Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In , on
10/29/2009
   at 11:55 AM, "McKown, John"  said:

>You specify the motherboad, size and brand of memory, exact video card,
>exact PSU, CD or DVD desired (or none), CPU type and clocking, heatsink,
>software (Ubuntu or Windows or none), HD brand and size (or none), case,
>and sound adapter. 

You can't; you can only specify, e.g., a part number, a model number.
Vendors ship different parts for the same part number, based on
spot-market prices. Google for "chipset du jour". BTDT,GTS[1].

>Of course, you do pay to "get the best".

I'd be happy if I could at least get the same part when I order the same
part number. At a minimum, I'd like for the vendors to be consistent
within a single order.

[1] No tee shirt, just the scars.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)
> Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2009 9:07 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT



> Every time someone says "I don't believe in theories", another theory
> dies. Ignoring issues of clumsiness and skinned knuckles, 
> getting what you
> want isn't as easy as it should be, because vendors buy whatever is
> cheapest on the spot market. Not only don't you know that an order
> identical to one you sent yesterday will be filled with the 
> same parts,
> you don't even know whether multiple instances on the same 
> order will be
> filled with the same parts.
>  
> -- 
>  Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT

try: http://jncs.com/

You specify the motherboad, size and brand of memory, exact video card, exact 
PSU, CD or DVD desired (or none), CPU type and clocking, heatsink, software 
(Ubuntu or Windows or none), HD brand and size (or none), case, and sound 
adapter. This is for the person who wants to DYI but can't for some reason. Of 
course, you do pay to "get the best".

--
John McKown 
Systems Engineer IV
IT

Administrative Services Group

HealthMarkets(r)

9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone * (817)-961-6183 cell
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com

Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or 
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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <4ae0666f.8489.00d...@joann.com>, on 10/22/2009
   at 02:04 PM, Scott Rowe  said:

>When it comes to PCs, I just order the parts and build it myself, it
>certainly not rocket science.  Any of this August group who have any
>hardware knowledge should be able to build a PC easily, and that way you
>don't have to compromise on hardware - you get exactly what you need,
>instead of some generic box that is more or less than you need.

Every time someone says "I don't believe in theories", another theory
dies. Ignoring issues of clumsiness and skinned knuckles, getting what you
want isn't as easy as it should be, because vendors buy whatever is
cheapest on the spot market. Not only don't you know that an order
identical to one you sent yesterday will be filled with the same parts,
you don't even know whether multiple instances on the same order will be
filled with the same parts.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In , on 10/22/2009
   at 08:59 AM, Arthur Gutowski  said:

>John, thanks for the links.  Also thanks to all who provided contact
>info.  I had  a recent "experience" with a dock station for my home
>machine that I want  to "share" with Dell corporate and "consumer
>reports" sites.  I used to think HP  was the bottom of the barrel.  For
>my next machine, I'll explore my options.  I,  too, wiped out Windoze for
>Linux, and am virus- and relatively crash-free.

If you're looking for a hardware vendor and will be running Linux[1], I
heartily recommend Pogo. My daughter had a machine that was hanging, and I
posted a query in a news group. Even though I had explicitly stated that
the machine was out of warranty, someone from Pogo contacted me and
offered to diagnose and fix it. They sent me a new graphics adapter, at no
charge, and the problem was resolved.

I'm used to having to fight to get things fixed when the machine is in
warranty. When a company helps like that even out of warranty, it gets my
attention.

[1] As I recall, they offer deadrat and openSUSE. They have an option
for windoze, but it's not one that I would take. 
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Natarajan Mohan]

MFM - modified frequency modulation and RLL - Run length limited... hard drive 
controller technologies used to encode how data is written :-). These were 5.25 
inch hard drives old old technology ... before ATA.

Natarajan

>>> Mark Zelden  10/22/2009 12:16 PM >>>
On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:40:44 -0400, Thompson, Steve
 wrote:

>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On
>Behalf Of Mark Zelden
>Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 1:27 PM
>To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu 
>Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
>
>
>I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just
>copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from
>my
>40M hard drive from the first PC I built.
>
>
>
>And how well does that MFM drive work today? Or is it RLL?
>

I don't understand the question.  I don't have that drive, I've always
just "upgraded" my HDs by copying to bigger / newer technology (for 
me, that is Sata 3GB/sec). 

Mark
--
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Sr. Software and Systems Architect - z/OS Team Lead
Zurich North America / Farmers Insurance Group - ZFUS G-ITO
mailto:mark.zel...@zurichna.com 
z/OS Systems Programming expert at http://expertanswercenter.techtarget.com/ 
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html 

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Scott]

I stopped suggesting that people build their own PC's, because they
invariably ask me for help.  One thing for me, though, is that I stopped
using desktops around 2002, when I went to college.  You can't really build
a laptop (it'd be more of a loltop) and I've become super evangelical with
regards to Apple's laptops.

