[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote:
Oh, well, niivaara, no wonder. That changes everything! ;-)
It actually *does*:
4 ***nivAra m. keeping off*** , hindering , impediment (cf.
%{dur-niv-}) ; (%{A}) f. N. of a river MBh. VP. (v.l. %{nIv-}).
5 nIvArA v.l. for %{nivArA} (see under %{ni-vR}).
6 nIvara m. ( %{nI}? ; cf. Un2. iii.) a trader ; an inhabitant ; a
beggar ; mud ; n. water L.
7 ***nIvAra m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice*** (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains)
Yeah, but was the nIvAra wearing a hat?
I think I've seen him wearing a hat rather like
the one Tibetan monks are sometimes using.
Seems quite a lot like UFO/ETI-inspired... :D
http://www.exoticindiaart.com/product/SR22/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@
The beginning of the line in question seems to go like this:
nivaarashuukavattanvii piitaa...
Er...niivaara
Oh, well, niivaara, no wonder. That changes everything! ;-)
It actually *does*:
Oh, Card, I'm sure it does. I was kidding you by pretending
to be shocked when I have no more idea what the difference
is than the man in the moon. I'm awed by your scholarship.
4 ***nivAra m. keeping off*** , hindering , impediment (cf.
%{dur-niv-}) ; (%{A}) f. N. of a river MBh. VP. (v.l. %{nIv-}).
5 nIvArA v.l. for %{nivArA} (see under %{ni-vR}).
6 nIvara m. ( %{nI}? ; cf. Un2. iii.) a trader ; an inhabitant ; a
beggar ; mud ; n. water L.
7 ***nIvAra m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice*** (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rf...@... wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcg...@... wrote: Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. Of course, Tony. The Taittariya Aranyaka is from the Yajur Veda which originated in ancient India. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
On Dec 6, 2009, at 8:35 AM, ShempMcGurk wrote: Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. Tomatoes, corn, potatoes, and I think certain types of beans also...maybe cocoa? Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rf...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. Of course, Tony. The Taittariya Aranyaka is from the Yajur Veda which originated in ancient India. Then I'm confused. Firstly, I am assuming that the Taittariya Aranyaka was cognized way before 1492 when Columbus landed on the shores of America. If this assumption is correct, how then can there be a reference to corn if it wasn't introduced to India, Europe, Asia, and the rest of the world until afterwards? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunsh...@... wrote: On Dec 6, 2009, at 8:35 AM, ShempMcGurk wrote: Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. Tomatoes, corn, potatoes, and I think certain types of beans also...maybe cocoa? Sal And tobacco!
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
Okay, I have now seen John's subsequent posting on Maize in ancient times which answers a lot of my questions! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcg...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. Of course, Tony. The Taittariya Aranyaka is from the Yajur Veda which originated in ancient India. Then I'm confused. Firstly, I am assuming that the Taittariya Aranyaka was cognized way before 1492 when Columbus landed on the shores of America. If this assumption is correct, how then can there be a reference to corn if it wasn't introduced to India, Europe, Asia, and the rest of the world until afterwards? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcg...@... wrote: Okay, I have now seen John's subsequent posting on Maize in ancient times which answers a lot of my questions! Has it occurred to you to wonder why, if a Sanskrit term that we were sure referred to maize was used in the Vedas, the evidence cited for the existence of maize in ancient India has to do with sculpture that appears to portray maize, and the references to it in the Vedas aren't mentioned at all?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcg...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: Wow. What a find. One of the most incredible excerpts from the Vedas I've seen. Thanks to John for posting it. However, I always thought that both tomatoes and corn were products of the new world; that is, they were introduced to the old world AFTER America was discovered. But there is of course the reference to corn below. Of course, Tony. The Taittariya Aranyaka is from the Yajur Veda which originated in ancient India. Then I'm confused. No, he is. He got your question backwards.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: Okay, I have now seen John's subsequent posting on Maize in ancient times which answers a lot of my questions! Has it occurred to you to wonder why, if a Sanskrit term that we were sure referred to maize was used in the Vedas, the evidence cited for the existence of maize in ancient India has to do with sculpture that appears to portray maize, and the references to it in the Vedas aren't mentioned at all? Could you please reword that question?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
