[Elecraft] Sad News: K6SE SK

[J F]

It is with deepest sorrow that I notify you of the
passing of my father, Earl Cunningham, also known to
you as K6SE. He died in his sleep yesterday, April
29th.

Services are pending and will most likely happen next
Saturday, May 5th, in Palmdale, California. I will
send out another e-mail in a few days with the
details.

The ham radio community was a very important part of
my father's life. I am sending this e-mail to you
because your e-mail address was listed in his Juno
address book.

Please feel free to forward this note to others as you
see fit.

Thank you,

Mariana Cunningham
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Thought folks here would like to know... He was a real
gent, always helpful and will be missed...

73,
Julius
n2wn
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Re: [Elecraft] The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[John GM4SLV]

On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:47:08 -0700
wayne burdick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> A modular K3 is, clearly, not what you'd think of as homebrew, but
> it certainly is a kit, and will still take considerable time to
> complete. 

One small question, since Wayne has given the first indication the the
self-build K3 is a little more complex than I might have first thought.

What is the estimate of how long a K3 _would_ take to put together?
Are we talking over the course of an evening or something a bit more
involving?

I'm not planning one for myself (my K2 is enough radio for me), but I
can see others wanting to join the party, and to save money by going the
self build route, and I would love to be able to give them the answers
that might just push them into it!

For some it might be "oh - it'll only take a couple of hours, go on
you'll enjoy it and get a great rig in the process" and for others it
may be "oh - it's still quite a bit of work, you'll enjoy the build
process and learn a lot in the process, _and_ get a great rig at the
end"



Cheers,

John GM4SLV 
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[Elecraft] Travelling with the K2

[JACrux]

I took #609 to South Africa for my ZS6/G3JAG vacation just after 9/11. No hand 
baggage allowed ... except  just one see-through plastic carrier bag. The 
airport had no more such bags available, so I repacked my stuff at check-in 
and used a super mart carrier bag. I just wrapped a newspaper round the K2.  
They let me through and it survived the trip undamaged ! 
In fact the worst thing was a tiny lightning strike in ZS6. I got a shock and 
there was a spark as I disconnected the antenna; the K2 receiver went dead, 
but it was OK next day.
So bubble wrap is fine. The K2 is not all that fragile and there is no need 
for a custom case.  BTW my host told me that his own (Japanese) radio had 
been zapped several times by static discharges .. and it did not recover 
overnight. It had to be sent away to be repaired. Yes, the K2 also survived 
the trip home.
John G3JAG
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[Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Bill W5WVO]

Just as an aside on the tremendously personal and intimate experience of 
participating in the K3 roll-out, I've also been monitoring the FT-2000 Yahoo 
group to see what they're talking about over there. Over the past week, nearly 
100% of the voluminous postings there have been about firmware updates.

1) A new firmware revision called v1.26 showed up on the Internet from 
SOMEWHERE -- nobody knows where it came from. A lot of people tried to install 
it and found serious problems. Yaesu eventually disclaimed it as somebody's 
unauthorized hack and advised people not to install it. This took weeks.

2) People began wondering how they could determine what firmware revision their 
unit is running. Answer: Fuhgedaboudit.  There is no way to get feedback from 
the FT-2000 as to its own firmware revision. So patently absurd that nobody 
could believe it until it was finally confirmed by a Yaesu tech rep. Reason: 
Yaesu keeps track of what firmware revision is in your radio on a serial-number 
basis. You don't need to know this.

3) When a new and officially sanctioned v1.27 firmware update finally emerged, 
people wondered what bug fixes it covered and what new features it offered. 
Answer: Fuhgedaboudit. You don't need to know this. Just trust Yaesu that it's 
better. Well, your country's sales rep might be able to find out for you... If 
you can actually talk to him. Or maybe not.

4) Want to go to the Yaesu website and download the update? Fuhgedaboudit. You 
can only get it by email from an authorized rep from your particular country on 
a one-by-one basis. Got problems and you want it right now? Fuhgedaboudit. You 
get on a wait list and... wait. And hope it gets sent to you One of These Days 
Real Soon Now. (So as a result, unauthorized personal website postings of the 
update popped up within 24 hours of its release. Is it the real v1.27? The 
correct country-specific v1.27 for your radio? Who knows?)

Y'all can thank your lucky stars that Elecraft owners have a completely 
different kind of experience with the manufacturer of their radio. I just 
thought you might like to know just how different it really is.

Bill / W5WVO
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[Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?

[J F]

I have mine in a Pelican case David, but as some point
out, it may be a bit overkill. The price was right for
the one I found, so figured why not ;o)

If anyone is interested, I do have another nice hard
case (not Pelican) that would work with a K2 and some
additional items. I can send pictures. Asking $30
delivered CONUS.

73,
Julius
n2wn
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Re: [Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?

[Simon Brown (HB9DRV)]

I also use Pelican cases, myself for cameras. I would only use Pelican for 
my (deposit paid) K3. Slightly expensive, excellent build quality. Camera 
shops often offer Pelican cases with discount.


Simon Brown, HB9DRV

- Original Message - 
From: "J F" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>



I have mine in a Pelican case David, but as some point
out, it may be a bit overkill. The price was right for
the one I found, so figured why not ;o) 


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Simon Brown (HB9DRV)]

If you think the tale of woe regarding the FT-2000 is bad, look at the 
FTDX-9000. To be fair to Yaesu they are trying to sort it out, it looks like 
it was rushed to the market. ICOM were very good with the IC-7800 - I owned 
one, now sold.


I have never come a cross a company that listens to customers like Elecraft 
does - I doubt that a radio has received so many advanced orders. I have so 
far failed to find a single thing that needs enhancing in the K3's spec / 
email replies from Wayne.


Simon Brown, HB9DRV

- Original Message - 
From: "Bill W5WVO" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>



Just as an aside on the tremendously personal and intimate experience of 
participating in the K3 roll-out, I've also been monitoring the FT-2000 
Yahoo group to see what they're talking about over there. Over the past 
week, nearly 100% of the voluminous postings there have been about firmware 
updates.


[chop-o-matic] 


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft in ARRL 160

[J F]

Bob,

Heard my first Japanese stations on 160 this year.
Still need to figure out where they were listening.
KH6 is pretty easy from here, we must be in the skip
zone. I didn't hear N8S on the Top Band, had limited
time to chase them. Nice QRP catch!

I think a lot of folks think they have to have a KW
and a monster to be effective on 160. You're a great
example, as are others here, of what is possible with
less than ideal antennas and 100 watts or less. The
band takes some patience and has a learning curve.
There are some great surprises for those interested...

73,
Julius
n2wn
--- Robert Tellefsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Yes, and KH6 and JA also.
> I even worked N8S on topband during the expedition.
> Also found that I took first place in Pacific
> Division
> ARRL 160 cw.  Just aren't that many QRPers on
> top band out here.
> 73, Bob N6WG
> 
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "J F" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Robert Tellefsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
> 
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 10:04 AM
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft in ARRL 160
> 
> 
> > 160M QRP is getting to be very popular and
> > competitive.
> >
> > You folks in the west do get kinda robbed on
> > multipliers...of course, KL7 is somewhat easier
> ;o)
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Julius
> > n2wn
> >
> > --- Robert Tellefsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > #20 for N6WG.  160 is tough from CA, especially
> QRP
> > > :-)
> > > 73, Bob N6WG
> > >
> > > - Original Message -
> > > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > To: "J F" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
> > > 
> > > Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 5:52 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft in ARRL 160
> > >
> > >
> > > > Looks like I made #36 for QRP Single Op with
> my K2
> > > and only a couple of
> > > hours of opearating time.
> > > >
> > > > Mark, NK8Q
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >From: J F <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > >Date: 2007/04/30 Mon AM 07:36:24 CDT
> > > > >To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> > > > >Subject: [Elecraft] Elecraft in ARRL 160
> > > >
> > > > >Curious how many other Elecrafts made the Top
> Ten
> > > in
> > > > >the ARRL 160.
> > > > >
> > > > >I know Gene, KB7Q, used one, as did I...
> Anyone
> > > else?
> > > > >
> > > > >73,
> > > > >Julius
> > > > >n2wn
> > > >
> >___
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> etc.):
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> > > >
> > > >
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> > >
> > >
> >
> 
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Larry Phipps]

I wonder if there is any K3 chatter on the FT-2000 list... seems like 
they are squarely in the crosshairs ;-)


Larry N8LP



Bill W5WVO wrote:

Just as an aside on the tremendously personal and intimate experience of 
participating in the K3 roll-out, I've also been monitoring the FT-2000 Yahoo 
group to see what they're talking about over there. Over the past week, nearly 
100% of the voluminous postings there have been about firmware updates.

1) A new firmware revision called v1.26 showed up on the Internet from 
SOMEWHERE -- nobody knows where it came from. A lot of people tried to install 
it and found serious problems. Yaesu eventually disclaimed it as somebody's 
unauthorized hack and advised people not to install it. This took weeks.

2) People began wondering how they could determine what firmware revision their 
unit is running. Answer: Fuhgedaboudit.  There is no way to get feedback from 
the FT-2000 as to its own firmware revision. So patently absurd that nobody 
could believe it until it was finally confirmed by a Yaesu tech rep. Reason: 
Yaesu keeps track of what firmware revision is in your radio on a serial-number 
basis. You don't need to know this.

3) When a new and officially sanctioned v1.27 firmware update finally emerged, 
people wondered what bug fixes it covered and what new features it offered. 
Answer: Fuhgedaboudit. You don't need to know this. Just trust Yaesu that it's 
better. Well, your country's sales rep might be able to find out for you... If 
you can actually talk to him. Or maybe not.

4) Want to go to the Yaesu website and download the update? Fuhgedaboudit. You 
can only get it by email from an authorized rep from your particular country on 
a one-by-one basis. Got problems and you want it right now? Fuhgedaboudit. You 
get on a wait list and... wait. And hope it gets sent to you One of These Days 
Real Soon Now. (So as a result, unauthorized personal website postings of the 
update popped up within 24 hours of its release. Is it the real v1.27? The 
correct country-specific v1.27 for your radio? Who knows?)

Y'all can thank your lucky stars that Elecraft owners have a completely 
different kind of experience with the manufacturer of their radio. I just 
thought you might like to know just how different it really is.

Bill / W5WVO
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Re: [Elecraft] The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[Gary Krause]

Good point, Wayne.  I would also like to add that a lot of us build our 
own computers which are also modular and we still get a sense of 
achievement and pride as well as learning how they work.   The world is 
dynamic and things change.


Gary, N7HTS

wayne burdick wrote:
First, let me say that I like Jim's sliding scale of what constitutes 
"homebrew" (reproduced at the end of this email from his recent QRP-L 
posting). Translating that into contest multipliers and 
building-contest rules is another story.


I've been engaged in "building" at every level of the N2EY Scale. I've 
designed a lot from scratch (including--with a lot of help from my 
friends--the K3/K2/K1/KX1/Sierra/SST/NC40A). I've built PCs from 
modules, built Heathkits, borrowed circuits from Hayward and DeMaw, 
and tried everything in between, sometimes with comical results. I had 
*no* clue what I was doing -- at first. The important thing is this: 
Every level of building is rewarding in its own way, because you have 
to learn something to do it well.


I have no qualms at all when I see the K3 at #6 on the scale. Skill is 
still involved: using tools, aligning hardware and panels by eye, 
calibrating trim-caps, reading instructions. A modular K3 is, clearly, 
not what you'd think of as homebrew, but it certainly is a kit, and 
will still take considerable time to complete. I'm content to have the 
subject debated by the many enthusiastic builders on this list, and 
will accept your judgment.


But I'll leave you with an interesting story. Once, at a wireless 
seminar, I had the opportunity to show one of my little projects 
(NorCal Sierra prototype) to Wes Hayward, W7ZOI. Wes is the famous 
co-author of Solid State Design, EMRFD, and other books, and was a 
mentor of mine, though he didn't realize it. At first he tossed a few 
compliments my way. But then he firmly chided me for having 
single-handedly stunted the intellectual growth of a generation of 
potential engineers -- by offering PC boards pre-made!


I countered that I might just have *helped* some future engineers by 
giving them something cool to start on. Something to stimulate their 
imagination. And over the years this has proven to be true: I've been 
contacted by many hams who hadn't built a thing until they'd 
encountered a kit (one of Doug's, or mine and Eric's, or Bob Dyer's, 
or Dave Benson's), and had then moved successively higher up the rungs 
on N2EY's hierarchy.


So when I think about the K3 and its pre-tested, no-soldering modules, 
I don't see a swath of destruction in the ranks of the technically 
inclined. I don't see a impending precipitous drop in IQ. Instead, I 
see hundreds of ordinary folks -- who might never have touched a 
soldering iron or even a screwdriver -- take their first tentative 
steps towards learning the skill of building.