Nothing else gives better value and quality for the $$.  There's OS X.  Plus
the maglock power cable = no more busted motherboard after tripping over the
cable.  And the battery now has a (roughly) 5-year lifetime (dependent on
recharges).  And!  It's got gizmos that detect if the laptop is off balance
and locks your HD in place (and has for 6 years now).  This is cool because
you can turn your MacBook into a light saber and the embarrassment will
cause troublesome girlfriends to leave the room.  Also, Steve Jobs' reality
distortion field causes you to furiously hit your browser's refresh button
for two hours at work, 2-3 times a year, during the keynote speeches where
they show you what you can't afford.  Truly gratifying.

Scott #2

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 11:04 AM, Scott Rowe  wrote:

> When it comes to PCs, I just order the parts and build it myself, it
> certainly not rocket science.  Any of this August group who have any
> hardware knowledge should be able to build a PC easily, and that way you
> don't have to compromise on hardware - you get exactly what you need,
> instead of some generic box that is more or less than you need.
>
> >>> Scott  10/22/2009 12:44 PM >>>
> I generally advocate getting a Mac and being done with it.  After some
> basic
> adjustments, you'll begin to wonder why everything else feels like it's
> 20-years behind.
>
> But if you get a PC, I suggest Lenovo or Fujitsu.  Even the newer HP's are
> pretty good.  Always stay away from Dell.
>
> Scott
>
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Arthur Gutowski 
> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:20:55 -0500, McKown, John wrote:
> >
> > >Not necessarily true. I know of a number of decent PC vendors who are
> > entirely local to the US. I've even gotten a Intel i7-920 from one of
> them
> > (Zareason) for a very good price. Of course, all my PC purchaces are 100%
> > Microsoft free. (Linux bigot).
> > >
> > >http://www.zareason.com/shop/home.php
> > >http://www.shoprcubed.com/
> > >http://system76.com/
> > >
> > >and many more.
> >
> > John, thanks for the links.  Also thanks to all who provided contact
> info.
> >  I had
> > a recent "experience" with a dock station for my home machine that I want
> > to "share" with Dell corporate and "consumer reports" sites.  I used to
> > think HP
> > was the bottom of the barrel.  For my next machine, I'll explore my
> > options.  I,
> > too, wiped out Windoze for Linux, and am virus- and relatively
> crash-free.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Art Gutowski
> >
> > --
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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Mark Zelden]

On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 15:25:34 -0400, Thompson, Steve
 wrote:



>>
>>
>>I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just
>>copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from
>>my
>>40M hard drive from the first PC I built.
>>
>>
>>
>>And how well does that MFM drive work today? Or is it RLL?
>>
>
>I don't understand the question.  I don't have that drive, I've always
>just "upgraded" my HDs by copying to bigger / newer technology (for
>me, that is Sata 3GB/sec).
>
>
>
>I have a few of the old drives, but I have no way to read them to go
>back and get something that wasn't copied.
>

Since I've been doing it along the way as technology has changed,
I've always been able to support 2 kinds for upgrading.  So I had 
ATA/EIDE connected at the same time as SATA for example and did
the copies that way.  

I don't want to continue this O.T. subject much longer, but I do have
to admit, if you were to start from scratch, these days you can buy a
name brand pc with memory, video, dvd writer, HDs and the OS cheaper
than you can by starting from scratch.   But it didn't used to be that way.
Regardless,  if you build you own, it gives you more flexibility in upgrading
just the part(s) you want to. 

Mark
--
Mark Zelden
Sr. Software and Systems Architect - z/OS Team Lead
Zurich North America / Farmers Insurance Group - ZFUS G-ITO
mailto:mark.zel...@zurichna.com
z/OS Systems Programming expert at http://expertanswercenter.techtarget.com/
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Thompson, Steve]

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On
Behalf Of Mark Zelden
Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 2:17 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:40:44 -0400, Thompson, Steve
 wrote:

>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On
>Behalf Of Mark Zelden
>Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 1:27 PM
>To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
>Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
>
>
>I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just
>copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from
>my
>40M hard drive from the first PC I built.
>
>
>
>And how well does that MFM drive work today? Or is it RLL?
>

I don't understand the question.  I don't have that drive, I've always
just "upgraded" my HDs by copying to bigger / newer technology (for 
me, that is Sata 3GB/sec). 



I have a few of the old drives, but I have no way to read them to go
back and get something that wasn't copied.

Regards,
Steve Thompson

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Linda Mooney]

I do the same and build my own PCs.  By collecting the parts over a couple 
months of sales, I save a lot of money over buying a built system and I don't 
have to fight with the Help Desk.  I often reuse/scrounge cases and I run the 
case fans until they drop - but I also have an  extra, temp controlled case fan 
in every case .  When a fan gets too noisy or just quits, I can DC it and 
replace it when convenient.  Good power supplies are a must IMHO.  A cheap one 
we had, just past its warranty, took out the MOBO in my son's PC.  I also stay 
off the 'top shelf'.  Too expensive to buy a top of the line MOBO/CPU.  When 
something breaks, I fix/replace it.  



