>> Harass, welcome.
>>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
>>>
>>> *From:* Mathew Howard
>>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
>>> *To:* AFMUG
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>>
>>> Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume... but
>>> yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty anonymous
>>> anyway.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give
>>> us an opportunity to harass new people.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:
>>>
 Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list members
 but only about 10% post.

 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

 I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post
 anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...

 I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they
 aren't going to every post anything anyway, do we care?

 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron <
 david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:

> I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant
> folks being identified as recipients of the information.   If I were
> signing up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be identified as
> being a part of the list given the value of the discussions on the list.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
>
>
> A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a
> government rep.
>
> Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some
> would prefer it.
>
> -Adam
>
> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF.
>
> I am thinking of posting this when new people join.
>
> Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out
> themselves?
>
>
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
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>>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Mark Radabaugh]

So the Netonix still blows out the POE even with the PTC fuses?   Have not used 
one so I don’t have any experience with it.

Mark

> On Sep 17, 2018, at 3:30 PM, Forrest Christian (List Account) 
>  wrote:
> 
> The netonix already has ptc fuses
> 
> There is a reason why I switched to electronic overcurrent protection years 
> ago.
> 
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018, 2:14 PM Mark Radabaugh  > wrote:
> Chuck,
> 
> We have had really good luck with putting PTC fuses in front of the POE power 
> on the Mimosa radios in order to avoid blowing the fuses in the rectifier 
> shelf when the gas tubes in the Mimosa short the POE.   I’m thinking maybe 
> you want to look at putting some of those on the SS for the power coming from 
> the Netonix?Let the gas tubes (or whatever surge suppressor you are 
> using) short all the lines together and let the PTC fuse cut the power 
> briefly?   Might be a little tricky to get the values right but might be able 
> to save the POE from blowing.
> 
> Or talk Netonix into including them internally so that they survive a POE 
> short circuit.
> 
> For those of you scratching your head… we routinely power Mimosa B5’s using 
> Packetflux DC injectors from the -48V rectifier.  The surge suppression in 
> the B5’s will short the power supply during a surge event long enough to blow 
> the 2 or 5A telecom fuse.   All the equipment lives but we have to go replace 
> the fuse - which we don’t want to do since it causes an outage until we get 
> there.  The PTC fuse inline avoids the fuse blowing.
> 
> 
> Mark
> 
>> On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:33 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com  wrote:
>> 
>> Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short 
>> everything to ground.
>> Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted. 
>>  
>> From: Josh Luthman <>
>> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
>> To: AFMUG <>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>  
>> Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and surge 
>> card.
>>  
>> What's the Netonix problem?
>> 
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>  
>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM > wrote:
>>> If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done that.
>>> Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem. 
>>>  
>>> From: Josh Luthman <>
>>> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
>>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>>  
>>> I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it 
>>> for sure.
>>>  
>>> The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now, 
>>> happily.  The POE and surge card are in the trash.
>>>  
>>> I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on 
>>> Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?
>>>  
>>>  
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>  
>>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM, > wrote:
 You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means the 
 POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding the 
 situation. 
  
 From: Josh Luthman <>
 Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
 To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
  
 I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?
  
  
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373
  
 On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM, > wrote:
> Do you have a spare POE to try ?
>  
> From: Josh Luthman <>
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>  
> Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After 
> several cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced 
> those two at the same time.
> 
> Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or more 
> sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in the 
> office for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.
>  
>  
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>  
> On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown > wrote:
>> It resets immediately if it is going to reset. 
>> Sounds like it took a hit. 
>>  
>> From: Josh Luthman <>
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2018 12:45 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>  
>> How long does it need to be cold for it to be 

Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Forrest Christian (List Account)]

The netonix already has ptc fuses

There is a reason why I switched to electronic overcurrent protection years
ago.

