Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-14 Thread awy

What version of SC are you running?

Does you server running SC go to sleep and do these sync problems occur
after it has woken up? In which case you are probably suffering from
'bug 10634' (http://bugs.slimdevices.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10634), which
should have been fixed in SC 7.3.2.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-14 Thread strmtrupr2

Hi,

Here is my SC info:

Code:


  Version: 7.3.2 - 24695 @ Mon Jan 19 18:55:04 PST 2009
  Hostname: Ajihad
  IP: 192.168.76.132
  HTTP Port: 9000
  OS: Windows Vista - EN - cp1252
  Platform: 586
  Perl Version: 5.8.8 - MSWin32-x86-multi-thread
  MySQL Version: 5.0.22-community-nt
  Total Players Recognized: 4
  



The computer is not set to sleep.  If there was an easy way to 'reset'
the playback and re-sync all players with the touch of a button /
manually, I'd be happy.

Thanks for looking into the issue!

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-14 Thread awy

Hmm, the log show that SC's idea of the players' time epoch is way out
compared with that of the server (probably about 23s at the time you
took the log snapshot). Every few seconds SC adjust its idea of the
players' epochs by 5ms, so it is going to take around 6 hours to get
back in sync.

Given that you server does not sleep, is there anything else which
could cause its time to jump, and possibly jump back again?


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-14 Thread strmtrupr2

Hi,

All sorts of things could mess with this Microsoft OS!  Scan disk,
windows time update, etc.

Any quick way to shock it into action?

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-14 Thread awy

strmtrupr2;415372 Wrote: 
 
 Any quick way to shock it into action?

Not short of restarting SC or each of the players.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-14 Thread strmtrupr2

Hi,

I'll try restarting SC next time.  Too bad there isn't a setting I can
change to allow a more swift catchup.  At least, now I know what to
look for, drastic time changes on the SC host.

Thanks for your help.

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-12 Thread strmtrupr2

awy;413476 Wrote: 
 Ok. The current trace looks fine. Post a longer snippet when you do.

Hi,

Sync started flaking out again today.  I attached the log.

Thanks for looking.

Scott


+---+
|Filename: server.zip   |
|Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7248|
+---+

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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-09 Thread awy

Your best bet is probably to wind Synchronization Start Delay up as far
as you can bear: maybe 1-2 seconds. As I said, syncing is always a
little hit and miss with SB1s because of the older protocol
limitations.

Trackstat may have been it, although I thought that Erland had updated
his plugins not to do stuff at track start. I don't know when Find
Cover Art comes into play, and I have no idea what Spicefly SugarCube
does.

Good luck.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-09 Thread bpa

FindArt will do nothing until its menu item is selected.  Even then I
think the only time there may be a processing delay would when saving
cover art.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-09 Thread sander

awy;414011 Wrote: 
 ...and I have no idea what Spicefly SugarCube does.

Sugarcube is an on-the-fly extension to MusicIP, which adds a new song
to the end of the playlist based on the current song playing. It seems
like a natural candidate for these delays, but it looks like it makes
the calculation after the song starts.

I have the sync delay set at 1 second currently, which appears to be
enough as I played music for about 2 hours last night and I only
experienced the delay with a couple of songs. If I experience more I
may make it longer.

I don't know if there may have been other issues related to this
problem, or if they were caused by some combination of the plugins, but
I did experience the following problems:

After removing the plugins last night the nightly rescan appears to
have blown up the database, sending Squeezecenter into a crash loop,
but it is rebuilding now.

And since I added the SB1, I did notice the occasional complete
disconnect in stream information, where Squeezecenter will report a
completely different song playing opposite the actual song that is
playing. This may be a side effect of the sync delay. I've noticed
Squeezecenter having trouble with shuffling the playlist right before
the track changes, but generally it would just stall, not play the
wrong song.

Also, as I noticed earlier, sometimes the SB1 would just drop the audio
output, but would otherwise be functioning normally according to its own
feedback and Squeezecenter.

