Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 22:55, schrieb mmathew1...@comcast.net: There is an article in the current issue of macilife wherein they seem to be discussing this topic on page 88 and ƒ. Does this help? So what does it say? I haven't got access to MacLife. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 23:01, schrieb Darcy James Argue: What mail client are you using? Thunderbird, I never liked Apple Mail much, and at the time it didn't work well for me, as it kept wanting to go online even when I was on a Modem connection. On the other hand I am sure it has evolved since. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 20:32, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: Well, what are you using that isn't a Monopoly? Apple? Microsoft? Monopoly of technology, yes. But Google is about to have a monopoly of information. Some of that information is actually personal. I know they haven't used it to our disadvantage - yet. Who knows who will eventually own Google and do things with this knowledge about us which we didn't anticipate? Incidentally this weeks title story in Der Spiegel, the most important German news magazin, is about Google and their wisdom about us. They basically know everything about me, and I personally prefer not to let them have my personal emails as well. Google, to me, seems a bit like 1984 come true, only it isn't the government (yet) who is watching us, it is a private company. Is that any better? Ok, I didn't want to start a long and biased discussion about Google here, so ignore my comments...;-) Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Fair enough re monopolies: we are financially raped in Australia by the banking oligopoly and obviously a monopoly has greater potential for problems. However I have the same basic system as you for my mail (not finalelist). I access email via google/pOP. When an email is downloaded to the home computer, google archives it into the archive folder. This is great because if away from my computer, or accessing via iphone or web, old email can be searched, but meanwhile there remains the convenience of pop mail having been downloaded if at home. Plus if the computer crashes all emails are still on the server and not all lost. My 2c Matthew Sent from my iPhone On 11/01/2010, at 7:55 PM, Johannes Gebauer li...@musikmanufaktur.com wrote: Am 10.01.10 20:32, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: Well, what are you using that isn't a Monopoly? Apple? Microsoft? Monopoly of technology, yes. But Google is about to have a monopoly of information. Some of that information is actually personal. I know they haven't used it to our disadvantage - yet. Who knows who will eventually own Google and do things with this knowledge about us which we didn't anticipate? Incidentally this weeks title story in Der Spiegel, the most important German news magazin, is about Google and their wisdom about us. They basically know everything about me, and I personally prefer not to let them have my personal emails as well. Google, to me, seems a bit like 1984 come true, only it isn't the government (yet) who is watching us, it is a private company. Is that any better? Ok, I didn't want to start a long and biased discussion about Google here, so ignore my comments...;-) Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Honestly, Google can gather information about my email. There is nothing interesting in there. I'd be more concerned with the global banking monopoly that existsbut that is me. I think there were a number of suggestions on how to use both IMAP and POP, or use IMAP in a way similar to how you are using POP right now. And these things are possible using Thunderbird as well (which I use). So... On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 12:55 AM, Johannes Gebauer li...@musikmanufaktur.com wrote: Am 10.01.10 20:32, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: Well, what are you using that isn't a Monopoly? Apple? Microsoft? Monopoly of technology, yes. But Google is about to have a monopoly of information. Some of that information is actually personal. I know they haven't used it to our disadvantage - yet. Who knows who will eventually own Google and do things with this knowledge about us which we didn't anticipate? Incidentally this weeks title story in Der Spiegel, the most important German news magazin, is about Google and their wisdom about us. They basically know everything about me, and I personally prefer not to let them have my personal emails as well. Google, to me, seems a bit like 1984 come true, only it isn't the government (yet) who is watching us, it is a private company. Is that any better? Ok, I didn't want to start a long and biased discussion about Google here, so ignore my comments...;-) Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 11.01.10 16:08, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I think there were a number of suggestions on how to use both IMAP and POP, or use IMAP in a way similar to how you are using POP right now. And these things are possible using Thunderbird as well (which I use). Yes, thanks for all the tips, I am still thinking about the best approach. Perhaps I will test an IMAP approach for everything, the problem is that I don't quite understand the functionality of some of it. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