Linda Mooney 


- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Zelden"  
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu 
Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 11:26:50 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific 
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT 

On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:04:34 -0400, Scott Rowe  wrote: 

>When it comes to PCs, I just order the parts and build it myself, it 
certainly not rocket science.  Any of this August group who have any 
hardware knowledge should be able to build a PC easily, and that way you 
don't have to compromise on hardware - you get exactly what you need, 
instead of some generic box that is more or less than you need. 
> 

Exactly what I do.  And you don't get all the bloatware either.   I usually 
order a CPU / MBO combo and let the provider do that part (put the CPU 
on the mbo).  I've also ordered "bare bones" systems (CPU/MBO/CASE+FANS). 
The biggest PITA of building yourself is connecting all the case connectors to 
the motherboard and mounting the motherboard. 

When I upgrade (about every 2 years), I usually stay 1 processor speed 
lower than the top model CPU (I use AMD) and it only costs a couple of 
hundred dollars.  It usually isn't worth it to get the fastest one vs. price. 
I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just 
copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from my 
40M hard drive from the first PC I built.   

Mark 
-- 
Mark Zelden 
Sr. Software and Systems Architect - z/OS Team Lead 
Zurich North America / Farmers Insurance Group - ZFUS G-ITO 
mailto:mark.zel...@zurichna.com 
z/OS Systems Programming expert at http://expertanswercenter.techtarget.com/ 
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html 

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Mark Zelden]

On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:40:44 -0400, Thompson, Steve
 wrote:

>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On
>Behalf Of Mark Zelden
>Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 1:27 PM
>To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
>Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
>
>
>I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just
>copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from
>my
>40M hard drive from the first PC I built.
>
>
>
>And how well does that MFM drive work today? Or is it RLL?
>

I don't understand the question.  I don't have that drive, I've always
just "upgraded" my HDs by copying to bigger / newer technology (for 
me, that is Sata 3GB/sec). 

Mark
--
Mark Zelden
Sr. Software and Systems Architect - z/OS Team Lead
Zurich North America / Farmers Insurance Group - ZFUS G-ITO
mailto:mark.zel...@zurichna.com
z/OS Systems Programming expert at http://expertanswercenter.techtarget.com/
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Lloyd Fuller]

Actually, my first drive was SCSI.  I could get a 40MB Seagate SCCI drive with 
the controller cheaper than I get could an RLL which was just coming out at the 
time.  It was more expensive than the MFM, but it was larger and faster. :)

Lloyd

--- On Thu, 10/22/09, Thompson, Steve  wrote:

> From: Thompson, Steve 
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Date: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 2:40 PM
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu]
> On
> Behalf Of Mark Zelden
> Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 1:27 PM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> 
> 
> I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since
> I've always just
> copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some
> stuff from
> my
> 40M hard drive from the first PC I built.  
> 
> 
> 
> And how well does that MFM drive work today? Or is it RLL?
> 
> Regards,
> Steve Thompson
> 
> --
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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Thompson, Steve]

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On
Behalf Of Mark Zelden
Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2009 1:27 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT


I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just
copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from
my
40M hard drive from the first PC I built.  



And how well does that MFM drive work today? Or is it RLL?

Regards,
Steve Thompson

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Mark Zelden]

On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:04:34 -0400, Scott Rowe  wrote:

>When it comes to PCs, I just order the parts and build it myself, it
certainly not rocket science.  Any of this August group who have any
hardware knowledge should be able to build a PC easily, and that way you
don't have to compromise on hardware - you get exactly what you need,
instead of some generic box that is more or less than you need.
>

Exactly what I do.  And you don't get all the bloatware either.   I usually 
order a CPU / MBO combo and let the provider do that part (put the CPU
on the mbo).  I've also ordered "bare bones" systems (CPU/MBO/CASE+FANS).
The biggest PITA of building yourself is connecting all the case connectors to
the motherboard and mounting the motherboard.

When I upgrade (about every 2 years), I usually stay 1 processor speed
lower than the top model CPU (I use AMD) and it only costs a couple of
hundred dollars.  It usually isn't worth it to get the fastest one vs. price.
I've been doing this almost since my first PC.  Since I've always just
copied hard drives to bigger hard drives, I still have some stuff from my
40M hard drive from the first PC I built.  

Mark
--
Mark Zelden
Sr. Software and Systems Architect - z/OS Team Lead
Zurich North America / Farmers Insurance Group - ZFUS G-ITO
mailto:mark.zel...@zurichna.com
z/OS Systems Programming expert at http://expertanswercenter.techtarget.com/
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Fletcher, Kevin]

I have to second Mr. Rowe's comment on building your own PC. The one I
built in 2003 is the best PC (out of 3, one a Dell :-( ) in my house.
Built it around a P4 chip. I built mine around the theory that you PC is
only as fast as the slowest piece of hardware (CD, disk drive, video,
etc.) So the moral of the story do not SKIMP on your hardware.

