[Hornlist] Re: solo beginnings - the list so far
It probably doesn't count because of the tutti orchestra hit on the first beat, but Tchaikovsky's Second Symphony also begins with a nice unaccompanied horn solo. Steve _ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail®. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd_062009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] metronome multiples of 6 [was: Mendelssohn Nocturne]
RE: Metronome "Scale" Take the first 17 numbers: 40 42 44 46 48 50 52 54 56 58 60 63 66 69 72 76 80 Notice that they count by twos from 40 to 60. Then by threes. Since 60-80 can't be divided evenly by threes he (Maelzel?) fudged by counting fours at the end. Here is a "logorhythmic" scale I found on the web: 40.00 41.77 43.62 45.55 47.57 49.67 51.87 54.17 56.57 59.07 61.69 64.42 67.27 70.25 73.36 76.61 80.00 But forget that crazy stuff. Go back to the first set (the first two "octaves" of our tempered metronome scale): 40 42 44 46 48 50 52 54 56 58 60 63 66 69 72 76 80 Then double each number: 80 84 88 92 96 100 104 108 112 116 120 126 132 138 144 152 160 then double a few of those: 160 168 176 184 192 200 208 There you have the settings of the metronome. All are multiples or factors of other numbers in the scale. The number of settings that are multiples of 6 is simply coincident, I believe. I think Hans is correct to point out the inherent proportional relationships between tempi. (There is an idea out there that all the movements of some works by Mozart are in tempos that are related to a common pulse-"takt") The beautiful thing is you can practice any tempo 104 and slower by setting the metronome to double speed for the subdivisions. I am surprised that a bunch of horn players, who live and die by their understanding of the harmonic series, failed to see such similar proportionalities in the metronomic scale. Steve _ Hotmail® has a new way to see what's up with your friends. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/WhatsNew?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_WhatsNew1_052009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Rare horn piece to be performed
One of the community groups I play with is a long-ago merger of the Pontiac (MI) Symphony with the orchestra of nearby Oakland University (We are in Oakland County). They tried to change the name a couple years ago, but after one season were forced to change it back to the Pontiac Oakland Symphony. Steve _ Rediscover Hotmail®: Get e-mail storage that grows with you. http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover_Storage2_042009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Duos for horn and trumpet
I have played through the duos for trumpet and horn by Alec Wilder. Not easy, but very cool! Steve *** _ Hotmail® is up to 70% faster. Now good news travels really fast. http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_70faster_032009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Morley-Pegge book
Sorry to change the subject, but it was all caps. I have my copy of "The French Horn" by R. Morley Pegge here. "Some notes on the Evolution of the Intrument and its Techniques" is the subtitle on the title page inside. So we are all talking about one book, I think. I bought mine from a bookstore that specialized in selling off remainders for $4.95 (It was called "Afterwords"). Mine is also not for sale, but I do highly recommend it. BTW mine is the second edition which included Norton with the original publisher Ernest Benn and was part of a series "Instruments of the Orchestra" Steve Burian *** _ Quick access to Windows Live and your favorite MSN content with Internet Explorer 8. http://ie8.msn.com/microsoft/internet-explorer-8/en-us/ie8.aspx?ocid=B037MSN55C0701A___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: "Dent" bags
Ironically, I only use my gig bag for my horn when I fly. The hard Yamaha case actually doesn't fit well and leaves about 3/4" for secondary impacts should it be handled roughly, so I can't imagine checking it. With an uncut bell, I just put it in the gig bag and put it under the seat in front of me. Steve Burian *** _ Windows Live™ Hotmail®:…more than just e-mail. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t2_hm_justgotbetter_explore_012009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Inauguration piece by John Williams-NHR
Just came across this article in the NY Times. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/23/arts/music/23band.html?emc=eta1 We've been "Milli-Vanillied." BTW, someone remarked on the good intonation from the Marine Band. I agree, but there was a moment that was pretty scary intonation wise. I think it was the first of the herald trumpet fanfares. It quickly got better. Didn't bother me; just proves it was real. Steve *** _ Windows Live™ Hotmail®…more than just e-mail. http://windowslive.com/howitworks?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t2_hm_justgotbetter_howitworks_012009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Inaugural Music-Barely HR
Jerry wrote: "After spending $170 million of ours in order to appear as the second coming of Abraham Lincoln, I rather expected period instruments." We tried, my civil war period brass band (using instruments from c.1840-1880 and named after a band that did play for Lincoln) did apply to perform, but we were not accepted. They took a HS marching band and a police mounted unit from my state. BTW, I was there. I flew in and out on Tuesday. Whatever your politics, it was cool to be part of the crowd. I think it is worth $170 million to let a couple million witness the peaceful transfer of power. And then let the entire world watch us do it without a major incident. And I was not disappointed in the John William piece. Doing anything with "Simple Gifts" after Copland must be akin to Brahms trying to write a symphony with Beethoven looking over his shoulder. We have a name for music designed to be fully appealing on the first hearing: "pop music." Not that there is anything wrong with that. _ Windows Live™ Hotmail®:…more than just e-mail. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t2_hm_justgotbetter_explore_012009___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Auf dem Strom--temperament and tuning
I wrote a small paper in Grad school on tuning and temperament and found this great quote from Shakespeare: In A Midsummer Night's Dream Theseus says: Hippolyta, I woo'd thee with my sword, And won thy love, doing thee injuries; But I will wed thee in another key, With pomp, with triumph and with revelling. BTW, I saw the book entitled "Tuning" by Jorgensen, referenced on the website rollingball.com, when I was at Michigan State (Where he was lead piano tech, I believe). Quite a tome and sure to answer many questions. His son was the piano tech at Central Mich where I studied and hired him to tune my piano. Steve _ Send e-mail faster without improving your typing skills. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_speed_122008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Auf dem Strom