With our help (and yours), some of them will make that same leap of 
faith that we did. They'll modify something. Or fix something. And 
before you know it, they'll be slapping 0402's on hand-etched 
microstrips   ;)


73,
Wayne
N6KR


* * *

N2EY's homebrew/kit scale:

1) Homebrew (scratch built): Original unit, designed and built by the 
ham,

including circuit design, mechanical layout, coil winding, etc.

2) Homebrew (article project): More-or-less copy of a project designed 
and

documented by others, such as an HBR receiver.

3) Surplus conversion: Adaptation of an electronic unit meant for one 
purpose

to a new purpose, but not a completely new design. Usually applied to WW2
military surplus but really applies to almost anything, such as 
land-mobile VHF

FM rigs converted to ham use.

4) Semi-kit: Construction of a kit that requires more than electronic
assembly, such as a QRP rig that consists of a PCB and most parts but 
leaves the
chassis and some other details up to the builder. Limited instructions 
are part of

the semi-kit class.

5) Heath-kit: Construction of a kit that requires only electronic 
assembly
(and possibly coil winding) from components. Extensive instructions, 
as in most

Heathkit and Elecraft products.

6) PC-kit: Construction of a kit from modules rather than components. 
Similar
to building a computer from a pile of goodies, hence the name. 
Elecraft K3.



---

http://www.elecraft.com

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Bill Tippett]

HB9DRV:
>I have never come a cross a company that listens to customers like 
Elecraft does


I strongly second that!  Ten-Tec does much
better than most but they are about 10 dB down from
Elecraft.  I can't comment on Flex Radio from personal
experience but they also appear to be very responsive.
It's interesting to watch the resurgence of 3 American
radio manufacturers all building their businesses around
the customer, and quite surprising others are not
since it is a fundamental part of Deming, TQM, etc...
which were re-taught to us by the Japanese in the
1980's..

If I were back in business school, someone
could probably write a case study about how Elecraft
has built an extremely strong business around
customer responsiveness.  It's truly sad how many
companies simply do not understand the fundamental
importance of listening to customers.  Congratulations
to Wayne and Eric for completely instilling this value
throughout their company!  May it always remain so.

73,  Bill  W4ZV

P.S.  A K3 is probably in my future as soon as I
learn a little more about it (e.g. phase-locked stereo
diversity, LO phase noise, IMD, etc). 


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[Elecraft] K3

[Eric]

Since I heard Elecraft is releasing the K3 I rejoined the list.

Is there any info on RX specs like MDR, IP3, MDS etc etc?

I probably missed a lot of discussion abt this subject.

vy 73 Eric PA3CEV

K2 #960


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Larry Phipps]

That's one of the main reasons I bought the K2 in the first place. I 
like assembling kits, but not for weeks at a time as I have plenty of 
assembly to do on my own products/projects. Serviceability and customer 
support are number one for me. That's why I will be buying a K3. For 
that reason alone, the K3 should cost more than a Japanese radio, 
factoring in future repair costs ;-)


I may wait for the second production run, although that may be sold out 
by the end of Dayton ;-) I'm guessing 200 for the first run, and maybe 
as many as 1,000 for the second run. I would like to hear feedback 
between those runs, but I don't think there will be time for much 
feedback. My main concern would be hardware changes between runs on the 
first few runs, and how they would be handled for early buyers. 
Obviously firmware changes are no problem. As good as the K3 design 
appears to be, there are always little running changes in a rollout.


73,
Larry N8LP



johnny wrote:

Hi Larry,
I have enough with my FTDX9000 and luckily I have already sold it only 
at some losses. Even I now have my IC7800, I still placed my order for K3.
As everyone here, I appreciate the customer support from Elecraft. I 
have enough experience with Ft2000 and FTDX9000 which I do not discuss 
in an Elecraft mail reflector. K3 will be my new rig which can be 
serviced by myself to some degree. I like my IC7800 but if the radio 
has anything wrong, my hands will be up in the air and a tip to ICOM 
service center is unavoidable.

cheers,
Johnny Siu VR2XMC

- Original Message -
*From:* Larry Phipps 
*To:* Bill W5WVO 
*Cc:* [Elecraft] 
*Sent:* Tuesday, May 01, 2007 9:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

I wonder if there is any K3 chatter on the FT-2000 list... seems like
they are squarely in the crosshairs ;-)

Larry N8LP



Bill W5WVO wrote:
> Just as an aside on the tremendously personal and intimate
experience of participating in the K3 roll-out, I've also been
monitoring the FT-2000 Yahoo group to see what they're talking
about over there. Over the past week, nearly 100% of the
voluminous postings there have been about firmware updates.
>
> 1) A new firmware revision called v1.26 showed up on the
Internet from SOMEWHERE -- nobody knows where it came from. A lot
of people tried to install it and found serious problems. Yaesu
eventually disclaimed it as somebody's unauthorized hack and
advised people not to install it. This took weeks.
>
> 2) People began wondering how they could determine what firmware
revision their unit is running. Answer: Fuhgedaboudit. There is no
way to get feedback from the FT-2000 as to its own firmware
revision. So patently absurd that nobody could believe it until it
was finally confirmed by a Yaesu tech rep. Reason: Yaesu keeps
track of what firmware revision is in your radio on a
serial-number basis. You don't need to know this.
>
> 3) When a new and officially sanctioned v1.27 firmware update
finally emerged, people wondered what bug fixes it covered and
what new features it offered. Answer: Fuhgedaboudit. You don't
need to know this. Just trust Yaesu that it's better. Well, your
country's sales rep might be able to find out for you... If you
can actually talk to him. Or maybe not.
>
> 4) Want to go to the Yaesu website and download the update?
Fuhgedaboudit. You can only get it by email from an authorized rep
from your particular country on a one-by-one basis. Got problems
and you want it right now? Fuhgedaboudit. You get on a wait list
and... wait. And hope it gets sent to you One of These Days Real
Soon Now. (So as a result, unauthorized personal website postings
of the update popped up within 24 hours of its release. Is it the
real v1.27? The correct country-specific v1.27 for your radio? Who
knows?)
>
> Y'all can thank your lucky stars that Elecraft owners have a
completely different kind of experience with the manufacturer of
their radio. I just thought you might like to know just how
different it really is.
>
> Bill / W5WVO


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Re: [Elecraft] K3

[Don Wilhelm]

Eric,

That info is not available yet, the testing is being refined.  So far we 
are assured that all parameters are 'better than the K2', but we don't 
know by how much.  Check the FAQ page at the Elecraft website for other 
info.


73,
Don W3FPR

Eric wrote:


Since I heard Elecraft is releasing the K3 I rejoined the list.

Is there any info on RX specs like MDR, IP3, MDS etc etc?

I probably missed a lot of discussion abt this subject.

vy 73 Eric PA3CEV

K2 #960



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[Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Rick Wheeler]

As owner of K2 No. 2005 I look forward to owning a K3 some time in the future. 
Nice job Elecraft!

I haven't yet seen an estimated build time for the K3. The consensus seems the 
K2 is usually around 40-60 hours for the first time K2 builder. Because of the 
K3's modular plug in construction I would assume the build time will be much 
less. Any estimates on the build time?

Also, I am curious as to how "smart" the K3 is in regards to self diagnostics 
for potential failures of various boards or components. Is there a significant 
amount of the routine (say compared to the K2) devoted to isolating and 
detecting faults and failures?

And are the boards designed (and/or will Elecraft encourage) for the 
builder/owner to fix them on site? Or once a potential troublesome board is 
identified will we normally send it back for repair or exchange?

The two items I like the most on my K2 (and other Elecraft product) is firstly 
the performance and at a close second is I never have to worry about being 
unable to fix, service, or align the radio. Of course, it is obvious the K3 
retains both those qualities. 

Rick
K4LX
Bradenton, FL 
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Re: [Elecraft] customer service: & NEW RADIOS

[Bill NY9H]

Larry you make such a great point here.
This is why I cancelled an order a few years ago from another 
manufacturer for a very large expensive radio. BEFORE IT SHIPPED.. 
and it appears that it was the right choice as there were ongoing 
changes (hard and soft)which were never really "finished" in my opinion.


I have an expectation with Eric & Wayne..and Elecraft that if such 
hardware changes are necessary that those "early adopters" would be 
covered like a blanket.


Bill  NY9H K2# 269   K3# ___


Now this is the spot where we hear some comment from Eric or Wayne 
saying something like..." of course!!!.




I may wait for the second production run, although that may be sold 
out by the end of Dayton ;-) I'm guessing 200 for the first run, and 
maybe as many as 1,000 for the second run. I would like to hear 
feedback between those runs, but I don't think there will be time 
for much feedback. My main concern would be hardware changes between 
runs on the first few runs, and how they would be handled for early 
buyers. Obviously firmware changes are no problem. As good as the K3 
design appears to be, there are always little running changes in a rollout.


73,
Larry N8LP



johnny wrote:

Hi Larry,
I have enough with my FTDX9000 and luckily I have already sold it 
only at some losses. Even I now have my IC7800, I still placed my order for K3.
As everyone here, I appreciate the customer support from Elecraft. 
I have enough experience with Ft2000 and FTDX9000 which I do not 
discuss in an Elecraft mail reflector. K3 will be my new rig which 
can be serviced by myself to some degree. I like my IC7800 but if 
the radio has anything wrong, my hands will be up in the air and a 
tip to ICOM service center is unavoidable.

cheers,
Johnny Siu VR2XMC

- Original Message -
*From:* Larry Phipps 
*To:* Bill W5WVO 
*Cc:* [Elecraft] 
*Sent:* Tuesday, May 01, 2007 9:09 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

I wonder if there is any K3 chatter on the FT-2000 list... seems like
they are squarely in the crosshairs ;-)

Larry N8LP



Bill W5WVO wrote:
> Just as an aside on the tremendously personal and intimate
experience of participating in the K3 roll-out, I've also been
monitoring the FT-2000 Yahoo group to see what they're talking
about over there. Over the past week, nearly 100% of the
voluminous postings there have been about firmware updates.
>
> 1) A new firmware revision called v1.26 showed up on the
Internet from SOMEWHERE -- nobody knows where it came from. A lot
of people tried to install it and found serious problems. Yaesu
eventually disclaimed it as somebody's unauthorized hack and
advised people not to install it. This took weeks.
>
> 2) People began wondering how they could determine what firmware
revision their unit is running. Answer: Fuhgedaboudit. There is no
way to get feedback from the FT-2000 as to its own firmware
revision. So patently absurd that nobody could believe it until it
was finally confirmed by a Yaesu tech rep. Reason: Yaesu keeps
track of what firmware revision is in your radio on a
serial-number basis. You don't need to know this.
>
> 3) When a new and officially sanctioned v1.27 firmware update
finally emerged, people wondered what bug fixes it covered and
what new features it offered. Answer: Fuhgedaboudit. You don't
need to know this. Just trust Yaesu that it's better. Well, your
country's sales rep might be able to find out for you... If you
can actually talk to him. Or maybe not.
>
> 4) Want to go to the Yaesu website and download the update?
Fuhgedaboudit. You can only get it by email from an authorized rep
from your particular country on a one-by-one basis. Got problems
and you want it right now? Fuhgedaboudit. You get on a wait list
and... wait. And hope it gets sent to you One of These Days Real
Soon Now. (So as a result, unauthorized personal website postings
of the update popped up within 24 hours of its release. Is it the
real v1.27? The correct country-specific v1.27 for your radio? Who
knows?)
>
> Y'all can thank your lucky stars that Elecraft owners have a
completely different kind of experience with the manufacturer of
their radio. I just thought you might like to know just how
different it really is.
>
> Bill / W5WVO

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Re: [Elecraft] customer service: & NEW RADIOS

[Thom LaCosta]

On Tue, 1 May 2007, Bill NY9H wrote:

I have an expectation with Eric & Wayne..and Elecraft that if such hardware 
changes are necessary that those "early adopters" would be covered like a 
blanket.


I submitted a question about the K3 3 times, once to the list and Lyle, Once to 
Wayne and once to Eric.  Based on not getting an answer to any of the messages, 
I am not willing to assume the early adopters would be covered for hardware 
changes...but a simple statement from Elecraft might clear up any 
mis-understanding.


Thom

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Martin Sole]

As a prospective overseas purchaser of a K3 I think Rick raises a very 
interesting point. Given the nature of the K3 construction it would 
hopefully lend itself to a  flexible repair philosophy.


To give a couple of examples: The company I work for has been trying to 
get our customers, most of whom are used to fixing radios at the 
component level to move toward viewing the entire radio as the line 
replaceable unit (LRU) To say this causes some difficulties, usually 
political, would be an understatement, but faced with multi layer 
surface mount construction anything more than  module replacement is 
pretty much out of the question, especially since the radio is  all DSP 
from the second IF down. It is at the module replacement that the 
balance seems to be  struck I have found.


A similar situation occurs with amateur radio products. Once upon a time 
we all (most) got inside pulled tubes, swapped overheated out of 
tolerance parts etc now when it breaks, as they all do, we are told send 
it back, all of it, all 20-30 pounds/kilos and more. If I can with 
confidence and assistance determine which module is bad and pull that 
for shipment at probably less than 1 or 2 pounds weight then I am going 
to be a much happier camper, especially with overseas mailing rates. It 
is also often much easier on customs formalities , both import and 
export when dealing with modules as opposed to radios.


