[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Yabut, what the hell is wrong with you that decades later, you're not still fixated on the cult and endlessly lashing out at it? You're right and I'm workin' on it. I just can't seem to live in the past when there's so much happening in the present - often more than I can handle! ;-) ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. No one can blame anyone for wanting these things. But they certainly are promises made by so many cults and even those selling self help books (and, of course, TM). They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed... Fascinating account! Scientology was never tempting to me as was the same situation for any of the bigger, well known systems
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
That's ok. I am enjoying the seeming chaos (-:
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 7:23 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote :
salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites
talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made
a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not
posting on
FFL2?
I shall try and post across the ever growing diaspora of FFL, might be tricky
keeping track of it all though!
I shall sort out a Salyavin email address so I don't get confused...
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote :
Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears
that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL.
Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a
new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking
about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the
wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :
insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others?
MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You
perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by
MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see.
Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily
justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the
right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to
exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now?
Happy to help.
Your friends are waiting in the sandbox.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :
Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a
misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech.
IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing
and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be
fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so.
It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which
you would be well advised to amend.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote :
As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning
aboutthe creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun
forlong by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Makingstraw-men may
suffice for some while and keep them from tearing ateach other for some time.
The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventuallywill find and rule them where ever they
may go as they meet up withkind people in civil society. A character of
violence in civilsociety often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the
asocialtend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that,
Alex.-JaiGuruYou
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote :
On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter
to me. Just letting you know it's there.
Yahoo! Groups
| |
| | | | Yahoo! Groups Sorry, an error occurred while loading the
content. | |
| View on groups.yahoo.com| Preview by Yahoo |
| |
Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I
think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zones
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. Me: If I didn't know who wrote it, I would have to assume this was a parody. You are taking the approach that is appropriate for the pre-schools I teach in or an exclusive POV group like TM. Two things stick out for me: One is the assumption that the unenforced Yahoo guidelines are some kind of Vedic scripture and were not banged out by 20 something's from the corporate lawyer's guidelines. You are taking them as some kind of profound message for how to both condescendingly coddle and at the same time control other adults engaged in free conversations. Two is that you are following a long historical line of people who value form over content and seem incapable of tolerating the way people who care about content engage in the process. When I am in a heated debate and someone calls me a name, it is very easy to label it for what it is, a sophistic tactic to distract from the weakness of the argument or their lack of ability to mount one. Often the back and forth of diverse opinions can inspire someone to mouth off a little. But that is because they are engaged, they care, they give a s-- oh wait, I just got a memo from the inhibitory part of my brain that alerts me that in your mind, you might bounce me if I use bad language You don't want passionate people who are emotionally behind their ideas and willing to hash it out in discussion. If I put some new age music behind what you wrote I could use it to go to sleep. You are taking the Kim Kardashian approach to the exchange of ideas. All Spanx and nothing behind the eyes. Buck:The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. The process comes to these same themes of facilitating and moving civil discourse. Me: A lot of chilling PC euphemisms here. It reminds me of why Jerry Seinfeld (see meditator reference so it must be good kids) said he doesn't perform on college campuses anymore. This line made my veins run with ice water: Buck: looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. Me: This is on the campus with a committee discussing actionable remedy for free speech if they detect micro-inequalities in what you have said. Am I really the lone voice in the wilderness who believes that this is the language of oppression? Is this what we lived through the 60's for? I am fundamentally opposed to every idea that is expressed by this POV. Buck: Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. This is not just about a hurtful violence endemically perpetrated like exampled here Me: Again with the conflation of violence and speech. This is critical to the sophistic goal of combining our natural civilized aversion to violence and pair it with someone calling another adult a name in a heated discussion. It is like an advertiser putting up a picture of their product next to a woman who looks as if she might be able to effectively nurse her child using a lady part that cannot be referenced directly because it might reveal the micro-inequality of sexism and might draw down the fire of an actionable remedy. (such creepy lawyer speech to hide creepy intentions.) Buck: by some behavior of some individuals in character as was on FFL but finding actionable cultural movement in progressive civil discourse that seems more broadly afoot otherwise. Me: You know what I hear in this tortured use of language? Intellectual insecurity. I hear this in education circles a lot. People afraid to state something simply and directly because they don't want you to really be able to evaluate the flimsy idea embellished by sophistic lawyer talk BSery. I can clear up the ideas easily: Buck is saying that he is
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. No one can blame anyone for wanting these things. But they certainly are promises made by so many cults and even those selling self help books (and, of course, TM). They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed... Fascinating account! Scientology was never tempting to me as was the same situation for any of the bigger, well known systems and cults. I seemed to have chosen the very personal and small cult prototype to follow for a few years. LOL But I don't beat myself up about that either. It was fascinating and character building and I met some wonderful people. Plus, it was three and a half years of my life - I just can't regret having lived. I was impressed that my friend got away from
[FairfieldLife] Starry Night..
Here's something to do on a Saturday afternoon in London. Get a boat down the river to Greenwich, have lunch in the park- preferably something purchased in the market - and then stroll up the hill to the Royal Greenwich Observatory and have a look at the history of Mankind's study of the stars. In another building is the only planetarium in London and it's also the site of the Astronomy Photographer of the Year contest always nicely presented with the pictures backlit in a dark room. You'll be surprised that a lot of these images were captured with easily available amateur equipment. Insight Astronomy Photographer of the Year 2015 shortlist - in pictures http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Insight Astronomy Photographer of the Year ... http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Highlights from the competition, which is now in its seventh year, with entries from enthusiastic amateurs and professional photographers View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. No one can blame anyone for wanting these things. But they certainly are promises made by so many cults and even those selling self help books (and, of course, TM). They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed... Fascinating account! Scientology was never tempting to me as was the same situation for any of the bigger, well known systems and cults. I seemed to have chosen the very personal and small cult prototype to follow for a few years. LOL But I don't beat myself up about that either. It was fascinating and character building and I met some wonderful people. Plus, it was three and a half years of my life - I just
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zones
On 07/09/2015 08:33 AM, curtisdeltabl...