All that said I consider this issue resolved. I'm always impressed at
the underlying engineering that went into the Squeezecenter design. The
fact that the remote architecture is such that my SB1, SB3 and Boom
remotes are all interchangeable, and that the SB1, with its outdated
underlying hardware is still viable client which can leverage the
latest server, is further testament to this.

I also appreciate the help from the community and Logitech which has
helped me make the most of this system.

Thanks again for helping me resolve this issue.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-08 Thread awy

What is the list of third-party plugins you are running? Please try
disabling them all and, if that fixes thing, enabling them one by one.

There are/have been a number of third-party plugins that listen for
track-start events and then do -clever- stuff. If this takes more than
about 50ms then it risks interfering with the synchronized start logic.
This will especially hit SB1s (and SliMP3s) - see my previous
explanation.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-08 Thread sander

awy;413687 Wrote: 
 What is the list of third-party plugins you are running? Please try
 disabling them all and, if that fixes thing, enabling them one by one.

Well, I disabled a bunch at once and including trackstat and along with
others which I really didn't use as much as I thought, and it works!
There's still the occasional hiccup, about a second once every 10
songs, but nothing like before.

I currently have the following plugins enabled:
Auto Dim Display
Date and Time
Extension Downloader
Find Cover Art
Lazy Search
Line In
Music Information Screen
MusicIP (A biggie for me!)
NPR Radio
Other Players
Podcasts
Radiotime
Rescan Music Library
Server and Network Health
Sleepfade
Spicefly SugarCube (another biggie I was afraid would be a culprit)
Superdate Time Screensaver (essential)
Visualizer Screensaver

I've meant to use Dynamic Playlists and I occasionally look at
TrackStat, but to be honest I let MusicIP be the guide most of the time
so I can do without them for now.

If any of these others might cause a problem let me know.

Thanks so much for your help. Maybe when the schema is updated in 8.0 I
can regain this functionality, but this is great for now, and I know
where to look in the future.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-07 Thread awy

strmtrupr2;413370 Wrote: 
 Hi,
 
 Sounds great, I'll leave it running.
 
 Here is a sample:
 
  
Code:

  
   [09-04-06 15:04:21.0041] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
   [09-04-06 15:06:51.0177] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
   ...
   

  
 
 


Are you sure that your have two players synced and playing. That log
does not indicate that.

You do have player.sync=debug, don't you?


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-07 Thread strmtrupr2

Hello,

The previous log snippet I posted was from right after I turned on the
debug setting.  I'll throw down another snippet after running for a
day; however, I must say it hasn't gotten out of sync yet.


Code:


  [09-04-07 06:47:38.1788] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (459) 
playPoints: 00:04:20:16:74:dc: 1239102242.014, 00:04:20:16:60:05:+9, 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d:+6, 00:04:20:1e:0b:26:   +10
  [09-04-07 06:47:38.1793] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (492) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 resync: skipAhead 10ms
  [09-04-07 06:47:40.1791] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (459) 
playPoints: 00:04:20:16:74:dc: 1239102242.015, 00:04:20:16:60:05:+8, 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d:+4, 00:04:20:1e:0b:26:+0
  [09-04-07 06:47:41.1785] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (459) 
playPoints: 00:04:20:16:74:dc: 1239102242.015, 00:04:20:16:60:05:+8, 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d:+4, 00:04:20:1e:0b:26:+0
  [09-04-07 06:47:42.1785] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (459) 
playPoints: 00:04:20:16:74:dc: 1239102242.015, 00:04:20:16:60:05:+8, 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d:+5, 00:04:20:1e:0b:26:+0
  [09-04-07 06:47:43.1788] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (459) 
playPoints: 00:04:20:16:74:dc: 1239102242.015, 00:04:20:16:60:05:+8, 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d:+4, 00:04:20:1e:0b:26:+0
  [09-04-07 06:47:44.1783] Slim::Player::StreamingController::_CheckSync (459) 
playPoints: 00:04:20:16:74:dc: 1239102242.014, 00:04:20:16:60:05:+9, 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d:+6, 00:04:20:1e:0b:26:+
  



I was a little worried you may get confused by the other posting in
between mine.  Thanks for staying on top of it.  

