[Flightgear-devel] FDMs and external atmosphere
Now that the environment subsystem can manage its own atmosphere model (at least up to 60,000 ft or so), I've added an option to use that model instead of the built-in model in each FDM (the default is still to let the FDM manage the atmosphere). If you run with fgfs --prop:/environment/params/control-fdm-atmosphere JSBSim and YASim will bypass their own atmosphere models use the values from the environment subsystem. Currently, YASim seems to be working fine with this after a few lines of code changes, but JSBSim is not. JSBSim has built-in support for an external atmosphere, and the values seem to be getting through OK (after removing some spurious set_* methods), but the trimming routine gets caught in a loop. I'd be very grateful if Tony and others could look at this and figure out what the problem might be. Why use an external atmosphere model at all? Of course we want to be able to control the atmosphere rather than always flying at the equivalent of 15 degC temperature, 28.5 inHG, and 0.00237 slugs/ft^3 density at sea level. We could do that by providing the sea-level defaults and letting the FDM's atmosphere models calculate the values at altitude (it would also require a few lines of code change), but unfortunately, the FDMs are not the only subsystems that need atmosphere information -- we also need it for the some of the instruments, for the engine model (which might not always be built-into the FDM), for cabin pressurisation, and for weather reports like the ATIS, for icing, and who knows what else. All the best, David -- David Megginson, [EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] FDMs and external atmosphere
On Wed, May 15, 2002 at 06:24:55AM -0400, David Megginson wrote: > Now that the environment subsystem can manage its own atmosphere model > (at least up to 60,000 ft or so), I've added an option to use that > model instead of the built-in model in each FDM (the default is still > to let the FDM manage the atmosphere). If you run with > > fgfs --prop:/environment/params/control-fdm-atmosphere > > JSBSim and YASim will bypass their own atmosphere models use the > values from the environment subsystem. > > Currently, YASim seems to be working fine with this after a few lines > of code changes, but JSBSim is not. JSBSim has built-in support for > an external atmosphere, and the values seem to be getting through OK > (after removing some spurious set_* methods), but the trimming routine > gets caught in a loop. I'd be very grateful if Tony and others could > look at this and figure out what the problem might be. > > Why use an external atmosphere model at all? Of course we want to be > able to control the atmosphere rather than always flying at the > equivalent of 15 degC temperature, 28.5 inHG, and 0.00237 slugs/ft^3 > density at sea level. We could do that by providing the sea-level > defaults and letting the FDM's atmosphere models calculate the values > at altitude (it would also require a few lines of code change), but > unfortunately, the FDMs are not the only subsystems that need > atmosphere information -- we also need it for the some of the > instruments, for the engine model (which might not always be > built-into the FDM), for cabin pressurisation, and for weather reports > like the ATIS, for icing, and who knows what else. > Are there any plans for adding support for the interesting bits of weather to this model? (ie, storms, realistic winds that actually relate to the rest of the weather model, etc) There seemed to be support for them in the CM weather stuff, and it seems a little redundant to be adding a new, less capable model when there's one already there . . . Simon -- PGP public key Id 0x144A991C, or ftp://bg77.anu.edu.au/pub/himi/himi.asc (crappy) Homepage: http://bg77.anu.edu.au doe #237 (see http://www.lemuria.org/DeCSS) My DeCSS mirror: ftp://bg77.anu.edu.au/pub/mirrors/css/ msg06064/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
RE: [Flightgear-devel] FDMs and external atmosphere
> Are there any plans for adding support for the interesting bits of > weather to this model? (ie, storms, realistic winds that actually > relate to the rest of the weather model, etc) Yes. We've got hooks in JSBSim to add in the effects of turbulence, but the math model driver for turbulence can be complicated. It's being worked on, albeit slowly. Jon smime.p7s Description: application/pkcs7-signature
Re: [Flightgear-devel] FDMs and external atmosphere
Simon Fowler writes: > Are there any plans for adding support for the interesting bits of > weather to this model? (ie, storms, realistic winds that actually > relate to the rest of the weather model, etc) We cannot do fully realistic winds, at least not with the amount of computing power available to us today. FGEnvironment does support gusting winds, not just in theory but in practice (i.e. they bounce the plane around and knock it off course) -- that's something we didn't have before. > There seemed to be support for them in the CM weather stuff, and it > seems a little redundant to be adding a new, less capable model when > there's one already there . . . WeatherCM currently has a bitbucket to hold the bounds of a thunderstorm and a random calculation for lightning probability, but that's only a tiny step -- most of the actual work of modelling thunderstorms (and other weather phenomena) needs to be done for either weather subsystem. All the best, David -- David Megginson, [EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] FDMs and external atmosphere
Jon Berndt writes: > Yes. We've got hooks in JSBSim to add in the effects of turbulence, but > the math model driver for turbulence can be complicated. It's being worked > on, albeit slowly. When you're ready, let me know, and I'll add a normalized turbulence value (0:1) to FGEnvironment. Ditto for YASim (i.e. I'll add it as soon as *any* FDM supports turbulence). By the way, one of my more immediate goals is adding variable winds as a complement to gusting winds. I might also add variability for up/down drafts. All the best, David -- David Megginson, [EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Source code Documentation
hi all is there any documentation for FGFS source code? if there exist any i will be glad to send me its address. with the best wishes Ali jafari. __ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Environment subsystem status