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. Me: If I didn't know who wrote it, I would have to assume this was a parody. You are taking the approach that is appropriate for the pre-schools I teach in or an exclusive POV group like TM. Two things stick out for me: One is the assumption that the unenforced Yahoo guidelines are some kind of Vedic scripture and were not banged out by 20 something's from the corporate lawyer's guidelines. You are taking them as some kind of profound message for how to both condescendingly coddle and at the same time control other adults engaged in free conversations. /*Heh, that's what I said in a post before I read this one. People sit around in corporate boardrooms and dream this stuff up because the lawyers and marketing demand it. There was probably a tug-a-war between the more rational and idealistic in that meeting and probably a more senior manager reminding them they were to create suggestions not rules. Those here who have sat in corporate boardrooms know what I mean. :)*/ Two is that you are following a long historical line of people who value form over content and seem incapable of tolerating the way people who care about content engage in the process. When I am in a heated debate and someone calls me a name, it is very easy to label it for what it is, a sophistic tactic to distract from the weakness of the argument or their lack of ability to mount one. Often the back and forth of diverse opinions can inspire someone to mouth off a little. But that is because they are engaged, they care, they give a s-- oh wait, I just got a memo from the inhibitory part of my brain that alerts me that in your mind, you might bounce me if I use bad language You don't want passionate people who are emotionally behind their ideas and willing to hash it out in discussion. If I put some new age music behind what you wrote I could use it to go to sleep. You are taking the Kim Kardashian approach to the exchange of ideas. All Spanx and nothing behind the eyes. Buck:The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. The process comes to these same themes of facilitating and moving civil discourse. Me: A lot of chilling PC euphemisms here. It reminds me of why Jerry Seinfeld (see meditator reference so it must be good kids) said he doesn't perform on college campuses anymore. This line made my veins run with ice water: Buck: looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. Me: This is on the campus with a committee discussing actionable remedy for free speech if they detect micro-inequalities in what you have said. Am I really the lone voice in the wilderness who believes that this is the language of oppression? Is this what we lived through the 60's for? I am fundamentally opposed to every idea that is expressed by this POV. Buck: Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. This is not just about a hurtful violence endemically perpetrated like exampled here Me: Again with the conflation of violence and speech. This is critical to the sophistic goal of combining our natural civilized aversion to violence and pair it with someone calling another adult a name in a heated discussion. It is like an advertiser putting up a picture of their product next to a woman who looks as if she might be able to effectively nurse her child using a lady part that cannot be referenced directly because it might reveal the micro-inequality of sexism and might draw down the fire of an actionable remedy. (such creepy lawyer speech to hide creepy intentions.) Buck: by some behavior of some individuals in character as was
[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zones
Curtis, I actually read this message from Doug rather differently. The section below seems to be referring to younger TMers at the university who are pointing out to older TM-movement types that some of the language they use contains these micro-inequities. The young people are not so trained in TM-speak as the older ones, so they are trying to educate them about the limitations or unconscious biases of the TM-speak that has been second nature to TM campus folk for thirty years and more. Here's the passage I am referring to: Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. If I am correct, this actually would be a positive development from the point of view of those who dislike traditional TM-speak. It's not always possible to tell from Doug's posts exactly what he has in mind, so I could be wrong, but that is how I read it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. Me: If I didn't know who wrote it, I would have to assume this was a parody. You are taking the approach that is appropriate for the pre-schools I teach in or an exclusive POV group like TM. Two things stick out for me: One is the assumption that the unenforced Yahoo guidelines are some kind of Vedic scripture and were not banged out by 20 something's from the corporate lawyer's guidelines. You are taking them as some kind of profound message for how to both condescendingly coddle and at the same time control other adults engaged in free conversations. Two is that you are following a long historical line of people who value form over content and seem incapable of tolerating the way people who care about content engage in the process. When I am in a heated debate and someone calls me a name, it is very easy to label it for what it is, a sophistic tactic to distract from the weakness of the argument or their lack of ability to mount one. Often the back and forth of diverse opinions can inspire someone to mouth off a little. But that is because they are engaged, they care, they give a s-- oh wait, I just got a memo from the inhibitory part of my brain that alerts me that in your mind, you might bounce me if I use bad language You don't want passionate people who are emotionally behind their ideas and willing to hash it out in discussion. If I put some new age music behind what you wrote I could use it to go to sleep. You are taking the Kim Kardashian approach to the exchange of ideas. All Spanx and nothing behind the eyes. Buck:The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. The process comes to these same themes of facilitating and moving civil discourse. Me: A lot of chilling PC euphemisms here. It reminds me of why Jerry Seinfeld (see meditator reference so it must be good kids) said he doesn't perform on college campuses anymore. This line made my veins run with ice water: Buck: looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. Me: This is on the campus with a committee discussing actionable remedy for free speech if they detect micro-inequalities in what you have said. Am I really the lone voice in the wilderness who believes that this is the language of oppression? Is this what we lived through the 60's for? I am fundamentally opposed to every idea that is expressed by this POV. Buck: Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. This is not just about a hurtful violence endemically perpetrated like exampled here Me: Again with the conflation of violence and
[FairfieldLife] True Detective spouts pure Advaita
If you want a dark-side presentation of the Advaita POV, listening carefully to statements made by season 1's Matthew McConaughey http://www.imdb.com/name/nm190/?ref_=tt_ov_st's role as Rust Chole would be a very good choice. Rust spouts pure Advaita throughout the first episodes. The only problem is that Rust doesn't not believe in God, and can't turn lemons into aide. That said, I could not find a single misstep in Rust's statements about reality. And then toss it into a gritty detective story, and you got entertainment. I'm posting this at FFL because you guys here need this info more than at FFL2. Because: Doug is preventing real-life-TMO from being discussed here, so a shot of Advaita might help balance things. Yeah, DOUG IS CENSORING FFL IN A WAY THAT HARMS IT. I conclude that Doug's personality has a major disorder. This is my opinion. Does this get me banned? How about David Lynch has a major personality disorder! -- that's my opinion also -- does that get me banned? How about Girish is a sexual pervert -- I was informed about this in a dream message from God -- does this get me banned? We don't know what gets one banned. THIS IS THE SIN OF DOUG. We don't know why Doug was given power. THIS IS THE SIN OF RICK ARCHER -- who now seems to have had a personality disorder all these years without it being revealed. Why else would he have sicced Doug on us unless he has some deep animosity that he's never expressed? So, until I'm given fuller explanations from Rick and until I'm seeing Doug actually step up and defend his positions without being the fucking putz he keeps on being here, then I'm concluding that Rick and Doug are fully in cahoots, and that means Rick and Doug are fuckwads without a hint of clarity who are striking out at the world due to their deep realization that they'll never be enlightened, never be anything but another piece of shit stuck to God's sandal. I'm calling you guys out. Doug -- you are sick minded. You need help. You're legally insane. You are harming everyone around you. Rick, fuck you and the dog you rode in on if you don't straighten this shit out. All the above are opinions. I don't need to say they're true, because everyone already knows they're true.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zones
LOL! Sounds like Yahoo is your new guru and Yahoo Guidelines the New Vedas? Are you going to sell your farm and move to Sunnyvale? Get ready for some real estate sticker shock. Are you doing pujas daily to Marissa? Being in the tech industry and living in the SF Bay Area let me give you a little background on Silicon Valley or what I like to call Silly Conned Valley (yes, it's a very nutty place). The phenomena popped up due to graduates from Stanford setting up businesses in their garages. Hewlett-Packard was one of the early ones. And we all know about the other two guys who started building computers in their garage but neither were graduates. Back in the late 1990s many of us were on an email service call eGroups. There are probably some here who participated in the Jyotish email group set up by a former TM teacher. It's still alive as a Yahoo Group with a lot Indian jyotishees brawling it out. In fact what happened to eGroups was that Yahoo bought them in 2000 and the result is Yahoo Groups. As for guidelines, these are things that folks sitting around in a boardroom dream up. They evolve over time and as product managers for Yahoo Groups bring up problems they are seeing but it's mainly someone saying we need some guidelines, particularly for newbies starting up a group. They are suggestions for decorum and nothing more. They are not rigid rules and they are certainly not the New Vedas. On 07/09/2015 06:47 AM, dhamiltony...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. The process comes to these same themes of facilitating and moving civil discourse. Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. This is not just about a hurtful violence endemically perpetrated like exampled here by some behavior of some individuals in character as was on FFL but finding actionable cultural movement in progressive civil discourse that seems more broadly afoot otherwise. The collaboration in practice seems to require some willing studied [conscious] self-control of self-moderation for participation in the engagement. Also known as, civility and how things are said. -JaiGuruYou! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 image https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Yahoo! Groups
[FairfieldLife] My Grampa wasn't Human!
This is fascinating, for the first time we can actually see the interspecies crossover between Homo Sapiens and the hominids we shared the planet with for millenia, the Neanderthals. They can't have been all that different from us. Personally I don't fancy Orang Utans all that much, and even Chimps lack that certain special something. I see no close connection like people claim there is between us and the rest of the apes. But we got it on with other distinct genetic groups of humans. It must have been a strange world where there were other groups of humans we could communicate with and more different than the current racial mix but close enough to actually breed and produce viable offspring. What a world and what a lineage, makes me wonder if Tony Nader ever pondered evolution at all, did the veda exist in the physiology of other extinct human species? No, how could it. This is a perfect example of the failure of ancient knowledge to explain new discoveries. Anyway, movement link aside this is a great glimpse into where we all came from: Ancient Man Had Neanderthal Great-Great Grandfather http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/06/150622-neanderthal-dna-jawbone-ancestor-anthropology/ http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/06/150622-neanderthal-dna-jawbone-ancestor-anthropology/ Ancient Man Had Neanderthal Great-Great Grandfather http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/06/150622-neanderthal-dna-jawbone-ancestor-anthropology/ Analysis of the jawbone of a man who lived about 40,000 years ago reveals the closest direct descendant of a Neanderthal who mated with a modern... View on news.nationalgeograph... http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/06/150622-neanderthal-dna-jawbone-ancestor-anthropology/ Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Collective Consciousness?
