Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Sorry for drudging up an old thread, but I was wondering if anyone knows what the Vrms for the DAC 60 is? I am sketching out the gain structure of my system and wanted to know. I haven't measured mine yet and wondered if anyone else has. I have to finish up some other larger DIY projects, but I have lots of ideas for modding the DAC-60. I was even thinking of transplanting a duet receiver inside the DAC-60 case and moving the transformers (and probably the first part of each PSU) to an external case. Then one can bypass the SPDIF interface between the duet rcvr and the DAC60. Then I am thinking of redesigning the analog output stage. It seems that not much creativity was used in the 6922 stage. Its a bog standard SRPP. I was thinking of doing a CCS (ala Pimm's SBCCS) loaded (triode strapped) D3A and taking the output from the CCS's mu output. Wouldn't cause too much mechanical reworking. The D3A would have 2.5 times the gain so the I/V resistor could be more than halved which would take a great deal of stress off the DAC, putting it in its more linear operating region. And despite having a great deal more gain, the D3A triode strapped has less miller capacitance then the 6922. And the Zout of the CCS-mu is 500ohms which is less than the SRPP's out, if I am not mistaken. It also has increased drive current for cables, etc. Of course, reworking of the HT PSU goes without saying. -- joshk joshk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1386 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Crooner thanks for all the post on your progress with the lite dac 60. I am thinking of getting one. As I am new to this sorry if my question sounds dumb. Do you think I can use a cheap toshiba DVD player like the toshiba sd6100 to use purely for the output into my Dac 60 or do I need a better transport to maximize the dac60's potential? Also what modifications do you think is absolutely needed on the Dac 60s? Different tubes (what brand), etc.? Thanks. -- Krobelus Krobelus's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16120 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Krobelus;280714 Wrote: Crooner thanks for all the post on your progress with the lite dac 60. I am thinking of getting one. As I am new to this sorry if my question sounds dumb. Do you think I can use a cheap toshiba DVD player like the toshiba sd6100 to use purely for the output into my Dac 60 or do I need a better transport to maximize the dac60's potential? Also what modifications do you think is absolutely needed on the Dac 60s? Different tubes (what brand), etc.? Thanks. Well, considering that many so called high end brands are using low cost DVD transports these days, chances are your Toshiba will work just fine with the DAC60. Make sure you use the coaxial connection, with a good quality cable! -- crooner Customized dual chassis Super Squeezebox EAD DSP-7000 Series III DAC with HDCD and mods. VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Marantz 10B tube FM tuner Marantz 7C tube preamp Marantz 8B tube power amp Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Thanks much on your reply. I will try out the configuration you suggested! Also, if I am going to upgrade the Tubes on the Dac 60s what is the best one to get if money is no object and also what is your favorite in terms of cost/benefit ratios? Thanks again Crooner. -- Krobelus Krobelus's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16120 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Krobelus;280922 Wrote: Thanks much on your reply. I will try out the configuration you suggested! Also, if I am going to upgrade the Tubes on the Dac 60s what is the best one to get if money is no object and also what is your favorite in terms of cost/benefit ratios? Thanks again Crooner. If money is no object, the Amperex 7308 and Siemens CCa variants are hard to beat. Make sure you get them from a reputable dealer. Lots of counterfeits floating around these days. The readily available Bugle Boy 6DJ8 from the 60s is a nice choice as well, and not terribly expensive. -- crooner Customized dual chassis Super Squeezebox EAD DSP-7000 Series III DAC with HDCD and mods. VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Marantz 10B tube FM tuner Marantz 7C tube preamp Marantz 8B tube power amp Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
crooner;182708 Wrote: Now... Looking at the innards of my DAC-60 while upgrading the tubes, I really don't know why people are modding the heck out of them. It comes with top quality parts already! All the stock electrolytics are audio/audiophile quality. There are tons of Elna Silmic's (considered by many to be better than the fabled Cerafines) and Sanyo OS-CON's! There are much better caps available. These are only the widely-used caps, not the best. Steve N. -- audioengr audioengr's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8041 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
audioengr;263081 Wrote: There are much better caps available. These are only the widely-used caps, not the best. Steve N. The best electrolytic is the fabled Rubycon BlackGate (I use the NX version in my modded EAD DSP-7000 III), now unfortunately discontinued. The ELNA Cerafine (also discontinued) is almost as good. The Nichicon MUSE was another good one from a bygone era. For being a $470 Chinese DAC, I think the stock capacitor selection is quite decent. -- crooner Customized dual chassis Super Squeezebox EAD DSP-7000 Series III DAC with HDCD and mods. VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Marantz 10B tube FM tuner Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
In my experience the black gates though good never gave there best ...they always seemed to be running in ie if you switch the unit off for any period, on start up it would take some time days to get the sound back. I've found nothing better than paper in oils for this position ..yes there big and often hard to fit ...but were significantly better than all the other caps I've tried. -- zanash Acoustician and builder of interesting cables zanash's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12157 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
