date:20060907

Re: [css-d] Gaps IE6 not FF or IE7

2006-09-07 Thread OOzy Pal

On 9/7/06, Yuna Boelmans <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> seems the .Grey container is the problem, set the width to 165px
> (minus 2 for the borders). this should fix the problem
>
> i'm not sure what you mean by content not expanding all the way?
>
> yuna
>
>
>
> On 9/7/06, OOzy Pal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Dears
> >
> > I have two problems in IE6 inly not in FF or IE7.
> >
> > 1. 1px shift in border
> > 2. Content will not expand all the way.
> >
> > Looking at the site using IE6 will clear the issue.
> >
> > http://codg.bjaili.com/13/
> >
> >
> > --
> > OOzy
> > Kubuntu-Dapper
> > __
> > css-discuss [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > http://www.css-discuss.org/mailman/listinfo/css-d
> > IE7b2 testing hub -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=IE7
> > List wiki/FAQ -- http://css-discuss.incutio.com/
> > Supported by evolt.org -- http://www.evolt.org/help_support_evolt/
> >
>

I mean about the content not expanding is if look at the right bottom
corrner of #Main you can see that there is a gap i.e. #Main is not
expanding even though, I am puting height: 100%.

My design is three cols with bottom footer row. The third col (right)
is the Main which does go to the same height as the other ones.

-- 
OOzy
Kubuntu-Dapper
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[css-d] clearing problem

2006-09-07 Thread beat.beer


Hi Folks

I have a strange clearing problem. In this site

http://www.stardesign.ch/startup1/kontakt.html

I use a navigation



home
über uns
Angebote
Anfahrt
Kontakt
Links
Impressum



 with the according css


#nav {
background: #999;
margin: 0;
clear: both;
color: white;
}
#navlist
{
margin: 0;
border-bottom: 1px solid #CCFF00;
background: #999;
border-color: #ff9600;
padding: 8px 0 20px;
border-width: 1px;
}

#navlist ul, #navlist li
{
margin: 0;
padding: 0;
display: inline;
list-style-type: none;
}

#navlist a, a:link, #navlist a:visited
{
float: left;
line-height: 14px;
font-weight: bold;
margin: 0 10px 4px 15px;
text-decoration: none;
color: white;
}

body#one #tone a, body#two #ttwo a, body#three #tthree a, body#four  
#tfour a, body#five #tfive a, body#six #tsix a

{
border-bottom: 4px solid #ccff33;
padding-bottom: 2px;
background: transparent;
border-color: #ff9600;
}

#navlist a:hover { color: #ff9600; }


But this css is overriding my links in the content container, even  
when I've used a general link description. What could this be?


thanks for the help


mit freundlichen Grüssen

Beat Beer

--

stardesign
Beat Beer
untere Kirchenzelg 5
3115 Gerzensee
Switzerland





phone: ++41 31 781 4620
mobile: ++41 79 325 1448
mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: www.stardesign.ch


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[css-d] Automatically scaling fonts

2006-09-07 Thread Pete Home

Is there a way to scale the font size as the window size increases? I am
working on an elastic layout that works fin when the browser window is
increased and reduced, however, the fonts do not increase or decrease in
size so I end up with blank space when the window size is big and
over-flowed text when it's small. I'd like the text size to increase as
well.

I suppose I could do something with Javascript, but I'd rather not.

Regards
Pete
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Re: [css-d] alternative to inline-block

2006-09-07 Thread Brian Cummiskey


> Aha.
> #navbar is not floated. And yes it better has 'layout' in order to  
> contain and constrain the floated ul inside of it.
> options as 'layout triggers': width, height, zoom:1,
> Zoom:1 is probably the best option: hidden from other browsers, and  
> will work for both IE 6 and 7.
> If you worry about validation, put it in a conditional comment.
> inline-block is a bit dangerous, at the moment, IE doesn't implement  
> it correctly at all for block-level elements, it only acts as a  
> 'layout' trigger, but  who knows what happen tomorrow.
the zoom:1 works the same as display:inline-block so i guess I will use 
that.

Thanks for the help Philippe.
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Re: [css-d] Site Check again please

2006-09-07 Thread Mike & Martha

- Original Message - 
From: "Professional Web Pages - Information" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Friday, September 08, 2006 12:50 AM
Subject: [css-d] Site Check again please

> Hi,
>
> I  have fixed the site for 800x600
>
> It was easier then what I first thought it to be, I just had to remove 2 
> px off everything in the stylesheet
>
>
> Once again could I please ask for www.TarotCardCombinations.com to be 
> checked and could somone please explain why I am getting the warnings in 
> the CSS validator and how to fix it
>
> Regards
> PWP
> __

They are _harmless_ warnings and can be safely ignored! It would be a very 
rare set of circumstances where you would actually need to set the 
background-color to prevent problems.

You can just add {background-color : inherit;} to each of the specifications 
that are giving the warnings now, and they will go away.

Michael S. Rose
Bluegrass Plus Events Calendar
http://mmrose.home.comcast.net/ 

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Re: [css-d] Site Check Please

2006-09-07 Thread ~davidLaakso

Professional Web Pages - Information wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Can you please check
>
> http://www.tarotcardcombinations.com/
>
> Also can someone tell me why I am getting those warnings in the CSS 
> validatorespecially with CntBody...because it has a background color in 
> it... and how to solve it..
>
>
> PWPaust
xp :: ie/ff/opera
Some suggestions you may want to consider:
-- Re-set all instances of text-align: justify; to text-align: left; 
(this will dry up the rivers)
-- Try adding Georgia as the first font in the TNR, Times, serif  
font-family string (in the body declaration). This  /may/ help to make 
your page less "ordinary."
-- Unlock the frozen fonts in ie ( set percent for the base font-size on 
the body declaration, and use percent to set individual selectors 
throughout the remainder of your stylesheet )
-- Delete all instances of height on the container (this will prevent 
the text shooting out the bottom on font zoom)
--Re-check all your pages in all browsers with font-zoom
--I think you can probably safely ignore the CSS validation service 
warnings (they are warnings not errors) .
--Personally, I'd ditch the validation links-- you are setting yourself, 
and your client, up.
I did not wait for these mac/win2000/ screen captures to load (30):

Good luck.
Best,
~dL

-- 
http://chelseacreekstudio.com/

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[css-d] Site Check again please

2006-09-07 Thread Professional Web Pages - Information

Hi,

I  have fixed the site for 800x600

It was easier then what I first thought it to be, I just had to remove 2 px off 
everything in the stylesheet


Once again could I please ask for www.TarotCardCombinations.com to be checked 
and could somone please explain why I am getting the warnings in the CSS 
validator and how to fix it

Regards
PWP
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Re: [css-d] alternative to inline-block

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh

On Sep 8, 2006, at 1:28 PM, Brian Cummiskey wrote:

> Philippe Wittenbergh wrote:
>> If that menu is floated, it already 'hasLayout' [1]
>> I suspect something else is going on with it.
>> Do you have a sample url ?
>
> No sample URL to post right now, but Here's the basic markup and css:
>
> [snip]
>
>
>
> #navbar {
>display: inline-block;/* ie6 fix */
>background: #036;
>color: #fff;
>padding: 0;
>margin: 0;
> }
>
> #navbar ul {
>margin: 0 5px 0 5px;
>padding: 6px 4px 6px 4px;
> }
>
> #navbar ul.fleft {
>float: left;
> }
>
> #navbar ul.fright {
>float: right;
> }
>
> [snip]
>
> Without the display:inline-block, the menu is all messed up in IE6.

Aha.
#navbar is not floated. And yes it better has 'layout' in order to  
contain and constrain the floated ul inside of it.
options as 'layout triggers': width, height, zoom:1,
Zoom:1 is probably the best option: hidden from other browsers, and  
will work for both IE 6 and 7.
If you worry about validation, put it in a conditional comment.
inline-block is a bit dangerous, at the moment, IE doesn't implement  
it correctly at all for block-level elements, it only acts as a  
'layout' trigger, but  who knows what happen tomorrow.

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh

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[css-d] cancel site check please

2006-09-07 Thread Professional Web Pages - Information

Hi,

Please do not check the site, it is too big for 800x600 res

I will fix it and then ask again.
Sorry for the inconvenience

Thanks
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[css-d] Site Check Please

2006-09-07 Thread Professional Web Pages - Information

Hi,

Can you please check

http://www.tarotcardcombinations.com/

Also can someone tell me why I am getting those warnings in the CSS 
validatorespecially with CntBody...because it has a background color in 
it... and how to solve it..