I promise to post a snippet once the players get out of sync again; it
may be a couple days before that happens.

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-07 Thread awy

sander;413392 Wrote: 
 
 In this section, right after I unpause and skip the next song my
 receiver (00:04:20:16:70:70) starts playing and the Squeezebox1
 (00:04:20:05:81:a2) lags and catches up about 4 seconds into the song.
 I'm pretty sure I captured it, but I can send more examples in email as
 its fairly easy to reproduce if I keep skipping to the next song.
 

With newer players (SB2 and up), SC can send the start request to the
player ahead of time. That is, it tells the player to start at X, where
X is some time in the future (default 100ms). For an SB1 it does not
have this option, and SC sets a high-priority timer to send the start
command at the relevant time, allowing for normal network latency. This
mechanism is inevitably a bit hit-and-miss because SC is single-threaded
and other activities can delay the firing of a timer.

From the log, I see two things:
  
- The start command (strm-u) to the SBR only gets acknowledged after
  448ms.
- The start command to the SB1 gets sent after the SB2 has already
  started.
  

Please check that you have undone all the changes on the Settings /
Player / player / Synchronization page for each player.

It could also be that SC is just busy at the start of a track. Do you
have any plugins installed? Were you using random-play?

I guess that this could be a problem with network saturation at the
beginning of tracks. You could try increasing the 'Synchronization
Start Delay' parameter (not sure of the exact name) under Settings /
Network (or is that Settings / Advanced / Network?).


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-07 Thread awy

strmtrupr2;413473 Wrote: 
 
 I was a little worried you may get confused by the other posting in
 between mine.  Thanks for staying on top of it.  
 
Well, a separate thread would have made things easier ...
 
 I promise to post a snippet once the players get out of sync again; it
 may be a couple days before that happens.
 Scott
Ok. The current trace looks fine. Post a longer snippet when you do.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-07 Thread sander

awy;413475 Wrote: 
 Please check that you have undone all the changes on the Settings /
 Player / player / Synchronization page for each player.

OK, I only did this the SB1, but I checked the settings on the others
and they appear to be OK

 It could also be that SC is just busy at the start of a track. Do you
 have any plugins installed? Were you using random-play?

I have about a dozen plugins, MusicIP and a fairly large library (~120K
tracks) so that could be the issue. However I do have Core Duo 2.5Ghz
with 2 GB of RAM so that should help, however I did notice another
problem (occasional sound drop out) coincided with my using the cover
finder plugin so it could be Squeezecenter getting overwhelmed.

 I guess that this could be a problem with network saturation at the
 beginning of tracks. You could try increasing the 'Synchronization
 Start Delay' parameter (not sure of the exact name) under Settings /
 Network (or is that Settings / Advanced / Network?).

I tried this and it was a little better, but there were still delays.
How big can I make this buffer?

What I'm unclear of is why the SB1 is starting late? I understand the
other devices can push themselves up in the queue, but it is on a wired
connection opposite the other players which are all wireless. The
latency is less than half a millisecond with constant bandwidth. Is it
the small buffer that makes it so vulnerable to the server being
overwhelmed?

