Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On Thu, 2006-10-19 at 09:52 -0400, Robert McGwier wrote: Bob Cowdery wrote: On Wed, 2006-10-18 at 19:20 -0500, KE5EUP wrote: I'd like to have: 1. A platform independent GUI. 2. An IDE that makes GUI development nice (i.e. NOT VC6 style). I think one should consider in all this the push into distribution with Erlang which frees up each node to be in the appropriate language for the appropriate platform. One size fits all is no longer a limiting factor. The GUI layer 'should' be thin and easily redeveloped in multiple guises. 73 de Bob Amen. This was a somewhat throw-away remark at the time which I didn't substantiate and no one challenged. I know people have been interested in the past in easier ways of getting involved and in general that means high level dynamic languages which are interactive and hide away that edit/compile/run cycle. This is a back-to-the-future moment where I can leverage what went before into the erlink-sr system. If you missed it or thought the earlier post irrelevant there is an intro at http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/g3ukb/ . I effectively have a UI API which I can package up quite easily into a library that can be used from Squeak and Python. I do believe in using the best language for the job and... - Erlang is wonderful for the infrastructure. - C is undoubtedly the best for DSP and arguable HW Control. - C with GTK+ is good for a high performance GUI. - Python is good for those quick automated processes and pieces of GUI in GTK+ or wxWindows. - Squeak Smalltalk is a great scripting environment and general playground. In effect Python and Squeak will be able to connect and play as erlang nodes against an API that will be exposed in their own language. For those who played with Squeak before there is 3.9 out which is a huge improvement in look and feel, less like a toy shop and more like a professional piece of work. I plan to work over the next few weeks on some shortcomings in the framework and on the Squeak plug-in adaptor (Python will come later). 73 de Bob ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
I offered this code as an example of a 2.0 port. I bailed out on it in March, since it was very time consuming, and there was absolutely no resonance with the folks on the reflector. It started as a kind of jigsaw project, just sorting the pieces into object categories, would need to be refactored a couple of times to perfect the design. My job is writing windows system software and GUIs in c#. I presented the radio, and the 2.0 modifications to the console, at a code camp. The settings dialog is mostly done, but the main console incomplete. It works however, and once you get into the code you can see what the console needs for completion. I found that data binding for some of the controls was too slow, so I created special handling for the frequency display, etc. I really encourage you to follow the data binding system in 2.0. http://www.cyberplasm.com/temp/xmldemo.zip === Well, the first place I would start is to open the Console project file in C# Express and let it convert the project - then start fixing the problems with .NET 1.1 to .NET 2.0 from there. In SVN the DLLs needed are already there (in binary form) so you should not need to be concerned with them at this point. The main task is getting the GUI code (The Console) ported over to .NET 2. If I had infinite time I would get something set up to start from, but I don't, so someone else will have to volunteer to get it started. ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On Wed, 2006-10-18 at 19:20 -0500, KE5EUP wrote: I'd like to have: 1. A platform independent GUI. 2. An IDE that makes GUI development nice (i.e. NOT VC6 style). I think one should consider in all this the push into distribution with Erlang which frees up each node to be in the appropriate language for the appropriate platform. One size fits all is no longer a limiting factor. The GUI layer 'should' be thin and easily redeveloped in multiple guises. 73 de Bob ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
IF you wanted to maximise the SDR1000 group participation in programming I'd say that the design architecture is paramount and would lead onto choosing the programming language(s) to suit the structure best. As a family man with limited time for hobbies I'd like to be able to develop a small chunk of code - most conveniently (say) written as a DLL - plonk it into one of several directories known to the new Flexradio software - run the radio and notice that my new feature appeared on the drop-down options already present on the radio. That new feature could be written in any language most suited to the task. e.g. Managing text in a smart data decoder versus say weak signal detection. You've got to ask - where would I like to be able to break into the signal and control flow for future experimentation? How to achieve that so that non-professional programmers will be able to write useful stuff and bolt it all together without needing a doctorate in computer science? Whatever you choose, I'd say make sure the interfaces are there, and that they are no more complicated than required - to open up the development to the 'digitally challenged' group ( me for instance!) Regards, Bob Edwards, G4BBY ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
