[Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Ron W3ZV]

Setting up my K3 for PSK31. Using PC with on board sound. (Intel 
Integrated Audio). Stereo cable from K3 to sound card.  I am looking to 
adjust  ALC for 4 bars using the line in adjustment. I find that a level 
change of one unit on K3 (i.e. 5 to 6) changes ALC from zero bars 
showing to 5 bars showing. Adjusting sound card levels move the onset 
point but doesn't change the behavior. Am I missing something or do I 
have something wrong with my setup?

Ron W3ZV


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[Elecraft] K3, and PSK

[AD9P]

Is there a way to mute the speaker while operating PSK ?
So far I have not been able to get PSK figured out just yet on the K3.
Serial number 400 went together great, and operates very well on CW, es SSB. 
But the Digital Modes (PSK) is still cloudy .
Thanks
Al
AD9P
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[Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Mike Short]

I am trying to set up my computer, etc to use HRD, DM780, and my K3.

I can tune around and receive and decode psk and rtty just fine with DM780,
but when I go to send, it goes in to transmit but has no power out.

My first guess is there is no modulation, but how can I verify?

 

Mike

AI4NS

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Lyle Johnson]

> Setting up my K3 for PSK31. Using PC with on board sound. (Intel 
> Integrated Audio). Stereo cable from K3 to sound card.  I am looking to 
> adjust  ALC for 4 bars using the line in adjustment. I find that a level 
> change of one unit on K3 (i.e. 5 to 6) changes ALC from zero bars 
> showing to 5 bars showing. Adjusting sound card levels move the onset 
> point but doesn't change the behavior. Am I missing something or do I 
> have something wrong with my setup?

5 bars is OK.  The adjustment is a bit coarse - and the display a bit 
tight! - for some combinations of sound card levels.

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Don Wilhelm]

Ron,

I would suggest that you reduce the soundcard output level and increase 
the K3 line in setting for smoother control of the audio level.  I run 
my K3 line in at 12 to 13 and adjust the soundcard level to achieve the 
proper number of ALC bars (4) - my soundcard controls are at the 
mid-point when it is adjusted correctly.
I am using an internal SoundBlaster Live 24 soundcard. Your results may 
depend on your particular soundcard as well as the K3 settings.

73,
Don W3FPR

Ron W3ZV wrote:
> Setting up my K3 for PSK31. Using PC with on board sound. (Intel 
> Integrated Audio). Stereo cable from K3 to sound card.  I am looking to 
> adjust  ALC for 4 bars using the line in adjustment. I find that a level 
> change of one unit on K3 (i.e. 5 to 6) changes ALC from zero bars 
> showing to 5 bars showing. Adjusting sound card levels move the onset 
> point but doesn't change the behavior. Am I missing something or do I 
> have something wrong with my setup?
>
> Ron W3ZV
>   
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Robert Hall]

Is there somewhere where I might find a more exhaustive step by step
discussion of seting up sound levels on the pc while connected to the K3. I
may be a little dense and have not felt entirely comfortable with what I
have read in the manual. Maybe this discussion might include config menu
items and what the different settings would do to effect the way the K3
behaves with different modes?

A good example of this is the idea of setting the number of bars for pc
output, correct? Would this be done for actual rf output or would this be
done via setting tx to test?

thank you,

Rob KE7VHF

Robert Hall
www.RobertHall.com


On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 8:20 PM, Don Wilhelm  wrote:

> Ron,
>
> I would suggest that you reduce the soundcard output level and increase
> the K3 line in setting for smoother control of the audio level.  I run
> my K3 line in at 12 to 13 and adjust the soundcard level to achieve the
> proper number of ALC bars (4) - my soundcard controls are at the
> mid-point when it is adjusted correctly.
> I am using an internal SoundBlaster Live 24 soundcard. Your results may
> depend on your particular soundcard as well as the K3 settings.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> Ron W3ZV wrote:
> > Setting up my K3 for PSK31. Using PC with on board sound. (Intel
> > Integrated Audio). Stereo cable from K3 to sound card.  I am looking to
> > adjust  ALC for 4 bars using the line in adjustment. I find that a level
> > change of one unit on K3 (i.e. 5 to 6) changes ALC from zero bars
> > showing to 5 bars showing. Adjusting sound card levels move the onset
> > point but doesn't change the behavior. Am I missing something or do I
> > have something wrong with my setup?
> >
> > Ron W3ZV
> >
> >
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Lyle Johnson]

> Is there somewhere where I might find a more exhaustive step by step 
> discussion of seting up sound levels on the pc while connected to the 
> K3...