David Megginson wrote: > > Currently, the environment subsystem manages the following properties: > > /environment/visibility-m > /environment/temperature-sea-level-degc > /environment/temperature-degc > /environment/pressure-sea-level-inhg > /environment/pressure-inhg > /environment/density-sea-level-slugft3 > /environment/density-slugft3 > /environment/wind-from-heading-deg > /environment/wind-speed-kt > /environment/wind-from-north-fps > /environment/wind-from-east-fps > /environment/wind-from-down-fps Great that we've got a standard place for these properties now. But I'm really concerned that these values aren't in SI units. So most of the world (except the US and perhaps a few other countries) can't use those units anymore without big research (aks somebody around here what a 'slug' is... [*I* know it, but that doesn't count]). And there are already 1.5 - 2 FDMs that use SI units (BalloonSim and much more important YASim). If a FDM wants to use obscure units internally (e.g. because the developers are use to them) that's their choice. But when we have very universal data that a lot of people need (users, panel programmers, ...) we should use an international standard. CU, Christian -- The idea is to die young as late as possible.-- Ashley Montague Whoever that is/was; (c) by Douglas Adams would have been better... ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
* Christian Mayer -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 17:39: > David Megginson wrote: > > /environment/pressure-inhg > > /environment/density-sea-level-slugft3 [...] > But I'm really concerned that these values aren't in SI units. > > So most of the world (except the US and perhaps a few other countries) > can't use those units anymore without big research (aks somebody around > here what a 'slug' is... [*I* know it, but that doesn't count]). ACK! I don't. Given that 90 percent of the world and 100 percent of the science community use SI units, "inhg" and "slugft3" make as much sense as "5 bananas long", "4 coconuts heavy", ... no actually, they make less sense. I =know= how long a banana typically is. ;-) m. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
On Wednesday 15 May 2002 12:12 pm, Melchior FRANZ wrote: > * Christian Mayer -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 17:39: > > David Megginson wrote: > > > /environment/pressure-inhg > > > /environment/density-sea-level-slugft3 > > [...] > > > But I'm really concerned that these values aren't in SI units. > > > > So most of the world (except the US and perhaps a few other countries) > > can't use those units anymore without big research (aks somebody around > > here what a 'slug' is... [*I* know it, but that doesn't count]). > > ACK! I don't. Given that 90 percent of the world and 100 percent of the > science community use SI units, "inhg" and "slugft3" make as much > sense as "5 bananas long", "4 coconuts heavy", ... no actually, they > make less sense. I =know= how long a banana typically is. ;-) > > m. > You must have went to the same uni as the Professor on Gilligans Island ;) > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Environment subsystem status
Christian Mayer wrote: > And there are already 1.5 - 2 FDMs that use SI units (BalloonSim and > much more important YASim). Woo hoo! Just a few short months in the source tree and already YASim is *much* more important than BaloonSim. World domination, here I come! As far as the SI vs. English units go, I restate my declared neutrality. While doing calculations *in* SI units is much safer and easier, I also see the advantages to representing them externally in traditional units. Typical (North American, anyway) altimeters still report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... Panel authors are in a poorer position to do the conversion than the FDM folks are. Andy -- Andrew J. RossNextBus Information Systems Senior Software Engineer Emeryville, CA [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.nextbus.com "Men go crazy in conflagrations. They only get better one by one." - Sting (misquoted) ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Environment subsystem status
Christian Mayer writes: > Great that we've got a standard place for these properties now. > > But I'm really concerned that these values aren't in SI units. > > So most of the world (except the US and perhaps a few other countries) > can't use those units anymore without big research (aks somebody around > here what a 'slug' is... [*I* know it, but that doesn't count]). I have no objection personally to doing everything in SI -- I'm Canadian, so I'm very used to metric. When we've had this discussion before, however, most developers were very strongly opposed to standardizing on SI internally, and it's certainly true that even in Canada (which switched to metric in the 1970s) we still use feet, inches of mercury, knots, and statute miles for aviation-related weather (but a Canadian ATIS broadcast *will* use celsius for temperature). In the end, I'm probably going to make the properties available in several flavours, so the main question will be what's used internally. It's not just a matter of SI vs. Imperial -- for example, for temperature we have to choose among Celsius, Kelvin, Fahrenheit, and Rankine, while for pressure, we have atmospheres, bar, mbar, inHg, inH2O, kgf/m^2, Pa, lbf/ft^2, mmHg, and many others. Yech. > If a FDM wants to use obscure units internally (e.g. because the > developers are use to them) that's their choice. But when we have > very universal data that a lot of people need (users, panel > programmers, ...) we should use an international standard. I agree with the principle, but note that the aircraft panel instruments give the altitude in feet, not meters, the altimeter will be calibrated for inches of mercury, not pascals, and the airspeed will be in knots (or possibly statute mph), not kph -- using SI internally will force a lot of conversions. I'm sure that there exist SI aircraft panels somewhere, but I have not yet seen photos of any in general aviation. All the best, David -- David Megginson, [EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
* Andy Ross -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 18:44: > Typical (North American, anyway) altimeters still > report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... Same here. But please don't tell me that US meteorologist work with slugft3. PS: I withdraw my estimatian that 90% of the world are using SI-units. I bet the Chinese have some silly non-standard units on their own. :-P m. -- "Computers in the future may perhaps only weigh 1.5 tons" -- Magazine "Popular Mechanics", 1949 ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Environment subsystem status
