Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

Agree 100%

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:45 PM Forrest Christian (List Account) <
li...@packetflux.com> wrote:

> You also avoid some of the issues with questionable quality/potency, and
> the related poisioning/overdose deaths.
>
> If one was to redirect all of the funds spent on the war on drugs (law
> enforcement, prisons, etc) into mental health, rehabilitation and
> education, I think we'd be far better off.
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> That's... That's not at all how it works in the models I'm talking about.
>>
>> You make it 100% legal, and remove the stigma. You provide safe places to
>> get supplies and mental health care.
>>
>> This largely removes the drug market all together (crashes it), making it
>> not a viable thing to sell (better opportunity elsewhere).
>>
>> It also has the highest treatment success rate for overcoming hard drug
>> addiction (mental health care + kratom).
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:13 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> decriminalizing maintains the control, keeps people limited to user
>>> amounts only, doesnt turn a junkie into a felon whose life is effectively
>>> over, but the drug dealers can still be put in prison where they go.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:58 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's
 product that is... Ahem tax free.

 It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also
 regulating it.

 It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!

 You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of
 mushrooms you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.

 This is all so stupid.

 ... But hey, D.A.R.E.

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
 wrote:

> I like pissing off cartels
>
> I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
> secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of
>> a child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>>
>> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
>> home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms 
>> or
>> MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
>> business is that?
>>
>> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or
>> to feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
>> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
>> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>>
>> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> theres no shortage of criminals
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds >> > wrote:
>>>
 I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and
 Portugal, but how would our for-profit prison system, police and 
 federal
 law enforcement get money?

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones <
 thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the
> brain, the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical
> (dopamine i think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its 
> actually
> that first use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon,
> people are seeking to replicate that first high but never can because 
> the
> physiologic change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> That's Fake News.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
>>> permanently
>>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug,
>>> and why
>>> it's so addictive.
>>>
>>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.
>>> I like
>>> > those too much.
>>> >
>>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and
>>> they are
>>> >> dissolved in hot water...

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Forrest Christian (List Account)]

You also avoid some of the issues with questionable quality/potency, and
the related poisioning/overdose deaths.

If one was to redirect all of the funds spent on the war on drugs (law
enforcement, prisons, etc) into mental health, rehabilitation and
education, I think we'd be far better off.




On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
wrote:

> That's... That's not at all how it works in the models I'm talking about.
>
> You make it 100% legal, and remove the stigma. You provide safe places to
> get supplies and mental health care.
>
> This largely removes the drug market all together (crashes it), making it
> not a viable thing to sell (better opportunity elsewhere).
>
> It also has the highest treatment success rate for overcoming hard drug
> addiction (mental health care + kratom).
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:13 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> decriminalizing maintains the control, keeps people limited to user
>> amounts only, doesnt turn a junkie into a felon whose life is effectively
>> over, but the drug dealers can still be put in prison where they go.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:58 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's
>>> product that is... Ahem tax free.
>>>
>>> It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also
>>> regulating it.
>>>
>>> It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!
>>>
>>> You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of
>>> mushrooms you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.
>>>
>>> This is all so stupid.
>>>
>>> ... But hey, D.A.R.E.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I like pissing off cartels

 I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
 secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of
> a child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>
> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
> home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or
> MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
> business is that?
>
> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to
> feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>
> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> theres no shortage of criminals
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal,
>>> but how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law
>>> enforcement get money?
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the
 brain, the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical
 (dopamine i think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its 
 actually
 that first use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon,
 people are seeking to replicate that first high but never can because 
 the
 physiologic change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> That's Fake News.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke 
> wrote:
>
>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
>> permanently
>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug,
>> and why
>> it's so addictive.
>>
>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.
>> I like
>> > those too much.
>> >
>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and
>> they are
>> >> dissolved in hot water...
>> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
>> >>
>> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
>> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
>> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

Alcohol wasn't just made 100% illegal, first driving up demand, but then it
was made legal to 18 and then 21 year olds to where it became the "gateway
to cool".

Oh, and it's fucking advertised on everything.

I'm not saying we could get rid of alcohol or any drug completely, but
there are a lot of things we can do by making them legal and providing
treatment to throw a wrench in the cartels, drive down demand, and actually
start saving people and families - right now we just throw them in jail.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:25 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> worked great for alcoholism and you cant even get black market moonshine
> now...oh wait
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 11:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> That's... That's not at all how it works in the models I'm talking about.
>>
>> You make it 100% legal, and remove the stigma. You provide safe places to
>> get supplies and mental health care.
>>
>> This largely removes the drug market all together (crashes it), making it
>> not a viable thing to sell (better opportunity elsewhere).
>>
>> It also has the highest treatment success rate for overcoming hard drug
>> addiction (mental health care + kratom).
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:13 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> decriminalizing maintains the control, keeps people limited to user
>>> amounts only, doesnt turn a junkie into a felon whose life is effectively
>>> over, but the drug dealers can still be put in prison where they go.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:58 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's
 product that is... Ahem tax free.

 It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also
 regulating it.

 It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!

 You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of
 mushrooms you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.

 This is all so stupid.

 ... But hey, D.A.R.E.

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
 wrote:

> I like pissing off cartels
>
> I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
> secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of
>> a child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>>
>> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
>> home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms 
>> or
>> MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
>> business is that?
>>
>> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or
>> to feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
>> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
>> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>>
>> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> theres no shortage of criminals
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds >> > wrote:
>>>
 I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and
 Portugal, but how would our for-profit prison system, police and 
 federal
 law enforcement get money?

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones <
 thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the
> brain, the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical
> (dopamine i think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its 
> actually
> that first use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon,
> people are seeking to replicate that first high but never can because 
> the
> physiologic change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> That's Fake News.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
>>> permanently
>>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug,
>>> and why
>>> it's so addictive.
>>>
>>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

worked great for alcoholism and you cant even get black market moonshine
now...oh wait

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 11:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
wrote:

> That's... That's not at all how it works in the models I'm talking about.
>
> You make it 100% legal, and remove the stigma. You provide safe places to
> get supplies and mental health care.
>
> This largely removes the drug market all together (crashes it), making it
> not a viable thing to sell (better opportunity elsewhere).
>
> It also has the highest treatment success rate for overcoming hard drug
> addiction (mental health care + kratom).
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:13 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> decriminalizing maintains the control, keeps people limited to user
>> amounts only, doesnt turn a junkie into a felon whose life is effectively
>> over, but the drug dealers can still be put in prison where they go.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:58 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's
>>> product that is... Ahem tax free.
>>>
>>> It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also
>>> regulating it.
>>>
>>> It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!
>>>
>>> You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of
>>> mushrooms you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.
>>>
>>> This is all so stupid.
>>>
>>> ... But hey, D.A.R.E.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I like pissing off cartels

 I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
 secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of
> a child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>
> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
> home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or
> MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
> business is that?
>
> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to
> feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>
> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> theres no shortage of criminals
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal,
>>> but how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law
>>> enforcement get money?
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the
 brain, the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical
 (dopamine i think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its 
 actually
 that first use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon,
 people are seeking to replicate that first high but never can because 
 the
 physiologic change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> That's Fake News.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke 
> wrote:
>
>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
>> permanently
>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug,
>> and why
>> it's so addictive.
>>
>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.
>> I like
>> > those too much.
>> >
>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and
>> they are
>> >> dissolved in hot water...
>> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
>> >>
>> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
>> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
>> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,
>> Henry
>> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
>> >>
>> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is
>> horribly
>> >> addictive and ruins everyone that 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

That's... That's not at all how it works in the models I'm talking about.

You make it 100% legal, and remove the stigma. You provide safe places to
get supplies and mental health care.

This largely removes the drug market all together (crashes it), making it
not a viable thing to sell (better opportunity elsewhere).

It also has the highest treatment success rate for overcoming hard drug
addiction (mental health care + kratom).


On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 11:13 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> decriminalizing maintains the control, keeps people limited to user
> amounts only, doesnt turn a junkie into a felon whose life is effectively
> over, but the drug dealers can still be put in prison where they go.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:58 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's
>> product that is... Ahem tax free.
>>
>> It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also
>> regulating it.
>>
>> It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!
>>
>> You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of mushrooms
>> you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.
>>
>> This is all so stupid.
>>
>> ... But hey, D.A.R.E.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I like pissing off cartels
>>>
>>> I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
>>> secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of a
 child, or risking life/limb of another person.

 Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
 home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or
 MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
 business is that?

 Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to
 feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
 people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
 talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.

 Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.



 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
 wrote:

> theres no shortage of criminals
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal,
>> but how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law
>> enforcement get money?
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain,
>>> the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical 
>>> (dopamine i
>>> think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that 
>>> first
>>> use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
>>> seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the 
>>> physiologic
>>> change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 That's Fake News.

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke 
 wrote:

> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
> permanently
> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug,
> and why
> it's so addictive.
>
> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I
> like
> > those too much.
> >
> > Chuck McCown wrote:
> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they
> are
> >> dissolved in hot water...
> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
> >>
> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,
> Henry
> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
> >>
> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience
> with that
> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
> >>
> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

decriminalizing maintains the control, keeps people limited to user amounts
only, doesnt turn a junkie into a felon whose life is effectively over, but
the drug dealers can still be put in prison where they go.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:58 PM, Josh Reynolds 
wrote:

> If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's
> product that is... Ahem tax free.
>
> It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also
> regulating it.
>
> It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!
>
> You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of mushrooms
> you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.
>
> This is all so stupid.
>
> ... But hey, D.A.R.E.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> I like pissing off cartels
>>
>> I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
>> secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of a
>>> child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>>>
>>> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
>>> home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or
>>> MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
>>> business is that?
>>>
>>> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to
>>> feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
>>> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
>>> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>>>
>>> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 theres no shortage of criminals

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal,
> but how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law
> enforcement get money?
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain,
>> the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine 
>> i
>> think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that 
>> first
>> use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
>> seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the 
>> physiologic
>> change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> That's Fake News.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>>>
 I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
 permanently
 alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and
 why
 it's so addictive.