Thanks,
 
Kevin Fletcher (317) 817-3545
Transition Coordinator 
z/OS, DB2, AS400 support
Conseco, LLC

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Scott Rowe]

When it comes to PCs, I just order the parts and build it myself, it certainly 
not rocket science.  Any of this August group who have any hardware knowledge 
should be able to build a PC easily, and that way you don't have to compromise 
on hardware - you get exactly what you need, instead of some generic box that 
is more or less than you need.

>>> Scott  10/22/2009 12:44 PM >>>
I generally advocate getting a Mac and being done with it.  After some basic
adjustments, you'll begin to wonder why everything else feels like it's
20-years behind.

But if you get a PC, I suggest Lenovo or Fujitsu.  Even the newer HP's are
pretty good.  Always stay away from Dell.

Scott

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Arthur Gutowski  wrote:

> On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:20:55 -0500, McKown, John wrote:
>
> >Not necessarily true. I know of a number of decent PC vendors who are
> entirely local to the US. I've even gotten a Intel i7-920 from one of them
> (Zareason) for a very good price. Of course, all my PC purchaces are 100%
> Microsoft free. (Linux bigot).
> >
> >http://www.zareason.com/shop/home.php 
> >http://www.shoprcubed.com/ 
> >http://system76.com/ 
> >
> >and many more.
>
> John, thanks for the links.  Also thanks to all who provided contact info.
>  I had
> a recent "experience" with a dock station for my home machine that I want
> to "share" with Dell corporate and "consumer reports" sites.  I used to
> think HP
> was the bottom of the barrel.  For my next machine, I'll explore my
> options.  I,
> too, wiped out Windoze for Linux, and am virus- and relatively crash-free.
>
> Regards,
> Art Gutowski
>
> --
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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Scott]

I generally advocate getting a Mac and being done with it.  After some basic
adjustments, you'll begin to wonder why everything else feels like it's
20-years behind.

But if you get a PC, I suggest Lenovo or Fujitsu.  Even the newer HP's are
pretty good.  Always stay away from Dell.

Scott

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 6:59 AM, Arthur Gutowski  wrote:

> On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:20:55 -0500, McKown, John wrote:
>
> >Not necessarily true. I know of a number of decent PC vendors who are
> entirely local to the US. I've even gotten a Intel i7-920 from one of them
> (Zareason) for a very good price. Of course, all my PC purchaces are 100%
> Microsoft free. (Linux bigot).
> >
> >http://www.zareason.com/shop/home.php
> >http://www.shoprcubed.com/
> >http://system76.com/
> >
> >and many more.
>
> John, thanks for the links.  Also thanks to all who provided contact info.
>  I had
> a recent "experience" with a dock station for my home machine that I want
> to "share" with Dell corporate and "consumer reports" sites.  I used to
> think HP
> was the bottom of the barrel.  For my next machine, I'll explore my
> options.  I,
> too, wiped out Windoze for Linux, and am virus- and relatively crash-free.
>
> Regards,
> Art Gutowski
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO
> Search the archives at http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html
>

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Arthur Gutowski]

On Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:20:55 -0500, McKown, John wrote:

>Not necessarily true. I know of a number of decent PC vendors who are 
entirely local to the US. I've even gotten a Intel i7-920 from one of them 
(Zareason) for a very good price. Of course, all my PC purchaces are 100% 
Microsoft free. (Linux bigot).
>
>http://www.zareason.com/shop/home.php
>http://www.shoprcubed.com/
>http://system76.com/
>
>and many more.

John, thanks for the links.  Also thanks to all who provided contact info.  I 
had 
a recent "experience" with a dock station for my home machine that I want 
to "share" with Dell corporate and "consumer reports" sites.  I used to think 
HP 
was the bottom of the barrel.  For my next machine, I'll explore my options.  
I, 
too, wiped out Windoze for Linux, and am virus- and relatively crash-free.

Regards,
Art Gutowski

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Tony Harminc]

2009/10/21 esmie moo :
> Good Morning Gentle Readers,
>
> Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where to turn to.  
> Recently I bought a laptop from Dell.  All is well however, they keep sending 
> me the paper work (including the warranty) in French.  Despite my numerous 
> calls to their not so attentive Customer support this problem continues.  
> Since there is no Customer Support in Canada, the call is routed to India.  
> They told me that if I want an English document (in this case the warranty) I 
> have to download it.  I tried the U.S. Customer Support (call routed to 
> India) and they told me to call the Customer Support for Canada.  I checked 
> the DELL website to see if there is a complaints department in the U.S. to my 
> disbelief there is none.  Would anybody know if there is an e-mail address 
> where I can register my complaint?  Does DELL send their correspondance in 
> Spanish?  Thanks.