Not that I am aware of.

Best to learn by doing.  Put the radio in TX TEST mode and play with the 
LINE IN GAIN and the PC soundcard program.  Don't get too worried about 
the ALC bars.  4 or 5 bars is fine. In some cases the bars fluctuate a bit.

When things look good, get out of test mode and goon the air :-)

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Don Wilhelm]

Robert,

I don't know of any step-by-step instructions, the whole picture is 
complicated because of the variety of computer soundcards that could be 
used.  As far as the K3 is concerned, the procedure is simple - adjust 
the line-in gain setting, much as you would with the mic gain.

Yes, the level can be set using TX TEST - and it is best if you do it 
that way because you don't both other hams with on-the-air signals.

Normally there are two controls to work with - the "LINE" gain setting 
in the K3 and the Line-out soundcard controls on your PC.  The output 
from soundcards vary, so you will just have to manipulate them and see 
what happens.  For starters, I would suggest setting the soundcard 
line-out level at the slider midpoint, then adjust the LINE gain setting 
on the K3.  You should strive for settings that will allow you some 
later adjustment room if possible, but if your soundcard output level is 
very low or very high, that may not be possible.

You want to have a maximum of 4 bars of the ALC meter illuminated.  5 
bars is where the 'real' ALC comes into operation, and the bars below 
the 5th act more like as a 'VU meter'.  You want the level as high as 
possible without actually driving it into the ALC region (5th bar).

Robert Hall wrote:
> Is there somewhere where I might find a more exhaustive step by step 
> discussion of seting up sound levels on the pc while connected to the 
> K3. I may be a little dense and have not felt entirely comfortable 
> with what I have read in the manual. Maybe this discussion might 
> include config menu items and what the different settings would do to 
> effect the way the K3 behaves with different modes?
>  
> A good example of this is the idea of setting the number of bars for 
> pc output, correct? Would this be done for actual rf output or would 
> this be done via setting tx to test?
>  
> thank you,
>  
> Rob KE7VHF
>  
> Robert Hall
> www.RobertHall.com 
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Julian, G4ILO]

Robert Hall - KE7VHF wrote:
> 
> Is there somewhere where I might find a more exhaustive step by step
> discussion of seting up sound levels on the pc while connected to the K3.
> I
> may be a little dense and have not felt entirely comfortable with what I
> have read in the manual. Maybe this discussion might include config menu
> items and what the different settings would do to effect the way the K3
> behaves with different modes?
> 
> A good example of this is the idea of setting the number of bars for pc
> output, correct? Would this be done for actual rf output or would this be
> done via setting tx to test?
> 
> 

It really would be impossible to do this because the output level and input
sensitivity of different sound cards will vary. The output even varies from
one program to another.

The receive side is easy enough, and can be adjusted until you see a faint
moving background on the waterfall with a quiet band, and the signals stand
out clear.

On transmit I would suggest that you just increase the audio going in to the
radio using a combination of the slider on the PC mixer and the MIC control,
until the output on the power meter reads the power you want. Ideally you
should do this while getting the software to send a Tune signal - a pure
tone, and aim for 50W or less. A modulated PSK signal should give a reading
of less than half the peak power, so no more than three bars on the power
scale.

I'm unhappy with the advice to set the level to 4 or 5 bars on the ALC scale
because when I do this my K3 puts out twice the power set on the POWER
control making it far too easy to overdrive the PA. I prefer to adjust the
input level until the output power matches what it says on the power
control. Then I can use the power control intuitively to set the power the
same way it works in CW and SSB modes. For me, the amount of input needed to
do this is some way below the point at which ANY ALC blobs appear.

-
Julian, G4ILO. K2 #392  K3 #222.
http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack   http://www.ham-directory.com/ Ham
Directoryhttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Robert Hall]

Don, Lyle, Greg,

You guys are fabulous!

Thank you. I would really like to make sure I have things tied down for Feb.