The pace of growth in knowledge of brain systems seems to be accelerating: Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brain-to-brain connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brai... http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection In two separate experiments, scientists have formed a network from the brains of monkeys and rats, allowing them to co-operate and learn as a “superbrain” View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Pandits of Iowa
Oprah Winfrey visited Vedic City to see the meditations and chants performed by the pandits. Based on this video, it appeared that the pandits were isolated from the rest of the town residents. Does anyone know if the pandits can go to downtown Fairfield to watch a movie and have dinner on weekends? Can they associate with MUM students?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zones
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Curtis, I actually read this message from Doug rather differently. The section below seems to be referring to younger TMers at the university who are pointing out to older TM-movement types that some of the language they use contains these micro-inequities. The young people are not so trained in TM-speak as the older ones, so they are trying to educate them about the limitations or unconscious biases of the TM-speak that has been second nature to TM campus folk for thirty years and more. Here's the passage I am referring to: Me: Yes I agree with you. Sometimes the push to limit free speech comes from the students as in this case which is why Jerry wont play gigs on campuses. But the details are not the problem that I am seeing. Whatever the vague standard they are proposing it is the same routine the establishment runs. Make a statement like only positivity will be tolerated and then you can go after anyone you want. But you are bringing up a cool point about the oppressors being called on language by the students. It is hilarious. They are going to make the PC people more PC in a different PC way! I did a Ventriloquist magic show at South Fallsberg a million years ago for a bunch of Mother Divine types. My contact was an old MIU friend and former World Government Lady. She went over my routine over the show and was very concerned that the dynamic between me and my vent figure partner was not satvic enough because he was making fun of me. Gutting comedic drama of anything that anyone could view as possibly negitive was what she was requesting. Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. If I am correct, this actually would be a positive development from the point of view of those who dislike traditional TM-speak. It's not always possible to tell from Doug's posts exactly what he has in mind, so I could be wrong, but that is how I read it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. Me: If I didn't know who wrote it, I would have to assume this was a parody. You are taking the approach that is appropriate for the pre-schools I teach in or an exclusive POV group like TM. Two things stick out for me: One is the assumption that the unenforced Yahoo guidelines are some kind of Vedic scripture and were not banged out by 20 something's from the corporate lawyer's guidelines. You are taking them as some kind of profound message for how to both condescendingly coddle and at the same time control other adults engaged in free conversations. Two is that you are following a long historical line of people who value form over content and seem incapable of tolerating the way people who care about content engage in the process. When I am in a heated debate and someone calls me a name, it is very easy to label it for what it is, a sophistic tactic to distract from the weakness of the argument or their lack of ability to mount one. Often the back and forth of diverse opinions can inspire someone to mouth off a little. But that is because they are engaged, they care, they give a s-- oh wait, I just got a memo from the inhibitory part of my brain that alerts me that in your mind, you might bounce me if I use bad language You don't want passionate people who are emotionally behind their ideas and willing to hash it out in discussion. If I put some new age music behind what you wrote I could use it to go to sleep. You are taking the Kim Kardashian approach to the exchange of ideas. All Spanx and nothing behind the eyes. Buck:The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. The process comes to these same themes of facilitating and moving civil discourse. Me: A lot of chilling PC euphemisms here. It reminds me of why
[FairfieldLife] Trump Speaks his Mind
It appears he's really serious about building a wall in the southern border of the US. But how much is that going to cost? If elected president, he would bomb the oil fields in Iraq to defeat ISIS. He thinks Iraq does not exist as a nation. But surprisingly he is supposedly leading all of the Republican candidates for president. As such, how do you think Trump will do if the Republicans chose him as their presidential nominee for the next election? 5 Biggest Whoppers From Donald Trumps Anderson Cooper Interview https://www.yahoo.com/tv/s/5-biggest-whoppers-donald-trump-anderson-cooper-interview-142526119.html https://www.yahoo.com/tv/s/5-biggest-whoppers-donald-trump-anderson-cooper-interview-142526119.html 5 Biggest Whoppers From Donald Trumps Anderson ... https://www.yahoo.com/tv/s/5-biggest-whoppers-donald-trump-anderson-cooper-interview-142526119.html Donald Trumps media triathalon raced on Wednesday in a sitdown with CNNs Anderson Cooper. In classic Trump fashion, he attacked everyone from C... View on www.yahoo.com https://www.yahoo.com/tv/s/5-biggest-whoppers-donald-trump-anderson-cooper-interview-142526119.html Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Lord Jesus' commentary on the importance of the 3rd eye....
“The eye is the Lamp of the body. So, if your eye is healthy, your whole body will be full of Light.” ~Matthew 6:22
[FairfieldLife] Re: Pandits of Iowa
..but we simply have not been able to replace the unprecedented generosity of the Settle Foundation. Our only option at this point is to change our strategy for creating an Invincible America. ..we will be able to keep the Vedic qualities alive in our community with a smaller, more permanent group of Vedic Pandits who consider Maharishi Vedic City their home. The Pandit numbers will continue to decrease over the next year until we reach a size that we are able to practically sustain. We are so grateful to all our cherished donors, who have been supporting the Vedic Pandits these past nine years. We could not have achieved any of this without you. -email ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_...@yahoo.com wrote : Oprah Winfrey visited Vedic City to see the meditations and chants performed by the pandits. Based on this video, it appeared that the pandits were isolated from the rest of the town residents. Does anyone know if the pandits can go to downtown Fairfield to watch a movie and have dinner on weekends? Can they associate with MUM students? srijau: they can audit courses at MUM now, but nothing that would qualify them to do anything other than their traditional occupation. Otherwise, the answers would be no and no. Thats not what they signed up for. same deal as TTC or even a residence course.
[FairfieldLife] Re: George Kelly needs your help
Not absolutely certain but I think you may be thinking of another George Kelley. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Click here to support Help George Kelley Fight Cancer by Kacie Meek http://www.gofundme.com/yw2z34 Never met George. Two decades in FF, and nope. But I heard his name every single week there...the guy was a true community gluer. Had to be that he was a solid Joe.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The FF Meditating Community
Yes, good analysis. I remember those days of the daily trudge or car ride to the dome, seeing people I didn't actually know but whose faces became very familiar. It was indeed the daily communal ritual; it was the glue that held us together. Now it has largely fallen away, although of course many people do still go. But in some ways we are almost in a post-TM era here now. I know so many people who no longer practice TM or care about anything the TMO does. It is just no longer a part of their lives. Instead of having one communal meeting ground every day, twice a day, people have developed a network of smaller groups, from the Sufis to Waking Down (just to give two examples) to cater to their particular post-TM interests. And yet is it wonderful that almost all of us have that common background. We understand each other in ways that would not be possible without it. I spent over 30 years doing TM and do not regret a single moment spent with eyes closed in the dome or elsewhere. But I have no desire to practice any form of meditation now. I have moved on, and others have too. I also find there is tremendous respect among the post-TMers for all the different paths or no paths that people have chosen to best satisfy their spiritual needs as they understand them now, 40-50 years (in many cases) since we first began this long journey, in a puja room somewhere with incense burning, a picture of the guru—and the imminence of transcendence, that sudden strange fall . . . ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Living in the meditating community it is interesting that the meditating community in Fairfield, Iowa is large enough that we do not necessarily know each other in it. Living here you recognize folks as part of the tribe. In the tribe there evidently are circles of folks something like guilds by affinity of interests or work that might overlap like Venn diagrams do. It used to be easier to recognize folks twenty years ago when the meditation numbers where significantly higher whence twice a day lots of meditators regardless of social economics, rank or element in the community, everyone walked in to the Domes shoulder-to-shoulder for meditation. The Dome meditation times then also served as communal 'check-in' times with friends and the larger meditating community. The Dome numbers have fragmented and diminished since those times and elements of the tribe have drifted a part from each other but there can still be overlap. And every once in a while you meet someone who has been living here in the larger meditating community for 20, 30 or 40 years that you never met before. For the last year or so as a 'town meditator' I have been on committees meeting up on campus and it has been a revelation at times putting some faces to names of folks up there in that part of the meditating community. And, also renewing old friendships of people who have been around for decades here. -JaiGuruYou Edg writes: Never met George. Two decades in FF, and nope. But I heard his name every single week there...the guy was a true community gluer. Had to be that he was a solid Joe.
[FairfieldLife] Co$ intro talk..
I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed...
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites
talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made
a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not
posting on
FFL2?
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote :
Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears
that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL.
Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a
new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking
about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the
wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :
insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others?
MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You
perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by
MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see.
Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily
justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the
right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to
exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now?
Happy to help.
Your friends are waiting in the sandbox.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :
Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a
misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech.
IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing
and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be
fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so.
It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which
you would be well advised to amend.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote :
As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning
aboutthe creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun
forlong by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Makingstraw-men may
suffice for some while and keep them from tearing ateach other for some time.