If such a process is intended for the K3 then it just gained another 
$200-300 dollars perceived value in my book.


Martin, HS0ZED

p.s. Has anybody confirmed if the K3 will be at Friedrichshafen at the 
end of June?







Rick Wheeler wrote:

As owner of K2 No. 2005 I look forward to owning a K3 some time in the future. 
Nice job Elecraft!

I haven't yet seen an estimated build time for the K3. The consensus seems the 
K2 is usually around 40-60 hours for the first time K2 builder. Because of the 
K3's modular plug in construction I would assume the build time will be much 
less. Any estimates on the build time?

Also, I am curious as to how "smart" the K3 is in regards to self diagnostics 
for potential failures of various boards or components. Is there a significant amount of 
the routine (say compared to the K2) devoted to isolating and detecting faults and 
failures?

And are the boards designed (and/or will Elecraft encourage) for the 
builder/owner to fix them on site? Or once a potential troublesome board is 
identified will we normally send it back for repair or exchange?

The two items I like the most on my K2 (and other Elecraft product) is firstly the performance and at a close second is I never have to worry about being unable to fix, service, or align the radio. Of course, it is obvious the K3 retains both those qualities. 


Rick
K4LX
Bradenton, FL 
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Don Wilhelm]

Larry,

I would not be concerned about the hardware from the first production 
run.  If the K2 stability can be any example, remember that the K2 did 
not have significant hardware changes to the receiver or transmitter 
chains.  There were a few enhancements, but my Field Test K2 has very 
little rework that is not present on my SN2100 K2 - both are upgraded to 
the current level.


In the firmware arena, I do expect changes as customer requests for 
added or changed functions are accommodated, but with the firmware being 
available as a download, those changes are easy to install.


As always, you can expect total commitment to customer support from 
Elecraft.


73,
Don W3FPR

Larry Phipps wrote:

I may wait for the second production run, although that may be sold out 
by the end of Dayton ;-) I'm guessing 200 for the first run, and maybe 
as many as 1,000 for the second run. I would like to hear feedback 
between those runs, but I don't think there will be time for much 
feedback. My main concern would be hardware changes between runs on the 
first few runs, and how they would be handled for early buyers. 
Obviously firmware changes are no problem. As good as the K3 design 
appears to be, there are always little running changes in a rollout.


73,
Larry N8LP

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Re: [Elecraft] The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

No one authorative so I'll answer the question about build time, since
I asked Eric this at the Visalia vendors forum.

7-9 hours estimated build time for a K3.  Not an evening, but a
weekend.

73, doug

   Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 08:44:29 +0100
   From: John GM4SLV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   Z-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--)
   Z-Spam-Report: No, hits=-2.4 required=5.5 test=BAYES_00,DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE 
autolearn=no version=3.1.8 
   * -2.6 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayesian spam probability is 0 to 1%
   *  [score: 0.]
   *  0.2 DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE RBL: Envelope sender in 
abuse.rfc-ignorant.org

   On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:47:08 -0700
   wayne burdick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

   > A modular K3 is, clearly, not what you'd think of as homebrew, but
   > it certainly is a kit, and will still take considerable time to
   > complete. 

   One small question, since Wayne has given the first indication the the
   self-build K3 is a little more complex than I might have first thought.

   What is the estimate of how long a K3 _would_ take to put together?
   Are we talking over the course of an evening or something a bit more
   involving?

   I'm not planning one for myself (my K2 is enough radio for me), but I
   can see others wanting to join the party, and to save money by going the
   self build route, and I would love to be able to give them the answers
   that might just push them into it!

   For some it might be "oh - it'll only take a couple of hours, go on
   you'll enjoy it and get a great rig in the process" and for others it
   may be "oh - it's still quite a bit of work, you'll enjoy the build
   process and learn a lot in the process, _and_ get a great rig at the
   end"



   Cheers,

   John GM4SLV 
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[Elecraft] tshirts

[Leo Bricker]

One up a K2?
Only with a K3
--
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.
--
Leo Bricker
73's K5LDB
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[Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[wayne burdick]

Thom,

I'm sorry I missed this one. We've been overwhelmed by email the past 
few days. Lyle and I have been tag-teaming, covering most of the bases, 
we hope!


On another list, some users who have both Drake equipment and K2's 
have been discussing the relative merits of the Drake NoiseBlankers 
versus the K2 NB.


The K3 noise blanker is a completely new design. It is being tested on 
a wide variety of noise sources. While it's impossible to say exactly 
how it would compare to other blankers on every noise type, I can 
assure you it's a significant enhancement. We studied several different 
design approaches before starting the KNB3, including the Drake 
circuit.


In addition, the K3 includes DSP-based both noise blanking and noise 
reduction features that can mitigate noise problems I.F. blankers can't 
touch, no matter how sophisticated.





There have also been discussions relative to passband tuning.


The K3 includes passband tuning. It's designed to take maximum 
advantage of its large number of crystal roofing filters and I.F. DSP, 
in combination. There are two sets of controls: SHIFT/WIDTH, and 
HICUT/LOCUT. Tapping a single button switches between the two. An 
optimized DSP graphic on the LCD sits just above the knobs, and shows 
you at a glance whether the passband has been shifted or narrowed as a 
result of using these controls.


The most appropriate roofing filter is selected automatically as these 
controls are rotated. If you have one of our [pending] 
variable-passband crystal roofing filters installed, then the 1st I.F. 
bandwidth (crystal filter) will closely track the 2nd I.F. bandwidth 
(DSP). This is far superior to receivers that have only wide roofing 
filters and try to do the whole job at the DSP, as well as receivers 
that simply shift one filter against another at two different IFs.


Feel free to email me directly with further questions on this topic.

73,
Wayne
N6KR


---

http://www.elecraft.com

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[Elecraft] Maintenance question

[Robert Tellefsen]

While everyone is talking up all the new and neat stuff
in the K3, I haven't seen much mentioned about how
the K3 will be maintained.

How extensive are the diagnostic routines to enable the
owner to decide if a module is bad, and which one?

Are the modules field repairable?  If extensively SMD
populated, I would guess probably not.

Will the modules be factory repaired and returned, or
will there be a module exchange program.

Part of the fame of the K2 is its owner repairability.
Since it seems we won't be able to do much with the
inner works of the modules, it would be reassuring to
know just what provision will be made to getting back
on the air reasonably quickly.

Keep up the good work.  I'm saving my pennies for my K3.

73, Bob N6WG

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[Elecraft] customer service - follow up on missed email

[DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL]

Well, there you have it.  Someone says, "I didn't get a response" and BINGO!

Not only a response, but a public one with an apology.

Business axiom about Customer Service:

1.  The customer is always right

2.  When the customer is wrong, re-read #1

Gotta love it.

de Doug KR2Q
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[Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[Thom LaCosta]

On Tue, 1 May 2007, wayne burdick wrote:


Thom,

I'm sorry I missed this one. We've been overwhelmed by email the past few 
days. Lyle and I have been tag-teaming, covering most of the bases, we hope!


Thanks for finding it and answering!


The K3 noise blanker is a completely new design. It is being tested on a wide 
variety of noise sources. While it's impossible to say exactly how it would 
compare to other blankers on every noise type, I can assure you it's a 
significant enhancement.


GreatI'll pass your information along to the list.

We studied several different design approaches 

before starting the KNB3, including the Drake circuit.

In addition, the K3 includes DSP-based both noise blanking and noise 
reduction features that can mitigate noise problems I.F. blankers can't 
touch, no matter how sophisticated.


So, the K3 might be known as "The Biggest Hammer"? (Hmmm, I reserve
K3 - The Biggest Hammer as a Tshirt Phrase.)





There have also been discussions relative to passband tuning.


The K3 includes passband tuning.


Cool


Feel free to email me directly with further questions on this topic.


Thanks...I will post your message to the drake mailing list...I suspect
you might be a few emails.

Thanks

73,Thom-k3hrn
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Tom Hammond]

Rick:

A while back (well, several DAYS ago) I seem to recall seeing Wayne 
comment that his take on 'build time' was between 6 and 8 hours.


73,

Tom Hammond   N0SS

At 09:03 AM 5/1/2007, you wrote:
As owner of K2 No. 2005 I look forward to owning a K3 some time in 
the future. Nice job Elecraft!


I haven't yet seen an estimated build time for the K3. The consensus 
seems the K2 is usually around 40-60 hours for the first time K2 
builder. Because of the K3's modular plug in construction I would 
assume the build time will be much less. Any estimates on the build time?


Also, I am curious as to how "smart" the K3 is in regards to self 
diagnostics for potential failures of various boards or components. 
Is there a significant amount of the routine (say compared to the 
K2) devoted to isolating and detecting faults and failures?


And are the boards designed (and/or will Elecraft encourage) for the 
builder/owner to fix them on site? Or once a potential troublesome 
board is identified will we normally send it back for repair or exchange?


The two items I like the most on my K2 (and other Elecraft product) 
is firstly the performance and at a close second is I never have to 
worry about being unable to fix, service, or align the radio. Of 
course, it is obvious the K3 retains both those qualities.


Rick
K4LX
Bradenton, FL
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[Elecraft] tShirt

[Mike]

 elecraft



 dah dit dah

dit dit dit dah dah




73,  Mike K5nu
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Lyle Johnson]

A while back (well, several DAYS ago) I seem to recall seeing Wayne 
comment that his take on 'build time' was between 6 and 8 hours.


He's faster than I am.  It's taken me 3+ years and I'm *still* not 
finished :-)


73,

Lyle KK7P

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[Elecraft] Another T Shirt idea

[Robert Tellefsen]

To steal a line from the sports world,

Elecraft
It's a K3-peat

73, Bob N6WG
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[Elecraft] TShirt

[Mike]

   e l e c r a f t


   k
 kkk
   k
 kkk
   k
  k
  k


 K Tree   73, 
k5nu
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Re: [Elecraft] TShirt

[Robert Tellefsen]

Oh, bad pun.
I love it :-)
73, Bob N6WG

- Original Message -
From: "Mike" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 8:36 AM
Subject: [Elecraft] TShirt


   e l e c r a f
t


   k
 kkk
   k
 kkk
   k
  k
  k


 K Tree
73, k5nu
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[Elecraft] Eric and Wayne - K3 Email overload

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Guys - Wayne and I are swamped by hundreds of direct emails with 
specific K3 questions. (Big surprise, eh? ;-) We are not going to be 
able to answer all emails directly, unless you want us to delay all 
release work on the k3 ;-) We will reply occasionally on the list, but 
to be honest that will also be sparse.


We are updating the K3 FAQ as time allows.  As Wayne mentioned, please 
send detailed questions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . You will -not- get a 
direct answer most of the time, but we are trying to read these as time 
permits and will add answers to the K3 FAQ page at:

http://www.elecraft.com/K3/K3FAQ.htm

And feel free to discuss the K3 among yourselves on the list. Also, 
watch the main K3 info pages on http://www.elecraft.com . We will add 
additional info, spec's etc. as time permits.


It's only a couple of weeks to Dayton. You can guess at the frenzy at 
Elecraft HQ. :-)


73, Eric   WA6HHQ  (sleepless in Aptos..)


DOUGLAS ZWIEBEL wrote:
Well, there you have it.  Someone says, "I didn't get a response" and 
BINGO!

Not only a response, but a public one with an apology.
Business axiom about Customer Service:

1.  The customer is always right
2.  When the customer is wrong, re-read #1

Gotta love it.
de Doug KR2Q


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[Elecraft] TShirt

[Mike]

   e l e c r a f t K3


   k2
k2k2k2
 k2k2k2k2k2
 k2k2k2k2k2k2k2   
  k2k2k2k2k2k2k2k2k2
   k2k2k2k2k2k2k2kk2kk2k2 
k1
k1 
k1

 K Tree  Better, 73, 
k5nu
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Larry Phipps]

I have an early serial number K2 that I have updated as well. I'm not 
concerned that there will be support... just wondering what form it will 
take. If there are changes that are parts substitutions, I assume we 
will have the option of doing our own rework and updates. I have the 
tools for SMD rework, so this is not a problem. My concern would be a 
board revision, which would rise to the level that rework would be 
difficult or impossible.  I assume any board which does not meet 
published specs would be replaced under warranty. I am also assuming a 
redesign just to improve performance would not be free, but would be 
available at nominal cost.


With so many beta testers this is all probably unlikely, but it is an 
all new design and with hundreds of early adopters, with wide ranging 
needs, the rig will be tested in ways which have probably not been 
encountered yet. It might be a good idea (and probably already in the 
works) to direct the beta testers to run additional tests and operations 
based on the reflector comments and questions of the last few days. With 
such a hot new product, I am certain that Eric and Wayne are being 
especially careful about the roll-out, so as not to taint it.


