KR> Gap Seals

[Jeff Scott]

?
?

Sent:?Tuesday, April 05, 2016 at 8:07 PM
From:?"Mark Langford via KRnet" 
To:?krnet at list.krnet.org
Cc:?"Mark Langford" 
Subject:?Re: KR> Adverse Yaw
Owen wrote:

> However, I also read an article about how important gap seals are for
> increasing climb performance.

See http://www.n56ml.com/troy/ for more on gap seals. Just looking at
that big honkin' gap that you get when you build the wings per the
plans, you can guess that there's an improvement in performance with gap
seals.

I built my wings with a Frise aileron, and with gap seals on
that, I saw no benefit at all to the seals, mainly because the gap seals
itself if you do it right. See 
http://www.n56ml.com/owings.html[http://www.n56ml.com/owings.html][http://www.n56ml.com/owings.html[http://www.n56ml.com/owings.html]]
 for
more on that (near the bottom).

Some folks would think that life is too short to spend this kind of
effort on the ailerons, but I thought it was pretty simple and made a
lot of sense. I will do my next one the same way, but will likely use a
piano hinge at the top for simplicity and drag reductions (eliminating
those external hinges from the airstream).

Mark Langford
ML at N56ML.com
http://www.n56ml.com[http://www.n56ml.com][http://www.n56ml.com[http://www.n56ml.com]]
---

I'll offer a completely different view of gap seals based on my experience 
testing them on my KR with the Diehl Wing/RAF-48. First off, if you built per 
plans, you should have a piano hinge that goes across the complete span of the 
aileron. While it's not even close to a "seal" it's also not an open flow of 
air up through the aileron hinge, so it isn't really disturbing the air flow on 
the top side of the wing. However, the gap seal will help streamline across teh 
gap from the bottom of the wing to the bottom of the aileron.

Now for the real world testing...

I used the mylar gap seals stuck to the trailing edge of the wing with 3M 
double stick tape. I tested both with and without the gap seals. With several 
climbs to altitude and several speed runs. I found no discernible difference in 
the performance numbers of my aircraft between flying with and without the gap 
seals. However, I did find that the mylar film really sucked up tight against 
the bottom of the aileron and caused the ailerons to bind to where it took a 
significant amount of muscle to move the ailerons at higher speeds. I was not 
at all comfortable with flying the plane with the ailerons in such a heavy 
condition, so once I had completed the testing, the gap seals were removed.

My testing with the gap seals was an attempt to differentiate between real 
numbers vs anecdotal pilot induced fantasies; although since I'm pretty big on 
making speed improvements, I was really expecting big gains.  That turned out 
to be not the case. I made it a point to fly the plane under conditions as 
identical as possible with the same load conditions between testing with and 
without gap seals. Just because I saw no performance advantage with the gap 
seals, and on my plane, a significant disadvantage, doesn't mean you won't find 
them to be advantageous on your plane. Also, I'll emphasize again, my testing 
was with RAF 48 Diehl Wings. Those that have tested with the "new" AS series 
airfoil have reported significant performance improvements.

I thought my original test data was lost to time, but thanks to the archives, I 
readily located my original post with the testing data from Sept 2, 2000.  See 
the post and test data below.

Jeff Scott
Los Alamos, NM

-

KR Pilots and Testers.

Over the course of the summer, with some supplies from Mark Langford and
Oscar Zuniga, we tested my KR-2S with the ?per plans? installation of the
RAF 48 Airfoil and Diehl Wing skins with the use of Aileron gap seals.
The seals were a thin mylar film that was stuck to the bottom of the wing
with 3M 444 industrial double sided tape, then the leading edge of the
gap seals were taped over with electrical tape. The mylar film bridged
the gap between the trailing edge of the wing and the leading edge of the
aileron on the bottom of the wing.