Ah, Dell's Indian "support". Lots of experience with that. A couple of
approaches:

1) When dealing with the Indian support people, don't allow them to
waste your time - something they seem to be trained to do. Tell them
right up front that your time is limited, and this call needs to be
handled completely in five minutes. When it's not dealt with in that
time, insist firmly that you must speak with a supervisor. No need to
shout or whine, just firmly demand. Don't talk about anything else
except transferring your call to the supervisor or manager.

Generally I've dealt with them on technical issues (broken hardware),
and until I got smart, the call would go something like:
[establish machine type and service tag]
Me: I have a DVD drive with a failure code :, and I need to
get it replaced.
Them: OK - please 
Me: But it's a hardware problem, and I already have the failure code
from the standalone Dell diagnostic program.
[iterate 5 or 6 times]
Them: You will have to reinstall Windows. Do you have the CDs?
Me: How will reinstalling Windows fix this hardware problem?
Them: Well maybe you are right, but we have to be sure, so please  reinstall Windows
Me: There is no reason I should wipe out my perfectly good Windows
installation when the problem is a defective DVD drive! Why can't you
just send me a new drive?
Them: Yes sir, but I have my procedures I must go through, and

[iterate some more - generally takes 1 to 1.5 hours in total]
Them: OK - we have determined that this is a hardware problem with
your DVD drive.
Me: @#$!
Them: Now you have next business day coverage, so we will be sending
this out on Tuesday, and it should arrive by Thursday at the latest.
Me: Thursday? But it's Friday today!
Them: No sir, it is Saturday, and weekend is not business days. We are
shipping on next business day, but we cannot control when it will
arrive.
Me: It may be Saturday in Bangalore, but it's Friday here in Toronto.
I want the drive on Monday. And even if it was Saturday, why wouldn't
you ship on Monday? Why Tuesday?
Them: long content-free non-answer about shipping and couriers and such.
[etc. etc.] Drive eventually arrives on Wednesday.

Now I just refuse to engage with them on the silly stuff. There's no
point arguing over the ship date and such, and I start right off by
telling them politely but firmly that I have a strictly hardware
problem, I will not be performing any experiments with Windows, I am
an IT professional - not a home user, my time is very limited and the
call should take no longer than 5 minutes to resolve. Of course it
goes over, and I again refuse to engage on the details, but insist on
going up a level. Usually the next guy is sufficiently anxious to get
himself out of the loop that he tells the first guy to just send the
replacement hardware.

OK - even better than all this is to avoid India completely. It's not
true that there is no local support; do you think that a Big 5 bank
who's just bought 1000 laptops gets their calls routed to Bangalore,
and gets told to reinstall Windows? No - they get local support.
Unfortunately they know from your service tag that you aren't RBC or
TD, and off to India you go. So two ways to avoid that:

2) For administrative stuff, you may be able to do it all online. When
it works, it works fairly well, and you can get both tech doc, and
warranty info online. You can even transfer ownership of a machine if
you sell it to someone. It beats talking to any of their people at
all.

3) Go through sales rather than support. If you bought a machine
online, there still seems to be a sales person in the loop - the trick
is getting his or her name. It should be on the invoice, or at least
there will be a sales contact number on it. Once you get the sale
person, no matter how much of a junior order-taker on the line, don't
let them fob you off to support. Insist that this is a sales problem,
not a support issue. If you bought over the phone in the first place,
you should already know who sold it to you. If you bought from a
retail store (I'm no

Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

esmie moo wrote:

>I tried that as well, needless to say that I haven't heard from them.  In the 
future, before I buy anything I will do my homework. 

Ok. I'm not surprised that you get no feedback. Seemed that company is too 
big for you in terms of service delivery... If you can, get another vendor.

>I will call them to register my anger ...

Uh, oh, I better check my testament...  :-D

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Bob Shannon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:57 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> 
> > If the center is not based in the US or Canada, then I will 
> avoid the 
> > product like the plague.
> 
> Unfortunately that means you won't be buying much.
> 
> Bob Shannon
> Rocket Software

Not necessarily true. I know of a number of decent PC vendors who are entirely 
local to the US. I've even gotten a Intel i7-920 from one of them (Zareason) 
for a very good price. Of course, all my PC purchaces are 100% Microsoft free. 
(Linux bigot).

http://www.zareason.com/shop/home.php
http://www.shoprcubed.com/
http://system76.com/

and many more.

--
John McKown 
Systems Engineer IV
IT

Administrative Services Group

HealthMarkets(r)

9151 Boulevard 26 * N. Richland Hills * TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone * (817)-961-6183 cell
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com * www.HealthMarkets.com

Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or 
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the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. 
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MEGA Life and Health Insurance Company.SM

 

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[esmie moo]

Dennis,
 
Thanks for the number.  I will give them a call.