The best I can offer is their URL. The discussion was an entire article in their how-to section of the current February issue of the magazine. http://www.maclife.com/ I've found that a lot of these magazine editors are very helpful when anyone has questions about this sort of process. Michael mmathew_musicp...@comcast.net mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl Phone and Fax: 503 641 6127 - Original Message - From: Johannes Gebauer li...@musikmanufaktur.com To: finale@shsu.edu Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 12:39:31 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP Am 10.01.10 22:55, schrieb mmathew1...@comcast.net: There is an article in the current issue of macilife wherein they seem to be discussing this topic on page 88 and ƒ. Does this help? So what does it say? I haven't got access to MacLife. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
On Sun, January 10, 2010 9:12 am, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Perhaps I am missing something, but does IMAP allow me to use it like POP with only added convenience, or am I then required to keep everything on the server all the time? I'll give you the simple answer by example. I use both. I check most mail via IMAP so I can reach it pretty much anywhere, and sort it into just a few mailboxes. That mail, for the time being, stays on the server. Mail that I answer via IMAP is Bcc'd to myself so I have a copy. This message, for example, is being answered via IMAP, but will Bcc to my address so that I have a copy with the same time stamp. When I'm ready to grab the mail that I want to keep, I move everything back to the IMAP inbox, mark it as unread, and run my POP mail program (where I have all my email since 1993). It downloads automatically deletes everything on the server's inbox. The other boxes are untouched, so I can keep mail stored there temporarily. Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 15:26, schrieb Dennis Bathory-Kitsz: When I'm ready to grab the mail that I want to keep, I move everything back to the IMAP inbox, mark it as unread, and run my POP mail program (where I have all my email since 1993). It downloads automatically deletes everything on the server's inbox. The other boxes are untouched, so I can keep mail stored there temporarily. Seems rather a lot of extra work: You have to first move everything back to the inbox and mark it unread? Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
On Sun, January 10, 2010 9:59 am, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Seems rather a lot of extra work: You have to first move everything back to the inbox and mark it unread? Depends on your IMAP interface, I guess. I only have two other mailboxes (Delayed Followup and Temp -- one is stuff I'm done with, the other things I have to answer). For me it's a just a few clicks: change to Delayed Followup, toggle all, move mail to inbox, change to Temp, toggle all, move mail to inbox, change to inbox, toggle all, mark unread. Then I'm ready to download. (Mark unread isn't necessary depending on your POP client.) Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
I'd say go imap. Get a gmail account. You can set up folders and what not. Computers (multiple) and iPhones can use the account via imap, and all your messages will be there. Plus gmail can also function as an exchange server service for the iPhone, and immediately beep the phone when you get mail. I don't think yahoo or other services have the exchange function, but they too offer imap which will work with the iPhone. I dunno, I haven't used pop mail ina decade? I've always used imap because I like to keep my mail all synced up between home and the studio, and since 2007 on the road. --- send out and aboot on my iPhone --- On Jan 10, 2010, at 6:12 AM, Johannes Gebauer li...@musikmanufaktur.com wrote: I this really has only very remotely to do with Finale. On the other hand it has to do with the Finale mailing list, so perhaps there will be some clever person here with some answers. I currently use several email accounts as POP accounts. All the mail gets downloaded to my computer, and deleted on the server. On my computer the mail is sorted. so that Finale list mail goes into the Finale list folder and so on. I have been living quite happily with this arrangement. Other than list mail I don't usually delete mail at all, and I keep all these emails in my email application. I estimate the amount of email on all my accounts, including the complete sent-mail folders (which I never empty, so I still have every single email I ever wrote) to be around 5 emails. Add to that the Finale list, which I erase sporadically. Usually I empty the folder after a few months, but I have been lazy lately, so it has filled up with almost 1 mails. I have a few other mailing lists I subscribe to, but none as active as Finale. Now something has changed: Santa gave me a nice little iPhone, and I am happily writing emails from it, too. And questions came up. Would IMAP serve me better? One of the reasons I started thinking about this is the Finale mail which I'd love to at least sort into a folder. The only way to do this on the iPhone is to use IMAP and do it on the server. I can work out how all of this functions, but surely it is not practical to keep thousands of emails on the server? Is there a way to have IMAP emails live on only on my computer after a certain period of time, say a few days for Finale, and perhaps a month for personal email, yet never lose anything completely? Perhaps I am missing something, but does IMAP allow me to use it like POP with only added convenience, or am I then required to keep everything on the server all the time? Perhaps someone with similar needs can give me some advice. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 19:03, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I'd say go imap. Get a gmail account. You can set up folders and what not. Computers (multiple) and iPhones can use the account via imap, and all your messages will be there. Plus gmail can also function as an exchange server service for the iPhone, and immediately beep the phone when you get mail. I don't think yahoo or other services have the exchange function, but they too offer imap which will work with the iPhone. I dunno, I haven't used pop mail ina decade? I've always used imap because I like to keep my mail all synced up between home and the studio, and since 2007 on the road. How many emails do you keep in your google account? I am certainly not going google, but IMAP is an option... Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Tens of thousands of messages. If not close to 100,000. I have emails going back to 1997 on there, plus interesting messages I've saved from the 40 or so lists I am on (Flute, Klarinet, etc). I don't know why you wouldn't consider Google mail. It works amazingly well. And it's free. And the exchange option is great. Apple also offers mobileme.com which is really great too, and it keeps your bookmarks and contact information synced between the iphone and computers. You don't need to attach the iPhone to iTune or anything. Though it costs $99 a year, I find it invaluable to have. On 1/10/10 10:14 AM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Am 10.01.10 19:03, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I'd say go imap. Get a gmail account. You can set up folders and what not. Computers (multiple) and iPhones can use the account via imap, and all your messages will be there. Plus gmail can also function as an exchange server service for the iPhone, and immediately beep the phone when you get mail. I don't think yahoo or other services have the exchange function, but they too offer imap which will work with the iPhone. I dunno, I haven't used pop mail ina decade? I've always used imap because I like to keep my mail all synced up between home and the studio, and since 2007 on the road. How many emails do you keep in your google account? I am certainly not going google, but IMAP is an option... Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
On Sun, January 10, 2010 1:14 pm, Johannes Gebauer wrote: I am certainly not going google, but IMAP is an option... Johannes, Does your musikmanufaktur.com web host not offer both IMAP and POP for the same account? If so, you can have the benefits of both -- IMAP as needed, POP for archiving locally. That's what I'm using and, like Eric, find using IMAP with my phone an easy task on the road. Yes, I have Gmail as a rarely-used backup account, but hate its interface (it can also be accessed via POP, as I understand). The options today are fairly extensive. (I don't use IMAP exclusively because I simply don't trust distant servers to preserve my mail. I have an investment in that archive; they don't.) Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 19:29, schrieb Dennis Bathory-Kitsz: Does your musikmanufaktur.com web host not offer both IMAP and POP for the same account? If so, you can have the benefits of both -- IMAP as needed, POP for archiving locally. That's what I'm using and, like Eric, find using IMAP with my phone an easy task on the road. As far as I can see it cannot be used at the same time unless you unsort the mail before using the pop access. That sort of defeats the purpose, no? Yes, all my accounts can use both pop and IMAP access. I am currently doing mostly what you suggest, but I can't really use the benefits of IMAP when I then load everything onto the computer via POP. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 19:20, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I don't know why you wouldn't consider Google mail. It works amazingly well. And it's free. And the exchange option is great. Apple also offers mobileme.com which is really great too, and it keeps your bookmarks and contact information synced between the iphone and computers. You don't need to attach the iPhone to iTune or anything. Though it costs $99 a year, I find it invaluable to have. So what is so special about Google mail? I don't like the idea of monopolies at all, and Google is doing everything to get monopolies, no? Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
POP mail can be set to delete itself from the server after a specified amount of time. I don't see why you could not just set everything to IMAP, and create local folders on your computer and drag and drop the messages you want to savethen you wouldn't have to worry about this whole POP/IMAP thing On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 11:22 AM, Johannes Gebauer li...@musikmanufaktur.com wrote: As far as I can see it cannot be used at the same time unless you unsort the mail before using the pop access. That sort of defeats the purpose, no? Yes, all my accounts can use both pop and IMAP access. I am currently doing mostly what you suggest, but I can't really use the benefits of IMAP when I then load everything onto the computer via POP. Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Well, what are you using that isn't a Monopoly? Apple? Microsoft? I use Google Mail cause it is robust. Millions of people use it. They provide lots of storage. They aren't going to disappear. And they had just one blip in their service since they started (last year, like 1/2 a day). And again it's free, and you don't see the ads if you use it through your email program or the iphone. On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 11:16 AM, Johannes Gebauer li...@musikmanufaktur.com wrote: Am 10.01.10 19:20, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I don't know why you wouldn't consider Google mail. It works amazingly well. And it's free. And the exchange option is great. Apple also offers mobileme.com which is really great too, and it keeps your bookmarks and contact information synced between the iphone and computers. You don't need to attach the iPhone to iTune or anything. Though it costs $99 a year, I find it invaluable to have. So what is so special about Google mail? I don't like the idea of monopolies at all, and Google is doing everything to get monopolies, no? Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