The first order of business was to fly some performance numbers with the
airplane. I started every session with the plane grossing 1075# and the
temperature at 65 deg F at a pressure altitude of 6500 feet ASL. I did
my time to climb testing by establishing a climb at a given airspeed at
6200 feet, then maintaining that climb speed through 6500 feet and timing
it up through 7500feet. I tested at the speeds around my best rate, so I
could establish times for climbing at 85, 90, 95, and 100 mph IAS.

The results of the time to climb testing are posted below. The first row
was my time to climb speeds with the plane in the same configuration it
has flown in since the first flight 3 years ago and was intended to be a
baseline to use for comparison. It didn?t necessarily work out that way.

The second set of numbers were flown after the aileron gap 

KR> Gap Seals

[Larry Flesner]

At 09:35 PM 4/5/2016, you wrote:
>If you're ever tempted to fly around the patch without the gap seals 
>between stub wing and outer wing installed, be prepared for a 
>dramatically lowered climb rate.
+++

You created two "little wings" instead of one big one, dramatically 
reducing the aspect ratio.  With the gaps exposed you effectively 
created two wings with four tips.

Larry Flesner 

KR> Gap Seals

[Mark Langford]

Jeff Scott wrote:

 > I tested both with and without the gap
 > seals. With several climbs to altitude and several speed runs. I
 > found no discernible difference in the performance numbers of my
 > aircraft between flying with and without the gap seals.

I think the difference may be that you can follow the plans and end up 
with a big gap at the lower front edge of the aileron, or you can take 
some care and design the nose of the aileron so that it comes close to 
sealing itself.  I'll throw out that perhaps Troy's RAF48 "per-plans" 
ailerons may have had a big gap at the bottom  during straight-ahead 
flight, whereas both mine (N56ML) and yours likely seal better at the 
nose and therefore do a better job of sealing themselves, so gap seals 
don't help in our case.  I can't vouch for Troy's experience, but can 
verify my own with the AS5048 wing and Frise aileronsno discernible 
difference with gap seals installed.

  Just FYI, N891JF came with gap seals installed, and I haven't noticed 
a lot of difficulty in making turns. But I also haven't experienced a 
stellar climb rate either.  Maybe I need to do some testing, rip them 
off, and do some more testing.  I'll have to find a fish scale that 
measures in grams though, instead of ounces of force.  What I really 
need is a Corvair hanging off the nose of this thing!

While we're on the subject of gap seals, I'll throw this out.  If you're 
ever tempted to fly around the patch without the gap seals between stub 
wing and outer wing installed, be prepared for a dramatically lowered 
climb rate.  And if you do it with only one missing and the other 
installed, be prepared for a serious roll tendency!  How do I know this? 
  Experimentation...

Mark Langford
ML at N56ML.com
http://www.n56ml.com

KR> gap seals

[Colin Rainey]

Larry said: but I recall that there is no aerodynamic gain in covering the
opening with the RAF48 airfoil.

It is my understanding that regardless of airfoil, that the primary benefit,
and reason for the wing gap seals for ailerons is for the benefit to climb
rate. The drag induced by the angle of attack allowing a significant amount
of air to burble through this area and cause drag, regardless of airfoil is
the reason for adding the seal. Almost all planes I have flown, in one way
or another, seem to have addressed this issue, either through a seal, or the
hinge and leading edge being mated like the elevator male and female
surfaces (like a half moon formed into each surface for smooth actuation and
little drag). Even Cessna Frise ailerons are mated with drag in cruise and
climb a consideration by making the area where the hinge is mate with the
least aerodynamic drag. Only when deflected do they cause the designed drag
to balance the outboard lift/drag induced (but that is another story)...