 On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
 > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I
 like
 > those too much.
 >
 > Chuck McCown wrote:
 >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they
 are
 >> dissolved in hot water...
 >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
 >>
 >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
 >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
 >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,
 Henry
 >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
 >>
 >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
 >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
 >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with
 that
 >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
 >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
 >>
 >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
 >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into
 her
 >> vertebrae).
 >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
 >>
 >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
 >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
 >> To: af@afmug.com
 >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
 >>
 >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound
 like fun
 >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I
 know about
 >> bath salts are the videos I've 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

If you legalize but tax, there still can be room for a competitor's product
that is... Ahem tax free.

It's a slipper slope, because if you are taxing it, you are also regulating
it.

It's crazy ... We allow alcohol but ban weed. Alcohol is disasterous!

You can sell homeopathic snake oil, but if you have a couple of mushrooms
you found under cowshit in a field you can go to prison.

This is all so stupid.

... But hey, D.A.R.E.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 10:43 PM Steve Jones 
wrote:

> I like pissing off cartels
>
> I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a
> secondary effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of a
>> child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>>
>> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming
>> home and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or
>> MDA to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's
>> business is that?
>>
>> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to
>> feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
>> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
>> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>>
>> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> theres no shortage of criminals
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal,
 but how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law
 enforcement get money?

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
 wrote:

> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain,
> the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine i
> think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that first
> use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
> seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the physiologic
> change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> That's Fake News.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>>
>>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
>>> permanently
>>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and
>>> why
>>> it's so addictive.
>>>
>>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I
>>> like
>>> > those too much.
>>> >
>>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they
>>> are
>>> >> dissolved in hot water...
>>> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
>>> >>
>>> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
>>> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
>>> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,
>>> Henry
>>> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
>>> >>
>>> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
>>> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
>>> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with
>>> that
>>> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
>>> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
>>> >>
>>> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
>>> >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into
>>> her
>>> >> vertebrae).
>>> >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
>>> >>
>>> >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
>>> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
>>> >> To: af@afmug.com
>>> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>>> >>
>>> >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound
>>> like fun
>>> >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know
>>> about
>>> >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>>> >>
>>> >> Steve Jones wrote:
>>> >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax,
>>> 16
>>> >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
>>> >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of
>>> meth
>>> >>> charges.
>>> >>> fucking bath salts
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

I like pissing off cartels

I always preferred decriminalization to legalization, maintains a secondary
effective tax to offset the byproduct cost in treatment, etc.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 10:27 PM, Josh Reynolds 
wrote:

> Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of a
> child, or risking life/limb of another person.
>
> Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming home
> and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or MDA
> to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's business
> is that?
>
> Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to
> feel something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let
> people get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to
> talk to someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.
>
> Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> theres no shortage of criminals
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal, but
>>> how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law enforcement
>>> get money?
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain,
 the molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine i
 think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that first
 use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
 seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the physiologic
 change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> That's Fake News.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
>> permanently
>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and
>> why
>> it's so addictive.
>>
>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I
>> like
>> > those too much.
>> >
>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they
>> are
>> >> dissolved in hot water...
>> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
>> >>
>> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
>> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
>> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,
>> Henry
>> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
>> >>
>> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
>> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
>> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with
>> that
>> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
>> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
>> >>
>> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
>> >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into
>> her
>> >> vertebrae).
>> >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
>> >>
>> >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
>> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
>> >> To: af@afmug.com
>> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>> >>
>> >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound
>> like fun
>> >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know
>> about
>> >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>> >>
>> >> Steve Jones wrote:
>> >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16
>> >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
>> >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of
>> meth
>> >>> charges.
>> >>> fucking bath salts
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > >>> > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that
>> Every
>> >>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or
>> paraphernalia
>> >>> in it.
>> >>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble
>> become
>> >>> demented.
>> >>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not
>> meant
>> >>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
>> >>> truth to that.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

Decriminalize drugs except in the event of endangering the welfare of a
child, or risking life/limb of another person.

Drugs are a personal choice. If Jimbo isn't hurting anybody by coming home
and the end of a day and smoking a joint, or maybe using mushrooms or MDA
to help overcome emotional trauma, or for religious reasons, who's business
is that?

Hard drugs are often done to escape inward or to damage onesself or to feel
something or just... Feel. The root problem is mental health. Let people
get clean needles in a controlled setting and give them access to talk to
someone. It's had amazing effects in those mentioned contries.

Oh yeah, it'll right piss off the cartels too.



On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 9:47 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> theres no shortage of criminals
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal, but
>> how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law enforcement
>> get money?
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain, the
>>> molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine i
>>> think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that first
>>> use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
>>> seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the physiologic
>>> change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 That's Fake News.

 On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
> permanently
> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and
> why
> it's so addictive.
>
> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I
> like
> > those too much.
> >
> > Chuck McCown wrote:
> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are
> >> dissolved in hot water...
> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
> >>
> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken,
> Henry
> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
> >>
> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with
> that
> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
> >>
> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
> >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into
> her
> >> vertebrae).
> >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
> >>
> >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
> >> To: af@afmug.com
> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
> >>
> >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like
> fun
> >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know
> about
> >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
> >>
> >> Steve Jones wrote:
> >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16
> >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
> >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth
> >>> charges.
> >>> fucking bath salts
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that
> Every
> >>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or
> paraphernalia
> >>> in it.
> >>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble
> become
> >>> demented.
> >>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not
> meant
> >>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
> >>> truth to that.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>  I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal
> with
>  almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
>  enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells
> me
>  that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they
> put at
>  about 80% with the 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services

[Steve Jones]

openfire has AD, for free

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 12:28 PM, Layne Sisk  wrote:

> We have been using RIOT, it works much like Slack but doesn’t cost an arm
> and a leg to get the one function we needed (Active Directory).
>
>
>
> Layne Sisk
>
> ServerPlus
>
> 801.426.8283, ext 102
>
> [image: New logo xl] 
>
> [image: http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
>
> [image: http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
> 
>
> [image: http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
> 
>
> [image: Utah 100]   [image: fast50-01][image: Inc 5000]
>
>
>
> *From:* Af  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 9:25 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services
>
>
>
> I rhought it was eol, but still there good for talking to the kid though
> when hes upstairs, fun video
>
>
>
> On Sat, Apr 14, 2018, 1:56 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
> The app is dog shit and only getting worse.
>
>
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
>
> *From: *"Steve Jones" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, April 13, 2018 10:14:03 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services
>
> i use hangouts to communicate with my boy, its handy
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 9:04 PM, Brian Webster 
> wrote:
>
>
> One to consider is Google Voice.
>
> You sign up for a free phone number account but it also has a chat client.
> Can be app based on the phone or browser based as well. One nice feature of
> the Google Voice chat is that you can also be texting/chatting with mobile
> users just like texting between phones. Make conversations, with those in
> the office easier because they don't have to use their phone, they can be
> on the computer using a full keyboard. Supports full MMS, pictures,
> hyperlinks etc. There is a chrome plugin as well. Side benefit is that is
> have the voice/phone features including voicemail and voicemail to text
> transcription, call screening and call forwarding based on rules or no
> answer conditions.
>
> Still is the evil empire and them tracking al that you do so there is that
> drawback
>
> https://voice.google.com
>
>
> Thank You,
> Brian Webster
> www.wirelessmapping.com
> www.Broadband-Mapping.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Nate Burke
> Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2018 3:26 PM
> To: Animal Farm
>
> Subject: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services
>
> With the demise of AIM, and not being on any social media sites, what's
> available for Instant messaging apps these days?  Basically so I can send
> the boss Hyperlinks without having to do everything through email
> while we're on an intercom call.It looks like Trillian.im offers a
> service that is ad free for $2/user/mo  But I thought I saw that there was
> a $10 minimum somewhere.
>
> Nate
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

theres no shortage of criminals

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal, but
> how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law enforcement
> get money?
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain, the
>> molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine i
>> think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that first
>> use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
>> seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the physiologic
>> change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds  wrote:
>>
>>> That's Fake News.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>>>
 I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once,
 permanently
 alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and why
 it's so addictive.

 On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
 > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like
 > those too much.
 >
 > Chuck McCown wrote:
 >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are
 >> dissolved in hot water...
 >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
 >>
 >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
 >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
 >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry
 >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
 >>
 >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
 >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
 >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with
 that
 >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
 >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
 >>
 >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
 >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her
 >> vertebrae).
 >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
 >>
 >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
 >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
 >> To: af@afmug.com
 >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
 >>
 >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like
 fun
 >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know
 about
 >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
 >>
 >> Steve Jones wrote:
 >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16
 >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
 >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth
 >>> charges.
 >>> fucking bath salts
 >>>
 >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave >> > wrote:
 >>>
 >>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that
 Every
 >>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or
 paraphernalia
 >>> in it.
 >>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble
 become
 >>> demented.
 >>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not
 meant
 >>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
 >>> truth to that.
 >>>
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
  I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal
 with
  almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
  enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
  that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put
 at
  about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that
 should
  probably be castrated upon a verdict.
 