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018, 2:14 PM Mark Radabaugh  wrote:

> Chuck,
>
> We have had really good luck with putting PTC fuses in front of the POE
> power on the Mimosa radios in order to avoid blowing the fuses in the
> rectifier shelf when the gas tubes in the Mimosa short the POE.   I’m
> thinking maybe you want to look at putting some of those on the SS for the
> power coming from the Netonix?Let the gas tubes (or whatever surge
> suppressor you are using) short all the lines together and let the PTC fuse
> cut the power briefly?   Might be a little tricky to get the values right
> but might be able to save the POE from blowing.
>
> Or talk Netonix into including them internally so that they survive a POE
> short circuit.
>
> For those of you scratching your head… we routinely power Mimosa B5’s
> using Packetflux DC injectors from the -48V rectifier.  The surge
> suppression in the B5’s will short the power supply during a surge event
> long enough to blow the 2 or 5A telecom fuse.   All the equipment lives but
> we have to go replace the fuse - which we don’t want to do since it causes
> an outage until we get there.  The PTC fuse inline avoids the fuse blowing.
>
>
> Mark
>
> On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:33 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short
> everything to ground.
> Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
> *To:* AFMUG
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
> Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and
> surge card.
>
> What's the Netonix problem?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM  wrote:
>
>> If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done
>> that.
>> Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem.
>>
>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>
>> I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it
>> for sure.
>>
>> The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now,
>> happily.  The POE and surge card are in the trash.
>>
>> I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on
>> Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM,  wrote:
>>
>>> You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means
>>> the POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding
>>> the situation.
>>>
>>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>>
>>> I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM,  wrote:
>>>
 Do you have a spare POE to try ?

 *From:* Josh Luthman
 *Sent:* Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

 Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After
 several cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced those
 two at the same time.

 Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or
 more sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in
 the office for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

> It resets immediately if it is going to reset.
> Sounds like it took a hit.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 11, 2018 12:45 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
> How long does it need to be cold for it to be self reset?  The one I
> took down this morning looks perfectly clean and I can't get pins 7/8
> through it.  At this point I'm thinking the (AC) POE is the cause of all
> our issues (Cambium, so that pair is positive 24v and data).
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 10:47 AM, Chuck 

Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Mark Radabaugh]

Chuck,

We have had really good luck with putting PTC fuses in front of the POE power 
on the Mimosa radios in order to avoid blowing the fuses in the rectifier shelf 
when the gas tubes in the Mimosa short the POE.   I’m thinking maybe you want 
to look at putting some of those on the SS for the power coming from the 
Netonix?Let the gas tubes (or whatever surge suppressor you are using) 
short all the lines together and let the PTC fuse cut the power briefly?   
Might be a little tricky to get the values right but might be able to save the 
POE from blowing.

Or talk Netonix into including them internally so that they survive a POE short 
circuit.

For those of you scratching your head… we routinely power Mimosa B5’s using 
Packetflux DC injectors from the -48V rectifier.  The surge suppression in the 
B5’s will short the power supply during a surge event long enough to blow the 2 
or 5A telecom fuse.   All the equipment lives but we have to go replace the 
fuse - which we don’t want to do since it causes an outage until we get there.  
The PTC fuse inline avoids the fuse blowing.


Mark

> On Sep 17, 2018, at 10:33 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> 
> Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short 
> everything to ground.
> Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted. 
>  
> From: Josh Luthman <>
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
> To: AFMUG <>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>  
> Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and surge 
> card.
>  
> What's the Netonix problem?
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>  
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM > wrote:
>> If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done that.
>> Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem. 
>>  
>> From: Josh Luthman <>
>> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>  
>> I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it for 
>> sure.
>>  
>> The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now, happily. 
>>  The POE and surge card are in the trash.
>>  
>> I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on 
>> Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?
>>  
>>  
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>  
>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM, > wrote:
>>> You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means the 
>>> POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding the 
>>> situation. 
>>>  
>>> From: Josh Luthman <>
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
>>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>>  
>>> I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?
>>>  
>>>  
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>  
>>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM, > wrote:
 Do you have a spare POE to try ?
  
 From: Josh Luthman <>
 Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
 To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
  
 Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After several 
 cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced those two at 
 the same time.
 
 Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or more 
 sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in the 
 office for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.
  
  
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373
  
 On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown > wrote:
> It resets immediately if it is going to reset. 
> Sounds like it took a hit. 
>  
> From: Josh Luthman <>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2018 12:45 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>  
> How long does it need to be cold for it to be self reset?  The one I took 
> down this morning looks perfectly clean and I can't get pins 7/8 through 
> it.  At this point I'm thinking the (AC) POE is the cause of all our 
> issues (Cambium, so that pair is positive 24v and data).
>  
>  
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>  
> On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 10:47 AM, Chuck McCown > wrote:
>> Sure, you can also wash them with 90% isopropyl alcohol.  That will 
>> remove any water.  Need to make sure there is no 

Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[Mark Radabaugh]

Assuming they are still in one piece - yes.   If all the magic smoke comes out 
then not so much.