The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventuallywill find and rule them where ever they
may go as they meet up withkind people in civil society. A character of
violence in civilsociety often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the
asocialtend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that,
Alex.-JaiGuruYou
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote :
On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter
to me. Just letting you know it's there.
Yahoo! Groups
| |
| | | | Yahoo! Groups Sorry, an error occurred while loading the
content. | |
| View on groups.yahoo.com| Preview by Yahoo |
| |
Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I
think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
core program of TM, that is. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : and yet you appear to practice the core program as regularly as anyone could, so, you have taken what you wanted, and left the rest. pretty simple really. it's how most of us go about it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
and yet you appear to practice the core program as regularly as anyone could, so, you have taken what you wanted, and left the rest. pretty simple really. it's how most of us go about it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL. Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others? MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see. Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now? Happy to help. Your friends are waiting in the sandbox. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Acropolis Now!
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, s3raphita@... wrote : Re I did it [TMSP] religiously for 10 years though and was never happier than when I quit.: Well no one could claim you didn't give it a fair shot. Yes indeed. The first problem with quitting is that once you've brought the dream that meditating leads to enlightenment then doing less meditation means you must get there slower right? Beliefs like that sink in deep and it can take a while to get to the bottom of where the guilt comes from but the TMO is steeped in it. It's only when you live among them that the majority worldview takes hold. How we learn things is a funny process, it isn't just a case of an idea coming in and we see the superior wisdom of it, there's a deliberation process where we have to convince ourselves that the new idea is more correct than our previous mental defaults. To do this usually we have to fall back on previous assessment strategies and work out whether we have found a better way of seeing things. It's a lot of work. In a basically closed group it's easier because other people around you having strong opinions helps a process of acceptance just to fit in or for the sake of a quiet life and we override some of our usual intellectual approach. Having a new and profound experience to explain makes this process even easier because of the ready packaged set of profound sounding beliefs with all sorts of triggers for quality like them being old or eastern and to accept that as superior you have to have accepted the idea that ancient man had a better understanding of him self and the world that we've lost in our hurried and confusing modern world. It all feeds off each other. I'm not just trying to excuse myself for doing something for so long that wasn't doing me any good, it's just that I'd lost the way of self-assessment that I'd usually apply. This stuff is powerful, a lot of people never get out of the beliefs they've adopted. Some will insist that they've still got the superior worldview and that I'm a quitter and any criticism of them or the organisation that inadvertently brainwashed us all marks me as an apostate. Anyway, after 10 years of this superior spiritual development I was stressed, withdrawn and in need of psychological help. But interestingly I had no idea about any of that and assumed I was on the fast track to enlightenment and didn't even blame unstressing as I hadn't realised my life had changed for the worst. Kiddology is another powerful force that's tricky to become aware of. One thing I've often wondered about the TM program is how TM teachers or checkers could be really sure that their pupils were doing the whole thing right. I recall a story of MMY once realising that a high-ranking member of the TMO and close associate hadn't been meditating correctly and giggling about it. Well, it's supposed to be really easy. The thing you have to watch is not interfering with it by getting frustrated at all the thoughts or lack of clear experience. If you feel slightly better after than you did before they consider it a success. But with the flying sidhi program it's different: either you are hopping or you aren't. Do those who fail to take off suffer humiliating feelings of being losers and second-class citizens of the Age of Enlightenment? Oh yes. The people on my flying course who didn't take off were bitterly frustrated about it and saw themselves as failures. One girl I knew quit the whole thing in disgust and really held it against us that we'd got it. Still does actually. But I was one of the last to get it so I know how she felt. I would have felt most pissed off if it hadn't worked. All rather quaint to look back on. It was good though, the first time you hop about, and it's powerful, it's like finding the part of the brain that usually transcends was only going part of the way and suddenly it seems to detach itself completely and you see your body and mundane thoughts as a totally separate thing, it's like a better glimpse of infinity than the ones that convinced you before that you were seeing infinity. That should teach you something about the physical nature of the psychological components of the mind. I still think the process of developing that inner eye will have benefits for consciousness research. Basic reductionism will work here in the sense that taking something apart gives you a better idea of how it works that you can't see usually... I just don't think it will reveal what the TM beliefs as still championed by Kings Tony and Hagelin claim it will. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, s3raphita@... wrote : Re No. However the real purpose of many of the yoga asanas is to prepare one to sit in either half-lotus or full lotus.: Thanks. But don't you have to adopt full- or half-lotus to
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
Salyavin is posting on FFL2, but FFL2 is not configured with Yahoo's anonymity system, so posts show up with an email address and not a Yahoo handle. I'm not the least bit bothered that Ravi posts here as he pleases, even though he is supposedly banned, but the security hole that lets him do it is not something I wanted configured into the new group. It's easy to make an anonymous email address, and there are a number of different free and paid options for VPN/proxies that will hide your IP address. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelon...@yahoo.com wrote : salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not posting on FFL2? From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL. Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others? MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see. Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now? Happy to help. Your friends are waiting in the sandbox. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
light bulb just went on over my head...hope it stays on LOL!
From: j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 6:37 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
Salyavin is posting on FFL2, but FFL2 is not configured with Yahoo's
anonymity system, so posts show up with an email address and not a Yahoo handle.
I'm not the least bit bothered that Ravi posts here as he pleases, even though
he is supposedly banned, but the security hole that lets him do it is not
something I wanted configured into the new group. It's easy to make an
anonymous email address, and there are a number of different free and paid
options for VPN/proxies that will hide your IP address.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelon...@yahoo.com wrote :
salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites
talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made
a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not
posting on
FFL2?
From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote :
Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears
that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL.
Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a
new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking
about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the
wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :
insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others?
MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You
perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by
MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see.
Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily
justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the
right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to
exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now?
Happy to help.
Your friends are waiting in the sandbox.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :
Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a
misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech.
IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing
and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be
fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so.
It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which
you would be well advised to amend.
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote :
As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning
aboutthe creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun
forlong by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Makingstraw-men may
suffice for some while and keep them from tearing ateach other for some time.
The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventuallywill find and rule them where ever they
may go as they meet up withkind people in civil society. A character of
violence in civilsociety often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the
asocialtend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that,
Alex.-JaiGuruYou
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote :
On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter
to me. Just letting you know it's there.