On Wed, 15 May 2002 12:52:39 -0400 David Megginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >I have no objection personally to doing everything in SI -- I'm >Canadian, so I'm very used to metric. I wish that the U.S. had standardized on metric, and that I had grown up on it, and that everything we use was based on metric - that would make it easier for all of us. Unfortunately that's not the case. I also wish that a kilogram was always a unit of mass and was not used as a unit of weight (force). Since much of our data that we build up aircraft models on is found in English units, we'd have to spend time converting that - and potentially introducing errors. I sympathize with SI users - it's a generally good system. But in the real world we've got to use what we're given - reality is not so nicely ordered. Jon ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
--- Melchior FRANZ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > * Andy Ross -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 18:44: > > Typical (North American, anyway) altimeters still > > report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... > > Same here. But please don't tell me that US > meteorologist work > with slugft3. Don't be so quick to slight slugs, feet, etc. The fundamental units of each system are ***arbitrarily*** defined and, because of that each system requires everybody to agree on a common set of arbitrary definitions. The only real advantage that SI has over any other is that scaling is done in powers of ten and a system of prefixes define those scales. So: Meters are not better than feet, just different. Kilograms are not better than slugs, just different. (yes, SI defines a scaled unit as the standard for mass) Liters are not better than gallons, just different. etc. etc. etc. > PS: I withdraw my estimatian that 90% of the world > are using SI-units. > I bet the Chinese have some silly non-standard units > on their own. :-P > > m. > > > > -- > "Computers in the future may perhaps only weigh 1.5 > tons" > -- Magazine "Popular > Mechanics", 1949 > > > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel > > __ Do You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience http://launch.yahoo.com ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
* Tony Peden -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 19:47: > Meters are not better than feet, just different. [...] Yes, obviously. It's the words "international" and "standard" that make the difference. But these a quite essential details. And it would be quite poor if US universities taught anything else than SI units. Except aeronautics, that is. And that's another hard to deny detail: These weird anachronistic imperial units =are= some international standard in this area ... (only). And this will hardly change any time soon. Moving over is simply too dangerous. It's like convincing Britains to drive at the right side. (Well, we all know, that the left side is the right side, anyway. ;-) m. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Proposed Environment Property Reorg
The /environment subtree is designed to capture weather at a particular place and time rather than general weather trends, but even then, it's getting fairly crowded. There is already an /environment/clouds/ subtree that is not (yet)managed by the environment subsystem -- how would everyone feel about a reorg to add three more subtrees (for now; more to follow)? 1. /environment/atmosphere/ 2. /environment/visibility/ 3. /environment/wind/ With the separate subtrees, it would be easier to add metric (and Imperial) alternatives without crowding any one branch too much, so we could have (for example) /environment/atmosphere/temperature-degc /environment/atmosphere/temperature-degf /environment/atmosphere/temperature-degk /environment/atmosphere/temperature-degr I also think that it might be a good idea to add a ./base/ sub-subtree within each /environment/*/ subtree. This would contain configuration information or bounds for the weather *at this particular time* -- for example, if winds are 14kt gusting 20kt (as they are right now in Ottawa), then the current wind speed might be 17kt, but the limits apply to right now as well -- that's what you'd get from the ATIS. For the atmosphere, the base/ sub-subtree would contain the sea-level density, pressure, and temperature. Note that the base/ tree does not represent future or past weather trends, or weather that will appear at other locations; instead, it represents only the margin of variability at the particular moment. With this change, we'd end up with something like this: /environment/atmosphere/temperature-degc /environment/atmosphere/pressure-inhg /environment/atmosphere/density-slugft3 /environment/atmosphere/base/temperature-sea-level-degc /environment/atmosphere/base/pressure-sea-level-inhg /environment/atmosphere/base/density-sea-level-slugft3 /environment/visibility/visibility-m /environment/visibility/base/min-visibility-m /environment/visibility/base/max-visibility-m /environment/wind/wind-from-north-fps /environment/wind/wind-from-east-fps /environment/wind/wind-from-down-fps /environment/wind/wind-from-heading-deg /environment/wind/wind-speed-kt /environment/wind/turbulence-norm /environment/wind/base/min-wind-speed-kt /environment/wind/base/max-wind-speed-kt /environment/wind/base/min-wind-from-heading-deg /environment/wind/base/max-wind-from-heading-deg /environment/wind/base/min-downdraft-fps /environment/wind/base/max-downdraft-fps /environment/wind/base/min-turbulence-norm /environment/wind/base/max-turbulence-norm Later on, we'd fix up /environment/clouds/ and add /environment/precipitation/, etc., as we are able to support them. Longer-term trends (like storms, clearing or clouding weather, etc.) would be handled elsewhere. Comments? Everything in here except turbulence is already supported by FlightGear -- it's just a matter of renaming properties. I added turbulence because Jon is promising support RSN. Thanks, David -- David Megginson, [EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.megginson.com/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
On Wed, May 15, 2002 at 10:47:03AM -0700, Tony Peden wrote: > > --- Melchior FRANZ <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > * Andy Ross -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 18:44: > > > Typical (North American, anyway) altimeters still > > > report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... > > > > Same here. But please don't tell me that US > > meteorologist work > > with slugft3. > > Don't be so quick to slight slugs, feet, etc. > > The fundamental units of each system are > ***arbitrarily*** defined and, because of that > each system requires everybody to agree on a > common set of arbitrary definitions. I wish it was that simple. After moving to Canada, I was doing an off the cuff calculation and said '1 gallon of water is roughly 8lbs'. Imagine my surprise when everyone in the room disagreed with me, saying a gallon weighs 10lb. All was made well when I was reminded that Canadians use imperial gallons. Aaargh. SI is a real international standard, while 'english' units are just a mess. Of course, I am constantly reminded of my US background when I tell the Scouts in my troop to cut a 6' piece of line and get blank stares. They want me to say 2m. At the same time almost none of them can tell me their 'weight' in kilograms. -- James (Jay) Treacy [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: stupid compile error