--- On Thu, 10/22/09, Roach, Dennis (N-GHG)  wrote:


From: Roach, Dennis (N-GHG) 
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Received: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 5:02 AM


Try http://www.yellowpages.com/name/Round-Rock-TX/dell. The first 2 hits were 
Round Rock.

Dennis Roach
GHG Corporation
Lockheed Martin Mission Services
Facilities Design and Operations Contract Strategic Technical Engineering 
NASA/JSC
Address:
   2100 Space Park Drive 
   LM-15-4BH
   Houston, Texas 77058
Mail:
   P.O. Box 58487
   Mail Code H4C
   Houston, Texas 77258
Phone:
   Voice:  (281)336-5027
   Cell:   (713)591-1059
   Fax:    (281)336-5410
E-Mail:  dennis.ro...@lmco.com

All opinions expressed by me are mine and may not agree with my employer or any 
person, company, or thing, living or dead, on or near this or any other planet, 
moon, asteroid, or other spatial object, natural or manufactured, since the 
beginning of time.

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On 
> Behalf Of esmie moo
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:54 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> 
> Elardus,
> 
> I tried that as well, needless to say that I haven't heard from them.
> In the future, before I buy anything I will do my homework.  The first 
> question I will ask where is your customer support center.  If the 
> center is not based in the US or Canada, then I will avoid the product 
> like the plague.
> 
> Thanks to all who answered my question.  If anybody stubmbles over a 
> customer support phone number in the USA please let me know and I will 
> call them to register my anger e.g. Round Rock, TX, USA
> 
> --- On Thu, 10/22/09, Elardus Engelbrecht 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Elardus Engelbrecht 
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Received: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 3:12 AM
> 
> 
> esmie moo wrote:
> 
> >Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where to turn
> to.
> 
> In South Africa we have this: www.hellopeter.co.za  where you can 
> moan, b*tch or lambasting about bad/good/ugly service... ;-D
> 
> >I checked the DELL website to see if there is a complaints department
> in the
> U.S. to my disbelief there is none.
> 
> Try Ed Finnell's reply or this address :
> 
> http://support.dell.com/support/index.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs
> 
> I used Ed's address and at the very top, changed the country to Canada 
> to arrive at above address.
> 
> http://support.dell.com/support/topics/topic.aspx/ca/shared/support/de
> l
> lcare/e
> n/contact_technical_support?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs
> 
> Above contains Canada's contact details...
> 
> HTH!
> 
> Groete / Greetings
> Elardus Engelbrecht
> 
> --
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> email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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Ask a question on any topic and get answers from real people. Go to Yahoo! 
Answers and share what you know at http://ca.answers.yahoo.com

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Roach, Dennis (N-GHG)]

Try http://www.yellowpages.com/name/Round-Rock-TX/dell. The first 2 hits were 
Round Rock.

Dennis Roach
GHG Corporation
Lockheed Martin Mission Services
Facilities Design and Operations Contract Strategic Technical Engineering 
NASA/JSC
Address:
   2100 Space Park Drive 
   LM-15-4BH
   Houston, Texas 77058
Mail:
   P.O. Box 58487
   Mail Code H4C
   Houston, Texas 77258
Phone:
   Voice:  (281)336-5027
   Cell:   (713)591-1059
   Fax:(281)336-5410
E-Mail:  dennis.ro...@lmco.com

All opinions expressed by me are mine and may not agree with my employer or any 
person, company, or thing, living or dead, on or near this or any other planet, 
moon, asteroid, or other spatial object, natural or manufactured, since the 
beginning of time.

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On 
> Behalf Of esmie moo
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:54 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> 
> Elardus,
> 
> I tried that as well, needless to say that I haven't heard from them.
> In the future, before I buy anything I will do my homework.  The first 
> question I will ask where is your customer support center.  If the 
> center is not based in the US or Canada, then I will avoid the product 
> like the plague.
> 
> Thanks to all who answered my question.  If anybody stubmbles over a 
> customer support phone number in the USA please let me know and I will 
> call them to register my anger e.g. Round Rock, TX, USA
> 
> --- On Thu, 10/22/09, Elardus Engelbrecht 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Elardus Engelbrecht 
> Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Received: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 3:12 AM
> 
> 
> esmie moo wrote:
> 
> >Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where to turn
> to.
> 
> In South Africa we have this: www.hellopeter.co.za  where you can 
> moan, b*tch or lambasting about bad/good/ugly service... ;-D
> 
> >I checked the DELL website to see if there is a complaints department
> in the
> U.S. to my disbelief there is none.
> 
> Try Ed Finnell's reply or this address :
> 
> http://support.dell.com/support/index.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs
> 
> I used Ed's address and at the very top, changed the country to Canada 
> to arrive at above address.
> 
> http://support.dell.com/support/topics/topic.aspx/ca/shared/support/de
> l
> lcare/e
> n/contact_technical_support?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs
> 
> Above contains Canada's contact details...
> 
> HTH!
> 
> Groete / Greetings
> Elardus Engelbrecht
> 
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send 
> email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message: GET IBM-MAIN INFO 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[esmie moo]

Yeah, come to think about it you are right.  