Eric wrote on 10/10/06 We ARE NOT planning on using the same tools for the future versions of the software. Rather, we will use FREE TOOLS. We have not settled 100% on what those free tools will be, but right Visual Studio 2005 Express versions are looking to be the best pick for the windows GUI. Obviously we'd like to have a cross platform GUI, but have yet to find a set of libraries/tools that rival the ease-of-use and efficiency of Visual Studio's tools. -Tim --- Integrated Technical Services Too much of everything is just enough. -Rob Barlow -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Flanders Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 10:12 AM To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) Could someone from the software team give us an update on the search for the new set of tools. Does it look promising? Any estimate of when might we be able to switch over (if ever)? Jerry W4UK At 03:37 10/18/2006, Ken Klein wrote: Rick; I'm waiting for the version that uses the free tools, which should be coming soon. I don't want to invest in current tools if they are going to be obsolete in the near future. But you're right; getting into the code is going to be interesting. Ken WR5H -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard Stasiak Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 7:52 PM To: FlexRadio reflector Subject: [Flexradio] PowerSDR Open Source Fan This is a personal anecdote written to thank Flex for deciding to make PowerSDR open source and to encourage other non-software types like me to experiment with the code. ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
I have the same question. I also have been thinking of tuning up my programming skills. (It's been 8 years). I will happily purchase whatever software tools are necessary but if those tools are going to change in the near future then I'll wait. Are we talking months or years? Mark NU6X Sedona,AZ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Flanders Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 7:12 AM To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) Could someone from the software team give us an update on the search for the new set of tools. Does it look promising? Any estimate of when might we be able to switch over (if ever)? Jerry W4UK At 03:37 10/18/2006, Ken Klein wrote: Rick; I'm waiting for the version that uses the free tools, which should be coming soon. I don't want to invest in current tools if they are going to be obsolete in the near future. But you're right; getting into the code is going to be interesting. Ken WR5H -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard Stasiak Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 7:52 PM To: FlexRadio reflector Subject: [Flexradio] PowerSDR Open Source Fan This is a personal anecdote written to thank Flex for deciding to make PowerSDR open source and to encourage other non-software types like me to experiment with the code. ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
Thanks, Tim Yes, many of us noticed Eric's post several days ago. That post is what prompted my question, because it has the effect of stopping any of us from purchasing and proceeding with the current tools. Jerry W4UK At 14:49 10/18/2006, Tim Ellison wrote: Eric wrote on 10/10/06 We ARE NOT planning on using the same tools for the future versions of the software. Rather, we will use FREE TOOLS. We have not settled 100% on what those free tools will be, but right Visual Studio 2005 Express versions are looking to be the best pick for the windows GUI. Obviously we'd like to have a cross platform GUI, but have yet to find a set of libraries/tools that rival the ease-of-use and efficiency of Visual Studio's tools. -Tim --- Integrated Technical Services Too much of everything is just enough. -Rob Barlow -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jerry Flanders Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 10:12 AM To: flexradio@flex-radio.biz Subject: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) Could someone from the software team give us an update on the search for the new set of tools. Does it look promising? Any estimate of when might we be able to switch over (if ever)? Jerry W4UK At 03:37 10/18/2006, Ken Klein wrote: Rick; I'm waiting for the version that uses the free tools, which should be coming soon. I don't want to invest in current tools if they are going to be obsolete in the near future. But you're right; getting into the code is going to be interesting. Ken WR5H ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