Colin Rainey
brokerpi...@bellsouth.net

KR> gap seals

[Larry Flesner]

Larry said: but I recall that there is no aerodynamic gain in covering the
>opening with the RAF48 airfoil.
>
>It is my understanding that regardless of airfoil, that the primary benefit,
>and reason for the wing gap seals for ailerons is for the benefit to climb
>rate.
>Colin Rainey


What I said was:

"The bottom needs to be open when using the piano hinge
to get the correct downward deflection.  Some have covered
the opening with a gap seal (easily done) but I recall that
there is no aerodynamic gain in covering the opening with
the RAF48 airfoil."

It's the bottom opening that I was talking about.  The hinge
closes the top and provides the aileron gap seal to eliminate
airflow from bottom to top or vise versa at the wing trail edge.

I recall someone testing both the RAF48 and the new airfoil
and found no aerodynamic benefit  when closing the bottom
aileron gap on the RAF48 airfoil.  There was, as I recall, a
benefit with the new airfoil in the climb rate.

It's been a while so I could be in error.  If so, someone will
correct me.

Larry Flesner

KR> gap seals

[Rich Seifert]

I installed gap seals, and would have to agree; I saw no aerodynamic
benifit, but in my case they flutter at stall speed and so they are now my
stall warning device.  You results my vary.  :-)

- Original Message -
From: "Larry Flesner" <fles...@verizon.net>
To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: KR> gap seals


>
> Larry said: but I recall that there is no aerodynamic gain in covering the
> >opening with the RAF48 airfoil.
> >
> >It is my understanding that regardless of airfoil, that the primary
benefit,
> >and reason for the wing gap seals for ailerons is for the benefit to
climb
> >rate.
> >Colin Rainey
> 
>
> What I said was:
>
> "The bottom needs to be open when using the piano hinge
> to get the correct downward deflection.  Some have covered
> the opening with a gap seal (easily done) but I recall that
> there is no aerodynamic gain in covering the opening with
> the RAF48 airfoil."
>
> It's the bottom opening that I was talking about.  The hinge
> closes the top and provides the aileron gap seal to eliminate
> airflow from bottom to top or vise versa at the wing trail edge.
>
> I recall someone testing both the RAF48 and the new airfoil
> and found no aerodynamic benefit  when closing the bottom
> aileron gap on the RAF48 airfoil.  There was, as I recall, a
> benefit with the new airfoil in the climb rate.
>
> It's been a while so I could be in error.  If so, someone will
> correct me.
>
> Larry Flesner
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

KR> gap seals

[phil brookman]

when i installed gap seals yes i woiuld say i say an improvement in roll and 
climb
has anyone fitted vortex generators
phill
- Original Message - 
From: "Rich Seifert" <rseif...@socal.rr.com>
To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2007 1:43 AM
Subject: Re: KR> gap seals


>I installed gap seals, and would have to agree; I saw no aerodynamic
> benifit, but in my case they flutter at stall speed and so they are now my
> stall warning device.  You results my vary.  :-)
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Larry Flesner" <fles...@verizon.net>
> To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
> Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 4:59 AM
> Subject: Re: KR> gap seals
>
>
>>
>> Larry said: but I recall that there is no aerodynamic gain in covering 
>> the
>> >opening with the RAF48 airfoil.
>> >
>> >It is my understanding that regardless of airfoil, that the primary
> benefit,
>> >and reason for the wing gap seals for ailerons is for the benefit to
> climb
>> >rate.
>> >Colin Rainey
>> 
>>
>> What I said was:
>>
>> "The bottom needs to be open when using the piano hinge
>> to get the correct downward deflection.  Some have covered
>> the opening with a gap seal (easily done) but I recall that
>> there is no aerodynamic gain in covering the opening with
>> the RAF48 airfoil."
>>
>> It's the bottom opening that I was talking about.  The hinge
>> closes the top and provides the aileron gap seal to eliminate
>> airflow from bottom to top or vise versa at the wing trail edge.
>>
>> I recall someone testing both the RAF48 and the new airfoil
>> and found no aerodynamic benefit  when closing the bottom
>> aileron gap on the RAF48 airfoil.  There was, as I recall, a
>> benefit with the new airfoil in the climb rate.
>>
>> It's been a while so I could be in error.  If so, someone will
>> correct me.
>>
>> Larry Flesner
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ___
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>
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KR> gap seals