I finally remembered to look at the book I mentioned: The Schubert Song Companion by John Reed. "Schubert's instictive awareness of the emotional colour of individual keys is an essential part of his finding the best musical form for a particular text... However, Schubert thought nothing of transposing his songs to suit individual singers, or the convenience of publishers. Moreover, the autograph, where it exists, and the first edition often differ in key used. Not too much weight, therefore should be attached to individual examples." Mr. Reed goes on to make generalizations about each key according to the songs Schubert composed in that key. I'll quote E major since that is the given key of Auf Dem Strom "The emotional associations of E Major are with innocence and joy. Seligkeit and An die Freude are characteristic, but the uncomplicated happiness they represent is not to be confused with felicity, or with the the contemplative joy of harmony with Narture and with God. The songs of innocence almost always confine themselves to E Major, but there is also a philosophical dimension to this key..." He then lists the 36 songs in E Major. As an aside: Die Forelle the song is in Db major, but is set in D Major in the famous quintet. Hope this helps.. Steve _ Send e-mail faster without improving your typing skills. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_speed_122008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
RE: [Hornlist] Auf dem strom und drang
I have a book at school The Schubert Song Companion or some similar title. Each of his 600 plus songs gets about 1-2 pages of background and some analysis. One of the appendixes (appendages?) categorizes by key. I will try to remember to bring the book home and share a few of its insights. Schubert definitely did associate certain emotions, moods and themes with certain keys. I'm not so sure Eb is a sad and gloomy key, however, Beethoven's Eroica alone is enough to refute that. Of course longer crooks are "darker," but that is but one factor in the mix. I seem to remember in one of the Radio Lab stories a mention of how many of the great composers had perfect pitch (and what of synethsesia?). Steve Burian _ Suspicious message? There’s an alert for that. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad2_122008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Peter and the Wolf-Woodwind Quintet Arr.
Hello all, My woodwind quintet has started to prepare an arrangement of Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf as arranged by Earl C. North for woodwind quintet. We have found a few errors already and believe there will be more. I have been charged with comparing all the parts to the original score (wouldn't it be easier to just make a new arrangement?). So two questions: 1. Does anyone have experience with this arrangement who would be willing to share an errata list? 2. Is there a better arrangement out there for WWQ5? Thanks in advance. Steve Burian _ Color coding for safety: Windows Live Hotmail alerts you to suspicious email. http://windowslive.com/Explore/Hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_safety_112008 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Dvorak Horn Solo
Last season we played the Dvorak Cello Concerto (Currently working on Symphony No.8) and I must say that just taking in the orchestra part in the first rehearsal without the soloist was one of the highlights of the season. I remember turning to the second horn and saying that I thought the piece sounded great as is and doesn't seem to need the soloist. Of course with the soloist is even better. Personally, the horn trio in the slow movement is some of the best writing for our instrument I have yet played. In other (NHR) news, there is a "Driveway moment" podcast on NPR featuring about 20 minutes of interview with Wynton Marsalis that is worth downloading. The man is such a cheerleader that it sometimes makes me want to blush, but his scholarship and understanding really come through in the interview. And while I'm thinking about it, Radio Lab has done some really interesting segments on music. Stephen Burian _ Want to do more with Windows Live? Learn “10 hidden secrets” from Jamie. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: NY Times horn feature
Hello all, I saw this article this morning and thought about replying but have not yet taken the effort. I think it may be futile. I also read his original review of the NY Phil when the horns had so much trouble on the Haydn under their newly appointed director: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/07/arts/music/07nyph.html I disagree with his apparent assertion that condensation is related to clams. (Maybe a few, but most are caused by other things than water) Hand-horn both raises and lowers pitch (not a point worth arguing over) but it also makes accuracy harder since it messes with resistance/airspeed. I don't think of it as a "resource" towards greater accuracy. I appreciate his efforts to explain the horn, but he obviously was worried more about his "dorky" band uniform than trying to master an instrument, and his defensiveness regarding all the e-mails he received already shows that he is not interested in learning anything new. His apparent "Boston envy" made me wonder if James Sommerville might someday become the Horn Bambino lured away to the mighty NY Phil in pinstriped tuxedoes leading to a 100-year dearth of horn playing in Boston. I hope not. Having taken my share of lessons and auditions, and having paid up to $100 to see a symphony concert, I do agree that if I pay for a ticket to see a big orchestra I can expect really well prepared playing. Otherwise, the writers genuine lack of understanding makes his lack of sympathy harder to sympathize with. BTW, I have a CD of Phil Meyers playing mostly obscure stuff. I find it to be some of the most compellingly musical playing in my collection. That's all I can really offer on that issue. Steve Burian _ Get more from your digital life. Find out how. http://www.windowslive.com/default.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Home2_082008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Horn Position
In their first lessons, I simply tell my students rule No. 1: "Bring the instrument to you, don't go to the instrument." If you sit properly and can put it on the knee then fine, otherwise it's off the knee. I do let them move the right leg over to the right or off the edge of the chair if it helps. Steve *** _ Keep your kids safer online with Windows Live Family Safety. http://www.windowslive.com/family_safety/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_family_safety_052008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: The fun of conducting!