Mark

> On Sep 17, 2018, at 1:06 PM, Steve Jones  wrote:
> 
> Do the gastube ones reset like the others?
> 
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:00 AM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
> wrote:
> Lots of solutions:
>  
> https://www.mccowntech.com/product/cambium-600ss-surge-protector-gige-upgrade-pcb/
>  
> 
>  
> From: Sam Lambie <>
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 8:44 AM
> To: af@af.afmug.com <>
> Subject: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS
>  
> Yo guys,
> The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using 
> anything else that is cheaper and effective?
> Thanks
>  
>  
> -- 
> -- 
> Sam Lambie
> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
> 575-758-7598 Office
> www.Taosnet.com 
> 
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com 
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 
> 
> 
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[chuck]

They react faster, so in theory they provide better protection.  I would use 
hybrid everywhere that is easily accessible and not connected to Cambium 
equipment.  
Gas everywhere else.  

From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 12:00 PM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

What would the main reasons be for using the hybrid solid state of the new 
gastube ones?


On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 12:49 PM  wrote:

  Yes, better than the hybrid solid state.  

  From: Steve Jones 
  Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 11:06 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

  Do the gastube ones reset like the others?

  On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:00 AM  wrote:

Lots of solutions:


https://www.mccowntech.com/product/cambium-600ss-surge-protector-gige-upgrade-pcb/

From: Sam Lambie 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 8:44 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

Yo guys, 
The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using 
anything else that is cheaper and effective?
Thanks


-- 

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Taosnet Wireless Tech.
575-758-7598 Office
www.Taosnet.com



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Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[Mathew Howard]

What would the main reasons be for using the hybrid solid state of the new
gastube ones?

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 12:49 PM  wrote:

> Yes, better than the hybrid solid state.
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 11:06 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS
>
> Do the gastube ones reset like the others?
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:00 AM  wrote:
>
>> Lots of solutions:
>>
>>
>> https://www.mccowntech.com/product/cambium-600ss-surge-protector-gige-upgrade-pcb/
>>
>> *From:* Sam Lambie
>> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 8:44 AM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS
>>
>> Yo guys,
>> The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using
>> anything else that is cheaper and effective?
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> *Sam Lambie*
>> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
>> 575-758-7598 Office
>> www.Taosnet.com 
>>
>> --
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> --
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>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] Check out our new addition

[Dave]

Yep, Forgot to add those

yeah this area is definitely near the foothills of the ozarks.



On 09/17/2018 09:36 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Nice looking mounts.
Rolling hills with trees, didn’t anyone tell you that wisps are 
impractical in areas like this.

I think you need some ice shields thought.
*From:* Dave
*Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 7:02 AM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Check out our new addition
this Link should work

https://youtu.be/sQx75I33oow


On 09/17/2018 07:59 AM, Dave wrote:

Chuck may like some of the stuff we used :)

https://youtu.be/sQx75I33oow 


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[AFMUG] looking for service at a location

[Josh Heide]

Looking to see if someone can provide internet service at a construction
site in San Carlos, Ca 94070. 

 

Thanks,

 

 

 

 





Josh Heide


Wireless Network Manager 


Velociter Wireless, Inc. 


209-838-1221 x108



1525 2nd st, Escalon Ca 95320



  Velociter.net |   
j...@velociter.net 



 

 

 

 

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Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[chuck]

Yes, better than the hybrid solid state.  

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 11:06 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

Do the gastube ones reset like the others?

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:00 AM  wrote:

  Lots of solutions:

  
https://www.mccowntech.com/product/cambium-600ss-surge-protector-gige-upgrade-pcb/

  From: Sam Lambie 
  Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 8:44 AM
  To: af@af.afmug.com 
  Subject: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

  Yo guys, 
  The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using 
anything else that is cheaper and effective?
  Thanks


  -- 

  -- 
  Sam Lambie
  Taosnet Wireless Tech.
  575-758-7598 Office
  www.Taosnet.com


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Re: [AFMUG] Wire pulling lube

[Seth Mattinen]

On 9/17/18 10:15 AM, Chuck Hogg wrote:

This is the best stuff...IMO

https://www.polywater.com/product-category/polywater-lubricants-selection/




The reviews on this one are pretty good:

https://www.amazon.com/Passion-Lubes-Natural-Water-Based-Lubricant/dp/B005MR3IVO

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Re: [AFMUG] Wire pulling lube

[Chuck Hogg]