[Jim]

Yea I bought into the gap seal will make the airplane go faster B.S. too 
When I had a C-150 it didn't go any faster however I could walk a little 
faster without all that money I spent having them put on P.T. Barnum 
theres's a sucker born every minute. Bye Jim B KICT
- Original Message - 
From: "Joe Beyer" <fly...@spiretech.com>
To: <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 11:59 PM
Subject: KR> gap seals


>I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and have seen 
>no
> noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering taking them off. 
> The
> gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging and that I
> don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the plane without 
> the
> seals. Follow the plans when building.
>
>
>
> -Joe
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Message: 6
>
> Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 22:16:10 -0500
>
> From: "Mark Langford" <n5...@hiwaay.net>
>
> Subject: KR> flying
>
> To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
>
> Message-ID: <001c01c670bb$6cc93a00$2802a8c0@2600xp>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>
>  reply-type=original
>
>
>
> NetHeads,
>
>
>
> I've been doing a little bit of flying myself.  Considering we were
>
> surrounded by thunderstorms, yesterday was a pretty smooth flying day.  I
>
> got in about 3 hours, first doing climbs, glides, and stalls, then adding
>
> gap seals and repeating the process.  Bottom line is that I could tell no
>
> appreciable difference in climb rate (and I have some pretty accurate 
> data,
>
> gathered while maintaining 95mph in each climb, plus or minus a mph or two
>
> either way).  Stall speed might have dropped a mph or two.  Top speed
>
> appears to have improved slightly.  I'll have to dig up the E6B to find 
> out
>
> exactly how much, but it's not much.  I attribute this to the care I
>
> exercised fairing the ailerons and split flaps into the wing (details near
>
> the bottom of http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/owings.html ).  Building
>
> ailerons per the plans yields a big fat gap at the bottom and that  begs 
> for
>
>
> gap seals.  One odd thing is that the stalls are now preceeded by some
>
> noticeable buffeting, which is new, and I'd swear it climbs with less
>
> fuselage angle and lands easier (I greased about 5 in a row at FYM), but
>
> these are probably my imagination.
>
>
>
> I'm up to 519 KR "landings" (and still only on the second set of tires!) 
> and
>
>
> 210.9 hours of KR time (sorry, Larry).  Maybe I'll get some more in
>
> tomorrow, as I plan to buzz up to MRC to visit Troy Petteway, a 20 minute
>
> flight...
>
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> 

KR> gap seals

[Barry Kruyssen]

Its going to take more than gap seals to make something as slick as C-150 go
faster.  I would say that on my KR2 there is a noticable difference.

Regards
Barry Kruyssen
Cairns, Australia
k...@bigpond.com
http://www.users.bigpond.com/kr2/kr2.htm


-Original Message-
From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On Behalf
Of Jim
Sent: Tuesday, 9 May 2006 9:38 AM
To: KRnet
Subject: Re: KR> gap seals

Yea I bought into the gap seal will make the airplane go faster B.S. too
When I had a C-150 it didn't go any faster however I could walk a little
faster without all that money I spent having them put on P.T. Barnum
theres's a sucker born every minute. Bye Jim B KICT
- Original Message -
From: "Joe Beyer" <fly...@spiretech.com>
To: <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 11:59 PM
Subject: KR> gap seals


>I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and have 
>seen no  noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering taking 
>them off.
> The
> gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging and 
>that I  don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the 
>plane without  the  seals. Follow the plans when building.
>
>
>
> -Joe

KR> gap seals

[JAMES C FERRIS]