73's

Rob

KE7VHF


Robert Hall
www.RobertHall.com


On Thu, Jan 29, 2009 at 10:42 AM, Don Wilhelm  wrote:

> Robert,
>
> I don't know of any step-by-step instructions, the whole picture is
> complicated because of the variety of computer soundcards that could be
> used.  As far as the K3 is concerned, the procedure is simple - adjust the
> line-in gain setting, much as you would with the mic gain.
>
> Yes, the level can be set using TX TEST - and it is best if you do it that
> way because you don't both other hams with on-the-air signals.
>
> Normally there are two controls to work with - the "LINE" gain setting in
> the K3 and the Line-out soundcard controls on your PC.  The output from
> soundcards vary, so you will just have to manipulate them and see what
> happens.  For starters, I would suggest setting the soundcard line-out level
> at the slider midpoint, then adjust the LINE gain setting on the K3.  You
> should strive for settings that will allow you some later adjustment room if
> possible, but if your soundcard output level is very low or very high, that
> may not be possible.
>
> You want to have a maximum of 4 bars of the ALC meter illuminated.  5 bars
> is where the 'real' ALC comes into operation, and the bars below the 5th act
> more like as a 'VU meter'.  You want the level as high as possible without
> actually driving it into the ALC region (5th bar).
>
> Robert Hall wrote:
>
>> Is there somewhere where I might find a more exhaustive step by step
>> discussion of seting up sound levels on the pc while connected to the K3. I
>> may be a little dense and have not felt entirely comfortable with what I
>> have read in the manual. Maybe this discussion might include config menu
>> items and what the different settings would do to effect the way the K3
>> behaves with different modes?
>>  A good example of this is the idea of setting the number of bars for pc
>> output, correct? Would this be done for actual rf output or would this be
>> done via setting tx to test?
>>  thank you,
>>  Rob KE7VHF
>>  Robert Hall
>> www.RobertHall.com  <
>> http://www.RobertHall.com >
>>
>>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Lyle Johnson]

> I'm unhappy with the advice to set the level to 4 or 5 bars on the ALC scale
> because when I do this my K3 puts out twice the power set on the POWER
> control making it far too easy to overdrive the PA. I prefer to adjust the
> input level until the output power matches what it says on the power
> control. Then I can use the power control intuitively to set the power the
> same way it works in CW and SSB modes. For me, the amount of input needed to
> do this is some way below the point at which ANY ALC blobs appear.

If you really must do this, you should probably set CONFIG:TX ALC OFF 
once you've adjusted your power level using the PWR control. Otherwise 
the ALC system will see the Tx output not being what was requested and 
will increase the gain, leading to power creep and all sorts of other 
problems.  And a side effect is that when you next request power, you'll 
get alot more than you asked for because the ALC loop now believes the 
Tx chain gain is far less than it actually is.  The ALC 5 bar level is 
the level to which all transmit system gains are balanced -- at least 
those that use any sort of audio as the ultimate source.

In the latest Beta code I tried very hard to balance levels so that 
CONFIG:TXG VCE can be set to 0.0dB.  This might have been affecting your 
power control issues.

I did extensive testing with Olivia (125/8 through 2000/64) and WSPR to 
be sure the power levels are as requested and stable.  At least on my 
K3, they seem to be.

73,

Lyle KK7P
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Julian, G4ILO]

Lyle Johnson wrote:
> 
> If you really must do this, you should probably set CONFIG:TX ALC OFF 
> once you've adjusted your power level using the PWR control. Otherwise 
> the ALC system will see the Tx output not being what was requested and 
> will increase the gain, leading to power creep and all sorts of other 
> problems.  And a side effect is that when you next request power, you'll 
> get alot more than you asked for because the ALC loop now believes the 
> Tx chain gain is far less than it actually is.  The ALC 5 bar level is 
> the level to which all transmit system gains are balanced -- at least 
> those that use any sort of audio as the ultimate source.
> 
If that's how it is supposed to work, why doesn't it REDUCE the gain when it
sees the Tx output being MORE than what is requested? Because it doesn't.
That's the point.



> In the latest Beta code I tried very hard to balance levels so that 
> CONFIG:TXG VCE can be set to 0.0dB.  This might have been affecting your 
> power control issues.
> 

The trouble with this is that TXG VCE is an SSB mode adjustment. I don't
have excessive power in SSB mode therefore I don't wish to reduce the TXG
VCE. If there was a separate TXG setting for DATA as others have suggested
on previous occasions, this might be the solution. Although at present, the
minimum -3.0dB setting is not quite sufficient to get the output down to the
correct level.

http://www.g4ilo.com/ G4ILO's Shack   http://www.ham-directory.com/ Ham
Directoryhttp://www.g4ilo.com/kcomm.html KComm for Elecraft K2 and K3 
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/K3-and-PSK-tp2236491p2244011.html
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Re: [Elecraft] K3, and PSK

[David Ferrington, M0XDF]

Turn the AF or Monitor down?