This is the best stuff...IMO

https://www.polywater.com/product-category/polywater-lubricants-selection/

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 8:56 AM, Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> I tried a vacuum myself here and there.  It doesn't solve this problem IME.
>
> Lube just always makes it easier.  I used the Ideal stuff on 2" and 6
> months later I didn't see anything weird.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Sun, Sep 16, 2018, 11:59 PM Trey Scarborough  wrote:
>
>> I would second the try blowing and vacuum a small pull string then pull
>> through some mule tape. The problem with the rod is it tends to kink after
>> a long distance and can get tangled in the current cable. A pull string
>> attached to a plastic bag tends to ride on top. Also give the existing
>> cable a little tug from each end make sure it isn't slacked up in the
>> middle from being pushed with the rod.
>>
>> On 9/16/2018 8:37 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>>
>> Polywater was the best we ever found. I also would try that and blowing
>> or vacuuming instead of a rod.
>>
>> On Sun, Sep 16, 2018, 8:32 PM Tim Withrow via AF  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> You should be able to source pulling lube from an electrical supplier.
>>> 20+ bucks a gallon gets expensive fast with the ideal lube,if a small job
>>> it may be all you need, but this seems not the case.
>>> --
>>> On Sunday, September 16, 2018 Jason McKemie  wrote:
>>> I have about 350' of 2" conduit that already has a .75" diameter cable
>>> installed, to which I need to add a flat drop cable. I've been trying to
>>> get a fiberglass pull rod to go through, but am getting hung up around 230'
>>> going from either end, probably due to friction with the other cable. I'm
>>> considering using something like Ideal cable lube to get the extra
>>> distance, does this stuff thicken up and turn to glue after a while?
>>> Anything else I should be trying?
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Trey Scarborough
>> VP Engineering
>> 3DS Communications LLC
>> p:9729741539
>>
>> --
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>>
>
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>
>


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Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Steve Jones]

[image: dont-forget-snitches-get-stitches-9365935.png]

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 11:42 AM Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> That's a weird way to spell spy
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 12:22 PM,  wrote:
>
>> We hereby accept your registration as a foreign agent.
>>
>> *From:* Cameron Crum
>> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 9:27 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>
>> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given
>> the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company
>> (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for
>> ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in
>> discussions about them unless I see something grossly in error. I would
>> actually rather keep that side of things separate from this group as I
>> value the relationships here above any employment scenario. My job at ubnt
>> is actually to engage with operators and try to find a better way to create
>> and maintain relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures
>> and criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
>> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is what I
>> can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this to turn into a
>> discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about products or
>> anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately. I
>> just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Cameron
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> bp
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, he is missed.
>>>
>>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:
>>>
 Harass, welcome.
 I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.

 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

 Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume...
 but yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty
 anonymous anyway.

 I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give
 us an opportunity to harass new people.

 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

> Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list
> members but only about 10% post.
>
> *From:* Mathew Howard
> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
> *To:* AFMUG
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post
> anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...
>
> I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they
> aren't going to every post anything anyway, do we care?
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron <
> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>
>> I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant
>> folks being identified as recipients of the information.   If I were
>> signing up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be identified as
>> being a part of the list given the value of the discussions on the list.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> David Coudron
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
>> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>
>>
>>
>> A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a
>> government rep.
>>
>> Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some
>> would prefer it.
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>
>> xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF.
>>
>> I am thinking of posting this when new people join.
>>
>> Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out
>> themselves?
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
 --
 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[Steve Jones]

Do the gastube ones reset like the others?

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:00 AM  wrote:

> Lots of solutions:
>
>
> https://www.mccowntech.com/product/cambium-600ss-surge-protector-gige-upgrade-pcb/
>
> *From:* Sam Lambie
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 8:44 AM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS
>
> Yo guys,
> The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using
> anything else that is cheaper and effective?
> Thanks
>
>
> --
> --
> *Sam Lambie*
> Taosnet Wireless Tech.
> 575-758-7598 Office
> www.Taosnet.com 
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Massachusettes Gas situation

[Seth Mattinen]

On 9/14/18 10:27 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
Oh I dunno, I'd bet whoever insures a gas company has the common sense 
to think about gas explosions.


I would expect the insurer to increase their rate after a claim like 
this though. And surely the gas company won't just eat the rate 
increase, it'll get passed along to the people whose houses they exploded.