At 08:36 AM 10/18/2006, Tim Ellison wrote: The release of the new version shouldn't be the primary criteria for purchasing the IDE for version 1.x I believe, that there is not going to be point in the future (if ever) where PowerSDR 1.x will not be usable with the SDR-1000 hardware. Flex has not announced an EOL (end of life) for PowerSDR 1.x. If you want to make changes to that GA software version, you will need to invest in VS 2003.NET. So, you should base you buying decision on that premise. Also, you can get them fairly cost effectively from e-bay. Before making a substantial investment of time and/or money, one might want to inquire about the support for VS2003 as time goes on. You might wind up with a development environment that only works on old unpatched versions of Windows. Fine if that's an ok environment for what you want to do, e.g. a dedicated standalone radio computer. We have a lot of dedicated systems with Win95 and even older OSes here at JPL because they were used to do some essential function 15 years ago, and because the spacecraft that was being developed at the time is still working, we have to keep them going. Or, because they control some one-of-a-kind hardware and it's cheaper to keep the old computer running than redevelop for a new platform. It can be a bit of a museum curation sort of task (for instance, we had to keep resetting the date back to the 90s to avoid a Y2K leap year problem on one HP/UX machine). James Lux, P.E. Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group Flight Communications Systems Section Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Mail Stop 161-213 4800 Oak Grove Drive Pasadena CA 91109 tel: (818)354-2075 fax: (818)393-6875 ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On 10/18/06, James Courtier-Dutton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Eric wrote on 10/10/06 We ARE NOT planning on using the same tools for the future versions of the software. Rather, we will use FREE TOOLS. We have not settled 100% on what those free tools will be, but right Visual Studio 2005 Express versions are looking to be the best pick for the windows GUI. Obviously we'd like to have a cross platform GUI, but have yet to find a set of libraries/tools that rival the ease-of-use and efficiency of Visual Studio's tools. Which tools were looked at? It would be nice if the PowerSDR gui could be built in eclipse. One could then look at running the PowerSDR gui on Linux. I believe the PowerSDR gui is written in C#. Linux can run C# programs in something called mono. dttsp already works in Linux. What else is needed to get PowerSDR gui working in both Windows and Linux? James System.Windows.Forms in Mono is still pretty much crap. It would be better to use GTK# on both Windows and Linux in Mono. If you don't want to stay in C#, then of course there is wxWindows, Qt, etc... etc... though there may be development still going on in wx.NET. 73 de Phil N8VB ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On 10/18/06, Tim Ellison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The release of the new version shouldn't be the primary criteria for purchasing the IDE for version 1.x I believe, that there is not going to be point in the future (if ever) where PowerSDR 1.x will not be usable with the SDR-1000 hardware. Flex has not announced an EOL (end of life) for PowerSDR 1.x. If you want to make changes to that GA software version, you will need to invest in VS 2003.NET. So, you should base you buying decision on that premise. Also, you can get them fairly cost effectively from e-bay. -Tim --- Integrated Technical Services Another think to think about is that someone could take up converting PowerSDR console to work with .NET 2.0. Since C# Express is free, someone could get started on this with no monetary investment in development tools. The other supporting library DLLs, like PortAudio, DttSP, FFTW, etc... can already be compiled with free compilers supplied in the .NET SDK, or someone could use the free Borland compilers (for Windows)... 73 de Phil N8VB ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
At 17:26 10/18/2006, you wrote: Another think to think about is that someone could take up converting PowerSDR console to work with .NET 2.0. Since C# Express is free, someone could get started on this with no monetary investment in development tools. The other supporting library DLLs, like PortAudio, DttSP, FFTW, etc... can already be compiled with free compilers supplied in the .NET SDK, or someone could use the free Borland compilers (for Windows)... 73 de Phil N8VB Many of us understand enough C to be able to hack a small change and push a recompile button, but the many steps required to actually set up the development tools into a software workbench (with libraries located properly, etc.) is a different - level task. Can anyone can give some details about what libraries are required, what compilers/switches they require, where to obtain sources, etc - i.e., help with setting up the workbench? Jerry W4UK ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