The Taittariya Aranyaka is from the Yajur Veda which originated in ancient India. Shemp McGurk wrote: Then I'm confused. Firstly, I am assuming that the Taittariya Aranyaka was cognized way before 1492 when Columbus landed on the shores of America. If this assumption is correct, how then can there be a reference to corn if it wasn't introduced to India, Europe, Asia, and the rest of the world until afterwards? Simple: The Mormon God brought the corn with him to the New World before the advent of agriculture. From: Duwaynea Anderson Subject: Re: John Manning a fool Newsgroups: alt.religion.mormon, alt.religion, soc.culture.jewish Date: November 20, 2009
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. But what fascinates me is what was *made* of the quote here. Even reading only in Message View, it appears that the only thing a few folks saw in the verse worth discussing was one word -- corn. It reminds me more than anything else of a classic Monty Python bit, in which the only word that the participants felt worth discussing was hats. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2QJvc_SxFQ --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rf...@... wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcg...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: Okay, I have now seen John's subsequent posting on Maize in ancient times which answers a lot of my questions! Has it occurred to you to wonder why, if a Sanskrit term that we were sure referred to maize was used in the Vedas, the evidence cited for the existence of maize in ancient India has to do with sculpture that appears to portray maize, and the references to it in the Vedas aren't mentioned at all? Could you please reword that question? Why isn't *linguistic* evidence what is cited for the existence of maize in ancient India? If we know the Sanskrit word translated corn refers to maize, and we want to prove that maize existed at the time of the Vedas, why don't we just say, Well, the Vedas talk about maize, so obviously it existed in India back then? Instead, the cited evidence is *sculpture* of what is thought to look like ears of maize. Not nearly as definitive. The point being that we *don't* know that the word translated corn referred to maize. Given that the word corn used to mean grain in general, and this is a rather old-fashioned translation, it makes more sense to assume that the Sanskrit term referred to grain in general as well. As to your question about yellow awn, the awn of corn isn't any yellower than that of most grains; the awns are typically sort of beige. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MatureSweetCorn.jpg
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? But what fascinates me is what was *made* of the quote here. Even reading only in Message View, it appears that the only thing a few folks saw in the verse worth discussing was one word -- corn. Indeed. Considering that the whole Transcendental Meditation teaching according to MMY, is based on the authenticity of the Vedas, it IS interesting (but not very surprising) to me that not one person other than you has said one word about the topic itself. Rather, the comments are confined to quibbling about whether or not there was corn in ancient India. Chuckle It reminds me more than anything else of a classic Monty Python bit, in which the only word that the participants felt worth discussing was hats. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2QJvc_SxFQ --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rf...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? Just a hunch, based on the fact that they don't sound anything like any translations of the Rig Veda I've ever heard before. They sound more like, say, Robert Bly's tranalations of Rumi, done poetically and eloquently, but without knowing a word of the original language. But what fascinates me is what was *made* of the quote here. Even reading only in Message View, it appears that the only thing a few folks saw in the verse worth discussing was one word -- corn. Indeed. Considering that the whole Transcendental Meditation teaching according to MMY, is based on the authenticity of the Vedas, it IS interesting (but not very surprising) to me that not one person other than you has said one word about the topic itself. Rather, the comments are confined to quibbling about whether or not there was corn in ancient India. Chuckle Yuppers. Don't look for a great deal of more interesting insight from me. I found it a really unique way of describing the heart chakra, but these days describing the chakras is not so much my interest as utilizing them in various forms of meditation. It reminds me more than anything else of a classic Monty Python bit, in which the only word that the participants felt worth discussing was hats. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2QJvc_SxFQ --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: ...Like a lotus turned downwards is the heart, a span below the neck and a span above the navel. Know that heart to be the abode of God. Surrounded by nerves, it hangs down like a lotus bud. At its end is a subtle nerve, in which is established the Being, who is everything. A great fire is at its center, which has flames all around, spreading in all directions. It is the first partaker, the ageless knower, who digests and circulates food. Above and below are its spreading flames. It keeps its body hot from head to feet. At its core lies a flame, tapering finely upwards, like the awn of corn, yellow, bright and subtle, flashing like a lightening in the heart of a dark cloud. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva. He is Indra. He is the indestructible Supreme Being, the lord Himself. - excerpts from the Taittariya Aranyaka III.13 from Hymns of the Rig Veda - Compiled by Jayaram V http://www.hinduwebsite.com/vedicsection/rigvedichymns.asp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. Precisely. But what fascinates me is what was *made* of the quote here. Even reading only in Message View, it appears that the only thing a few folks saw in the verse worth discussing was one word -- corn. Actually, one person asked a question about something that puzzled him, and the rest of us were trying to help him out. (I was actually trying to steer him in the direction of what you suggest above, but you wouldn't know that, of course, since you assume the lines you deign to read in Message View give you the complete picture). It reminds me more than anything else of a classic Monty Python bit, in which the only word that the participants felt worth discussing was hats. Yes, and what is it that *you* feel like discussing about these verses? Looks like the only thing you feel worth discussing is how trivial the concerns of the rest of us are.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rf...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? But what fascinates me is what was *made* of the quote here. Even reading only in Message View, it appears that the only thing a few folks saw in the verse worth discussing was one word -- corn. Indeed. Considering that the whole Transcendental Meditation teaching according to MMY, is based on the authenticity of the Vedas, it IS interesting (but not very surprising) to me that not one person other than you has said one word about the topic itself. NEWS FLASH: Barry hasn't said anything about the topic itself either. Rather, the comments are confined to quibbling about whether or not there was corn in ancient India. And Barry's are confined, Chuckles, to putting down those who are not talking about the topic itself, without *himself* saying anything about it either. Chuckle horselaugh
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
On Dec 6, 2009, at 12:59 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rf...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? Just a hunch, based on the fact that they don't sound anything like any translations of the Rig Veda I've ever heard before. They sound more like, say, Robert Bly's tranalations of Rumi, done poetically and eloquently, but without knowing a word of the original language. TMer's like to call many things the Veda or Vedic which are not. I'd be careful of confusing the Taittariya Aranyaka with Taittariya Upanishad. The Taittariya Aranyaka is a sacrificial manual! The chapter 3 that is excerpted here, seems to be borrowing yogic (non-Vedic) terminology and this chapter 'treats technicalities of several other homas and yajnas'. I've actually met Brahmins from the Taittariya Upanishad line. Fifth and Sixth Anuvakas try to describe Brahman in the form of Vyahrutis. The words Bhooh , Bhuvah, Suvah, Mahah, Janah, Tapah and Satyam arecalled seven Vyahruti's or Sapta Vyahrutis. Those familiar with the original mantric practice of the Age of Enlightenment technique will immediately recognize these mantras. Full Age of Enlightenment Technique After TMSP: Place attention on the following: Nostrils Lips Ears Eyes Between Brows Top of head Whole head Throat Chest Stomach Sides of the body Back Upper back Shoulder blades Upper arms Lower arms Palms Fingers Upper legs Ankles Feet Whole body Then have sequential awareness of the following spaces, along with the mantras which follow. City you are in Country you are in Continent (North/SouthAmerica) Africa Europe Austral-Asia Whole world Earth and the Sun together The Solar System The Galaxy Clusters of Galaxies Whole Universe The Absolute The Whole Body Lokas (done simultaneously with the above): Om Bhu (utter at level of clouds) Om Bhu Va (higher and higher) Om Sva Om Maha Om Jana Om Tapa Om Sat Yam (pron: Om Sut Yum) When you utter Sat Yam place attention on the top of the head. Have an awareness of the Whole Body. Sutra: Soma, soma, soma. Rest 5-10 minutes.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: snip Just a hunch, based on the fact that they don't sound anything like any translations of the Rig Veda I've ever heard before. Interesting. They sound exactly like the vast majority of the translations I've heard of the Rig Veda and Vedic literature generally, very flowery. Most of the important ones were made a century or more ago.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradh...@... wrote: On Dec 6, 2009, at 12:59 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex do.rflex@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? Just a hunch, based on the fact that they don't sound anything like any translations of the Rig Veda I've ever heard before. They sound more like, say, Robert Bly's tranalations of Rumi, done poetically and eloquently, but without knowing a word of the original language. TMer's like to call many things the Veda or Vedic which are not. I'd be careful of confusing the Taittariya Aranyaka with Taittariya Upanishad. The Taittariya Aranyaka is a sacrificial manual! The chapter 3 that is excerpted here, seems to be borrowing yogic (non-Vedic) terminology and this chapter 'treats technicalities of several other homas and yajnas'. I've actually met Brahmins from the Taittariya Upanishad line. As has been noted before, I have zero interest in describing the human body in terms of the resting place of various gods. Therefore, describing the heart chakra as the home of Brahman, Shiva and Indra does not exactly float my interest boat. :-) I do find it interesting that the seer didn't include any *godesses* in a description of -- duh -- the heart chakra, but that's probably just me. The one thing that struck me as curious, though, especially given your suggestion that this text may have borrowed from yogic terminology and concepts, is the description of the heart chakra as keeping the body warm from head to feet. That sounds very yogic, but experientially...uh... wrong. I certainly can't claim to have learned all of the various techniques associated with tumo or the generation of bodily heat, but all of the ones I have learned utilized the navel chakra, not the heart chakra. If this verse is taken to suggest an actual technique for keeping the body warm, my suspicion is that the yogi/seer who cognized it was very short, and thus his navel chakra and heart chakra were so close together that the technique worked for him anyway. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: [snip] But what fascinates me is what was *made* of the quote here. Even reading only in Message View, it appears that the only thing a few folks saw in the verse worth discussing was one word -- corn. [snip] Your reading comprehension skills suck, Barry. Reread what I originally responded to John and you'll see that the rest of the verse -- indeed, the entire verse -- I considered incredible. As such, it was complete and other than praising it, which I did, there really wasn't anything else to discuss about it. Not discussing something doesn't mean one feels it worthless. Au contraire, it is because of its completeness and beauty that no other discussion need take place. But thank you, Barry, for managing to find the single shit stain in an otherwise interesting and beautiful thread. We can always count on you for that.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
On Dec 6, 2009, at 1:50 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: The one thing that struck me as curious, though, especially given your suggestion that this text may have borrowed from yogic terminology and concepts, is the description of the heart chakra as keeping the body warm from head to feet. Once one has stabilized the kundalini at the navel, it's raised and spread throughout the bodies' entire network as the energy refines, finer and finer. So, for example, in tummo, one of the things that will get quite hot are the fingers (in very experienced practitioners).
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote:
Okay, I have now seen John's subsequent posting on Maize
in ancient times which answers a lot of my questions!
Has it occurred to you to wonder why, if a Sanskrit term
that we were sure referred to maize was used in the Vedas,
the evidence cited for the existence of maize in ancient
India has to do with sculpture that appears to portray
maize, and the references to it in the Vedas aren't
mentioned at all?
The beginning of the line in question seems to go like this:
nivaarashuukavattanvii piitaa...
(nivaara-shuukavat tanvii piitaa...)
Vocabulary:
nIvAra (niivaara) m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains) VS. S3Br. MBh. c. ;
zUka (shuuka) m. n. (g. %{ardharcA7di} ; derivation doubtful) the awn of
grain R. Sarvad.
The suffix -vat after 'shuuka' means 'like' (adv.
1. In the manner of being; as if. )
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@...
The beginning of the line in question seems to go like this:
nivaarashuukavattanvii piitaa...
Er...niivaara
Vocabulary:
nIvAra (niivaara) m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains) VS. S3Br. MBh. c. ;
zUka (shuuka) m. n. (g. %{ardharcA7di} ; derivation doubtful) the awn
of grain R. Sarvad.
The suffix -vat after 'shuuka' means 'like' (adv.
1. In the manner of being; as if. )
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ShempMcGurk shempmcgurk@ wrote:
Okay, I have now seen John's subsequent posting on Maize
in ancient times which answers a lot of my questions!
Has it occurred to you to wonder why, if a Sanskrit term
that we were sure referred to maize was used in the Vedas,
the evidence cited for the existence of maize in ancient
India has to do with sculpture that appears to portray
maize, and the references to it in the Vedas aren't
mentioned at all?
The beginning of the line in question seems to go like this:
nivaarashuukavattanvii piitaa...
(nivaara-shuukavat tanvii piitaa...)
Vocabulary:
nIvAra (niivaara) m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains) VS. S3Br. MBh. c. ;
zUka (shuuka) m. n. (g. %{ardharcA7di} ; derivation doubtful) the awn
of grain R. Sarvad.