I'm sure lawsuits are coming from the people who had their houses 
destroyed, or their insurers as claims are processed. It'll be 
interesting what the investigation turns up. Natural gas is usually seen 
as reliable to the point where people trust generators on a gas pipe 
over diesel. This has the disaster recovery voice inside of me wondering 
if I saved all those propane conversion bits for the gas appliances in 
my house and what I'd need to to hook up a propane tank in place of the 
gas meter.


~Seth

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Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Josh Luthman]

That's a weird way to spell spy


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 12:22 PM,  wrote:

> We hereby accept your registration as a foreign agent.
>
> *From:* Cameron Crum
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 9:27 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
> In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given
> the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company
> (still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for
> ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in
> discussions about them unless I see something grossly in error. I would
> actually rather keep that side of things separate from this group as I
> value the relationships here above any employment scenario. My job at ubnt
> is actually to engage with operators and try to find a better way to create
> and maintain relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures
> and criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
> side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is what I
> can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this to turn into a
> discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about products or
> anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately. I
> just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker.
>
> Best,
>
> Cameron
>
> On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince  wrote:
>
>> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.
>>
>>
>>
>> bp
>> 
>>
>>
>> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>>
>> Yes, he is missed.
>>
>> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:
>>
>>> Harass, welcome.
>>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
>>>
>>> *From:* Mathew Howard
>>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
>>> *To:* AFMUG
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>>
>>> Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume... but
>>> yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty anonymous
>>> anyway.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give
>>> us an opportunity to harass new people.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:
>>>
 Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list members
 but only about 10% post.

 *From:* Mathew Howard
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
 *To:* AFMUG
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

 I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post
 anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...

 I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they
 aren't going to every post anything anyway, do we care?

 On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron <
 david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:

> I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant
> folks being identified as recipients of the information.   If I were
> signing up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be identified as
> being a part of the list given the value of the discussions on the list.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
> *To:* af@af.afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>
>
>
> A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a
> government rep.
>
> Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some
> would prefer it.
>
> -Adam
>
> On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF.
>
> I am thinking of posting this when new people join.
>
> Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out
> themselves?
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
 --
 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>> --
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>>
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[chuck]

We hereby accept your registration as a foreign agent. 

From: Cameron Crum 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 9:27 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given the 
current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company (still do, 
just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for ubnt although I 
am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in discussions about 
them unless I see something grossly in error. I would actually rather keep that 
side of things separate from this group as I value the relationships here above 
any employment scenario. My job at ubnt is actually to engage with operators 
and try to find a better way to create and maintain relationships with them. I 
hope to take all the past failures and criticisms and present them with a plan 
on how to be better at that side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad 
stuff as that is what I can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want 
this to turn into a discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about 
products or anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me 
privately. I just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker. 

Best, 

Cameron

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince  wrote:

  Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.



bp


On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:

Yes, he is missed.

On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:

  Harass, welcome.
  I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.  

  From: Mathew Howard 
  Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
  To: AFMUG 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

  Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume... but 
yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty anonymous 
anyway. 

  I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give 
us an opportunity to harass new people.

  On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:

Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list members 
but only about 10% post.  

From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post 
anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...

I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they 
aren't going to every post anything anyway, do we care?


On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron 
 wrote:

  I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant 
folks being identified as recipients of the information.   If I were signing 
up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be identified as being a part of 
the list given the value of the discussions on the list.



  Regards,



  David Coudron

  From: AF  On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
  Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification



  A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a 
government rep.

  Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some 
would prefer it.

  -Adam



  On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF. 

I am thinking of posting this when new people join. 

Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they 
out themselves? 






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Re: [AFMUG] Heeees Baaaaaack

[Colin Stanners]

That's good, we can't have only Chuck telling the "in my day you could spit
on the twisted pairs, and know which modulation the T1 was running at by
the sound of the whistle" kind of stories.

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:18 AM  wrote:

>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: mailman-boun...@af.afmug.com
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 9:16 AM
> To: af-ow...@af.afmug.com
> Subject: AF subscription notification
>
> af...@kwisp.com has been successfully subscribed to AF.
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[Josh Luthman]

Oh.  That's rough.