  On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:
 
  I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took
 the
  kids in (her sister�s kids).
  Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
  One of the parents got them back for a while, then the
 other.
  Those kids still think of my wife as �mom�.  They are
 all
  grown up with grandkids of their own now.
  One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not
 turned
  out so well.
  The world needs standup guys like you.
  *From:* Steve Jones
  

Re: [AFMUG] Chicago-Area UBNT USG

[Jon Lee]

I'm not in IL but I could overnight one (too late today) I'm in AZ.

-Jon
Off-Grid Networks


On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 4:49 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Yes.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Josh Reynolds" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:48:02 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Chicago-Area UBNT USG
>
>
> You talking about ye olden USG? Little square thing?
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:25 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
>> If any of you in the Chicago area have an available UBNT USG, let me
>> know. I opened up mine today for a demo tomorrow and it's dead.
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>
>


-- 
Jon Lee
Off-Grid Networks
c.928.793.2972

Re: [AFMUG] Chicago-Area UBNT USG

[Mike Hammett]

Yes. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Josh Reynolds"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:48:02 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Chicago-Area UBNT USG 


You talking about ye olden USG? Little square thing? 


On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:25 PM Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 




If any of you in the Chicago area have an available UBNT USG, let me know. I 
opened up mine today for a demo tomorrow and it's dead. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

Re: [AFMUG] Chicago-Area UBNT USG

[Josh Reynolds]

You talking about ye olden USG? Little square thing?

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:25 PM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> If any of you in the Chicago area have an available UBNT USG, let me know.
> I opened up mine today for a demo tomorrow and it's dead.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

I wish we would treat drugs here like they do in Spain and Portugal, but
how would our for-profit prison system, police and federal law enforcement
get money?

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:42 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain, the
> molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine i
> think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that first
> use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
> seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the physiologic
> change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds  wrote:
>
>> That's Fake News.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>>
>>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once, permanently
>>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and why
>>> it's so addictive.
>>>
>>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like
>>> > those too much.
>>> >
>>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are
>>> >> dissolved in hot water...
>>> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
>>> >>
>>> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
>>> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
>>> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry
>>> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
>>> >>
>>> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
>>> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
>>> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that
>>> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
>>> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
>>> >>
>>> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
>>> >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her
>>> >> vertebrae).
>>> >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
>>> >>
>>> >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
>>> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
>>> >> To: af@afmug.com
>>> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>>> >>
>>> >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like
>>> fun
>>> >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know
>>> about
>>> >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>>> >>
>>> >> Steve Jones wrote:
>>> >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16
>>> >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
>>> >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth
>>> >>> charges.
>>> >>> fucking bath salts
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave >> >>> > wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that
>>> Every
>>> >>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or
>>> paraphernalia
>>> >>> in it.
>>> >>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble
>>> become
>>> >>> demented.
>>> >>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
>>> >>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
>>> >>> truth to that.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>>>  I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
>>>  almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
>>>  enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
>>>  that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put
>>> at
>>>  about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
>>>  probably be castrated upon a verdict.
>>> 
>>>  On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown >>  > wrote:
>>> 
>>>  I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
>>>  kids in (her sister�s kids).
>>>  Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
>>>  One of the parents got them back for a while, then the
>>> other.
>>>  Those kids still think of my wife as �mom�.  They are
>>> all
>>>  grown up with grandkids of their own now.
>>>  One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
>>>  out so well.
>>>  The world needs standup guys like you.
>>>  *From:* Steve Jones
>>>  *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
>>>  *To:* af@afmug.com
>>>  *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>>>  You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like
>>> 7
>>>  years ago we took in 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

Thats heroin that permantly alters the opoid receptors in the brain, the
molecule is slightly larger than the normal brain chemical (dopamine i
think) its replacing, so the receptor is enlarged. Its actually that first
use that is why doing heroin is called chasing the dragon, people are
seeking to replicate that first high but never can because the physiologic
change only happens once so its like chasing a dragon

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 6:18 PM Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> That's Fake News.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:
>
>> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once, permanently
>> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and why
>> it's so addictive.
>>
>> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
>> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like
>> > those too much.
>> >
>> > Chuck McCown wrote:
>> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are
>> >> dissolved in hot water...
>> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
>> >>
>> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
>> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
>> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry
>> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
>> >>
>> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
>> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
>> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that
>> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
>> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
>> >>
>> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
>> >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her
>> >> vertebrae).
>> >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
>> >>
>> >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
>> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
>> >> To: af@afmug.com
>> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>> >>
>> >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
>> >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
>> >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>> >>
>> >> Steve Jones wrote:
>> >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16
>> >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
>> >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth
>> >>> charges.
>> >>> fucking bath salts
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > >>> > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
>> >>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
>> >>> in it.
>> >>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
>> >>> demented.
>> >>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
>> >>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
>> >>> truth to that.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>>  I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
>>  almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
>>  enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
>>  that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
>>  about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
>>  probably be castrated upon a verdict.
>> 
>>  On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown >  > wrote:
>> 
>>  I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
>>  kids in (her sister�s kids).
>>  Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
>>  One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
>>  Those kids still think of my wife as �mom�.  They are all
>>  grown up with grandkids of their own now.
>>  One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
>>  out so well.
>>  The world needs standup guys like you.
>>  *From:* Steve Jones
>>  *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
>>  *To:* af@afmug.com
>>  *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>>  You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
>>  years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
>>  fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
>>  fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
>>  momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
>>  at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
>>  with some shoes with the 

[AFMUG] Chicago-Area UBNT USG

[Mike Hammett]

If any of you in the Chicago area have an available UBNT USG, let me know. I 
opened up mine today for a demo tomorrow and it's dead. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

That's Fake News.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 2:21 PM Nate Burke  wrote:

> I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once, permanently
> alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and why
> it's so addictive.
>
> On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
> > Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like
> > those too much.
> >
> > Chuck McCown wrote:
> >> If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are
> >> dissolved in hot water...
> >> Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.
> >>
> >> I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
> >> Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
> >> (I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry
> >> Winehards Private Reserve...)
> >>
> >> Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly
> >> addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
> >> I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that
> >> either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.
> >> Coke Zero does that enough for me.
> >>
> >> My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries
> >> (decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her
> >> vertebrae).
> >> But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.
> >>
> >> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
> >> To: af@afmug.com
> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
> >>
> >> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
> >> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
> >> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
> >>
> >> Steve Jones wrote:
> >>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16
> >>> doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts.
> >>> other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth
> >>> charges.
> >>> fucking bath salts
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave  >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
> >>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
> >>> in it.
> >>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
> >>> demented.
> >>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
> >>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
> >>> truth to that.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>  I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
>  almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
>  enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
>  that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
>  about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
>  probably be castrated upon a verdict.
> 
>  On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown   > wrote:
> 
>  I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
>  kids in (her sister�s kids).
>  Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
>  One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
>  Those kids still think of my wife as �mom�.  They are all
>  grown up with grandkids of their own now.
>  One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
>  out so well.
>  The world needs standup guys like you.
>  *From:* Steve Jones
>  *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
>  *To:* af@afmug.com
>  *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>  You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
>  years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
>  fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
>  fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
>  momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
>  at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
>  with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
>  locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
>  his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
>  was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
>  understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
>  never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
>  least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
>  a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
>  Finally got these boys shaped up 

Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz Licensed Link best power and Rx Sensitivity

[George Skorup]

Have a coordinator tell you how much power you can run on the path 
before you decide to buy gear. You might be limited to the typical 
14-20dBm Tx power due to other paths/licensees.


A Radiowaves HP2-18 is 38dBi. We have a 2.5 mile Exalt ExtendAir G2-18 
link with that at both ends. +19dBm Tx power at 40MHz/256QAM. -35dBm 
RSL. Rarely drops out in the rain.


On 4/17/2018 5:50 PM, SmarterBroadband wrote:


We are looking to install a couple of 18GHz License Links and are 
restricted to 2 foot antennas. Therefore I need the best output power 
and Rx sensitivity available today.


Both Dragonwave and Bridgewave are touting HP versions but neither 
will be available for months.�� Maybe longer.


So what is available off the shelf today? I am checking vendors spec 
sheets but If you know of a higher powered radio please let me know.


Thanks

Adam

Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz Licensed Link best power and Rx Sensitivity

[Eric Kuhnke]

Absolute highest power?  I think there is an Aviat 18 GHz radio that is
something like +24 Tx power before you add the dish gain. Won't be cheap.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 3:50 PM, SmarterBroadband  wrote:

> We are looking to install a couple of 18GHz License Links and are
> restricted to 2 foot antennas.   Therefore I need the best output power and
> Rx sensitivity available today.
>
>
>
> Both Dragonwave and Bridgewave are touting HP versions but neither will be
> available for months.   Maybe longer.
>
>
>
> So what is available off the shelf today?   I am checking vendors spec
> sheets but If you know of a higher powered radio please let me know.
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Adam
>

[AFMUG] 18GHz Licensed Link best power and Rx Sensitivity

[SmarterBroadband]

We are looking to install a couple of 18GHz License Links and are restricted
to 2 foot antennas.   Therefore I need the best output power and Rx
sensitivity available today.

 

Both Dragonwave and Bridgewave are touting HP versions but neither will be
available for months.   Maybe longer.

 

So what is available off the shelf today?   I am checking vendors spec
sheets but If you know of a higher powered radio please let me know.

 

Thanks

 

Adam

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Sterling Jacobson]

Well, that’s possible I guess, but it’s a real PITA to configure and keep 
straight.

I mean, you got to keep it tight until it hits the actual router interface, and 
I have at least two points of VRRP entry into each bank of switches.

It’s just much simpler to do static MAC/IP assignments in the DHCP server and 
lock the switches down with snooping and broadcast controls.

Works well, just need to optimize the settings.