Yahoo! Groups
| |
| | | | Yahoo! Groups Sorry, an error occurred while loading the
content. | |
| View on groups.yahoo.com| Preview by Yahoo |
| |
Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I
think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not posting on FFL2? I shall try and post across the ever growing diaspora of FFL, might be tricky keeping track of it all though! I shall sort out a Salyavin email address so I don't get confused... From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL. Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others? MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see. Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now? Happy to help. Your friends are waiting in the sandbox. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, I think the key phrase in your response is what you say about inferred knowledge, that it lacks the data to demonstrate. I'd agree that it lacks the data to demonstrate that it's more than just a meaning given by humans. But I think I've driveled something similar before. (-: Yep, that is indeed the point. We must be careful what definitions we ascribe to experiences. to the world as revealed by our eyes and ears, it's really hard to know what is going on just from looking at something as we see so little of it. It takes clever experiment to work things out that aren't immediately available and the more data we get about everything the more the explanations have to grow to encompass it all. A decent model of consciousness will have to include spiritual experiences and why they impress us so much, but will it include a link to particle physics? I think the mystics are in dreamland on that one. I don't mind dry and dusty at all. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 8, 2015 2:13 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : hi salyavin, glad you're still here. And now I'm really wishing you were here in Fairfield. Because you'd find many folks who like you find dinosaurs spiritual. Or birds or trees or even plastic bags! This is what I've been trying to convey to you and Curtis too. That many people here have grown beyond a bounded view of human development. Based on their own experiences. Now, the other topic I'd like to address, and this is my response to your post about evolution and science and at a deeper level, what is real. Isn't the determination of what is real dependent upon when one takes the photo? IOW, considering the process during which a caterpillar becomes a butterfly, if we take the photo at a certain point in that process, we could say the caterpillar is gone. But is that real? Or said another way, is that the whole picture? The trick is you have to be sure that you get as much of the picture before making statements about accuracy. In the case of a butterfly it would be impossible to fathom it's life until you know all the stages but once you do it's impossible to think there is something else hiding undiscovered. Most aspects of life are the same, what else could there be to mankind in a real sense as opposed to us just making stuff up about funny trips we've had? Spiritual is what things mean to us, not a reflection of any intrinsic value in nature. We infer that an inner experience is a profound understanding of nature but you can't have inferred knowledge, there is no such thing. It's just a guess based on what we want to be true, or lack the objectivity or data to demonstrate otherwise. Science is how we've learned not to fool ourselves. So I'm very wary of spiritual claims of knowledge gained through revelation. With any experience I have, whether during TM or outside of it, I wonder, Is this the whole picture? And I think many of us long term TMers have come to realize that there is no static whole picture, that it is an ever unfolding experience of what it means to be a ever unfolding human in an ever unfolding universe. Excellent. Rejecting the guru's teaching is a good first step. Just don't replace it with your own drivel ;-) This experience makes one a scientist, but one who is full of wonder and joy about what is being observed. This is what I sense in you too and what makes me think you'd enjoy a visit to Fairfield. You say but I would say that science starts with a sense of wonder and more importantly, a desire to explain what we experience. The idea of the scientist as a dry and dusty individual with no sense of romance is way wide of the mark. Just don't multiply entities unnecessarily (Occam's razor) From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.coma To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 8, 2015 12:13 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : But it's the Funny Farm Lounge. We should expect knee-jerk abusive and often obscene ranting from the inmates. I just don't want to see discussion narrowed to some sheltered view of spirituality. Yup. Spiritual means different things to different people, it isn't just a term for airy-fairy daydreams about awakening into a sea of bliss. I find dinosaurs very spiritual because thinking about the deep past and the sense of time passing and the unpredictable future of life gives me a sense of perspective in my day. A sense of place in the universe, and it's real. On 07/07/2015 01:17 PM, feste37 wrote: I'm mystified as to why you think that the alternative to having a moderated group as it is
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Salyavin is posting on FFL2, but FFL2 is not configured with Yahoo's anonymity system, so posts show up with an email address and not a Yahoo handle. Does my screen name come up at the bottom of posts as they appear in the message list on FFL2? Perhaps I can't tell because I'm logged in... I'm not the least bit bothered that Ravi posts here as he pleases, even though he is supposedly banned, but the security hole that lets him do it is not something I wanted configured into the new group. It's easy to make an anonymous email address, and there are a number of different free and paid options for VPN/proxies that will hide your IP address. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not posting on FFL2? From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL. Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others? MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see. Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now? Happy to help. Your friends are waiting in the sandbox. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote : and yet you appear to practice the core program as regularly as anyone could, so, you have taken what you wanted, and left the rest. pretty simple really. it's how most of us go about it. And your point is? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed...
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents
salyavin, I think the key phrase in your response is what you say about inferred knowledge, that it lacks the data to demonstrate. I'd agree that it lacks the data to demonstrate that it's more than just a meaning given by humans. But I think I've driveled something similar before. (-: I don't mind dry and dusty at all. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 8, 2015 2:13 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : hi salyavin, glad you're still here. And now I'm really wishing you were here in Fairfield. Because you'd find many folks who like you find dinosaurs spiritual. Or birds or trees or even plastic bags! This is what I've been trying to convey to you and Curtis too. That many people here have grown beyond a bounded view of human development. Based on their own experiences. Now, the other topic I'd like to address, and this is my response to your post about evolution and science and at a deeper level, what is real. Isn't the determination of what is real dependent upon when one takes the photo? IOW, considering the process during which a caterpillar becomes a butterfly, if we take the photo at a certain point in that process, we could say the caterpillar is gone. But is that real? Or said another way, is that the whole picture? The trick is you have to be sure that you get as much of the picture before making statements about accuracy. In the case of a butterfly it would be impossible to fathom it's life until you know all the stages but once you do it's impossible to think there is something else hiding undiscovered. Most aspects of life are the same, what else could there be to mankind in a real sense as opposed to us just making stuff up about funny trips we've had? Spiritual is what things mean to us, not a reflection of any intrinsic value in nature. We infer that an inner experience is a profound understanding of nature but you can't have inferred knowledge, there is no such thing. It's just a guess based on what we want to be true, or lack the objectivity or data to demonstrate otherwise. Science is how we've learned not to fool ourselves. So I'm very wary of spiritual claims of knowledge gained through revelation. With any experience I have, whether during TM or outside of it, I wonder, Is this the whole picture? And I think many of us long term TMers have come to realize that there is no static whole picture, that it is an ever unfolding experience of what it means to be a ever unfolding human in an ever unfolding universe. Excellent. Rejecting the guru's teaching is a good first step. Just don't replace it with your own drivel ;-) This experience makes one a scientist, but one who is full of wonder and joy about what is being observed. This is what I sense in you too and what makes me think you'd enjoy a visit to Fairfield. You say but I would say that science starts with a sense of wonder and more importantly, a desire to explain what we experience. The idea of the scientist as a dry and dusty individual with no sense of romance is way wide of the mark. Just don't multiply entities unnecessarily (Occam's razor) From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.coma To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 8, 2015 12:13 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : But it's the Funny Farm Lounge. Weshould expect knee-jerk abusive and often obscene ranting from theinmates. I just don't want to see discussion narrowed to somesheltered view of spirituality. Yup. Spiritual means different things to different people, it isn't just a term for airy-fairy daydreams about awakening into a sea of bliss. I find dinosaurs very spiritual because thinking about the deep past and the sense of time passing and the unpredictable future of life gives me a sense of perspective in my day. A sense of place in the universe, and it's real. On 07/07/2015 01:17 PM, feste37 wrote: I'm mystified as to why youthink that the alternative to having a moderated group asit is evolving here on FFL is a bliss ninny group.That's absurd. I am all for vigorous discussion, opposingpoints of view, and honest dialogue. I am against the kindof knee-jerk abusive and often obscene ranting against allthings spiritual that went on here up until the last fewweeks. And for all the abuse Doug has taken, one wouldhardly realize that he has been a good exponent of exactlywhat you are calling for in your post: a discussion ofwhere things have gone in the TMO and where they aregoing. Many of his comments and insights over the last fewyears have been very astute. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@...wrote : As faras I'm concerned Rick set thecommunity standards as he defines it on the headerfor thegroup. If you don't like them then start
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
On FFL2, your Salyavin screen name shows up on your posts when viewed on the group website, but it's not on your posts when received via email. Switching to a Salyavin email address on FFL2 would put all the confusion to rest. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Salyavin is posting on FFL2, but FFL2 is not configured with Yahoo's anonymity system, so posts show up with an email address and not a Yahoo handle. Does my screen name come up at the bottom of posts as they appear in the message list on FFL2? Perhaps I can't tell because I'm logged in... I'm not the least bit bothered that Ravi posts here as he pleases, even though he is supposedly banned, but the security hole that lets him do it is not something I wanted configured into the new group. It's easy to make an anonymous email address, and there are a number of different free and paid options for VPN/proxies that will hide your IP address. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not posting on FFL2? From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL. Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others? MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see. Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now? Happy to help. Your friends are waiting in the sandbox. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. No one can blame anyone for wanting these things. But they certainly are promises made by so many cults and even those selling self help books (and, of course, TM). They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed... Fascinating account! Scientology was never tempting to me as was the same situation for any of the bigger, well known systems and cults. I seemed to have chosen the very personal and small cult prototype to follow for a few years. LOL But I don't beat myself up about that either. It was fascinating and character building and I met some wonderful people. Plus, it was three and a half years of my life - I just can't regret having lived.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
Nothing more than noting that after all the cult aspects, and supposed misdeeds of the TMO, there you are, and there I am, and there are many others here, practicing the basic technique and, I assume, deriving benefits. And by the way, I don't think the cultish aspects of the TMO are lost on anyone here. It's just that they (the cultish aspects) are acknowledged for what they are, and generally ignored in favor of what benefits the other parts of the program have to offer. And along this theme, I don't believe engaging in a spiritual pursuit has ever been one of a constant challenge to the teacher. I would say you enter with an open heart and an open mind, and you see if things click. And if they do, you stick around for a little while longer. And if they don't, you move on. Do you mind me asking if you regret the ten years you spend in service to the TMO? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : And your point is? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On FFL2, your Salyavin screen name shows up on your posts when viewed on the group website, but it's not on your posts when received via email. Switching to a Salyavin email address on FFL2 would put all the confusion to rest. OK, thanks. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : Salyavin is posting on FFL2, but FFL2 is not configured with Yahoo's anonymity system, so posts show up with an email address and not a Yahoo handle. Does my screen name come up at the bottom of posts as they appear in the message list on FFL2? Perhaps I can't tell because I'm logged in... I'm not the least bit bothered that Ravi posts here as he pleases, even though he is supposedly banned, but the security hole that lets him do it is not something I wanted configured into the new group. It's easy to make an anonymous email address, and there are a number of different free and paid options for VPN/proxies that will hide your IP address. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, actually it's a bit of a 3 ring circus now with people on all 3 sites talking about the other sites! Wonder if that will settle out...well, you made a good try with your Scientology post. Just curious, how come you're not posting on FFL2? From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:28 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : Has MJ been banished too? Is it karma that has come a full circle? It appears that Nature has a way of cleaning up the forum to pave a new phase for FFL. Yes indeed, MJ is over on the naughty step with the other miscreants. So it's a new phase for sure, but is it a better one? Maybe when people here stop talking about people there and post some stuff we'll see what we've lost without the wit and wisdom of the forcibly departed. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others? MJ was canned for voicing an opinion about Marshy. That's free speech. You perhaps saw it as an insult. I'm sure the comment could have been justified by MJ - If he'd had the chance, but he didn't. No free speech you see. Barry got the boot for a criticism of David Lynch. That too was easily justifiable. I think you have some confusion between your own biases and the right of others to think different differently. Respecting the right of both to exist side by side is the essence of free speech. Got it now? Happy to help. Your friends are waiting in the sandbox. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2?soc_src=mailsoc_trk=ma Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might
[FairfieldLife] Re: Co$ intro talk..