At 11:29 AM 10/18/2006, Philip Covington wrote: Well, the first place I would start is to open the Console project file in C# Express and let it convert the project - then start fixing the problems with .NET 1.1 to .NET 2.0 from there. You will get well over 400 warnings and errors when you load it. In SVN the DLLs needed are already there (in binary form) so you should not need to be concerned with them at this point. The main task is getting the GUI code (The Console) ported over to .NET 2. If I had infinite time I would get something set up to start from, but I don't, so someone else will have to volunteer to get it started. Phil N8VB Jim ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On 10/18/06, Bob Cowdery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 2006-10-18 at 13:20 -0400, Philip Covington wrote: On 10/18/06, James Courtier-Dutton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Eric wrote on 10/10/06 We ARE NOT planning on using the same tools for the future versions of the software. Rather, we will use FREE TOOLS. We have not settled 100% on what those free tools will be, but right Visual Studio 2005 Express versions are looking to be the best pick for the windows GUI. Obviously we'd like to have a cross platform GUI, but have yet to find a set of libraries/tools that rival the ease-of-use and efficiency of Visual Studio's tools. Which tools were looked at? It would be nice if the PowerSDR gui could be built in eclipse. One could then look at running the PowerSDR gui on Linux. I believe the PowerSDR gui is written in C#. Linux can run C# programs in something called mono. dttsp already works in Linux. What else is needed to get PowerSDR gui working in both Windows and Linux? James System.Windows.Forms in Mono is still pretty much crap. It would be better to use GTK# on both Windows and Linux in Mono. If you don't want to stay in C#, then of course there is wxWindows, Qt, etc... etc... though there may be development still going on in wx.NET. I've settled for using GTK+ on both Windows and Linux. Glade is a really nice GUI builder and the only one I've found where it's effortless to create resizable everythings and the only builder where I have been able to cut and paste whole chunks of interface between containers and windows without it throwing up it's hands in horror. It's also very cross platform. I compile it with Express on Windows without trouble. 73 de Bob I have had the same experience with GTK+. And I agree that Glade is very nice. Sounds like the plan is the Console will stay in C# though, using WinForms and .NET 2. Still if the GUI is separated out, someone can write the GUI in whatever language and with whatever toolkit they want. Phil N8VB ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
Not necessarily. I would prefer to have a cross platform solution. I have not evaluated Eclipse yet, but it sounds like it could be an alternative. Eric Wachsmann FlexRadio Systems -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] radio.biz] On Behalf Of Philip Covington Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 3:44 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: FlexList Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) ...Sounds like the plan is the Console will stay in C# though, using WinForms and .NET 2. ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On Wed, 2006-10-18 at 16:02 -0500, Eric Wachsmann wrote: Not necessarily. I would prefer to have a cross platform solution. I have not evaluated Eclipse yet, but it sounds like it could be an alternative. A cross-platform solution does not necessarily need a cross-platform IDE although of course that would be nice if there was such a thing. Eclipse is very good for Java which was its original target being Java itself. It's a little lack-luster on everything else. I've settled for just doing different builds on each platform with the best IDE for the platform. VS is very good at staying completely out the way by letting you put all the files exactly where you want so not polluting the source tree, others are not so good at that or I haven't found how yet. Bob Eric Wachsmann FlexRadio Systems -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] radio.biz] On Behalf Of Philip Covington Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 3:44 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: FlexList Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) ...Sounds like the plan is the Console will stay in C# though, using WinForms and .NET 2. ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On 10/18/06, Eric Wachsmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not necessarily. I would prefer to have a cross platform solution. I have not evaluated Eclipse yet, but it sounds like it could be an alternative. Eric Wachsmann FlexRadio Systems I thought Eclipse was a development environment. Are you talking about the possibility of writing the Console in Java? What language or GUI toolkit are you leaning towards or have you not gotten to that point yet? Phil N8VB ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
I'd like to have: 1. A platform independent GUI. 2. An IDE that makes GUI development nice (i.e. NOT VC6 style). I am not stuck on any tool or language at this point as I don't have enough information to say, This is the best tool or This is the best language. These two obviously go hand in hand. What I can say is that from a GUI support/development standpoint, I have yet to see anything that can compare to Visual Studio .NET 2003 (and this goes for 2005 as well) in terms of GUI support/development productivity. The catch is that what makes this easy has been built in .NET which is, for all practical purposes, Windows only. Eric Wachsmann FlexRadio Systems -Original Message- From: Philip Covington [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 4:12 PM To: Eric Wachsmann Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; FlexList Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) On 10/18/06, Eric Wachsmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not necessarily. I would prefer to have a cross platform solution. I have not evaluated Eclipse yet, but it sounds like it could be an alternative. Eric Wachsmann FlexRadio Systems I thought Eclipse was a development environment. Are you talking about the possibility of writing the Console in Java? What language or GUI toolkit are you leaning towards or have you not gotten to that point yet? Phil N8VB ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