From: Af  On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 3:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

If you are doing fiber with active ethernet, why not just run QinQ with a CVLAN 
for each port and an SVLAN back to wherever?

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 4:40 PM, Dave 
> wrote:
OMG!
 what a broadcast nightmare :)

On 04/17/2018 11:49 AM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:
Well, I’m using 48 port or more switches attached to each other, so I need 
something to limit it.

The switches typically limit ingress per port, so a low limiter should only 
affect the devices behind that port if one of the devices storm out.

I do have DHCP snooping, but that doesn’t necessarily block other types of bad 
traffic like that.

One thing I have to be careful of is to not broadly limit the uplink ports as 
well.

From: Af  On Behalf Of Adam 
Moffett
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

Exactly what I was thinking.

Is it a global setting for the switch or an ingress limit per port?  If you can 
limit it per port then something like 5pps should be plenty.  They only need to 
ARP their default gateway and send a DHCP discover...anything else is surplus 
garbage. But If it's a global limit then someone sending garbage could prevent 
everybody else's ARP from working.

I may not be thinking clearly but doesn't port isolation address the risk of 
broadcast storms? You allow one path from the customer's access port to the 
uplink port.  Any broadcast traffic is received only at the router port which 
will only respond to the ones that matter and ignore the rest.

I recognize there are reasons to not like PPPoE, but PPPoE is another way to 
address it.  You configure the switch to discard anything from an access port 
that is not PPPoE.



-- Original Message --
From: "Forrest Christian (List Account)" 
>
To: "af" >
Sent: 4/17/2018 3:01:18 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more devices 
would permit filtering such that the only broadcasts/multicasts permitted on 
customer facing segments were ARP and possibly DCHP if that's applicable to you.

If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value is likely as 
low as you can set it.

If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the ramifications 
where a low level broadcast storm saturates the setting you have set and 
prevents arp and dhcp from working

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
> wrote:
What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second storm control on 
your switches/devices?

I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets

Is 100pps too low?

Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request type traffic?



--
Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.
Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | 
http://www.packetflux.com
[https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/linkedin.png]
 [https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/facebook.png] 
  
[https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/twitter.png] 




--
[cid:image001.jpg@01D3D66B.96ECEA70]



--

Carl Peterson

PORT NETWORKS

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Jaime Solorza]

My favorite is ChuckUFarley

Jaime Solorza

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 3:53 PM Dave  wrote:

> LOL
> dont give the bad guys any ideas plz :)
>
>
> On 04/17/2018 12:26 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>
> Cheap routers plugged in here and there to announce goofy SSIDs could be a
> whole lot of fun/chaos/alarm...
>
> ISIS Unit 1
>
> ANFO Detonator #1
>
> SARAN Release Valve Controller
>
> Hello NSA, just joking around here...
>
> *From:* Chris Fabien
> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 11:23 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> This is about 20 min from us yea it really happened!
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
>> ODD NEWS
>>
>> Name of Wi-Fi network prompts gym evacuation
>>
>> Saginaw Township, Mich.
>>
>> • A Michigan gym patron looking for a Wi-Fi connection found one named
>> “remote detonator,” prompting an evacuation and precautionary search of the
>> facility by a bomb-sniffing dog. The Saginaw News reported nothing was
>> found in the search Sunday at Planet Fitness in Saginaw Township, about 85
>> miles northwest of Detroit. Saginaw Township police Chief Donald Pussehl
>> says the patron brought the Wi-Fi connection’s name to the attention of a
>> manager, who evacuated the building and called police. The gym was closed
>> for about three hours as police responded. Pussehl says there’s “no crime
>> or threat,” so no charges are expected. He notes people often have odd
>> names for Wi-Fi connections. Planet Fitness says the manager was following
>> company procedure for when there’s suspicion about a safety issue.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Dave]

LOL
dont give the bad guys any ideas plz :)


On 04/17/2018 12:26 PM, Chuck McCown wrote:
Cheap routers plugged in here and there to announce goofy SSIDs could 
be a whole lot of fun/chaos/alarm...

ISIS Unit 1
ANFO Detonator #1
SARAN Release Valve Controller
Hello NSA, just joking around here...
*From:* Chris Fabien
*Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 11:23 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
This is about 20 min from us yea it really happened!
On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

ODD NEWS
Name of Wi-Fi network prompts gym evacuation
Saginaw Township, Mich.
• A Michigan gym patron looking for a Wi-Fi connection found one
named “remote detonator,” prompting an evacuation and
precautionary search of the facility by a bomb-sniffing dog. The
Saginaw News reported nothing was found in the search Sunday at
Planet Fitness in Saginaw Township, about 85 miles northwest of
Detroit. Saginaw Township police Chief Donald Pussehl says the
patron brought the Wi-Fi connection’s name to the attention of a
manager, who evacuated the building and called police. The gym was
closed for about three hours as police responded. Pussehl says
there’s “no crime or threat,” so no charges are expected. He notes
people often have odd names for Wi-Fi connections. Planet Fitness
says the manager was following company procedure for when there’s
suspicion about a safety issue.



--

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Adam Moffett]

Interesting thought.

-- Original Message --
From: "Carl Peterson" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 4/17/2018 5:23:39 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

If you are doing fiber with active ethernet, why not just run QinQ with 
a CVLAN for each port and an SVLAN back to wherever?


On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 4:40 PM, Dave  wrote:

OMG!
 what a broadcast nightmare :)


On 04/17/2018 11:49 AM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:
Well, I’m using 48 port or more switches attached to each other, so I 
need something to limit it.




The switches typically limit ingress per port, so a low limiter 
should only affect the devices behind that port if one of the devices 
storm out.




I do have DHCP snooping, but that doesn’t necessarily block other 
types of bad traffic like that.




One thing I have to be careful of is to not broadly limit the uplink 
ports as well.




From: Af  On 
Behalf Of Adam Moffett

Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:29 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control



Exactly what I was thinking.



Is it a global setting for the switch or an ingress limit per port?  
If you can limit it per port then something like 5pps should be 
plenty.  They only need to ARP their default gateway and send a DHCP 
discover...anything else is surplus garbage. But If it's a global 
limit then someone sending garbage could prevent everybody else's ARP 
from working.




I may not be thinking clearly but doesn't port isolation address the 
risk of broadcast storms? You allow one path from the customer's 
access port to the uplink port.  Any broadcast traffic is received 
only at the router port which will only respond to the ones that 
matter and ignore the rest.




I recognize there are reasons to not like PPPoE, but PPPoE is another 
way to address it.  You configure the switch to discard anything from 
an access port that is not PPPoE.








-- Original Message --

From: "Forrest Christian (List Account)" 

To: "af" 

Sent: 4/17/2018 3:01:18 AM

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control



I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more 
devices would permit filtering such that the only 
broadcasts/multicasts permitted on customer facing segments were ARP 
and possibly DCHP if that's applicable to you.




If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value is 
likely as low as you can set it.




If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the 
ramifications where a low level broadcast storm saturates the 
setting you have set and prevents arp and dhcp from working




On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
 wrote:


What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second 
storm control on your switches/devices?


I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets

Is 100pps too low?

Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request 
type traffic?








--

Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.

Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602

forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com

  
  





--




--
Carl Peterson

PORT NETWORKS

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Carl Peterson]

If you are doing fiber with active ethernet, why not just run QinQ with a
CVLAN for each port and an SVLAN back to wherever?

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 4:40 PM, Dave  wrote:

> OMG!
>  what a broadcast nightmare :)
>
>
> On 04/17/2018 11:49 AM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:
>
> Well, I’m using 48 port or more switches attached to each other, so I need
> something to limit it.
>
>
>
> The switches typically limit ingress per port, so a low limiter should
> only affect the devices behind that port if one of the devices storm out.
>
>
>
> I do have DHCP snooping, but that doesn’t necessarily block other types of
> bad traffic like that.
>
>
>
> One thing I have to be careful of is to not broadly limit the uplink ports
> as well.
>
>
>
> *From:* Af   *On Behalf Of *Adam
> Moffett
> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:29 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control
>
>
>
> Exactly what I was thinking.
>
>
>
> Is it a global setting for the switch or an ingress limit per port?  If
> you can limit it per port then something like 5pps should be plenty.  They
> only need to ARP their default gateway and send a DHCP discover...anything
> else is surplus garbage. But If it's a global limit then someone sending
> garbage could prevent everybody else's ARP from working.
>
>
>
> I may not be thinking clearly but doesn't port isolation address the risk
> of broadcast storms? You allow one path from the customer's access port to
> the uplink port.  Any broadcast traffic is received only at the router port
> which will only respond to the ones that matter and ignore the rest.
>
>
>
> I recognize there are reasons to not like PPPoE, but PPPoE is another way
> to address it.  You configure the switch to discard anything from an access
> port that is not PPPoE.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- Original Message --
>
> From: "Forrest Christian (List Account)" 
>
> To: "af" 
>
> Sent: 4/17/2018 3:01:18 AM
>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control
>
>
>
> I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more devices
> would permit filtering such that the only broadcasts/multicasts permitted
> on customer facing segments were ARP and possibly DCHP if that's applicable
> to you.
>
>
>
> If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value is likely
> as low as you can set it.
>
>
>
> If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the
> ramifications where a low level broadcast storm saturates the setting you
> have set and prevents arp and dhcp from working
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
> wrote:
>
> What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second storm
> control on your switches/devices?
>
> I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets
>
> Is 100pps too low?
>
> Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request type
> traffic?
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> *Forrest Christian* *CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.*
>
> Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
>
> forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com
>
>   
>   
>
>
> --
>



-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Dave]

OMG!
 what a broadcast nightmare :)


On 04/17/2018 11:49 AM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:


Well, I’m using 48 port or more switches attached to each other, so I 
need something to limit it.


