Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Layne Sisk]

When they do you won’t be able to resell it, they will just sell it to your 
customers and you won’t make anything.

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102
[New logo xl]
[http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
[Utah 100]   [fast50-01] [Inc 5000]

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:40 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

That's how technology is.

Until DirecTV, Google, Sony, etc. get full line-ups OTT, you're not going to 
find something you can sell that's going to have a full line-up.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Clint Wiley" 
>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:01:32 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution.
Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett 
> wrote:
The statement of the week...


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Matt Hoppes" 
>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
Maybe. Time will tell.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett 
> wrote:
I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Layne Sisk]

We are a partner in Real Choice.  

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102




   

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:21 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

When you say "We", do you mean that ServerPlus has an IPTV solution?
Is this something you're reselling?


-- Original Message --
From: "Layne Sisk" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 2/23/2018 5:31:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

>There are 2 types of licensing, MVPD and OTT.  MVPD is closed network 
>only, and allows all content to be distributed via that closed network 
>(all locals, all content on those locals).  OTT is over the open 
>internet but does not generally include the ability to provide all 
>content (some channels are available, some are not, some channels black 
>out certain content).  One big difference as well is that OTT requires 
>that we sign deals with huge monthly minimums, as much as I wish I had 
>the cash that Google and Sony have I simply don't so we decided to 
>stick with the MVPD model.
>
>Layne Sisk
>ServerPlus
>801.426.8283, ext 102
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
>Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:17 PM
>To: af@afmug.com
>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
>Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via 
>the public internet, why not RCTV?
>
>Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like 
>this.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Clint Wiley
>Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
>To: af@afmug.com
>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
>I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it 
>adds an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.
>
>Thanks,
>_
>
>Clint Wiley
>Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>
>>On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com" 
>>wrote:
>>
>>That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
>>tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could 
>>drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and 
>>never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get 
>>caught.
>>
>>Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I 
>>was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN 
>>over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were 
>>OK with it.
>>
>>-Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
>>Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
>>To: af@afmug.com
>>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>>
>>RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private 
>>line requirement.
>>
>>>On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley 
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>Hi,
>>>
>>>I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If 
>>>so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
>>>wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, 
>>>experiences, etc. on either provider?
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>_
>>>Clint Wiley
>>>Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Matt Hoppes]

I’m pretty sure bringing US content that was destined for the Philippines back 
into the US is not legal. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 23:12, Rory Conaway  wrote:
> 
> We are doing Viva and WISPs will be able to sign up on it Monday with 
> commissions.
> 
> Rory
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Clint Wiley
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:39 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, are 
> any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale provider? 
> Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on either 
> provider? 
> 
> Thanks,
> _
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Mimosa c5c 80MHz channel ptp

[Rory Conaway]

Usually I run B5-Lites for these and it’s about 680Mbps.Got one that runs 
up to 500Mbps every night in just that scenario right now.

Rory

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Eric Kuhnke
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 9:10 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Mimosa c5c 80MHz channel ptp

Anyone have real world IP speed tests they could share from a short distance, 
strong signal c5c link, in an 80MHz channel?

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Rory Conaway]

We are doing Viva and WISPs will be able to sign up on it Monday with 
commissions.

Rory

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:39 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, are 
any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale provider? Can 
any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on either provider? 

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

[AFMUG] Mimosa c5c 80MHz channel ptp

[Eric Kuhnke]

Anyone have real world IP speed tests they could share from a short
distance, strong signal c5c link, in an 80MHz channel?

Re: [AFMUG] Como chingo..

[Jaime Solorza]

Thanks!!

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 8:44 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:

> Pretty good. There were some bugs early on (we got some of the pre-release
> units), but it's nice and stable now. Latency is slightly worse than the
> normal af-5x, but they can run at higher modulations at lower signal levels
> and support up to 100mhz wide channels.
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:14 PM, "Jaime Solorza" 
> wrote:
>
>> How is it working for you?
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 8:07 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah, we have a link up.
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2018 8:57 PM, "Jaime Solorza" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Have any of you Kopacetic Kool Kats deployed the AirFiber 5X HD LTU
 radios yet?  Thanks

 Jaime Solorza

>>>

Re: [AFMUG] Como chingo..

[Mathew Howard]

Pretty good. There were some bugs early on (we got some of the pre-release
units), but it's nice and stable now. Latency is slightly worse than the
normal af-5x, but they can run at higher modulations at lower signal levels
and support up to 100mhz wide channels.

On Feb 23, 2018 9:14 PM, "Jaime Solorza"  wrote:

> How is it working for you?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 8:07 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:
>
>> Yeah, we have a link up.
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 8:57 PM, "Jaime Solorza" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Have any of you Kopacetic Kool Kats deployed the AirFiber 5X HD LTU
>>> radios yet?  Thanks
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Chris Fabien]

So, we have been working with Rodeo for nearly a year as they slowly get
their system ready for launch. Technically, Realchoice is a better and more
"finished" product, but the pricing left Zero margin for me to be able to
sell, and the private line requirement PLUS a significant monthly minimum
made it a non-starter.

Rodeo, what they are offering to sell is more flexible channel lineup at
prices that you can make a decent margin. If they can get the technical
issues past them they will be a great option. They have made a lot of
progress but it's been a very painful process to work through.
Communication and transparency  from them has been very poor, but improving
lately.

If server plus/ realchoice could find a way to get their pricing in line
they'd be a slam dunk. I had a frank discussion with someone there a few
months ago and the feedback I got was, we think our pricing is perfect,
take it or leave it.

On Feb 23, 2018 9:35 PM, "Clint Wiley"  wrote:

> I’m a trigger puller. That’s why I asked originally.  I’m looking for
> feedback now as I don’t plan to dwell on it for long.
>
> Thanks,
> _
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>
>
> On Feb 23, 2018, at 8:57 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
>
> The thing is, while you're waiting someone else is selling a service to
> your customer.and you're carrying the traffic without getting anything
> out of it.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Clint Wiley" 
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Sent: 2/23/2018 7:01:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want
> to choose the wrong technology/solution.
>
> Thanks,
> _
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>
>
> On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
> The statement of the week...
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Matt Hoppes" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> Maybe. Time will tell.
>
> On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
> I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same
> lineup.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the
> public internet, why not RCTV?
>
> Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Clint Wiley
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds
> an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.
>
> Thanks,
> _
>
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>
> > On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:
> >
> > That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
> > tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could
> drop
> > it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get
> > caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
> >
> > Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was
> > trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN
> > (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were 

Re: [AFMUG] Como chingo..

[Jaime Solorza]

I have 4 AF5x links churning away...one link is 22 miles

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 8:07 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:

> Yeah, we have a link up.
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 8:57 PM, "Jaime Solorza" 
> wrote:
>
>> Have any of you Kopacetic Kool Kats deployed the AirFiber 5X HD LTU
>> radios yet?  Thanks
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Como chingo..

[Jaime Solorza]

How is it working for you?

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 8:07 PM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:

> Yeah, we have a link up.
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 8:57 PM, "Jaime Solorza" 
> wrote:
>
>> Have any of you Kopacetic Kool Kats deployed the AirFiber 5X HD LTU
>> radios yet?  Thanks
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Just a friendly reminder......3.65 license available

[Jaime Solorza]

https://youtu.be/XT8hE7_8BCY

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 8:04 PM, "CBB - Jay Fuller" 
wrote:

>
> As many of you have heard, we recently discovered we had a spare 3.65
> license.
>
> We have decided to put this up for auction for the next seven days. If you
> need a 3.65 license, go bid on this.
>
> Good luck!
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/NN-License-LICENSING-FOR-THE-3-
> 65-3-70-GHZ-SPECTRUM/222848486692
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Como chingo..

[Mathew Howard]

Yeah, we have a link up.

On Feb 23, 2018 8:57 PM, "Jaime Solorza"  wrote:

> Have any of you Kopacetic Kool Kats deployed the AirFiber 5X HD LTU radios
> yet?  Thanks
>
> Jaime Solorza
>

[AFMUG] Just a friendly reminder......3.65 license available

[CBB - Jay Fuller]

As many of you have heard, we recently discovered we had a spare 3.65 license. 


We have decided to put this up for auction for the next seven days. If you need 
a 3.65 license, go bid on this.


Good luck!


https://www.ebay.com/itm/NN-License-LICENSING-FOR-THE-3-65-3-70-GHZ-SPECTRUM/222848486692

[AFMUG] Como chingo..

[Jaime Solorza]

Have any of you Kopacetic Kool Kats deployed the AirFiber 5X HD LTU radios
yet?  Thanks

Jaime Solorza

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Clint Wiley]

I’m a trigger puller. That’s why I asked originally.  I’m looking for feedback 
now as I don’t plan to dwell on it for long.

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 8:57 PM, Adam Moffett 
> wrote:

The thing is, while you're waiting someone else is selling a service to your 
customer.and you're carrying the traffic without getting anything out of it.


-- Original Message --
From: "Clint Wiley" 
>
To: "af@afmug.com" >
Sent: 2/23/2018 7:01:33 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution.

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett 
> wrote:

The statement of the week...



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Matt Hoppes" 
>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Maybe. Time will tell.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett 
> wrote:

I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the
public internet, why not RCTV?

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.

-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.

Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com" 
> > wrote:
>
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN
> (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
>
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

A lot of the packaging is per license agreements, but there is some discretion. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Adam Moffett"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 8:03:52 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 


Honestly I have to admit that it was quite clever on Dish Network's part. They 
made sure everyone actually wanted the second price tier because there's one 
critical channel for everybody that isn't in the bottom tier. 


Or maybe it's not intentional but rather a side effect of licensing or some 
such, but I'm equally willing to assume it's a result of evil genius. 


-- Original Message -- 
From: "Mike Hammett" < af...@ics-il.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:59:04 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 





and there's no way they'll sell it that way for the foreseeable future. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Adam Moffett" < dmmoff...@gmail.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:55:43 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 


Yup. I remember that from when I had to sell Dish Network. No two people agree 
on what the right set of channels are, but they all agree that the channels 
they want should be in the cheaper package. 




-- Original Message -- 
From: "Mike Hammett" < af...@ics-il.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:40:11 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 





" a set of the channels folks want to watch" That's going to be even harder 
than a full line-up OTT. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:08:14 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



It’s why I’ve held off for as long as I have. None of the options were right. 
They either required expensive private lines, or the costs were so high I ended 
up making no profit and I felt like it was too expensive to try to sell to the 
end user. Or the quality of the feed was junk. 


Just give me a set of the channels folks want to watch for $30-$40/month and I 
can sell it. 


I can’t sell a service where I need a $1,500/month private line. Or where the 
monthly rate ends up being $60 when I mark it up. 


Or where the provider takes their entire head end down for a day while they 
move it. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 19:01, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 




That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution. 



Thanks, 
_ 
Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 



On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





The statement of the week... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



Maybe. Time will tell. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV? 

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this. 

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks, 
_ 

Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, " ch...@wbmfg.com " < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
> 
> That is not by choice. The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around. RealChoice could drop 
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught. 
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right) over the public internet. Some of them were OK 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

Honestly I have to admit that it was quite clever on Dish Network's 
part.  They made sure everyone actually wanted the second price tier 
because there's one critical channel for everybody that isn't in the 
bottom tier.


Or maybe it's not intentional but rather a side effect of licensing 
or some such, but I'm equally willing to assume it's a result of evil 
genius.


-- Original Message --
From: "Mike Hammett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:59:04 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV


and there's no way they'll sell it that way for the foreseeable future.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: "Adam Moffett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:55:43 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Yup.  I remember that from when I had to sell Dish Network.  No two 
people agree on what the right set of channels are, but they all agree 
that the channels they want should be in the cheaper package.



-- Original Message --
From: "Mike Hammett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:40:11 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

"a set of the channels folks want to watch" That's going to be even 
harder than a full line-up OTT.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:08:14 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

It’s why I’ve held off for as long as I have.  None of the options 
were right. They either required expensive private lines, or the costs 
were so high I ended up making no profit and I felt like it was too 
expensive to try to sell to the end user. Or the quality of the feed 
was junk.


Just give me a set of the channels folks want to watch for 
$30-$40/month and I can sell it.


I can’t sell a service where I need a $1,500/month private line. Or 
where the monthly rate ends up being $60 when I mark it up.


Or where the provider takes their entire head end down for a day while 
they move it.


On Feb 23, 2018, at 19:01, Clint Wiley  
wrote:


That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t 
want to choose the wrong technology/solution.


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:


The statement of the week...



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Maybe. Time will tell.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett  wrote:

I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly 
the same lineup.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

and there's no way they'll sell it that way for the foreseeable future. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Adam Moffett"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:55:43 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 


Yup. I remember that from when I had to sell Dish Network. No two people agree 
on what the right set of channels are, but they all agree that the channels 
they want should be in the cheaper package. 




-- Original Message -- 
From: "Mike Hammett" < af...@ics-il.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:40:11 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 





" a set of the channels folks want to watch" That's going to be even harder 
than a full line-up OTT. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:08:14 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



It’s why I’ve held off for as long as I have. None of the options were right. 
They either required expensive private lines, or the costs were so high I ended 
up making no profit and I felt like it was too expensive to try to sell to the 
end user. Or the quality of the feed was junk. 


Just give me a set of the channels folks want to watch for $30-$40/month and I 
can sell it. 


I can’t sell a service where I need a $1,500/month private line. Or where the 
monthly rate ends up being $60 when I mark it up. 


Or where the provider takes their entire head end down for a day while they 
move it. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 19:01, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 




That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution. 



Thanks, 
_ 
Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 



On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





The statement of the week... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



Maybe. Time will tell. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV? 

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this. 

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks, 
_ 

Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, " ch...@wbmfg.com " < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
> 
> That is not by choice. The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around. RealChoice could drop 
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught. 
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right) over the public internet. Some of them were OK with it. 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 
> 
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> requirement. 
> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 
>> 
>> Hi, 
>> 
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> either provider? 
>> 
>> Thanks, 
>> _ 
>> Clint Wiley 
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

The thing is, while you're waiting someone else is selling a service to 
your customer.and you're carrying the traffic without getting 
anything out of it.