> * Keith Wiley -- Tuesday 14 May 2002 21:47: > > I recvsed yesterday and now it won't compile: > > /usr/local/src/FlightGear/src/Main/fg_init.cxx:628: undefined reference to > > `FGNullFDM::FGNullFDM(do ble)' > ^ > > What's that? "do ble"? > It definitely compiles here. Corrupted file? Bad memory? Beats me. I just cvsed. I don't think that's my own code or anything. The cvs code must have that in it. I have no idea what it means. > By the way, you need something like the following patch to make the UFO > behave: I don't even want to use the UFO, but because it's in the code, I can't get FG to compile. Ugh. Keith Wiley[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.unm.edu/~keithw http://www.mp3.com/KeithWiley "Yet mark his perfect self-contentment, and hence learn his lesson, that to be self-contented is to be vile and ignorant, and that to aspire is better than to be blindly and impotently happy." -- Edwin A. Abbott, Flatland ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[OT] Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
James A. Treacy writes: > Of course, I am constantly reminded of my US background when I tell > the Scouts in my troop to cut a 6' piece of line and get blank stares. > They want me to say 2m. At the same time almost none of them can tell > me their 'weight' in kilograms. I remember when I was in England at a youth camp we were playing some game where the kids had to go around and find the leaders and get them to sign off on their sheet. The big trick was that the kids had to find the leaders in ascending order. I had the joy of being #2. So as soon as the first couple kids found me, a very large, vicious, and demanding mob quickly began to form around me all of them shoving little papers and pencils in my face. It was very traumatic. :-) I started yelling, "Hey! Everyone get in a line or I'm not signing anyone's paper." This was met with continued and even more frantic mobbing. After yelling my ultimatum a couple more times with no change in the mob behavior, a light bulb went off. I yelled "Oi! Queue up!" and almost instantly the insane mob transformed itself into a perfectly calm, well behaved line, er, uh I mean queue. James mentioned "line" and "blank stares" so I thought this would be a similar story ... :-) Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: stupid compile error
Keith Wiley writes: > > * Keith Wiley -- Tuesday 14 May 2002 21:47: > > > I recvsed yesterday and now it won't compile: > > > /usr/local/src/FlightGear/src/Main/fg_init.cxx:628: undefined reference to > > > `FGNullFDM::FGNullFDM(do ble)' > > ^ > > > > What's that? "do ble"? > > It definitely compiles here. Corrupted file? Bad memory? > > Beats me. I just cvsed. I don't think that's my own code or anything. > The cvs code must have that in it. I have no idea what it means. > > > By the way, you need something like the following patch to make the UFO > > behave: > > I don't even want to use the UFO, but because it's in the code, I can't > get FG to compile. Ugh. Have you tried a complete "make clean" followed by a "make"? Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: stupid compile error
> Have you tried a complete "make clean" followed by a "make"? Doing it right now. It'll probably take about two hours to finish. Just sitting back and waiting now. Thanks for the reccomendation. Keith Wiley[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.unm.edu/~keithw http://www.mp3.com/KeithWiley "Yet mark his perfect self-contentment, and hence learn his lesson, that to be self-contented is to be vile and ignorant, and that to aspire is better than to be blindly and impotently happy." -- Edwin A. Abbott, Flatland ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Re: stupid compile error
* Keith Wiley -- Wednesday 15 May 2002 22:46: > > * Keith Wiley -- Tuesday 14 May 2002 21:47: > > > I recvsed yesterday and now it won't compile: > > > /usr/local/src/FlightGear/src/Main/fg_init.cxx:628: undefined reference to > > > `FGNullFDM::FGNullFDM(do ble)' > > ^ > > What's that? "do ble"? > > It definitely compiles here. Corrupted file? Bad memory? > > Beats me. I just cvsed. I don't think that's my own code or anything. > The cvs code must have that in it. I have no idea what it means. It =doesn't= mean anything! It should read "double"! And this is certainly not from CVS. Could you re-checkout this file? m. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
"James A. Treacy" wrote: > > SI is a real international standard, while 'english' units are just a mess. > > Of course, I am constantly reminded of my US background when I tell > the Scouts in my troop to cut a 6' piece of line and get blank stares. > They want me to say 2m. At the same time almost none of them can tell > me their 'weight' in kilograms. And the length of people is also measures in feet, isn't it? At least in New Zealand it's the same. But that'll go away eventually. In Germany is the generation of my parents still asking for a "pound" (= 500g = 1/2 kg) of something in the shop. But the people of my generation is using the official units. Anyway to come back to the thread: isn't your story a proof that SI should be used? CU, Christian -- The idea is to die young as late as possible.-- Ashley Montague Whoever that is/was; (c) by Douglas Adams would have been better... ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Environment subsystem status