Daniel says: "As an experienced amateur player, I'd say that your suggestions are quite reasonable. But I could never realize how conducting can actually be fun." * I too agree with the most excellent list of suggestions for conducting. I would explain the appeal of conducting this way: some like to work on cars in their garages, some like to admire cars on the road or in museums. Some enjoy casual safe driving with other cars while some enjoy the thrill of getting behind the wheel and seeing what a car can do. I enjoy the horn for many reasons (this week it is the slow movement of the Dvorak cello concerto!!). I enjoy conducting because part of me wants to understand how all the parts fit together. When I conduct I definitely get to know a piece better. And, I admit it is a huge ego trip. I don't enjoy being bossy or having to push weaker players to improve. But finding things to praise is hugely rewarding, as is finding the right thing to say in a few words that makes the piece go better. Choosing programs and exploring lesser known or new music is really cool (I am currently directing Haydn's Symphony 26, and a concerto by Charles Avison that I Finale'd from a microfilm of the original 1758 edition). My largest audience (as conductor) to date was about 6000 (x4 nights) and it was huge adrenaline rush to be "on." Talk about "selling your skin" as Hans says. Hope this help explain, Daniel. Steve *** _ Going green? See the top 12 foods to eat organic. http://green.msn.com/galleries/photos/photos.aspx?gid=164&ocid=T003MSN51N1653A___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Humperdink "Evening Prayer" from "Hansel Und
I have a copy of an arrangement of Elsa's Procession to the Cathedral. It is for marching band. I feel I am doing my part by not sharing it. Steve Burian _ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista® + Windows Live™. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_MediaCtr_bigscreen_012008___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Yamaha 667V
Hello again, I have also heard the line Ken Pope just gave us that the difference between Yamaha Professional horns and Custom horns is that the Custom horns are assembled by only one person start to finish. I don't remember if I said it here already or in a private e-mail so forgive me if I repeat myself. If I remember correctly, I was told this at the former Yamaha Factory in Grand Rapids, MI. I like to think that given the "Custom" designation, my 667V is really an "800" level custom horn. It is significantly different from a 667. Having said that, I have tried a few 667's that have made me think I spent too much for the upgrade since they were also very nice horns. Before he joined Boston, James Sommerville stopped by to solo with the Sault Ste. Marie Symphony (c. 1997). I don't remember the wrap, but I asked about his horn after the amazing performance and he non-nonchalantly said it was just a regular Yamaha "off the shelf." Thanks for the good thread. What is the next topic? How about New Year's Resolutions for hornists? Steve Burian _ i’m is proud to present Cause Effect, a series about real people making a difference. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/MTV/?source=text_Cause_Effect___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Yamaha 667V
Hi Brad and Hornlist, I am not an expert on the Yamaha 667V, but I have played one for about 7 years. I can only add a little to what other people have said. My perception has been relatively little discussion about the 667V compared to other makes. First I think it would be significantly different from an 8D. Perhaps not polar opposite, but I do think my sound concept changed a little from my previous horn (Holton 379). It seems to be fine for WWQ5 and Brass Q5, but when I am in a section of big horns and everyone else is playing very loudly, I have sometimes felt like I had to work harder to keep up with their volume. I drilled out my stock 30C4 a little and really liked the results. I have been told not to worry so much, that my sound does carry. I can tell you I am very happy with my 667V, but I was also able to choose from about 20 pro and custom horns at a Yamaha facility. I was even able to return a week after initial testing to narrow down my choice from two finalists. (I expected to choose horn a, but ended up with b, when I returned to school, my teacher said she knew I would choose horn b!). I know Yamaha is considered to be very consistent, but every horn had a unique set of properties. Play test before you buy!! As for the difference between the 667 and 667V, I was told at one point that the "Professional" Yamaha horns are made/assembled in Japan by more than one builder, and that "Custom" horns are made/assembled by an individual builder from start to finish. I would be curious to know if anyone can confirm this for us. Another usual difference is that "custom" horns normally come unlacquered. I do look at the listings to see how my horn's sisters do when they go up for sale. I believe that relative to the number of 667Vs out there, they seem to come up for sale infrequently. That could be the best endorsement. One complaint, in working out delicate moments that require smooth F-Bb transitions (Mahler 1 "Frere Jacque" theme for example) the thumb valve must travel 1/3 of a turn rather than 1/4, and I have to work harder to get a smooth result. Steve Burian *** _ i’m is proud to present Cause Effect, a series about real people making a difference. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/MTV/?source=text_Cause_Effect___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Re: Oom-pahs