-- Original Message --
From: "Clint Wiley" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 2/23/2018 7:01:33 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t 
want to choose the wrong technology/solution.


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:


The statement of the week...



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Maybe. Time will tell.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett  wrote:

I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the 
same lineup.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via 
the

public internet, why not RCTV?

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like 
this.


-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it 
adds

an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.

Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  
wrote:

>
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice 
could drop
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never 
get

> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I 
was
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over 
VPN
> (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK 
with it.

>
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private 
line

> requirement.
>
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  
wrote:

>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. 
If so,
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
wholesale
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, 
etc. on

>> either provider?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

Yup.  I remember that from when I had to sell Dish Network.  No two 
people agree on what the right set of channels are, but they all agree 
that the channels they want should be in the cheaper package.



-- Original Message --
From: "Mike Hammett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:40:11 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

"a set of the channels folks want to watch" That's going to be even 
harder than a full line-up OTT.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:08:14 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

It’s why I’ve held off for as long as I have.  None of the options were 
right. They either required expensive private lines, or the costs were 
so high I ended up making no profit and I felt like it was too 
expensive to try to sell to the end user. Or the quality of the feed 
was junk.


Just give me a set of the channels folks want to watch for 
$30-$40/month and I can sell it.


I can’t sell a service where I need a $1,500/month private line. Or 
where the monthly rate ends up being $60 when I mark it up.


Or where the provider takes their entire head end down for a day while 
they move it.


On Feb 23, 2018, at 19:01, Clint Wiley  
wrote:


That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t 
want to choose the wrong technology/solution.


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:


The statement of the week...



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Maybe. Time will tell.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett  wrote:

I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the 
same lineup.




-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
 
 
 


Midwest Internet Exchange 
 
 


The Brothers WISP 





From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via 
the

public internet, why not RCTV?

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies 
like this.


-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but 
it adds

an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.

Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  
wrote:

>
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice 
could drop
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

That's how technology is. 

Until DirecTV, Google, Sony, etc. get full line-ups OTT, you're not going to 
find something you can sell that's going to have a full line-up. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Clint Wiley"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:01:32 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution. 



Thanks, 
_ 
Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 



On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





The statement of the week... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



Maybe. Time will tell. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV? 

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this. 

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks, 
_ 

Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, " ch...@wbmfg.com " < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
> 
> That is not by choice. The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around. RealChoice could drop 
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught. 
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right) over the public internet. Some of them were OK with it. 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 
> 
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> requirement. 
> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 
>> 
>> Hi, 
>> 
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> either provider? 
>> 
>> Thanks, 
>> _ 
>> Clint Wiley 
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

" a set of the channels folks want to watch" That's going to be even harder 
than a full line-up OTT. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:08:14 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



It’s why I’ve held off for as long as I have. None of the options were right. 
They either required expensive private lines, or the costs were so high I ended 
up making no profit and I felt like it was too expensive to try to sell to the 
end user. Or the quality of the feed was junk. 


Just give me a set of the channels folks want to watch for $30-$40/month and I 
can sell it. 


I can’t sell a service where I need a $1,500/month private line. Or where the 
monthly rate ends up being $60 when I mark it up. 


Or where the provider takes their entire head end down for a day while they 
move it. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 19:01, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 




That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution. 



Thanks, 
_ 
Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 



On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





The statement of the week... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



Maybe. Time will tell. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV? 

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this. 

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks, 
_ 

Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, " ch...@wbmfg.com " < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
> 
> That is not by choice. The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around. RealChoice could drop 
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught. 
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right) over the public internet. Some of them were OK with it. 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 
> 
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> requirement. 
> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 
>> 
>> Hi, 
>> 
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> either provider? 
>> 
>> Thanks, 
>> _ 
>> Clint Wiley 
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

I did not realize the association.


-- Original Message --
From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/23/2018 8:23:49 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV


Yes they do. It’s called real choice.


On Feb 23, 2018, at 20:20, Adam Moffett  wrote:

When you say "We", do you mean that ServerPlus has an IPTV solution?
Is this something you're reselling?


-- Original Message --
From: "Layne Sisk" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 2/23/2018 5:31:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

There are 2 types of licensing, MVPD and OTT.  MVPD is closed network 
only, and allows all content to be distributed via that closed 
network (all locals, all content on those locals).  OTT is over the 
open internet but does not generally include the ability to provide 
all content (some channels are available, some are not, some channels 
black out certain content).  One big difference as well is that OTT 
requires that we sign deals with huge monthly minimums, as much as I 
wish I had the cash that Google and Sony have I simply don't so we 
decided to stick with the MVPD model.


Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102






-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:17 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via 
the public internet, why not RCTV?


Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like 
this.


-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it 
adds an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.


Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  
wrote:


That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could
drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and
never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get 
caught.


Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I
was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN
over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them 
were OK with it.


-Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private
line requirement.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  
wrote:


Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. 
If

so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the
wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts,
experiences, etc. on either provider?

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Matt Hoppes]

Yes they do. It’s called real choice. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 20:20, Adam Moffett  wrote:
> 
> When you say "We", do you mean that ServerPlus has an IPTV solution?
> Is this something you're reselling?
> 
> 
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Layne Sisk" 
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Sent: 2/23/2018 5:31:27 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
> 
>> There are 2 types of licensing, MVPD and OTT.  MVPD is closed network only, 
>> and allows all content to be distributed via that closed network (all 
>> locals, all content on those locals).  OTT is over the open internet but 
>> does not generally include the ability to provide all content (some channels 
>> are available, some are not, some channels black out certain content).  One 
>> big difference as well is that OTT requires that we sign deals with huge 
>> monthly minimums, as much as I wish I had the cash that Google and Sony have 
>> I simply don't so we decided to stick with the MVPD model.
>> 
>> Layne Sisk
>> ServerPlus
>> 801.426.8283, ext 102
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:17 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
>> public internet, why not RCTV?
>> 
>> Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Clint Wiley
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
>> an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> 
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>> 
>>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:
>>> 
>>> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
>>> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could
>>> drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and
>>> never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>>> 
>>> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I
>>> was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN
>>> over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK 
>>> with it.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
>>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>>> 
>>> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private
>>> line requirement.
>>> 
 On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If
 so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the
 wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts,
 experiences, etc. on either provider?
 
 Thanks,
 _
 Clint Wiley
 Hagerstown Fiber Internet
> 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

When you say "We", do you mean that ServerPlus has an IPTV solution?
Is this something you're reselling?


-- Original Message --
From: "Layne Sisk" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 2/23/2018 5:31:27 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

There are 2 types of licensing, MVPD and OTT.  MVPD is closed network 
only, and allows all content to be distributed via that closed network 
(all locals, all content on those locals).  OTT is over the open 
internet but does not generally include the ability to provide all 
content (some channels are available, some are not, some channels black 
out certain content).  One big difference as well is that OTT requires 
that we sign deals with huge monthly minimums, as much as I wish I had 
the cash that Google and Sony have I simply don't so we decided to 
stick with the MVPD model.


Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102






-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:17 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via 
the public internet, why not RCTV?


Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like 
this.


-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it 
adds an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.


Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  
wrote:


That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could
drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and
never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get 
caught.


Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I
was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN
over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were 
OK with it.


-Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private
line requirement.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  
wrote:


Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If
so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the
wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts,
experiences, etc. on either provider?

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

Company I doing work for is Dragonwave dealer

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 5:28 PM, "SmarterBroadband"  wrote:

> Dragonwave-X Harmony Enhanced HP.
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
> *Sent:* Friday, February 23, 2018 2:59 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
>
>
> Someone (I forget who) was claiming their high power (34 dBm) 18 GHz
> radios would reach just as far as many 11 GHz radios.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
>
> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 9:33:50 AM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from
> CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles
> ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a
> sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and
> want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more
> CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you guys
> would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in
> eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with your
> suggestions?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[SmarterBroadband]

Dragonwave-X Harmony Enhanced HP. 

 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:59 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

 

Someone (I forget who) was claiming their high power (34 dBm) 18 GHz radios 
would reach just as far as many 11 GHz radios.



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  
 
  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  
 
  The Brothers WISP
   
 




  _  

From: "Jaime Solorza"  >
To: "Animal Farm"  >
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 9:33:50 AM
Subject: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from 
CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles ) 
from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a sectored 
antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and want to deliver 
1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more CenturyLink feeds to 
provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you guys would recommend?  I know 
it's a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they 
have good budget , dazzle me with your suggestions? 

Jaime Solorza

 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Matt Hoppes]

It’s why I’ve held off for as long as I have.  None of the options were right. 
They either required expensive private lines, or the costs were so high I ended 
up making no profit and I felt like it was too expensive to try to sell to the 
end user. Or the quality of the feed was junk. 

Just give me a set of the channels folks want to watch for $30-$40/month and I 
can sell it. 

I can’t sell a service where I need a $1,500/month private line. Or where the 
monthly rate ends up being $60 when I mark it up. 

Or where the provider takes their entire head end down for a day while they 
move it. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 19:01, Clint Wiley  wrote:
> 
> That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
> choose the wrong technology/solution.
> 
> Thanks,
> _
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
> 
> 
> On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
>> The statement of the week...
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: "Matt Hoppes" 
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> Maybe. Time will tell. 
>> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett  wrote:
>> 
>> I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
>> lineup.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: ch...@wbmfg.com
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
>> public internet, why not RCTV?
>> 
>> Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.
>> 
>> -Original Message- 
>> From: Clint Wiley
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
>> an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> 
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>> 
>> > On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:
>> >
>> > That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
>> > tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop 
>> > it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
>> > caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>> >
>> > Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
>> > trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
>> > (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
>> >
>> > -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
>> > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
>> > To: af@afmug.com
>> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> >
>> > RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
>> > requirement.
>> >
>> >> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> >> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> >> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> >> either provider?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks,
>> >> _
>> >> Clint Wiley
>> >> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 
>> 
>> 
>> 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Clint Wiley]

That’s actually a good point. This is a rapidly moving area. I don’t want to 
choose the wrong technology/solution.

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 6:23 PM, Mike Hammett 
> wrote:

The statement of the week...



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Matt Hoppes" 
>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Maybe. Time will tell.

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett 
> wrote:

I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the
public internet, why not RCTV?

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.

-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.

Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com" 
> > wrote:
>
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN
> (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
>
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line
> requirement.
>
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley 
>> > wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so,
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on
>> either provider?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] testing

[Jaime Solorza]

Works

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 2:11 PM, "Dennis Burgess"  wrote:

> Testing outbound.
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

Two years ago

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 4:28 PM, "Jaime Solorza"  wrote:

> Artesia area.. I installed bunch on Siklu links along with a few 3.65
> Ubiquiti radios
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 11:11 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:
>
>> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>>>
>>> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>>> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
>>> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>>> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and
>>> will be looking at roughly $15k / link
>>>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
>>> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
>>> Bridgewave's new radios).
>>>
>>> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you
>>> have a few more options
>>> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>>>
>>> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
>>> needed.
>>>
>>> Best of luck.
>>>
>>> Regards.
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>>
>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>>
>>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>>>
 Bang it out with PTP820C ring
 Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
 the ODU if you go all outdoor.
 They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.



 On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

 That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
 wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

 Jaime Solorza

 On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
 wrote:

> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
> ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
> have a redundant setup.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy 
> wrote:
>
>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at
>>> three locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale. 
>>>  If
>>> they can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything
>>> together on a VLAN.
>>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
>>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
 Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to
 office from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 
 6.2
 and 9.1 miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span 
 if I
 was using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want 
 licensed
 links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
 adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
 what
 you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
 outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me 
 with
 your suggestions?

 Jaime Solorza

>>>
 --

>>>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

Artesia area.. I installed bunch on Siklu links along with a few 3.65
Ubiquiti radios

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 11:11 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:

> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
> wrote:
>
>> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>>
>> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
>> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will
>> be looking at roughly $15k / link
>>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
>> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
>> Bridgewave's new radios).
>>
>> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have
>> a few more options
>> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>>
>> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
>> needed.
>>
>> Best of luck.
>>
>> Regards.
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>
>> --
>>
>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>
>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>>
>>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
>>> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
>>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>>
>>> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
>>> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
 ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
 have a redundant setup.

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:

> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
> wrote:
>
>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
>> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If 
>> they
>> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything 
>> together
>> on a VLAN.
>>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
>>> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 
>>> 9.1
>>> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
>>> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
>>> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
>>> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
>>> what
>>> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
>>> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
>>> your suggestions?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>
>>> --
>>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

The statement of the week... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 5:04:40 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 



Maybe. Time will tell. 

On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV? 

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this. 

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks, 
_ 

Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, " ch...@wbmfg.com " < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
> 
> That is not by choice. The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around. RealChoice could drop 
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught. 
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right) over the public internet. Some of them were OK with it. 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 
> 
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> requirement. 
> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley < cl...@hagerstownfiber.com > wrote: 
>> 
>> Hi, 
>> 
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> either provider? 
>> 
>> Thanks, 
>> _ 
>> Clint Wiley 
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Matt Hoppes]

Maybe. Time will tell. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:46, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
> lineup.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange
> 
> The Brothers WISP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
> 
> Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
> public internet, why not RCTV?
> 
> Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Clint Wiley
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
> 
> I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
> an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.
> 
> Thanks,
> _
> 
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
> 
> > On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:
> >
> > That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
> > tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop 
> > it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> > caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
> >
> > Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> > trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> > (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
> >
> > -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
> > To: af@afmug.com
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
> >
> > RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> > requirement.
> >
> >> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
> >> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
> >> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
> >> either provider?
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> _
> >> Clint Wiley
> >> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Mike Hammett]

Someone (I forget who) was claiming their high power (34 dBm) 18 GHz radios 
would reach just as far as many 11 GHz radios. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Jaime Solorza"  
To: "Animal Farm"  
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 9:33:50 AM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Question for the collective... 


Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from 
CenturyLink. They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles ) 
from office. All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a sectored 
antenna. On email, they indicated they want licensed links and want to deliver 
1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more CenturyLink feeds to 
provide 1Gig to each site. I wonder what you guys would recommend? I know it's 
a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern NM. Let's say they have good 
budget , dazzle me with your suggestions? 


Jaime Solorza 

[AFMUG] Exalt ExtremeAir

[Brandon Shiers]

Anybody seen the error "Ethernet port 1 input alarm" on an Exalt Extremeair 
radio?  I seem to be getting them when I try to pass packet sizes larger than 
1500 bytes.  Link is up at 1G full and I've tried both a laptop plugged into 
the radio power supply directly as well as from a MKT CCR router that the radio 
is plugged into.  Running 2.6.2 code and can't seem to get anything larger than 
1500 bytes through without fragmentation.  I can't even ping the interface on 
the radio with a 1501 byte packet with the DF bit set, it requires 
fragmentation.



Thanks,







Brandon Shiers, RF Engineer



937 West Main Street
Riverton, WY 82501



307.857.6704 (o)
307.840.2366 (c)
307.856.1499 (f)
brandon.shi...@cerento.com
[http://www.cerento.com/emailsignatures/logo.jpg][cid:image005.jpg@01D3ACBD.8216E010][cid:image006.jpg@01D3ACBD.8216E010]

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

I think those that go over the public Internet don't have nearly the same 
lineup. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:16:50 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV? 

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this. 

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks, 
_ 

Clint Wiley 
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote: 
> 
> That is not by choice. The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around. RealChoice could drop 
> it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
> caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught. 
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right) over the public internet. Some of them were OK with it. 
> 
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 
> 
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> requirement. 
> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote: 
>> 
>> Hi, 
>> 
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> either provider? 
>> 
>> Thanks, 
>> _ 
>> Clint Wiley 
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Mike Hammett]

Are there any other full-line providers that don't have a private line 
requirement? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Hoppes"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:46:09 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV 

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
requirement. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote: 
> 
> Hi, 
> 
> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, are 
> any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale provider? 
> Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on either 
> provider? 
> 
> Thanks, 
> _ 
> Clint Wiley 
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Layne Sisk]

We do have an OTT option for those that are interested, no locals and no DVR 
but a OTT option for the other channels which can be done via VPN.  

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102




   

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Matt Hoppes
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Also. This makes real Choice an IPTV solution not an OTT solution. 

We need a cost effective OTT solution. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:18, Keefe John  wrote:
> 
> Unless you're getting a short wave most long-distance layer2 connections are 
> going to be MPLS over layer3 anyways.  So how's that different than a VPN or 
> GRE tunnel?
> 
> Keefe
> 
> 
>> On 2/23/2018 3:56 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different tolerance 
>> as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop it and 
>> probably ship the product over the public internet and never get caught, 
>> however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>> 
>> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
>> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
>> (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
>> 
>> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
>> requirement.
>> 
>>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>>> either provider?
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> _
>>> Clint Wiley
>>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>>> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Layne Sisk]

There are 2 types of licensing, MVPD and OTT.  MVPD is closed network only, and 
allows all content to be distributed via that closed network (all locals, all 
content on those locals).  OTT is over the open internet but does not generally 
include the ability to provide all content (some channels are available, some 
are not, some channels black out certain content).  One big difference as well 
is that OTT requires that we sign deals with huge monthly minimums, as much as 
I wish I had the cash that Google and Sony have I simply don't so we decided to 
stick with the MVPD model.  

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102




   

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:17 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the public 
internet, why not RCTV?

Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.

-Original Message-
From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds an 
expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.

Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:
>
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could 
> drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and 
> never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I 
> was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN 
> over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with 
> it.
>
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private 
> line requirement.
>
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If 
>> so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
>> wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, 
>> experiences, etc. on either provider?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Layne Sisk]

I have made that exact argument, to which they say "those are the rules".  

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102




   

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Keefe John
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:18 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Unless you're getting a short wave most long-distance layer2 connections are 
going to be MPLS over layer3 anyways.  So how's that different than a VPN or 
GRE tunnel?

Keefe


On 2/23/2018 3:56 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
> tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could 
> drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and 
> never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get 
> caught.
>
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I 
> was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN 
> over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were 
> OK with it.
>
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private 
> line requirement.
>
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If 
>> so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
>> wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, 
>> experiences, etc. on either provider?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>>

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Matt Hoppes]

Also. This makes real Choice an IPTV solution not an OTT solution. 

We need a cost effective OTT solution. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 17:18, Keefe John  wrote:
> 
> Unless you're getting a short wave most long-distance layer2 connections are 
> going to be MPLS over layer3 anyways.  So how's that different than a VPN or 
> GRE tunnel?
> 
> Keefe
> 
> 
>> On 2/23/2018 3:56 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different tolerance 
>> as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop it and 
>> probably ship the product over the public internet and never get caught, 
>> however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
>> 
>> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
>> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
>> (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
>> 
>> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
>> 
>> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
>> requirement.
>> 
>>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>>> either provider?
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> _
>>> Clint Wiley
>>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
>>> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Keefe John]

Unless you're getting a short wave most long-distance layer2 connections 
are going to be MPLS over layer3 anyways.  So how's that different than 
a VPN or GRE tunnel?


Keefe


On 2/23/2018 3:56 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could 
drop it and probably ship the product over the public internet and 
never get caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get 
caught.


Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I 
was trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN 
over VPN (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were 
OK with it.


-Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private 
line requirement.


On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  
wrote:


Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If 
so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, 
experiences, etc. on either provider?


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Layne Sisk]

Since you can't get support on Gmail from Google there are lots of companies 
springing up that deal specifically with how to get gmail support.  Some of 
them make some pretty substantial cash.  

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102




   

-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 11:54 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

We still see a fair number of support calls from people on G/Yahoo/Hot/ mail.

Email is a dark swirling vortex of confusion.


bp


On 2/23/2018 10:48 AM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
> Maybe some kind of interpreted pressure. We stopped providing it at 
> some point and just had our installers suggest one of the free 
> services and I can't remember anyone ever having an issue with that.
> But in the end to each his own. I just never saw that it did anything 
> but cost me money. Very tiny amounts of direct income from it and 
> absolutely no net profit.

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[chuck]

Well, the are all allowing all the other streamers to deliver it via the 
public internet, why not RCTV?


Does not seem fair to discriminate against the smaller companies like this.

-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley

Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 3:12 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds 
an expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover.


Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet


On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:

That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different 
tolerance as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop 
it and probably ship the product over the public internet and never get 
caught, however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.


Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
(silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.


-Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
requirement.



On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
either provider?


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Clint Wiley]

I agree that a VPN makes plenty of sense. I get why they do it but it adds an 
expense that may take me a good bit of time to recover. 

Thanks,
_

Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 4:56 PM, "ch...@wbmfg.com"  wrote:
> 
> That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different tolerance 
> as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop it and 
> probably ship the product over the public internet and never get caught, 
> however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.
> 
> Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
> trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
> (silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.
> 
> -Original Message- From: Matt Hoppes
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV
> 
> RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
> requirement.
> 
>> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
>> are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
>> provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
>> either provider?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> _
>> Clint Wiley
>> Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[chuck]

That is not by choice.  The content providers all have a different tolerance 
as to how their product is piped around.  RealChoice could drop it and 
probably ship the product over the public internet and never get caught, 
however they risk losing channels if they ever get caught.


Not sure what their current deal is, when I was working with them I was 
trying to get the programmers to allow content via VPN or VLAN over VPN 
(silly, right)  over the public internet.  Some of them were OK with it.


-Original Message- 
From: Matt Hoppes

Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:46 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
requirement.



On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
either provider?


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Matt Hoppes]

RealChoice would be a great option if they would drop their private line 
requirement. 

> On Feb 23, 2018, at 15:39, Clint Wiley  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, are 
> any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale provider? 
> Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on either 
> provider? 
> 
> Thanks,
> _
> Clint Wiley
> Hagerstown Fiber Internet
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Steve Jones]

around that without antennas
SAF changed their distribution model at the beginning of the year though

Im a SAF fan, i love it, i want to marry it and sleep with it in my bed,
other than Mimosa, which is like UBNT non Airfiber line quality, SAF is all
ive messed with in licensed, but its been solid

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:14 PM, Mathew Howard  wrote:

> What did that Integra link end up costing? I'm guessing somewhere around
> $20k?
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:02 PM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> fyi, im bench satisfied with saf integra ws 2+0, 11ghz, 1.2gbps duplex
>> and no latency, thats 4 radios 80mhz channel sets, mix 11ghz and 6ghz you
>> can get aggregate rates if they have the money, the multiple radio/antenna
>> footprints, the money, the channels, the money
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:54 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I am not sure where is the location.. but don't be surprised, the Cell
>>> Co's have been chewing up licensed spectrum like crazy with their LTE
>>> deployments.
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>>
>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> *From: *"Lewis Bergman" 
>>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 1:11:54 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>>
>>> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 so.. here is how things will break down for you 

 to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
 or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain
 fade)
 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and
 will be looking at roughly $15k / link
  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
 $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
 Bridgewave's new radios).

 Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you
 have a few more options
 which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link

 Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
 needed.

 Best of luck.

 Regards.

 Faisal Imtiaz
 Snappy Internet & Telecom
 http://www.snappytelecom.net

 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>

 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
 supp...@snappytelecom.net

 --

 *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
 *To: *"Animal Farm" 
 *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

 Not familiar with this productwill download specs

 Jaime Solorza

 On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:

> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right
> into the ODU if you go all outdoor.
> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>
>
>
> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at
> office...I wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
> wrote:
>
>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
>> ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
>> have a redundant setup.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at
 three locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows 
 resale.  If
 they can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything
 together on a VLAN.

>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
 losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to
> office from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 
> 6.2
> and 9.1 miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span 
> if I
> was using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Mathew Howard]

That's definitely an interesting looking radio... it'll be interesting to
see how they price it. Considering some of the recent specials Bridgewave
has been running on their e-band radios, I wouldn't be surprised if it was
"disruptive".

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:22 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
wrote:

> I am waiting to see how the new Bridgewave company prices the Navigator
> Radio
>
> That is going to be one slick puppy.. and let's hope it is going to be
> priced 'disruptively' !
>
> https://bridgewave.com/navigator/
>
> :)
>
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Mathew Howard" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 4:14:19 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
> What did that Integra link end up costing? I'm guessing somewhere around
> $20k?
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:02 PM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> fyi, im bench satisfied with saf integra ws 2+0, 11ghz, 1.2gbps duplex
>> and no latency, thats 4 radios 80mhz channel sets, mix 11ghz and 6ghz you
>> can get aggregate rates if they have the money, the multiple radio/antenna
>> footprints, the money, the channels, the money
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:54 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I am not sure where is the location.. but don't be surprised, the Cell
>>> Co's have been chewing up licensed spectrum like crazy with their LTE
>>> deployments.
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>>
>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> *From: *"Lewis Bergman" 
>>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 1:11:54 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>>
>>> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 so.. here is how things will break down for you 

 to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
 or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain
 fade)
 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and
 will be looking at roughly $15k / link
  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
 $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
 Bridgewave's new radios).

 Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you
 have a few more options
 which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link

 Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
 needed.

 Best of luck.

 Regards.

 Faisal Imtiaz
 Snappy Internet & Telecom
 http://www.snappytelecom.net

 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>

 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
 supp...@snappytelecom.net

 --

 *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
 *To: *"Animal Farm" 
 *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

 Not familiar with this productwill download specs

 Jaime Solorza

 On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:

> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right
> into the ODU if you go all outdoor.
> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>
>
>
> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at
> office...I wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
> wrote:
>
>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
>> ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
>> have a redundant setup.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at
 three locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer 

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

I also just found out about another outfit called Singularity TV.  I 
have a call with them next week.



-- Original Message --
From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/23/2018 4:36:28 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

I know the RealChoice guys personally.  I trust them.  I was involved 
in the beginning of that product and it was pretty good them.  I am 
sure it is much better now.


-Original Message- From: Clint Wiley
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:39 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If 
so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, 
experiences, etc. on either provider?


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Dave]

Cambium networks PTP820C
I recently certified on it in October.


On 02/23/2018 11:49 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

Not familiar with this productwill download specs

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave" > wrote:


Bang it out with PTP820C ring
Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right
into the ODU if you go all outdoor.
They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.



On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at
office...I wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" > wrote:

If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every
location in a ring topology. A little routing or switch magic
(your preference) and you have a redundant setup.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy
> wrote:

I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy
>
wrote:

CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give
them a gig at three locations.  ISPs are not
eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they can
get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie
everything together on a VLAN.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza
> wrote:

Going to have a meeting with company that has a
1GBps feed to office from CenturyLink.   They
have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60
degree span if I was using a sectored antenna. 
On email, they indicated they want licensed links
and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not
sure if they are adding more CenturyLink feeds to
provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you
guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy
company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern  NM. 
Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
your suggestions?

Jaime Solorza



-- 



--

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[chuck]

I know the RealChoice guys personally.  I trust them.  I was involved in the 
beginning of that product and it was pretty good them.  I am sure it is much 
better now.


-Original Message- 
From: Clint Wiley

Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:39 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, 
are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale 
provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on 
either provider?


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Adam Moffett]

Of the people I've talked to, RealChoice seemed to have their act 
together the best.  I have not talked to Rodeo at all.



-- Original Message --
From: "Keefe John" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 2/23/2018 4:01:42 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV


I'd like to see a YoutubeTV reseller program.  Has anyone inquired?

Keefe


On 2/23/2018 2:39 PM, Clint Wiley wrote:

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If 
so, are any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the 
wholesale provider? Can any of you provide feedback, thoughts, 
experiences, etc. on either provider?


Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[chuck]

+1, never had a problem with 7 miles at 18 GHz.  Even stretched a few to 9 
without big problems (minor rain fade during storms).  

From: Rory Conaway 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:29 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

I would do all the shots less than 7 miles in 18GHz if you can’t get 11GHz.  

 

Rory

 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:39 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

 

For the shorter(4-5 mile) links you could do something like the Siklu EX2500 
with 2' antennas and a hot fall over (This is a licensed feature but its cheap) 
 They also have an antenna with integrated 5GHz so if you were doing the backup 
in 5GHz you could do it all on one antenna.  The backup radio plugs into the 
Siklu and it does the fall over for you so you don't need to do that in routing 
etc.  

 

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:05 PM, Mathew Howard  wrote:

Yeah, if the actual requirements are a full duplex 1 gig link, then it's going 
to be expensive. It sounds like this is all going to be sharing the existing 1 
gig fiber that they already have, so I suspect that it probably doesn't really 
need to be a full gig everywhere... if that's the case, then it can be done a 
lot cheaper, and with a lot less spectrum. An 11ghz radio on a single 80mhz 
channel can do over 600Mbps, and can be had relatively cheap.

The cheapest way to get something that's close enough to a gig that won't 
matter to most people would be using B11's, but that's not full duplex, and it 
would burn up a LOT of spectrum... actually, I'm not sure if it would even be 
possible to run 4 B11 links that close to the same direction, even if the 
entire band is completely clear...

 

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Faisal Imtiaz  
wrote:

so.. here is how things will break down for you 

 

to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..

60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)

or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)

11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will be 
looking at roughly $15k / link

 ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of $12k to 
$15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by Bridgewave's new 
radios).

 

Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have a few 
more options

which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link

 

Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is needed.

 

Best of luck.

 

Regards.

 

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
http://www.snappytelecom.net

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

 




  From: "Jaime Solorza" 
  To: "Animal Farm" 
  Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

  Not familiar with this productwill download specs

  Jaime Solorza

   

  On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:

Bang it out with PTP820C ring 
Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into the 
ODU if you go all outdoor. 
They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.




On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

  That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I 
wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully? 

  Jaime Solorza

   

  On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:

  If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring 
topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a 
redundant setup.

   

  On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:

I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

 

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:

  CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three 
locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they can 
get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together on a 
VLAN.

  On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza 
 wrote:

  Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office 
from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 
miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a 
sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and want 
to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more CenturyLink 
feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Faisal Imtiaz]

I am waiting to see how the new Bridgewave company prices the Navigator Radio 

That is going to be one slick puppy.. and let's hope it is going to be priced 
'disruptively' ! 

https://bridgewave.com/navigator/ 

:) 

Faisal Imtiaz 
Snappy Internet & Telecom 
http://www.snappytelecom.net 

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net 

> From: "Mathew Howard" 
> To: "af" 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 4:14:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

> What did that Integra link end up costing? I'm guessing somewhere around $20k?

> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:02 PM, Steve Jones < thatoneguyst...@gmail.com >
> wrote:

>> fyi, im bench satisfied with saf integra ws 2+0, 11ghz, 1.2gbps duplex and no
>> latency, thats 4 radios 80mhz channel sets, mix 11ghz and 6ghz you can get
>> aggregate rates if they have the money, the multiple radio/antenna 
>> footprints,
>> the money, the channels, the money

>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:54 PM, Faisal Imtiaz < fai...@snappytelecom.net >
>> wrote:

>>> I am not sure where is the location.. but don't be surprised, the Cell Co's 
>>> have
>>> been chewing up licensed spectrum like crazy with their LTE deployments.

>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> http://www.snappytelecom.net

>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

 From: "Lewis Bergman" < lewis.berg...@gmail.com >
 To: af@afmug.com
 Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:11:54 PM
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

 I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz < fai...@snappytelecom.net >
 wrote:

> so.. here is how things will break down for you 

> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
> 60ghz or 80ghz (very short links)
> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will be looking at 
> roughly
> $15k / link
> ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of $12k to $15k may change in 
> depending
> on pricing announcement by Bridgewave's new radios).

> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G (500meg to 800meg) then you have 
> a few
> more options
> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k per link

> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is 
> needed.

> Best of luck.

> Regards.

> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net

> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

>> From: "Jaime Solorza" < losguyswirel...@gmail.com >
>> To: "Animal Farm" < af@afmug.com >
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs

>> Jaime Solorza

>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave" < dmilho...@wletc.com > wrote:

>>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into 
>>> the ODU
>>> if you go all outdoor.
>>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.

>>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

 That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at 
 office...I wonder
 if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

 Jaime Solorza

 On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" < lewis.berg...@gmail.com > 
 wrote:

> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a 
> ring
> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you 
> have a
> redundant setup.

> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > 
> wrote:

>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > 
>> wrote:

>>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at 
>>> three locations.
>>> ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale. If they can 
>>> get that
>>> deal, it would be your best bet. They tie everything together on a 
>>> VLAN.

>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza < 
>>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com >
>>> wrote:

 Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to 
 office from
 CenturyLink. They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 
 9.1 miles )
 from office. All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using 
 a sectored
 antenna. On email, they indicated they want licensed links 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Lewis Bergman]

I'll bet in that micro climate 18G wouldn't work any better at 7 miles than
it would here. I can't get anything reliable over 4.5 miles here on 18G.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:29 PM Rory Conaway  wrote:

> I would do all the shots less than 7 miles in 18GHz if you can’t get
> 11GHz.
>
>
>
> Rory
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Friday, February 23, 2018 12:39 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
>
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
>
>
> For the shorter(4-5 mile) links you could do something like the Siklu
> EX2500 with 2' antennas and a hot fall over (This is a licensed feature but
> its cheap)  They also have an antenna with integrated 5GHz so if you were
> doing the backup in 5GHz you could do it all on one antenna.  The backup
> radio plugs into the Siklu and it does the fall over for you so you don't
> need to do that in routing etc.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:05 PM, Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
>
> Yeah, if the actual requirements are a full duplex 1 gig link, then it's
> going to be expensive. It sounds like this is all going to be sharing the
> existing 1 gig fiber that they already have, so I suspect that it probably
> doesn't really need to be a full gig everywhere... if that's the case, then
> it can be done a lot cheaper, and with a lot less spectrum. An 11ghz radio
> on a single 80mhz channel can do over 600Mbps, and can be had relatively
> cheap.
>
> The cheapest way to get something that's close enough to a gig that won't
> matter to most people would be using B11's, but that's not full duplex, and
> it would burn up a LOT of spectrum... actually, I'm not sure if it would
> even be possible to run 4 B11 links that close to the same direction, even
> if the entire band is completely clear...
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
> wrote:
>
> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>
>
>
> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>
> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
>
> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>
> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will
> be looking at roughly $15k / link
>
>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
> Bridgewave's new radios).
>
>
>
> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have
> a few more options
>
> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>
>
>
> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
> needed.
>
>
>
> Best of luck.
>
>
>
> Regards.
>
>
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
>
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>
> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>
>
> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
>
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:
>
> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
> redundant setup.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>
> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>
> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
> on a VLAN.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from
> CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles
> ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a
> sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and
> want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more
> CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Mathew Howard]

What did that Integra link end up costing? I'm guessing somewhere around
$20k?

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 3:02 PM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> fyi, im bench satisfied with saf integra ws 2+0, 11ghz, 1.2gbps duplex and
> no latency, thats 4 radios 80mhz channel sets, mix 11ghz and 6ghz you can
> get aggregate rates if they have the money, the multiple radio/antenna
> footprints, the money, the channels, the money
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:54 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
> wrote:
>
>> I am not sure where is the location.. but don't be surprised, the Cell
>> Co's have been chewing up licensed spectrum like crazy with their LTE
>> deployments.
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>
>> --
>>
>> *From: *"Lewis Bergman" 
>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 1:11:54 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>
>> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>>>
>>> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>>> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
>>> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>>> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and
>>> will be looking at roughly $15k / link
>>>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
>>> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
>>> Bridgewave's new radios).
>>>
>>> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you
>>> have a few more options
>>> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>>>
>>> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
>>> needed.
>>>
>>> Best of luck.
>>>
>>> Regards.
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>>
>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>>
>>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>>>
 Bang it out with PTP820C ring
 Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
 the ODU if you go all outdoor.
 They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.



 On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

 That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
 wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

 Jaime Solorza

 On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
 wrote:

> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
> ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
> have a redundant setup.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy 
> wrote:
>
>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at
>>> three locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale. 
>>>  If
>>> they can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything
>>> together on a VLAN.
>>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
>>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
 Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to
 office from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 
 6.2
 and 9.1 miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span 
 if I
 was using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want 
 licensed
 links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
 adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
 what
 you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
 outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me 
 with
 your suggestions?

 Jaime Solorza

>>>
 --

>>>
>>
>

[AFMUG] testing

[Dennis Burgess]

Testing outbound.

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Steve Jones]

fyi, im bench satisfied with saf integra ws 2+0, 11ghz, 1.2gbps duplex and
no latency, thats 4 radios 80mhz channel sets, mix 11ghz and 6ghz you can
get aggregate rates if they have the money, the multiple radio/antenna
footprints, the money, the channels, the money

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:54 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
wrote:

> I am not sure where is the location.. but don't be surprised, the Cell
> Co's have been chewing up licensed spectrum like crazy with their LTE
> deployments.
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Lewis Bergman" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 1:11:54 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
> wrote:
>
>> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>>
>> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
>> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will
>> be looking at roughly $15k / link
>>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
>> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
>> Bridgewave's new radios).
>>
>> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have
>> a few more options
>> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>>
>> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
>> needed.
>>
>> Best of luck.
>>
>> Regards.
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>
>> --
>>
>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>
>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>>
>>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
>>> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
>>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>>
>>> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
>>> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
 ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
 have a redundant setup.

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:

> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
> wrote:
>
>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
>> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If 
>> they
>> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything 
>> together
>> on a VLAN.
>>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
>>> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 
>>> 9.1
>>> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
>>> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
>>> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
>>> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
>>> what
>>> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
>>> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
>>> your suggestions?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>
>>> --
>>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Keefe John]

I'd like to see a YoutubeTV reseller program.  Has anyone inquired?

Keefe


On 2/23/2018 2:39 PM, Clint Wiley wrote:

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, are 
any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale provider? Can 
any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on either provider?

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] Bulk upload to ULS for 3.65 registrations

[Steve Jones]

no
last i talked to her, which was some time ago, we do have to put them in,
they spit out a nice little spreadsheet for her. sounds like the system is
export only

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:26 PM, Sean Heskett  wrote:

> Anyone no of a way to bulk upload 3.65 registrations to the ULS??
>
> -Sean
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Faisal Imtiaz]

I am not sure where is the location.. but don't be surprised, the Cell Co's 
have been chewing up licensed spectrum like crazy with their LTE deployments. 

Faisal Imtiaz 
Snappy Internet & Telecom 
http://www.snappytelecom.net 

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net 

> From: "Lewis Bergman" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 1:11:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

> I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.

> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz < fai...@snappytelecom.net >
> wrote:

>> so.. here is how things will break down for you 

>> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>> 60ghz or 80ghz (very short links)
>> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will be looking at 
>> roughly
>> $15k / link
>> ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of $12k to $15k may change in 
>> depending
>> on pricing announcement by Bridgewave's new radios).

>> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G (500meg to 800meg) then you have a 
>> few
>> more options
>> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k per link

>> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is 
>> needed.

>> Best of luck.

>> Regards.

>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> http://www.snappytelecom.net

>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

>>> From: "Jaime Solorza" < losguyswirel...@gmail.com >
>>> To: "Animal Farm" < af@afmug.com >
>>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

>>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs

>>> Jaime Solorza

>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave" < dmilho...@wletc.com > wrote:

 Bang it out with PTP820C ring
 Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into 
 the ODU
 if you go all outdoor.
 They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.

 On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I 
> wonder
> if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

> Jaime Solorza

> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" < lewis.berg...@gmail.com > 
> wrote:

>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
>> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you 
>> have a
>> redundant setup.

>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > wrote:

>>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > 
>>> wrote:

 CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three 
 locations.
 ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale. If they can get 
 that
 deal, it would be your best bet. They tie everything together on a 
 VLAN.

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza < 
 losguyswirel...@gmail.com >
 wrote:

> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office 
> from
> CenturyLink. They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 
> miles )
> from office. All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a 
> sectored
> antenna. On email, they indicated they want licensed links and want 
> to deliver
> 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more CenturyLink 
> feeds to
> provide 1Gig to each site. I wonder what you guys would recommend? I 
> know it's
> a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern NM. Let's say they 
> have good
> budget , dazzle me with your suggestions?

> Jaime Solorza

 --

[AFMUG] RodeoTV vs. RealChoice TV

[Clint Wiley]

Hi,

I wanted to see if any of you are offering IPTV to your customers. If so, are 
any of you using either RodeoTV or RealChoice TV as the wholesale provider? Can 
any of you provide feedback, thoughts, experiences, etc. on either provider? 

Thanks,
_
Clint Wiley
Hagerstown Fiber Internet

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Rory Conaway]

I would do all the shots less than 7 miles in 18GHz if you can’t get 11GHz.

Rory

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:39 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

For the shorter(4-5 mile) links you could do something like the Siklu EX2500 
with 2' antennas and a hot fall over (This is a licensed feature but its cheap) 
 They also have an antenna with integrated 5GHz so if you were doing the backup 
in 5GHz you could do it all on one antenna.  The backup radio plugs into the 
Siklu and it does the fall over for you so you don't need to do that in routing 
etc.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:05 PM, Mathew Howard 
> wrote:
Yeah, if the actual requirements are a full duplex 1 gig link, then it's going 
to be expensive. It sounds like this is all going to be sharing the existing 1 
gig fiber that they already have, so I suspect that it probably doesn't really 
need to be a full gig everywhere... if that's the case, then it can be done a 
lot cheaper, and with a lot less spectrum. An 11ghz radio on a single 80mhz 
channel can do over 600Mbps, and can be had relatively cheap.
The cheapest way to get something that's close enough to a gig that won't 
matter to most people would be using B11's, but that's not full duplex, and it 
would burn up a LOT of spectrum... actually, I'm not sure if it would even be 
possible to run 4 B11 links that close to the same direction, even if the 
entire band is completely clear...