Is that slick or sick mispelled?
On Tue, 9 May 2006 09:43:02 +1000 "Barry Kruyssen" <k...@bigpond.com>
writes:
> Its going to take more than gap seals to make something as slick as 
> C-150 go
> faster.  I would say that on my KR2 there is a noticable 
> difference.
> 
> Regards
> Barry Kruyssen
> Cairns, Australia
> k...@bigpond.com
> http://www.users.bigpond.com/kr2/kr2.htm
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On 
> Behalf
> Of Jim
> Sent: Tuesday, 9 May 2006 9:38 AM
> To: KRnet
> Subject: Re: KR> gap seals
> 
> Yea I bought into the gap seal will make the airplane go faster B.S. 
> too
> When I had a C-150 it didn't go any faster however I could walk a 
> little
> faster without all that money I spent having them put on P.T. 
> Barnum
> theres's a sucker born every minute. Bye Jim B KICT
> - Original Message -
> From: "Joe Beyer" <fly...@spiretech.com>
> To: <kr...@mylist.net>
> Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 11:59 PM
> Subject: KR> gap seals
> 
> 
> >I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and 
> have 
> >seen no  noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering 
> taking 
> >them off.
> > The
> > gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging 
> and 
> >that I  don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the 
> 
> >plane without  the  seals. Follow the plans when building.
> >
> >
> >
> > -Joe
> 
> 
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at 
> http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> 
> 

KR> gap seals

[Jim]

Dream on  Jim B
- Original Message - 
From: "Barry Kruyssen" <k...@bigpond.com>
To: "'KRnet'" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 6:43 PM
Subject: RE: KR> gap seals


> Its going to take more than gap seals to make something as slick as C-150 
> go
> faster.  I would say that on my KR2 there is a noticable difference.
>
> Regards
> Barry Kruyssen
> Cairns, Australia
> k...@bigpond.com
> http://www.users.bigpond.com/kr2/kr2.htm
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On Behalf
> Of Jim
> Sent: Tuesday, 9 May 2006 9:38 AM
> To: KRnet
> Subject: Re: KR> gap seals
>
> Yea I bought into the gap seal will make the airplane go faster B.S. too
> When I had a C-150 it didn't go any faster however I could walk a little
> faster without all that money I spent having them put on P.T. Barnum
> theres's a sucker born every minute. Bye Jim B KICT
> - Original Message -
> From: "Joe Beyer" <fly...@spiretech.com>
> To: <kr...@mylist.net>
> Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 11:59 PM
> Subject: KR> gap seals
>
>
>>I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and have
>>seen no  noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering taking
>>them off.
>> The
>> gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging and
>>that I  don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the
>>plane without  the  seals. Follow the plans when building.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Joe
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> 

KR> gap seals

[Jim]

Dream On Jim B
- Original Message - 
From: "Barry Kruyssen" <k...@bigpond.com>
To: "'KRnet'" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2006 6:43 PM
Subject: RE: KR> gap seals


> Its going to take more than gap seals to make something as slick as C-150 
> go
> faster.  I would say that on my KR2 there is a noticable difference.
>
> Regards
> Barry Kruyssen
> Cairns, Australia
> k...@bigpond.com
> http://www.users.bigpond.com/kr2/kr2.htm
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: krnet-boun...@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-boun...@mylist.net] On Behalf
> Of Jim
> Sent: Tuesday, 9 May 2006 9:38 AM
> To: KRnet
> Subject: Re: KR> gap seals
>
> Yea I bought into the gap seal will make the airplane go faster B.S. too
> When I had a C-150 it didn't go any faster however I could walk a little
> faster without all that money I spent having them put on P.T. Barnum
> theres's a sucker born every minute. Bye Jim B KICT
> - Original Message -
> From: "Joe Beyer" <fly...@spiretech.com>
> To: <kr...@mylist.net>
> Sent: Friday, May 05, 2006 11:59 PM
> Subject: KR> gap seals
>
>
>>I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and have
>>seen no  noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering taking
>>them off.
>> The
>> gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging and
>>that I  don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the
>>plane without  the  seals. Follow the plans when building.
>>
>>
>>
>> -Joe
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
> 

KR> gap seals

[Joe Beyer]

I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and have seen no
noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering taking them off. The
gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging and that I
don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the plane without the
seals. Follow the plans when building.