zanash;263247 Wrote: In my experience the black gates though good never gave there best ...they always seemed to be running in ie if you switch the unit off for any period, on start up it would take some time days to get the sound back. I've found nothing better than paper in oils for this position ..yes there big and often hard to fit ...but were significantly better than all the other caps I've tried. BlackGates are (or were!) your only choice when you are talking about large capacitance values not available in film or oil. They do need an excruciatingly long time to break-in so to speak... -- crooner Customized dual chassis Super Squeezebox EAD DSP-7000 Series III DAC with HDCD and mods. VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Marantz 10B tube FM tuner Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
A late coming guy from HK. I have play around with DAC68 for quite a while. Sound quality is very good. I made certain mod but a minimum that gives big improvement should at least change output cap and linestage tube. Don't believe any ad., DAC68 is a 24/96 upsampling dac but 24/192. The receiver use a CS8420 to upsample the spdif signal to 92k in I2S format and then pass to AD1853. The max. input frequency is limited by CS8420 to 96k even though AD1853 can supoort 192k. To further improve the clock stablity, I also change the crystal oscillator to TCXO. Tum is correct, sould quality for unbalanced output is not very stunning. A very simple method to overide the problem is utilize a step-down isolation transformer to convert XLR to RCA. Roland. -- rolandhoyf rolandhoyf's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=15169 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Tum;253850 Wrote: If you need two output and remote, Citypulse DA7.2xII may be suit for you. It has one unbalance output, one balance output and one fixed unbalance output. Moreover, it has one input (you can bypass pre-amp.). Anyway, it use Class A transistor output stage - not tube. I almost buy this model, and you can see more details at www.diykits.com.hk. I think that you can ask sale person over there about Lite DAC-68 (remote)and Citypulse DA 7.2xII. He can give you more details. I bought DAC-60 from him - ship within a day. Looks good, thanks... -- Lowrider Linn Unidisk SC, Classic 16.0, Schallwand Sangreal, Tannoy ST50, BW PV-1, ESE labs Enlil Lowrider's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14617 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Thanks, I need two outputs simultaneous, one for subwoofer and one for amplifier, balanced or not, also remote is important, the April Audio Stello DP220 is the best compromise I found, but expensive... -- Lowrider Linn Unidisk SC, Classic 16.0, Schallwand Sangreal, Tannoy ST50, BW PV-1, ESE labs Enlil Lowrider's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14617 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
If you need two output and remote, Citypulse DA7.2xII may be suit for you. It has one unbalance output, one balance output and one fixed unbalance output. Moreover, it has one input (you can bypass pre-amp.). Anyway, it use Class A transistor output stage - not tube. I almost buy this model, and you can see more details at www.diykits.com.hk. I think that you can ask sale person over there about Lite DAC-68 (remote)and Citypulse DA 7.2xII. He can give you more details. I bought DAC-60 from him - ship within a day. -- Tum Tum's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13878 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I was also interested in DAC-68 before I bought DAC-60. As its specification available in English, I think that it has digital volume control (remote is not mentioned). It also uses different D/A chip (AD1853). Moreover, it has Balance I/P and O/P. I try to discuss with some one in HK who tested this model, but it was written in Chinese. He kindly answered me some questions, and he recommended that it was a good DAC if you need Balance O/P. If unbalance O/P was used, he said about 70% quality acheived(his comments). It price is about 100 USD more than DAC-60. For me, I do not have Balance I/P pre-amplifier. So, I bought DAC-60, then I changed O/P cap. to Moundoff Supreme and tube to NOS PCC88 Telefunken. Addition cost was around 170 USD. I think that it is better to use money to upgrade DAC-60 than buy DAC-68. Anyway, if you go for DAC-68, I recommend you to change tube to NOS tube. You will be happier with NOS tube than Sovek. -- Tum Tum's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13878 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Thanks, What about the DAC 68, I know it has volume control and decodes DVDs, but unfortunately I dont see a remote... Any alternative with remote volume ? -- Lowrider Lowrider's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14617 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I am interested in this DAC, I read a review and they say it has volume controled by remote, is his true ? -- Lowrider Lowrider's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14617 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Lowrider;251626 Wrote: I am interested in this DAC, I read a review and they say it has volume controled by remote, is his true ? Also, does it decode DVDs, at least DD ? Thanks, Not the DAC60 that I owned. Perhaps its a new revision? I know it is built using the same chassis as the Monarchy M24 and that one has a built in preamp. Dunno if it's remote capable, though... -- crooner Customized dual chassis Super Squeezebox EAD DSP-7000 Series III DAC with HDCD and mods. VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Marantz 10B tube FM tuner Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Tum;244684 Wrote: I've got Lite DAC-60 from HK ..www.diykits.co.hk . The quality of it is much better than $370. I've just changed output capacitors to M-Cap supreme, then it sound is more details and wider sound stage. Now, I've got NOS Telefunken PCC88 to be replaced Sovek 6922. For the first listening, it