--- On Thu, 10/22/09, Bob Shannon  wrote:


From: Bob Shannon 
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Received: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 4:56 AM


> If the center is not based in the US or Canada, then I will avoid the 
> product like the plague.

Unfortunately that means you won't be buying much.

Bob Shannon
Rocket Software

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Bob Shannon]

> If the center is not based in the US or Canada, then I will avoid the 
> product like the plague.

Unfortunately that means you won't be buying much.

Bob Shannon
Rocket Software

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[esmie moo]

Elardus,
 
I tried that as well, needless to say that I haven't heard from them.  In the 
future, before I buy anything I will do my homework.  The first question I will 
ask where is your customer support center.  If the center is not based in the 
US or Canada, then I will avoid the product like the plague.
 
Thanks to all who answered my question.  If anybody stubmbles over a customer 
support phone number in the USA please let me know and I will call them to 
register my anger e.g. Round Rock, TX, USA

--- On Thu, 10/22/09, Elardus Engelbrecht  
wrote:


From: Elardus Engelbrecht 
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Received: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 3:12 AM


esmie moo wrote:

>Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where to turn to.  

In South Africa we have this: www.hellopeter.co.za  where you can moan, 
b*tch or lambasting about bad/good/ugly service... ;-D

>I checked the DELL website to see if there is a complaints department in the 
U.S. to my disbelief there is none.  

Try Ed Finnell's reply or this address :

http://support.dell.com/support/index.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs

I used Ed's address and at the very top, changed the country to Canada to 
arrive at above address.

http://support.dell.com/support/topics/topic.aspx/ca/shared/support/dellcare/e
n/contact_technical_support?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs

Above contains Canada's contact details... 

HTH!

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[esmie moo]

John,
 
I do live in the French province of the country, but we are allowed (imagine 
that) to receive English material (if we ask for it, which I did repeatedly).  
Thanks for the link I will e-Mail the DELL head honchos my diatribe.  
 
Thanks again.

--- On Thu, 10/22/09, McKown, John  wrote:


From: McKown, John 
Subject: Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Received: Thursday, October 22, 2009, 2:50 AM


> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of esmie moo
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 8:26 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> 
> Good Morning Gentle Readers,
>  
> Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where 
> to turn to.  Recently I bought a laptop from Dell.  All is 
> well however, they keep sending me the paper work (including 
> the warranty) in French.  Despite my numerous calls to their 
> not so attentive Customer support this problem continues.  
> Since there is no Customer Support in Canada, the call is 
> routed to India.  They told me that if I want an English 
> document (in this case the warranty) I have to download it.  
> I tried the U.S. Customer Support (call routed to India) and 
> they told me to call the Customer Support for Canada.  I 
> checked the DELL website to see if there is a complaints 
> department in the U.S. to my disbelief there is none.  Would 
> anybody know if there is an e-mail address where I can 
> register my complaint?  Does DELL send their correspondance 
> in Spanish?  Thanks.

I don't know if this would work. But, personally, I'd contact your current Dell 
Support as you have and tell them that if they don't give you the paperwork in 
English, you will be demanding to return the system WITH NO RESTOCKING FEE. I 
don't know how angry you are about this, but contacting (or threating to 
contact) a lawyer might be a good idea. Also, you can try contacting some of 
the "letters to the editor" emails for various PC magazines to let others know 
of your problem. Sufficient bad publicity can get a company's attention. But 
you need to be angry enough to stick with it. Now, if it were me, (a Texas 
resident), I'd go down to Dell company headquarters with a bull horn and make a 
real nuisance of myself. 

I'll bet part of your "problem" is that you live in the part of Canada which is 
predominately French speaking and Dell is too stupid to understand that.

Or try this web site to get some Dell email addresses (including Michael 
Dell's!)

http://consumerist.com/321353/email-addresses-for-19-dell-executives

--
John McKown 
Systems Engineer IV
IT

Administrative Services Group

HealthMarkets®

9151 Boulevard 26 . N. Richland Hills . TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone . (817)-961-6183 cell
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com . www.HealthMarkets.com

Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or 
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact 
the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. 
HealthMarkets® is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the 
insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance 
Company®, Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA 
Life and Health Insurance Company.SM



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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Hal Merritt]

I don't know much about US law and even less about Canada Law, but I found this:

"A Federal law in Canada regulates the use of bilingual packaging across the
country. Inside the province of Quebec a provincial legislation regulates 
bilingual labels
and packages, as well as instructions inside the package, brochures, 
catalogues, etc. As a
rule of thumb, French must be there and as ‘Prominent' as the English copy. In 
Quebec,
the rules regarding POP Materials are a little more complicated. If it is in 
French only,
you are safe. If not, check the provincial regulations or consult a Quebec 
lawyer."