On 16/2/08 00:13, "AD9P" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> sent:

> 
> Is there a way to mute the speaker while operating PSK ?
> So far I have not been able to get PSK figured out just yet on the K3.
> Serial number 400 went together great, and operates very well on CW, es SSB.
> But the Digital Modes (PSK) is still cloudy .
> Thanks
> Al
> AD9P

-- 
Unix is basically a simple operating system, but you have to be a genius to
understand the simplicity. -- Dennis Ritchie



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RE: [Elecraft] K3, and PSK

[Greg]

Actually if its during TX, he should turn down MON.

Greg


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of David Ferrington,
M0XDF
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2008 5:06 PM
To: AD9P; Crafters
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3, and PSK


Turn the AF or Monitor down?


On 16/2/08 00:13, "AD9P" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> sent:

>
> Is there a way to mute the speaker while operating PSK ?
> So far I have not been able to get PSK figured out just yet on the K3.
> Serial number 400 went together great, and operates very well on CW, es
SSB.
> But the Digital Modes (PSK) is still cloudy .
> Thanks
> Al
> AD9P

--
Unix is basically a simple operating system, but you have to be a genius to
understand the simplicity. -- Dennis Ritchie



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Re: [Elecraft] K3, and PSK

[Alan D. Wilcox]

Al,
I just posted "K3 configuration for PSK31 - How To" a moment ago. 
Perhaps it'll help you out.

Alan

Alan D. Wilcox, W3DVX
570-321-1516
http://WilcoxEngineering.com
Williamsport, PA 17701 



AD9P wrote:

Is there a way to mute the speaker while operating PSK ?
So far I have not been able to get PSK figured out just yet on the K3.
Serial number 400 went together great, and operates very well on CW, es SSB. 
But the Digital Modes (PSK) is still cloudy .

Thanks
Al
AD9P
  


--
Alan D. Wilcox, W3DVX
570-321-1516
http://WilcoxEngineering.com
Williamsport, PA 17701 


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Re: [Elecraft] K3, and PSK

[Alan D. Wilcox]

Al,
Glad I could help. Enjoy!
Alan

Alan D. Wilcox, W3DVX
570-321-1516
http://WilcoxEngineering.com
http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/6768 ... for Client Comments
Williamsport, PA 17701 


Al wrote:

Hi Alan,
I finally got everything working.  Vista does not make setting the 
audio up easy. 
Thanks

Al
AD9P 
 
/---Original Message---/
 
/*From:*/ Alan D. Wilcox <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

/*Date:*/ 2/16/2008 4:19:46 PM
/*To:*/ elecraft <mailto:elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
/*Subject:*/ Re: [Elecraft] K3, and PSK
 
Al,

I just posted "K3 configuration for PSK31 - How To" a moment ago.
Perhaps it'll help you out.
Alan
 
Alan D. Wilcox, W3DVX

570-321-1516
http://WilcoxEngineering.com
Williamsport, PA 17701
 
 
AD9P wrote:

> Is there a way to mute the speaker while operating PSK ?
> So far I have not been able to get PSK figured out just yet on the K3.
> Serial number 400 went together great, and operates very well on CW, 
es SSB.

> But the Digital Modes (PSK) is still cloudy .
> Thanks
> Al
> AD9P
>
 
--

Alan D. Wilcox, W3DVX
570-321-1516
http://WilcoxEngineering.com
Williamsport, PA 17701
 






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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Richard Ferch]

Mike,

In answer to your question, you can tell whether there is modulation or
not by using the K3's Monitor function (the MON level must of course be
above zero for this to work).

As for the answer to the question you didn't ask, one possible explanation
for the lack of modulation is that your input level is set to zero. If you
are using DATA A mode and your sound card's output is connected to the
LINE IN jack, you can adjust the LINE level using the MIC gain control.
(If rotating this control adjusts the MIC level in DATA A mode, you can
correct this by setting MAIN:MIC SEL = LINE while the radio is in DATA A
mode. This will not affect the MIC SEL setting in voice modes.) A level
setting somewhere around LINE 10 should get some modulation into the
radio.