improves bass and more details than Sovek. It need to be burned in a few days to get better performance. Sorry? some typos.. it should be www.diykits.com.hk -- Tum Tum's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13878 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I've got Lite DAC-60 from HK ..www.diykits.co.hk . The quality of it is much better than $370. I've just changed output capacitors to M-Cap supreme, then it sound is more details and wider sound stage. Now, I've got NOS Telefunken PCC88 to be replaced Sovek 6922. For the first listening, it improves bass and more details than Sovek. It need to be burned in a few days to get better performance. -- Tum Tum's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13878 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Sorry to make this revive, but I have a problem. My lite dac broke up and I need to find a PCM1704 replacement. I do not have the dac with me now. Anyone can tell me how many PCM1704 are actually inside the machine? Any idea of where to find them. They seem to have all run out of stock! g -- g_ghirardi g_ghirardi's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3161 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
crooner;183163 Wrote: The ear test on the DAC60? Well, I've had mine for a year so I think I'm qualified to comment. The improvement in sound quality is very noticeable with the Lite DAC. It basically turns the SB3 into a Transporter for a fraction of the price :-). Actually, I've never heard the TP, but the SB3+DAC60 is so good I'm not in a real hurry to upgrade! Hi All, I too have been running a SB3 + DAC 60 for over a year now and overall I'm happy with the sound except for tracks where cymbals are at the forefront (tinny springs to mind ) but the best improvement I found was ditching the wireless part and going hard wired especially the Squeezenetwork performance -- pkfox When the going gets weird - the weird turn pro. Hunter S Thompson pkfox's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=5346 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I'm also interested, and would appreciate feedback once someone has done the listening test ... does it in fact provide a noticeable improvement over using the SB's DAC stage. I live in Europe. Is there a 220v version? -- Mark Scanlan MarkS Mark Scanlan's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10365 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
The ear test on the DAC60? Well, I've had mine for a year so I think I'm qualified to comment. The improvement in sound quality is very noticeable with the Lite DAC. It basically turns the SB3 into a Transporter for a fraction of the price! -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Now... Looking at the innards of my DAC-60 while upgrading the tubes, I really don't know why people are modding the heck out of them. It comes with top quality parts already! All the stock electrolytics are audio/audiophile quality. There are tons of Elna Silmic's (considered by many to be better than the fabled Cerafines) and Sanyo OS-CON's! -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Wonder how this version compares with the mods by Pacific Valve and GR-Research? http://eshop.diyclub.biz/product_info.php?cPath=23_162products_id=335 -- mmg_fan mmg_fan's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9157 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Got my Siemens CCa pair today. Man, these are sweet! Playing James Taylor's Hourglass right now and it's like listening to it for the very first time. Sounds incredibly real. I'm happy! +---+ |Filename: siemens cca closeup on dac60.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2458| +---+ -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Looks interesting! Too bad they are not showing pics of the internals. I'm having great results by minimally modding mine (Sonicap coupling caps) and adding the Siemens CCa's. But $505 doesn't sound bad at all. Of course, shipping is not going to be cheap! mmg_fan;182651 Wrote: Wonder how this version compares with the mods by Pacific Valve and GR-Research? http://eshop.diyclub.biz/product_info.php?cPath=23_162products_id=335 -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
mmg_fan;181840 Wrote: Hi has anyone tried the pacific Valve mods for the Lite DAC? Just wondering if its worth the extra $$ http://www.pacificvalve.us/LTDAC60M.html I just received my DAC 60 with the Pacific Valve mods (the midline version, not the DAC 62) yesterday. So far it sounds quite good - a definate step up from the SB3's analog outputs. But I can't really say whether it's $100 better than the base DAC 60, or $100 worse than the DAC 62, since I've never heard either of those. -- bobschneider bobschneider's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10074 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I've used some JJ's (former Teslas) on mine and didn't like the sound. A little congested. Perhaps they needed further break-in. The Amperex JAN 7308s were great but one of them was noisy so I returned them to Kevin Deal. I'm getting a pair of very expensive Siemens CCa's instead. Can't wait to hear them! -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Has anyone here tested the Lite DAC38? I'm looking for a solid state alternative to connect directly to my solid state direct coupled amp. -- P Floding No, I didn't ABX it. And I won't even if you ask me. (Especially not if you ask me.) P Floding's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2932 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Hi Crooner, Thanks for your inputs. AS I am not familiar with electroncs, I'll probably have someone doing the job for me. In terms of which particular condenser to buy, do you have any suggestion on which specs I should be looking for? In Europe, for example, I could quite easily buy the condensers from MUNDORF (see http://www.mundorf.com/english/), of whoch I have read interesting reviews, but I understand each model has a different capacity (expressed in #956;F], VDC, lenght of wire, diameter, etc. What exactely should I be looking