As far as my problem, it sure looks like the POE is the source of our
issues one way or the other.  A week of both APs working with different
POEs is a lot better than ~12 hours of blowing surge cards.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:33 AM,  wrote:

> Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short
> everything to ground.
> Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
> *To:* AFMUG
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
> Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and
> surge card.
>
> What's the Netonix problem?
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM  wrote:
>
>> If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done
>> that.
>> Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem.
>>
>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>
>> I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it
>> for sure.
>>
>> The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now,
>> happily.  The POE and surge card are in the trash.
>>
>> I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on
>> Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM,  wrote:
>>
>>> You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means
>>> the POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding
>>> the situation.
>>>
>>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>>
>>> I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM,  wrote:
>>>
 Do you have a spare POE to try ?

 *From:* Josh Luthman
 *Sent:* Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

 Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After
 several cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced those
 two at the same time.

 Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or
 more sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in
 the office for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

> It resets immediately if it is going to reset.
> Sounds like it took a hit.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 11, 2018 12:45 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>
> How long does it need to be cold for it to be self reset?  The one I
> took down this morning looks perfectly clean and I can't get pins 7/8
> through it.  At this point I'm thinking the (AC) POE is the cause of all
> our issues (Cambium, so that pair is positive 24v and data).
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 10:47 AM, Chuck McCown 
> wrote:
>
>> Sure, you can also wash them with 90% isopropyl alcohol.  That will
>> remove any water.  Need to make sure there is no corrosion.
>> Wash out the jacks extra good too.
>>
>> If they have not had too large of a surge, they are totally self
>> resetting.
>>
>> *From:* Josh Luthman
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 11, 2018 7:25 AM
>> *To:* AFMUG
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV
>>
>> There's a cause and I'm pretty confident it's not the cards
>> themselves.
>>
>> This weekend an AP started having eth link issues.  Look at it and
>> the card/rj45 is full of water.  Replaced the line.  Problem returns 
>> about
>> 12 hours later.
>>
>> I plug in my continuity tester and pin 7 blinks quickly and fades
>> away.  Headed up the tower now for a new AP and already did a new Poe (no
>> power until AP replaced).
>>
>> Is it possible the Poe/AP are damaging 

Re: [AFMUG] Heeees Baaaaaack

[Harold Bledsoe]

Woohoo!!

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:18 AM  wrote:

>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: mailman-boun...@af.afmug.com
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 9:16 AM
> To: af-ow...@af.afmug.com
> Subject: AF subscription notification
>
> af...@kwisp.com has been successfully subscribed to AF.
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 

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Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Cameron Crum]

In the interest of full disclosure, for those that don't know, and given
the current environment, when I joined the group I had my own company
(still do, just not doing much with it currently), but now also work for
ubnt although I am not here to shill for them nor will I involve myself in
discussions about them unless I see something grossly in error. I would
actually rather keep that side of things separate from this group as I
value the relationships here above any employment scenario. My job at ubnt
is actually to engage with operators and try to find a better way to create
and maintain relationships with them. I hope to take all the past failures
and criticisms and present them with a plan on how to be better at that
side of things. I actually prefer to hear the bad stuff as that is what I
can use to help change things, hopefully. I don't want this to turn into a
discussion about the company, but if you want to talk about products or
anything other than the lawsuit, feel free to reach out to me privately. I
just don't want to seem like the enemy lurker.

Best,

Cameron

On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:11 AM, Bill Prince  wrote:

> Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie wrote:
>
> Yes, he is missed.
>
> On Saturday, September 15, 2018,  wrote:
>
>> Harass, welcome.
>> I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.
>>
>> *From:* Mathew Howard
>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
>> *To:* AFMUG
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>
>> Well, it would only be new lurkers that would get outed, I assume... but
>> yeah, if all we're seeing is an email address, that can be pretty anonymous
>> anyway.
>>
>> I'm not sure what good it would really do us though...  other than give
>> us an opportunity to harass new people.
>>
>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM  wrote:
>>
>>> Probably best to not out the lurkers.  There are about 500 list members
>>> but only about 10% post.
>>>
>>> *From:* Mathew Howard
>>> *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:03 PM
>>> *To:* AFMUG
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification
>>>
>>> I assume most of the subscribers to this list never actually post
>>> anything. It might be kind of interesting to see who's watching us...
>>>
>>> I imagine there are some people that wouldn't like it, but if they
>>> aren't going to every post anything anyway, do we care?
>>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 3:52 PM David Coudron <
>>> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>>>
 I think enough information is shared feely in this group to warrant
 folks being identified as recipients of the information.   If I were
 signing up, I don’t think it would be unreasonable to be identified as
 being a part of the list given the value of the discussions on the list.