The way to set the correct levels for this control, together with the
sound card output level controls, is to set the K3's meter to read ALC and
adjust the levels until you get 4-5 bars of ALC reading while
transmitting. In PSK31, for the cleanest signal you should set the PWR
control to 50 watts or less (5 watts or less on a K3/10).

73,
Rich VE3KI


AI4NS wrote:

> I am trying to set up my computer, etc to use HRD, DM780, and my K3.
>
> I can tune around and receive and decode psk and rtty just fine with
> DM780, but when I go to send, it goes in to transmit but has no power
> out.
>
> My first guess is there is no modulation, but how can I verify?



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK

[Mike Short]

Thanks for everyone's assistance. I had a multiple of issues, all due to
adjustments, etc. 

Mike
AI4NS

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[Elecraft] K3 and PSK mode

[F8EZE]

Is there a French station using K3 in PSK mode please.

Thanks.

F8EZE Jean

 

Greetings de F8EZE Jean

CDXC 1307

 

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[Elecraft] K3 and PSK 31

[abullington]

I've really been enjoying my new used K3. I installed the KPA3A in it and have 
been very active on the CW bands. 
My question is this. I can't get psk 31 to work in my HRD...either in 
conjunction with Win4k3 or by itself. It works fine with Win4K3 by itself but I 
want the nice HRD waterfall display. I don't use the sound card, right? Just 
the port connection from the rig to the computer. I've followed..carefully..the 
directions in the Win4k3 help for connecting to HRD but I can't even get HRD 
standalone to give me any out put. There has to be some box I'm not checking or 
shouldn't be checking or just something I'm not understanding. Remember...the 
keyboard works perfectly in Win4k3 terminal in either cw mode or psk. Any help 
is much appreciated.
Andy W1AWB

Sent from my iPad
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and PSK 31

[Don Wilhelm]

Andy,

I did not see any response on the reflector, so I will try.

First of all, you need a soundcard.  If you have installed the KIO3B in 
that K3, there is an internal soundcard in the K3 that can e used.
If the KIO3 has not been upgraded, you will need a soundcard external to 
the K3.  Either an internal computer soundcard or an external one.
The computer must send audio to the K3 Line input and receive audio from 
the Line Out of the K3.


HRD (or Win4K3 or other applications) will provide rig control functions 
without the audio paths.


For instance, PSK31 (and other data modes) sends audio tones to the K3 
via the computer soundcard, and receives audio tones from the K3 for 
decoding.


Set the K3 to DATA A submode (AFSK A for RTTY), and during receive, 
adjust the computer Line In (or Mic) level to give you a good waterfall 
display.  You can also adjust the LINE OUT level in the K3 menu.
For transmit, adjust the soundcard Line Out (or Speaker) slider to about 
75% of full and then in the K3, set the MIC SEL menu to LINE and adjust 
the "MIC GAIN" (actually LINE IN gain) so you have 4 bars illuminated 
solid on the K3 ALC display with the 5th bar flashing.

Adjust the desired power level with the K3 power knob.

Ignore the internet advice (and some software applications) to set the 
power to max and adjust the power output with the audio level - that 
does not work well with Elecraft gear.  That advice is for other 
transceivers which do not control the power output by actually measuring 
the power level and making adjustments to make the power equal to the 
requested power level.  Use the instructions in the K3 manual - 
paraphrased above.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 3/12/2017 11:19 PM, abulling...@comcast.net wrote:

I've really been enjoying my new used K3. I installed the KPA3A in it and have 
been very active on the CW bands.
My question is this. I can't get psk 31 to work in my HRD...either in 
conjunction with Win4k3 or by itself. It works fine with Win4K3 by itself but I 
want the nice HRD waterfall display. I don't use the sound card, right? Just 
the port connection from the rig to the computer. I've followed..carefully..the 
directions in the Win4k3 help for connecting to HRD but I can't even get HRD 
standalone to give me any out put. There has to be some box I'm not checking or 
shouldn't be checking or just something I'm not understanding. Remember...the 
keyboard works perfectly in Win4k3 terminal in either cw mode or psk. Any help 
is much appreciated.
Andy W1AWB


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