-Joe







Message: 6

List-Post: krnet@list.krnet.org
Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 22:16:10 -0500

From: "Mark Langford" 

Subject: KR> flying

To: "KRnet" 

Message-ID: <001c01c670bb$6cc93a00$2802a8c0@2600xp>

Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";

  reply-type=original



NetHeads,



I've been doing a little bit of flying myself.  Considering we were 

surrounded by thunderstorms, yesterday was a pretty smooth flying day.  I 

got in about 3 hours, first doing climbs, glides, and stalls, then adding 

gap seals and repeating the process.  Bottom line is that I could tell no 

appreciable difference in climb rate (and I have some pretty accurate data, 

gathered while maintaining 95mph in each climb, plus or minus a mph or two 

either way).  Stall speed might have dropped a mph or two.  Top speed 

appears to have improved slightly.  I'll have to dig up the E6B to find out 

exactly how much, but it's not much.  I attribute this to the care I 

exercised fairing the ailerons and split flaps into the wing (details near 

the bottom of http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/owings.html ).  Building 

ailerons per the plans yields a big fat gap at the bottom and that  begs for


gap seals.  One odd thing is that the stalls are now preceeded by some 

noticeable buffeting, which is new, and I'd swear it climbs with less 

fuselage angle and lands easier (I greased about 5 in a row at FYM), but 

these are probably my imagination.



I'm up to 519 KR "landings" (and still only on the second set of tires!) and


210.9 hours of KR time (sorry, Larry).  Maybe I'll get some more in 

tomorrow, as I plan to buzz up to MRC to visit Troy Petteway, a 20 minute 

flight...

KR> gap seals

[bo...@hatconversions.com]

Historicaly, gap seals have been used in applications where air is getting
through a flying surface from one side of the wing to the other, thus
interupting the boundry layer on that side and causing drag. With your
piano hinges that are on the KR ailerons, I don't think enough air can get
through them to make gap seals very effective.  Bobby





> I have installed gap seals on my KR-2 a couple of years ago and have seen
> no
> noticeabled difference in performance. I am considering taking them off.
> The
> gap seals cause more mechanical friction on the aileron rigging and that I
> don't need. Also the wing is easier to handle when off the plane without
> the
> seals. Follow the plans when building.
>
>
>
> -Joe
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Message: 6
>
> Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 22:16:10 -0500
>
> From: "Mark Langford" 
>
> Subject: KR> flying
>
> To: "KRnet" 
>
> Message-ID: <001c01c670bb$6cc93a00$2802a8c0@2600xp>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>
>   reply-type=original
>
>
>
> NetHeads,
>
>
>
> I've been doing a little bit of flying myself.  Considering we were
>
> surrounded by thunderstorms, yesterday was a pretty smooth flying day.  I
>
> got in about 3 hours, first doing climbs, glides, and stalls, then adding
>
> gap seals and repeating the process.  Bottom line is that I could tell no
>
> appreciable difference in climb rate (and I have some pretty accurate
> data,
>
> gathered while maintaining 95mph in each climb, plus or minus a mph or two
>
> either way).  Stall speed might have dropped a mph or two.  Top speed
>
> appears to have improved slightly.  I'll have to dig up the E6B to find
> out
>
> exactly how much, but it's not much.  I attribute this to the care I
>
> exercised fairing the ailerons and split flaps into the wing (details near
>
> the bottom of http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/owings.html ).  Building
>
> ailerons per the plans yields a big fat gap at the bottom and that  begs
> for
>
>
> gap seals.  One odd thing is that the stalls are now preceeded by some
>
> noticeable buffeting, which is new, and I'd swear it climbs with less
>
> fuselage angle and lands easier (I greased about 5 in a row at FYM), but
>
> these are probably my imagination.
>
>
>
> I'm up to 519 KR "landings" (and still only on the second set of tires!)
> and
>
>
> 210.9 hours of KR time (sorry, Larry).  Maybe I'll get some more in
>
> tomorrow, as I plan to buzz up to MRC to visit Troy Petteway, a 20 minute
>
> flight...
>
>
>
> ___
> Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>