The switches typically limit ingress per port, so a low limiter should 
only affect the devices behind that port if one of the devices storm out.


I do have DHCP snooping, but that doesn’t necessarily block other 
types of bad traffic like that.


One thing I have to be careful of is to not broadly limit the uplink 
ports as well.


*From:* Af  *On Behalf Of *Adam Moffett
*Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:29 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

Exactly what I was thinking.

Is it a global setting for the switch or an ingress limit per port? 
 If you can limit it per port then something like 5pps should be 
plenty.  They only need to ARP their default gateway and send a DHCP 
discover...anything else is surplus garbage. But If it's a global 
limit then someone sending garbage could prevent everybody else's ARP 
from working.


I may not be thinking clearly but doesn't port isolation address the 
risk of broadcast storms? You allow one path from the customer's 
access port to the uplink port.  Any broadcast traffic is received 
only at the router port which will only respond to the ones that 
matter and ignore the rest.


I recognize there are reasons to not like PPPoE, but PPPoE is another 
way to address it.  You configure the switch to discard anything from 
an access port that is not PPPoE.


-- Original Message --

From: "Forrest Christian (List Account)" >


To: "af" >

Sent: 4/17/2018 3:01:18 AM

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more
devices would permit filtering such that the only
broadcasts/multicasts permitted on customer facing segments were
ARP and possibly DCHP if that's applicable to you.

If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value
is likely as low as you can set it.

If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the
ramifications where a low level broadcast storm saturates the
setting you have set and prevents arp and dhcp from working

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson
> wrote:

What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second
storm control on your switches/devices?

I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets

Is 100pps too low?

Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP
request type traffic?



-- 


*Forrest Christian*/CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc./

Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602

forre...@imach.com  |
http://www.packetflux.com 


 



--

[AFMUG] Cradlepoint Devices or multi-cell Hotspot

[Nate Burke]

So the boss is getting ready to take a road trip, It's vital important 
that he remain continually connected (his words), I believe what he 
meant to say is, 'I want to watch netflix every night at the 
campground'.  We have Verizon, but it doesn't work everywhere, I was in 
a campground in southern Indiana last year with no service, but I think 
sprint or AT were working fine.  I've never used one, but I thought 
one of the advantages to having a cradepoint device was that you could 
throw multiple SIM cards in it, and it would automagically switch 
between carriers.  Looking through the cradepoint section over at 
Baltic, it looks like there are a bunch of models now, and you buy for a 
carrier.  What would be nice is to have a Verizon+another carrier, with 
built in WIFI and the option for some external antennas all in a nice 
package.  The data path would prefer Verizon, but would switch to 
carrier 2 if Verizon is not available.Preferably without him have to 
call tech support (me) every night to get it working.


It looks like there is an AER3100 coming out that supports dual modems 
with built in wifi.  is it replacing something else?  Is there a cheaper 
version?


Nate

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Adam Moffett]

Cathinones.  An artificial stimulant.

There was/is a loophole in some areas that it's not illegal to sell a 
product just because it can be misused.  So if you sell aerosol cans and 
somebody is inhaling the propellant to catch a buzz then the seller and 
producer are not liable for the idiot's behavior.  Glade and Krylon are 
not drug dealers.


So some people cook up cathinones and label the item as "bath salts" or 
similar and then sell it in their head shop.  Not their fault if someone 
smokes it, right?  I have no idea whether the item can actually dissolve 
in a bath and perform some sort of function as an actual bath salt.  I 
would think that would be a pre-requisite for the loophole to function.




-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 4/17/2018 2:18:54 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are 
dissolved in hot water...

Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Chuck McCown]

Yep, like a bad piece of firmware.  It is a root kit for the brain.

-Original Message- 
From: Nate Burke

Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 1:21 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once, permanently
alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and why
it's so addictive.

On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like 
those too much.


Chuck McCown wrote:
If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are 
dissolved in hot water...

Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.

I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
(I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry 
Winehards Private Reserve...)


Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly addictive 
and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that 
either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.

Coke Zero does that enough for me.

My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries (decompression of 
the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her vertebrae).

But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.

-Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
bath salts are the videos I've come across.

Steve Jones wrote:
They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 doses 
od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other misch 
controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.

fucking bath salts

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > wrote:


I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
in it.
Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
demented.
A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
truth to that.



On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:

I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
probably be castrated upon a verdict.

On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:

I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
kids in (her sister�s kids).
Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
Those kids still think of my wife as �mom�.  They are all
grown up with grandkids of their own now.
One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
out so well.
The world needs standup guys like you.
*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
fucking meth
So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
late dealing with 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Nate Burke]

I thought I heard somewhere that any use of Meth, even once, permanently 
alters the brain chemistry.  So it's not a 'recreational' drug, and why 
it's so addictive.


On 4/17/2018 2:11 PM, Jay Weekley wrote:
Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like 
those too much.


Chuck McCown wrote:
If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are 
dissolved in hot water...

Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.

I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
(I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry 
Winehards Private Reserve...)


Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly 
addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that 
either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.

Coke Zero does that enough for me.

My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries 
(decompression of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her 
vertebrae).

But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.

-Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
bath salts are the videos I've come across.

Steve Jones wrote:
They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 
doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. 
other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth 
charges.

fucking bath salts

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > wrote:


I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
in it.
Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
demented.
A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
truth to that.



On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:

I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
probably be castrated upon a verdict.

On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:

I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
kids in (her sister�s kids).
Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
Those kids still think of my wife as �mom�.  They are all
grown up with grandkids of their own now.
One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
out so well.
The world needs standup guys like you.
*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
fucking meth
So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
also get the joy of headlice.
Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Jay Weekley]

Anything that makes me not want to eat or sleep isn't for me.  I like 
those too much.


Chuck McCown wrote:
If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are 
dissolved in hot water...

Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.

I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
(I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry 
Winehards Private Reserve...)


Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly 
addictive and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that 
either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.

Coke Zero does that enough for me.

My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries (decompression 
of the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her vertebrae).

But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.

-Original Message- From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
bath salts are the videos I've come across.

Steve Jones wrote:
They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 
doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. 
other misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth 
charges.

fucking bath salts

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > wrote:


I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
in it.
Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
demented.
A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
truth to that.



On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:

I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
probably be castrated upon a verdict.

On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:

I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
kids in (her sister’s kids).
Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all
grown up with grandkids of their own now.
One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
out so well.
The world needs standup guys like you.
*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
fucking meth
So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
also get the joy of headlice.
Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to
kids, theyre not just a thing you have while doing other 
things.

Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone
who is remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
But 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Josh Reynolds]

War is ok though.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 1:39 PM justsumname  wrote:

> some people thought voting at 18 was a good idea.
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 2:19 PM, Steve Jones 
> wrote:
>
>> yeah, can you imagine if a kid had got into that stuff
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Jay Weekley 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
>>> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
>>> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>>>
>>> Steve Jones wrote:
>>>
 They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 doses
 od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other misch
 controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.
 fucking bath salts

 On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave >> dmilho...@wletc.com>> wrote:

 I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
 vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
 in it.
 Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
 demented.
 A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
 to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
 truth to that.



 On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:

> I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
> almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
> enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
> that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
> about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
> probably be castrated upon a verdict.
>
> On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown  > wrote:
>
> I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
> kids in (her sister’s kids).
> Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
> One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
> Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all
> grown up with grandkids of their own now.
> One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
> out so well.
> The world needs standup guys like you.
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>
> You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
> years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
> fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
> fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
> momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
> at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
> with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
> locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
> his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
> was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
> understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
> never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
> least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
> a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
> Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
> and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
> ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
> Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
> funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
> fucking meth
> So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
> late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
> squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
> also get the joy of headlice.
> Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to
> kids, theyre not just a thing you have while doing other
> things.
> Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone
> who is remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
> But seriously, what the fuck, you get your kids back and sell
> meth. And theyre already asking if they sign their righys if
> they can see the kids still.
> I have very few skills, and none of rhem involve the ability
> to 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[justsumname]

some people thought voting at 18 was a good idea.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 2:19 PM, Steve Jones 
wrote:

> yeah, can you imagine if a kid had got into that stuff
>
> On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Jay Weekley 
> wrote:
>
>> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
>> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
>> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>>
>> Steve Jones wrote:
>>
>>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 doses
>>> od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other misch
>>> controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.
>>> fucking bath salts
>>>
>>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > dmilho...@wletc.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
>>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
>>> in it.
>>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
>>> demented.
>>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
>>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
>>> truth to that.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>>>
 I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
 almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
 enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
 that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
 about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
 probably be castrated upon a verdict.