Thanks for the feedback



Thanks
PWPaust
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Re: [css-d] alternative to inline-block

2006-09-07 Thread Brian Cummiskey

Philippe Wittenbergh wrote:
> If that menu is floated, it already 'hasLayout' [1]
> I suspect something else is going on with it.
> Do you have a sample url ?

No sample URL to post right now, but Here's the basic markup and css:

mast head///

View All 
Items
View Clothing
View 
Accessories

About the 
E-Store
President's 
Letter
FAQs

body//
footer/

#navbar {
display: inline-block;/* ie6 fix */
background: #036;
color: #fff;
padding: 0;
margin: 0;
}

#navbar ul {
margin: 0 5px 0 5px;
padding: 6px 4px 6px 4px;
}

#navbar ul.fleft {
float: left;
}

#navbar ul.fright {
float: right;
}

#navbar ul li {
list-style-type: none;
display: inline;
margin: 0;
padding: 6px 4px 6px 4px;
}

#navbar ul li a {
margin: 0;
padding: 6px 4px 6px 4px;
color: white;
background: inherit;
font-weight: bold;
font-size: 1.1em;
text-decoration: none;
}

#navbar ul li a:hover {
color: #222;
background: #CBD3DB;
text-decoration: underline;
}

Without the display:inline-block, the menu is all messed up in IE6. 
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Re: [css-d] Avoiding empty pages in print - any ideas?

2006-09-07 Thread Tom Livingston

> > I've created a print.css that does what I want most of the time.
> > However, every now and then I end up with empty pages. Does anyone know
> > of a trick I could use to loose at least the last empty page? I've
> > searched high and low, but I can't find something workable.
> >

Sorry, no time to peek...

Are you floating major sections of the content? Like a 2- or 3-col
layout? Try adding to (or adding period) your print style:

 * {float:none;} <-- or a specific element instead of *

That solved similar things for me. Print is getting tricky for me lately...

HTH


-- 


Tom Livingston | Senior Multimedia Artist | Media Logic |
ph: 518.456.3015x231 | fx: 518.456.4279 | mlinc.com
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Re: [css-d] obsolete?

2006-09-07 Thread Wes Gamble

Donna,

Thanks.  I understand how span works.  Just wanted to here how they had 
been obsoleted :).  I guess that I misunderstood the statement.

Wes

Donna Casey wrote:

>Wes Gamble wrote:
>  
>
>>I saw a comment on the list recently that the  tag was obsolete. 
>>
>>Can anyone explain how that is?
>>
>>
>
>It isn't. Using a span is a great way to hang a class or contextual 
>style on an inline element inside a paragraph or list item, for example.
>
>some text here is blue. but this text is 
>red.
>
>p.foo {
>color:blue;
>}
>.foo span {
>color:red;
>}
>
>simplified, but you get the idea, right? You could as easily create a 
>span class rather than use the contextual approach, but that would mean 
>actually applying the class to more elements, whereas you could simply 
>have as many spans occur within a specific container and the rule 
>automatically applies without affecting non "foo" spans.
>
>Donna
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>  
>
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Re: [css-d] obsolete?

2006-09-07 Thread Wes Gamble

Donna,

Thanks.  I understand how span works.  Just wanted to here how they had 
been obsoleted :).  I guess that I misunderstood the statement.

Wes

Donna Casey wrote:

>Wes Gamble wrote:
>  
>
>>I saw a comment on the list recently that the  tag was obsolete. 
>>
>>Can anyone explain how that is?
>>
>>
>
>It isn't. Using a span is a great way to hang a class or contextual 
>style on an inline element inside a paragraph or list item, for example.
>
>some text here is blue. but this text is 
>red.
>
>p.foo {
>color:blue;
>}
>.foo span {
>color:red;
>}
>
>simplified, but you get the idea, right? You could as easily create a 
>span class rather than use the contextual approach, but that would mean 
>actually applying the class to more elements, whereas you could simply 
>have as many spans occur within a specific container and the rule 
>automatically applies without affecting non "foo" spans.
>
>Donna
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>
>  
>
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Re: [css-d] obsolete?

2006-09-07 Thread Donna Casey

Wes Gamble wrote:
> I saw a comment on the list recently that the  tag was obsolete. 
> 
> Can anyone explain how that is?

It isn't. Using a span is a great way to hang a class or contextual 
style on an inline element inside a paragraph or list item, for example.

some text here is blue. but this text is 
red.

p.foo {
color:blue;
}
.foo span {
color:red;
}

simplified, but you get the idea, right? You could as easily create a 
span class rather than use the contextual approach, but that would mean 
actually applying the class to more elements, whereas you could simply 
have as many spans occur within a specific container and the rule 
automatically applies without affecting non "foo" spans.

Donna
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Re: [css-d] Font choices - Safari acting up (beginner question)

2006-09-07 Thread Felix Miata

On 06/09/08 08:21 (GMT+0900) Philippe Wittenbergh apparently typed:

> On Sep 8, 2006, at 4:03 AM, richard n wrote:

>> In the site I'm creating I've set up the fonts for the Body tag  
>> like so:

>> 'font: small "Gill Sans Light", "Gill Sans", "Trebuchet MS",  
>> Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;'

>> (I believe that Gill Sans and Gill Sans Light are supplied as standard
>> with OSX. They're unlikely to be on the average PC, so Trebuchet is  
>> for them.)

>> Previewing in different browsers on my Mac, I see Gill Sans Light in
>> Firefox, Opera and even IE Mac 5.2.3.

>> Safari, however, won't display Gill Sans Light - it displays Gill  
>> Sans.

> You need to use the Postscript name of the font: 'GillSans-Light' for  
> Safari, otherwise Safari uses the 'regular' weight
> font: small 'GillSans-Light', 'Gill Sans Light', 'Gill Sans', ..

Another problem with Gill Sans is that Lotus Smartsuite shipped with some that 
don't work right. Here are samples from the system font palette:

Condensed: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/SS/font-gillsanscond.jpg
Normal: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/SS/font-gillsansnorm-good.jpg
Ultra Bold: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/SS/font-gillsansubld.jpg

WordPro can use them properly, but Gecko won't. If all three are installed, 
ultra bold is what Gecko always uses if roman is requested. If you uninstall 
ultra bold, then Gecko will use condensed. Gecko will only use normal
if the other two are removed from the system. That can produce some rather 
strange looking pages: 
http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/SS/font-gillsans-fawny-sm101Eplus120.jpg

Test page: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/auth/Font/font-gillsans.html
-- 
"Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Though it cost all you
have, get understanding. Esteem her, and she will exalt you;
embrace her, and she will honor you."   Proverbs 4:7-8 NIV

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/
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Re: [css-d] alternative to inline-block

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh


On Sep 8, 2006, at 12:37 AM, Brian Cummiskey wrote:

> I have a menu that is floated, and the only way it renders  
> correctly in
> ie6 is if it gets a hasLayout attribute.  I added display: inline- 
> block
> to the container div, and all is well. except, it doesn't  
> validate.

If that menu is floated, it already 'hasLayout' [1]
I suspect something else is going on with it.
Do you have a sample url ?

[1] 
>

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh





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Re: [css-d] obsolete?

2006-09-07 Thread Ed Seehouse

On 9/7/06, Wes Gamble <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I saw a comment on the list recently that the  tag was obsolete.
>
> Can anyone explain how that is?

It isn't.  It is however much abused and often used when another
semantic tag would do a lot better IMO.  xxx for example, is a travesty.  SPAN is badly overused
but by no means obsolete.  It provides a way of grouping inline
elements or text when no appropriately semantic other inline tag
exists for a particular purpose.

-- 
Ed Seedhouse
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Re: [css-d] collapsing heights/widths for inline divs

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh


On Sep 8, 2006, at 9:33 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> problem is inline divs with dimensions that collapse when div is  
> set to
> display inline -
>
> - http://www.fatgraffix.com/testing/test_03-inlinedivs/
>
> i'm assuming that inline elements can't have specified widths and  
> heights -
> is this true - ?

width and height do not apply to inline elements (or elements set to  
display:inline)



Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh





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Re: [css-d] collapsing heights/widths for inline divs

2006-09-07 Thread Ed Seehouse

On 9/7/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> problem is inline divs with dimensions that collapse when div is set to
> display inline -

Of course they do - they are supposed to.

> i'm assuming that inline elements can't have specified widths and heights -
> is this true - ?

Pretty much, though you can give an inline box a line-height which
acts a lot like vertical padding.

We often talk about the box model, but really there are *two* box
models - one for block boxes and another for inline boxes.