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
> wrote:
so.. here is how things will break down for you 

to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will be 
looking at roughly $15k / link
 ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of $12k to 
$15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by Bridgewave's new 
radios).

Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have a few 
more options
which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link

Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is needed.

Best of luck.

Regards.

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
http://www.snappytelecom.net

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: 
supp...@snappytelecom.net


From: "Jaime Solorza" 
>
To: "Animal Farm" >
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
Not familiar with this productwill download specs
Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave" 
> wrote:
Bang it out with PTP820C ring
Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into the ODU 
if you go all outdoor.
They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.


On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I wonder 
if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
> wrote:
If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring 
topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a 
redundant setup.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy 
> wrote:
I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
> wrote:
CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three 
locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they can 
get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together on a 
VLAN.
On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from 
CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles ) 
from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a sectored 
antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and want to deliver 
1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more CenturyLink feeds to 
provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you guys would recommend?  I know 
it's a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they 
have good budget , dazzle me with your suggestions?

[AFMUG] Bulk upload to ULS for 3.65 registrations

[Sean Heskett]

Anyone no of a way to bulk upload 3.65 registrations to the ULS??

-Sean

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Mathew Howard]

There was a much higher expectation that email would be provided 5-10 years
ago. Now most people don't really care because they're already using
something like gmail and aren't going to use an ISP provided email account
anyway.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:48 PM, Lewis Bergman 
wrote:

> Maybe some kind of interpreted pressure. We stopped providing it at some
> point and just had our installers suggest one of the free services and I
> can't remember anyone ever having an issue with that. But in the end to
> each his own. I just never saw that it did anything but cost me money. Very
> tiny amounts of direct income from it and absolutely no net profit.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:43 PM Paul Stewart 
> wrote:
>
>> That definitely makes it easier when there is no expectation of providing
>> the email service  in most I dealt with, their competition was doing it
>> so there was a certain competitive obligation to do so 
>>
>> On 2018-02-23, 1:19 PM, "Af on behalf of Seth Mattinen" <
>> af-boun...@afmug.com on behalf of se...@rollernet.us> wrote:
>>
>> On 2/23/18 8:22 AM, Paul Stewart wrote:
>> > +1 on that … good systems go a long ways to reduce support calls.
>> I’d
>> > also support another response that says it gets better with scale –
>> if
>> > you have hundreds of users vs 10’s or 100’s of thousands then
>> > perspective on this can change quite a bit especially if you’re
>> > outsourcing.  Every ISP I’ve ever worked for or consulted with ran
>> their
>> > own email infrastructure mainly because it’s an expected service
>> from
>> > the ISP and because of “scales of economy” where they already had
>> staff
>> > in place to support other server related infrastructure and email
>> was a
>> > part of that.
>>
>>
>>
>> I've been running an email service since like 2005-ish. It pretty much
>> runs on autopilot at this point. But if I were starting today I
>> wouldn't
>> bother, and I've never included or offered email with ISP services.
>>
>> ~Seth
>>
>>
>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Carl Peterson]

For the shorter(4-5 mile) links you could do something like the Siklu
EX2500 with 2' antennas and a hot fall over (This is a licensed feature but
its cheap)  They also have an antenna with integrated 5GHz so if you were
doing the backup in 5GHz you could do it all on one antenna.  The backup
radio plugs into the Siklu and it does the fall over for you so you don't
need to do that in routing etc.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 2:05 PM, Mathew Howard  wrote:

> Yeah, if the actual requirements are a full duplex 1 gig link, then it's
> going to be expensive. It sounds like this is all going to be sharing the
> existing 1 gig fiber that they already have, so I suspect that it probably
> doesn't really need to be a full gig everywhere... if that's the case, then
> it can be done a lot cheaper, and with a lot less spectrum. An 11ghz radio
> on a single 80mhz channel can do over 600Mbps, and can be had relatively
> cheap.
>
> The cheapest way to get something that's close enough to a gig that won't
> matter to most people would be using B11's, but that's not full duplex, and
> it would burn up a LOT of spectrum... actually, I'm not sure if it would
> even be possible to run 4 B11 links that close to the same direction, even
> if the entire band is completely clear...
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
> wrote:
>
>> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>>
>> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
>> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
>> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
>> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will
>> be looking at roughly $15k / link
>>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
>> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
>> Bridgewave's new radios).
>>
>> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have
>> a few more options
>> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>>
>> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
>> needed.
>>
>> Best of luck.
>>
>> Regards.
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>>
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>
>> --
>>
>> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
>> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>>
>> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>>
>>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
>>> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
>>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>>
>>> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
>>> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
 ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
 have a redundant setup.

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:

> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy 
> wrote:
>
>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
>> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If 
>> they
>> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything 
>> together
>> on a VLAN.
>>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
>>> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 
>>> 9.1
>>> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
>>> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
>>> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
>>> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
>>> what
>>> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
>>> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
>>> your suggestions?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>
>>> --
>>>
>>
>>
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[chuck]

Gag.  I always hated dealing with DMA controllers.  
I think I have a solution with the gates.  It is old school but I really don’t 
have to have the Pi do anything but insert that one single bit at an 8 Khz rate.

From: Chuck Macenski 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:10 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

Your other option would be to find a way to setup an internal DMA controller to 
trigger off of an external input. From your clock source, you would trigger 
individual DMAs from a static buffer to GPIO connected to some sort of circuit 
to invert the Mark bits. The DMA controller would loop over the buffer and the 
jitter would be limited to that of your 1.544 MHz reference clock source. For 
Raspberry PI, you might be looking at writing a kernel driver/module assuming 
you can find documentation on the CPU and DMA controllers. Might be easier with 
an STM32 like CPU (small, cheap, and potentially Linux free if you are into 
that sort of thing).  



On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:35 AM, Bill Prince  wrote:

  1/4 microsecond is too much jitter?

  I don't think the pi is going to be your solution.


  bp
  


  On 2/22/2018 5:22 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:

I have about 250 nS of jitter on my output signal. 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[Chuck Macenski]

Your other option would be to find a way to setup an internal DMA
controller to trigger off of an external input. From your clock source, you
would trigger individual DMAs from a static buffer to GPIO connected to
some sort of circuit to invert the Mark bits. The DMA controller would loop
over the buffer and the jitter would be limited to that of your 1.544 MHz
reference clock source. For Raspberry PI, you might be looking at writing a
kernel driver/module assuming you can find documentation on the CPU and DMA
controllers. Might be easier with an STM32 like CPU (small, cheap, and
potentially Linux free if you are into that sort of thing).



On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:35 AM, Bill Prince  wrote:

> 1/4 microsecond is too much jitter?
>
> I don't think the pi is going to be your solution.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 2/22/2018 5:22 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>
>> I have about 250 nS of jitter on my output signal.
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Mathew Howard]

Yeah, if the actual requirements are a full duplex 1 gig link, then it's
going to be expensive. It sounds like this is all going to be sharing the
existing 1 gig fiber that they already have, so I suspect that it probably
doesn't really need to be a full gig everywhere... if that's the case, then
it can be done a lot cheaper, and with a lot less spectrum. An 11ghz radio
on a single 80mhz channel can do over 600Mbps, and can be had relatively
cheap.

The cheapest way to get something that's close enough to a gig that won't
matter to most people would be using B11's, but that's not full duplex, and
it would burn up a LOT of spectrum... actually, I'm not sure if it would
even be possible to run 4 B11 links that close to the same direction, even
if the entire band is completely clear...

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
wrote:

> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>
> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will
> be looking at roughly $15k / link
>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
> Bridgewave's new radios).
>
> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have
> a few more options
> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>
> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
> needed.
>
> Best of luck.
>
> Regards.
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>
>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
>> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>
>> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
>> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:
>>
>>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
>>> ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
>>> have a redundant setup.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>>>
 I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:

> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything 
> together
> on a VLAN.
>
 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
>> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 
>> 9.1
>> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
>> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
>> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
>> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
>> what
>> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
>> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
>> your suggestions?
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>
>> --
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Bill Prince]

We still see a fair number of support calls from people on 
G/Yahoo/Hot/ mail.


Email is a dark swirling vortex of confusion.


bp


On 2/23/2018 10:48 AM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
Maybe some kind of interpreted pressure. We stopped providing it at 
some point and just had our installers suggest one of the free 
services and I can't remember anyone ever having an issue with that. 
But in the end to each his own. I just never saw that it did anything 
but cost me money. Very tiny amounts of direct income from it and 
absolutely no net profit.

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Lewis Bergman]

Maybe some kind of interpreted pressure. We stopped providing it at some
point and just had our installers suggest one of the free services and I
can't remember anyone ever having an issue with that. But in the end to
each his own. I just never saw that it did anything but cost me money. Very
tiny amounts of direct income from it and absolutely no net profit.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:43 PM Paul Stewart  wrote:

> That definitely makes it easier when there is no expectation of providing
> the email service  in most I dealt with, their competition was doing it
> so there was a certain competitive obligation to do so 
>
> On 2018-02-23, 1:19 PM, "Af on behalf of Seth Mattinen" <
> af-boun...@afmug.com on behalf of se...@rollernet.us> wrote:
>
> On 2/23/18 8:22 AM, Paul Stewart wrote:
> > +1 on that … good systems go a long ways to reduce support calls.
> I’d
> > also support another response that says it gets better with scale –
> if
> > you have hundreds of users vs 10’s or 100’s of thousands then
> > perspective on this can change quite a bit especially if you’re
> > outsourcing.  Every ISP I’ve ever worked for or consulted with ran
> their
> > own email infrastructure mainly because it’s an expected service from
> > the ISP and because of “scales of economy” where they already had
> staff
> > in place to support other server related infrastructure and email
> was a
> > part of that.
>
>
>
> I've been running an email service since like 2005-ish. It pretty much
> runs on autopilot at this point. But if I were starting today I
> wouldn't
> bother, and I've never included or offered email with ISP services.
>
> ~Seth
>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Paul Stewart]

That definitely makes it easier when there is no expectation of providing the 
email service  in most I dealt with, their competition was doing it so 
there was a certain competitive obligation to do so  

On 2018-02-23, 1:19 PM, "Af on behalf of Seth Mattinen"  wrote:

On 2/23/18 8:22 AM, Paul Stewart wrote:
> +1 on that … good systems go a long ways to reduce support calls.  I’d 
> also support another response that says it gets better with scale – if 
> you have hundreds of users vs 10’s or 100’s of thousands then 
> perspective on this can change quite a bit especially if you’re 
> outsourcing.  Every ISP I’ve ever worked for or consulted with ran their 
> own email infrastructure mainly because it’s an expected service from 
> the ISP and because of “scales of economy” where they already had staff 
> in place to support other server related infrastructure and email was a 
> part of that.



I've been running an email service since like 2005-ish. It pretty much 
runs on autopilot at this point. But if I were starting today I wouldn't 
bother, and I've never included or offered email with ISP services.

~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Seth Mattinen]

On 2/23/18 8:22 AM, Paul Stewart wrote:
+1 on that … good systems go a long ways to reduce support calls.  I’d 
also support another response that says it gets better with scale – if 
you have hundreds of users vs 10’s or 100’s of thousands then 
perspective on this can change quite a bit especially if you’re 
outsourcing.  Every ISP I’ve ever worked for or consulted with ran their 
own email infrastructure mainly because it’s an expected service from 
the ISP and because of “scales of economy” where they already had staff 
in place to support other server related infrastructure and email was a 
part of that.




I've been running an email service since like 2005-ish. It pretty much 
runs on autopilot at this point. But if I were starting today I wouldn't 
bother, and I've never included or offered email with ISP services.


~Seth

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Lewis Bergman]

I bet he won't have any issues with frequencies where he is.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:04 PM Faisal Imtiaz 
wrote:

> so.. here is how things will break down for you 
>
> to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices..
> 60ghz or 80ghz  (very short links)
> or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade)
> 11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will
> be looking at roughly $15k / link
>  ( the pricing on 1G links in the range of
> $12k to $15k may change in depending on pricing announcement by
> Bridgewave's new radios).
>
> Now if the requirements were say sub 1G  (500meg to 800meg) then you have
> a few more options
> which can be in the range of $3k to $7k  per link
>
> Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is
> needed.
>
> Best of luck.
>
> Regards.
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> http://www.snappytelecom.net
>
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <(305)%20663-5518>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 <(305)%20663-5518> Option 2 or Email:
> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Jaime Solorza" 
> *To: *"Animal Farm" 
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...
>
> Not familiar with this productwill download specs
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:
>
>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
>> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>>
>> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
>> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:
>>
>>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a
>>> ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you
>>> have a redundant setup.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>>>
 I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:

> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything 
> together
> on a VLAN.
>
 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
> losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
>> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 
>> 9.1
>> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
>> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
>> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
>> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder 
>> what
>> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
>> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
>> your suggestions?
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>
>> --
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Faisal Imtiaz]

so.. here is how things will break down for you  

to do 1G duplex links, you have a few choices.. 
60ghz or 80ghz (very short links) 
or you do 24ghz (short to medium, depending on rain fade) 
11ghz or 6ghz.. you need to have freq available, and will be looking at roughly 
$15k / link 
( the pricing on 1G links in the range of $12k to $15k may change in depending 
on pricing announcement by Bridgewave's new radios). 

Now if the requirements were say sub 1G (500meg to 800meg) then you have a few 
more options 
which can be in the range of $3k to $7k per link 

Bigger challenge will be finding enough licensed spectrum to do what is needed. 

Best of luck. 

Regards. 