Jon S Berndt wrote: > > On Wed, 15 May 2002 12:52:39 -0400 > David Megginson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >I have no objection personally to doing everything in SI -- I'm > >Canadian, so I'm very used to metric. > > I wish that the U.S. had standardized on metric, and that > I had grown up on it, and that everything we use was based > on metric - that would make it easier for all of us. > Unfortunately that's not the case. I also wish that a > kilogram was always a unit of mass and was not used as a > unit of weight (force). The users are abusing the system. There's no way to use "kilograms" for a force in an official way (because we've got Newtons for that). > Since much of our data that we build up aircraft models on > is found in English units, we'd have to spend time > converting that - and potentially introducing errors. I > sympathize with SI users - it's a generally good system. > But in the real world we've got to use what we're given - > reality is not so nicely ordered. You are right about the "potentially introducing errors". We should try to minimize that. FDMs (et al) are programmed once, so we need only one hardcoded transformation that gets verified all the time. So there's low risk of getting an error (and a very low risk for a systematic error) But as most users (assuming international audience) are used to SI (or at least are familiar with it) they should be confronted with SI. Otherwise they are likely to get the values wrong each time (or most of the time) they use them. A totally different discussion is the unit on the panel gauges. These should be in the international avionics standard - we are seeking for realism after all. CU, Christian -- The idea is to die young as late as possible.-- Ashley Montague Whoever that is/was; (c) by Douglas Adams would have been better... ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp site? Thanks, Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] SI vs Imperial
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 > As far as the SI vs. English units go, I restate my declared > neutrality. While doing calculations *in* SI units is much safer and > easier, I also see the advantages to representing them externally in > traditional units. Typical (North American, anyway) altimeters still > report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... Panel authors are in > a poorer position to do the conversion than the FDM folks are. The easiest way to fix this is to have a properly /sim/metricorimperial. If set to 1 all values will magicly turn from imperial to metric. if set to 0 they will all magically turn to imperial, no matter what they were entered in. Could this be done? Thanks, David -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE84uCHx58m2d272NoRApjbAJ48WGcokFJ9lB316I0udGNlD6yk7QCfRykN Q2SDV3Dd14fyPQdOn8wqKNs= =94lP -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Curtis L. Olson) [2002.05.16 17:26]: > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package > and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp > site? $ apt-get install zip Can't you automate this with your release scripts? -- Cameron Moore [ Why is the man who invests all your money called a broker? ] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Cameron Moore writes: > * [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Curtis L. Olson) [2002.05.16 17:26]: > > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package > > and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp > > site? > > $ apt-get install zip > > Can't you automate this with your release scripts? Sorry, it's not quite that simple. For all it's glory and power, the unix zip utility does *not* generate correct/proper zip files for the base package ... perhaps it's due to the size? or the number of files? or something else? But the base package .zip file comes out corrupted when built with the unix zip utility. So, I have to ask that a windows person convert this from .tar.gz to .zip for me. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] SI vs Imperial
David Findlay wrote: > > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > > As far as the SI vs. English units go, I restate my declared > > neutrality. While doing calculations *in* SI units is much safer and > > easier, I also see the advantages to representing them externally in > > traditional units. Typical (North American, anyway) altimeters still > > report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... Panel authors are in > > a poorer position to do the conversion than the FDM folks are. > > The easiest way to fix this is to have a properly > > /sim/metricorimperial. > > If set to 1 all values will magicly turn from imperial to metric. if set to 0 > they will all magically turn to imperial, no matter what they were entered > in. Could this be done? Thanks, We might be able to create such a logic, but IMHO too much depends on it. Every part of the code that uses these properties would have to check /sim/metricorimperial and convert the data itself. I think it could be better to add an adition "subdirectory" to each property, e.g. /environment/wind/mps /environment/wind/fps /environment/wind/knots The environment code sets only one of these and the property logic dynamically creates the other ones when they get requested. The benefit is that only those conversions are done that need to be done. This should be good for performance. But I don't know if the gneral overhed would eat up all performace gains and generate a performance loss in the end. CU, Christian -- The idea is to die young as late as possible.-- Ashley Montague Whoever that is/was; (c) by Douglas Adams would have been better... ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
"Curtis L. Olson" wrote: > > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package > and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp > site? Sorry, I've got no webspace where I can put such a big file. But any decent Windows based ZIP tool should be able to unzip .tar.gz anyway. (e.g. WinZIP does) CU, Christian -- The idea is to die young as late as possible.-- Ashley Montague Whoever that is/was; (c) by Douglas Adams would have been better... ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Christian Mayer writes: > "Curtis L. Olson" wrote: > > > > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package > > and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp > > site? > > Sorry, I've got no webspace where I can put such a big file. > > But any decent Windows based ZIP tool should be able to unzip .tar.gz > anyway. (e.g. WinZIP does) Right, but you aren't the one that has to answer 10 emails a day about not being able to extract a .tar.gz :-) Although, now that you mention it, if anyone wants to volunteer to handle all my incoming email and take care of all the simpler to medium difficulty stuff, delete all the spam, delete all the email from my boss, make it sound like I'm working extra hard, etc. :-) I would be happy to discuss arrangements. :-) Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] re fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Native Win32 Tar with zlib support < command line > http://telia.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/gnuwin32/tar-1.13-bin.zip FYI Most Win32 archive tools < WinZip ect > support tar files nowadays So we shouldn't have to worry about converting this Cheers Norman ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] re fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Norman Vine wrote: > > FYI > Most Win32 archive tools < WinZip ect > support tar files nowadays FYI The Latin for "and the rest" is "et cetera", abbreviated "etc." (or less commonly "&c.") :) - Julian ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: getting closer