DIVs shouldn't be used for inline anyway - that's what SPANs are for.

-- 
Ed Seedhouse
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[css-d] obsolete?

2006-09-07 Thread Wes Gamble

I saw a comment on the list recently that the  tag was obsolete. 

Can anyone explain how that is?

Thanks,
Wes
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[css-d] collapsing heights/widths for inline divs

2006-09-07 Thread [EMAIL PROTECTED]

hi all - 

problem is inline divs with dimensions that collapse when div is set to
display inline - 

- http://www.fatgraffix.com/testing/test_03-inlinedivs/

i'm assuming that inline elements can't have specified widths and heights -
is this true - ?

thx to all for your help...

=fgx=


mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .


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Re: [css-d] Font choices - Safari acting up (beginner question)

2006-09-07 Thread richard n

Great tip. I would never have guessed. Thank you.

Can anyone recommend a site that has an in-depth discussion of styling 
text with CSS?

Richard





> 
> On Sep 8, 2006, at 4:03 AM, richard n wrote:
> 
>> In the site I'm creating I've set up the fonts for the Body tag like so:
>> 
>> 'font: small "Gill Sans Light", "Gill Sans", "Trebuchet MS", Helvetica,
>> Arial, sans-serif;'
>> 
>> (I believe that Gill Sans and Gill Sans Light are supplied as standard
>> with OSX. They're unlikely to be on the average PC, so Trebuchet is for
>> them.)
>> 
>> Previewing in different browsers on my Mac, I see Gill Sans Light in
>> Firefox, Opera and even IE Mac 5.2.3.
>> 
>> Safari, however, won't display Gill Sans Light - it displays Gill Sans.
> 
> You need to use the Postscript name of the font: 'GillSans-Light' for 
> Safari, otherwise Safari uses the 'regular' weight
> font: small 'GillSans-Light', 'Gill Sans Light', 'Gill Sans', ..
> 
> Philippe
> ---
> Philippe Wittenbergh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [css-d] CSS for a telescoping menu

2006-09-07 Thread francky

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

>I have a telescoping menu (controlled by JavaScript). All that works 
>wonderfully, but my problem is the links contained in the list. When the 
>background for the L2 links changes, it only changes the backgrounds of 
>the links. I want the whole 130px width to change it's background.
>
>li.L2, li.L2over {
>list-style:none;
>margin-top:-.25em;
>text-decoration:none;
>width:130px;
>}
>.L2 a, .L2 a:link, .L2 a:visited, .L2 span {
>background:none;
>color:#900;
>height:1.5em;
>line-height:1.5em;
>padding-left:10px;
>text-decoration: none;
>width:130px;
>}
>.L2 a:hover, .L2over span {
>background:none;
>background-color:#900;
>color:#fff;
>cursor:pointer;
>height:1.5em;
>line-height:1.5em;
>padding-left:10px;
>text-decoration: none;
>width:130px;
>}
>
>My Flagship
>
>My 
>Home
>My 
>Loans
>My 
>Tasks
>My 
>Alerts
>My Settings
>id="flagshipsettings">
>href="blah">Change Password
>href="blah">User Profile
>
>
>href="blah">Training
>
>
>  
>
Hi Marc,
It smells like adding { display: block; } to the a's, but I didn't test.

Greetings,
francky

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Re: [css-d] Font choices - Safari acting up (beginner question)

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh


On Sep 8, 2006, at 4:03 AM, richard n wrote:

> In the site I'm creating I've set up the fonts for the Body tag  
> like so:
>
> 'font: small "Gill Sans Light", "Gill Sans", "Trebuchet MS",  
> Helvetica,
> Arial, sans-serif;'
>
> (I believe that Gill Sans and Gill Sans Light are supplied as standard
> with OSX. They're unlikely to be on the average PC, so Trebuchet is  
> for
> them.)
>
> Previewing in different browsers on my Mac, I see Gill Sans Light in
> Firefox, Opera and even IE Mac 5.2.3.
>
> Safari, however, won't display Gill Sans Light - it displays Gill  
> Sans.

You need to use the Postscript name of the font: 'GillSans-Light' for  
Safari, otherwise Safari uses the 'regular' weight
font: small 'GillSans-Light', 'Gill Sans Light', 'Gill Sans', ..

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh





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Re: [css-d] Examples of true pure semantic XHTML web sites using css?

2006-09-07 Thread Gunlaug Sørtun

Audra Coldiron wrote:
>> http://designerkarma.com

> If you tried to validate it failed due to my own poor mark-up in the
>  content, not the skeleton.  That's what I get for trying to do too
> many things at once.  All's fixed now though, thanks for pointing it
> out :-)

I usually don't bother to run XHTML documents through the validator, but
instead just check if they survive when served with a proper MIME type.
Most don't, but yours is looking fine now :-)

HTML Tidy would like to add...
/**/
...but that's all.

regards
Georg
-- 
http://www.gunlaug.no
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[css-d] CSS for a telescoping menu

2006-09-07 Thread MarcLuzietti

I have a telescoping menu (controlled by JavaScript). All that works 
wonderfully, but my problem is the links contained in the list. When the 
background for the L2 links changes, it only changes the backgrounds of 
the links. I want the whole 130px width to change it's background.

li.L2, li.L2over {
list-style:none;
margin-top:-.25em;
text-decoration:none;
width:130px;
}
.L2 a, .L2 a:link, .L2 a:visited, .L2 span {
background:none;
color:#900;
height:1.5em;
line-height:1.5em;
padding-left:10px;
text-decoration: none;
width:130px;
}
.L2 a:hover, .L2over span {
background:none;
background-color:#900;
color:#fff;
cursor:pointer;
height:1.5em;
line-height:1.5em;
padding-left:10px;
text-decoration: none;
width:130px;
}

My Flagship

My 
Home
My 
Loans
My 
Tasks
My 
Alerts
My Settings

Change Password
User Profile


Training



-- 
Marc Luzietti
Flagship Project
Bayview Financial, L.P.
(305) 341-5624
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Re: [css-d] Firefox 100% Height

2006-09-07 Thread francky

Bradley Wright wrote:

> > This problem I'm sure many have had, I need my page background to
> > stretch 100% of the page in an absolute div. But in Firefox, It will
> > go 100% until it scrolls. Then the background stops.
>
>I think (from memory) that this fixes the issue:
>
>html, body {
>   margin: 0;
>   padding: 0;
>   min-height: 100%;
>}
>
>* html, * html body {
>   height: 100%;
>}
>
>body {
>   /* background styles */
>}
>  
>
Hi Jeff,
And if this doesn't work, I guess you can split up the backgrounds for 
header, navbar, main and footer; then the background oimage for the #all 
wrapper can be mised.
For a raw impression *): see testpage 
.

Greetings,
francky

*)
I only adapted the main-section, with existing css. With fresh css it 
can be simplified. :-)
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Re: [css-d] Examples of true pure semantic XHTML web sites using css?

2006-09-07 Thread Audra Coldiron

> http://designerkarma.com


> Pity it doesn't survive when properly served, as 'application/xhtml+xml'...
> ( XML parsing failed: syntax error (Line: 114, Character: 44) )
> Might have been more useful then, and in accordance with XHTML 1.0
> standard. Shouldn't be too difficult to achieve.

If you tried to validate it failed due to my own poor mark-up in the 
content, not the skeleton.  That's what I get for trying to do too many 
things at once.  All's fixed now though, thanks for pointing it out :-)


-- 
Audra Coldiron

Rock-n-Roll Design & Hosting
http://rock-n-roll-design.com

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Re: [css-d] Navbar disappearing in IE and spacing questions

2006-09-07 Thread francky

Anne E. Shroeder wrote:

>I'm having a great weirdness in IE - my dark blue navigation bar is simply 
>disappearing.  It works fine in Firefox, and I'm really puzzled as to what 
>is causing it to simply not display at all in IE.  There are two examples of 
>this phenomenon:
>http://www.language-works.com/swimdesign/template-public-1.htm
>http://www.language-works.com/swimdesign/template-1.htm
>  
>
Hi Anne,
This is one of the "hasLayout" issues in IE [1].
With giving the #bluenavBar container an imaginary {height: 1%;} it can 
be solved.
See testpage 1 
.
Also in this testpage: with a {vertical-align: bottom;} for the header 
image, the IE gap between the header and the bluenavBar can be closed.
Even although not indicated, IE thinks the image is on a paragraph line 
with text, and positions it at the height of the bottom of a letter with 
a tail (as an y).