Yabut, what the hell is wrong with you that decades later, you're not still fixated on the cult and endlessly lashing out at it? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : I nearly became a Scientologist once. I was young and easily led so I won't beat myself up about it. It just happened that their's was the first practical sounding belief system that I'd come across that promised all the things that everybody wants, perfect relationships, more success at work, better health, eventually reaching a state of perfection etc. It's possible that list might sound a bit familiar. No one can blame anyone for wanting these things. But they certainly are promises made by so many cults and even those selling self help books (and, of course, TM). They have a good way of piquing your interest once you've been hooked by your first encounter with the sales pitch. My intitial contact came from a book a guy at work lent me called Self Analysis by Scientology founder L Ron Hubbard. We thought it a well reasoned and plausible account and he had decided to go to the book shop advertised in the back and find out some more. This is their place in Tottenham court road and it's where you get reeled as soon as you step through the door. He'd purchased a copy of Dianetics, Hubbard's masterwork of modern mental health (or not) and got really interested. We even talked about going to their stately home in Kent to study and become perfect humans as had been promised him. Luckily for us Ron Hubbard died before we could act on our impulse to get involved and when all the stories of him being an abusive coke head with a uniform fetish and who treated his disciples like shit we thanked our lucky stars that we hadn't yet gone along for our free personality test. And that's where I left it but I bumped into my old friend the other day and as we were chatting the subject of what I had been doing in the intervening years came up and I told him about the TMO and how weird it was and how cultish but not as bad as the Scientologists that we'd almost gotten ensnared by. But then he told me he had taken it further after we'd stopped working together and had gone along for the personality test which, surprise surprise, highlighted a lot of flaws that, also surprisingly, they had the cure for. It's the difference in approach to newbies between the TMO and the Co$ that amazed me. His next step was to have a go on an e-meter to work out which areas to work on which seemed reasonable. An e-meter is a basic lie detector that measures subconscious impulses collected via two tin cans attached to a big box with an old style volt meter on the front. But the first thing he was asked was Are you a journalist or writer? or any of his family even. Satisfied that he wasn't a potential mole or spy they went on to quiz him about sexual fantasies, violent episodes he'd witnessed. It's all hardcore cult stuff, making you feel uneasy by making you reveal personal secrets and then you become dependent on the nice guy with the cure you meet next day. And it was all taped. After the personality test he was taken to another room and given a high pressure sales talk by two well drilled suits about going to live with them in their mansion. He said it was like they weren't going to give up until they'd agreed and so he did but rang up and changed his mind later. But they'd got to him with wild promises and he went back to the shop to see if there was anything else he could do to work off the credits needed for his first auditing, or therapy, session. They offered to take all his unemployment money from him in return for a session but he declined, and they offered him the chance to walk around London in costume trying to get other people interested. Luckily he didn't fancy that either. We'd always figured that cults naturally attract the sort of people best suited to the intellectual and social environment inside and his conclusion here is that you'd have to be pretty down on yourself or easily manipulated or just a plain masochist to want to get further involved with Hubbard's cronies. Textbook material. I told him he had to see the new Going Clear movie to see what he'd just missed getting into, he could have be one of the menacing suits that follow you around trying to put the frighteners on you if they think you might be an enemy. Or worse.. It's time to thank your lucky stars if you get away from that lot unscathed... Fascinating account! Scientology was never tempting to me as was the same situation for any of the bigger, well known systems and cults. I seemed to have chosen the very personal and small cult prototype to follow for a few years. LOL But I don't beat myself up about that either. It was fascinating and character building and I met some wonderful
[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zones
Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can hold 'stealth-mores' and 'micro-inequities' that some may not realize they are sharing as they speak. The process comes to these same themes of facilitating and moving civil discourse. Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. This is not just about a hurtful violence endemically perpetrated like exampled here by some behavior of some individuals in character as was on FFL but finding actionable cultural movement in progressive civil discourse that seems more broadly afoot otherwise. The collaboration in practice seems to require some willing studied [conscious] self-control of self-moderation for participation in the engagement. Also known as, civility and how things are said. -JaiGuruYou! ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Doug is right here, and I think calling this new group Free Speech is a misnomer, as Doug implies. It's more a question of civility than free speech. IIf, say, you go to a party and spend your time there insulting and ridiculing and misrepresenting others, you will likely be asked to leave. But would it be fair to call that a curtailment of your right to free speech? I don't think so. It would just be an adverse commentary on your boorish social behavior, which you would be well advised to amend. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : As someone pointed out down at Paradiso Cafe in Fairfield, Iowa this morning about the creation of FFL2 for the FFL-banished, these fox may not have fun for long by themselves without also having hens to pick on. Making straw-men may suffice for some while and keep them from tearing at each other for some time. The Yahoo-groups guidelines eventually will find and rule them where ever they may go as they meet up with kind people in civil society. A character of violence in civil society often is that it is self-limiting in nature and the asocial tend to isolate themselves. Thanks for better facilitating that, Alex. -JaiGuruYou ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stanley@... wrote : On a whim, I made a FFL free speech zone. Use it. Don't use it. Doesn't matter to me. Just letting you know it's there. Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Yahoo! Groups https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content. View on groups.yahoo.com https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/FFL-2 Preview by Yahoo Thank God, now maybe we can get some peace around here from all the whining. I think you might have wanted to call the new site australia.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Trump Speaks his Mind
He won't be nominated.He's not PC enough. He thinks he can get the Mexicans to
build the wall. Personally, I'd like to see all individual money transfers to
Mexico and Central America heavily taxed. Let that help pay for border security.
From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 1:41 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Trump Speaks his Mind
It appears he's really serious about building a wall in the southern border
of the US. But how much is that going to cost?
If elected president, he would bomb the oil fields in Iraq to defeat ISIS. He
thinks Iraq does not exist as a nation.
But surprisingly he is supposedly leading all of the Republican candidates for
president. As such, how do you think Trump will do if the Republicans chose
him as their presidential nominee for the next election?
5 Biggest Whoppers From Donald Trumps Anderson Cooper Interview
||
|||| 5 Biggest Whoppers From Donald Trumps Anderson ...
Donald Trumps media triathalon raced on Wednesday in a sitdown with CNNs
Anderson Cooper. In classic Trump fashion, he attacked everyone from C...|
|
| View on www.yahoo.com |Preview by Yahoo|
||
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Starry Night..
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Here's something to do on a Saturday afternoon in London. Get a boat down the river to Greenwich, have lunch in the park- preferably something purchased in the market - and then stroll up the hill to the Royal Greenwich Observatory and have a look at the history of Mankind's study of the stars. In another building is the only planetarium in London and it's also the site of the Astronomy Photographer of the Year contest always nicely presented with the pictures backlit in a dark room. You'll be surprised that a lot of these images were captured with easily available amateur equipment. In bloody credible. These photos are amazing because they give the impression of tremendous energy and power and space that exists all around us. Insight Astronomy Photographer of the Year 2015 shortlist - in pictures http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Insight Astronomy Photographer of the Year ... http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Highlights from the competition, which is now in its seventh year, with entries from enthusiastic amateurs and professional photographers View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Collective Consciousness?