Okay, getting closer on the problem previously posted. Apparantly the makefile doesn't know what to do with FGUFO and FGNullFDM. Why is the makefile broken to the point that FG won't compile? Did cvs not get the makefile properly? If cvs isn't going to get the file properly for me, what can I possibily do about it? Keith Wiley[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.unm.edu/~keithw http://www.mp3.com/KeithWiley "Yet mark his perfect self-contentment, and hence learn his lesson, that to be self-contented is to be vile and ignorant, and that to aspire is better than to be blindly and impotently happy." -- Edwin A. Abbott, Flatland ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] re fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Julian Foad writes: > >FYI >The Latin for "and the rest" is "et cetera", abbreviated >"etc." (or less commonly "&c.") :) FWIW - the problem is I type with my teos :-) ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
AW: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Curt, I think we should provide a .zip file for Win users. There sure are tools for unpacking .tar.gz under Windows but it's just that: "zip" is for Win what "tar" is for Unix. XP comes with native .zip support. This said, I just packed an fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip, however I lack the webspace for an upload either. But I'd be willing to upload it someplace. Could you give me temporary write access to a certain place for ftp or perhaps tell me an appropriate place for anon ftp? Sincerely, Michael -- Michael Basler, Jena, Germany [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.geocities.com/pmb.geo/ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Curtis L. Olson) [2002.05.16 17:26]: > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package > and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp > site? FYI, it looks like someone forgot to tag the fgfsbase CVS tree when we made the 0.7.10 release. No harm done since we have the tar.gz's, but you might want to add that to your release todo list. -- Cameron Moore [ If a word in the dictionary were misspelled, how would we know? ] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] SI vs Imperial
On Thu, 16 May 2002 08:26:15 +1000, David Findlay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message <200205152226.g4FMQHoN009406@tornado>: > -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- > Hash: SHA1 > > > As far as the SI vs. English units go, I restate my declared > > neutrality. While doing calculations *in* SI units is much safer > > and easier, I also see the advantages to representing them > > externally in traditional units. Typical (North American, anyway) > > altimeters still report feet, VSI indicators read in fpm, etc... > > Panel authors are in a poorer position to do the conversion than the > > FDM folks are. > > The easiest way to fix this is to have a properly > > /sim/metricorimperial. > > If set to 1 all values will magicly turn from imperial to metric. if > set to 0 they will all magically turn to imperial, no matter what they > were entered in. Could this be done? Thanks, ..a possibly wiser name could be '/sim/SI-metric-or-standard-english-units'. These 'standard' units are not neccesarily Imperial, some are American, AFAIK. ..does anyone use metric flight instruments anymore? The only ones I know of, were the WWII Luftwaffe and the Warsaw Pact Air Forces and "hang-arounds", possibly also the Communist Chinese AF. AFAIK, none of these were strictly SI metric. -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;-) ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
On Wed, 15 May 2002 17:49:49 -0500 (CDT), "Curtis L. Olson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Christian Mayer writes: > > "Curtis L. Olson" wrote: > > > > > > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base > > > package and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on > > > the ftp site? > > > > Sorry, I've got no webspace where I can put such a big file. > > > > But any decent Windows based ZIP tool should be able to unzip > > .tar.gz anyway. (e.g. WinZIP does) ...in 2 steps. Call it fgfs-base-0.7.10.tgz. Moving to '*.tgz', makes it an _1_ step "unzip in winzip". Try it for a month or so and see what happens to the newbee questions. -- ..med vennlig hilsen = with Kind Regards from Arnt... ;-) ...with a number of polar bear hunters in his ancestry... Scenarios always come in sets of three: best case, worst case, and just in case. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] FDMs and external atmosphere
At 07:36 AM 5/15/2002 -0400, you wrote: >Jon Berndt writes: > > > Yes. We've got hooks in JSBSim to add in the effects of turbulence, but > > the math model driver for turbulence can be complicated. It's being worked > > on, albeit slowly. > >When you're ready, let me know, and I'll add a normalized turbulence value >(0:1) to FGEnvironment. Ditto for YASim (i.e. I'll add it as soon as >*any* FDM supports turbulence). > >By the way, one of my more immediate goals is adding variable winds as >a complement to gusting winds. I might also add variability for >up/down drafts. It would, indeed, be nice to have a vertical velocity model for simulating soaring flight. I'm still trying to run down stability derivatives for my sailplane! rj ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
I noticed that the latest version of main.cxx references a macro SG_COMPILER_STR, which doesn't seem to be defined anywhere. Is this suppose to be referencing SG_COMPILER from simgear/compiler.h? Also, for some reason, MSVC does not like the most recently generated FlightGear.dsp (it does some REALLY WEIRD(tm) things). Jonathan Polley ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Two other things. First there is a constant string in telnet.cxx that contains s, which MSVC does not like. Second, telnet.cxx uses snprintf(), which is not supported under MSVC (for some reason, they use _snprintf(), go figure). Jonathan Polley On Wednesday, May 15, 2002, at 07:58 PM, Jonathan Polley wrote: > I noticed that the latest version of main.cxx references a macro > SG_COMPILER_STR, which doesn't seem to be defined anywhere. Is this > suppose to be referencing SG_COMPILER from simgear/compiler.h? Also, for > some reason, MSVC does not like the most recently generated > FlightGear.dsp (it does some REALLY WEIRD(tm) things). > > Jonathan Polley > > > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Jonathan Polley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > I noticed that the latest version of main.cxx references a macro > SG_COMPILER_STR, which doesn't seem to be defined anywhere. Is this > suppose to be referencing SG_COMPILER from simgear/compiler.h? Probably :-) I changed my copy of main.cxx for now. Maybe there's a newer version of compiler.h somewhere. Curt? Best, Jim ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: getting closer