Hello Listers: Dawn McCandless asks: "Any significance as to why the horn was chosen for all the the pahh's?" As a conductor of a civil war brass band I have observed that the harmonic-rhythmic parts (what is left after melody, counter-melody and bass line are assigned) in early band music do not have as much "afterbeat action" (oxymoron?). At least as common are steady repeated eight notes, steady alternating eight notes, the syncopated rhythm of eighth-quarter-quarter-quarter-eighth, or perhaps an eighth rest followed by three eight notes. In short, early band music had much more variety to the accompaniment parts. It is really easy for us horn players to fixate on the tedium of playing Sousa marches, but I believe his gift for melody rivals that of Mozart or Schubert. I actually enjoy playing Sousa's music. I think the stride style of piano accompaniment such as found in ragtime was a point in the cross-pollination between piano music and band music. Think about how a band leader in 1900 might arrange the left hand of a Joplin rag for his band. Give the low bass notes to the bass and split the chord on the afterbeats among the tenor and also voices. This needs further study. Steve Burian *** _ Get the power of Windows + Web with the new Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_powerofwindows_122007___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Hornlist] Concert Band question - upright bass
As a recovering band director, I find this thread interesting. Check out the really cool string bass part in Alfred Reed's Russian Christmas Music (originally for band, now also for orchestra). The part is cued in the tubas, but it is a walking (almost jazzy) pizzicato line that I don't think transfers to the tuba so well. In the absence of string bass it is best left out. >From the liner notes to Fennell's recording of the Gran Partita with Eastman >on the Mercury label: "Confusion reigns among Mozart scholars over what bass instrument Mozart intended to be used in that vital role. The available copy of the autograph of the first page simply carried the term 'Contrabasso' at the bass line, the string bass thus becoming the an undeniable element of consideration. Those who felt the string instrument to be an intrusion resorted to its replacement by a contrabassoon, which instrument Mozart knew well and used elsewhere. The recent perfection and general availability of the contrabass clarinet qualifies this instrument for entry into the confusion." He goes on to say that pizzicato is indicated so obviously (to me) string bass was one option. If the bass line in Baroque and early Classical works could be played interchangeably by any bass instrument, then I bet that it is acceptable to this piece. What I thought was interesting was that Fennell used string bass, contrabassoon AND contrabass clarinet! (though not at the same time) He argues that if Mozart had the contra-clarinet then he would have used it! I bet some scholars would take issue with that line of argument. Cheers, Steve Burian *** _ The best games are on Xbox 360. Click here for a special offer on an Xbox 360 Console. http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/wheretobuy/___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
Re: Playing softly (was: [Hornlist] Rims, Chops, Airstreams
Hello all, On the issue of blowing "loud" but playing soft, Dave Weiner's comment on string players using more bow to play louder is very helpful. I offer these additional comments: String players can play stronger in several different ways, each giving a different timbre. They can pull the bow faster/use more bow, they can tilt the hair so that more hair is in contact with the string, they can move the contact point closer to the bridge (usually with an increase in speed and/or weight to avoid crunching) and they can use more weight (make the bow "heavier"). Since most notes can be played on more than one string, string choice can also be a factor. Of course they can also "press" more sound out of the string but this gives a less satisfactory tone. Similar to when my students try to play louder by blowing harder but without opening the aperture to balance the equation. What is the difference between making the bow "heavier" and simply "pressing" the bow into the string? It is the same as the difference between playing "loud" and playing "strong." We can't just blow harder, we have to shape the air. Make it "spin" or focused or whatever we want to call it. I call it "voicing" the tone. Steve Burian *** _ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Giardinelli C10 Mouthpiece
Hello again, Every now and then I see a post from someone looking for a Giardinelli C-10 mouthpiece. I happen to have one that I bought about 20 years ago and have never really used. It is hard for me to get past the feeling of the flat rim. Could someone please explain what makes this mouthpiece desirable? (For reference, I played on a Farkas MC for many years and switched to a stock 30C4 when I got my Yamaha 667V several years ago. I later drilled out the bore and liked the results.) Thanks, Steve *** _ Windows Live Hotmail and Microsoft Office Outlook – together at last. Get it now. http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA102225181033.aspx?pid=CL100626971033___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] The really terrible horn thread
Hello List,
I saw the article in the NY Times a few months ago that is referenced in the
previous posts. I thought the whole thing was great fun, but when I went to
show it to some of my amateur musician friends they were either offended or
dismissive ("oh, it's just that British humour"). So I have kept it to myself.
I loved the bit about being sued by the publisher for making un-approved
changes to "Thus Spake...", and the response that it wasn't intentional, they
just played it that badly. And also the Principal bassoonist who says: “But I
have trouble with C sharps — a design fault of the instrument, I think — which
means I don’t play them,”
I'd give you a link to the NY Times article, but you have to log-in anyway.
Just go to NYTimes.com and look for the August 26, 2007 article in the music
section.
Steve
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[Hornlist] Instrument of the Devil?