for? Thanks! Giovanni -- g_ghirardi g_ghirardi's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3161 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Hi Giovanni, Mundorf should be an excellent choice. Replace with a 3.3 uF Muldorf and a small bypass of 1 uF or less. -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Anyone has any suggestion on which valves to buy to substitute the originals? I am reasonably happy with the DAC-60, but it simply cannot compare to the internal analogue-digital converter of my beautifl Jolida jd100s (CD Player) with two Sovtek 12AX7LPS mounted in. My last test was to connect the DAC-60 to the digital out connection of the Jolida and compare the internal and the external dac using the same CD source. The internal Jolida remains better. I definitely think it has something to do with the tubes. -- g_ghirardi g_ghirardi's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3161 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Try the Amperex 7308s PQ, JAN or USN. Mid 60s vintage if possible. Even the cheaper 6DJ8 Bugle Boy made in Holland, gives you much better sound than the stock Electroharmonix. Also, upgrade the coupling caps to something better. I'm using Sonicaps from Sonic Craft but I've heard success stories with Auricaps as well. -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
It is generally recognized Delta Sigma DACs have improved considerably in the past few years. However, there's still consensus that traditional parallel or ladder DACs sound better than Delta Sigmas. The Delta Sigma DACs are much cheaper to produce and that's pretty much why the traditional approach has been discontinued. jmourik;180199 Wrote: Thanks for that info Crooner, interesting. I googled this chip and this page has some interesting info: http://www.lessloss.com/converter.html Of course, if I get the dac60, I certainly will want to believe them: :-) -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Hi, I just bought these Amperex ECC88/6DJ8 matched pair on e-bay. Will they improve the sound? And what is the purpose exactely of the audio capacitors? Where should I mount them? Thanks for your invaluable help! g +---+ |Filename: 1235_1_sbl.JPG | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2417| +---+ -- g_ghirardi g_ghirardi's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3161 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Looks like they are A Frame 6DJ8s. Should work nicely in the DAC60. The cap mod is simply replacing the big blue rectangle coupling caps with something better. The stock blue caps are right in front of the tubes. Hard to miss. Here's a shot of my unit with the Sonicaps installed. I used 3.3 uF values (large units) with a bypass of 1uF IIRC. 200V works fine here. I'm going to open the unit up again for some mods soon and will take closer shots of the caps. Remember there are high voltages inside the unit. Do not attempt any mod without prior experience in doing this kind of thing. +---+ |Filename: dac60 with damping rings jan 07.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2418| +---+ -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
btw. the speakers we were using for the comparison are these Selah line arrays: http://www.selahaudio.com/id52.html . Quite an impressive speaker! WAF might be fairly low though... +---+ |Filename: xt8c.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2411| +---+ -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
One reason the DAC60 sounds so good is the use of the Burr Brown PCM1704U-K parallel P2P DAC. This state-of-the-art device was originally developed for super high end applications. Among the most famous units using the chip were the Mark Levinson 30.6 and the $20,000 Linn CD12 CD player. Note that this chip was designed with audiophile high performance in mind, by the original Burr Brown company before it was acquired by Texas Instruments. This is the only true 24 bit DAC in the traditional (non delta-sigma) parallel architecture. This approach is considered to be superior in sound quality with excellent jitter rejection. Cost cutting was not a consideration in the design. The chip used to sell for around $30. It's replacement (the delta sigma PCM1796), costs around $5. -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
opaqueice;179562 Wrote: but it's been proven to be the case with megabuck CD transports versus very cheap ones, so it wouldn't surprise me at all. Maybe someday I'll buy a TP and try it myself. Proven is a very strong statement? Can you show me the proof? I haven't met anyone in my life that cannot tell a difference between a $40 Sony DVD player against a $3000 Cary 303/300. -- 95bcwh 95bcwh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4358 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
95bcwh;179616 Wrote: Proven is a very strong statement, where's the proof by the way? I haven't met anyone in my life that cannot tell a difference between a $200 Sony DVD player against a $3000 Cary 303/300. Really? This of course hasn't been tried with every transport, but I've seen reports on several (maybe 5) such comparisons. In not a single one could people tell the difference; that is, I've *never* seen a blind test in which the participants could distinguish between any two transports or DACs. Have you? That's rather telling, don't you think? These are tests done in good faith, by audiophiles or by researchers. As for proven, it's just what I said - those tests prove that the participants could not reliably distinguish under the circumstances of the test. While that doesn't prove there is no difference, it provides very strong evidence that the differences are very subtle and probably inaudible. I'd be happy to be wrong - it makes life more interesting to have more meaningful options! So I'm always looking for tests like that with a positive result - do you know any? -- opaqueice opaqueice's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4234 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