IMO, monkeys have a fairly similar DNA structure than humans. So, their DNA can probably be manipulated genetically to create a super-intelligent monkey that perhaps can converse with humans. But the obvious question is: why would anyone want to do that? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : The pace of growth in knowledge of brain systems seems to be accelerating: Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brain-to-brain connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brai... http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection In two separate experiments, scientists have formed a network from the brains of monkeys and rats, allowing them to co-operate and learn as a “superbrain” View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Trump Speaks his Mind
Not a wall but may use the Ed Koch former mayor of NY city idea high teck sensors camera etc.boarder response teams about every 20 mile have Mexico help pay 4 such perhaps use their Mexico's boarder policies in the north as they do in their southern boarder. with Central American countries those below. Cost is less than we pay 4 illegal alien expenses at present -Original Message- From: jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thu, Jul 9, 2015 2:41 pm Subject: [FairfieldLife] Trump Speaks his Mind It appears he's really serious about building a wall in the southern border of the US. But how much is that going to cost? If elected president, he would bomb the oil fields in Iraq to defeat ISIS. He thinks Iraq does not exist as a nation. But surprisingly he is supposedly leading all of the Republican candidates for president. As such, how do you think Trump will do if the Republicans chose him as their presidential nominee for the next election? 5 Biggest Whoppers From Donald Trumps Anderson Cooper Interview 5 Biggest Whoppers From Donald Trumps Anderson ... Donald Trumps media triathalon raced on Wednesday in a sitdown with CNNs Anderson Cooper. In classic Trump fashion, he attacked everyone fro m C... View on www.yahoo.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Collective Consciousness?
Because they can? That seems to be the reason for a lot of things nowadays. Perhaps they should also ask but should we? But the answer to that may often be yes, because if we don't someone else will. On 07/09/2015 12:26 PM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: IMO, monkeys have a fairly similar DNA structure than humans. So, their DNA can probably be manipulated genetically to create a super-intelligent monkey that perhaps can converse with humans. But the obvious question is: why would anyone want to do that? ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : The pace of growth in knowledge of brain systems seems to be accelerating: Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brain-to-brain connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection image http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brai... http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection In two separate experiments, scientists have formed a network from the brains of monkeys and rats, allowing them to co-operate and learn as a “superbrain” View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Collective Consciousness?
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jr_esq@... wrote : IMO, monkeys have a fairly similar DNA structure than humans. So, their DNA can probably be manipulated genetically to create a super-intelligent monkey that perhaps can converse with humans. But the obvious question is: why would anyone want to do that? To understand. If we can learn how to ultimately manipulate brains then we are closer to knowing the great secret of ourselves. Imagine the consequences of that, for psychiatry, self knowledge, peak performance, space travel etc. We'll truly be the masters of the universe. But the question of whether we should do that is one we'll have to ask as we go along. Learning responsibility will become essential but I doubt we'll be able to control the genie once it's out of the bottle. The urge to learn is too strong in us and knowledge can always be used for good or bad. You can't unlearn so as this sort of thing is possible we are going to have to learn to live with it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : The pace of growth in knowledge of brain systems seems to be accelerating: Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brain-to-brain connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Monkey 'brain net' raises prospect of human brai... http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection In two separate experiments, scientists have formed a network from the brains of monkeys and rats, allowing them to co-operate and learn as a “superbrain” View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jul/09/monkey-brain-net-raises-prospect-of-human-brain-to-brain-connection Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] George Kelly needs your help
Click here to support Help George Kelley Fight Cancer by Kacie Meek http://www.gofundme.com/yw2z34 Never met George. Two decades in FF, and nope. But I heard his name every single week there...the guy was a true community gluer. Had to be that he was a solid Joe.
[FairfieldLife] How Rand Paul Could Ride the Maharishi Effect to Victory
| | | | | | | | | | | How Rand Paul Could Ride the Maharishi Effect to VictoryThe candidate has a ready-made base at Iowa’s Maharishi University. | | | | View on www.bloomberg.com | Preview by Yahoo | | | | | http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2015-07-08/how-rand-paul-could-ride-the-maharishi-effect-to-victory
[FairfieldLife] Fwd: Dumb or Clueless!! [1 Attachment]
-Original Message- From: DON LOOS l.donaldl...@gmail.com To: Don Loos l.donaldl...@gmail.com Sent: Thu, Jul 9, 2015 9:38 am Subject: Fw: Dumb or Clueless!! Dumb or Clueless? You may recall that a few weeks ago, President Obama spoke of three former Presidents making prisoner swaps at the end of wars that took place on their watch, much like this swap he said convincingly. CNN carried this quote, This is what happens at the end of wars.” President Barack Obama boasted Tuesday when he was asked about swapping American Army Sgt. Deserter for five vicious Taliban terrorists. That was true for George Washington, that was true for Abraham Lincoln and that was true for FDR. That’s been true of every combat situation, that at some point, you make sure that you try to get your folks back...and that’s the right thing to do.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Starry Night..
Re Get a boat down the river to Greenwich, have lunch in the park- preferably something purchased in the market - and then stroll up the hill to the Royal Greenwich Observatory: Whenever I have friends visiting from Up North or from abroad that itinerary is what I always suggest when the sun shines. I must be an authority on the Observatory display by now. But it's the plain marker that shows the Greenwich Mean Time boundary line that always brings on the selfie mania. Funny how something completely notional and conventional can strike a chord with people. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Here's something to do on a Saturday afternoon in London. Get a boat down the river to Greenwich, have lunch in the park- preferably something purchased in the market - and then stroll up the hill to the Royal Greenwich Observatory and have a look at the history of Mankind's study of the stars. In another building is the only planetarium in London and it's also the site of the Astronomy Photographer of the Year contest always nicely presented with the pictures backlit in a dark room. You'll be surprised that a lot of these images were captured with easily available amateur equipment. Insight Astronomy Photographer of the Year 2015 shortlist - in pictures http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Insight Astronomy Photographer of the Year ... http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Highlights from the competition, which is now in its seventh year, with entries from enthusiastic amateurs and professional photographers View on www.theguardian.com http://www.theguardian.com/science/gallery/2015/jul/09/insight-astronomy-photographer-of-the-year-2015-shortlist-in-pictures Preview by Yahoo
[FairfieldLife] Re: Free Speech Zone
Re I did a Ventriloquist magic show at South Fallsberg a million years ago for a bunch of Mother Divine types.: A YouTube video of that performance would have been priceless. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : Curtis, I actually read this message from Doug rather differently. The section below seems to be referring to younger TMers at the university who are pointing out to older TM-movement types that some of the language they use contains these micro-inequities. The young people are not so trained in TM-speak as the older ones, so they are trying to educate them about the limitations or unconscious biases of the TM-speak that has been second nature to TM campus folk for thirty years and more. Here's the passage I am referring to: Me: Yes I agree with you. Sometimes the push to limit free speech comes from the students as in this case which is why Jerry wont play gigs on campuses. But the details are not the problem that I am seeing. Whatever the vague standard they are proposing it is the same routine the establishment runs. Make a statement like only positivity will be tolerated and then you can go after anyone you want. But you are bringing up a cool point about the oppressors being called on language by the students. It is hilarious. They are going to make the PC people more PC in a different PC way! I did a Ventriloquist magic show at South Fallsberg a million years ago for a bunch of Mother Divine types. My contact was an old MIU friend and former World Government Lady. She went over my routine over the show and was very concerned that the dynamic between me and my vent figure partner was not satvic enough because he was making fun of me. Gutting comedic drama of anything that anyone could view as possibly negitive was what she was requesting. Interestingly, the millennial meditating generation that is present participating in this is not sitting still at all for old patriarchal ways and they are quite studied in their push and their holding some elder feet to the fire. If I am correct, this actually would be a positive development from the point of view of those who dislike traditional TM-speak. It's not always possible to tell from Doug's posts exactly what he has in mind, so I could be wrong, but that is how I read it. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5@... wrote : Yes, as some are affirming here the Yahoo-groups guidelines are a lot about civility and how things are said. Yes it is about civility and facilitating communal well-being for individuals in [safe] collaborative communal organization. With this it seems a lot of thought has been put in to the Yahoo-groups guidelines by folks at Yahoo. Me: If I didn't know who wrote it, I would have to assume this was a parody. You are taking the approach that is appropriate for the pre-schools I teach in or an exclusive POV group like TM. Two things stick out for me: One is the assumption that the unenforced Yahoo guidelines are some kind of Vedic scripture and were not banged out by 20 something's from the corporate lawyer's guidelines. You are taking them as some kind of profound message for how to both condescendingly coddle and at the same time control other adults engaged in free conversations. Two is that you are following a long historical line of people who value form over content and seem incapable of tolerating the way people who care about content engage in the process. When I am in a heated debate and someone calls me a name, it is very easy to label it for what it is, a sophistic tactic to distract from the weakness of the argument or their lack of ability to mount one. Often the back and forth of diverse opinions can inspire someone to mouth off a little. But that is because they are engaged, they care, they give a s-- oh wait, I just got a memo from the inhibitory part of my brain that alerts me that in your mind, you might bounce me if I use bad language You don't want passionate people who are emotionally behind their ideas and willing to hash it out in discussion. If I put some new age music behind what you wrote I could use it to go to sleep. You are taking the Kim Kardashian approach to the exchange of ideas. All Spanx and nothing behind the eyes. Buck:The yahoo guidelines seem very much like a re-structuring and looking at language that is happening a lot of places and also ongoing within the TM movement itself to help folks figure out civil processes. Like between and within the different elements as in the case of TM, of what or who is TM. I was in movement working committee meetings yesterday on campus where a focus of discussion was looking for actionable remedy to some really poor behavior and culture in language-ing that can
[FairfieldLife] Re: And So It Begins...