Hello list, On the topic of Mozart's sacred music and the use of trombones and trumpets, but not horn, in his Requiem, I made the comment: "Besides, the horn is the instrument of the devil and we don't want that in a sacred work, do we?"To which David Jewell asks where this idea came from. I have to admit, I don't remember specifically how this seed was planted. It was really meant in jest. A little "bad boy" humor. Perhaps someone once said it was a devilishly difficult instrument to play. My idea was not so much that the Devil himself plays the horn (I think he is actually a violinist who prefers country music, but maybe he doubles on blues guitar). I sang the Mozart Requiem as a college freshman and references were made in my college years to trumpets and trombones as being instruments named somewhere in the bible. Perhaps I simply inferred this from the absence of horns. Or as a freshman I asked why no horns, since Mozart otherwise liked the horn, and was told this by some well meaning but mis-informed teacher. Sorry I don't have a better answer. When people find out I play the horn and comment on the difficulty, I try to minimize it by saying something like "yeah, that's what people tell me" or "all instruments have their unique challenges." I don't allow myself to think the horn is hard. I think that believing that the closer proximity of our partials can be a strength, not a weakness is an important part of the "inner game" of horn playing. I also don't like the idea of being "handicapped" by the audience and allowing people to think that more mistakes from the horns are to be expected or accepted.Stephen Burian *** _ Climb to the top of the charts! Play Star Shuffle: the word scramble challenge with star power. http://club.live.com/star_shuffle.aspx?icid=starshuffle_wlmailtextlink_oct___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Mozart Requiem instrumentation
Hello List,
I am sure someone more expert can weigh in on this, but I will offer that it is
well established that sometimes composers compose for a certain instrumentation
because they know somebody. Telemann had a great horn player in his stable and
of course Mozart had Leutgeb.
We do know that the Requiem was originally a commission, perhaps the patron
asked for a specific instrumentation.
In the case of the Requiem I believe it is clear that Mozart knew he was
setting a very old text and that he felt like using old textures forms and
techniques. So much is like Baroque oratorio to my ears. We know that he
studied the counterpoint of Bach, among others. (BTW I feel Symphony 41 also
has a retrospective feel to it at times).
Trumpets and/or trombones (tromba and trombe) are clearly called for when the
text discusses the trumpets sounding to announce the end-times ("tuba mirum").
The clarinets and basset horns are a great choice for the somber colors.
Besides, the horn is the instrument of the devil and we don't want that in a
sacred work, do we?
Steve Burian
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[Hornlist] Embouchure change
Having gone through a couple, I can add a couple brief thoughts to all that has been written: 1. To help go cold turkey, first consider not playing for a couple weeks to let the old muscles atrophy a little. 2. The regular advice of a teacher you trust is invaluable. I have changed with and without guidance and can't recommend making a major change without some form of feedback. 3. Best of luck. Steve Burian _ Need a brain boost? Recharge with a stimulating game. Play now! http://club.live.com/home.aspx?icid=club_hotmailtextlink1 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Expressive intonation, puzzles and paradoxes
Dear Daniel, I did not word that very well. But rather than try to explain again try this website: http://music.cwru.edu/duffin/JustTuning/Index.html Click on Benedetti's Puzzles and listen to a few examples. There are also synthesized recordings of the Gesualdo "Moro, lasso" elsewhere on the site that compare equal temperament to mean tone performance. I found this page to be fascinating. I think I may have to look up Professor Duffin's How Equal Temperament Ruined Harmony (And Why You Should Care) (W. W. Norton, 2007) Also for further reading I highly recommend Christopher Leuba's paper entitled: "A Study of Musical Intonation." (1962, Prospect Publications; revised 1977, 1984 and 1992.) Mine is the 8th printing of 1993. If it is possible to get permission, I would be happy to scan the paper and share. Someone recently commented on the Boston horn player who was surprised to find a lack of intonation awareness in the BSO. This paper proves that at least in Chicago in 1962, someone was aware. :-) Actually I would bet the BSO plays quite well in tune, so hold the flaming please. Personally, I hate tuning, but I love playing in tune. Steve message: 6 date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:10:20 +0200 from: Daniel Canarutto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> subject: Re: [Hornlist] Expressive intonation Steve Burian wrote: The ending pitch level would have been more of a distraction, I suspect, than to have fudged along the way. I'm sorry, my English is not good enough that I can clearly understand this sentence; would you mind to explain? Daniel _ More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Expressive intonation
I have read that Pablo Casals advocated for something he called "expressive intonation." It was a recognition that certain pitches wanted to lean towards their resolutions; leading tones lean a little sharp when resolving up and of course FA leaning down into MI. Enesco pointed out to Casals that Hungarian folk musicians were among the most skilled practitioners of this. I recently conducted a couple of rehearsals for a friend and read thru Enesco's Rumanian Rhapsody No 2 (not so well known as No 1. but also a gem). As I write this I remember certain chords that didn't make much sense when tuned vertically, but which made great sense when the melody was heard as independent. When I first read this, I was doing research for a paper and immediately rejected that melodic notes could be held to a different standard of intonation, but now I think the idea has merit. If even Haydn can compose double inflections (simultaneous major and minor thirds, for example) that we don't even notice because one is in the harmony and the other is in the melody, then I no longer think it is a stretch that independent melodies should be in tune with themselves more than with the accompaniment. Of course we must be guided by common sense, good taste and no small amount of experience. There is an interesting study of a vocal piece by one of the great Renaissance masters. I think it was the Carmina Chormatico by Lassus or Moro Lasso by Gesualdo. If each chord is tuned to just intonation and if each common tone is held perfectly still from one chord to the next, the net result is that the piece ends on a significantly different pitch level than it begins. The ending pitch level would have been more of a distraction, I suspect, than to have fudged along the way. SB _ Make every IM count. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. Its free. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGHM_MAY07 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] pitch, temperament and intonation