opaqueice;179645 Wrote: Really? This of course hasn't been tried with every transport, but I've seen reports on several (maybe 5) such comparisons. In not a single one could people tell the difference; that is, I've *never* seen a blind test in which the participants could distinguish between any two transports or DACs. Have you? That's rather telling, don't you think? These are tests done in good faith, by audiophiles or by researchers. As for proven, it's just what I said - those tests prove that the participants could not reliably distinguish under the circumstances of the test. While that doesn't prove there is no difference, it provides very strong evidence that the differences are very subtle and probably inaudible. I'd be happy to be wrong - it makes life more interesting to have more meaningful options! So I'm always looking for tests like that with a positive result - do you know any? Have you tried a few different transports into a DAC? Say, a DAC of the traditional kind that doesn't reject jitter very well. -- P Floding No, I didn't ABX it. And I won't even if you ask me. (Especially not if you ask me.) P Floding's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2932 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
P Floding;179651 Wrote: Have you tried a few different transports into a DAC? Say, a DAC of the traditional kind that doesn't reject jitter very well. A little - once I tried comparing three different transports into one DAC (which was an NOS DAC without any special jitter rejection), and heard no differences. I'm not claiming these differences can never be audible - that would be a blanket statement and certainly false. As I said earlier, I've heard differences, but only when the DAC was distorting due to an impedance mismatch. So my feeling is - and it's just a feeling, it may be wrong, but it's firmly based on both personal experience and public research - that the technology has matured to the point that it can largely be ignored, in contrast to speakers for example. It would be nice to see a single blind study that contests that, but even Stereophile's own data (once you correct their wrong statistical analyses in some cases) show the that these differences are inaudible. -- opaqueice opaqueice's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4234 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I'll probably try a TP when people with upgradeditis start to dump them off at Audiogon! -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
95bcwh;179378 Wrote: It doesn't means that SB3 + DAC60 will be equal to TP Analog out.I'd like to find out how big the differences are though, if it's worth the extra money... -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
95bcwh;179378 Wrote: Therefore, you'd still be better off buying a TP, provided that its presentation is exactly what you've been looking for. Don't expect any short-cut or money-saving alternatives in the attempt to match or beat the TP, Slim Devices is NOT a snake-oil company, the company won't charge you $2k unless there's significant audible improvement over a $300 squeezebox, buying a TP already get you more than what you pay for. I'd be catious here. I certainly agree that SD is not a snake-oil company, and we know the TP digital out measures significantly better than the SB, so you're getting something for your money. But that does not mean there is a significant audible improvement, particularly when another device (the external DAC) is involved. In fact there is strong evidence that jitter-rejecting DACs will sound exactly the same given any digital input that isn't wildly distorted. For the analogue outs I don't know of any reliable listening tests for TP versus SB, but the general trend is that the differences are very small, and if Jan didn't hear a difference between a tube analogue output stage and the TPs I'd be inclined to think he wouldn't hear one between the SB and the TP. -- opaqueice opaqueice's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4234 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
jmourik;179418 Wrote: I'd like to find out how big the differences are though, if it's worth the extra money... Probably not much of a difference, specially when using premium tubes and/or modding on the DAC60. The weak point of the stock SB3, aside from the switcher AC adapter, is the analog circuitry. By cost constraints, the quality of the parts is not comparable to the TP. Obviously the TP is a winner here. Digital is another thing entirely. I believe the SB3 does a great job as a transport using an external DAC. I've seen the innards of the TP and, aside from the nice blue colored Indian made toroidal transformer, it's quite empty inside. Take a look at a DAC60. It uses dual (yes that's 2), cutting edge R core transformers. These transformers are now used by such high-end companies as Audio Research and McIntosh. The six individually regulated stages use devices mounted in deluxe extruded aluminum heatsinks. PCB board material is thick, premium glass epoxy. The DAC60 weighs around 20 lbs. Not bad for a DAC. The reason the DAC60 costs so little is because of chinese assembly. The TP, as suspected by many, has a very high profit margin. -- crooner SB3 with Custom Linear Power Supply Lite Audio DAC-60 Tube DAC VPI Scout with Benz Micro Glider M2 Audio Research PH3, SP16L and VS110 Vandersteen 2Ce signatures, 2W subwoofer. crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
opaqueice;179419 Wrote: Jan didn't hear a difference between a tube analogue output stage and the TPs I'd be inclined to think he wouldn't hear one between the SB and the TP. I definitely hear a difference between the stock SB3 and the TP. Got another chance to listen today, and the Bolder did sound much better today than earlier this week. But I still liked the TP better, the Bolder kind of hurts my ears when for example a guitar is played aggressively. Didn't feel that with the TP. We didn't listen to the dac60 today though. jan -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