Robots have a loveable - as well as a murderous - side. Two robots have tied the knot in Japan in what is thought to be the first wedding of its kind in the world. Frois, the groom, and bride Yukirin walked the aisle, wore traditional outfits and even carried out a 'wedding kiss' at the event in Tokyo on Saturday. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pVNyg1hPwc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pVNyg1hPwc
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents
salyavin, in the movie of the same name, Lucy says time is the basis of reality. Meaning that if something is traveling faster than the speed of light, it basically doesn't exist! Of course, this is not a documentary, but fabulous nonetheless about time and evolution and human development. I'm obviously on a Lucy kick today. (-: From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2015 7:32 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : salyavin, I think the key phrase in your response is what you say about inferred knowledge, that it lacks the data to demonstrate. I'd agree that it lacks the data to demonstrate that it's more than just a meaning given by humans. But I think I've driveled something similar before. (-: Yep, that is indeed the point. We must be careful what definitions we ascribe to experiences. to the world as revealed by our eyes and ears, it's really hard to know what is going on just from looking at something as we see so little of it. It takes clever experiment to work things out that aren't immediately available and the more data we get about everything the more the explanations have to grow to encompass it all. A decent model of consciousness will have to include spiritual experiences and why they impress us so much, but will it include a link to particle physics? I think the mystics are in dreamland on that one. I don't mind dry and dusty at all. From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 8, 2015 2:13 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : hi salyavin, glad you're still here. And now I'm really wishing you were here in Fairfield. Because you'd find many folks who like you find dinosaurs spiritual. Or birds or trees or even plastic bags! This is what I've been trying to convey to you and Curtis too. That many people here have grown beyond a bounded view of human development. Based on their own experiences. Now, the other topic I'd like to address, and this is my response to your post about evolution and science and at a deeper level, what is real. Isn't the determination of what is real dependent upon when one takes the photo? IOW, considering the process during which a caterpillar becomes a butterfly, if we take the photo at a certain point in that process, we could say the caterpillar is gone. But is that real? Or said another way, is that the whole picture? The trick is you have to be sure that you get as much of the picture before making statements about accuracy. In the case of a butterfly it would be impossible to fathom it's life until you know all the stages but once you do it's impossible to think there is something else hiding undiscovered. Most aspects of life are the same, what else could there be to mankind in a real sense as opposed to us just making stuff up about funny trips we've had? Spiritual is what things mean to us, not a reflection of any intrinsic value in nature. We infer that an inner experience is a profound understanding of nature but you can't have inferred knowledge, there is no such thing. It's just a guess based on what we want to be true, or lack the objectivity or data to demonstrate otherwise. Science is how we've learned not to fool ourselves. So I'm very wary of spiritual claims of knowledge gained through revelation. With any experience I have, whether during TM or outside of it, I wonder, Is this the whole picture? And I think many of us long term TMers have come to realize that there is no static whole picture, that it is an ever unfolding experience of what it means to be a ever unfolding human in an ever unfolding universe. Excellent. Rejecting the guru's teaching is a good first step. Just don't replace it with your own drivel ;-) This experience makes one a scientist, but one who is full of wonder and joy about what is being observed. This is what I sense in you too and what makes me think you'd enjoy a visit to Fairfield. You say but I would say that science starts with a sense of wonder and more importantly, a desire to explain what we experience. The idea of the scientist as a dry and dusty individual with no sense of romance is way wide of the mark. Just don't multiply entities unnecessarily (Occam's razor) From: salyavin808 no_re...@yahoogroups.coma To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 8, 2015 12:13 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: My two cents ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : But it's the Funny Farm Lounge. Weshould expect knee-jerk abusive and often obscene ranting from theinmates. I just don't want to see discussion narrowed to somesheltered view of spirituality. Yup. Spiritual means different things to different people, it isn't just a term for
[FairfieldLife] Re: Pandits of Iowa
they can audit courses at MUM now, but nothing that would qualify them to do anything other than their traditional occupation. Otherwise, the answers would be no and no. Thats not what they signed up for. same deal as TTC or even a residence course.
[FairfieldLife] Post Count Fri 10-Jul-15 00:15:04 UTC
Fairfield Life Post Counter === Start Date (UTC): 07/04/15 00:00:00 End Date (UTC): 07/11/15 00:00:00 303 messages as of (UTC) 07/09/15 23:32:06 57 salyavin808 43 Bhairitu noozguru 33 awoelflebater 20 curtisdeltablues 17 steve.sundur 16 s3raphita 16 Michael Jackson mjackson74 14 j_alexander_stanley 13 Share Long sharelong60 11 Mike Dixon mdixon.6569 10 jr_esq 8 feste37 7 dhamiltony2k5 5 ultrarishi 4 Xenophaneros Anartaxius anartaxius 4 Duveyoung 3 hepa7 3 geezerfreak 3 authfriend 3 anartaxius 3 William Leed WLeed3 2 yifuxero 2 emptybill 2 emily.mae50 2 email4you mikemail4you 1 srijau 1 dr_rc_racy Posters: 27 Saturday Morning 00:00 UTC Rollover Times = Daylight Saving Time (Summer): US Friday evening: PDT 5 PM - MDT 6 PM - CDT 7 PM - EDT 8 PM Europe Saturday: BST 1 AM CEST 2 AM EEST 3 AM Standard Time (Winter): US Friday evening: PST 4 PM - MST 5 PM - CST 6 PM - EST 7 PM Europe Saturday: GMT 12 AM CET 1 AM EET 2 AM For more information on Time Zones: www.worldtimezone.com
[FairfieldLife] The FF Meditating Community
Living in the meditating community it is interesting that the meditating community in Fairfield, Iowa is large enough that we do not necessarily know each other in it. Living here you recognize folks as part of the tribe. In the tribe there evidently are circles of folks something like guilds by affinity of interests or work that might overlap like Venn diagrams do. It used to be easier to recognize folks twenty years ago when the meditation numbers where significantly higher whence twice a day lots of meditators regardless of social economics, rank or element in the community, everyone walked in to the Domes shoulder-to-shoulder for meditation. The Dome meditation times then also served as communal 'check-in' times with friends and the larger meditating community. The Dome numbers have fragmented and diminished since those times and elements of the tribe have drifted a part from each other but there can still be overlap. And every once in a while you meet someone who has been living here in the larger meditating community for 20, 30 or 40 years that you never met before. For the last year or so as a 'town meditator' I have been on committees meeting up on campus and it has been a revelation at times putting some faces to names of folks up there in that part of the meditating community. And, also renewing old friendships of people who have been around for decades here. -JaiGuruYou Edg writes: Never met George. Two decades in FF, and nope. But I heard his name every single week there...the guy was a true community gluer. Had to be that he was a solid Joe.