Faisal Imtiaz 
Snappy Internet & Telecom 
http://www.snappytelecom.net 

Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net 

> From: "Jaime Solorza" 
> To: "Animal Farm" 
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 12:49:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

> Not familiar with this productwill download specs

> Jaime Solorza

> On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave" < dmilho...@wletc.com > wrote:

>> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
>> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into the 
>> ODU
>> if you go all outdoor.
>> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.

>> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:

>>> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I 
>>> wonder
>>> if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

>>> Jaime Solorza

>>> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" < lewis.berg...@gmail.com > wrote:

 If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
 topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
 redundant setup.

 On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > wrote:

> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy < jeremysmi...@gmail.com > wrote:

>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three 
>> locations.
>> ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale. If they can get 
>> that
>> deal, it would be your best bet. They tie everything together on a VLAN.

>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza < 
>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com >
>> wrote:

>>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office 
>>> from
>>> CenturyLink. They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 
>>> miles )
>>> from office. All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a 
>>> sectored
>>> antenna. On email, they indicated they want licensed links and want to 
>>> deliver
>>> 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more CenturyLink 
>>> feeds to
>>> provide 1Gig to each site. I wonder what you guys would recommend? I 
>>> know it's
>>> a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern NM. Let's say they 
>>> have good
>>> budget , dazzle me with your suggestions?

>>> Jaime Solorza

>> --

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

Not familiar with this productwill download specs

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:56 AM, "Dave"  wrote:

> Bang it out with PTP820C ring
> Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into
> the ODU if you go all outdoor.
> They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.
>
>
>
> On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
>
> That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
> wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>
> On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:
>
>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
>> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
>> redundant setup.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>>>
 CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
 locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
 can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
 on a VLAN.

>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
 losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what
> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
> your suggestions?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>

> --
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Dave]

Bang it out with PTP820C ring
Most of the switching is now for doing such a thing is built right into 
the ODU if you go all outdoor.

They do make a split unit or an all indoor unit as well.



On 02/23/2018 10:30 AM, Jaime Solorza wrote:
That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at 
office...I wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?


Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman" > wrote:


If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in
a ring topology. A little routing or switch magic (your
preference) and you have a redundant setup.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy > wrote:

I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy
> wrote:

CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a
gig at three locations. ISPs are not eligible, as it no
longer allows resale.  If they can get that deal, it would
be your best bet.  They tie everything together on a VLAN.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza
> wrote:

Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps
feed to office from CenturyLink.   They have four
remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles ) from
office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I
was using a sectored antenna.  On email, they
indicated they want licensed links and want to deliver
1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding
more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site. 
I wonder what you guys would recommend? I know it's a
energy company and Pecan farm outfit in eastern  NM. 
Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with your
suggestions?

Jaime Solorza



--

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

Yes I am considering that as well...I am getting KMZ files later today

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:38 AM, "Mathew Howard"  wrote:

That's a good point... there's also potential that you could have even
shorter links between some of the others... like if the 4.1 an 4.4 mile
joints were actually only .3 miles apart, that opens up all sorts of
options.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:33 AM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> Is this just public connectivity or inner connectivity also? Lewis has the
> right idea, inner connect with redundancies, that 9.1 miles isnt
> necessarily a 9.1 mile shot if there are midpoint in the other facilities.
> ideally it would be 2.9 from the 6.2 joint. staying under 5 miles keeps you
> in happy antennas
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:07 AM, Lewis Bergman 
> wrote:
>
>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
>> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
>> redundant setup.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>>>
 CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
 locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
 can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
 on a VLAN.

>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
 losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what
> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
> your suggestions?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>

>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Mathew Howard]

That's a good point... there's also potential that you could have even
shorter links between some of the others... like if the 4.1 an 4.4 mile
joints were actually only .3 miles apart, that opens up all sorts of
options.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:33 AM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> Is this just public connectivity or inner connectivity also? Lewis has the
> right idea, inner connect with redundancies, that 9.1 miles isnt
> necessarily a 9.1 mile shot if there are midpoint in the other facilities.
> ideally it would be 2.9 from the 6.2 joint. staying under 5 miles keeps you
> in happy antennas
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:07 AM, Lewis Bergman 
> wrote:
>
>> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
>> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
>> redundant setup.
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>>
>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>>>
 CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
 locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
 can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
 on a VLAN.

>>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza <
 losguyswirel...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what
> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
> your suggestions?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>

>

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[Bill Prince]

1/4 microsecond is too much jitter?

I don't think the pi is going to be your solution.


bp


On 2/22/2018 5:22 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
I have about 250 nS of jitter on my output signal. 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Steve Jones]

Is this just public connectivity or inner connectivity also? Lewis has the
right idea, inner connect with redundancies, that 9.1 miles isnt
necessarily a 9.1 mile shot if there are midpoint in the other facilities.
ideally it would be 2.9 from the 6.2 joint. staying under 5 miles keeps you
in happy antennas

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:07 AM, Lewis Bergman 
wrote:

> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
> redundant setup.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>
>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
>>> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
>>> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
>>> on a VLAN.
>>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza >> > wrote:
>>>
 Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
 from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
 miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
 using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
 links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
 adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what
 you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
 outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
 your suggestions?

 Jaime Solorza

>>>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

That is what I was thinking...4 P2P links and tie them in at office...I
wonder if you could colocate 4 11GHz links successfully?

Jaime Solorza

On Feb 23, 2018 9:07 AM, "Lewis Bergman"  wrote:

> If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
> topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
> redundant setup.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:
>
>> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
>>> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
>>> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
>>> on a VLAN.
>>>
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza >> > wrote:
>>>
 Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
 from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
 miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
 using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
 links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
 adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what
 you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
 outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
 your suggestions?

 Jaime Solorza

>>>

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[chuck]

I don’t know verilog or vhdl.  This stuff happened after college.  GALs and 
PALs were just coming on the scene when I stopped making FSM logic machines and 
started using microcontrollers for everything.  

From: Chuck Macenski 
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2018 9:48 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

This calls out for an FPGA solution.

On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 10:45 PM, Forrest Christian (List Account) 
 wrote:

  You can get a fpga board which might be suitable for this project (after 
adding appropriate clocks) for around $20 anymore.   One example: 
http://tinyfpga.com/




  On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 6:42 PM, Lewis Bergman  
wrote:

They aren't cheap but you could always use an fpga.


On Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 7:35 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

  No, I saw it, but I already had the Pi so I ignored it and hoped for the 
best.
  I tried it first with arduino.  Just not enough speed.  And it had the 
jitter problem too.

  I have a method using three TTL/CMOS chips that is going to work... I 
think...

  The only thing separating the gps disciplined signal and the T1 will be a 
D flip flop and a few AND/NAND gates.  So that ought to get me super low 
jitter.  

  Trying for stratum I with rubidium hold-over isochronous performance at 
the end of the day.  For cheap.

  From: Forrest Christian (List Account) 
  Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2018 6:27 PM
  To: af 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

  Ok, I think you missed this portion of my email last time:

  "I'm skeptical that you'll be able to generate a bitstream with enough 
accuracy under Linux, without extreme programming measures.
  I'd suggest a digilent chipkit wifire and the arduino ide for this.  You 
should be able to bitbang at least a T1 with this processor (500mhz)"

  Generally the raspberry pi is great for 'tiny server stuff', or 'user 
interface' stuff, and the arduino and/or microcontrollers will work better for 
what you're looking at, since there isn't an operating system in the way.  All 
arduino really is is a c++ ide with some simplified libraries. 

  The wifire product I mentioned is really a PIC32MZ dev board, optimized 
for arduino.  If you've had enough of the arduino ide, you can download the 
microchip ide and program it with a full development kit.


  Honestly for what you are talking about a EUSART in even a low end PIC 
might be able to handle this.  If you program the EUSART into synchronous mode 
you'll just have to stuff a byte into it every 8 bit times and it will clock it 
out for you.  Not sure if the clock rate is adjustable enough for you, but if 
you get a PIC with the NCO peripheral you might be able to dynamically adjust 
the frequency enough to make it work. 

  NCO app sheet:  
http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/90003131A.pdf




  On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:48 PM,  wrote:

Anyone know how to get my program to run on bare metal?

Or at the very least tell Linux that my program is the most important 
thing in the world and service it above all other things.

I am trying to create a timing signal with the Pi.  It is doing it but 
the jitter is pretty bad.  

I have researched trying to use an interrupt but there is a pretty low 
limit on how many times per second you can fire a hardware interrupt.
Too low for my application.  




  -- 

Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.

Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com

   







  -- 

Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.

Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com

   

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Paul Stewart]

+1 on that … good systems go a long ways to reduce support calls.  I’d also 
support another response that says it gets better with scale – if you have 
hundreds of users vs 10’s or 100’s of thousands then perspective on this can 
change quite a bit especially if you’re outsourcing.  Every ISP I’ve ever 
worked for or consulted with ran their own email infrastructure mainly because 
it’s an expected service from the ISP and because of “scales of economy” where 
they already had staff in place to support other server related infrastructure 
and email was a part of that.

 

Paul

 

 

From: Af  on behalf of Mike Hammett 
Reply-To: 
Date: Friday, February 23, 2018 at 8:47 AM
To: 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

 

Throwing up basic Dovecot and Postfix and that's it on a VM is a bit different 
of a system than if you actually put some care into it.

Put in some time to have a good system and spend less on support.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP



From: "Lewis Bergman" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:42:12 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

Never do your own mail if you don't already do it. Maybe everyone here doing it 
has found some magic solution but I doubt it. As discussed n this thread, the 
users get in the way no matter what your efforts.

I am cynical, but I doubt anyone here is charging enough to make up for even 
the support costs much less the per user fees if not doing it themselves. 
Having said that, I guess you can go tell your users to sod off but I doubt 
many here do that. I could have had 1/5 th the number of support people had I 
not had email. What a pile of steaming poo email is to support. My guess would 
be that you would have to have upwards of 50k paid mailboxes to start to get 
ahead on the expenses. I am not even sure stupid users would even let that work.

I probably tried to provide a higher quality service than anyone should for 
email. Email users, by their own actions, not their words, demand an extremely 
low level of support. Charge enough for the support they demand and they'll go 
elsewhere. They want gmail prices (free) but have someone to call and bug the 
crap out of when they are to stupid or lazy to configure their client no matter 
what it is installed on. I think maybe you just have a call flow that says "if 
you have email trouble push 1, If you ..." When they press one, refer them to a 
web site, tell them the settings, curse at them and hang up. If they call back 
and press 2 or something the tech immediately forwards them to the message they 
would hear if pressing one without saying a word.

I am glad those of you who still do it have figured it out or don't know enough 
about accounting or cost assignment to know how much money you are losing on it.

 

On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 11:28 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

We would probably do our own mail if we had enough emails to get a good enough 
rate at rackspace to get a good enough rate to do email.

Also, if we had some eggs we could have ham and eggs, if we had some ham

 

On Feb 22, 2018 11:23 PM, "Steve Jones"  wrote:

Youre probably on the dame grandfather pricing we are

On Feb 22, 2018 10:54 PM, "Rob Genovesi"  wrote:

That's their retail price.  You can do much better on a wholesale agreement - 
price will probably depend on your quantity.  We got in real early and got a 
very good price that may not be available anymore.

As for tech headaches:  yes we have autodiscover set up and that catches a lot. 
 The biggest headaches are the uber-non technical that are afraid to do 
anything without "professional guidance" (we use that term loosely around here) 
or hacked/disabled accounts that need a password reset.

We use Google Apps internally and I love Gmail - was considering switching to G 
(before they pulled the plug on the ISP edition).  I polled some customers 
about it and we had more than a few customers that were concerned with Google 
getting in their pants.

-Rob

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Steve Jones  wrote:

https://www.rackspace.com/en-us/email-hosting/webmail looks like around 2 bucks 
now

 

On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 11:31 AM, Matt  wrote:

What is the pricing for rackspace email?

 

 

 

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Lewis Bergman]

If budget isn't a problem, I would put up P2P to every location in a ring
topology. A little routing or switch magic (your preference) and you have a
redundant setup.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 10:03 AM Jeremy  wrote:

> I would assume that you can add a fourth location...
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:
>
>> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
>> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
>> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
>> on a VLAN.
>>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office
>>> from CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1
>>> miles ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was
>>> using a sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed
>>> links and want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are
>>> adding more CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what
>>> you guys would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm
>>> outfit in eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with
>>> your suggestions?
>>>
>>> Jaime Solorza
>>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jeremy]

I would assume that you can add a fourth location...

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:00 AM, Jeremy  wrote:

> CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
> locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
> can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
> on a VLAN.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from
>> CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles
>> ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a
>> sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and
>> want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more
>> CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you guys
>> would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in
>> eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with your
>> suggestions?
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jeremy]

CL has an option called Fiber Plus that will give them a gig at three
locations.  ISPs are not eligible, as it no longer allows resale.  If they
can get that deal, it would be your best bet.  They tie everything together
on a VLAN.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:33 AM, Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from
> CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles
> ) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a
> sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and
> want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more
> CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you guys
> would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in
> eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with your
> suggestions?
>
> Jaime Solorza
>

[AFMUG] Question for the collective...

[Jaime Solorza]

Going to have a meeting with company that has a 1GBps feed to office from
CenturyLink.   They have four remote locations (4.1, 4.4, 6.2 and 9.1 miles
) from office.   All are west and with a 60 degree span if I was using a
sectored antenna.  On email, they indicated they want licensed links and
want to deliver 1GBps to each location. Not sure if they are adding more
CenturyLink feeds to provide 1Gig to each site.  I wonder what you guys
would recommend?  I know it's a energy company and Pecan farm outfit in
eastern  NM.  Let's say they have good budget , dazzle me with your
suggestions?

Jaime Solorza

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Joe Novak]

I tend to agree with Lewis, if your not already doing email it's a time
sink.

It's different if you have offered it for years. If your a a new startup
it's probably not worth your time.