73,
Larry N8LP



Don Wilhelm wrote:

Larry,

I would not be concerned about the hardware from the first production 
run.  If the K2 stability can be any example, remember that the K2 did 
not have significant hardware changes to the receiver or transmitter 
chains.  There were a few enhancements, but my Field Test K2 has very 
little rework that is not present on my SN2100 K2 - both are upgraded 
to the current level.


In the firmware arena, I do expect changes as customer requests for 
added or changed functions are accommodated, but with the firmware 
being available as a download, those changes are easy to install.


As always, you can expect total commitment to customer support from 
Elecraft.


73,
Don W3FPR

Larry Phipps wrote:

I may wait for the second production run, although that may be sold 
out by the end of Dayton ;-) I'm guessing 200 for the first run, and 
maybe as many as 1,000 for the second run. I would like to hear 
feedback between those runs, but I don't think there will be time for 
much feedback. My main concern would be hardware changes between runs 
on the first few runs, and how they would be handled for early 
buyers. Obviously firmware changes are no problem. As good as the K3 
design appears to be, there are always little running changes in a 
rollout.


73,
Larry N8LP




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Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[W2AGN]

wayne burdick wrote:




The most appropriate roofing filter is selected automatically as these 
controls are rotated. If you have one of our [pending] variable-passband 
crystal roofing filters installed, then the 1st I.F. bandwidth (crystal 
filter) will closely track the 2nd I.F. bandwidth (DSP). This is far 
superior to receivers that have only wide roofing filters and try to do 
the whole job at the DSP, as well as receivers that simply shift one 
filter against another at two different IFs.





I have been trying to avoid adding to the bedlam, but then you drop a mini-bomb 
like this "pending" variable passband crystal roofing filter.


It would appear to be a good idea not to fill up the roofing filter slots until 
this is no longer pending. I assume it will be similar to the K2 filters?


This is one of those little "gotcha's" that makes me wait until the dust settles 
to order.


---
  _____
 / \  / \  / \  / \  / \   John L. Sielke
( W )( 2 )( A )( G )( N )  http://w2agn.net
 \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/   http://www.blurty.com/users/w2agn
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Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[Thom LaCosta]

On Tue, 1 May 2007, W2AGN wrote:



I have been trying to avoid adding to the bedlam, but then you drop a 
mini-bomb like this "pending" variable passband crystal roofing filter.


It would appear to be a good idea not to fill up the roofing filter slots 
until this is no longer pending. I assume it will be similar to the K2 
filters?


And that is the type of concern that was expressed in the discussion about 
support for initial buyers if there was a hardware "change".




This is one of those little "gotcha's" that makes me wait until the dust 
settles to order.


In an earlier life you must not have been one of the pioneers.

73,Thom-k3hrn
www.zerobeat.net Home of QRP Web Ring, Drakelist home page,Drake Web Ring,
QRP IRC channel, Drake IRC Channel, Elecraft Owners Database
www.tlchost.net/hosting/  ***  Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month
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[Elecraft] K3 SQL control suggestion

[Barry N1EU]

I'd like to suggest a K3 feature for the ability to optionally
reassign the SQL control to subreceiver RF Gain.  This would make for
a beautifully symmetric pair of AF and RF Gain controls for main and
sub receivers, which would be great for frequent users of the
subreceiver.

Thanks & 73,
Barry N1EU
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Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[W2AGN]

Thom LaCosta wrote:

On Tue, 1 May 2007, W2AGN wrote:







This is one of those little "gotcha's" that makes me wait until the 
dust settles to order.


In an earlier life you must not have been one of the pioneers.

73,Thom-k3hrn


Well, in an earlier life I WAS one of the K2 Field testers. I still have, and 
use K2 #023. I HAVE had to spend money to upgrade it, but if I remember, we 
"pioneers" got 10% off the Field Test rigs, so it was a fair trade-off.


--
---
  _____
 / \  / \  / \  / \  / \   John L. Sielke
( W )( 2 )( A )( G )( N )  http://w2agn.net
 \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/   http://www.blurty.com/users/w2agn
check out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QRPariahs/
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[Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[wayne burdick]

Thom,

I've mentioned the future variable passband filters several times, 
including in the very first posting. Not sure when they'll be 
available. Probably sometime after first shipments.


In any case, you're right -- if you like this idea, then reserve at 
least one crystal filter slot for it.


73,
Wayne
N6KR


On May 1, 2007, at 8:59 AM, W2AGN wrote:


wayne burdick wrote:


The most appropriate roofing filter is selected automatically as 
these controls are rotated. If you have one of our [pending] 
variable-passband crystal roofing filters installed, then the 1st 
I.F. bandwidth (crystal filter) will closely track the 2nd I.F. 
bandwidth (DSP). This is far superior to receivers that have only 
wide roofing filters and try to do the whole job at the DSP, as well 
as receivers that simply shift one filter against another at two 
different IFs.



I have been trying to avoid adding to the bedlam, but then you drop a 
mini-bomb like this "pending" variable passband crystal roofing 
filter.



---

http://www.elecraft.com

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Simon Brown (HB9DRV)]

- Original Message - 
From: "Martin Sole" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


A similar situation occurs with amateur radio products. Once upon a time 
we all (most) got inside pulled tubes, swapped overheated out of 
tolerance parts etc


But theory was simpler then, also we could actually see the components :-)

Simon HB9DRV
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Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[Toby Deinhardt]

In any case, you're right -- if you like this idea, then reserve at 
least one crystal filter slot for it.


Err... 

more like 4... 

two for the main RX and two for the sub RX... 


:) :) :)


vy 73 de toby
--
DD5FZ, 4N6FZ (ex dj7mgq, dg5mgq, dd5fz)
K2 #885, K2/100 #3248
K3/100 #??? (< #200)
DOK C12, BCC, DL-QRP-AG

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Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

There are five crystal filter positions per receive. Five on the main, 
five on the sub.


73, Eric   (..now back to finishing that K3 web order page!)
-

Toby Deinhardt wrote:
In any case, you're right -- if you like this idea, then reserve at 
least one crystal filter slot for it.


Err...
more like 4...
two for the main RX and two for the sub RX...
:) :) :)


vy 73 de toby


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RE: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Craig Rairdin]

As an early adopter of many new devices and technologies I fully understand
that my serial number < 100 device will probably require some updates, and
may require them at my expense. I refuse to demand that Elecraft "cover me
like a blanket" for any necessary updates. If I wasn't willing to take some
risk in order to be among the first owners of this radio, I wouldn't have
placed my order within 30 minutes of the announcement being posted to the
list.

There are three kinds of people when it comes to a new product like this.
Those who jump in with no regrets and no expectations beyond getting the
radio before anyone else (early adopters); those who wait for all the
glitches to be wrung out and for the price to come down (the patient); and
those who are actually in the latter camp but who really want to get their
hands on the product early (the hand-wringers). I don't think it's
Elecraft's responsibility to make that third group feel better about their
purchase decision. 

If there are big hardware changes that need to be made and Elecraft sends me
a replacement module for the cost of shipping, great. If they send me
instructions and a bag of parts, great. If they send me an apology and an
order form for a replacement module at my expense, great. If that's not the
way you look at it then you're wise to wait a year or two. Better yet, wait
for the K4 then pick up a late-model K3 on eBay. (The first post-K3 K2 is up
there now.) :-)

Craig
NZ0R
KX1 #1499
K1 #1966
K2/100 #4941
K3/100 #20-#220

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Larry Phipps
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 10:58 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [Elecraft]
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!


I have an early serial number K2 that I have updated as well. I'm not 
concerned that there will be support... just wondering what form it will 
take. If there are changes that are parts substitutions, I assume we 
will have the option of doing our own rework and updates. I have the 
tools for SMD rework, so this is not a problem. My concern would be a 
board revision, which would rise to the level that rework would be 
difficult or impossible.  I assume any board which does not meet 
published specs would be replaced under warranty. I am also assuming a 
redesign just to improve performance would not be free, but would be 
available at nominal cost.

With so many beta testers this is all probably unlikely, but it is an 
all new design and with hundreds of early adopters, with wide ranging 
needs, the rig will be tested in ways which have probably not been 
encountered yet. It might be a good idea (and probably already in the 
works) to direct the beta testers to run additional tests and operations 
based on the reflector comments and questions of the last few days. With 
such a hot new product, I am certain that Eric and Wayne are being 
especially careful about the roll-out, so as not to taint it.

73,
Larry N8LP



Don Wilhelm wrote:
> Larry,
>
> I would not be concerned about the hardware from the first production 
> run.  If the K2 stability can be any example, remember that the K2 did 
> not have significant hardware changes to the receiver or transmitter 
> chains.  There were a few enhancements, but my Field Test K2 has very 
> little rework that is not present on my SN2100 K2 - both are upgraded 
> to the current level.
>
> In the firmware arena, I do expect changes as customer requests for 
> added or changed functions are accommodated, but with the firmware 
> being available as a download, those changes are easy to install.
>
> As always, you can expect total commitment to customer support from 
> Elecraft.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> Larry Phipps wrote:
>
>> I may wait for the second production run, although that may be sold 
>> out by the end of Dayton ;-) I'm guessing 200 for the first run, and 
>> maybe as many as 1,000 for the second run. I would like to hear 
>> feedback between those runs, but I don't think there will be time for 
>> much feedback. My main concern would be hardware changes between runs 
>> on the first few runs, and how they would be handled for early 
>> buyers. Obviously firmware changes are no problem. As good as the K3 
>> design appears to be, there are always little running changes in a 
>> rollout.
>>
>> 73,
>> Larry N8LP
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Simon Brown (HB9DRV)]

I purchased from the first batch for two reasons:

[1] To be able to support K3 users with Ham Radio Deluxe,
[2] I expect the demand to be so great that were I to wait more than a few 
weeks I could well be waiting for delivery in 2008. I am not prepared to 
wait - this is a stonking radio.


Too many good friends have died young, all with unfulfilled plans.

Carpe diem & 73,

Simon Brown, HB9DRV

- Original Message - 
From: "Craig Rairdin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


[chop-o-matic] 


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[Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[Jeff Stai]

Here's a photo I took of the inside of the K3 at Visalia. The tour that follows is from memory, 
sorry if I misremember.


http://twistedoak.typepad.com/stuff/k3inside.jpg

The front panel is at the top, and you can see four filters for the main RX behind it. I don't know 
what the two daughter boards are. Most of the main board components are on the bottom side.


To the left where the toroids are, are the main RX bandpass filter for the 
amateur bands.

My understanding is that the sub RX board fits on top of the main RX - but I 
didn't see that board.

Center back is the heat sink for the 100W amp.

Left back is the KAT3 tuner.

enjoy! - jeff wk6i

--
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Twisted Oak Winery  http://www.twistedoak.com/
Winery Blog http://www.elbloggotorcido.com/

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Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[Toby Deinhardt]

Yep - but only two of the five per RX can be variable if I have 
understood correctly.


- Original Message - 
From: "Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "Toby Deinhardt" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: "Elecraft Reflector" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 6:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3


There are five crystal filter positions per receive. Five on the 
main, five on the sub.


73, Eric   (..now back to finishing that K3 web order page!)
-

Toby Deinhardt wrote:
In any case, you're right -- if you like this idea, then reserve 
at least one crystal filter slot for it.


Err...
more like 4...
two for the main RX and two for the sub RX...
:) :) :)


vy 73 de toby




__ NOD32 2232 (20070430) Information __

This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
http://www.eset.com




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Larry Phipps]

Like Ted Williams seeing the stitches on a moving baseball, some of us 
could actually see the electrons flowing from cathode to plate! We did 
this at night after trudging to school and back through 2' of snow... 
uphill both ways ;-)


I loved the "good ole days" of circuit design, but I love today for 
different reasons.


Larry N8LP



Simon Brown (HB9DRV) wrote:

- Original Message - From: "Martin Sole" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


A similar situation occurs with amateur radio products. Once upon a 
time we all (most) got inside pulled tubes, swapped overheated out of 
tolerance parts etc


But theory was simpler then, also we could actually see the components 
:-)


Simon HB9DRV
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[Elecraft] Re: More Questions: K3

[wayne burdick]

Up to three of the filters can be variable-bandwidth. These filters 
have an additional 4-pin connector for bandwidth control.


We have plans for at least two different types.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

On May 1, 2007, at 9:59 AM, Toby Deinhardt wrote:

Yep - but only two of the five per RX can be variable if I have 
understood correctly.


---

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RE: [Elecraft] The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[Brett gazdzinski]

I have done 1 to 6, homebrew receivers and transmitters without any
starting design, superhets and kilowatt transmitters,
old push pull tube stuff, pi net continuous coverage, etc,
plus the old heathkit stuff (lots of it), regens out of
encyclopedias, home made circuit board things out
of the ARRL handbook, home built computers, etc, and its
all fun. The design/prototype/test part seems to be the most
fun and educational for me, finding a good simple local
oscillator design using junk box parts was very fun.