 On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:

 I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
 kids in (her sister’s kids).
 Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
 One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
 Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all
 grown up with grandkids of their own now.
 One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
 out so well.
 The world needs standup guys like you.
 *From:* Steve Jones
 *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
 *To:* af@afmug.com
 *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

 You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
 years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
 fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
 fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
 momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
 at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
 with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
 locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
 his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
 was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
 understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
 never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
 least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
 a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
 Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
 and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
 ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
 Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
 funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
 fucking meth
 So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
 late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
 squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
 also get the joy of headlice.
 Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to
 kids, theyre not just a thing you have while doing other things.
 Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone
 who is remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
 But seriously, what the fuck, you get your kids back and sell
 meth. And theyre already asking if they sign their righys if
 they can see the kids still.
 I have very few skills, and none of rhem involve the ability
 to not want to feed these people lead


>>> --
>>>
>>>
>>> >> rce=link_campaign=sig-email_content=emailclient>Virus-free.
>>> 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

yeah, can you imagine if a kid had got into that stuff

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Jay Weekley 
wrote:

> I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
> and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
> bath salts are the videos I've come across.
>
> Steve Jones wrote:
>
>> They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 doses
>> od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other misch
>> controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.
>> fucking bath salts
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave  dmilho...@wletc.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
>> vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
>> in it.
>> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
>> demented.
>> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
>> to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
>> truth to that.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>>
>>> I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
>>> almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
>>> enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
>>> that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
>>> about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
>>> probably be castrated upon a verdict.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown >> > wrote:
>>>
>>> I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
>>> kids in (her sister’s kids).
>>> Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
>>> One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
>>> Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all
>>> grown up with grandkids of their own now.
>>> One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
>>> out so well.
>>> The world needs standup guys like you.
>>> *From:* Steve Jones
>>> *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
>>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>>>
>>> You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
>>> years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
>>> fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
>>> fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
>>> momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
>>> at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
>>> with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
>>> locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
>>> his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
>>> was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
>>> understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
>>> never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
>>> least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
>>> a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
>>> Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
>>> and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
>>> ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
>>> Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
>>> funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
>>> fucking meth
>>> So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
>>> late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
>>> squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
>>> also get the joy of headlice.
>>> Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to
>>> kids, theyre not just a thing you have while doing other things.
>>> Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone
>>> who is remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
>>> But seriously, what the fuck, you get your kids back and sell
>>> meth. And theyre already asking if they sign their righys if
>>> they can see the kids still.
>>> I have very few skills, and none of rhem involve the ability
>>> to not want to feed these people lead
>>>
>>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> > source=link_campaign=sig-email_content=emailclient>
>> Virus-free. www.avg.com > ature?utm_medium=email_source=link_campaign=sig-
>> email_content=emailclient>
>>
>> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Chuck McCown]

If I am going to use bath salts, they are called Epsom and they are 
dissolved in hot water...

Not really clear what they mean by bath salts.

I was prescribed Xanax once.  Made me sleepy.
Pot was not my thing back in the 70s...
(I preferred Olympia, Blitz, Rainier, Hamms, Miller, Heineken, Henry 
Winehards Private Reserve...)


Not really sure what meth does to you but I know it is horribly addictive 
and ruins everyone that gets hooked.
I guess it is a version of speed.  But no direct experience with that 
either.  Not wanting anything that cause my hear to race.

Coke Zero does that enough for me.

My wife lived on Oxy after a pair of horrific surgeries (decompression of 
the spine, harrington rods, 14 lag screws into her vertebrae).

But she didn't get hooked.  Claimed it worked really well.

-Original Message- 
From: Jay Weekley

Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:08 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun
and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about
bath salts are the videos I've come across.

Steve Jones wrote:
They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 doses od 
suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other misch 
controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.

fucking bath salts

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > wrote:


I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
in it.
Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
demented.
A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
truth to that.



On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:

I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
probably be castrated upon a verdict.

On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:

I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
kids in (her sister’s kids).
Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all
grown up with grandkids of their own now.
One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
out so well.
The world needs standup guys like you.
*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
fucking meth
So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
also get the joy of headlice.
Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to
kids, theyre not just a thing you have while doing other things.
Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone
who is remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
But seriously, what the fuck, you get your kids back and sell
meth. And theyre already asking if they sign their 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Jay Weekley]

I understand opiods, Xanax and pot but meth just doesn't sound like fun 
and bath salts has to be the lowest of lows.  Granted, all I know about 
bath salts are the videos I've come across.


Steve Jones wrote:
They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 
doses od suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other 
misch controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.

fucking bath salts

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave > wrote:


I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every
vehicle that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia
in it.
Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
demented.
A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant
to breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some
truth to that.



On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:

I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with
almost every sheriff in and most every drug focused law
enforcement I hear a lot of their stories. One of them tells me
that 95%+ of crime is drug related. CPS type problems they put at
about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of perverts that should
probably be castrated upon a verdict.

On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown > wrote:

I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the
kids in (her sister’s kids).
Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all
grown up with grandkids of their own now.
One of them is a solid cop in Reno. The other has not turned
out so well.
The world needs standup guys like you.
*From:* Steve Jones
*Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7
years ago we took in my old ladys nephews because, well
fuckwit parents. FYI the foster care system is aweful. We
fostered them for a year and half while her brother and baby
momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18 month old
at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig
with some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes
locked outward with a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til
his hip popped one night, i thought i broke his hip, but it
was just something going back. The 4 year old you couldbt
understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the
least bad of the fuckery. This was me, the old lady,
a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a tiny 2 bedroom.
Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room,
and a week later they gave them back to the mom. The old
ladies brother never did what he was supposed to.
Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms)
funeral, so whats this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling
fucking meth
So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be
late dealing with the child services people. Get all that
squared away, get through the funeral and now find out we
also get the joy of headlice.
Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to
kids, theyre not just a thing you have while doing other things.
Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone
who is remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
But seriously, what the fuck, you get your kids back and sell
meth. And theyre already asking if they sign their righys if
they can see the kids still.
I have very few skills, and none of rhem involve the ability
to not want to feed these people lead



-- 




 
	Virus-free. www.avg.com 
 



<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents

[Steve Jones]

They released the report, they seized appox 70 grams of xanax, 16 doses od
suboxone (essentially heroin) 11.8 grams of bath salts. other misch
controlled substance pills as well as delivery of meth charges.
fucking bath salts

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 8:18 AM, Dave  wrote:

> I hear the same shit as lewis and the sheriff mentioned that Every vehicle
> that is pulled over has some form of drug or paraphernalia in it.
> Meth is the demon drug that will cause even the most humble become
> demented.
> A peer of my rank in the army said "That some were just not meant to
> breed!" We laughed about it but I do believe there is some truth to that.
>
>
>
> On 04/15/2018 05:11 PM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
>
> I think Meth answers all your "why" questions. Since I deal with almost
> every sheriff in and most every drug focused law enforcement I hear a lot
> of their stories. One of them tells me that 95%+ of crime is drug related.
> CPS type problems they put at about 80% with the remaining 15% made of of
> perverts that should probably be castrated upon a verdict.
>
> On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 10:03 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
>> I had a similar situation.  Rather my wife did.  We took the kids in (her
>> sister’s kids).
>> Very similar situation, neglected, abused, drugs etc.
>>
>> One of the parents got them back for a while, then the other.
>>
>> Those kids still think of my wife as “mom”.  They are all grown up with
>> grandkids of their own now.
>> One of them is a solid cop in Reno.  The other has not turned out so
>> well.
>>
>> The world needs standup guys like you.
>>
>> *From:* Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Saturday, April 14, 2018 11:00 PM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT: very OT. Scumbag parents
>>
>> You folks get my vent because i cant anywherr else. So like 7 years ago
>> we took in my old ladys nephews because, well fuckwit parents. FYI the
>> foster care system is aweful. We fostered them for a year and half while
>> her brother and baby momma sorted their shit, or so we thought. The 18
>> month old at the time had a club foot, i had to build a sleeping rig with
>> some shoes with the ankles hooked together and the toes locked outward with
>> a ruler, i worked his legs in and out til his hip popped one night, i
>> thought i broke his hip, but it was just something going back. The 4 year
>> old you couldbt understand cause they thought baby talk was cute so they
>> never taught him to speak. We fixed that, and that was the least bad of the
>> fuckery. This was me, the old lady, a1,2,4,and 5 year old with our 2 in a
>> tiny 2 bedroom.
>> Finally got these boys shaped up and bought a house for room, and a week
>> later they gave them back to the mom. The old ladies brother never did what
>> he was supposed to.
>> Now today was their grandmas (my old ladies step moms) funeral, so whats
>> this trashcan do? Gets arrested for selling fucking meth
>> So dealing with all that comes with a funeral, we had to be late dealing
>> with the child services people. Get all that squared away, get through the
>> funeral and now find out we also get the joy of headlice.
>> Seriously, fucking shit fuck. How do people do this shit to kids, theyre
>> not just a thing you have while doing other things.
>>
>> Im not lawfully allowed to discuss any of this with anyone who is
>> remotely involved, i figure none of you are.
>>
>> But seriously, what the fuck, you get your kids back and sell meth. And
>> theyre already asking if they sign their righys if they can see the kids
>> still.
>>
>> I have very few skills, and none of rhem involve the ability to not want
>> to feed these people lead
>>
>
> --
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services

[Layne Sisk]

We have been using RIOT, it works much like Slack but doesn’t cost an arm and a 
leg to get the one function we needed (Active Directory).

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102
[New logo xl]
[http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
[Utah 100]   [fast50-01] [Inc 5000]

From: Af  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2018 9:25 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services

I rhought it was eol, but still there good for talking to the kid though when 
hes upstairs, fun video

On Sat, Apr 14, 2018, 1:56 PM Mike Hammett 
> wrote:
The app is dog shit and only getting worse.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Steve Jones" 
>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2018 10:14:03 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services
i use hangouts to communicate with my boy, its handy

On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 9:04 PM, Brian Webster 
> wrote:

One to consider is Google Voice.

You sign up for a free phone number account but it also has a chat client. Can 
be app based on the phone or browser based as well. One nice feature of the 
Google Voice chat is that you can also be texting/chatting with mobile users 
just like texting between phones. Make conversations, with those in the office 
easier because they don't have to use their phone, they can be on the computer 
using a full keyboard. Supports full MMS, pictures, hyperlinks etc. There is a 
chrome plugin as well. Side benefit is that is have the voice/phone features 
including voicemail and voicemail to text transcription, call screening and 
call forwarding based on rules or no answer conditions.