I think that to say F# is not the same as Gb (or pick your own favorite black key on the keyboard) can be expanded further. An F# in the key of D major might be as much as 30 cents higher than the Gb in the key of Eb minor. But this assumes that in each case the tonic is true to equal temperament and that each of the other ptches is tuned to tonic in just intonation. What is key here is that that same F# would change again for keys other than D Major. It seems logical that based on 12 Major and 12 minor keys (not counting enharmonics), there are no fewer than 24 different F sharps and another 24 G flats. Of course that seemed too easy to figure out, so I must be forgetting something. I have read that some early keyboards had as many as 32 divisions (individual keys) to the octave! In my ear training classes I like to do an exercise related to this topic. I ask the class to sing a single pitch and while they hold it I play the remaining notes from different chords, on the piano. For example they sing G. I then play C and E to make them tune the fifth of a C Major triad (2 cents sharp). Then while they continue to hold G, I play root third and fifth of an A7 chord and they can instantly feel their pitch being pulled down (up to 29 cents, which might be mathematically correct, but hard for our modern tempered ears to accept). The equal temperament of the piano makes this an imperfect excercise, but it does work to illustrate my point. Fascinating topic, but playing is tune is much more fun (and less work) that talking about it. Just my thoughts. SB _ More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Kyle Mills
I just read a notice in our local paper today (Detroit free Press) that Kyle Mills (31) died over the weekend in an airplane accident. He was Principal Horn in the Michigan Opera Theater Orchestra and had spent the last year in Montana with his girlfriend/fiancee, oboist Jennifer Sengpiel, playing with the Great Falls Montana Orchestra. I understand he recently won an audition to play in Calgary. More details here: http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/7499477.html SB _ More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail. http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Principal Horn Seat Musical Chairs
A very interesting topic. Last night I performed the Gounod Petite Symphonie. I chose to let my second horn player play first part for the last two movements. In some rehearsals we did not change seats (I stayed on the left) but when we did switch, it suddenly seemed easier to tune and balance. In the performance we did switch seats. I suspect my comfort with sitting left to right is more based on what I have gotten used to over the years. It is my understanding that the principal sets the volume level that the others balance to, but we also know that good intonation comes from listening down to the bottom voices. I admit it is sometimes difficult to hear what exactly is going on at the other end of the section. It reminds me: We had a favorite exercise in HS band where we would sit in one large circle facing the center. You were not allowed to sit near anyone from your section. It was not practical in some ways, but it did a lot to illustrate things that we had been blind to. It takes a little getting used to, but I have had positive experiences with "riding the bus" or "family car." (2 rows, 2x2). When the horn section from our local symphony gave a quartet recital last year, they sat this way. But I think I would still prefer to face my friends in chamber music when there is no conductor. Steve _ Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon. http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglineapril07 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] eBay: Horn Mouth pipes Brass Instrument Uncut
Hello List, I think I know, but if I am right, then I find it surprising that no one else has answered this aready. In the manufacture process, tubes are first bent to approximate shape. Then placed in a mold. One end is stopped and high pressure liquid is put in the other end to force the tube to expand to the exact dimension of the mold. The picture seems to show such tubes after expansion but before having the ends trimmed off. The lister may be right to say "uncut," but perhaps wrong to say "mouth pipe" as it could be a different pipe elsewhere on the horn. Of course the seller could mean "horn" to mean some other cousin in the brass family. Perhaps these are replacement mouthpipes for convertible marching euphoniums. Without a scale it is hard to tell size. Or I could be making this up. I am sure lots of instrument repair shops deal with spare motorcycle parts. Steve Burian _ Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check savings https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=10035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2bbb&disc=y&vers=925&s=4056&p=5117 ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Yamaha Mouthpiece
Hello Steve, et al. I play on a drilled 30C4 paired with a Yamaha 667V Geyer. Tom Greer at Moosewood suggested a #14 bit if I wanted to try drilling it myself. I could not easily find a numbered bit, so I went with the next smallest imperial size: 11/64. I used my cordless drill and had to buff out some scratches with my dremel moto-tool and some buffing compound, so the advice to use a lathe or drill press is good advice. I also bought a spare stock 30C4 as a back-up and for comparison. Steve Burian *** _ Its tax season, make sure to follow these few simple tips http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/PreparationTips/PreparationTips.aspx?icid=HMMartagline ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] NHR