If you're trying to justify to yourself NOT spending any extra money for the TP, then good luck to you in finding those people who cannot hear difference between the TP and the SB:) But not from me - who'd spent significant amount of time from stock SB to stock TP to all kinds of mods; and not from the people who have bought the TP and thought that the TP is comparable to a $6k CDP..:) Not that any of these opinions are useful. In fact, I keep reminding people that, opinons are fun to read, and that's where it stops. There's no such thing as reliable listening test except your own ears. If you're going to base any purchase decision based on reading the opinions of the others, I'm afraid you're driving on the wrong lane. opaqueice;179419 Wrote: I'd be catious here. I certainly agree that SD is not a snake-oil company, and we know the TP digital out measures significantly better than the SB, so you're getting something for your money. But that does not mean there is a significant audible improvement, particularly when another device (the external DAC) is involved. In fact there is strong evidence that jitter-rejecting DACs will sound exactly the same given any digital input that isn't wildly distorted. For the analogue outs I don't know of any reliable listening tests for TP versus SB, but the general trend is that the differences are very small, and if Jan didn't hear a difference between a tube analogue output stage and the TPs I'd be inclined to think he wouldn't hear one between the SB and the TP. -- 95bcwh 95bcwh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4358 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
95bcwh;179536 Wrote: Not that any of these opinions are useful. In fact, I keep reminding people that, opinons are fun to read, and that's where it stops. There's no such thing as reliable listening test except your own ears. If you're going to base any purchase decision based on reading the opinions of the others, I'm afraid you're driving on the wrong lane. By reliable I meant controlled for bias, i.e. blind. My attitude is, if several people (or one person with fine hearing and a good system) can't distinguish between two sources - forget it. After all anyone can differentiate between two sources a few dB of volume apart with no difficulty at all - so why stress over something which is impossible to distinguish even when carefully A/B-ed? I'm not saying this is the case with the TP versus SB, but it's been proven to be the case with megabuck CD transports versus very cheap ones, so it wouldn't surprise me at all. Maybe someday I'll buy a TP and try it myself. -- opaqueice opaqueice's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4234 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Yesterday I had the chance to compare the Lite Dac-60, slightly modded by the owner, to a modded Transporter (no idea what the mods are). To my surprise I couldn't hear a difference between them! We were switching back and forth, the dac fed by the digital out of the Transporter, and it sounded the same to me! We already compared the TP to a stock SB3 and a Bolder modded SB2, and of course the TP beat both of them handsomely. So I was quite surprised to find the dac60 to be equal to the TP! I was very surprised, and partly glad, partly disappointed. Glad, because it will save me a lot of money, disappointed, because the TP looks so good... jan -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
jmourik;179108 Wrote: Yesterday I had the chance to compare the Lite Dac-60, slightly modded by the owner, to a modded Transporter (no idea what the mods are). To my surprise I couldn't hear a difference between them! We were switching back and forth, the dac fed by the digital out of the Transporter, and it sounded the same to me! We already compared the TP to a stock SB3 and a Bolder modded SB2, and of course the TP beat both of them handsomely. So I was quite surprised to find the dac60 to be equal to the TP! I was very surprised, and partly glad, partly disappointed. Glad, because it will save me a lot of money, disappointed, because the TP looks so good... jan You were using the Transporter to make the DAC60 better though, due to it's vanishingly low jitter. A better test might have been the Sb3 into DAC60 vs. Transporter, IMHO. I.e. you can't use the Transporter to show how something is it's equal :-) -- Skunk Skunk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2685 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
Skunk;179112 Wrote: I.e. you can't use the Transporter to show how something is it's equal :-) Should be a fair comparison of the DAC part, or not? We did listen to the sb3 + dac60, but no direct comparison. I thought through the sb3 it sounded a bit more edgy, but then again, when we first started listening to the dac60 through the TP, I thought the dac60 sounded more edgy. Until we started a/b comparisons... -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
jmourik;179116 Wrote: Should be a fair comparison of the DAC part, or not? In all honesty it should have been an advantage to the Transporter, since it's DAC is internal, and the LiTe has to go through S-PDIF. Someone here looking to get a LiTe probably has an Sb3 already though, so it seems like a better comparison would be those two versus the Transporter. My original thought was that a lot of DAC's are dependent on the transport, so using the Transporter to feed the LiTe is an advantage most users wouldn't have in the end (unless they have a Northstar etc.). -- Skunk Skunk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2685 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
tomjtx;179127 Wrote: Do you have a chance to compare the modded TP to a stock TP? No, unfortunately we didn't have a stock TP. crooner;179129 Wrote: Yesterday I got a couple of NOS Amperex JAN 7308 white label tubes (1966 vintage) and tried them on the DAC. So where do you buy tubes? Are they easy to replace? jan -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