Still is the evil empire and them tracking al that you do so there is that 
drawback

https://voice.google.com


Thank You,
Brian Webster
www.wirelessmapping.com
www.Broadband-Mapping.com


-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf 
Of Nate Burke
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2018 3:26 PM
To: Animal Farm
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: IM Services

With the demise of AIM, and not being on any social media sites, what's 
available for Instant messaging apps these days?  Basically so I can send the 
boss Hyperlinks without having to do everything through email
while we're on an intercom call.It looks like Trillian.im offers a
service that is ad free for $2/user/mo  But I thought I saw that there was a 
$10 minimum somewhere.

Nate

Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Chuck McCown]

Cheap routers plugged in here and there to announce goofy SSIDs could be a 
whole lot of fun/chaos/alarm...

ISIS Unit 1

ANFO Detonator #1

SARAN Release Valve Controller

Hello NSA, just joking around here...

From: Chris Fabien 
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 11:23 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

This is about 20 min from us yea it really happened!

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

  ODD NEWS

  Name of Wi-Fi network prompts gym evacuation

  Saginaw Township, Mich.

  • A Michigan gym patron looking for a Wi-Fi connection found one named 
“remote detonator,” prompting an evacuation and precautionary search of the 
facility by a bomb-sniffing dog. The Saginaw News reported nothing was found in 
the search Sunday at Planet Fitness in Saginaw Township, about 85 miles 
northwest of Detroit. Saginaw Township police Chief Donald Pussehl says the 
patron brought the Wi-Fi connection’s name to the attention of a manager, who 
evacuated the building and called police. The gym was closed for about three 
hours as police responded. Pussehl says there’s “no crime or threat,” so no 
charges are expected. He notes people often have odd names for Wi-Fi 
connections. Planet Fitness says the manager was following company procedure 
for when there’s suspicion about a safety issue.

Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Chris Fabien]

This is about 20 min from us yea it really happened!

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018 at 1:08 PM, Chuck McCown  wrote:

> ODD NEWS
>
> Name of Wi-Fi network prompts gym evacuation
>
> Saginaw Township, Mich.
>
> • A Michigan gym patron looking for a Wi-Fi connection found one named
> “remote detonator,” prompting an evacuation and precautionary search of the
> facility by a bomb-sniffing dog. The Saginaw News reported nothing was
> found in the search Sunday at Planet Fitness in Saginaw Township, about 85
> miles northwest of Detroit. Saginaw Township police Chief Donald Pussehl
> says the patron brought the Wi-Fi connection’s name to the attention of a
> manager, who evacuated the building and called police. The gym was closed
> for about three hours as police responded. Pussehl says there’s “no crime
> or threat,” so no charges are expected. He notes people often have odd
> names for Wi-Fi connections. Planet Fitness says the manager was following
> company procedure for when there’s suspicion about a safety issue.
>
>
>

[AFMUG] OT Fun

[Chuck McCown]

ODD NEWS

Name of Wi-Fi network prompts gym evacuation

Saginaw Township, Mich.

• A Michigan gym patron looking for a Wi-Fi connection found one named “remote 
detonator,” prompting an evacuation and precautionary search of the facility by 
a bomb-sniffing dog. The Saginaw News reported nothing was found in the search 
Sunday at Planet Fitness in Saginaw Township, about 85 miles northwest of 
Detroit. Saginaw Township police Chief Donald Pussehl says the patron brought 
the Wi-Fi connection’s name to the attention of a manager, who evacuated the 
building and called police. The gym was closed for about three hours as police 
responded. Pussehl says there’s “no crime or threat,” so no charges are 
expected. He notes people often have odd names for Wi-Fi connections. Planet 
Fitness says the manager was following company procedure for when there’s 
suspicion about a safety issue.

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Sterling Jacobson]

Well, I’m using 48 port or more switches attached to each other, so I need 
something to limit it.

The switches typically limit ingress per port, so a low limiter should only 
affect the devices behind that port if one of the devices storm out.

I do have DHCP snooping, but that doesn’t necessarily block other types of bad 
traffic like that.

One thing I have to be careful of is to not broadly limit the uplink ports as 
well.

From: Af  On Behalf Of Adam Moffett
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:29 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

Exactly what I was thinking.

Is it a global setting for the switch or an ingress limit per port?  If you can 
limit it per port then something like 5pps should be plenty.  They only need to 
ARP their default gateway and send a DHCP discover...anything else is surplus 
garbage. But If it's a global limit then someone sending garbage could prevent 
everybody else's ARP from working.

I may not be thinking clearly but doesn't port isolation address the risk of 
broadcast storms? You allow one path from the customer's access port to the 
uplink port.  Any broadcast traffic is received only at the router port which 
will only respond to the ones that matter and ignore the rest.

I recognize there are reasons to not like PPPoE, but PPPoE is another way to 
address it.  You configure the switch to discard anything from an access port 
that is not PPPoE.



-- Original Message --
From: "Forrest Christian (List Account)" 
>
To: "af" >
Sent: 4/17/2018 3:01:18 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more devices 
would permit filtering such that the only broadcasts/multicasts permitted on 
customer facing segments were ARP and possibly DCHP if that's applicable to you.

If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value is likely as 
low as you can set it.

If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the ramifications 
where a low level broadcast storm saturates the setting you have set and 
prevents arp and dhcp from working

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
> wrote:
What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second storm control on 
your switches/devices?

I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets

Is 100pps too low?

Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request type traffic?



--
Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.
Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | 
http://www.packetflux.com
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 [https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/facebook.png] 
  
[https://s3.amazonaws.com/images.wisestamp.com/icons/twitter.png] 

Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

[Robert]

Lease them the dirt  ( Obviously you have already tried that..)

On 4/17/18 9:18 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

In my area, all the storage companies are booked solid.
Yes, nice security fence.  The software allows them to open the gate 
with their phone.

Cameras, lights, DVR etc.
But, I have a storage company wanting to buy the dirt right now.  So I 
might just sell the dirt.

*From:* Lewis Bergman
*Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:36 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg
I own a small storage business called 277 Storage 
. First I would say, there is storage business 
software that wraps this all up for you. For something of that scale, I 
would think the ROI of that software is prohibitive, but likely less so 
than doing it yourself with what I assume your time is worth. At least 
that was the case last time I looked. There is somebody in Utah that 
claims to have software a small business 
 like you 
describe could afford.
The second thing I would say is I wouldn't do it with conex boxes. While 
I Like those containers and they are generally tighter than purpose 
built storage buildings, they turn renters off. Every site I have seen 
with them looks a bit dodgy and people seem to expect to pay less for 
those sites. A fence would be advisable. Units without fencing get 
burglary attempts than non fenced. I think it is likely due to the 
perception thieves have about the rest of the attitude on security.
Maybe I am wrong but the people who call me are more worried about 
security than price. I would also suggest putting up a HikVision, or if 
you prefer, Ubiquiti, camera system as well. Even a fake camera system 
would be worth the effort. Lastly, Throw all that out if this land isn't 
in a good location and just use conex boxes. Storage is a real estate 
business similar to others and if the location isn't good you will fight 
that uphill battle. If there are a lot of businesses in the area they 
may like those for storage. Don't know. We have had really good results 
with our warehouse storage. Call if you want to talk about it.
On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 10:04 PM Brian Webster 
 wrote:


I rented an apartment in California years ago where the gate control
had the ability for a visitor to hit an intercom button for your
unit and it would dial the number they had programmed in to the
system, you could answer the phone and enter a touch tone command to
open the gate





Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com 

www.Broadband-Mapping.com 



*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
*Sent:* Monday, April 16, 2018 11:40 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT One for the borg



Thinking of arranging about 50 conex containers on some commercial
land I own and renting them out for storage.

I want software where they will go online, see vacancies, rent, auto
pay etc.  Totally hands off.  Even like a phone app to open the gate
for them when they want to get into the place. 



Hate to develop code for this.  It has to exist out in the world
somewhere...



Any ideas. 

Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

[Chuck McCown]

In my area, all the storage companies are booked solid.
Yes, nice security fence.  The software allows them to open the gate with their 
phone.
Cameras, lights, DVR etc.  

But, I have a storage company wanting to buy the dirt right now.  So I might 
just sell the dirt.  

From: Lewis Bergman 
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:36 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

I own a small storage business called 277 Storage. First I would say, there is 
storage business software that wraps this all up for you. For something of that 
scale, I would think the ROI of that software is prohibitive, but likely less 
so than doing it yourself with what I assume your time is worth. At least that 
was the case last time I looked. There is somebody in Utah that claims to have 
software a small business like you describe could afford.  

The second thing I would say is I wouldn't do it with conex boxes. While I Like 
those containers and they are generally tighter than purpose built storage 
buildings, they turn renters off. Every site I have seen with them looks a bit 
dodgy and people seem to expect to pay less for those sites. A fence would  be 
advisable. Units without fencing get burglary attempts than non fenced. I think 
it is likely due to the perception thieves have about the rest of the attitude 
on security.

Maybe I am wrong but the people who call me are more worried about security 
than price. I would also suggest putting up a HikVision, or if you prefer, 
Ubiquiti, camera system as well. Even a fake camera system would be worth the 
effort. Lastly, Throw all that out if this land isn't in a good location and 
just use conex boxes. Storage is a real estate business similar to others and 
if the location isn't good you will fight that uphill battle. If there are a 
lot of businesses in the area they may like those for storage. Don't know. We 
have had really good results with our warehouse storage. Call if you want to 
talk about it.

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 10:04 PM Brian Webster  wrote:

  I rented an apartment in California years ago where the gate control had the 
ability for a visitor to hit an intercom button for your unit and it would dial 
the number they had programmed in to the system, you could answer the phone and 
enter a touch tone command to open the gate





  Thank You,

  Brian Webster

  www.wirelessmapping.com

  www.Broadband-Mapping.com



  From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
  Sent: Monday, April 16, 2018 11:40 AM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg



  Thinking of arranging about 50 conex containers on some commercial land I own 
and renting them out for storage.

