Re: [mailop] AT Block

[Jeff Pang via mailop]

On 2024-07-09 02:31, John Von Essen via mailop wrote:
Just to pile on ATT issues. I assume you are trying to deliver to an 
att.net address, these are the emails they provided for free to 
dialup/broadband users, its also legacy prodigy.net.


What you are experiencing is not new news. Yes, ATT refuses email from 
any new IP - regardless how clean or dirty it is. And yes, the reason 
is always:


553 5.3.0 alph766 DNSBL:RBL 521< 208.88.X.X >_is_blocked.For assistance 
forward this error to abuse_...@abuse-att.net 





My experience with ATT:

Once I run a new mailserver hosted in NYC. When I tried to send mail to 
ATT from that server, the message was blocked as the info above. But 
after I contacted att postmaster by the address above, they did reply me 
and unblock my IP/server.


Now I run another new mailserver (this one simplemail.co.in) and I send 
messages to ATT, they get passed without problem. I guess the reason is 
that mailserver is hosted in Azure which has good reputation on IP 
spaces.


Also AFAIK att has the following mail domains included.

att.net
bellsouth.net
sbcglobal.net
currently.com
prodigy.net

Messages come to these domains are filtered by att's own gateway then 
delivered to yahoo.


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Re: [mailop] AT Block

[John Von Essen via mailop]

Just to pile on ATT issues. I assume you are trying to deliver to an att.net 
address, these are the emails they provided for free to dialup/broadband users, 
its also legacy prodigy.net.

What you are experiencing is not new news. Yes, ATT refuses email from any new 
IP - regardless how clean or dirty it is. And yes, the reason is always:

553 5.3.0 alph766 DNSBL:RBL 521< 208.88.X.X >_is_blocked.For assistance forward 
this error to abuse_...@abuse-att.net 

Its possible some “select” IP space/ASNs get better treatment, but I have not 
seen evidence of that. So by that logic, any new email provider or email host 
will have a hard time sending to att.net .

I understand “my server, my rules”, but this behavior is silly. My personal 
opinion is ATT does this on purpose to accelerate the death of their legacy 
email commitment. For starters, they dont want to support this old email 
anymore (all ISPs have long abandoned email), but some old contracts are 
forcing them to keep it for those who are grandfathered in. If you are a legit 
att.net  email user, life must be hard for you and you likely 
miss some emails. This means more people abandon their old ATT.net 
 email and get a gmail account. Over time the numbers dwindle 
down. Also, this is ATT we’re talking about...

Its possible that after a long time of sending low volume email (that 553’s) 
they might let it through after you tolerated the punishment, or they 
eventually answer the RBL request.

Good luck. Maybe redirect your att.net  email to a smarthost 
service that is able to deliver to att (Amazon SES maybe?)

-John

> On Jul 5, 2024, at 10:30 AM, Scott Mutter via mailop  
> wrote:
> 
> Anyone from AT on the list that can assist with the blacklisting of the IPs:
> 
> 23.239.97.150
> 5.101.141.35
> 
> Message is
> 
> 553 5.3.0 alph749 DNSBL:RBL 521< 23.239.97.150 >_is_blocked.For assistance 
> forward this error to abuse_...@abuse-att.net
> 
> As is the usual case, I've gotten no response from an inquiry to 
> abuse_...@abuse-att.net.  I sent one to abuse_...@abuse-att.net for 
> 23.239.97.150 on July 2nd and no response.  To be fair, I wrote 
> abuse_...@abuse-att.net about 5.101.141.35 just yesterday (July 4th) so it 
> really hasn't been 24 hours yet, but past experience has taught me that I 
> rarely get a response from an inquiries sent to abuse_...@abuse-att.net.
> 
> I suspect that this is being blocked because these are new IPs that AT has 
> never received mail from, so they block them by default.  Is there an 
> official way to inform AT before trying to send mail from new IPs that new 
> IPs will be sending mail?  As far as I know AT is the only service that 
> outright blocks messages from new and unseen IP addresses by default.
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Re: [mailop] AT Block

[Jeff Pang via mailop]

I suspect that this is being blocked because these are new IPs that AT 
has never received mail from, so they block them by default. Is there an 
official way to inform AT before trying to send mail from new IPs that 
new IPs will be sending mail?  As far as I know AT is the only service 
that outright blocks messages from new and unseen IP addresses by default.


No. TNL(t-online) is even worse.
BTW, you may contact Lili directly who is on this list.