Thanks again for your help.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread awy

No obvious, specific advice. Does restarting the station (press ) not
fix the problem? A log of player.sync=debug, when the problem occurs,
could be helpful.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread strmtrupr2

Hello,

Here is a snippet from my log:


Code:


  [09-04-04 16:04:58.0275] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-04 17:25:03.0162] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-04 18:30:09.0193] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-04 23:40:17.0163] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-04 23:42:13.9873] Slim::Utils::Misc::msg (1122) Warning: 
[23:42:13.9869] Use of uninitialized value in subtraction (-) at 
/C:\PROGRA~1\SQUEEZ~1\server\SQUEEZ~1.EXESlim/Buttons/Common.pm line 993.
  [09-04-04 23:42:15.1150] Slim::Utils::Misc::msg (1122) Warning: 
[23:42:15.1146] Use of uninitialized value in subtraction (-) at 
/C:\PROGRA~1\SQUEEZ~1\server\SQUEEZ~1.EXESlim/Buttons/Common.pm line 993.
  [09-04-04 23:42:16.6081] Slim::Utils::Misc::msg (1122) Warning: 
[23:42:16.6077] Use of uninitialized value in subtraction (-) at 
/C:\PROGRA~1\SQUEEZ~1\server\SQUEEZ~1.EXESlim/Buttons/Common.pm line 993.
  [09-04-05 12:35:28.0162] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-05 13:35:37.0542] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-05 13:55:44.0142] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-05 17:15:22.0981] Slim::Player::Song::open (341) Error: Couldn't 
create command line for m3u playback for 
[http://opml.radiotime.com/Tune.ashx?id=s96389username=strmtrupr2partnerId=16]
  [09-04-05 18:15:49.0152] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-05 18:45:54.0143] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-05 18:55:59.0155] 
Slim::Networking::SqueezeNetwork::Players::_players_error (146) Unable to get 
players from SN: Timed out waiting for data, retrying in 300 seconds
  [09-04-05 20:23:42.7074] Slim::Player::Song::open (341) Error: Couldn't 
create command line for m3u playback for 
[http://opml.radiotime.com/Tune.ashx?id=s96389username=strmtrupr2partnerId=16]
  [09-04-05 20:23:46.8743] Slim::Player::Song::open (341) Error: Couldn't 
create command line for m3u playback for 
[http://opml.radiotime.com/Tune.ashx?id=s96389username=strmtrupr2partnerId=16]
  [09-04-05 20:23:50.5713] Slim::Player::Song::open (341) Error: Couldn't 
create command line for m3u playback for 
[http://opml.radiotime.com/Tune.ashx?id=s96389username=strmtrupr2partnerId=16]
  [09-04-06 07:43:19.1370] Slim::Utils::Scanner::Remote::__ANON__ (206) Error: 
Can't connect to remote server to retrieve playlist: Connect timed out: Bad 
file descriptor.
  



Thank you very much for looking.

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread strmtrupr2

Hi,

I was wondering what the best and easiest way would be to re-sync my
players.  I listen to a lot of Internet radio, and every few days they
get out of sync.  Do you know what the best way is to shock them back
into sync again?

So far, I've only changed one setting in attempt to keep them in sync,
and that's the Minimum Synchronization Adjustment (ms), I set it to 10
from 30.

I have 2 receivers, one boom, and one box.  Two are wired and two are
wireless.

Thanks for your advice.

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread awy

sander;412946 Wrote: 
 As the proud new owner of an original Squeezebox, I'm having a problem
 when it syncs with the newer units in my house.
 
 Specifically new songs pause twice at consistent intervals when they
 start on all units and it takes a couple of seconds until the SB1 syncs
 up correctly.
 

With just a single SB1 in the mix, sync should work fine (with 7.3.2).

Can you capture a log at level player.source=info, player.sync=debug,
and networking.protocol.slimproto=info? Upload it here, along with a
description of what happened and at what time.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread funkstar

How about turning off internal Flac decoding for the SB2+ units?

Thats likely to be the issue for older hardware, it doesn't support
Flac decoding natively. Syncing is supposed to handle this, there are
obviously issues with it though.

Have a look in Bugzilla (http://bugs.slimdevices.com) to see if there
is anything relating to sync in there.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread peterw

What version of SqueezeCenter do you use? If you don't have any Booms,
you might try SqueezeCenter 7.2. Version 7.3 introduced a new syncing
framework that's great with SB2 and newer, but IIRC some here have said
it's worse with SB1 and Slimp3 players.