opaqueice;179162 Wrote: Just out of curiousity, have you ever compared two DACs with the same source and heard a difference? I have, but only when one was distorting due to an impedence mismatch. When both DACs are reasonably well designed and functioning properly, volume matched, and with a decent source, I doubt very much there will be any audible differences. Sure. A Benchmark against a Lavry is very noticible. -Ben -- Ben Diss 'SB3' (http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_squeezebox.html) - 'Lavry DA10' (http://www.lavryengineering.com/productspage_da_10.html) - 'BAT VK-31SE' (http://www.balanced.com/products/line/Vk-31SE/index.html) - 'Halo A21' (http://www.parasound.com/halo/a21.php) - 'BW 803D' (http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/products.models/label/Model%20803D) Ben Diss's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4289 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
I was actually asking Jan, since he has admitted he couldn't hear a difference between two very very different DACs (the Lite DAC 60 has a tubed output). That's consistent with listening tests, for example those showing people can't distinguish between tube amps and solid state or $10,000 CD players and $30 ones, but most audiophiles won't admit to it. So I'm curious whether Jan has heard differences in other DACs. -- opaqueice opaqueice's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4234 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
jmourik;179141 Wrote: No, unfortunately we didn't have a stock TP. So where do you buy tubes? Are they easy to replace? jan I've had bad/mixed luck with Ebay. Believe it or not, people will actually try to take advantage of audiophiles. The best luck I've had is at my local electronic salvage store. They have a general disdain for audiophiles as well, IME, so act like your building a ham radio or something :-) Repairmen bring them in by the crate sometimes. The one I frequent also has an incredible tube tester with about 50 socket types, so you know what you're getting (they'll let you bring your own tubes in as well). His prices are $10 for most unbranded, $20 for most USA, $30 for the exotic stuff. If you know tube markings pretty well, you'll find some of the $10 ones are worth more than the $30 ones. They are designed to be easy to replace, when cool. -- Skunk Skunk's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2685 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
opaqueice;179234 Wrote: I was actually asking Jan, since he has admitted he couldn't hear a difference between two very very different DACs (the Lite DAC 60 has a tubed output). I did hear a difference between an Arcam CD23 FMJ and the Transporter, if that counts :-) But only in direct A/B comparisons, I'm pretty sure I couldn't pick the correct one if I walked out of the room. And the Bolder sounded kind of weird to my ears, like the treble was turned down, and kind of a disconnected sound. Strange. jan -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
By the way, the Bolder SB2, and Modified Transporter are from me. I brought them to the meeting. And of course I have listened to all of them in my system. Jan is talking about transporter feeding the Lite-DAC60 having the same sound as the transporter analog out. I have never listened to this setup so I can't, but I have listened to the stock SB3 feeding the Lite-DAC60 compared with the transporter analog out. In that instance, the transporter is of course warmer, smoother, and goes deeper. The digital section of the modified transporter is probably just as good as a digitally modified squeezebox with Silver/Gold Bybee. It's warm, smooth, no glare. I have listened to the stock transporter but still prefers the digitally modified squeezebox, and now I heard the modified transporter and I was very impressed with it. I cannot comprehend what Jan was referring to as weird sound from the Bolder SB2, it certainly didn't sounded weird to me in my sytem. But there's a bit regrets with the setup Jan listened because all the sources goes through a preamp, whereas my experience has always been running the Bolder SB2 analog out and the transporter analog out directly into the power amp. I didn't get to hear them in similar manner at the meeting because when we set up the transporter directly into the amp, it generated a loud pink noise and that got the host a little nervous. So since then everything has to go through a preamp. Jan was also talking about hearing a difference between the transporter and the ARCAM CDP, from my past memory of listening to the ARCAM, if I am to describe each of them in terms of warmness, the the ranking goes: ARACM Transporter analog out Bolder SB2 analog out Stock SB3 analog out. So the ARCAM is warmest, but warm doesn't means best sound or vice versa. It all depends on what you're looking for, and how well it match with the rest of your gears. -- 95bcwh 95bcwh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4358 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
By the way, the Bolder SB2, and Modified Transporter are from me. I brought them to the meeting. And of course I have listened to all of them in my system. Jan is talking about transporter feeding the Lite-DAC60 having the same sound as the transporter analog out. I have never listened to this setup so I can't, but I have listened to the stock SB3 feeding the Lite-DAC60 compared with the transporter analog out. In that instance, the transporter is of course warmer, smoother, and goes deeper. The digital section of the modified transporter is probably just as good as a digitally modified squeezebox with Silver/Gold Bybee. It's warm, smooth, no glare. I have listened to the stock transporter but still prefers the digitally modified squeezebox, and now I heard the modified transporter and I was very impressed with it. I cannot comprehend what Jan was referring to as weird sound from the Bolder SB2, it certainly didn't sounded weird to me in my sytem. But there's a bit regrets with the setup Jan listened because all the sources goes through a preamp, whereas my experience has always been running the Bolder SB2 analog out and the transporter analog out directly into the power amp. I didn't get to hear them in similar manner at the meeting because when we set up the transporter directly into the amp, it generated a loud pink noise and that got the host a little nervous. So since then everything has to go through a preamp. Jan was also talking about hearing a difference between the transporter and the ARCAM CDP, from my past memory of listening to the ARCAM, if I am to describe each of them in terms of warmness, the the ranking goes: ARACM Transporter analog out Bolder SB2 analog out Stock SB3 analog out. So the ARCAM is warmest, but warm doesn't means best sound or vice versa. It all depends on what you're looking for, and how well it match with the rest of your gears. -- 95bcwh 95bcwh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4358 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