>I have two other questions :)
>(1) On this page: 
>http://www.language-works.com/swimdesign/template-public-1.htm 
>
Here in IE (IE6 on my Win98SE) my eyes got attracted immidiately to the 
messing up of the "Regions" and "Products" tabs; only after some 
hovering you see the right place.
Again a positioning error of IE, this time it can be solved with giving 
a { position: relative;} to the containing table.
See testpage 2 
.
Also in this testpage some adaptations to make it possible for FF and 
other bowsers to enlarge the browser font scale, without breaking this 
table.
See source code.
Now to serve also the "Products" you have to change the ID #tabnavbar in 
a class="tabnavbar"; an ID is an unique IDentification, allowed only 
once in 1 page.

>the grey box 
>on the right is not flush with the margin - is it possible to get it over 
>there?  I've checked the margin definition and it is 0, so I'm not sure how 
>else to accomplish that.
>  
>
I see this problem is melted by the assigning of the 1% height to the 
bluenavbar. :-)

>(2) I need a grey line to go over the footer navigation - right now I'm just 
>using an  tag and specifying a width, but really the grey bar needs to 
>expand or contract along with the text under it.  Any ideas how to 
>accomplish that?
>  
>
For instance: making a  with a border-top around the footer links.
Implemented in testpage 2.

>I apologize if these are naive questions - i'm still struggling through the 
>maze of CSS-dom.
>
>Anne
>
If it is about IE-errors, no naive questions exists, only a naive 
browser (or something like that). ;-)
See also [2].

Greetings,
francky

[1]
Ingo Chao: OnHavingLayout 


[2]
PIE: Explorer Exposed! 
PIE: Internet Explorer vs. the Standards 

**Community MX: How To Attack An Internet Explorer (Win) Display Bug 

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[css-d] IE hack for center images, center linked captions

2006-09-07 Thread Sandra Davis

Suggestions please? 

http://www.keshavhowe.com/7/upcoming_intensives.php

The CSS code for this is all at the bottom of keshav.css, all what I'm
calling the 'grid' - where I'm lining up images & links below, all
centered. Beautiful in FF, stacks vertically in IE. I need an IE hack.
I'm SURE it's something simple I keep missing...


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[css-d] Image wrapping on window resize in IE

2006-09-07 Thread Alexander Burr

Hi everyone, any help would be great:

I'm working on re-coding an existing website into XHTML/CSS and am
hitting a small snag: The banner ads section. Using min-width I am
able to get the desired behavior w/ Firefox but (big surprise) not in
IE...

http://www.alexburr.com/yehoodi/3/index.php

In IE when you resize the window down, the banner ad jumps down a line
to fit itself. What I want is for it to wrap under the right-hand
column as it does in IE...

Any thoughts? Thanks in advance...

- A Burr
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[css-d] Font choices - Safari acting up (beginner question)

2006-09-07 Thread richard n

In the site I'm creating I've set up the fonts for the Body tag like so:

'font: small "Gill Sans Light", "Gill Sans", "Trebuchet MS", Helvetica, 
Arial, sans-serif;'

(I believe that Gill Sans and Gill Sans Light are supplied as standard 
with OSX. They're unlikely to be on the average PC, so Trebuchet is for 
them.)

Previewing in different browsers on my Mac, I see Gill Sans Light in 
Firefox, Opera and even IE Mac 5.2.3.

Safari, however, won't display Gill Sans Light - it displays Gill Sans.

Anyone know why?

Thanks

Richard




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Re: [css-d] Examples of true pure semantic XHTML web sites using css?

2006-09-07 Thread Gunlaug Sørtun

Audra Coldiron wrote:
> http://designerkarma.com

> [...] They are all totally necessary to have nearly complete design 
> flexibility while working with the same skeleton.

I'll say a 'conditional yes' to that - given the current standards, but
are those inline styles necessary too?

> I've often thought we'd get the same people saying the same thing 
> about our system... that is, until they use it and see the utility of
>  it ;-)

Pity it doesn't survive when properly served, as 'application/xhtml+xml'...
( XML parsing failed: syntax error (Line: 114, Character: 44) )
Might have been more useful then, and in accordance with XHTML 1.0
standard. Shouldn't be too difficult to achieve.

regards
Georg
-- 
http://www.gunlaug.no
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Re: [css-d] Wiki Updated - IE on Linux

2006-09-07 Thread Aaron Gray

Good stuff.

A near enough a straight install on Fedora - apart from a checksum error 
on one file which I did a wget on and reran the installer and it worked 
fine.

A a bit buggy on the left hand favorites/search bar resizing, maybe 
other bugs too.

Great for checking out layouts though.

Thanks,

Aaron

Felix Miata wrote:
> It's now easy to test for yourself using IE on Linux.
>
> Screenshot: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/SS/kde-IE6.gif
>
> Howto link: http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/index-en.html
>
> Updated wiki page: http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=BrowserTesting
>
> It wasn't entirely simple, as it complained about old Wine version when I 
> tried installing it on my SUSE 10.0 system. When I tried to start it, it 
> crashed before finishing loading. I then tried on a newer Linux version
> equipped with a newer Wine, and it installed quickly and easily. The result 
> you can see in the screenshot. I didn't change very much on the wiki page. 
> Someone else might want to tweak it.
>   
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Re: [css-d] Layout check please- was "Table squirting out of DIV"

2006-09-07 Thread Gunlaug Sørtun

rollandburn wrote:

> http://blog.html.it/layoutgala/LayoutGala24.html
> 
> div#wrapper{float:right;width:100%;margin-left:-200px} 
> div#content{margin-left:200px}

Try to think of it like this:
1: div#wrapper will show up as a 100% wide float-container, but will
/only take up space/ equivalent to '100% minus 200px' (regardless of how
much that is).
That leaves 200px empty space on the left side.

2: div#content will stay 200px away from the left edge of div#wrapper,
so it won't cover up the empty space on the left side.

Result: there's 200px empty space for 'navigation' and 'more stuff here'
to stay in.

Method with 'negative margins' on floats is best described here...

...and your LayoutGala example is just a variation.

This example on my site is a bit "overdone"...

...but the entire page-layout and the 'removed floats' rely entirely on
the same 'negative margins' method as described in the ALA article. A
useful bit of standard float-behavior.

regards
Georg
-- 
http://www.gunlaug.no
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Re: [css-d] Examples of true pure semantic XHTML web sites using css?

2006-09-07 Thread Audra Coldiron

Paul Novitski wrote:

> At 9/6/2006 03:13 AM, David Dorward wrote:
> 
>>One of the major critisms of CSS Zen Garden is
>>that it is laden down with vast numbers of divs and spans which are
>>there solely to hook CSS onto.
> 
> 
> 
> I find it hard to take seriously criticism that the Zen Garden page 
> has too many tags!  That would be like criticizing an actor for 
> having too many colors of greasepaint in her kit.  The Zen Garden 
> page isn't a model for every web page -- it's marked up specifically 
> to achieve its goal of multitudinous reskinnability.  

I totally agree.  I could never understand that criticism either.  In 
fact, I'm such a big fan of the Zen Garden my developer parter and I 
have created a CMS that works around the same principle.  Everything has 
an ID and/or a class and in many cases multiple classes.  Divs wrap most 
everything and there are spans here and there that at first glance you'd 
question too.  They are all totally necessary to have nearly complete 
design flexibility while working with the same skeleton.

I've often thought we'd get the same people saying the same thing about 
our system... that is, until they use it and see the utility of it ;-)

If anyone's curious you can check it out here: http://designerkarma.com

-- 
Audra Coldiron

Rock-n-Roll Design & Hosting
http://rock-n-roll-design.com
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[css-d] putting it all together (side-scrolling portfolio)

2006-09-07 Thread richard n

Thanks for the tips on my dropdown navigation menu.

I'm starting to wonder whether ANY dropdown is a bit too fancy (from a 
user, rather than a code, perspective).

But to make a decision, I need to get the dropdown up-and-running with 
the scrolling gallery.

However I can't for the life of me figure out how to do the layout!

Here's what I've got (pink and green backgrounds inserted to help me 
try to figure out what's going wrong). It looks similarly wrong in FF 
Mac and Safari. (Probably not worth checking in IE at the moment as 
that will introduce more errors.)

http://www.richardnicholson.com/testing/menu_gallery.html

What I want:

- name + navigation all on the same horizontal level.
- name + navigation expand simply to the right (without wrapping, and 
maintaining spacing) when the text is enlarged.
- name + navigation fixed at top, as if in a frame (I've accomplished 
this by putting name + nav in a fixed topbar div - but I gather I need 
a workaround to get working in IE).