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[mailop] AT Block

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

Anyone from AT on the list that can assist with the blacklisting of the
IPs:

23.239.97.150
5.101.141.35

Message is

553 5.3.0 alph749 DNSBL:RBL 521< 23.239.97.150 >_is_blocked.For assistance
forward this error to abuse_...@abuse-att.net

As is the usual case, I've gotten no response from an inquiry to
abuse_...@abuse-att.net.  I sent one to abuse_...@abuse-att.net for
23.239.97.150 on July 2nd and no response.  To be fair, I wrote
abuse_...@abuse-att.net about 5.101.141.35 just yesterday (July 4th) so it
really hasn't been 24 hours yet, but past experience has taught me that I
rarely get a response from an inquiries sent to abuse_...@abuse-att.net.

I suspect that this is being blocked because these are new IPs that AT
has never received mail from, so they block them by default.  Is there an
official way to inform AT before trying to send mail from new IPs that
new IPs will be sending mail?  As far as I know AT is the only service
that outright blocks messages from new and unseen IP addresses by default.
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft's block list?

[Alessandro Vesely via mailop]

On Wed 22/Nov/2023 15:25:36 +0100 Otto J. Makela via mailop wrote:

Can someone shed light on a Microsoft/Outlook block list? Our hobby server
(on upcloud.com) seem to have been blocked for quite some time now.

At this time, SPF and DKIM should be correct for our outgoing messages.
Is there anything to be done, apart from switching to some mail sender
company instead of ourselves attempting a direct connection?

2023-11-15T08:27:37.762372+00:00 mail postfix/smtp[113710]: 7407B6274D: 
to=, 
relay=hotmail-com.olc.protection.outlook.com[104.47.18.97]:25, delay=0.29, 
delays=0.05/0/0.21/0.03, dsn=5.7.1, status=bounced (host 
hotmail-com.olc.protection.outlook.com[104.47.18.97] said: 550 5.7.1 
Unfortunately, messages from [SERVERIPADDRESS] weren't sent. Please contact 
your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block list 
(S3150). You can also refer your provider to 
http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. 
[AM6EUR05FT032.eop-eur05.prod.protection.outlook.com 2023-11-15T08:27:37.743Z 
08DBE4B9C5B508E7] (in reply to MAIL FROM command))



I used to have lots of those "550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from 
[94.198.96.74] weren't sent".  It was caused by MIPSpace, #595 in Valli's 
multirbl.  The IP was already blocked when I got it, last April (but it doesn't 
show up in queries, perhaps because it's private).


MIPSpace only accept delist requests from "a representative of the company 
listed in the SWIP or rwhois", so I cannot even ask.  I solved by using a relay 
for M$'s domains.



Best
Ale
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft's block list?

[Tim Starr via mailop]

Go to the URL, open a ticket, be persistent, explain that you don't send
any spam.

-Tim

On Wed, Nov 22, 2023 at 8:41 AM Otto J. Makela via mailop 
wrote:

> Can someone shed light on a Microsoft/Outlook block list? Our hobby server
> (on upcloud.com) seem to have been blocked for quite some time now.
>
> At this time, SPF and DKIM should be correct for our outgoing messages.
> Is there anything to be done, apart from switching to some mail sender
> company instead of ourselves attempting a direct connection?
>
> 2023-11-15T08:27:37.762372+00:00 mail postfix/smtp[113710]: 7407B6274D:
> to=, relay=
> hotmail-com.olc.protection.outlook.com[104.47.18.97]:25, delay=0.29,
> delays=0.05/0/0.21/0.03, dsn=5.7.1, status=bounced (host
> hotmail-com.olc.protection.outlook.com[104.47.18.97] said: 550 5.7.1
> Unfortunately, messages from [SERVERIPADDRESS] weren't sent. Please contact
> your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our block
> list (S3150). You can also refer your provider to
> http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. [
> AM6EUR05FT032.eop-eur05.prod.protection.outlook.com
> 2023-11-15T08:27:37.743Z 08DBE4B9C5B508E7] (in reply to MAIL FROM command))
>
> --
> /* * * Otto J. Makela  * * * * * * * * * */
>/* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
>   /* Mail: Mechelininkatu 26 B 27,  FI-00100 Helsinki */
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft's block list?

[Atro Tossavainen via mailop]

On Wed, Nov 22, 2023 at 04:25:36PM +0200, Otto J. Makela via mailop wrote:
> Can someone shed light on a Microsoft/Outlook block list? Our hobby server
> (on upcloud.com) seem to have been blocked for quite some time now.

I have no idea why, but given that upcloud.com spammed my company to
try to sell us their business, I'd be tempted to say that they have
a reputation. The "n" is way too small to claim that it would mean
anything, but maybe this unique data point could serve as that $.02
that you needed to move your VPS to another provider.

(I can provide a complete unredacted copy of the spam to you, you and I
 go back 40 years and I have no issues trusting you with spam evidence.)