opaqueice;179234 Wrote: I was actually asking Jan, since he has admitted he couldn't hear a difference between two very very different DACs (the Lite DAC 60 has a tubed output). That's consistent with listening tests, for example those showing people can't distinguish between tube amps and solid state or $10,000 CD players and $30 ones, but most audiophiles won't admit to it. So I'm curious whether Jan has heard differences in other DACs. Duh. I should have paid more attention. Thanks for being patient with me. -Ben -- Ben Diss 'SB3' (http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_squeezebox.html) - 'Lavry DA10' (http://www.lavryengineering.com/productspage_da_10.html) - 'BAT VK-31SE' (http://www.balanced.com/products/line/Vk-31SE/index.html) - 'Halo A21' (http://www.parasound.com/halo/a21.php) - 'BW 803D' (http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/products.models/label/Model%20803D) Ben Diss's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4289 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
95bcwh;179293 Wrote: I have listened to the stock SB3 feeding the Lite-DAC60 compared with the transporter analog out. In that instance, the transporter is of course warmer, smoother, and goes deeper. I wish we had compared this, I wanted to try it by hooking both up and synchronizing them, but we didn't have enough time to do that. So now I still have two questions: - how much difference does the TP make vs SB3 as a transport only - how much difference is there between the stock TP and the modded TP. jan -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
jmourik;179343 Wrote: I wish we had compared this, I wanted to try it by hooking both up and synchronizing them, but we didn't have enough time to do that. So now I still have two questions: - how much difference does the TP make vs SB3 as a transport only - how much difference is there between the stock TP and the modded TP. jan If you said TP digital out + DAC60 is equal to TP Analog out, then the different is very significant..:)) The different between stock TP and the modded TP is that the modded TP is smoother and juicier, without the relatively dry and hard analytical sound of the stock TP. I'll leave the rest to your imagination. :) -- 95bcwh 95bcwh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4358 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
95bcwh;179372 Wrote: If you said TP digital out + DAC60 is equal to TP Analog out, then the different is very significant..Which is exactly what I said, that's how we did the A/B comparison. TP analog out into pre input 1, TP digital into dac60 into pre input 2. Easy to switch back and forth. Not easy to hear a difference, well, impossible for me :-) jan PS. the pre (tube pre-amp) was feeding a moscode (with tubes) which was driving a pair of huge speakers... -- jmourik jmourik's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=7123 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
jmourik;179374 Wrote: Which is exactly what I said, that's how we did the A/B comparison. TP analog out into pre input 1, TP digital into dac60 into pre input 2. Easy to switch back and forth. Not easy to hear a difference, well, impossible for me :-) jan Perhaps I didn't emphasize one important point in my previous post, bear in mind that even if TP digital out + DAC60 is equal to TP Analog out. It doesn't means that SB3 + DAC60 will be equal to TP Analog out. Therefore, you'd still be better off buying a TP, provided that its presentation is exactly what you've been looking for. Don't expect any short-cut or money-saving alternatives in the attempt to match or beat the TP, Slim Devices is NOT a snake-oil company, the company won't charge you $2k unless there's significant audible improvement over a $300 squeezebox, buying a TP already get you more than what you pay for. -- 95bcwh 95bcwh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4358 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lite Audio DAC-60 thinking about getting one..
One of the most attractive features of the SB3 is the ability to use external DACs due to the transparent coax output. Since the SB3's design already includes a top notch Burr Brown DAC, an old 1990's outdated DAC or a cheapie little box, I am guessing, is not going to cut it. I want something that would literally blow me away, not just barely audible, if you know what I mean. The minimum requirement for an external DAC would be a tube output stage and/or a more advanced 24 bit DAC chip IMHO. The Benchmark DAC-1 is a nice unit, but the near 1K price tag is a little steep for me. I have come across the Chinese made Lite DAC-60 and it seems to be just what I was looking for. It has two 6922 tubes in the analog buffer and dual Burr Brown 24 bit DACs. Construction is also impressive with two large PS transformers and decent quality parts. The full size chassis has a large machined aluminum front panel which reminds me of the old Sonic Frontiers products. The price is $475 air shipped from the factory. My Audio Research PH3 phono stage also uses 6922s, so I am quite familiar with them. I even have some NOS Bugle Boy 6DJ8s that I can use for tube rolling ;-) I think I am going to go for this one. Sounds like one heck of a deal to me. Best, crooner +---+ |Filename: dacfront.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=851| +---+ -- crooner crooner's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3379 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20789 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