At the moment the navigation is dropping downwards, below the level of 
my name. To fix this I've tried everything - pixels, margins, boxes, 
positioning, pixels, ems etc

I think the HTML is ok - clean and simple.

So I must be doing something wrong with the CSS.

What am I missing

Thanks for any tips.

Richard
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Re: [css-d] Layout check please- was "Table squirting out of DIV"

2006-09-07 Thread rollandburn

Hi again and thanks Gunlaug.  I don't feel so inept when the solution  
is something I wouldn't have thought of in a million years...hehe.   
Both of your suggestions worked perfectly to fix the footer width and  
gecko 1px line problems.  And you are correct, my test page did not  
validate but it should now validate as html 4.01 strict.

The fact that IE doesn't understand XHTML is news to me and makes me  
wonder if why I've been using XHTML all this time.  (embarassment = 
[)  I think I may have made a mistake saying, "only used by IE on  
pc's in North America"  I should have just left it at, "should  
support firefox and ie on mac and pc".  Sorry for the confusion.

The LayoutGala page with the margins that seemed to cancel each other  
out still confuses me.  The html has a #wrapper directly around only  
the #content.  My confusion comes from not knowing why this example  
needs to shove the #wrapper to the left, then push the #content back  
to the right the same amount.   What problem does the #wrapper solve  
that makes its use necessary?

http://blog.html.it/layoutgala/LayoutGala24.html

div#wrapper{float:right;width:100%;margin-left:-200px}
div#content{margin-left:200px}


  
   ...
  




Thanks!!!

=
Your test page isn't XHTML 1.0, so you should clean it up first, or
change it to HTML 4.01 and mark it up accordingly.

Don't know how your original page is, but the same standard-requirements
should be applied to that too. No IE-version understand XHTML anyway, so
you may as well change it since IE-only is one of _your_ requirements.

Having written that: it shouldn't be much of a problem to clean it up
and  turn it into proper XHTML, that survives if served as
'application/xhtml+xml' if _that_ is a requirement (it is according to
W3C). I just did, and all standard-compliant browsers rendered it
perfectly, but IE/win will of course not play ball. Maybe IE8 will :-)

--


> When scrolling to the right in IE/PC, I notice the footer doesn't
> stretch along 'x' plane all the way when the table is really wide
>
>
IE/win lose track of how wide the page really is, and limits the
footer-width to the window-width. It is sometimes a tricky one.

Here is a future-safe hack for IE6 and older versions, which must be
placed - completely with @media rule and all - after all other styles.
Will make IE6 behave - or appear as if it does.

@media screen {
* html #footer {
float: left;
width: 5000%;
margin-right: -4999%;
}
}

I have no idea how IE7 renders that footer, but it won't be disturbed by
the above hack. Neither will any other browser.


> In Firefox PC and Mac i notice at the bottom of the footer a baby
> blue 1px horizontal line where the background image shows through. It
>  comes and goes with keyboard font resizing.
>

The "overprecise" calculation in Gecko tends to "hit and miss" a bit.
The simplest "cover-up" in your case is to pull up the bottom margin on
the footer.

#footer {margin-bottom: -1px)

...should do.

-

Regarding "margins seem to cancel themselves out...", is not so.
The #content {margin-left:12em} is positioning that container so far
from the left edge of #container to make space for navigation. If you
don't need navigation, then you simply change that margin to zero.

Example:

body#with-nav #content {margin-left:12em;}
body#no-nav #content {margin-left:12em;}

...or something like that.


I don't know how many eventualities you have to cover with this layout,
so I can't say if "this layout CSS has all the bases covered" or not.
Given proper (and clean) markup I can't see any problems with it in any
of my browsers.

regards
Georg
-- 
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Re: [css-d] Explorer hack / not only IE...

2006-09-07 Thread francky

francky wrote:

>[...]
>Yes, here's a test page 
>
>  
>
Sorry, wrong link; must be:
test page 


francky
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[css-d] Wiki Updated - IE on Linux

2006-09-07 Thread Felix Miata

It's now easy to test for yourself using IE on Linux.

Screenshot: http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/SS/kde-IE6.gif

Howto link: http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/index-en.html

Updated wiki page: http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=BrowserTesting

It wasn't entirely simple, as it complained about old Wine version when I tried 
installing it on my SUSE 10.0 system. When I tried to start it, it crashed 
before finishing loading. I then tried on a newer Linux version
equipped with a newer Wine, and it installed quickly and easily. The result you 
can see in the screenshot. I didn't change very much on the wiki page. Someone 
else might want to tweak it.
-- 
"Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Though it cost all you
have, get understanding. Esteem her, and she will exalt you;
embrace her, and she will honor you."   Proverbs 4:7-8 NIV

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/
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Re: [css-d] Firefox 100% Height

2006-09-07 Thread Bradley Wright

 > This problem I'm sure many have had, I need my page background to
 > stretch 100% of the page in an absolute div. But in Firefox, It will
 > go 100% until it scrolls. Then the background stops.

I think (from memory) that this fixes the issue:

html, body {
margin: 0;
padding: 0;
min-height: 100%;
}

* html, * html body {
height: 100%;
}

body {
/* background styles */
}
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Re: [css-d] Body background image align to bottom: Firefox

2006-09-07 Thread Zoe M. Gillenwater

Micky Hulse wrote:
>> Generally, there is no best fix for things in CSS. There are multiple 
>> ways to do things. If something works in your layout and target 
>> browsers, and uses the leanest markup or CSS possible, go for it.
>> 
>
> Sounds good to me. And yep, appears to work great in IE6 and Firefox.
>
> I guess I was just surprised to see the body tag shrink-wrapping to my 
> content... I always thought it was more of an invisible element (like 
> html element) - or, well, an element that did not behave like a 
> "container" div... Anyway, thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate 
> your time.  :)
>   

If you want to get even more confused, you should experiment with the 
differences of the body element between HTML and XHTML Strict. :-) The 
body element does not always take up the entire viewport, as you may 
expect it to do.

Anyway, glad you found a solution that worked for you.

Zoe

-- 
Zoe M. Gillenwater
Design Services Manager
UNC Highway Safety Research Center
http://www.hsrc.unc.edu


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Re: [css-d] alternative to inline-block

2006-09-07 Thread Bradley Wright

 > Is there an alternative to display:inline-block that will give a div
 > hasLayout?

It goes a bit against the validation grain, but I suggest using:
zoom: 1;
in a separate CSS file hidden from the validator by conditional 
comments. It's a little more future-proof (since it's a proprietary 
property from MS) than other methods, even if it is completely and 
utterly invalid.
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[css-d] Firefox 100% Height

2006-09-07 Thread Jeff Kilroy

This problem I'm sure many have had, I need my page background to 
stretch 100% of the page in an absolute div. But in Firefox, It will go 
100% until it scrolls. Then the background stops. If anyone has any 
suggestions or fixes. Thank you. - Here is the link:  
|http://www.kilroymultimedia.com/clients/messina/home.html|
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[css-d] alternative to inline-block

2006-09-07 Thread Brian Cummiskey

I have a menu that is floated, and the only way it renders correctly in 
ie6 is if it gets a hasLayout attribute.  I added display: inline-block 
to the container div, and all is well. except, it doesn't validate.  
You and I both know it does, but the validator says otherwise, and 
unfortunately, that is what my client is going to be looking at.

Is there an alternative to display:inline-block that will give a div 
hasLayout?

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[css-d] Navbar disappearing in IE and spacing questions

2006-09-07 Thread Anne E. Shroeder

I'm having a great weirdness in IE - my dark blue navigation bar is simply 
disappearing.  It works fine in Firefox, and I'm really puzzled as to what 
is causing it to simply not display at all in IE.  There are two examples of 
this phenomenon:
http://www.language-works.com/swimdesign/template-public-1.htm
http://www.language-works.com/swimdesign/template-1.htm

I have two other questions :)
(1) On this page: 
http://www.language-works.com/swimdesign/template-public-1.htm the grey box 
on the right is not flush with the margin - is it possible to get it over 
there?  I've checked the margin definition and it is 0, so I'm not sure how 
else to accomplish that.

(2) I need a grey line to go over the footer navigation - right now I'm just 
using an  tag and specifying a width, but really the grey bar needs to 
expand or contract along with the text under it.  Any ideas how to 
accomplish that?

I apologize if these are naive questions - i'm still struggling through the 
maze of CSS-dom.

Anne 

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Re: [css-d] 2 column fixed width

2006-09-07 Thread Cistý design

Thank you everyone!
Your answers really helped me... I have it now.