I think the K2 was a little over to the parts stuffing side
of kit building, but with so many parts, it has its own
flavor of kit building, and I rate it higher then the old
heathkit stuff.
And nothing heathkit ever designed worked so well, they
always seemed to compromise performance severely over cost.

It sure sounds like the K3 is case building and then you stuff
the modules into slots, do some calibration, and operate.
No way they could offer something as complex in any
other format.


I personally have no reason to upgrade to a K3 other than
the AM receiver part. It sure would be nice if the K3
ends up having a good hi fidelity AM receiver in it.
(20 to 5000 Hz, low distortion and noise)

Many AMers are using old R390's and such, a truckload
of tubes and gears, and it still needs work and
an outboard amp to sound good.

Most swl stuff is not setup to be a communications receiver,
and most is poor for anything other than swl stuff.

Modern ham gear seems to limit things to 300 to maybe 3000
Hz at 1.5 watts and 10% distortion, out of a 2 inch speaker...
add in plenty of IC chip hash from the 4 conversions and
they sound horrible on AM.

I hear flex radio is doing amazing things on AM with 
their stuff, you can set the fidelity, modulation, compression,
etc on both rx and tx, and they can sound better than broadcast
stations, but I don't want a computer in the shack.
I sure hope the K3 includes some of that type of stuff
on the AM mode.
I don't think I could sell the K2, but the 756 pro will
be gone in a flash if the K3 has nice AM receive!

Although I think the crew at elecraft are really amazing, maybe
they shot themselves in the foot with the premature release
of some k3 info, everyone is all lathered up now!

I suppose its time to list the 756 pro on ebay



Brett
N2DTS



   

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RE: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics

[Brett gazdzinski]

 
With bare feet of course!

Brett
N2DTS

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Larry Phipps
> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 12:44 PM
> To: Simon Brown (HB9DRV)
> Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 build time and diagnostics
> 
> Like Ted Williams seeing the stitches on a moving baseball, 
> some of us 
> could actually see the electrons flowing from cathode to 
> plate! We did 
> this at night after trudging to school and back through 2' of snow... 
> uphill both ways ;-)
> 
> I loved the "good ole days" of circuit design, but I love today for 
> different reasons.
> 
> Larry N8LP
> 
> 
> 
> Simon Brown (HB9DRV) wrote:
> > - Original Message - From: "Martin Sole" 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>
> >> A similar situation occurs with amateur radio products. 
> Once upon a 
> >> time we all (most) got inside pulled tubes, swapped 
> overheated out of 
> >> tolerance parts etc
> >
> > But theory was simpler then, also we could actually see the 
> components 
> > :-)
> >
> > Simon HB9DRV
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RE: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[Brett gazdzinski]

 
Where are all the parts??
Sure seems like a lot of ROOM in there!

thanks for the pix!

Brett


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Stai
> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 12:59 PM
> To: Elecraft
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo
> 
> 
> Here's a photo I took of the inside of the K3 at Visalia. The 
> tour that follows is from memory, 
> sorry if I misremember.
> 
> http://twistedoak.typepad.com/stuff/k3inside.jpg
> 
> The front panel is at the top, and you can see four filters 
> for the main RX behind it. I don't know 
> what the two daughter boards are. Most of the main board 
> components are on the bottom side.
> 
> To the left where the toroids are, are the main RX bandpass 
> filter for the amateur bands.
> 
> My understanding is that the sub RX board fits on top of the 
> main RX - but I didn't see that board.
> 
> Center back is the heat sink for the 100W amp.
> 
> Left back is the KAT3 tuner.
> 
> enjoy! - jeff wk6i
> 
> -- 
> Jeff Stai   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Twisted Oak Winery  http://www.twistedoak.com/
> Winery Blog http://www.elbloggotorcido.com/
> 
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[Elecraft] K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information

[wayne burdick]

If you wish to transmit in wide-band modes (AM, ESSB, FM), you'll need 
to have the corresponding wide filter bandwidths installed in the main 
receiver. This is because the transmitter and main receiver share the 
same circuitry. By "wide", I mean:


  AM or ESSBKFL3A-6.0  (6 kHz)
  FMKFL3B-FM   (approx. 13 kHz)

Of course you can also install wide filters on the subreceiver.

This information is being added to the order form. My apologies for any 
inconvenience due to not explaining this sooner.


73,
Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[Lyle Johnson]

The front panel is at the top, and you can see four filters for the main 
RX behind it. I don't know what the two daughter boards are.


The one on the left is the frequency reference, the one on the right is 
the synthesizer.  The two short standoffs to the left of the frequency 
reference are where the subreceiver synthesizer is installed.


73,

Lyle KK7P


BTW, the bright LED near the crystal filters tells me that either the RF 
gain was cranked back or there was a really stong signal being received :-)


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[Elecraft] Re: K3 inside photo

[wayne burdick]

On May 1, 2007, at 10:17 AM, Brett gazdzinski wrote:



Where are all the parts??


There are several hundred SMDs on the bottom of the RF board, and 
several boards you can't see  :)




Sure seems like a lot of ROOM in there!


Not when you add the subreceiver, which has its own BPFs, I.F., and 
full set of roofing filters



73,
Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[W2AGN]

Jeff Stai wrote:


Here's a photo I took of the inside of the K3 at Visalia. The tour that 
follows is from memory, sorry if I misremember.





Gee, just look at all those toroids we'll miss the fun of winding
---
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

Does that mean that if we substitute the 2.8kHz 8 pole filter for the
2.7kHz 5 pole then we'll get a slightly cleaner transmit signal, too?

73, doug

   From: wayne burdick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 10:21:38 -0700

   If you wish to transmit in wide-band modes (AM, ESSB, FM), you'll need 
   to have the corresponding wide filter bandwidths installed in the main 
   receiver. This is because the transmitter and main receiver share the 
   same circuitry. By "wide", I mean:

  AM or ESSBKFL3A-6.0  (6 kHz)
  FMKFL3B-FM   (approx. 13 kHz)

   Of course you can also install wide filters on the subreceiver.

   This information is being added to the order form. My apologies for any 
   inconvenience due to not explaining this sooner.

   73,
   Wayne
   N6KR


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[Elecraft] more on planned variable-BW roofing filters

[wayne burdick]

One of our planned variable-BW filters would have a BW of about 1.6-2.4 
kHz, targeted at SSB use. This is a crystal roofing filter, not a 
filter downstream someplace. It would have at least 4, and possibly as 
many as 8 discrete bandwidths. In effect, it's like having four (or 
more) filters in one slot, allowing you to narrow down and avoid QRM 
with more precision.


It would be automatically set to whichever bandwidth is just above the 
selected DSP BW (that which results from the setting of 
SHIFT/WIDTH/HICUT/LOCUT).


73,
Wayne
N6KR

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RE: [Elecraft] K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information

[Brett gazdzinski]

 
And could you use the FM filter on AM or SSB?

Thanks,
Brett


> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Doug 
> Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604
> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 1:38 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 roofing filters: Important 
> ordering information
> 
> Does that mean that if we substitute the 2.8kHz 8 pole filter for the
> 2.7kHz 5 pole then we'll get a slightly cleaner transmit signal, too?
> 
> 73, doug
> 
>From: wayne burdick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 10:21:38 -0700
> 
>If you wish to transmit in wide-band modes (AM, ESSB, FM), 
> you'll need 
>to have the corresponding wide filter bandwidths installed 
> in the main 
>receiver. This is because the transmitter and main 
> receiver share the 
>same circuitry. By "wide", I mean:
> 
>   AM or ESSBKFL3A-6.0  (6 kHz)
>   FMKFL3B-FM   (approx. 13 kHz)
> 
>Of course you can also install wide filters on the subreceiver.
> 
>This information is being added to the order form. My 
> apologies for any 
>inconvenience due to not explaining this sooner.
> 
>73,
>Wayne
>N6KR
> 
> 
>---
> 
>http://www.elecraft.com
> 
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[Elecraft] K3 RX ant in/out

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

OK, my memory is a bit flaky sometimes.

IIRC, the RX ant in/out connectors can be used for an external
front-end filter, or for a separate RX antenna system.  What else can
they be used for?

73, doug
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[Elecraft] Re: K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information

[wayne burdick]

On May 1, 2007, at 10:37 AM, Doug Faunt N6TQS wrote:


Does that mean that if we substitute the 2.8kHz 8 pole filter for the
2.7kHz 5 pole then we'll get a slightly cleaner transmit signal, too?


If the 2.8 kHz filter had any advantage over 2.7 kHz in a given mode, 
that advantage would be realized in both transmit and receive mode, if 
the filter were installed in the main filter bank (rather than in the 
subreceiver).


The 2.8 kHz filter will have sharper skirts, which may be an advantage. 
Ultimate attenuation will be the same with either 5- or 8-pole filters 
because of the I.F. DSP.


73,
Wayne
N6KR

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Re: [Elecraft] The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[J S]

Wayne wrote, in part, last night:

"I countered that I might just have *helped* some future engineers by
giving them something cool to start on. Something to stimulate their
imagination. And over the years this has proven to be true: I've been
contacted by many hams who hadn't built a thing until they'd
encountered a kit (one of Doug's, or mine and Eric's, or Bob Dyer's,
or Dave Benson's), and had then moved successively higher up the rungs
on N2EY's hierarchy."

Wayne,

I have saved your post to my computer, because more than anything I've
seen, it says so much about you and about Elecraft.  It really means a
lot to me.

A little bit about me.  As a teen many years ago, I wanted to get into
ham radio, but it all looked so technical.  And I didn't know anyone
who was a ham who could help me.  I bought "How to Become a Radio
Amateur", and was fascinated, but didn't carry it any farther.
Finally, years later,  in 1999, I passed the written exam and code
exam and got my first license!  A dream had come true for me at last.

Shortly thereafter, I decided to try my hand at kit building with a
Ramsey 20 meter receiver from the local ham radio store here in town.
I'd never soldered anything, so it turned out poorly and it didn't
work. I was pretty discouraged about that, and wondered if I'd ever
build an electonic project (with soldering) that would work.  I found
eham.net on the web, and started to read reviews about QRP radios.
The reviews I found led me to your website, and the wealth of
information and help about soldering and kit building, not to mention
all the kits offered there.

So here I was, a guy with no technical training or background, who
never successfully built anything electronic, and you, your superb
website, and the other folks at Elecraft are the sole reasons I
successfully built a K1 three years ago.  It was certainly a challenge
for me, but I finished it, and I've made many contacts with that
radio.  And it's a high-quality rig as well.  I was amazed at the
success of that project.

Thank you, Wayne, is all I can say.  I think the real test of all you
are doing, now with the K3 as well, is:  can a high quality radio that
does what it does very, very well be made available not only to the
technically skilled, but also to those like me who don't have a
technical background?  If you achieve these goals, you will done a
great service for the hobby and community of ham radio.

Thank you again for your post. There is so much that you say there.
It's more than all the kits you have devised and built, Wayne.  It's
your perspective: the desire to mentor and encourage others in
building their own radios and projects.  More than that, when so many
will say that ham radio is a dying hobby, what you are really trying
to do is remind us how much there is that is fun in this hobby.  You
and Elecraft really bring us back again to the "Magic of Marconi" -
the discovery of the wonder of radio transmission and communication.
It's how that invisible signal through the air can miraculously allow
me to communicate with someone across town, across the country, or
across the ocean.   Isn't that what Elecraft is really about, after
all?

Your post is real hall-of-fame material, in this ham's opinion.  Thank
you, Wayne, for this great reminder of the magic of radio... for all
to enjoy.

Jeff Simpson
K6ATT
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[Elecraft] Re: K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information

[wayne burdick]

AM, probably. I'm not sure there's a good reason to use the FM filter 
in SSB mode. We'll provide more details in the FAQ.


73,
Wayne
N6KR


On May 1, 2007, at 10:45 AM, Brett gazdzinski wrote:



And could you use the FM filter on AM or SSB?


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[Elecraft] T shirt slogans

[Leigh]

The new K3 is for me

Believe you me the K3 is for me

The radio for me is the K3

Hurrah for the new K3

Nothin’ for me but the new K3

You should see the new K3

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RE: [Elecraft] T shirt slogans

I don't know about T-Shirts but I want Elecraft Boxer Shorts!.
Lee
w0vt

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[Elecraft] T shirt slogans

[Leigh]

The new K3 is for me

Believe you me the K3 is for me

The radio for me is the K3

Hurrah for the new K3

Nothin’ for me but the new K3

You should see the new K3

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[Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[J F]

Jeff,

Is the top of the case perforated? I'm wondering about
the air flow through the case...

Cheers,
Julius
n2wn
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RE: [Elecraft] The K3 and "homebrew": view from the E-lab

[Brett gazdzinski]

There is actually a step below 1 on the scale.
Remember way back, like when the ARRL started, everyone
made their own parts!
Caps, coils, batteries, resistors were all home made
in many cases.
I do my own coils and was thinking about ways I might
make some big air variable caps for a big antenna tuner, 
but draw the line at blowing glass for tubes and making
resistors out of carbon

Brett
N2DTS

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[Vic K2VCO]

Craig Rairdin wrote:

As an early adopter of many new devices and technologies I fully understand
that my serial number < 100 device will probably require some updates, and
may require them at my expense. I refuse to demand that Elecraft "cover me
like a blanket" for any necessary updates. If I wasn't willing to take some
risk in order to be among the first owners of this radio, I wouldn't have
placed my order within 30 minutes of the announcement being posted to the
list.