Dear Bill Gross, You are right. I broke the very rule I was trying to defend and have automatically lost the argument. I am sorry. Ironically, I was thinking about the same quote regarding spelling while composing my first message. Dear Hans Pizka, It was wrong of me to correct you in the manner that I did. I apologize. In the future, I will let your messages stand without comment. Dear List, Sorry to have wasted your time with this. I feel that no further discussion on-list is needed. Steve _ The average US Credit Score is 675. The cost to see yours: $0 by Experian. http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=660600&bcd=EMAILFOOTERAVERAGE ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Bating the hornists' nest
A prominent musician recently offered: "Practise one octave jumps tongued and slured, practise the same way for nineth, tenth, eleventh, twelvth, thirteenth, fourteenth, fifteenth & finally double octaves... And that are double "octaves" not "octives"... And it cannot be the a-flat above the clef. It should be the a-flat above the staff. Is it that difficult to remember even the minimum of terminology in music ?" I am disappointed that in the process of chastising a poster for confusing "clef" with "staff" we are given no fewer than 5 spelling errors and an error of fact. Note: a fifteenth IS a double octave. Remember that when counting intervals 8+8=15. It is to discuss horn playing that we are here for, not to check each others' grammar and spelling. I am thankful that non-native English speakers are willing to contribute ideas from across the globe in a second or third language. I promise not to nit-pick and correct every spelling and grammatical error that appears on this list as long as those making the mistakes don't nitpick others for the same. Oh, and I did mean bating, not batting nor baiting. Although I am sure you will read the meaning that you are looking for. Steve *** _ Win a Zunemake MSN® your homepage for your chance to win! http://homepage.msn.com/zune?icid=hmetagline ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] synethsesia
Hello all, Dave Meichle offered: "I know a few students in my ear-training class who can tell (quite reliably) what key something is in by its "color." I don't mean color as in sound timbre, I mean actual visual color. F major is blue, A major is Yellow, like that." From the little I have read on synethsesia, the colors, or shapes, or textures that a synethsete sees when s/he hears sounds are unique to each individual. That is, a person with synethsesia that sees green collums whever she hears an F major will reliabaly see the same green collums each time. Another synethsete may reliably see different shapes or colors. I suspect this is as reliable as perfect pitch. I think the example of two or more ear-training students who hear the same colors may be an example of conditioned pitch or perfect pitch with associations. When I taught beginning strings and tuned several dozen instruments a day, I could find an "A" pretty reliably, but I often had to start over again on Mondays. Incidently I also once had a beginning horn student who clearly had perfect pitch... in F. I think of it as more a blending or crossing of two or more senses. not just what we hear effecting what we see. I have read that it is believed that all babies are born with it (as I have also heard that all humans are born with potential perfect pitch). Given the importance of touch and taste to infant development I find this very believable and fascinating. Unfortunately this means that none of us will ever see or feel or touch Messaien's music as he perceived it. Fascinatin' topic. Steve _ With tax season right around the corner, make sure to follow these few simple tips. http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/PreparationTips/PreparationTips.aspx?icid=HMFebtagline ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Muting question
Hello again, Can anyone offer insights into muting practice in Gershwin? In the Piano Concerto in F (ed. F. Campbell Watson) there are passages marked muted, "closed" and also some notes marked with a "+." It was suggested that "closed" means something different than the + sign since both appear independently. I suspect that extended passages were marked "closed" while the + was used for single notes as needed, and that they really mean the same thing. In at least one case the "closed" horn needs to blend with muted trumpet. Btw: I was encouraged to see Hans' assesment of stopping below f1. There seems to be ever more of it asked for by composers not realizing the strengths and weaknesses of the technique. And on this day (Thanksgiving holiday in US) I am thankful for being a horn player. Steve _ All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC. Get a free 90-day trial! http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo005002msn/direct/01/?href=http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwlo005001msn/direct/01/?href=http://www.windowsonecare.com/?sc_cid=msn_hotmail ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Stolen Horns
Hello List, The first trumpet player in my quintet had his vehicle stolen a number of years ago, with all of his trumpets and accessories. When two of the trumpets recently appeared on Ebay, he was ultimately unable to recover the instruments because the original police reports of several years ago did not include the serial numbers!! He tried to buy one of them back (ostensibly using the insurance payment from many years ago) but the seller was annoyed by his initial efforts to recover them by sending the local police in (The seller was in a different city from the crime one county away) and refused to deal. (The starting price was too high, so my friend would not force the sale by bidding high enough) Another thought: once you are paid off by insurance you are no longer the victim, the insurance company is. Replacing trumpets is relatively easy (please no flaming) compared to the pain of replacing first trumpet parts to the hundreds of brass quintet arrangements. In brief: make sure that you have serial numbers and that you include them on police reports. And consider scanning your irreplaceable music. Respectfully, Steve Burian _ All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC. Get a free 90-day trial! http://www.windowsonecare.com/trial.aspx?sc_cid=msn_hotmail ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Public domain music and a few other related items