KR> Gap Seals

[JIM VANCE]

Steve Jones,

Please contact me offline.  I have some Mylar for you.

Jim Vance
va...@claflinwildcats.com

KR> Gap Seals / idea - question

[larry flesner]

>Another possible solution,
>What about some of the great Model aircraft coverings, 
>Phil Matheson
+++

Why not just make a strip of fiberglass as long and wide as you
want.  Lay it on plastic or other smooth, non-stick surface for
a smooth finish and glass/epoxy it to the bottom side of the wing to
cover the gap.  If you have to remove the aileron you could undo
the aileron pushrod and tip the aileron to the vertical position
to get to the hinge attach bolts.  A piece of tape on the aileron 
surface would keep the gap seal from marking the paint.  

Larry Flesner

KR> Gap Seals / idea - question

[Mark Jones]

Excellent idea Larry. That would work just fine. If I had not already
ordered my Mylar that would be an option. However, the Mylar being applied
with double sided tape is still the best answer for those who have already
painted.

Mark Jones (N886MJ)
Wales, WI  USA
E-mail me at flyk...@wi.rr.com
Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at
http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html


- Original Message - 
From: "larry flesner" <fles...@midwest.net>
To: "KRnet" <kr...@mylist.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2004 6:28 PM
Subject: KR> Gap Seals / idea - question


>
> >Another possible solution,
> >What about some of the great Model aircraft coverings,
> >Phil Matheson
> +++
>
> Why not just make a strip of fiberglass as long and wide as you
> want.  Lay it on plastic or other smooth, non-stick surface for
> a smooth finish and glass/epoxy it to the bottom side of the wing to
> cover the gap.  If you have to remove the aileron you could undo
> the aileron pushrod and tip the aileron to the vertical position
> to get to the hinge attach bolts.  A piece of tape on the aileron
> surface would keep the gap seal from marking the paint.
>
> Larry Flesner
>
>
>
> ___
> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to krnet-le...@mylist.net
> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html
>

KR> Gap Seals / idea - question

[Barry Kruyssen]

The amount of flex required, especially for the ailerons fitted with a piano 
hing, would cause fibreglass and the paint on it to eventually crack. Also the 
fireglass is stiffer than Mylar and would cause more drag on the controls.

I've been using mylar on gliders for years and have already bought, about a 
year ago, 5 meters by 1 meter of 0.3 mm of mylar, I haven't fitted it yet as I 
want to get my test period flown off first. Though looking at that curved mylar 
from http://www.wingsandwheels.com/page28.htm I will probably order some from 
them as I am concerned that flat mylar that wide may fold into the aileron gap, 
I have piano hing type fittings.

Progress report: Jabiru 2200 fitted, making new cowling plug, then mould, then 
cowling.

regards
Barry Kruyssen
Cairns, Australia
RAA 19-3873

k...@bigpond.com
http://users.tpg.com.au/barryk/KR2.htm

  - Original Message - 
  From: larry flesner 

  Why not just make a strip of fiberglass as long and wide as you
  want.  Lay it on plastic or other smooth, non-stick surface for
  a smooth finish and glass/epoxy it to the bottom side of the wing to
  cover the gap.  If you have to remove the aileron you could undo
  the aileron pushrod and tip the aileron to the vertical position
  to get to the hinge attach bolts.  A piece of tape on the aileron 
  surface would keep the gap seal from marking the paint.