There are several reasons why the K3 pioneers will not be taking too 
many arrows in their backs.


First of all, the K3 has a good balance of technology between the 
hardware and the firmware. Most upgrades will be firmware-only, and 
since it will be downloadable, you won't even need to worry about 
zapping a chip.


Second, the K2 is modular. Even if a board has to be replaced, I expect 
that the cost will be reasonable.


Third, the development process has been thorough as is the testing 
process. Elecraft has been working on it for more than three years (I 
know, because I found out about it in 2004 and actually kept my mouth 
shut -- it wasn't easy), and their development team has been wringing 
out the prototypes for months. Beta testers (non-Elecraft people) will 
continue to test it before the first 200 orders are shipped. The K3 will 
not be released half-baked, as some recent products of other 
manufacturers have (they know who they are).


I waited for a while before getting a K2 -- my K2 is serial no. 709. The 
above considerations plus my experience with Elecraft has convinced me 
that I don't need to wait for the K3, and I am going for the lowest 
serial number I can get!

--
73,
Vic, K2VCO
Fresno CA
http://www.qsl.net/k2vco
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[wayne burdick]

On May 1, 2007, at 11:10 AM, J F wrote:


Jeff,

Is the top of the case perforated?


Yes.

Wayne

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Re: [Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?

[waltk8cv4612amos]

I did dxpeditions in the 80's and ALWAYS carried on my TS-830, remote vfo, 
keyer and paddle along with log books on the plane. YOU CAN'T DO THAT ANY 
MORE ! You have monkeys pawing through your stuff every time you get on the 
plane. If your radio will fit in a 2 oz. bottle it is ok :-) Oh, sure , you 
can CHECK THROUGH anything but a BOMB in the check in luggage but it is 
un-locked and it may or may NOT come out the other end ! Go to the homeland 
security sight, it's all there. I left my ATS-3 at home on my last trip to 
Hawaii a few weeks ago. I was on Lanai and it would have been pretty rare, 
but alas, not for me.


Best bet, don't travel with a radio. PERIOD !!

If you are traveling in the USA to some destination send the radio on ahead 
by UPS and it will be at your sisters place or your hotel HOPEFULLY if you 
make arrangements for them to accept it before hand.


Sure , some guys will tell you " I didn't have any problem " but they were 
lucky.


Walt K8CV Royal Oak, MI.


- Original Message - 
From: "Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: 
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 11:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?



I've carried mine in all those ways, plus just putting it a softsided
case that fits it, and putting that in a duffle bag padded with clothes,
and checking it.

For a oneshot, bubblewrapping and in hardside luggage should be fine.
The Pelican case is overkill unless you're packing it a lot, into
extreme environments, and use of the radio at the other end is
critical, such as you're traveling for a DXpedition.

I used a 4225 on my first DXpedition, and now that I've got a way of
testing the 4125 at extreme levels before I leave, I've started taking
that one again.

73, doug

  Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2007 17:47:59 -0700
  From: David Fleming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

  It's mighty quite around here all of a sudden.

  I'll be taking the K2 with me and the family on vacation this summer.
  I'm trying to come up with a good way to package the rig for the
  flight. I've never traveled with a radio before. I'll be taking the K2,
  KAT100-1, MFJ-4225MV (I know, but it seems to be a fairly decent little
  power supply), headset/mic, bencher paddles, cables, wire, some tools,
  etc. My first thought was to give everything a good bubble wrapping and
  put it all in a sturdy (hard shell) suitcase and be done with it. But I
  can't treat my K2 that way. I'm thinking the best solution (within
  reason) would be to buy a Pelican 1650 with the pluck foam and make a
  nice cubby hole in the foam for everything. Or I could put the K2 and
  KAT in a much smaller case and take it carry-on and put everything else
  in a suitcase. Those Pelican cases are a bit pricey though. How do ya'll
  (yous guys) do it?

  -David W4SMT


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Re: [Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?

[Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604]

Err, I've been on a dozen DXpeditions since 2001, and have been "lucky"
every time.   Given an attitude about "monkeys pawing through your
stuff", you probably would have problems.

Yes, it's possible that your gear will be molested or stolen, we lost
a bag of stuff at APW on this last trip, but life is risks.

73, doug

   From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 09:43:08 -0400

   I did dxpeditions in the 80's and ALWAYS carried on my TS-830, remote vfo, 
   keyer and paddle along with log books on the plane. YOU CAN'T DO THAT ANY 
   MORE ! You have monkeys pawing through your stuff every time you get on the 
   plane. If your radio will fit in a 2 oz. bottle it is ok :-) Oh, sure , you 
   can CHECK THROUGH anything but a BOMB in the check in luggage but it is 
   un-locked and it may or may NOT come out the other end ! Go to the homeland 
   security sight, it's all there. I left my ATS-3 at home on my last trip to 
   Hawaii a few weeks ago. I was on Lanai and it would have been pretty rare, 
   but alas, not for me.

   Best bet, don't travel with a radio. PERIOD !!

   If you are traveling in the USA to some destination send the radio on ahead 
   by UPS and it will be at your sisters place or your hotel HOPEFULLY if you 
   make arrangements for them to accept it before hand.

   Sure , some guys will tell you " I didn't have any problem " but they were 
   lucky.

   Walt K8CV Royal Oak, MI.


   - Original Message - 
   From: "Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   Cc: 
   Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 11:29 PM
   Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?


   > I've carried mine in all those ways, plus just putting it a softsided
   > case that fits it, and putting that in a duffle bag padded with clothes,
   > and checking it.
   >
   > For a oneshot, bubblewrapping and in hardside luggage should be fine.
   > The Pelican case is overkill unless you're packing it a lot, into
   > extreme environments, and use of the radio at the other end is
   > critical, such as you're traveling for a DXpedition.
   >
   > I used a 4225 on my first DXpedition, and now that I've got a way of
   > testing the 4125 at extreme levels before I leave, I've started taking
   > that one again.
   >
   > 73, doug
   >
   >   Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2007 17:47:59 -0700
   >   From: David Fleming <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
   >
   >   It's mighty quite around here all of a sudden.
   >
   >   I'll be taking the K2 with me and the family on vacation this summer.
   >   I'm trying to come up with a good way to package the rig for the
   >   flight. I've never traveled with a radio before. I'll be taking the K2,
   >   KAT100-1, MFJ-4225MV (I know, but it seems to be a fairly decent little
   >   power supply), headset/mic, bencher paddles, cables, wire, some tools,
   >   etc. My first thought was to give everything a good bubble wrapping and
   >   put it all in a sturdy (hard shell) suitcase and be done with it. But I
   >   can't treat my K2 that way. I'm thinking the best solution (within
   >   reason) would be to buy a Pelican 1650 with the pluck foam and make a
   >   nice cubby hole in the foam for everything. Or I could put the K2 and
   >   KAT in a much smaller case and take it carry-on and put everything else
   >   in a suitcase. Those Pelican cases are a bit pricey though. How do ya'll
   >   (yous guys) do it?
   >
   >   -David W4SMT
   >
   >
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[Elecraft] RE: K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information

[Brett gazdzinski]

 I was thinking the FM filter could be used on
other modes as a wide filter. I think the K3 comes standard
with the 2.7 filter, plus just the FM filter would allow
wider bandwidths in the other modes with decreased performance.
I don't contest or DX hunt, and don't generally operate
(voice anyway) when the bands are crowded.

My hearing is gone and I don't need anything more than
6kc on AM, but others like it a bit wider.
Plus, if you get the FM filter, you could use the FM
mode, the AM mode, a wide ssb mode?, and only have
to pay for the one FM filter...

Am I right in thinking that with dsp, the roofing filter
is only real important if there are very close strong signals?

Am I right in thinking you could limit the bandwidth on TX
to say 3kc on ssb even though you have the FM filter in?
That would be 6kc with both sidebands on AM...

Best bet sounds like it would be one variable filter
that matched the bandwidth selected, from 15 KHz to 200 cycles!

Is that not possible?

Brett





> -Original Message-
> From: wayne burdick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 1:49 PM
> To: Brett gazdzinski
> Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: K3 roofing filters: Important ordering information
> 
> AM, probably. I'm not sure there's a good reason to use the FM filter 
> in SSB mode. We'll provide more details in the FAQ.
> 
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
> 
> 
> On May 1, 2007, at 10:45 AM, Brett gazdzinski wrote:
> 
> >
> > And could you use the FM filter on AM or SSB?
> 
> ---
> 
> http://www.elecraft.com
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[Jeff Stai]

It is, but I didn't investigate further as to the airflow. cheers! - jeff wk6i

J F wrote:

Jeff,

Is the top of the case perforated? I'm wondering about
the air flow through the case...



--
Jeff Stai   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Twisted Oak Winery  http://www.twistedoak.com/
Winery Blog http://www.elbloggotorcido.com/

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[Elecraft] A (Not the Only) Secret of Elecraft's Success

[J S]

Part (only part) of the secret of Wayne and Eric's success is that,
not only do they spark enthusiasm for their quality kits and ham
radio, they also hire people with that same desire!  What a team.  You
folks are elmering a lot of us.

Jeff
K6ATT
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[Elecraft] Roofing Filters

[Lee Buller]

 
   
  OK
   
  How many roofing filters do you need in a K3?  I would suggest one for SSB 
and one for CW.  What am I missing here with roofing filters.  Someone with 
more engineering savy should enlighten us liberal arts majors.
   
  Lee - K0WA
   


In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply.  If you don't 
have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it.  If you can't find 
any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense.  Is 
Common Sense devine?
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Re: [Elecraft] How do you travel with the K2?

[Lyle Johnson]

Best bet, don't travel with a radio. PERIOD !!


Last year I took my K2 to Western Australia.  It was in my carry-on on 
the way over, and in my checked baggage on the way back.  I flew 
domestically and internationally on that trip since OZ isn't served from 
Seattle.


Zero problems.

In hundreds of international flights pre- and tens post-9/11, this has 
almost never been an issue.  When it was, a careful, calm reaction to 
questions always resulted in being able to take the equipment, either on 
board or checked.  Only once did I have to work my way past an obstinate 
person, and that was hand-carrying a satellite (AO-51) to a launch 
facility (Aeroflot to Moscow) enroute to Kazhakstan.


I *have* had things stolen from my locked, checked baggage, but that was 
when I went to *very* 3rd world places.


73,

Lyle KK7P


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[Elecraft] The K3 and "Homebrew"

[David Yarnes]

The first transmitter I had was completely homebrew--chassis, transformers, 
even several of the coils and chokes.  Several of the tuning capacitors 
started out larger than neccessary, and we just pulled off rotor plates 
until we got the right value.  Needless to say I had help, but I did do most 
of the work.  But ever since then, "building" has been evolving.  Early on 
every part was a separate part.  Then we started benefitting from the 
combination of parts into one part to the point where we now have integrated 
circuits, etc.  Every step meant less soldering and, surprise, better 
results!  Heck, the NE602 is almost a receiver all by itself.


What Eric and Wayne have done is take it to the next level--modules instead 
of more parts--and more soldering.  Ten-Tec actually did this years 
ago--they just didn't offer those txcvrs as kits.  You didn't necessarily 
have to send your whole radio back for repair, you just sent one of the 
modules.


It will probably rub purists the wrong way, and I hope to build more radios 
including soldering, but I actually condone their decision.  My main reason 
is that, although I have successfully dealt with SMD's, the teeny-weeny ones 
are pretty frustrating.  I suspect there are a bunch of those in the K3. 
And these days it's harder and harder to find anything but SMD's.  Chasing 
down parts these days to really "homebrew" something is almost as 
frustrating as getting QSL's from DX stations.  I gave up worrying about 
that  too!


So, I have no problem swallowing my "builder's pride" in order to get a 1st 
class rig like the K3 (my order is in!).  I'll still call it a kit, but in 
deference to that first transmitter I had, I won't call it "homebrew".  It 
ain't!  But I will always greatly admire those who do build from scratch, 
and if I have to spot them a multiplier in a contest I will gladly do so. 
It just means I have to work on my operator skills that much more to try and 
overcome it.


Dave W7AQK (K2 #72)





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[Elecraft] K3 specs

[Eric]

Hi,


Thank you all for your emails and comments on my questions. I decided 
to trust the Elecraft guys and to order and pre-pay.


vy 73 Eric PA3CEV


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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing Filters

[Jeff Stai]

Depends on what you want to do. I ordered the SSB 2.8KHz filter, plus the 250 and 400Hz for RTTY and 
 CW contests. I'm not planning on any FM or AM use.


I like having both 250 and 400 for RTTY - sometimes one or the other BW will copy better on my 
current rig depending on QRM, etc.