Jana



>>Hello
>>I was trying to do simple 2 column layout fixed width (not liquid 
>>layout) using float for the left column which contains menu. The 
>>problem I found is that when the menu is longer than the the right 
>>column, it tends to run outside the page area and continues into the 
>>background below the page. Is there any way to fix this? Sometimes 
>>the left column will be longer, sometimes the right one. I need the 
>>page to expand according to either one.
>>
>>I would be grateful for any tips or links...
>>
>>Thank you!
>>
>>Jana Forsyth
> 
> Jana:
> 
> Try looking into faux columns.
> 
> http://alistapart.com/articles/fauxcolumns/
> 
> It's just simply a way to use a background image to make the columns 
> "look" like they're the same size. It works.
> 
> tedd
> -- 
> ---
> http://sperling.com  http://ancientstones.com  http://earthstones.com
> 
>

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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Alex Robinson

I did come up with a fix for Gecko gang which I posted here along 
with reservations

http://archivist.incutio.com/viewlist/css-discuss/77165


>Sent to fast, forgot something or two.
>
>1/ the same problems affect recent WebKit (future Safari) builds and
>the just release Omniweb5.5.
>
>2/ Nobody seems to have a clean picture of what exactly should happen
>in the case of overflow hidden boxes and anchors. There are some
>Gecko bugs open on this, but they have been silent for some months. I
>wonder if a next version of the CSS 2.1 docs doe out soon will
>provide some answers.


Philippe hits the nail on the head.

However the answer to 2, now that Opera and Safari have got in line 
with Gecko and IE's behaviour (as Gecko got in line with IE before), 
is pretty obviously going to be the current anchors jumping within 
the hidden block. The specs will be amended to conform to browser 
behaviour (if necessary - it's arguable that the change from 2 to 2.1 
is already sufficent)
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Re: [css-d] Body background image align to bottom: Firefox

2006-09-07 Thread Micky Hulse

Hi Zoe, thanks for the quick response, much appreciated.

Zoe M. Gillenwater wrote:
> What don't you like about this solution that you are trying to fix? What 
> browsers or content situations doesn't it work with? Do you have a test 
> page?

I have yet to do a browser-cam capture... or I would share that. The 
test page is not really at a point where I can share... sorry. :(

I could do a minimal test page, but I think you have already answered my 
question. :)

> Generally, there is no best fix for things in CSS. There are multiple 
> ways to do things. If something works in your layout and target 
> browsers, and uses the leanest markup or CSS possible, go for it.

Sounds good to me. And yep, appears to work great in IE6 and Firefox.

I guess I was just surprised to see the body tag shrink-wrapping to my 
content... I always thought it was more of an invisible element (like 
html element) - or, well, an element that did not behave like a 
"container" div... Anyway, thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate 
your time.  :)

Cheers,
Micky

-- 
  Wishlist: 
Switch: 
My:  
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Re: [css-d] Avoiding empty pages in print - any ideas?

2006-09-07 Thread Zoe M. Gillenwater

hepabolu wrote:
> Hello list,
>
> I've created a print.css that does what I want most of the time. 
> However, every now and then I end up with empty pages. Does anyone know 
> of a trick I could use to loose at least the last empty page? I've 
> searched high and low, but I can't find something workable.
>
> Also: could people on OS other than Mac or using another default paper 
> size than A4, please let me know if things work out?
>
> on this page it works:
> http://www.origami-osn.nl/minori/model2006-08.html
>
> on this page I end up with an empty page at the end:
> http://www.origami-osn.nl/minori/model2006-07.html
>
> The first obvious idea to make the image smaller is not an option since 
> I might have multiple images.
>   

Helma,

If the image is too big to fit on a piece of paper, with the other 
content that is already there, the browser has only two options: split 
the image across the sheets, or push the whole thing to the next page so 
it can display in one piece. My browser was doing the second option, 
which I think you would agree with me is far preferable to the first 
option in this case, no? So I'm afraid that you'll have to live with it. 
If something doesn't fit, it doesn't fit, unless you make it smaller.

Where the pages break is going to be entirely dependent on the users' 
settings anyway: paper size, paper orientation, whether they have shrink 
to fit turned on, whether they are printing at 50% size, etc. So there's 
only so much you can do to control this. I think the way you have it set 
up now is the best you can do.

Zoe

-- 
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Design Services Manager
UNC Highway Safety Research Center
http://www.hsrc.unc.edu

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Re: [css-d] Body background image align to bottom: Firefox

2006-09-07 Thread Zoe M. Gillenwater

Micky Hulse wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Just wondering if this is the /best fix/ to make an image align to the 
> bottom left of the BODY background for Firefox:
>
>
> html {
>   min-height: 100%;
>   height: auto;
> }
>
> body {
>   url(/le/images/template/bkgrnd-grfk.jpg) no-repeat bottom left;
> }
>
>
> Hehe, it has been a while since I have had to put a background image in 
> the body aligned to the bottom... did not know this was the typical 
> behavior (i.e. having to specify a height for the HTML element.)
>
> Just wondering if there is a better solution, particularly one that 
> works well in all browsers.
>   

What don't you like about this solution that you are trying to fix? What 
browsers or content situations doesn't it work with? Do you have a test 
page?

Generally, there is no best fix for things in CSS. There are multiple 
ways to do things. If something works in your layout and target 
browsers, and uses the leanest markup or CSS possible, go for it.

Zoe

-- 
Zoe M. Gillenwater
Design Services Manager
UNC Highway Safety Research Center
http://www.hsrc.unc.edu


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Re: [css-d] Examples of true pure semantic XHTML web sites using css?

2006-09-07 Thread Zoe M. Gillenwater

Rimantas Liubertas wrote:
> <...>
>   
>> Well, divs have no semantic meaning, so *any* div that you add to a page
>> is for the purpose of design, really. There's no such thing as a
>> semantic div, in the strict sense. But, I doubt you are looking for
>> examples of sites that use neither tables nor divs, as that would be a
>> pretty plain page. So I'm guessing you are looking for pages that
>> structure the chunks of information on the page into divs with
>> meaningful ids (which are nevertheless just there for style) and don't
>> nest divs?
>> 
> <...>
>
> I wouldn't be so strict. 

I'm not. :-) The original poster was, and I replied in kind. If you want 
absolute 100% separation of content and presentation, and pure 
semantics, you can't use divs. But that's pretty silly.

> Divs are/may be used to group related content
> together, just like ol/ul groups a bunch of list items. Yes,  is
> more general in semantic sense, but not without semantic meaning.
> Ids can be used not only for the styling or DOM manipulation. Ids are
> for that their name says - identification which can be useful in many ways.
> Maybe we don't have default meanings for those things, but it does not mean
> we cannot provide them. Class attribute has even less semantic meaning than
> div element, but take microformats and it is no longer meaningless.
>   

No, divs have no semantic meaning, inherently, in the pure sense of the 
word. They can contain anything -- thus, there is no "match" between the 
element and its content. An id can't establish semantics -- again, in 
the pure sense of the word. Divs and aren't non-semantic (like font or 
center elements), they are just a-semantic. Neutral. But this is just a 
debate about pie-in-the-sky theory about the meaning of words. Now, if 
you want to speak more generally, instead of in strict standards-speak, 
and say whether a div with an id of "header" that contains heading 
information for the site is meaningful, yes, it is. That way my point -- 
that all divs are inherently neutral, and are only used for presentation 
purposes, but that doesn't mean that you can't use divs selectively and 
in a meaningful way to create your designs. But this balance (what a 
meaningful div is and what an "extra" div is) is something that is 
determined by each individual.

Zoe

-- 
Zoe M. Gillenwater
Design Services Manager
UNC Highway Safety Research Center
http://www.hsrc.unc.edu

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Re: [css-d] 2 column fixed width

2006-09-07 Thread tedd

At 1:48 PM +0200 9/7/06, =?iso-8859-2?Q?=C8ist=FD_design?= wrote:
>Hello
>I was trying to do simple 2 column layout fixed width (not liquid 
>layout) using float for the left column which contains menu. The 
>problem I found is that when the menu is longer than the the right 
>column, it tends to run outside the page area and continues into the 
>background below the page. Is there any way to fix this? Sometimes 
>the left column will be longer, sometimes the right one. I need the 
>page to expand according to either one.
>
>I would be grateful for any tips or links...
>
>Thank you!
>
>Jana Forsyth

Jana:

Try looking into faux columns.

http://alistapart.com/articles/fauxcolumns/

It's just simply a way to use a background image to make the columns 
"look" like they're the same size. It works.

tedd
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Re: [css-d] Examples of true pure semantic XHTML web sites using css?