 Regards,



 David Coudron

 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
 *Sent:* Friday, September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
 *To:* af@af.afmug.com
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification



 A manufacturer rep might prefer to quietly lurk and observeor a
 government rep.

 Nobody is entitled to privacy in a public forum, but I'm sure some
 would prefer it.

 -Adam

 On 9/14/2018 1:53 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

 xx...@.xxx has been successfully subscribed to AF.

 I am thinking of posting this when new people join.

 Or do new list subscribers deserve to remain incognito until they out
 themselves?



 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>> --
>>> --
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>>> AF mailing list
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>>>
>> --
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
>
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
>
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[AFMUG] Heeees Baaaaaack

[chuck]

-Original Message- 
From: mailman-boun...@af.afmug.com 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 9:16 AM 
To: af-ow...@af.afmug.com 
Subject: AF subscription notification 


af...@kwisp.com has been successfully subscribed to AF.



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Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription notification

[Bill Prince]

  
  
Likewise. I hope that he is lurking in incognito mode at least.


bp



On 9/15/2018 8:44 AM, Jason McKemie
  wrote:


  
  Yes, he is missed.
  
  On Saturday, September 15, 2018, 
  wrote:
  

  

  Harass, welcome.
  I hope for the day to see Ken Hohof show up.  
  

   
  
From: Mathew Howard 
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 5:58 PM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF subscription
  notification
  

 
  
  
Well, it would only be new lurkers that
  would get outed, I assume... but yeah, if all we're
  seeing is an email address, that can be pretty
  anonymous anyway.
   
  I'm not sure what good it would really do us
though...  other than give us an opportunity to
harass new people.

 

  On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 4:11 PM 
wrote:
  
  

  

  Probably best to not out the lurkers. 
There are about 500 list members but only
about 10% post.  
  

   
  
From: Mathew Howard

Sent: Friday, September 14,
  2018 3:03 PM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] AF
  subscription notification
  

 
  
  

  I assume most of the subscribers to
this list never actually post anything.
It might be kind of interesting to see
who's watching us...
   
  I imagine there are some people that
wouldn't like it, but if they aren't
going to every post anything anyway, do
we care?
  

 

  On Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at
3:52 PM David Coudron 
wrote:
  
  

  
I think
enough information is shared
feely in this group to warrant
folks being identified as
recipients of the information.  
If I were signing up, I don’t
think it would be unreasonable
to be identified as being a part
of the list given the value of
the discussions on the list.
 
Regards,
 
David
Coudron

  
From: AF

On Behalf Of Adam
Moffett
Sent: Friday,
September 14, 2018 3:34 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG]
AF subscription notification
  

 
A
  manufacturer rep might prefer to

Re: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[chuck]

Lots of solutions:

https://www.mccowntech.com/product/cambium-600ss-surge-protector-gige-upgrade-pcb/

From: Sam Lambie 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 8:44 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

Yo guys, 
The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using 
anything else that is cheaper and effective?
Thanks


-- 

-- 
Sam Lambie
Taosnet Wireless Tech.
575-758-7598 Office
www.Taosnet.com



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[AFMUG] Suitable Cambium replacement 600SS

[Sam Lambie]

Yo guys,
The 600ss has gotten expensive as a surge suppressor. Are you all using
anything else that is cheaper and effective?
Thanks


-- 
-- 
*Sam Lambie*
Taosnet Wireless Tech.
575-758-7598 Office
www.Taosnet.com 
-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Check out our new addition

[chuck]

Nice looking mounts.  

Rolling hills with trees, didn’t anyone tell you that wisps are impractical in 
areas like this.

I think you need some ice shields thought.  

From: Dave 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 7:02 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Check out our new addition

this Link should work 

https://youtu.be/sQx75I33oow



On 09/17/2018 07:59 AM, Dave wrote:

  Chuck may like some of the stuff we used :)

  https://youtu.be/sQx75I33oow



  -- 


   



-- 




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Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

[chuck]

Surges cause the surge components to do their job, which is to short everything 
to ground.
Netonix ports will blow if they are shorted.  

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2018 6:58 AM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

Should only be 24v.  Even if it doubled, should be OK on the radio and surge 
card. 

What's the Netonix problem?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Sep 14, 2018, 12:44 PM  wrote:

  If the voltage was too high or had spikes it could certainly have done that.
  Kinda the reverse of the Netonix problem.  

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Friday, September 14, 2018 10:37 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

  I replaced the POE, AP, and surge card on Tuesday.  That's what fixed it for 
sure. 