Hello all, I think this thread brings up several important points. Allow me to share my thoughts. After years of having my teachers simply give me photocopies of the music I was studying, and even doing the same for some of my students, I decided a few years ago to require myself to play from purchased parts when possible. Over the years I have slowly replaced my photocopies of key sonatas and concertos with purchased copies; as I revisit old photocopies, I purchase replacements. Likewise I have adopted a policy of requiring my private students to purchase music we study. I will sometimes help and order music myself and then re-sell to my students (this can be beneficial if the local music store gives you a teacher discount). In grad school I played lots of new music. Many were consortium commissions paid for by 10-30 colleges (and sometimes high schools). This practice led to an average of almost one new piece per concert. The majority had fatal flaws and would never be considered masterworks. Many have immediately dropped out of the repertoire, but the joy of discovery was always there. For the one out of ten that was truly special, the experience makes it completely worth it. I still remember attending the premiere performance of "Southern Harmony" at a CBDNA performance in Austin about 6 years ago, and thinking to myself that this piece will get played many more times. The air was electric; it was clear that the others felt the same. It is worth noting that in that same time period the orchestra only gave one premiere. A symphony by a major American composer that could easily have cost as much as all the band music combined. Preservation and scholarship are important. Having the best editions that represent the composers intent most clearly is a worthy goal of all, but I would propose we spend a little more ink on sharing resources to get tomorrow's masterworks written. I recently researched and handled ASCAP and BMI licensure for a community orchestra I played with (and am now guest conducting). All musicians who perform music under copyright for money should be familiar with this. I can't say it was gratifying to have to pay a performance license for one piece that was more than the rental of that piece, but I understand the system better now and am willing to play by the rules. At least Dmitri's orphan children will no longer go hungry *grin*. Incidentally my program includes Suk, Shostakovich, Tchaikovsky and a contemporary American Robert Moran. I think the real benefit of the web will be two-fold: 1) To make available pieces from the past that may deserve a second look. Even Bach received an important second look by Mendelssohn (among others). 2) To aid the process of getting new compositions disseminated. I heard a piece on CBC radio a few years ago and thought "that sounds nice, I should look into playing it" I wrote down the title and composer while driving. I later found it through www.musiccentre.ca where they printed a set to sell me (on demand). I am performing Elizabeth Raum's Pantheon for horn violin and piano next month. Every time I listen to a song by Samuel Barber, or music of other favorite composers, I feel a tinge of sadness that they never got around to writing (more) chamber music including the horn (yes I have read Summer Music). What would a concerto by Bartok be like? Thanks for reading. Steve Burian _ Windows Live Spaces is here! Its easy to create your own personal Web site. http://spaces.live.com/signup.aspx ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] Brahms 2
Chrissie:
I am also preparing this excerpt for the first time after having played a
few auditions without it. A few things that I am finding are working for
me: 1) Review our written F# scale just to get the fingerings into the
fingers. 2) Transpose by clef instead if interval (I went back and re-read
Farkas since I have learned to read the big ones {horn in Bb and C} by
interval not by clef). Meaning that the second line from bottom is now
middle C and then you apply the 6 sharps mentioned elsewhere. 3) I like
Farkas' suggestion of learning a few key notes (tonic and dominant scale
degrees) to which you can relate the other notes until you gain fluency. 4)
Biggest help: I play other things such as Kopprach in H to teach me this
transposition and then look at Brahms. Brahms now seems easy by comparison.
While it is true that you will rarely be forced to play from their parts,
you never know. In fact, the audition I am preparing for specifies the use
of original notation for the Brahms 4 excerpts but not for the other Brahms
excerpts. In one audition the proctor announced to the committee that "the
candidate was using the candidate's own parts." I doubt it really makes a
difference, but I was annoyed all the same. I agree with one of the others
responders that playing from transposed parts takes away the "fun" of what
we do as horn players. I actually make much fewer mistakes playing from
original parts.
Break a leg and have fun!
Steve
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[Hornlist] Mutes
Hi, It is time to find a new straight mute. While working in the low register with my old Aulos, I discovered a bad note that just didn't sound. Trying a similarly shaped Trumcor yielded a similar result. I can guess that a full cone Rittich style Trumcor or other make would not have the same issue. I have tried a mute by Dick Lang and was impressed but have not found a web presence yet. I will also consider other makers, including Kowalchuk, Balu, Engemann, Denis Wick, etc. So... Any advice on: If I tried one mute by a maker and liked it, is that good enough to just trust mail-order for my own, or do I need to try the specific mute before purchase? Are there makers who will let you try before you buy? Where can I find a Dick Lang mute? Thanks, Steve _ Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ___ post: horn@music.memphis.edu unsubscribe or set options at http://music2.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
[Hornlist] RE: Water removal 667V
Dan, It is pretty quick and easy. 1. Rotate the horn to the right 3/4 turn (to move contents of third valve slides to valve area). The bell should be just past pointing to ceiling. 2. Press all four valves several times (while holding this angle) 3. Water will drain to the leadpipe from the valve section and to the bell branch from the F side. 4. Remove main tuning slide and turn to the right to empty leadpipe. Replace tuning slide. 5. Make one more complete turn to the right to empty the bell branch 6. Sometimes this needs to be repeated, but then it really is good and empty. I virtually never get water from that awkward section of F only tubing; I think it finds its way into the bell branch with the first turn. Because of the special "dual plane" thumb valve arrangement, I am guessing the process would be different for the other Yamaha Geyers (567,667). I love this horn, but it takes dents if you look at it wrong. I have to be very careful (even when turning it to get the water out) to avoid deforming the metal. Hope this helps. Steve Stephen Burian Royal Oak, MI [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ post: [EMAIL PROTECTED] unsubscribe or set options at http://music.memphis.edu/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