2006-09-07 Thread Mihai Manuta

Well now... the only way I can think of you may be able to achieve that
is by providing content xml that is "styled" using xsl into an (x)html
further styled with css.
You can't possibly go from pure content to design. At least not until
CSS3 is widely supported (not soon) and even then I'm not so sure...

Best regards,
Mihai

On Wed, 2006-09-06 at 11:25 +0200, Norgren Mats wrote:

> I want the xhtml documents to be totally free from
> design, all the way!
> 
> I want som examples of nice looking web sites, to show the designers
> that there is nice ways to solve the problem.
> I have looked att css-zen-garden, and that is a cool site, but I want to
> know other web sites that has the same sort of purity in separating code
> from design.

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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Al Sparber

From: "Kay Olson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> http://www.quinebaugkennels.com and the links to the left of the 
> photo are
> the ones I'm concerned about - i.e., private lessons, gun dog 
> training, etc.
> The further down the page the link is, the more or all of the menu
> disappears.
>
> Thanks for any advice - in the meantime, I just added a page up link 
> to each
> section to get the menu to be viewable.

OK. I see it now. Your page does not need to be using that kind of 
hack. Check this lists wiki for "faux columns". You might have to do a 
bit of "remodeling", but it will be more stable. You might want to 
check the wiki for dropdown menus, to replace those nasty Macromedia 
ones, too :-)

-- 
Al 


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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Al Sparber

> I think that is referring to this kind of problems
> 
> With more details from Alex here
>  equalheightproblems>

I see it now. For some reason it does not happen every time for me in 
FF 1.5.0.6 and not at all on other browsers. Thanks for the 
clarification, Philippe. 


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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh

I wrote:

> I think that is referring to this kind of problems
> 
> With more details from Alex here
>  equalheightproblems>

Sent to fast, forgot something or two.

1/ the same problems affect recent WebKit (future Safari) builds and  
the just release Omniweb5.5.

2/ Nobody seems to have a clean picture of what exactly should happen  
in the case of overflow hidden boxes and anchors. There are some  
Gecko bugs open on this, but they have been silent for some months. I  
wonder if a next version of the CSS 2.1 docs doe out soon will  
provide some answers.

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh

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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh


On Sep 7, 2006, at 10:04 PM, Al Sparber wrote:

>> In my experience, this is a known error with the equal height
>> columns
>> hack. The overflow: hidden; that you place on the containing element
>> means that if the div scrolls (as it sometimes does when using
>> anchor
>> elements), it will scroll content off the top of the "page" (or off
>> the
>> top of the visible view port).
>>
>> I'm sorry to say that I have no solution for this--all I can tell
>> you is
>> that you're not crazy. :)
>
> Is this specific to a browser or OS? I cannot duplicate that problem.
> All I see is that the top of page anchor simply goes where it should,
> based on its position in the markup. The page can then be manually
> scrolled from that point. I'm curious to see the problem if someone
> can provide a more detailed description with steps to reporoduce.

I think that is referring to this kind of problems

With more details from Alex here


Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh





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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Al Sparber

> In my experience, this is a known error with the equal height 
> columns
> hack. The overflow: hidden; that you place on the containing element
> means that if the div scrolls (as it sometimes does when using 
> anchor
> elements), it will scroll content off the top of the "page" (or off 
> the
> top of the visible view port).
>
> I'm sorry to say that I have no solution for this--all I can tell 
> you is
> that you're not crazy. :)

Is this specific to a browser or OS? I cannot duplicate that problem. 
All I see is that the top of page anchor simply goes where it should, 
based on its position in the markup. The page can then be manually 
scrolled from that point. I'm curious to see the problem if someone 
can provide a more detailed description with steps to reporoduce. 


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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Bradley Wright

> I have links to named anchors on a separate page. There is no problem
> getting to the appropriate spot. The problem is that the page can't be
> scrolled up to see all the menu items. I have used the hack for equal height
> columns on the menu - don't know if this affects it. The page is here:
> http://www.quinebaugkennels.com and the links to the left of the photo are
> the ones I'm concerned about - i.e., private lessons, gun dog training, etc.
> The further down the page the link is, the more or all of the menu
> disappears. 

In my experience, this is a known error with the equal height columns 
hack. The overflow: hidden; that you place on the containing element 
means that if the div scrolls (as it sometimes does when using anchor 
elements), it will scroll content off the top of the "page" (or off the 
top of the visible view port).

I'm sorry to say that I have no solution for this--all I can tell you is 
that you're not crazy. :)
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Re: [css-d] IE problems can't be solved

2006-09-07 Thread Gunlaug Sørtun

Lyn Williams wrote:
> I have a web page that displays perfectly in Firefox but has errors
> when displayed in IE 6.

> http://www.alanevansmotors.co.uk/browse.php

1: div.nplinks becomes 100% + 20px wide (the W3C box model).

#main-l div.nplinks {
text-align: right;
/* width: 100% <-- delete this property */;
padding: 10px;
}

Since IE/win always makes elements expand to make space for everything
inside (an IE-bug), #content #main-l will become 20px wider than it
should be in IE6. Thus, #content #main-r is pushed that much too far to
the right.

Deleting the width will make it default to 'width: auto', and it will
self-adjust to 100% width without overshooting. Result: no expanding and
no pushing.

2: adding...

#head img {display: block;}

...will get rid of the gap in  in IE6.

regards
Georg
-- 
http://www.gunlaug.no
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Re: [css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Al Sparber

From: "Kay Olson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

>I have links to named anchors on a separate page. There is no problem
> getting to the appropriate spot. The problem is that the page can't 
> be
> scrolled up to see all the menu items. I have used the hack for 
> equal height
> columns on the menu - don't know if this affects it. The page is 
> here:
> http://www.quinebaugkennels.com and the links to the left of the 
> photo are
> the ones I'm concerned about - i.e., private lessons, gun dog 
> training, etc.
> The further down the page the link is, the more or all of the menu
> disappears.
>
> Thanks for any advice - in the meantime, I just added a page up link 
> to each
> section to get the menu to be viewable.

Im not at all sure of what you mean, or of which browsers you are 
seeing a problem in. If the issues is your Top of Page named anchor, 
it is simply in the wrong spot if you want it to scroll the page all 
the way up to your masthead.

-- 
Al Sparber
PVII
http://www.projectseven.com

"Designing with CSS is sometimes like barreling down a crumbling 
mountain road at 90 miles per hour secure in the knowledge that 
repairs are scheduled for next Tuesday".






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Re: [css-d] Problem with IE for Mac

2006-09-07 Thread Philippe Wittenbergh

On Sep 7, 2006, at 8:52 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I have a problem with the IE browser for Mac.
> The page can be seen at:
> http://www.sheldrake.org/homepage.html
> which will eventually be the new index page for this website.
> The page works ok on IE 6.0 for Windows, Firefox 1.0.1 and Safari  
> 1.2 for
> Mac

I would suggest as a first step to validate your html

your Doctype is on the 3rd line instead of the first one,...
(I tried to save your page locally, but my browser happily made a mess).

The clean up the comments in your css section. I saw a least one miss- 
nested comment there, under div#listmenu, you start a comment that is  
not closed.

Some browsers are quite relaxed on those things, IE Mac can be very  
picky.

If you still have problems with IE Mac, browse around this site:

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh

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[css-d] Named Anchor and disappearing menu

2006-09-07 Thread Kay Olson

I have links to named anchors on a separate page. There is no problem
getting to the appropriate spot. The problem is that the page can't be
scrolled up to see all the menu items. I have used the hack for equal height
columns on the menu - don't know if this affects it. The page is here:
http://www.quinebaugkennels.com and the links to the left of the photo are
the ones I'm concerned about - i.e., private lessons, gun dog training, etc.
The further down the page the link is, the more or all of the menu
disappears. 
 
Thanks for any advice - in the meantime, I just added a page up link to each
section to get the menu to be viewable.
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Re: [css-d] 2 column fixed width

2006-09-07 Thread Gunlaug Sørtun

Čistý design wrote:
> I would be grateful for any tips or links...

Plenty of examples and links under *containing floats*


Georg
-- 
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[css-d] Problem with IE for Mac

2006-09-07 Thread JhnCaton

Dear css-discuss
I have a problem with the IE browser for Mac.
The page can be seen at:
http://www.sheldrake.org/homepage.html
which will eventually be the new index page for this website.
The page works ok on IE 6.0 for Windows, Firefox 1.0.1 and Safari 1.2 for 
Mac.
On IE for Mac the page structure breaks down, the fern image appears right of 
the Nav bar instead of below, and the navigation links don't work.
The problem seems to be associated with the css scripting for the nav bar 
(within head section of page). 
Help much appreciated.
John Caton.
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[css-d] IE problems can't be solved

2006-09-07 Thread Lyn Williams

I have a web page that displays perfectly in Firefox but has errors when
displayed in IE 6. I tried to solve the issues but I can not do it. Can
somebody help?