The suffix -vat after 'shuuka' means 'like' (adv.
1. In the manner of being; as if. )
Must mean uncultivated rice, rather than wild rice
as we know it, which isn't actually rice, and which is
native to North America and China but not India.
But here's a picture of a rice field in India in which
the awns sure look yellow:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/14120...@n02/1692596580/
At any rate, I gather there's nothing to link the term
to maize. Thanks, card!
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. John wrote: Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? Because 'Siva' wasn't invented until the age of the devotional sects in India? There is no mention of 'Shiva' in the Rig Veda. These terms came much later after Shankara in the 9th century. The Rig Veda is concerned with the supernal dieties, the personified forces of nature - there are no devatas mentioned in the Rig Veda and no Supreme Being called 'Brahman'. The term Brahman isn't used until the composition of the Upanishads. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: John, this was actually a very sweet quote. I can only assume that the translator's choice of language is extremely poetic, and that he did not feel the need for an exact translation, merely one that captured what he saw in the verse. John wrote: Why do you assume that the author's words aren't an exact translation? Because 'Siva' wasn't invented until the age of the devotional sects in India? There is no mention of 'Shiva' in the Rig Veda. These terms came much later after Shankara in the 9th century. The Rig Veda is concerned with the supernal dieties, the personified forces of nature - there are no devatas mentioned in the Rig Veda and no Supreme Being called 'Brahman'. The term Brahman isn't used until the composition of the Upanishads. I think TaittiriiyaaraNyaka belongs to kRSNa-yajur-veda. That line seems to go like this: sa brahma sa shivassa harissendras... (sa brahma sa shivaH sa hariH sa + indraH...) He [is] Brahma(n), he [is] Shiva, etc. At the center of this flame is installed the Supreme Being. He is Brahman. He is Siva...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ The beginning of the line in question seems to go like this: nivaarashuukavattanvii piitaa... Er...niivaara Oh, well, niivaara, no wonder. That changes everything! ;-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jst...@... wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote:
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@
The beginning of the line in question seems to go like this:
nivaarashuukavattanvii piitaa...
Er...niivaara
Oh, well, niivaara, no wonder. That changes everything! ;-)
It actually *does*:
4 ***nivAra m. keeping off*** , hindering , impediment (cf.
%{dur-niv-}) ; (%{A}) f. N. of a river MBh. VP. (v.l. %{nIv-}).
5 nIvArA v.l. for %{nivArA} (see under %{ni-vR}).
6 nIvara m. ( %{nI}? ; cf. Un2. iii.) a trader ; an inhabitant ; a
beggar ; mud ; n. water L.
7 ***nIvAra m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice*** (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your heart is the abode of God [Rig Veda]
Oh, well, niivaara, no wonder. That changes everything! ;-)
It actually *does*:
4 ***nivAra m. keeping off*** , hindering , impediment (cf.
%{dur-niv-}) ; (%{A}) f. N. of a river MBh. VP. (v.l. %{nIv-}).
5 nIvArA v.l. for %{nivArA} (see under %{ni-vR}).
6 nIvara m. ( %{nI}? ; cf. Un2. iii.) a trader ; an inhabitant ; a
beggar ; mud ; n. water L.
7 ***nIvAra m. (ifc. f. %{A}) wild rice*** (sg. the plant ; pl. the
grains)
Yeah, but was the nIvAra wearing a hat?
We know that people aren't wearing enough of them,
but did Vedic grains wear enough hats. And even
more important, was Shiva wearing a hat? These
things, after all, are the important things in
the verse. :-)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2QJvc_SxFQ
My point is simply that of all the comments on the
heady corn controversy, Sal's seems most apt.
The whole discussion seems to have been a defense
of the idea that 1) the Vedas can't possibly have
been wrong about something, followed by 2) India
can't possibly have been less than the wonderful
place we've been told it was in Vedic times,
cruising the world in its many navy vessels,
transporting its crops to the rest of the world,
spreading the light of knowledge everywhere.
Meanwhile, so far only Vaj and Barry discussed the
heart chakra being described in the verse as if
they had any personal experience with it.
Classic Fairfield Life. :-)