I'm hoping between now and July they will offer a 1.8KHz SSB filter, which I refer to as my 
Sweepstakes filter on my current rig...:)


(Sorry - I didn't have time to put all that in iambic pentameter!)

73 - jeff wk6i


Lee Buller wrote:


How many roofing filters do you need in a K3?  I would suggest one for SSB and 
one for CW.  What
am I missing here with roofing filters.  Someone with more engineering savy 
should enlighten us
liberal arts majors.

Lee - K0WA



--
Jeff Stai   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Twisted Oak Winery  http://www.twistedoak.com/
Winery Blog http://www.elbloggotorcido.com/

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RE: [Elecraft] T shirt slogans

[Tom Hall]

I just left a deposit for a K3.

My T shirt will now say:

K34ME! K24U?

Tom, ak2b



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Re: [Elecraft] T shirt slogans

[Robert Tellefsen]

Hmmm
Sounds like a license plate.
You may need an annual sticker to
keep the cops from ticketing you :-)
73, Bob N6WG

- Original Message - 
From: "Tom Hall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 1:02 PM
Subject: RE: [Elecraft] T shirt slogans


> I just left a deposit for a K3.
> 
> My T shirt will now say:
> 
> K34ME! K24U?
> 
> Tom, ak2b
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing Filters

[Toby Deinhardt]

 How many roofing filters do you need in a K3?


I belong to the liberal arts faction...

In other words I don't know what I am talking about... ;-)


I ordered my K3 with the secondary RX, 6kHz Filter, FM Filter, 2x 
2.7kHz and the CG frontend filter.


As for the other roofing filters, I also am unsure what I should 
order - mainly because we do not know yet, when which filters will be 
avaidable, and we do not have any hard data on the filters themselves.


If the variable filters have no real disadvantages (factors such as 
skirt steepness down to c. -30dB, image rejection for IF to NF, 
impulse behaviour, etc.), then I personally would try and cover as 
large a bandwidth range as possible with the variable filters.


My dream configuration could look like this:

RX1

1) 200Hz (or 250Hz)
2) 300Hz to 600Hz variable
3) 600Hz to 1.2kHz variable
4) 1.2kHz to 2.4kHz variable
5) 2.7kHz (or 2.8kHz)

RX2+CG

1) 300Hz to 600Hz variable
2) 1.2kHz to 2.4kHz variable
3) 2.7khz (or 2.8kHz)
4) 3kHz to 6kHz variable
5) FM

OTOH, if the A/D and AGC are good enough, we might be able to do with 
only few well choosen bandwidths.


I doubt Elecraft will offer a 3kHz to 6kHz, and 600Hz to 1.2kHz is 
also not very likely. But maybe the firmware will allow people who 
have the right skills to design and build their own filters.


I do think this will become an area for much discussion in months to 
come, especially if third parties also start to offer roofing filters 
for the K3.



vy 73 de toby
--
DD5FZ, 4N6FZ (ex dj7mgq, dg5mgq, dd5fz)
K2 #885, K2/100 #3248
K3/100 #??? (< #200)
DOK C12, BCC, DL-QRP-AG


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[Elecraft] N2CQ QRP Contest Calendar: May 2007

[Ken Newman]

~
N2CQ QRP CONTEST CALENDAR
May 2007 
~

AGCW QRP/QRP Party (CW) ... QRP Contest!
May 1, 1300z to 1900z
Rules: http://www.agcw.org/agcw-con/2007/Englisch/agcw-dl_e.htm
~
Adventure Radio Spartan Sprint (CW) ... QRP Contest!
May 8, 0100z to 0300z (First Monday 9 PM EDT)
Rules: http://www.arsqrp.com/
~
Ten-Ten International Spring Contest (Dig/CW)...QRP Category
May 5, 0001z to May 6, 2359z
Rules: http://www.ten-ten.org/calendar.html
~
7th Call Area QSO Party (Ph/CW) ... QRP Category
May 5, 1300z to May 6, 0700z
Rules: http://www.7qp.org
~
Indiana QSO Party (All) ... QRP Category
May 5, 1600z to May 6, 0400z
Rules: http://www.hdxcc.org/inqp/
~
New England QSO Party (Phone/CW) ... QRP Category
May 5, 2000z to May 6, 0500z
May 6, 1300z to May 6, 2400z
Rules: http://www.neqp.org/
~
VK/trans-Tasman Contests (80 M Ph) ... QRP Category
May 12, 0800z to 1400z
Rules: http://home.iprimus.com.au/vktasman/RULES.HTM
~
Mid-Atlantic QSO Party (CW/Dig/SSB/FM) ... QRP Category
May 12, 1600z to May 13, 0400z 
Rules: http://www.maqp.info/

~
FISTS Spring Sprint (CW) ... QRP Category
May 12, 1700z to 2100z
Rules: http://www.fists.org/sprints.html
~
CQM International DX Contest (CW/SSB) ... QRP Category
May 12, 1200z to May 13, 1159z
Rules: http://www.sk3bg.se/contest/cqmidxc.htm
~
NAQCC Straight Key/Bug Sprint *** QRP CONTEST! ***
EDT: May 16, 8:30 PM to 10:30 PM
UTC: May 17, 0030z to 0230z
Rules: http://www.arm-tek.net/~yoel/contests.html
~
Dayton Hamvention (QRP Event - FDIM)
May 18-20
Info: http://www.hamvention.org/
~
US Counties QSO Party (SSB)
May 19, z to May 20, 2359z
Rules: http://marac.org/ssbqsoparty.htm
~
HIS MAJESTY THE KING OF SPAIN CONTEST (CW)
May 19, 1200z to May 20, 1200z
Rules: http://www.sk3bg.se/contest/kingofsp.htm
~
EU PSK DX Contest  ... Low Power (10W) Category
May 19, 1200z to May 20, 1200z
Rules: http://www.eudx.srars.org/
~
All America Contest (CW) ... QRP Category
May 19, 1500z to May 20, 2359z
Rules: http://www.powerline.com.br/cwjf/eng4.htm#regulamento
~
Baltic Contest (CW/SSB) (80 Meters)
May 19, 2100z to May 20, 0200z
Rules: http://www.lrsf.lt/bcontest/english/rules_html.htm
~
RUN FOR THE BACON (CW) *** QRP CONTEST ***
EDT: May 20, 9 PM to 11 PM
UTC: May 21, 0100z 0300z
Rules: http://fpqrp.com
~
CQWW WPX Contest (CW) ... QRP Category
May 26, z to May 27, 2359z
Rules: http://www.cq-amateur-radio.com/awards.html
~
VK/trans-Tasman Contests (80 M CW) ... QRP Category
May 26, 0800z to 1300z
Rules: http://home.iprimus.com.au/vktasman/RULES.HTM
~
QRP ARCI Hoot Owl Sprint (CW) ... QRP Contest!
May 27, 2000 to 2400 LOCAL TIME
Rules: http://www.qrparci.org
~
Michigan QRP Memorial Day Sprint (CW) ... QRP Contest!
May 28, 2300z to May 29, 0300z
Rules: http://www.qsl.net/miqrpclub/contest.html
~
QRP BARBERSHOP QUARTET CONTEST (CW QRP)... QRP Contest!
May 30, 9PM to 11PM EDT  
Rules: http://www.io.com/~n5fc/barbershop_contest.htm

~
Thanks to SM3CER, WA7BNM, N0AX(ARRL) and others 
for assistance in compiling this calendar. 

Please foreward the contest info you sponsor 
to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and we will post it and give it more publicity.

Anyone may use this "N2CQ QRP Contest Calendar" for your website,
newsletter, e-mail list or other media as you choose.  
(Include a credit to the source of this material of course.)

72 de
Ken Newman - N2CQ 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

http://www.amqrp.org/contesting/contesting.html
http://www.n3epa.org/Pages/Contest/contest.htm

   



___

Re: [Elecraft] Roofing Filters

[Toby Deinhardt]

mainly because we do not know yet, when which filters will be 
avaidable, and we do not have any hard data on the filters 
themselves.


If no one else noticed, the web based order form has been updated, and 
there is a new roofing filter mentioned: KFL3A-1.0  1 kHz, 8-pole 
roofing filter



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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft customer service: appreciate it!

[David Wilburn]

I remember hearing in one of the posts that they had been working on 
this for 3 years.  Would it be possible to hear an overview of their 
beta testing process, how many folks were involved, maybe some 
interesting anecdotes from the process?  Just curious.  If I'm stepping 
into areas best left alone, that is fine.


David Wilburn
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
K4DGW
K2 #5982


Larry Phipps wrote:
I have an early serial number K2 that I have updated as well. I'm not 
concerned that there will be support... just wondering what form it will 
take. If there are changes that are parts substitutions, I assume we 
will have the option of doing our own rework and updates. I have the 
tools for SMD rework, so this is not a problem. My concern would be a 
board revision, which would rise to the level that rework would be 
difficult or impossible.  I assume any board which does not meet 
published specs would be replaced under warranty. I am also assuming a 
redesign just to improve performance would not be free, but would be 
available at nominal cost.


With so many beta testers this is all probably unlikely, but it is an 
all new design and with hundreds of early adopters, with wide ranging 
needs, the rig will be tested in ways which have probably not been 
encountered yet. It might be a good idea (and probably already in the 
works) to direct the beta testers to run additional tests and operations 
based on the reflector comments and questions of the last few days. With 
such a hot new product, I am certain that Eric and Wayne are being 
especially careful about the roll-out, so as not to taint it.


73,
Larry N8LP



Don Wilhelm wrote:

Larry,

I would not be concerned about the hardware from the first production 
run.  If the K2 stability can be any example, remember that the K2 did 
not have significant hardware changes to the receiver or transmitter 
chains.  There were a few enhancements, but my Field Test K2 has very 
little rework that is not present on my SN2100 K2 - both are upgraded 
to the current level.


In the firmware arena, I do expect changes as customer requests for 
added or changed functions are accommodated, but with the firmware 
being available as a download, those changes are easy to install.


As always, you can expect total commitment to customer support from 
Elecraft.


73,
Don W3FPR

Larry Phipps wrote:

I may wait for the second production run, although that may be sold 
out by the end of Dayton ;-) I'm guessing 200 for the first run, and 
maybe as many as 1,000 for the second run. I would like to hear 
feedback between those runs, but I don't think there will be time for 
much feedback. My main concern would be hardware changes between runs 
on the first few runs, and how they would be handled for early 
buyers. Obviously firmware changes are no problem. As good as the K3 
design appears to be, there are always little running changes in a 
rollout.


73,
Larry N8LP




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RE: [Elecraft] Roofing Filters

[Craig Rairdin]

I miss a 100Hz filter, which I use in the K2 all the time during contests. I
ordered the 200Hz and 400Hz filters for CW and am hoping that's what I want.

Craig

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Toby Deinhardt
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 3:36 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Roofing Filters


>  How many roofing filters do you need in a K3?

I belong to the liberal arts faction...

In other words I don't know what I am talking about... ;-)


I ordered my K3 with the secondary RX, 6kHz Filter, FM Filter, 2x 
2.7kHz and the CG frontend filter.

As for the other roofing filters, I also am unsure what I should 
order - mainly because we do not know yet, when which filters will be 
avaidable, and we do not have any hard data on the filters themselves.

If the variable filters have no real disadvantages (factors such as 
skirt steepness down to c. -30dB, image rejection for IF to NF, 
impulse behaviour, etc.), then I personally would try and cover as 
large a bandwidth range as possible with the variable filters.

My dream configuration could look like this:

RX1

1) 200Hz (or 250Hz)
2) 300Hz to 600Hz variable
3) 600Hz to 1.2kHz variable
4) 1.2kHz to 2.4kHz variable
5) 2.7kHz (or 2.8kHz)

RX2+CG

1) 300Hz to 600Hz variable
2) 1.2kHz to 2.4kHz variable
3) 2.7khz (or 2.8kHz)
4) 3kHz to 6kHz variable
5) FM

OTOH, if the A/D and AGC are good enough, we might be able to do with 
only few well choosen bandwidths.

I doubt Elecraft will offer a 3kHz to 6kHz, and 600Hz to 1.2kHz is 
also not very likely. But maybe the firmware will allow people who 
have the right skills to design and build their own filters.

I do think this will become an area for much discussion in months to 
come, especially if third parties also start to offer roofing filters 
for the K3.


vy 73 de toby
-- 
DD5FZ, 4N6FZ (ex dj7mgq, dg5mgq, dd5fz)
K2 #885, K2/100 #3248
K3/100 #??? (< #200)
DOK C12, BCC, DL-QRP-AG
 

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[Elecraft] F.S. K2/100

[Don Wilhelm]

I am offering one of my K2/100s SN 2100 for sale.  This K2 has been 
fully and professionally upgraded to the equivalent of the current ship 
level including all A to B mods (the optional ones too), a new crystal 
set and is in perfect working condition as an all band 160 through 10 
meter K2 including 60 meters.  It is fully loaded with all options as 
follows:


Base K2
KPA100
KSB2
KNB2
K160RX
K60XV
KAF2

It also has the W3FPR Fixed Audio board tucked between the front panel 
and the control board with the output line on the microphone jack.