> At this time, SPF and DKIM should be correct for our outgoing messages.
> Is there anything to be done, apart from switching to some mail sender
> company instead of ourselves attempting a direct connection?

A direct connection may be perfectly fine. Your server will always be
affected by your hosting provider's reputation. I wouldn't try with
DigitalOcean either.

-- 
Atro Tossavainen, Founder, Partner
Koli-Lõks OÜ (reg. no. 12815457, VAT ID EE101811635)
Tallinn, Estonia
tel. +372-5883-4269, https://www.koliloks.eu/
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft's block list?

[Byron Lunz via mailop]

Jaroslaw, that's the typical process. I've had to go through that a
few times. However, recently MS decided to block a server I manage and
this time, they refuse to remove the block AND they refuse to tell me
why. The last reply I received was:

  As previously stated, your IP (xx.xx.xx.xxx) do not qualify for
mitigation at this time.  I do apologize, but I am unable to provide
any details about this situation since we do not have the liberty to
discuss the nature of the block. At this point, I would suggest that
you review and comply with Outlook.com’s technical standards. We
regret that we are unable to provide any additional information or
assistance at this time.

Of course, this server has been online, delivering wanted mail to MS
for years. I've received just 3 MJRP reports for this server in the
last 6 months and its SNDS rating is consistently <0.1%. When I
responded AGAIN with that information, I got no further replies. I DID
look into the 'technical standards' link, but everything suggested,
we're doing. Their system, their rules, I guess, but this sucks.

Byron Lunz
www.cctomany.com

On Wed, Nov 22, 2023 at 7:54 AM Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop
 wrote:
>
> Dnia 22.11.2023 o godz. 16:25:36 Otto J. Makela via mailop pisze:
> > Can someone shed light on a Microsoft/Outlook block list? Our hobby server
> > (on upcloud.com) seem to have been blocked for quite some time now.
> >
> > At this time, SPF and DKIM should be correct for our outgoing messages.
> > Is there anything to be done, apart from switching to some mail sender
> > company instead of ourselves attempting a direct connection?
>
> I recently had this.
>
> My hosting company told me I need myself fill appropriate forms at Microsoft
> to be unblocked. Of course after I did it I got a standard reply from them
> that "my IP does not qualify for mitigation", to which I replied by mail
> asking to be unblocked nevertheless - and it worked. I can now send to
> Microsoft.
>
> According to the information my hosting comapny gave me, I first subscribed
> to Microsft SNDS here:
> https://postmaster.live.com/snds/JMRP.aspx?wa=wsignin1.0
>
> and then I submitted the request for my server IP to be unblocked:
> https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/getsupport?oaspworkflow=start_1.0.0.0=capsub=edfsmsbl3=en-us=635857671692853062
> --
> Regards,
>Jaroslaw Rafa
>r...@rafa.eu.org
> --
> "In a million years, when kids go to school, they're gonna know: once there
> was a Hushpuppy, and she lived with her daddy in the Bathtub."
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft's block list?

[Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop]

Dnia 22.11.2023 o godz. 16:25:36 Otto J. Makela via mailop pisze:
> Can someone shed light on a Microsoft/Outlook block list? Our hobby server
> (on upcloud.com) seem to have been blocked for quite some time now.
> 
> At this time, SPF and DKIM should be correct for our outgoing messages.
> Is there anything to be done, apart from switching to some mail sender
> company instead of ourselves attempting a direct connection?

I recently had this.

My hosting company told me I need myself fill appropriate forms at Microsoft
to be unblocked. Of course after I did it I got a standard reply from them
that "my IP does not qualify for mitigation", to which I replied by mail
asking to be unblocked nevertheless - and it worked. I can now send to
Microsoft.

According to the information my hosting comapny gave me, I first subscribed
to Microsft SNDS here:
https://postmaster.live.com/snds/JMRP.aspx?wa=wsignin1.0

and then I submitted the request for my server IP to be unblocked:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/getsupport?oaspworkflow=start_1.0.0.0=capsub=edfsmsbl3=en-us=635857671692853062
-- 
Regards,
   Jaroslaw Rafa
   r...@rafa.eu.org
--
"In a million years, when kids go to school, they're gonna know: once there
was a Hushpuppy, and she lived with her daddy in the Bathtub."
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[mailop] Microsoft's block list?

[Otto J. Makela via mailop]

Can someone shed light on a Microsoft/Outlook block list? Our hobby server
(on upcloud.com) seem to have been blocked for quite some time now.

At this time, SPF and DKIM should be correct for our outgoing messages.
Is there anything to be done, apart from switching to some mail sender
company instead of ourselves attempting a direct connection?