  The AP is sitting here in the lab and doing gigabit for 3 days now, happily.  
The POE and surge card are in the trash.

  I'm wondering if it's possible the POE fried all of those surge cards on 
Saturday/Sunday/Monday/Tuesday.  If that's possible?


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:21 PM,  wrote:

You say you are inclined to think it is the POE.  I presume that means the 
POE power supply.  So try a new one.  I am probably not understanding the 
situation.  

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 11:39 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

I have a thousand new POEs.  What do you want me to try?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 11:07 AM,  wrote:

  Do you have a spare POE to try ?

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2018 6:10 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

  Well there was no lightning or anything, beautiful weather.  After 
several cards I have to imagine it's the POE or the AP.  We replaced those two 
at the same time. 

  Does it make sense the POE was doing something weird to fry them or more 
sense the AP was pulling too many amps?  AP seems perfectly fine in the office 
for 36 hours, so I'm inclined to believe it's the POE.


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 2:51 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

It resets immediately if it is going to reset.  
Sounds like it took a hit.  

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2018 12:45 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

How long does it need to be cold for it to be self reset?  The one I 
took down this morning looks perfectly clean and I can't get pins 7/8 through 
it.  At this point I'm thinking the (AC) POE is the cause of all our issues 
(Cambium, so that pair is positive 24v and data).


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 10:47 AM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  Sure, you can also wash them with 90% isopropyl alcohol.  That will 
remove any water.  Need to make sure there is no corrosion. 
  Wash out the jacks extra good too.  

  If they have not had too large of a surge, they are totally self 
resetting.  

  From: Josh Luthman 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2018 7:25 AM
  To: AFMUG 
  Subject: [AFMUG] Surge suppression failure gigE APC HV

  There's a cause and I'm pretty confident it's not the cards 
themselves. 

  This weekend an AP started having eth link issues.  Look at it and 
the card/rj45 is full of water.  Replaced the line.  Problem returns about 12 
hours later.

  I plug in my continuity tester and pin 7 blinks quickly and fades 
away.  Headed up the tower now for a new AP and already did a new Poe (no power 
until AP replaced).

  Is it possible the Poe/AP are damaging the surge card?  We've gone 
through 5-6 cards since Saturday, and I thought it was all water related.  It 
stopped raining on Sunday after card 3 + new line.

  Any other ideas?  Can I wait a minute and reuse the dry cards, are 
they self resetting (I tried power cycling the POE for 5 seconds with no 
change) after a length of time?


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

--
  -- 
 

[AFMUG] Check out our new addition

[Dave]

Chuck may like some of the stuff we used :)

https://youtu.be/sQx75I33oow 


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Re: [AFMUG] Wire pulling lube

[Josh Luthman]

I tried a vacuum myself here and there.  It doesn't solve this problem IME.

Lube just always makes it easier.  I used the Ideal stuff on 2" and 6
months later I didn't see anything weird.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Sun, Sep 16, 2018, 11:59 PM Trey Scarborough  wrote:

> I would second the try blowing and vacuum a small pull string then pull
> through some mule tape. The problem with the rod is it tends to kink after
> a long distance and can get tangled in the current cable. A pull string
> attached to a plastic bag tends to ride on top. Also give the existing
> cable a little tug from each end make sure it isn't slacked up in the
> middle from being pushed with the rod.
>
> On 9/16/2018 8:37 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>
> Polywater was the best we ever found. I also would try that and blowing or
> vacuuming instead of a rod.
>
> On Sun, Sep 16, 2018, 8:32 PM Tim Withrow via AF  wrote:
>
>>
>> You should be able to source pulling lube from an electrical supplier.
>> 20+ bucks a gallon gets expensive fast with the ideal lube,if a small job
>> it may be all you need, but this seems not the case.
>> --
>> On Sunday, September 16, 2018 Jason McKemie  wrote:
>> I have about 350' of 2" conduit that already has a .75" diameter cable
>> installed, to which I need to add a flat drop cable. I've been trying to
>> get a fiberglass pull rod to go through, but am getting hung up around 230'
>> going from either end, probably due to friction with the other cable. I'm
>> considering using something like Ideal cable lube to get the extra
>> distance, does this stuff thicken up and turn to glue after a while?
>> Anything else I should be trying?
>> --
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>
>
>
> --
>
> Trey Scarborough
> VP Engineering
> 3DS Communications LLC
> p:9729741539
>
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