Asking $1300 for it shipped to your door anywhere in the US.  For 
international shipments I would have to add the shipping differential.


My reasons for selling - first I don't really need 3 K2s! and secondly, 
I really *WANT* a K3, but the current budget will not allow it.


I will set the filters, sidetone pitch, mic header, etc to the buyers 
preferences and do a complete calibration before shipping it.


Please reply off-reflector and it helps if you remove the [Elecraft] 
from the subject line.


73,
Don W3FPR
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[Elecraft] Re: Roofing Filters

[wayne burdick]

Craig Rairdin wrote:

I miss a 100Hz filter, which I use in the K2 all the time during 
contests. I
ordered the 200Hz and 400Hz filters for CW and am hoping that's what I 
want.


Hi Craig,

Our 200 Hz or 400 Hz filter, combined with DSP I.F. and A.F. filtering 
down to 50 Hz, should handle any CW-mode QRM situation.


73,
Wayne
N6KR


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[Elecraft] CW/DATA modes: Why you'll want a narrow roofing filter

[wayne burdick]

Let's suppose the only crystal roofing filter you have installed is 2.8 
kHz wide. You put the rig into CW (or data) mode, then dial the DSP 
bandwidth down to 400 Hz. Everything will be fine -- unless an 
extremely strong signal appears that's *outside* the DSP's passband but 
still *inside* the crystal filter passband.


This can cause what's called "pumping," meaning activation of the AGC 
or desensing. Many transceivers with I.F. DSP don't have the ability to 
do anything about this, so they get "trashed" on receive. Such 
transceivers typically have only a 3 kHz (or wider) roofing filter, 
allowing strong signals to cause trouble.


The K3 has roofing filter bandwidths as low as 200 Hz, giving you a 
means to completely eliminating problems with nearby signals. If 
installed, these will be automatically selected as you narrow the DSP's 
bandwidth using the shift/width/hicut/locut controls. Or you can select 
them manually.


We'll add this to the FAQ.

73,
Wayne
N6KR



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[Elecraft] Roofing Filters

[Bill Tippett]

K0WA:
>How many roofing filters do you need in a K3?
I would suggest one for SSB and one for CW.

That's basically correct, although it
depends on how you plan to operate (i.e. serious
low band DXing or contests versus casual operating).
Remember that a roofing filter's purpose is to
prevent IMD and BDR products from passing through
the IF chain to the final DSP stage where the final
filtering is done.  That stage will have variable
filter bandwidths over a wide range (every 50 Hz if
I recall correctly).  The DSP stage really does the
heavy lifting after the roofing filter ensures that
unwanted products are eliminated at the first IF.

If you do casual operating where adjacent
signals are seldom above S9+30, it is very unlikely
you need more than the stock 5-pole 2.7 kHz filter.
Remember that (excluding Orion) few modern rigs use
roofing filters narrower than 3 kHz (this includes
the IC-7800, FTDX9000, FT-2000 and most of the Inrad
roofing filter add-ons for older rigs (Ten-Tec's
Omni VI excluded which can be fitted with a 600 Hz).

Since the filters have not yet been fully
defined or characterized, I would be tempted not to
order ANY optional filters at this point.  As ARRL
discovered in their Orion tests, narrower is not always
better.  This resulted in Ten-Tec redesigning the
Orion II with ONLY 4-pole roofing filters, instead
of using the older 8-pole 500 Hz and 6-pole 250 Hz
filters used in the original Orion.  By "characterized"
above, I mean published IMD and BDR specs for each filter.
As Ten-Tec has discovered with Orion, roofing filters are
somewhat "black magic" and there is no substitute for
actual measurements before making a decision about which
may be best.  A good discussion of roofing filters by
George W2VJN of Inrad is here:

http://www.qth.com/inrad/roofing-filters.pdf

Filling K3 with filters as Toby suggested is
both unnecessary and expensive IMHO.  I think he is
forgetting that there is very good DSP filtering in
the final DSP IF that is already doing what he is
attempting to do with a wide range of roofing filters.
If you are a serious contester, likely to operate in
an environment of S9+30 signals spaced every 500 Hz
on 160 meters, then you probably do need a narrow
filter like the 500 Hz or 400 Hz.  Going narrower
is questionable IMHO because:

1.  You would not hear off-frequency callers with
narrower bandwidths (I've found even 500 Hz is too
narrow in some cases.

2.  At 500 Hz signal spacing, which a 500 Hz roofing
filter will handle very well (i.e. +/- 250 Hz excludes
the +/- 500 Hz interfering products), you are probably
already limited by issues like transmitted phase noise,
key clicks, etc. which will override even a perfect
receiver with infinitely good IMD and BDR performance.
Even a perfect receiver cannot prevent an adjacent TX
signal's defects!

Regarding 5-pole versus 8-pole, note W2VJN's
comment from page 6 of the article above:

"5. If 6 poles work so well, why not 8 poles?
The most important part of the filter
characteristic is from the pass-band on down
to about –30 dB on either side of center.
Eight poles would provide much better
stop-band isolation, but it’s not required in a
roofing filter and would make no
noticeable improvement in IMD performance."

Bottom line:

1.  Narrower is not always better
2.  8-poles is not always better than 5-poles.
3.  Let IMD and BDR measurements be your guide.

73,  Bill  W4ZV




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[Tom Arntzen]

I'll bet you can order a full sett of K2 toroids that you can wind in 
between assembly of the K3 :-)


73 de Tom LA1PHA

- Original Message - 
From: "W2AGN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

To: "Jeff Stai" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: "Elecraft" 
Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo



Jeff Stai wrote:


Here's a photo I took of the inside of the K3 at Visalia. The tour that 
follows is from memory, sorry if I misremember.





Gee, just look at all those toroids we'll miss the fun of winding
---
  _____
 / \  / \  / \  / \  / \   John L. Sielke
( W )( 2 )( A )( G )( N )  http://w2agn.net
 \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/   http://www.blurty.com/users/w2agn
check out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QRPariahs/
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269.6.2/784 - Release Date: 01.05.2007 14:57






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[Elecraft] Roofing filters

[Doug Person]

Pardon my ignorance...  I'm not completely clear on what a roofing 
filter is.  I understand traditional filters that control the passband 
and DSP that also controls the passband through software means.  But 
what exactly is meant by a roofing filter?  How is it different then say 
the crystal CW filter I have in my old Yaesu FT-900?


thanks

Doug -- K0DXV
(K2 1920 & 5837)

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[Elecraft] Re: [QRP-L] HomeBREW

[Mark J. Schreiner]

Well spoken John.  I've been meaning to jump in here on this one as 
well.  As a professional and practicing electrical engineer it is 
obvious to me that very few of the products that get assembled have 
something new and unique, something patentable.  Most are similar to 
previous design efforts and are built on building blocks and connected 
together to make an overall functioning widget.  Many of the designs are 
directly from application notes, many of them, all assembled together, 
along with other standard circuit models that have been used as tools by 
engineers from the days of tubes (upgraded along the way to transistors, 
ICs, ASICs, etc).  The ingenuity of the overall design is in putting 
together all of the pieces in a coherent fashion to result in a product 
that does what is desired. 

I don't think that "home" brewing is or should be much different.  I 
agree with the list I saw that delineated several levels or categories 
of homebrewing.  But it all boils down to a couple of things.  If the 
end product is not something that was bought off the shelf and used as 
is there is some level of homebrewing involved.  Not everyone has the 
ability to start from scratch and build from the ground up, but that is 
okay.  There is plenty of homebrewing that can be done at any level or 
category of homebrewing and doing so at any of those provides the 
homebrewer satisfaction.  Of course using the end product provides 
ongoing satisfaction long after the project is completed!


72,

Mark, NK8Q

John wrote:

Gentlemen, the keyword here is "brew".
Just as in the making of homebrewed beer, something that has been put together from a 
collection of parts, following some sort of recipe or own plans, constitutes 
"homebrew".
72 and a half.
John.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo

[RBrigham1]

OTOH,
It would cost more but for the nostalgic (or otherwise twisted) builders out 
there Eric and Wayne could offer a version of the K3 kit where you get to wind 
the toroids yourself...;-) 

Rob
KC6ROC

"Tom Arntzen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>I'll bet you can order a full sett of K2 toroids that you can wind in 
>between assembly of the K3 :-)
>
>73 de Tom LA1PHA
>
>- Original Message - 
>From: "W2AGN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "Jeff Stai" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Cc: "Elecraft" 
>Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 7:35 PM
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 inside photo
>
>
>> Jeff Stai wrote:
>>>
>>> Here's a photo I took of the inside of the K3 at Visalia. The tour that 
>>> follows is from memory, sorry if I misremember.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Gee, just look at all those toroids we'll miss the fun of winding
>> ---
>>   _    _    _    _    _
>>  / \  / \  / \  / \  / \   John L. Sielke
>> ( W )( 2 )( A )( G )( N )  http://w2agn.net
>>  \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/  \_/   http://www.blurty.com/users/w2agn
>> check out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QRPariahs/
>> ___
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
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>> Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 
>> 269.6.2/784 - Release Date: 01.05.2007 14:57
>>
>> 
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] CW/DATA modes: Why you'll want a narrow roofing filter

[Don Wilhelm]

AGC pumping is the problem I notice most with data modes - the roofing 
filter must keep out of passband signals at a sufficiently low level to 
allow copy of a weak desired signal.


Also my opinion on filters used for data modes is that they would 
ideally have good group delay characteristics, and to me that is more 
important than steep skirts or a flat passband. (steep skirted filters 
with very flat passbands usually exhibit poor group delay 
characteristics).  Low group delay also means more pleasant sounding CW.


Steep skirts are not really needed with a roofing filter because the DSP 
can create the desired skirt selectivity.  Again the roofing filter must 
only be narrow enough to keep strong offending signals out of the 1st IF 
passband (or sufficiently reduced to keep the AGC pumping problem at 
bay).  Perhaps a Gaussian to 6dB filter would act as a better roofing 
filter than a steep skirted filter - but I have not done any 
measurements - just thinking out loud.


73,
Don W3FPR

wayne burdick wrote:
Let's suppose the only crystal roofing filter you have installed is 2.8 
kHz wide. You put the rig into CW (or data) mode, then dial the DSP 
bandwidth down to 400 Hz. Everything will be fine -- unless an extremely 
strong signal appears that's *outside* the DSP's passband but still 
*inside* the crystal filter passband.


This can cause what's called "pumping," meaning activation of the AGC or 
desensing. Many transceivers with I.F. DSP don't have the ability to do 
anything about this, so they get "trashed" on receive. Such transceivers 
typically have only a 3 kHz (or wider) roofing filter, allowing strong 
signals to cause trouble.


The K3 has roofing filter bandwidths as low as 200 Hz, giving you a 
means to completely eliminating problems with nearby signals. If 
installed, these will be automatically selected as you narrow the DSP's 
bandwidth using the shift/width/hicut/locut controls. Or you can select 
them manually.


We'll add this to the FAQ.

73,
Wayne
N6KR



---

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[Elecraft] The XYL/OM Issue

[Cathy James]

I was enthusiastically poring through the K3 information last night when 
my husband came into the room.  I showed him the rig and was clearly 
looking a little starry-eyed.  He looked at me and said, "What do you 
need another radio for?  Your current ones work fine!"


Just thought I'd share -- it's not only XYL's who don't understand. :-)  
It's not a gender thing, really!


Cathy
N5WVR
K2 #5191
K1 #2280
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[Elecraft] Wish List - K3 with TIVO

[KJ3D]

I know we are supossed to be sending these to Wayne, but I may need a grass
roots movement on this suggestion.

I got back to CW this year, and am pretty rusty.  I also started watching
Jerico on TV.  Every episode starts with a burst of CW - a little message
pertinent to that episode.  The code is 20 - 25 wpm, about half in the noise
and not well sent.

But, with my TIVO, I can back up 8 seconds and play it again until I get it.

Ya think we could get a TIVO backup in the K3?

72/73,

Tom - KJ3D

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Re: [Elecraft] Wish List - K3 with TIVO

[Tom Hammond]

Tom:


Ya think we could get a TIVO backup in the K3?


It's there... if I recall, I think the K3 offers 30-seconds of RX 
audio playback... maybe longer.


73,

Tom Hammond   N0SS

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Re: [Elecraft] Roofing Filters - Plots

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Here is a link to our 8-pole, 8.215 MHz, crystal filter plots. It has 
now been added to the K3 page.


http://www.elecraft.com/K3/K3_8_pole_plots.htm
http://www.elecraft.com/news.htm

Also note that we follow these filters with the DSP for even more out of 
band rejection and skirt steepness.


73, Eric  WA6HHQ
-

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[Elecraft] K3 questions: Please send them to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

[wayne burdick]

This will keep the list traffic manageable.

Thanks,
Wayne
N6KR


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