-Peter


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread sander

I use 7.3.2, and I have one of each of the newer units, Squeezebox3,
duet, and boom, so I can't go back too much farther. I saw a
SqueezeBox1 wired-only on craigslist (for $25 :) ) so I thought I'd add
it to my office as the software clients can't sync reliably either.

Unfortunately about half the time the SB1 starts playing just a little
later and the newer units pause for it to catch up about 5 seconds into
playing. For streaming and podcasts its not an issue, but in normal
playback its very annoying.

I tried playing with the Audio Startup time on the SB1, but I didn't
seem to make a difference, and unfortunately the rest of the players
started behaving unusual (not syncing and starting late) so I undid all
the changes.

7.3.x has been bulletproof with syncing between the SB2+ style hardware
for me. 

My understanding was the syncing problems were due to the peculiarities
in the SqueezePlay code the inability of the other software clients to
poll the hardware on PCs to the same extent they can on hardware
clients.

The hardware polling isn't an issue, obviously since it does sync up
unlike the software clients, but I'm trying to figure out why the SB1
is starting late and is there anything I can do to fix it.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread awy

It does not look like you set the log level I requested.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread strmtrupr2

Would you mind reminding me which file that debug level is set in
please?

Thank you very much.

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread awy

Use the Web interface (localhost:9000) and open the Settings page. Go to
Advanced / Logging and select the level from the appropriate drop-down
menu


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread strmtrupr2

Hi,

I setup the debug log level; however, it's not exhibiting the issue
anymore.  I'll have to wait a day or so for it to come back, do you
think I should turn the logging back to normal until the issue comes
back, then turn it back on?

-thanks

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread awy

If you have enough disk space then just leave the log running. It will
compress well (with ZIP or whatever) when you are ready to upload it.
Or, for this case, you could turn it off now and turn it back on when
it happens. That may mean that we don't see the trigger to the problem.
In any case, a snippet of the current log would be good to see now.


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread strmtrupr2

Hi,

Sounds great, I'll leave it running.

Here is a sample:


Code:


  [09-04-06 15:04:21.0041] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:07:f1:7d adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:06:51.0177] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:07:46.0142] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.002s
  [09-04-06 15:08:41.0110] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:21:46.0061] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:22:51.0063] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.002s
  [09-04-06 15:25:16.0060] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:34:11.0060] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:16:60:05 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:34:11.0177] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.002s
  [09-04-06 15:34:46.0059] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:35:06.0146] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:35:56.0060] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:37:06.0046] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:16:74:dc adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:45:26.0170] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  [09-04-06 15:58:26.0060] Slim::Player::Player::trackJiffiesEpoch (927) 
00:04:20:1e:0b:26 adjust jiffies epoch -0.001s
  



Thanks for your help!

Scott


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Re: [slim] SB1 syncing tips?

2009-04-06 Thread sander

awy;413344 Wrote: 
 If you have enough disk space then just leave the log running. It will
 compress well (with ZIP or whatever) when you are ready to upload it.
 Or, for this case, you could turn it off now and turn it back on when
 it happens. That may mean that we don't see the trigger to the problem.
 In any case, a snippet of the current log would be good to see now.

Thanks for taking the time to look at this! Those settings generate an
awful lot of information in a short time, so I can generate more, but
I'm going to run into the limit of what I can upload here.

In this section, right after I unpause and skip the next song my
receiver (00:04:20:16:70:70) starts playing and the Squeezebox1
(00:04:20:05:81:a2) lags and catches up about 4 seconds into the song.
I'm pretty sure I captured it, but I can send more examples in email as
its fairly easy to reproduce if I keep skipping to the next song.

Let me know what's helpful to you and I'll give you as much information
as I can.

Thanks again!


+---+
|Filename: squeezecenter_log.zip|
|Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7226|
+---+

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