Joe

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 8:52 AM, Lewis Bergman 
wrote:

> I ran Magicmail at the end. It was a pretty decent system. I think the
> only way to reduce support costs is just not answer the phone. Maybe 1% of
> our support for email had anything to do with something that could even
> remotely be considered a server issue. It was all stupid user tricks.
>
> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 7:47 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
>> Throwing up basic Dovecot and Postfix and that's it on a VM is a bit
>> different of a system than if you actually put some care into it.
>>
>> Put in some time to have a good system and spend less on support.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>> --
>> *From: *"Lewis Bergman" 
>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 7:42:12 AM
>>
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Email Server
>>
>> Never do your own mail if you don't already do it. Maybe everyone here
>> doing it has found some magic solution but I doubt it. As discussed n this
>> thread, the users get in the way no matter what your efforts.
>> I am cynical, but I doubt anyone here is charging enough to make up for
>> even the support costs much less the per user fees if not doing it
>> themselves. Having said that, I guess you can go tell your users to sod off
>> but I doubt many here do that. I could have had 1/5 th the number of
>> support people had I not had email. What a pile of steaming poo email is to
>> support. My guess would be that you would have to have upwards of 50k paid
>> mailboxes to start to get ahead on the expenses. I am not even sure stupid
>> users would even let that work.
>> I probably tried to provide a higher quality service than anyone should
>> for email. Email users, by their own actions, not their words, demand an
>> extremely low level of support. Charge enough for the support they demand
>> and they'll go elsewhere. They want gmail prices (free) but have someone to
>> call and bug the crap out of when they are to stupid or lazy to configure
>> their client no matter what it is installed on. I think maybe you just have
>> a call flow that says "if you have email trouble push 1, If you ..." When
>> they press one, refer them to a web site, tell them the settings, curse at
>> them and hang up. If they call back and press 2 or something the tech
>> immediately forwards them to the message they would hear if pressing one
>> without saying a word.
>> I am glad those of you who still do it have figured it out or don't know
>> enough about accounting or cost assignment to know how much money you are
>> losing on it.
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 11:28 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> We would probably do our own mail if we had enough emails to get a good
>>> enough rate at rackspace to get a good enough rate to do email.
>>> Also, if we had some eggs we could have ham and eggs, if we had some ham
>>>
>>> On Feb 22, 2018 11:23 PM, "Steve Jones" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Youre probably on the dame grandfather pricing we are

>>> On Feb 22, 2018 10:54 PM, "Rob Genovesi"  wrote:

>>> That's their retail price.  You can do much better on a wholesale
> agreement - price will probably depend on your quantity.  We got in real
> early and got a very good price that may not be available anymore.
>
> As for tech headaches:  yes we have autodiscover set up and that
> catches a lot.  The biggest headaches are the uber-non technical that are
> afraid to do anything without "professional guidance" (we use that term
> loosely around here) or hacked/disabled accounts that need a password 
> reset.
>
> We use Google Apps internally and I love Gmail - was considering
> switching to G (before they pulled the plug on the ISP edition).  I polled
> some customers about it and we had more than a few customers that were
> concerned with Google getting in their pants.
>
> -Rob
>
> On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Steve Jones <
> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Lewis Bergman]

I ran Magicmail at the end. It was a pretty decent system. I think the only
way to reduce support costs is just not answer the phone. Maybe 1% of our
support for email had anything to do with something that could even
remotely be considered a server issue. It was all stupid user tricks.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 7:47 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Throwing up basic Dovecot and Postfix and that's it on a VM is a bit
> different of a system than if you actually put some care into it.
>
> Put in some time to have a good system and spend less on support.
>
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Lewis Bergman" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, February 23, 2018 7:42:12 AM
>
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Email Server
>
> Never do your own mail if you don't already do it. Maybe everyone here
> doing it has found some magic solution but I doubt it. As discussed n this
> thread, the users get in the way no matter what your efforts.
> I am cynical, but I doubt anyone here is charging enough to make up for
> even the support costs much less the per user fees if not doing it
> themselves. Having said that, I guess you can go tell your users to sod off
> but I doubt many here do that. I could have had 1/5 th the number of
> support people had I not had email. What a pile of steaming poo email is to
> support. My guess would be that you would have to have upwards of 50k paid
> mailboxes to start to get ahead on the expenses. I am not even sure stupid
> users would even let that work.
> I probably tried to provide a higher quality service than anyone should
> for email. Email users, by their own actions, not their words, demand an
> extremely low level of support. Charge enough for the support they demand
> and they'll go elsewhere. They want gmail prices (free) but have someone to
> call and bug the crap out of when they are to stupid or lazy to configure
> their client no matter what it is installed on. I think maybe you just have
> a call flow that says "if you have email trouble push 1, If you ..." When
> they press one, refer them to a web site, tell them the settings, curse at
> them and hang up. If they call back and press 2 or something the tech
> immediately forwards them to the message they would hear if pressing one
> without saying a word.
> I am glad those of you who still do it have figured it out or don't know
> enough about accounting or cost assignment to know how much money you are
> losing on it.
>
> On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 11:28 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> We would probably do our own mail if we had enough emails to get a good
>> enough rate at rackspace to get a good enough rate to do email.
>> Also, if we had some eggs we could have ham and eggs, if we had some ham
>>
>> On Feb 22, 2018 11:23 PM, "Steve Jones" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Youre probably on the dame grandfather pricing we are
>>>
>> On Feb 22, 2018 10:54 PM, "Rob Genovesi"  wrote:
>>>
>> That's their retail price.  You can do much better on a wholesale
 agreement - price will probably depend on your quantity.  We got in real
 early and got a very good price that may not be available anymore.

 As for tech headaches:  yes we have autodiscover set up and that
 catches a lot.  The biggest headaches are the uber-non technical that are
 afraid to do anything without "professional guidance" (we use that term
 loosely around here) or hacked/disabled accounts that need a password 
 reset.

 We use Google Apps internally and I love Gmail - was considering
 switching to G (before they pulled the plug on the ISP edition).  I polled
 some customers about it and we had more than a few customers that were
 concerned with Google getting in their pants.

 -Rob

 On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Steve Jones  wrote:

> https://www.rackspace.com/en-us/email-hosting/webmail looks like
> around 2 bucks now
>
> On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 11:31 AM, Matt 
> wrote:
>
>> What is the pricing for rackspace email?
>>
>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[Mike Hammett]

I'm newly in charge of a Metaswitch environment as well. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Chuck McCown"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:48:19 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 




Yes, and one would think that Metaswitch would have a 10 MHz input. 




From: Lewis Bergman 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:44 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 


Every Rubidium GPS timing piece of gear I have ever seen outputs 10MHz. Every 
device that I have ever seen that takes a timing signal requires 10MHz. I 
probably have lead a sheltered life but I haven't seen anything else. 


On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:06 AM Robert < i...@avantwireless.com > wrote: 


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECos 

On 2/22/18 5:52 PM, Chuck McCown wrote: 
> That looks great. Did not find a cost anywhere. 
> *From:* Bill Prince 
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 6:47 PM 
> *To:* Motorola III 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 
> Try this: http://www.ecoscentric.com/news/press-170314.shtml 
> 
> --bp 
> -- 
> bp 
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com 
> On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:56 PM, Bill Prince < part15...@gmail.com > wrote: 
> 
> Pretty sure you need RTOS to accomplish this.That will get pretty 
> close to bare metal. 
> 
> -bp 
> -- 
> bp 
> part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com 
> On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:36 PM, < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
> 
> Had the command syntax wrong. 
> But got nice to work. Have to sudo if you use negative nice 
> numbers. 
> It made zero difference in my jitter. I went from 19 to –20 on 
> nice and no change. 
> *From:* ch...@wbmfg.com 
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:29 PM 
> *To:* af@afmug.com 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 
> The problem is there is a crap ton of stuff out there that needs 
> network sync. And it all has a T1 as an input. 
> But most T1 trunking circuits are getting replaced with SIP. 
> So, I am building a cheap and dirty T1 signal generator that is 
> GPS and rhubidium referenced. The hard part is easy. The easy 
> part should be easy but all the T1 framing chips that used to 
> exist no longer exist. 
> The ones that are out there have massive CPU interfaces and tons 
> of registers that need to get set to get them fired up and 
> running 
> Where is Exar when you need them 
> *From:* Adam Moffett 
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:21 PM 
> *To:* af@afmug.com 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 
> Tell whoever's got the T1 that 1967 is way behind us and get a 
> new interface. 
> Problem eliminated LOL 
> -- Original Message -- 
> From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Sent: 2/22/2018 6:16:45 PM 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 
>> I have to generate an alternate mark inversion signal on 1.544 
>> MHz with every 193rd bit following a t1 framing sequence. 
>> Sure wish a 555 could do that. 
>> *From:* Dave 
>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:10 PM 
>> *To:* af@afmug.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 
>> Find a 555 timer ... I used many in the olden day when 
>> radioshacks were king LOL! 
>> 
>> 
>> On 02/22/2018 05:05 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: 
>>> I am thinking of using some shift registers instead of using 
>>> the PI output directly as the timing signal. 
>>> Use the PI to load them. 
>>> I love me some hardware design anyhow 
>>> *From:* Colin Stanners 
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 3:59 PM 
>>> *To:* af@afmug.com 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI 
>>> Other than setting the process priority, you may need a 
>>> custom kernel. See 
>>> https://medium.com/@metebalci/latency-of-raspberry-pi-3-on-standard-and-real-time-linux-4-9-kernel-2d9c20704495
>>>  
>>> < 
>>> https://medium.com/@metebalci/latency-of-raspberry-pi-3-on-standard-and-real-time-linux-4-9-kernel-2d9c20704495
>>>  > 
>>> 
>>> On Feb 22, 2018 4:48 PM, < ch...@wbmfg.com > wrote: 
>>> 
>>> Anyone know how to get my program to run on bare metal? 
>>> Or at the very least tell Linux that my program is the 
>>> most important thing in the world and service it above 
>>> all other things. 
>>> I am trying to create a timing signal with the Pi. It is 
>>> doing it but the jitter is pretty bad. 
>>> I have researched trying to use an interrupt but there is 
>>> a pretty low limit on how many times per second you can 
>>> fire a hardware interrupt. 
>>> Too low for my application. 
>> 
>> -- 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[Chuck McCown]

Yes, and one would think that Metaswitch would have a 10 MHz input.  

From: Lewis Bergman 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:44 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

Every Rubidium GPS timing piece of gear I have ever seen outputs 10MHz. Every 
device that I have ever seen that takes a timing signal requires 10MHz. I 
probably have lead a sheltered life but I haven't seen anything else.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:06 AM Robert  wrote:

  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECos

  On 2/22/18 5:52 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
  > That looks great.  Did not find a cost anywhere.
  > *From:* Bill Prince
  > *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 6:47 PM
  > *To:* Motorola III
  > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
  > Try this: http://www.ecoscentric.com/news/press-170314.shtml
  >
  > --bp
  > --
  > bp
  > part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
  > On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:56 PM, Bill Prince  wrote:
  >
  > Pretty sure you need  RTOS to accomplish this.That will get pretty
  > close to bare metal.
  >
  > -bp
  > --
  > bp
  > part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
  > On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:36 PM,  wrote:
  >
  > Had the command syntax wrong.
  > But got nice to work.  Have to sudo if you use negative nice
  > numbers.
  > It made zero difference in my jitter.  I went from 19 to –20 on
  > nice and no change.
  > *From:* ch...@wbmfg.com
  > *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:29 PM
  > *To:* af@afmug.com
  > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
  > The problem is there is a crap ton of stuff out there that needs
  > network sync.  And it all has a T1 as an input.
  > But most T1 trunking circuits are getting replaced with SIP.
  > So, I am building a cheap and dirty T1 signal generator that is
  > GPS and rhubidium referenced.  The hard part is easy.  The easy
  > part should be easy but all the T1 framing chips that used to
  > exist no longer exist.
  > The ones that are out there have massive CPU interfaces and tons
  > of registers that need to get set to get them fired up and
  > running
  > Where is Exar when you need them
  > *From:* Adam Moffett
  > *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:21 PM
  > *To:* af@afmug.com
  > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
  > Tell whoever's got the T1 that 1967 is way behind us and get a
  > new interface.
  > Problem eliminated LOL
  > -- Original Message --
  > From: ch...@wbmfg.com
  > To: af@afmug.com
  > Sent: 2/22/2018 6:16:45 PM
  > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
  >> I have to generate an alternate mark inversion signal on 1.544
  >> MHz with every 193rd bit following a t1 framing sequence.
  >> Sure wish a 555 could do that.
  >> *From:* Dave
  >> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:10 PM
  >> *To:* af@afmug.com
  >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
  >> Find a 555 timer ... I used many in the olden day when
  >> radioshacks were king LOL!
  >>
  >>
  >> On 02/22/2018 05:05 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
  >>> I am thinking of using some shift registers instead of using
  >>> the PI output directly as the timing signal.
  >>> Use the PI to load them.
  >>> I love me some hardware design anyhow
  >>> *From:* Colin Stanners
  >>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 3:59 PM
  >>> *To:* af@afmug.com
  >>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
  >>> Other than setting the process priority, you may need a
  >>> custom kernel. See
  >>> 
https://medium.com/@metebalci/latency-of-raspberry-pi-3-on-standard-and-real-time-linux-4-9-kernel-2d9c20704495
  >>> 

  >>>
  >>> On Feb 22, 2018 4:48 PM,  wrote:
  >>>
  >>> Anyone know how to get my program to run on bare metal?
  >>> Or at the very least tell Linux that my program is the
  >>> most important thing in the world and service it above
  >>> all other things.
  >>> I am trying to create a timing signal with the Pi.  It is
  >>> doing it but the jitter is pretty bad.
  >>> I have researched trying to use an interrupt but there is
  >>> a pretty low limit on how many times per second you can
  >>> fire a hardware interrupt.
  >>> Too low for my application.
  >>
  >> --
  >

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Mike Hammett]

Throwing up basic Dovecot and Postfix and that's it on a VM is a bit different 
of a system than if you actually put some care into it. 