 

The webpage is: http://www.alanevansmotors.co.uk/browse.php 

 

 

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[css-d] 2 column fixed width

2006-09-07 Thread Čistý design

Hello
I was trying to do simple 2 column layout fixed width (not liquid layout) using 
float for the left column which contains menu. The problem I found is that when 
the menu is longer than the the right column, it tends to run outside the page 
area and continues into the background below the page. Is there any way to fix 
this? Sometimes the left column will be longer, sometimes the right one. I need 
the page to expand according to either one.

I would be grateful for any tips or links...

Thank you!

Jana Forsyth
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Re: [css-d] Sitecheck please

2006-09-07 Thread francky

Florian Hamberger wrote:

>Meanwhile I fixed the errors - the problem with Opera 9 still exists. The 
>horizontal rule still behaves strangely with IE - it should always be 66% 
>wide, however IE shows it on all pages except the home page about half. 
>
Hi Florian,
The html-validator reports on the Actuell page some errors 
.
Maybe correcting helps.

>And 
>an additional problem: IE doesn't print the background image of div#header.
>  
>
Here it is fine in my Print example.
Did you allow printing background images in the IE settings of your 
viewing system? (IE menu Extra > Internet Options > Advanced > Print > 
Checkbox "Print Background Colors and Inages").

Greetings,
francky
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Re: [css-d] Explorer hack / not only IE...

2006-09-07 Thread francky

Yves Vindevogel wrote:
My previous thing can easiliy be reproduced with this ...

* 

  Test

Hi Yves,
Yes, here's a test page 
. 
;-)

Jorge Rumoroso wrote:

>There is a syntactic error that prevents the reading of the rule. IE ignores
>the error and it interprets it.
>
Yes, seems IE doesn't follow properly the rules for error handling.
See: css2.1 rules for parsing errors 
.

But as George remarked here not so long ago (forgotten the thread): 
error handling by different browsers (and versions) is very tricky stuff...
For instance: I noticed also Netscape6.2.1 is playing a blue background.
And as it is working for IE6 on Win, maybe not for other versions or 
operating systems (didn't test).

For safety, I should stick to the conditional comment method. :-)

Gretings,
francky
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[css-d] Gaps IE6 not FF or IE7

2006-09-07 Thread OOzy Pal

Dears

I have two problems in IE6 inly not in FF or IE7.

1. 1px shift in border
2. Content will not expand all the way.

Looking at the site using IE6 will clear the issue.

http://codg.bjaili.com/13/


-- 
OOzy
Kubuntu-Dapper
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Re: [css-d] Sitecheck please

2006-09-07 Thread Florian Hamberger

Meanwhile I fixed the errors - the problem with Opera 9 still exists. The 
horizontal rule still behaves strangely with IE - it should always be 66% 
wide, however IE shows it on all pages except the home page about half. And 
an additional problem: IE doesn't print the background image of div#header.

The print style sheet is www.rosenheimer-forum.de/stylesheets/site-print.css

Am Mittwoch, 6. September 2006 16:52 schrieb Tim Offenstein:
> Hi Florian,
>
> Running your page through the W3C validator (http://validator.w3.org)
> shows a number of minor errors that can easily be fixed. Fixing these
> will help standardize your pages. Don't know if it'll make them work
> better with the problematic browsers but it will be a step in the
> right direction.
>
> -Tim
>
> At 4:13 PM +0200 9/6/06, Florian Hamberger wrote:
> >I redesigned the following site. I tested it with IE 6, FF, Konqueror, and
> >Opera. With Opera 9 the navigation isn't displayed correctly, with Opera
> > 8.x no errors occur. Some hints - perhaps also for better results with
> > IE?
> >
> >The address of the site is: www.rosenheimer-forum.de
> >The stylesheets are www.rosenheimer-forum.de/stylesheets/site.css and
> >www.rosenheimer-forum.de/stylesheets/menu.css
> >__
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-- 
Florian Hamberger
Florian Hamberger Computerberatung
Pfannstiel 7
83112 Frasdorf

Fon: +49 8052 2196
Fax: +49 8052 909111

email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Internet: www.fhcb.net
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[css-d] Body background image align to bottom: Firefox

2006-09-07 Thread Micky Hulse

Hi,

Just wondering if this is the /best fix/ to make an image align to the 
bottom left of the BODY background for Firefox:


html {
min-height: 100%;
height: auto;
}

body {
url(/le/images/template/bkgrnd-grfk.jpg) no-repeat bottom left;
}


Hehe, it has been a while since I have had to put a background image in 
the body aligned to the bottom... did not know this was the typical 
behavior (i.e. having to specify a height for the HTML element.)

Just wondering if there is a better solution, particularly one that 
works well in all browsers.

Many thanks in advance,
Cheers,
Micky


-- 
  Wishlist: 
Switch: 
My:  
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[css-d] CSS 3 column layout: elastic/fluid

2006-09-07 Thread dasdan20



 Concerning 3-column layout techniques
 
 there is a great overview here:
 http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=ThreeColumnLayouts
 
 here are some column layouts manuals, examples:
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/visit.php?cid=34&lid=865
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/singlelink.php?cid=34&lid=864
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/singlelink.php?cid=34&lid=868
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/singlelink.php?cid=34&lid=1968
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/singlelink.php?cid=34&lid=1967
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/singlelink.php?cid=34&lid=1966
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/singlelink.php?cid=34&lid=1965
 
 more CSS stuff
 http://www.dasdan.be/modules/mylinks/viewcat.php?cid=34
 
 Kind Regards,
 Kevin Wood AKA Dasdan
 www.dasdan.be

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Re: [css-d] Good Conditional Comments Book

2006-09-07 Thread Eystein Alnaes

> *CSS Hacks and Filters: Making Cascading Stylesheets Work*
> 


Don, I think you are going the wrong way about it. Although it makes sence
to think about that way - I did it myself, got the book, but it isn't very
good, despite the title. I've found it much better to learn why browsers
behave the way they do, and  adjust the css accordingly.

I have just finished reading two books which has helped me greatly.
Bulletproof Web Design: http://tinyurl.com/guuwf
CSS Mastery: http://tinyurl.com/k8bpr

Eystein
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Re: [css-d] Print stylesheet not read by Firefox?

2006-09-07 Thread Albert van der Veen

Thanks alot Brett! Removing the title attribute from the link tag solved it.

kind regards,
Albert

At 11:41 PM 9/6/2006, you wrote:
>Hello Albert,
>
>The problem probably comes from the use of the TITLE attribute. This
>attribute does not have side effects in other elements, but in LINK tags for
>external stylesheets, the situation is different.
>
>Here is one reference that should help out:
>
>http://devedge-temp.mozilla.org/viewsource/2002/preferred-stylesheets/index_en.html
>
>Brett Merkey


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Re: [css-d] rtl and ltr text

2006-09-07 Thread Bradley Wright

 > But I have a feeling that browsers should deal with that direction
 > stuff automatically anyway.

Nope, turns out that they don't handle that kind of thing automatically. 
  So use this final bit of mark up (as pure as I can get it):

http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd";>


Language Test


body { direction: rtl; }
[lang=en] { direction: ltr; }



ראש חטיבת המחקר באגף המודיעין במטכ"ל, תא"ל יוסיEnglish wordsלהישגים; אלוף גדי אייזנקוט,



Add a 'class="en"' on English elements if you want it to work in IE 
(which I assume you do), then change the:
[lang=en] { direction: ltr; }
rule to:
.en { direction: ltr; }

Brad
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Re: [css-d] rtl and ltr text

2006-09-07 Thread Bradley Wright

Ideally, you should be using something like:

http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/strict.dtd";>


Language Test



ראש חטיבת המחקר באגף המודיעין במטכ"ל, תא"ל יוסיEnglish wordsלהישגים; אלוף גדי אייזנקוט,

]

(don't ask me about that Hebrew--I cut it from a website I found :)

Also, in an ideal CSS world (since this is a CSS list), you would use 
the following selectors:

body { direction: rtl; }
span[lang=en] { direction: ltr; }

But I have a feeling that browsers should deal with that direction stuff 
automatically anyway.

Brad
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