On Sun, January 10, 2010 2:22 pm, Johannes Gebauer wrote: As far as I can see it cannot be used at the same time unless you unsort the mail before using the pop access. That sort of defeats the purpose, no? Yes, I understand. I don't really worry about sorting until I download, which I generally do nightly. On the road, yes, I do sort into a handful of separate mailboxes. When I'm home I move them to the inbox one at a time for POP download. Yes, all my accounts can use both pop and IMAP access. I am currently doing mostly what you suggest, but I can't really use the benefits of IMAP when I then load everything onto the computer via POP. Got it. I don't really like IMAP -- the only reason I use it at all is because my POP mail is accessed from and stored on my laptop (with external backup) and I don't use the laptop for 'real' work at home. When I use the laptop at home (such as for POP download), I VNC to it. Otherwise it's never touched except for travel. Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 20:40, schrieb Dennis Bathory-Kitsz: Got it. I don't really like IMAP -- the only reason I use it at all is because my POP mail is accessed from and stored on my laptop (with external backup) and I don't use the laptop for 'real' work at home. When I use the laptop at home (such as for POP download), I VNC to it. Otherwise it's never touched except for travel. So when you are using email at home you don't have direct access to your mail database? Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
Am 10.01.10 20:29, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I don't see why you could not just set everything to IMAP, and create local folders on your computer and drag and drop the messages you want to savethen you wouldn't have to worry about this whole POP/IMAP thing Drag and drop? That seems like an enormous step backwards after automatic sorting. You know, other than automatic sorting, I am so lazy about moving messages by hand that I have close to 1 messages in my inbox. I guess setting pop mail to leave things on the server for a specified amount of time will serve some purpose, however, it doesn't solve the problem of folder sorting. It seems rather inconvenient to have all those Finale messages along with some other mail in the same inbox. I guess I could make an account just for Finale... Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
On Sun, January 10, 2010 3:03 pm, Johannes Gebauer wrote: So when you are using email at home you don't have direct access to your mail database? Yes. I use VNC to operate the laptop from my desktop (screen-in-screen, with cross-computer copy/paste of text, etc.) Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
There is an article in the current issue of macilife wherein they seem to be discussing this topic on page 88 and ƒ. Does this help? Michael mmathew_musicp...@comcast.net mmathew_musicp...@yahoo.com http://www.musicengravers.com/cgi-bin/engravers.pl Phone and Fax: 503 641 6127 - Original Message - From: Dennis Bathory-Kitsz bath...@maltedmedia.com To: finale@shsu.edu Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 12:35:28 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP On Sun, January 10, 2010 3:03 pm, Johannes Gebauer wrote: So when you are using email at home you don't have direct access to your mail database? Yes. I use VNC to operate the laptop from my desktop (screen-in-screen, with cross-computer copy/paste of text, etc.) Dennis ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
Re: [Finale] Completely OT: IMAP vs POP
What mail client are you using? In Apple Mail, it is very easy to have both online (IMAP) folders and On My Mac folders, with automatic rules to handle sorting to each. You could have a rule that moved all messages older than 30 days from your (online) inbox to your (offline) inbox archive, for instance. And obviously you could keep your Finale mail separate from the rest of your inbox. I have been doing this sort of thing for years now. Cheers, - DJA - WEB: http://secretsociety.typepad.com On 10 Jan 2010, at 3:01 PM, Johannes Gebauer wrote: Am 10.01.10 20:29, schrieb Eric Dannewitz: I don't see why you could not just set everything to IMAP, and create local folders on your computer and drag and drop the messages you want to savethen you wouldn't have to worry about this whole POP/IMAP thing Drag and drop? That seems like an enormous step backwards after automatic sorting. You know, other than automatic sorting, I am so lazy about moving messages by hand that I have close to 1 messages in my inbox. I guess setting pop mail to leave things on the server for a specified amount of time will serve some purpose, however, it doesn't solve the problem of folder sorting. It seems rather inconvenient to have all those Finale messages along with some other mail in the same inbox. I guess I could make an account just for Finale... Johannes ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale ___ Finale mailing list Finale@shsu.edu http://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