On 10/18/06, Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 11:29 AM 10/18/2006, Philip Covington wrote: Well, the first place I would start is to open the Console project file in C# Express and let it convert the project - then start fixing the problems with .NET 1.1 to .NET 2.0 from there. You will get well over 400 warnings and errors when you load it. snip Jim Yep, that sounds about right...I think I got over 200 the last time I tried it 6+ months ago. It will definitely will keep the poor soul that undertakes the task busy for a while. LOL.. Phil N8VB ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
At 01:36 PM 10/18/2006, Philip Covington wrote: On 10/18/06, Jim Lux [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 11:29 AM 10/18/2006, Philip Covington wrote: Well, the first place I would start is to open the Console project file in C# Express and let it convert the project - then start fixing the problems with .NET 1.1 to .NET 2.0 from there. You will get well over 400 warnings and errors when you load it. snip Jim Yep, that sounds about right...I think I got over 200 the last time I tried it 6+ months ago. It will definitely will keep the poor soul that undertakes the task busy for a while. LOL.. I think that most are just because there's one or two key modules (I think it's mostly the thread safe control wrappers) that need to be redefined so that they appear in the correct namespaces (or that the console modules reference the right namespace). That would probably get rid of 90% of the warnings. I was going to poke at it next weekend. Phil N8VB James Lux, P.E. Spacecraft Radio Frequency Subsystems Group Flight Communications Systems Section Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Mail Stop 161-213 4800 Oak Grove Drive Pasadena CA 91109 tel: (818)354-2075 fax: (818)393-6875 ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
At 02:43 PM 10/18/2006, Eric Wachsmann wrote: I'd like to have: 1. A platform independent GUI. 2. An IDE that makes GUI development nice (i.e. NOT VC6 style). I am not stuck on any tool or language at this point as I don't have enough information to say, This is the best tool or This is the best language. These two obviously go hand in hand. What I can say is that from a GUI support/development standpoint, I have yet to see anything that can compare to Visual Studio .NET 2003 (and this goes for 2005 as well) in terms of GUI support/development productivity. The catch is that what makes this easy has been built in .NET which is, for all practical purposes, Windows only. which is why you (generically, not Eric specifically) really want a fork here. Let the Linux UI evolve in a Linux compatible way, using methods and tools that are congenial for Linux, and the Windows UI evolve using the capabilities that Windows has. The two OSes are sufficiently different that cross platform compromise solutions will be just that, compromise. There ARE some cross platform approaches which seem to be fairly powerful (e.g. Java) BUT, they have some non-zero learning curve to get going. You also need to consider whether you're genuinely interested in increasing the number of coding participants significantly (whether for contributions to the mainline code or for private experiments). That tends to push towards environments and tools that have wider existing market penetration (Windows,.NET, VS in the WinXX world, whatever the equivalents are in the Linux world..I only do GUI in Windows.. my Linux coding is all command line/script file style) Jim, W6RMK ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
Jim; Please excuse a really dumb question: Why NOT use Java??? Seems to me for an Open Source project such as this, that would be the first choice. Ken WR5H -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim Lux Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2006 5:00 PM To: Eric Wachsmann; 'Philip Covington' Cc: 'FlexList' Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan) At 02:43 PM 10/18/2006, Eric Wachsmann wrote: I'd like to have: 1. A platform independent GUI. 2. An IDE that makes GUI development nice (i.e. NOT VC6 style). I am not stuck on any tool or language at this point as I don't have enough information to say, This is the best tool or This is the best language. These two obviously go hand in hand. What I can say is that from a GUI support/development standpoint, I have yet to see anything that can compare to Visual Studio .NET 2003 (and this goes for 2005 as well) in terms of GUI support/development productivity. The catch is that what