I cannot speak to the validity of the quoted material. I only suggest that 
Canadian law may be the root of your problem. If that is true, then it computes 
that support folks would be even more clueless than normal. 

The Google search words were "Canada law French". 

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of 
esmie moo
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 8:26 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

Good Morning Gentle Readers,
 
Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where to turn to.  
Recently I bought a laptop from Dell.  All is well however, they keep sending 
me the paper work (including the warranty) in French.  Despite my numerous 
calls to their not so attentive Customer support this problem continues.  Since 
there is no Customer Support in Canada, the call is routed to India.  They told 
me that if I want an English document (in this case the warranty) I have to 
download it.  I tried the U.S. Customer Support (call routed to India) and they 
told me to call the Customer Support for Canada.  I checked the DELL website to 
see if there is a complaints department in the U.S. to my disbelief there is 
none.  Would anybody know if there is an e-mail address where I can register my 
complaint?  Does DELL send their correspondance in Spanish?  Thanks.


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Yahoo! Canada Toolbar: Search from anywhere on the web, and bookmark your 
favourite sites. Download it now
http://ca.toolbar.yahoo.com.

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[Elardus Engelbrecht]

esmie moo wrote:

>Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where to turn to.  

In South Africa we have this: www.hellopeter.co.za  where you can moan, 
b*tch or lambasting about bad/good/ugly service... ;-D

>I checked the DELL website to see if there is a complaints department in the 
U.S. to my disbelief there is none.  

Try Ed Finnell's reply or this address :

http://support.dell.com/support/index.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=dhs

I used Ed's address and at the very top, changed the country to Canada to 
arrive at above address.

http://support.dell.com/support/topics/topic.aspx/ca/shared/support/dellcare/e
n/contact_technical_support?c=ca&cs=cadhs1&l=en&s=dhs

Above contains Canada's contact details... 

HTH!

Groete / Greetings
Elardus Engelbrecht

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Re: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT

[McKown, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of esmie moo
> Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 8:26 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> Subject: OFF TOPIC - DELL CUSTOMER SUPPORT
> 
> Good Morning Gentle Readers,
>  
> Please forgive me for my post but I didn't know who or where 
> to turn to.  Recently I bought a laptop from Dell.  All is 
> well however, they keep sending me the paper work (including 
> the warranty) in French.  Despite my numerous calls to their 
> not so attentive Customer support this problem continues.  
> Since there is no Customer Support in Canada, the call is 
> routed to India.  They told me that if I want an English 
> document (in this case the warranty) I have to download it.  
> I tried the U.S. Customer Support (call routed to India) and 
> they told me to call the Customer Support for Canada.  I 
> checked the DELL website to see if there is a complaints 
> department in the U.S. to my disbelief there is none.  Would 
> anybody know if there is an e-mail address where I can 
> register my complaint?  Does DELL send their correspondance 
> in Spanish?  Thanks.

I don't know if this would work. But, personally, I'd contact your current Dell 
Support as you have and tell them that if they don't give you the paperwork in 
English, you will be demanding to return the system WITH NO RESTOCKING FEE. I 
don't know how angry you are about this, but contacting (or threating to 
contact) a lawyer might be a good idea. Also, you can try contacting some of 
the "letters to the editor" emails for various PC magazines to let others know 
of your problem. Sufficient bad publicity can get a company's attention. But 
you need to be angry enough to stick with it. Now, if it were me, (a Texas 
resident), I'd go down to Dell company headquarters with a bull horn and make a 
real nuisance of myself. 

I'll bet part of your "problem" is that you live in the part of Canada which is 
predominately French speaking and Dell is too stupid to understand that.

Or try this web site to get some Dell email addresses (including Michael 
Dell's!)

http://consumerist.com/321353/email-addresses-for-19-dell-executives

--
John McKown 
Systems Engineer IV
IT

Administrative Services Group

HealthMarkets®

9151 Boulevard 26 . N. Richland Hills . TX 76010
(817) 255-3225 phone . (817)-961-6183 cell
john.mck...@healthmarkets.com . www.HealthMarkets.com

Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message may contain confidential or 
proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact 
the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the original message. 
HealthMarkets® is the brand name for products underwritten and issued by the 
insurance subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc. -The Chesapeake Life Insurance 
Company®, Mid-West National Life Insurance Company of TennesseeSM and The MEGA 
Life and Health Insurance Company.SM

 

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Re: Off Topic Dell Customer Support

[Ed Finnell]

_Dell  - Welcome to Order Support_ 
(http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/order_support/order_support?c=us&l=en&s=gen&redirect=1)
  
 
Googled for about ten seconds and found this,  HTH.

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