Keith Wiley writes: > Okay, getting closer on the problem previously posted. Apparantly the > makefile doesn't know what to do with FGUFO and FGNullFDM. Why is the > makefile broken to the point that FG won't compile? Did cvs not get the > makefile properly? If cvs isn't going to get the file properly for me, > what can I possibily do about it? Keith, I'm not sure why you are having problems with this. Do you have files called UFO.[ch]xx and NullFDM.[ch]xx in src/FDM/ ? Cvs should get everything properly. You might want to make sure you are running "cvs update -d" so you get any new directories that are created. Also watch the output of the cvs command carefully to see if any errors or warnings are scrolling by. Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Jonathan Polley writes: > I noticed that the latest version of main.cxx references a macro > SG_COMPILER_STR, which doesn't seem to be defined anywhere. Is this > suppose to be referencing SG_COMPILER from simgear/compiler.h? Ooops, my fault, missed committing a change. It should all be there now. > Also, for some reason, MSVC does not like the most recently > generated FlightGear.dsp (it does some REALLY WEIRD(tm) things). Bernie is the one that created the script for this. If you expand on your definition of "really weird" a bit, I'm sure he can figure out the problem. Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Jonathan Polley wrote: > > Two other things. First there is a constant string in telnet.cxx that > contains s, which MSVC does not like. Second, telnet.cxx uses > snprintf(), which is not supported under MSVC (for some reason, they use > _snprintf(), go figure). > Could we fix the snprintf/_snprintf problem once and for all by adding #define snprintf _snprintf to simgear/compiler.h in the MSVC section. Bernie ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: Environment subsystem status
On Thu, May 16, 2002 at 12:07:21AM +0200, Christian Mayer wrote: > > Anyway to come back to the thread: isn't your story a proof that SI > should be used? Proof? That's a bit strong. I'm somewhat torn on this issue. Having grown up using english units, I have a (small) soft spot for them. On the other hand, SI units are more logical and reduce the chance for errors. Also, being a volunteer group, it is difficult to impose a rule such as 'thou shalt use SI'. If anyone cares about the opinion of a non-coder (on this project) a reasonable solution to the issue of units could be that a piece of code must provide an SI interface. This way parts of the project, such as jsb, can use whatever units they want internally as long as they provide an SI interface. They are, of course, free to provide other interfaces if they choose. -- James (Jay) Treacy [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Bernie Bright writes: > Jonathan Polley wrote: > > > > Two other things. First there is a constant string in telnet.cxx that > > contains s, which MSVC does not like. Second, telnet.cxx uses > > snprintf(), which is not supported under MSVC (for some reason, they use > > _snprintf(), go figure). > > > > Could we fix the snprintf/_snprintf problem once and for all by adding > > #define snprintf _snprintf > > to simgear/compiler.h in the MSVC section. I'm open to this. This problem keeps biting us poor unsuspecting unix programmers. :-) Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
> Jonathan Polley writes: > > I noticed that the latest version of main.cxx references a macro > > SG_COMPILER_STR, which doesn't seem to be defined anywhere. Is this > > suppose to be referencing SG_COMPILER from simgear/compiler.h? > > Ooops, my fault, missed committing a change. It should all be there > now. > > Curt. I just did an update and built and got this: main.cxx: In function `int mainLoop(int, char **)': main.cxx:1336: `SG_COMPILER_STR' undeclared (first use this function) main.cxx:1336: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once main.cxx:1336: for each function it appears in.) make[2]: *** [main.o] Error 1 Are you sure you got that fix in? Jon smime.p7s Description: application/pkcs7-signature
Re: [Flightgear-devel] fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
Hi > Would anyone be willing to create a "zip" version of the base package > and post it some place where I can fetch it and put it on the ftp > site? > I can put a version on one of my ftp machines. Just need to move it out from behind the firewall. Say the word and I'll send you the address, and some account info Regards John W. ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
RE: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Never mind. I need to start waiting two minutes later than I normally would to send emails complaining of faults. That's how long it usually takes me between the time I think of writing until I find where I screwed up. :-/ Jon smime.p7s Description: application/pkcs7-signature
RE: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
Jon Berndt writes: > > Jonathan Polley writes: > > > I noticed that the latest version of main.cxx references a macro > > > SG_COMPILER_STR, which doesn't seem to be defined anywhere. Is this > > > suppose to be referencing SG_COMPILER from simgear/compiler.h? > > > > Ooops, my fault, missed committing a change. It should all be there > > now. > > > > Curt. > > > I just did an update and built and got this: > > main.cxx: In function `int mainLoop(int, char **)': > main.cxx:1336: `SG_COMPILER_STR' undeclared (first use this function) > main.cxx:1336: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once > main.cxx:1336: for each function it appears in.) > make[2]: *** [main.o] Error 1 > > Are you sure you got that fix in? It's a simgear fix so you need to make sure to fetch and install the latest simgear first. Regards, Curt. -- Curtis Olson IVLab / HumanFIRST Program FlightGear Project Twin Cities[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minnesota http://www.menet.umn.edu/~curt http://www.flightgear.org ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Latest Update Problems