makes this easy has been built in .NET which is, for all practical purposes, Windows only. which is why you (generically, not Eric specifically) really want a fork here. Let the Linux UI evolve in a Linux compatible way, using methods and tools that are congenial for Linux, and the Windows UI evolve using the capabilities that Windows has. The two OSes are sufficiently different that cross platform compromise solutions will be just that, compromise. There ARE some cross platform approaches which seem to be fairly powerful (e.g. Java) BUT, they have some non-zero learning curve to get going. You also need to consider whether you're genuinely interested in increasing the number of coding participants significantly (whether for contributions to the mainline code or for private experiments). That tends to push towards environments and tools that have wider existing market penetration (Windows,.NET, VS in the WinXX world, whatever the equivalents are in the Linux world..I only do GUI in Windows.. my Linux coding is all command line/script file style) Jim, W6RMK ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
At 04:10 PM 10/18/2006, Ken Klein wrote: Jim; Please excuse a really dumb question: Why NOT use Java??? Seems to me for an Open Source project such as this, that would be the first choice. Not a dumb question at all. It would revolve around whether you want to have maximum portability or maximum participation. There are probably 100 (maybe 1000) times as many C programmers as Java programmers out there. Java gives you portability, but a smaller developer pool to draw from. One could argue that the developer pool for portable c is also quite small, since the implication is that you not only need to know C, but also the particular environment and libraries you're working with (e.g. .NET framework, X11, whathaveyou). So, for maximum participation, pick the programming environment with the largest pool of participants, and that's MS Windows, VC, .NET (although VB is probably actually more popular and easier, but I'd hate to try and translate PowerSDR back into VB). OTOH, if something like PowerSDR were to be rewritten in Java (by humans, not a machine translation, which would result in incomprehensible code (viz f2c)), it would provide an excellent learning environment for learning Java (it's always nice to start with something you KNOW works and make little changes). However, no skilled Java programmer has volunteered to do the port so far. And neither goal really is correlated to Open Source, which is just a matter of having the source code available, with no implication (as has been made abundantly clear to me by several Open Source afficionados) that the source is documented, understandable, readily modifiable, or even in any standard language or character set. Open Source is a necessary but not sufficient condition for public participation. And that is still different from Free (as in speech, not as in beer) software. Jim ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Q for software team (Was: PowerSDR Open Source Fan)
I have an uninformed question. What about Python? Forgive the ignorance, I have a series of books and learning it is on my short list this winter. The web site states and I quote below: Python runs on Windows, Linux/Unix, Mac OS X, OS/2, Amiga, Palm Handhelds, and Nokia mobile phones. Python has also been ported to the Java and .NET virtual machines. Al Jim Lux wrote: At 02:43 PM 10/18/2006, Eric Wachsmann wrote: I'd like to have: 1. A platform independent GUI. 2. An IDE that makes GUI development nice (i.e. NOT VC6 style). I am not stuck on any tool or language at this point as I don't have enough information to say, This is the best tool or This is the best language. These two obviously go hand in hand. What I can say is that from a GUI support/development standpoint, I have yet to see anything that can compare to Visual Studio .NET 2003 (and this goes for 2005 as well) in terms of GUI support/development productivity. The catch is that what makes this easy has been built in .NET which is, for all practical purposes, Windows only. which is why you (generically, not Eric specifically) really want a fork here. Let the Linux UI evolve in a Linux compatible way, using methods and tools that are congenial for Linux, and the Windows UI evolve using the capabilities that Windows has. The two OSes are sufficiently different that cross platform compromise solutions will be just that, compromise. There ARE some cross platform approaches which seem to be fairly powerful (e.g. Java) BUT, they have some non-zero learning curve to get going. You also need to consider whether you're genuinely interested in increasing the number of coding participants significantly (whether for contributions to the mainline code or for private experiments). That tends to push towards environments and tools that have wider existing market penetration (Windows,.NET, VS in the WinXX world, whatever the equivalents are in the Linux world..I only do GUI in Windows.. my Linux coding is all command line/script file style) Jim, W6RMK ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://www.mail-archive.com/flexradio%40flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