Put in some time to have a good system and spend less on support. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Lewis Bergman"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:42:12 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Email Server 


Never do your own mail if you don't already do it. Maybe everyone here doing it 
has found some magic solution but I doubt it. As discussed n this thread, the 
users get in the way no matter what your efforts. 
I am cynical, but I doubt anyone here is charging enough to make up for even 
the support costs much less the per user fees if not doing it themselves. 
Having said that, I guess you can go tell your users to sod off but I doubt 
many here do that. I could have had 1/5 th the number of support people had I 
not had email. What a pile of steaming poo email is to support. My guess would 
be that you would have to have upwards of 50k paid mailboxes to start to get 
ahead on the expenses. I am not even sure stupid users would even let that 
work. 
I probably tried to provide a higher quality service than anyone should for 
email. Email users, by their own actions, not their words, demand an extremely 
low level of support. Charge enough for the support they demand and they'll go 
elsewhere. They want gmail prices (free) but have someone to call and bug the 
crap out of when they are to stupid or lazy to configure their client no matter 
what it is installed on. I think maybe you just have a call flow that says "if 
you have email trouble push 1, If you ..." When they press one, refer them to a 
web site, tell them the settings, curse at them and hang up. If they call back 
and press 2 or something the tech immediately forwards them to the message they 
would hear if pressing one without saying a word. 
I am glad those of you who still do it have figured it out or don't know enough 
about accounting or cost assignment to know how much money you are losing on 
it. 


On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 11:28 PM Steve Jones < thatoneguyst...@gmail.com > 
wrote: 



We would probably do our own mail if we had enough emails to get a good enough 
rate at rackspace to get a good enough rate to do email. 
Also, if we had some eggs we could have ham and eggs, if we had some ham 




On Feb 22, 2018 11:23 PM, "Steve Jones" < thatoneguyst...@gmail.com > wrote: 





Youre probably on the dame grandfather pricing we are 







On Feb 22, 2018 10:54 PM, "Rob Genovesi" < r...@corp.coastside.net > wrote: 












That's their retail price. You can do much better on a wholesale agreement - 
price will probably depend on your quantity. We got in real early and got a 
very good price that may not be available anymore. 


As for tech headaches: yes we have autodiscover set up and that catches a lot. 
The biggest headaches are the uber-non technical that are afraid to do anything 
without "professional guidance" (we use that term loosely around here) or 
hacked/disabled accounts that need a password reset. 


We use Google Apps internally and I love Gmail - was considering switching to G 
(before they pulled the plug on the ISP edition). I polled some customers about 
it and we had more than a few customers that were concerned with Google getting 
in their pants. 


-Rob 



On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Steve Jones < thatoneguyst...@gmail.com > 
wrote: 



https://www.rackspace.com/en-us/email-hosting/webmail looks like around 2 bucks 
now 



On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 11:31 AM, Matt < matt.mailingli...@gmail.com > wrote: 



What is the pricing for rackspace email? 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[Chuck McCown]

O, I was googling for cheap fpga but did not find anything that cheap.

From: Forrest Christian (List Account) 
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2018 9:45 PM
To: af 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

You can get a fpga board which might be suitable for this project (after adding 
appropriate clocks) for around $20 anymore.   One example: http://tinyfpga.com/




On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 6:42 PM, Lewis Bergman  wrote:

  They aren't cheap but you could always use an fpga.


  On Thu, Feb 22, 2018, 7:35 PM Chuck McCown  wrote:

No, I saw it, but I already had the Pi so I ignored it and hoped for the 
best.
I tried it first with arduino.  Just not enough speed.  And it had the 
jitter problem too.

I have a method using three TTL/CMOS chips that is going to work... I 
think...

The only thing separating the gps disciplined signal and the T1 will be a D 
flip flop and a few AND/NAND gates.  So that ought to get me super low jitter.  

Trying for stratum I with rubidium hold-over isochronous performance at the 
end of the day.  For cheap.

From: Forrest Christian (List Account) 
Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2018 6:27 PM
To: af 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

Ok, I think you missed this portion of my email last time:

"I'm skeptical that you'll be able to generate a bitstream with enough 
accuracy under Linux, without extreme programming measures.
I'd suggest a digilent chipkit wifire and the arduino ide for this.  You 
should be able to bitbang at least a T1 with this processor (500mhz)"

Generally the raspberry pi is great for 'tiny server stuff', or 'user 
interface' stuff, and the arduino and/or microcontrollers will work better for 
what you're looking at, since there isn't an operating system in the way.  All 
arduino really is is a c++ ide with some simplified libraries. 

The wifire product I mentioned is really a PIC32MZ dev board, optimized for 
arduino.  If you've had enough of the arduino ide, you can download the 
microchip ide and program it with a full development kit.


Honestly for what you are talking about a EUSART in even a low end PIC 
might be able to handle this.  If you program the EUSART into synchronous mode 
you'll just have to stuff a byte into it every 8 bit times and it will clock it 
out for you.  Not sure if the clock rate is adjustable enough for you, but if 
you get a PIC with the NCO peripheral you might be able to dynamically adjust 
the frequency enough to make it work. 

NCO app sheet:  http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/90003131A.pdf




On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:48 PM,  wrote:

  Anyone know how to get my program to run on bare metal?

  Or at the very least tell Linux that my program is the most important 
thing in the world and service it above all other things.

  I am trying to create a timing signal with the Pi.  It is doing it but 
the jitter is pretty bad.  

  I have researched trying to use an interrupt but there is a pretty low 
limit on how many times per second you can fire a hardware interrupt.
  Too low for my application.  




-- 

  Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.

  Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
  forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com

 







-- 

  Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.

  Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
  forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com

 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI

[Lewis Bergman]

Every Rubidium GPS timing piece of gear I have ever seen outputs 10MHz.
Every device that I have ever seen that takes a timing signal requires
10MHz. I probably have lead a sheltered life but I haven't seen anything
else.

On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 12:06 AM Robert  wrote:

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECos
>
> On 2/22/18 5:52 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
> > That looks great.  Did not find a cost anywhere.
> > *From:* Bill Prince
> > *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 6:47 PM
> > *To:* Motorola III
> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
> > Try this: http://www.ecoscentric.com/news/press-170314.shtml
> >
> > --bp
> > --
> > bp
> > part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
> > On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:56 PM, Bill Prince 
> wrote:
> >
> > Pretty sure you need  RTOS to accomplish this.That will get pretty
> > close to bare metal.
> >
> > -bp
> > --
> > bp
> > part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com
> > On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 3:36 PM,  wrote:
> >
> > Had the command syntax wrong.
> > But got nice to work.  Have to sudo if you use negative nice
> > numbers.
> > It made zero difference in my jitter.  I went from 19 to –20 on
> > nice and no change.
> > *From:* ch...@wbmfg.com
> > *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:29 PM
> > *To:* af@afmug.com
> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
> > The problem is there is a crap ton of stuff out there that needs
> > network sync.  And it all has a T1 as an input.
> > But most T1 trunking circuits are getting replaced with SIP.
> > So, I am building a cheap and dirty T1 signal generator that is
> > GPS and rhubidium referenced.  The hard part is easy.  The easy
> > part should be easy but all the T1 framing chips that used to
> > exist no longer exist.
> > The ones that are out there have massive CPU interfaces and tons
> > of registers that need to get set to get them fired up and
> > running
> > Where is Exar when you need them
> > *From:* Adam Moffett
> > *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:21 PM
> > *To:* af@afmug.com
> > *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
> > Tell whoever's got the T1 that 1967 is way behind us and get a
> > new interface.
> > Problem eliminated LOL
> > -- Original Message --
> > From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> > To: af@afmug.com
> > Sent: 2/22/2018 6:16:45 PM
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
> >> I have to generate an alternate mark inversion signal on 1.544
> >> MHz with every 193rd bit following a t1 framing sequence.
> >> Sure wish a 555 could do that.
> >> *From:* Dave
> >> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:10 PM
> >> *To:* af@afmug.com
> >> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
> >> Find a 555 timer ... I used many in the olden day when
> >> radioshacks were king LOL!
> >>
> >>
> >> On 02/22/2018 05:05 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> >>> I am thinking of using some shift registers instead of using
> >>> the PI output directly as the timing signal.
> >>> Use the PI to load them.
> >>> I love me some hardware design anyhow
> >>> *From:* Colin Stanners
> >>> *Sent:* Thursday, February 22, 2018 3:59 PM
> >>> *To:* af@afmug.com
> >>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Raspberry PI
> >>> Other than setting the process priority, you may need a
> >>> custom kernel. See
> >>>
> https://medium.com/@metebalci/latency-of-raspberry-pi-3-on-standard-and-real-time-linux-4-9-kernel-2d9c20704495
> >>> <
> https://medium.com/@metebalci/latency-of-raspberry-pi-3-on-standard-and-real-time-linux-4-9-kernel-2d9c20704495
> >
> >>>
> >>> On Feb 22, 2018 4:48 PM,  wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Anyone know how to get my program to run on bare metal?
> >>> Or at the very least tell Linux that my program is the
> >>> most important thing in the world and service it above
> >>> all other things.
> >>> I am trying to create a timing signal with the Pi.  It is
> >>> doing it but the jitter is pretty bad.
> >>> I have researched trying to use an interrupt but there is
> >>> a pretty low limit on how many times per second you can
> >>> fire a hardware interrupt.
> >>> Too low for my application.
> >>
> >> --
> >
>

Re: [AFMUG] Email Server

[Lewis Bergman]

Never do your own mail if you don't already do it. Maybe everyone here
doing it has found some magic solution but I doubt it. As discussed n this
thread, the users get in the way no matter what your efforts.
I am cynical, but I doubt anyone here is charging enough to make up for
even the support costs much less the per user fees if not doing it
themselves. Having said that, I guess you can go tell your users to sod off
but I doubt many here do that. I could have had 1/5 th the number of
support people had I not had email. What a pile of steaming poo email is to
support. My guess would be that you would have to have upwards of 50k paid
mailboxes to start to get ahead on the expenses. I am not even sure stupid
users would even let that work.
I probably tried to provide a higher quality service than anyone should for
email. Email users, by their own actions, not their words, demand an
extremely low level of support. Charge enough for the support they demand
and they'll go elsewhere. They want gmail prices (free) but have someone to
call and bug the crap out of when they are to stupid or lazy to configure
their client no matter what it is installed on. I think maybe you just have
a call flow that says "if you have email trouble push 1, If you ..." When
they press one, refer them to a web site, tell them the settings, curse at
them and hang up. If they call back and press 2 or something the tech
immediately forwards them to the message they would hear if pressing one
without saying a word.
I am glad those of you who still do it have figured it out or don't know
enough about accounting or cost assignment to know how much money you are
losing on it.

On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 11:28 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> We would probably do our own mail if we had enough emails to get a good
> enough rate at rackspace to get a good enough rate to do email.
> Also, if we had some eggs we could have ham and eggs, if we had some ham
>
> On Feb 22, 2018 11:23 PM, "Steve Jones"  wrote:
>
>> Youre probably on the dame grandfather pricing we are
>>
> On Feb 22, 2018 10:54 PM, "Rob Genovesi"  wrote:
>>
> That's their retail price.  You can do much better on a wholesale
>>> agreement - price will probably depend on your quantity.  We got in real
>>> early and got a very good price that may not be available anymore.
>>>
>>> As for tech headaches:  yes we have autodiscover set up and that catches
>>> a lot.  The biggest headaches are the uber-non technical that are afraid to
>>> do anything without "professional guidance" (we use that term loosely
>>> around here) or hacked/disabled accounts that need a password reset.
>>>
>>> We use Google Apps internally and I love Gmail - was considering
>>> switching to G (before they pulled the plug on the ISP edition).  I polled
>>> some customers about it and we had more than a few customers that were
>>> concerned with Google getting in their pants.
>>>
>>> -Rob
>>>
>>> On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 https://www.rackspace.com/en-us/email-hosting/webmail looks like
 around 2 bucks now

 On Wed, Feb 21, 2018 at 11:31 AM, Matt 
 wrote:

> What is the pricing for rackspace email?
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Leatherman

[Jason McKemie]

It's not a Gerber or a Leatherman (although I've had both of those), but
I've had a couple Kershaw combo edge knives and have nothing but good
things to say about them other than I lose them when I'm drunk.  The speed
safe feature is awesome.


Virus-free.
www.avast.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

On Thu, Feb 22, 2018 at 10:06 PM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> Ive seen alot of variants, closest in quality was my buddies gerber.
> I never was satisfied with a pocket knife, then again i never had the
> skill my dad has with his old timer as a multitool.
> I think most people whos old man carried a single pocket knife only used
> it one time and didnt give it back for his pocket. Usually a pretty painful
> lesson to learn.
>
> On Feb 22, 2018 9:51 PM, "Jaime Solorza" 
> wrote:
>
>> I have an Old Timer that is about 24 years old and I got it used...I
>> appreciate quality toolsI have lost every Leatherman within months of
>> buying one...
>>
>> Jaime Solorza
>>
>> On Feb 22, 2018 8:48 PM, "Steve Jones"  wrote:
>>
>>> I just finally retired my supertool 300, its been healthily beaten. This
>>> harsh sexy beast sacrifices many bits of iyself. So i picked up a wingman
>>> because a little bit less weight and i miss scissors from my first one.
>>> Plus its got a belt clip, the pouch on the supertool was worn and broken
>>> for over a year before i gave in and relegated to tool to my pocket to live
>>> with my tool.
>>> So i was looking at the warranty on the wingman, turns out thes bad
>>> mothers sport a 25 year warranty... 25 years.
>>>
>>> Its like getting a do over with my best friend knowing the supertool may
>>> get another ride on the pony. When it gets home i may have a party for it.
>>> This thing has installed and repaired a measurable percentage of the
>>> network. If i had tear ducts instead of hate valves, id do that wet eye
>>> shit that sallys do.
>>>
>>