On Wednesday, May 15, 2002, at 09:31 PM, Curtis L. Olson wrote: >> Also, for some reason, MSVC does not like the most recently >> generated FlightGear.dsp (it does some REALLY WEIRD(tm) things). > > Bernie is the one that created the script for this. If you expand on > your definition of "really weird" a bit, I'm sure he can figure out > the problem. > "Really weird" WAS it not recognizing the .dsp file as a valid file. I deleted and re-fetched the file many times and it still didn't work. "Really weird" NOW means that it recognizes the file as valid, but it is missing all the plib, metakit and SimGear libraries from the project file. I don't know why, I don't know why... Jonathan Polley ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Sound problems
Hope I'm not being a pest but it's been a while since the last sound patch. The gear-lock sound doesn't work on the c310. Nor do the engine[0] sounds. And the cranking is weird (very short?) on everything. I tried playing around with the xml some but didn't get any results. This is with latest everything, but the problem was there after the most recent sound patch that added conditional xml. Best, Jim ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] re fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
> The Latin for "and the rest" is "et cetera", abbreviated "etc." (or less commonly "&c.") :) Actually is "et coetera". Marcio Shimoda ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Source code Documentation
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] (A J) [2002.05.16 07:51]: > is there any documentation for FGFS source code? > if there exist any i will be glad to send me its > address. FlightGear does not use a source documentation system (such as doxygen or DOC++). What documentation we have is on the website at: http://flightgear.org/Docs/ There is also some useful documentation in the source tree under the docs-mini/ directory. The JSBSim FDM does, however, use DOC++. The latest version of that is viewable at: http://jsbsim.sf.net/JSBSim/index.html See the plib site for some documentation on the plib subsystems: http://plib.sf.net/ The only other documentation we have is the comments in the code. Depending on the programmer, some code may be self-documenting. :-) If anyone has any more links or suggestions, please let me know. I'd like to add this question+answer to the FAQ. Thanks -- Cameron Moore / Every so often, I like to stick my head out the \ \ window, look up, and smile for a satellite photo. / ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] re fgfs-base-0.7.10.zip
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Julian Foad) [2002.05.16 18:18]:
> The Latin for "and the rest" is "et cetera", abbreviated "etc." (or
> less commonly "&c.") :)
Or even less commonly "ANSI". :)
--
Cameron Moore
bash$ :(){ :|:&};:
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[Flightgear-devel] Re: [Flightgear-cvslogs] CVS: FlightGear/src/Main options.cxx,1.162,1.163
* [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Curtis L. Olson) [2002.05.16 23:06]: > Update of /var/cvs/FlightGear-0.7/FlightGear/src/Main > In directory seneca:/tmp/cvs-serv26528/src/Main > > Modified Files: > options.cxx > Log Message: > Bernie Bright: > To make MSVC happy it appears we need backslashes on string literals > spanning multiple lines. Can we get a second opinion on the changes in this file? Why on earth does MSVC bark about this: cout << "say" << endl << "what?!" << endl; I can understand this being a problem: cout << "say what?! "; because of the linefeeds possibly being unix linefeeds, but how is the first example broken? I'm baffled... -- Cameron Moore / The other day, I went to a tourist information booth and asked, \ \ "Tell me about some of the people who were here last year"./ ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Re: [Flightgear-cvslogs] CVS: FlightGear/src/Main options.cxx,1.162,1.163
MSVC was complaining about the latter. My solution was: cout << "say\n\ what?\n\ "; Jonathan Polley On Thursday, May 16, 2002, at 11:21 PM, Cameron Moore wrote: > * [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Curtis L. Olson) [2002.05.16 23:06]: >> Update of /var/cvs/FlightGear-0.7/FlightGear/src/Main >> In directory seneca:/tmp/cvs-serv26528/src/Main >> >> Modified Files: >> options.cxx >> Log Message: >> Bernie Bright: >> To make MSVC happy it appears we need backslashes on string literals >> spanning multiple lines. > > > Can we get a second opinion on the changes in this file? Why on earth > does MSVC bark about this: > > cout << "say" << endl ><< "what?!" << endl; > > I can understand this being a problem: > > cout << "say > what?! > "; > > because of the linefeeds possibly being unix linefeeds, but how is the > first example broken? I'm baffled... > -- > Cameron Moore > / The other day, I went to a tourist information booth and asked, \ > \ "Tell me about some of the people who were here last year"./ > > ___ > Flightgear-devel mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Environment subsystem status
> ... > If a FDM wants to use obscure units internally (e.g. because the > > developers are use to them) that's their choice. But when we have > > very universal data that a lot of people need (users, panel > > programmers, ...) we should use an international standard. > > I agree with the principle, but note that the aircraft panel > instruments give the altitude in feet, not meters, the altimeter will > be calibrated for inches of mercury, not pascals, and the airspeed > will be in knots (or possibly statute mph), not kph -- using SI > internally will force a lot of conversions. I'm sure that there exist > SI aircraft panels somewhere, but I have not yet seen photos of any in > general aviation. > David, The only place that I know of that manufactures aircraft (or at least did routinely) with SI based instrumentation was the old Soviet Union. Some of their aircraft either sold to customers, or operating outside the SU were involved in at least two mid air collisions (IIRC, between heavies in India and off western Africa). This was thought at the time to be due to confusion over unit conversion, either in the cockpit or by the ATCs involved. Maybe somebody can recall these instances with better accuracy. Either way, history condemned us to English units. At any rate, might we introduce a configuration line in the set up files that alerts the program that all following units are SI instead of English? Ditto access members that are known to report/set data members/parameters in SI instead of English unit values? This might make dealing with airframes like some of the older Russian designs a bit easier and less error prone. Regards, Charlie H. -- "Madam, there's no such thing as a tough child- if you parboil them first for seven hours, they always come out tender." - W.C. [William Claude] Fields (1879 - 1946) ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mail.flightgear.org/mailman/listinfo/flightgear-devel