  I want software where they will go online, see vacancies, rent, auto pay etc. 
 Totally hands off.  Even like a phone app to open the gate for them when they 
want to get into the place.  



  Hate to develop code for this.  It has to exist out in the world somewhere...



  Any ideas.  

Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

[Chuck McCown]

$39/month
And it does everything you could possibly imagine.  
Totally hands off, no people required, no interaction with the customer 
required.  

From: Lewis Bergman 
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 6:36 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

I own a small storage business called 277 Storage. First I would say, there is 
storage business software that wraps this all up for you. For something of that 
scale, I would think the ROI of that software is prohibitive, but likely less 
so than doing it yourself with what I assume your time is worth. At least that 
was the case last time I looked. There is somebody in Utah that claims to have 
software a small business like you describe could afford.  

The second thing I would say is I wouldn't do it with conex boxes. While I Like 
those containers and they are generally tighter than purpose built storage 
buildings, they turn renters off. Every site I have seen with them looks a bit 
dodgy and people seem to expect to pay less for those sites. A fence would  be 
advisable. Units without fencing get burglary attempts than non fenced. I think 
it is likely due to the perception thieves have about the rest of the attitude 
on security.

Maybe I am wrong but the people who call me are more worried about security 
than price. I would also suggest putting up a HikVision, or if you prefer, 
Ubiquiti, camera system as well. Even a fake camera system would be worth the 
effort. Lastly, Throw all that out if this land isn't in a good location and 
just use conex boxes. Storage is a real estate business similar to others and 
if the location isn't good you will fight that uphill battle. If there are a 
lot of businesses in the area they may like those for storage. Don't know. We 
have had really good results with our warehouse storage. Call if you want to 
talk about it.

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 10:04 PM Brian Webster  wrote:

  I rented an apartment in California years ago where the gate control had the 
ability for a visitor to hit an intercom button for your unit and it would dial 
the number they had programmed in to the system, you could answer the phone and 
enter a touch tone command to open the gate





  Thank You,

  Brian Webster

  www.wirelessmapping.com

  www.Broadband-Mapping.com



  From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
  Sent: Monday, April 16, 2018 11:40 AM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg



  Thinking of arranging about 50 conex containers on some commercial land I own 
and renting them out for storage.

  I want software where they will go online, see vacancies, rent, auto pay etc. 
 Totally hands off.  Even like a phone app to open the gate for them when they 
want to get into the place.  



  Hate to develop code for this.  It has to exist out in the world somewhere...



  Any ideas.  

Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

[Dave]

Aww man I was wanting to build him an Automated Storage and Retrieval 
System :)

Six Axis Robot Storage and Retrieval System ASRS

On 04/17/2018 07:36 AM, Lewis Bergman wrote:
I own a small storage business called 277 Storage 
. First I would say, there is storage business 
software that wraps this all up for you. For something of that scale, 
I would think the ROI of that software is prohibitive, but likely less 
so than doing it yourself with what I assume your time is worth. At 
least that was the case last time I looked. There is somebody in Utah 
that claims to have software a small business 
 like you 
describe could afford.


The second thing I would say is I wouldn't do it with conex boxes. 
While I Like those containers and they are generally tighter than 
purpose built storage buildings, they turn renters off. Every site I 
have seen with them looks a bit dodgy and people seem to expect to pay 
less for those sites. A fence would  be advisable. Units without 
fencing get burglary attempts than non fenced. I think it is likely 
due to the perception thieves have about the rest of the attitude on 
security.


Maybe I am wrong but the people who call me are more worried about 
security than price. I would also suggest putting up a HikVision, or 
if you prefer, Ubiquiti, camera system as well. Even a fake camera 
system would be worth the effort. Lastly, Throw all that out if this 
land isn't in a good location and just use conex boxes. Storage is a 
real estate business similar to others and if the location isn't good 
you will fight that uphill battle. If there are a lot of businesses in 
the area they may like those for storage. Don't know. We have had 
really good results with our warehouse storage. Call if you want to 
talk about it.


On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 10:04 PM Brian Webster 
> wrote:


I rented an apartment in California years ago where the gate
control had the ability for a visitor to hit an intercom button
for your unit and it would dial the number they had programmed in
to the system, you could answer the phone and enter a touch tone
command to open the gate

Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com 

www.Broadband-Mapping.com 

*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com
] *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com

*Sent:* Monday, April 16, 2018 11:40 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

Thinking of arranging about 50 conex containers on some commercial
land I own and renting them out for storage.

I want software where they will go online, see vacancies, rent,
auto pay etc.  Totally hands off.  Even like a phone app to open
the gate for them when they want to get into the place.

Hate to develop code for this.  It has to exist out in the world
somewhere...

Any ideas.



--

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Dave]

We route and segment to remove this from being an issue on the 
infrastructure but as with any network a customer will always figure out 
a way
to break stuff hence the isolation that we use on the AP. If its not a 
routed packed then it doesnt get thru.



On 04/16/2018 04:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson wrote:

What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second storm control on 
your switches/devices?

I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets

Is 100pps too low?

Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request type traffic?


--

Re: [AFMUG] OT One for the borg

[Lewis Bergman]

I own a small storage business called 277 Storage .
First I would say, there is storage business software that wraps this all
up for you. For something of that scale, I would think the ROI of that
software is prohibitive, but likely less so than doing it yourself with
what I assume your time is worth. At least that was the case last time I
looked. There is somebody in Utah that claims to have software a small
business  like
you describe could afford.

The second thing I would say is I wouldn't do it with conex boxes. While I
Like those containers and they are generally tighter than purpose built
storage buildings, they turn renters off. Every site I have seen with them
looks a bit dodgy and people seem to expect to pay less for those sites. A
fence would  be advisable. Units without fencing get burglary attempts than
non fenced. I think it is likely due to the perception thieves have about
the rest of the attitude on security.

Maybe I am wrong but the people who call me are more worried about security
than price. I would also suggest putting up a HikVision, or if you prefer,
Ubiquiti, camera system as well. Even a fake camera system would be worth
the effort. Lastly, Throw all that out if this land isn't in a good
location and just use conex boxes. Storage is a real estate business
similar to others and if the location isn't good you will fight that uphill
battle. If there are a lot of businesses in the area they may like those
for storage. Don't know. We have had really good results with our warehouse
storage. Call if you want to talk about it.

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 10:04 PM Brian Webster 
wrote:

> I rented an apartment in California years ago where the gate control had
> the ability for a visitor to hit an intercom button for your unit and it
> would dial the number they had programmed in to the system, you could
> answer the phone and enter a touch tone command to open the gate
>
>
>
>
>
> Thank You,
>
> Brian Webster
>
> www.wirelessmapping.com
>
> www.Broadband-Mapping.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Monday, April 16, 2018 11:40 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] OT One for the borg
>
>
>
> Thinking of arranging about 50 conex containers on some commercial land I
> own and renting them out for storage.
>
> I want software where they will go online, see vacancies, rent, auto pay
> etc.  Totally hands off.  Even like a phone app to open the gate for them
> when they want to get into the place.
>
>
>
> Hate to develop code for this.  It has to exist out in the world
> somewhere...
>
>
>
> Any ideas.
>

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Adam Moffett]

Exactly what I was thinking.

Is it a global setting for the switch or an ingress limit per port?  If 
you can limit it per port then something like 5pps should be plenty.  
They only need to ARP their default gateway and send a DHCP 
discover...anything else is surplus garbage. But If it's a global limit 
then someone sending garbage could prevent everybody else's ARP from 
working.


I may not be thinking clearly but doesn't port isolation address the 
risk of broadcast storms? You allow one path from the customer's access 
port to the uplink port.  Any broadcast traffic is received only at the 
router port which will only respond to the ones that matter and ignore 
the rest.


I recognize there are reasons to not like PPPoE, but PPPoE is another 
way to address it.  You configure the switch to discard anything from an 
access port that is not PPPoE.




-- Original Message --
From: "Forrest Christian (List Account)" 
To: "af" 
Sent: 4/17/2018 3:01:18 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more 
devices would permit filtering such that the only broadcasts/multicasts 
permitted on customer facing segments were ARP and possibly DCHP if 
that's applicable to you.


If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value is 
likely as low as you can set it.


If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the 
ramifications where a low level broadcast storm saturates the setting 
you have set and prevents arp and dhcp from working


On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
 wrote:
What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second storm 
control on your switches/devices?


I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets

Is 100pps too low?

Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request type 
traffic?




--
Forrest Christian CEO, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.
Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com 

  
  

Re: [AFMUG] Switch Storm Control

[Forrest Christian (List Account)]

I don't have a good answer for you but  I really wish more devices
would permit filtering such that the only broadcasts/multicasts permitted
on customer facing segments were ARP and possibly DCHP if that's applicable
to you.

If you can exempt arp and dhcp from this, then the correct value is likely
as low as you can set it.

If you can't exempt arp and dhcp, you need to think about the ramifications
where a low level broadcast storm saturates the setting you have set and
prevents arp and dhcp from working

On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 PM, Sterling Jacobson 
wrote:

> What are you guys using as a 'standard' for packets per second storm
> control on your switches/devices?
>
> I can limit broadcast, multicast and unknown unicast type packets
>
> Is 100pps too low?
>
> Would this be based on say a /24 network arping and DHCP request type
> traffic?
>



-- 
*Forrest Christian* *CEO**, PacketFlux Technologies, Inc.*
Tel: 406-449-3345 | Address: 3577 Countryside Road, Helena, MT 59602
forre...@imach.com | http://www.packetflux.com