2023-11-15T08:27:37.762372+00:00 mail postfix/smtp[113710]: 7407B6274D: 
to=, 
relay=hotmail-com.olc.protection.outlook.com[104.47.18.97]:25, delay=0.29, 
delays=0.05/0/0.21/0.03, dsn=5.7.1, status=bounced (host 
hotmail-com.olc.protection.outlook.com[104.47.18.97] said: 550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, 
messages from [SERVERIPADDRESS] weren't sent. Please contact your Internet service 
provider since part of their network is on our block list (S3150). You can also refer 
your provider to http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. 
[AM6EUR05FT032.eop-eur05.prod.protection.outlook.com 2023-11-15T08:27:37.743Z 
08DBE4B9C5B508E7] (in reply to MAIL FROM command))

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  /* Phone: +358 40 765 5772, ICBM: N 60 10' E 24 55' */
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Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

[Andrey Oleynik via mailop]

It's just temp limitations, if you can't see them in 5 mins - just retry
email that's all you need to do.
Looks like you are sending too much to proofpoint domains (there are
thousands) in a short time, we run into similar issues and just created a
retry rule.

On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 5:13 AM Jason Carter via mailop 
wrote:

> Go to Home | Proofpoint Dynamic Reputation - IP Lookup
> <https://ipcheck.proofpoint.com/> and put in your IP, then put in a
> ticket they will work with you on the issue.  I have never seen them not be
> responsive on tickets from the PDR lookup tool.
>
>   If you have a Proofpoint customer you are sending to, they can put in a
> ticket on your behalf as well.
> Home | Proofpoint Dynamic Reputation - IP Lookup
> <https://ipcheck.proofpoint.com/>
> About Proofpoint ® Dynamic Reputation (PDR). Dynamic Reputation leverages
> Proofpoint's machine-learning driven content classification system to
> determine which IPs may be compromised to send spam (i.e. part of a botnet).
> ipcheck.proofpoint.com
>
>
> *Jason Carter*
> IT Manager
> Microsoft/Collaboration Services Infrastructure and Security
> Information Technology Services  |  Florida State University
> *p*  850.645.8069  |  *w*  its.fsu.edu
>
>
>
>
> --
> *From:* mailop  on behalf of Michael Peddemors
> via mailop 
> *Sent:* Monday, April 12, 2021 7:24 PM
> *To:* mailop@mailop.org 
> *Subject:* Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues
>
> Again, you would save everyone time if you actually posted the ranges
> you are having trouble with..
>
> On 2021-04-12 2:35 p.m., Zachary Sverdrup via mailop wrote:
> > Hi All,
> > We are running into an issue where two of our IP ranges are being
> > randomly(we believe) listed at Proofpoint for the last 3-4 weeks. We
> > have reviewed the client sending out of these ranges and have submitted
> > a few tickets and emailed their postmas...@proofpoint.com
> > <mailto:postmas...@proofpoint.com > email a
> few times with no response.
> >
> > About 60% of the time when we get these alerts we are checking within 5
> > minutes on their site and they are not showing us as being blocked. We
> > will get 15+ notifications in 10 minutes with not a single one actually
> > being listed and then other times we will be listed briefly and then
> > removed.
> >
> > We have gone through and reviewed multiple clients but cannot figure out
> > why our entire ranges keep getting blocked. Has anyone seen this before
> > or have any idea what we can do about this?
> >
> > Thank you,
> >
> > ___
> > mailop mailing list
> > mailop@mailop.org
> >
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> >
>
>
>
> --
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> 
> Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
> Visit us at
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.linuxmagic.com__;!!PhOWcWs!izkVJPjYgklmao-woaSlABF6DQRmqlc3zvfhON_SantWct07L58j25M23Mp9tYyByw$
> @linuxmagic
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> "LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.
> 
> 604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada
>
> This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and intended
> solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed.
> Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are solely
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Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

[Jaren Angerbauer via mailop]

Hi Zachary,

Will look at this and will follow up with you off list.

Thanks,

--Jaren
Proofpoint Postmaster



On Tue, Apr 13, 2021 at 12:07 PM Zachary Sverdrup via mailop <
mailop@mailop.org> wrote:

> Hey Michael,
>
>  So sorry I thought I had included the IP ranges. The two ranges are
> 96.47.26.0/24 and 96.47.27.0/24.
>
> And Jason we have submitted several tickets over the last few weeks but
> have not gotten any feedback yet. When we are actually blocked and we
> submit a ticket we are removed quickly but that’s really the only response
> we have received.
>
>  In the past they have been responsive but for some reason we haven’t
> gotten a response from any of our tickets which is one reason why im
> reaching out to see if anyone else is having similar issues.
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Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

[Zachary Sverdrup via mailop]

Hey Michael,

 So sorry I thought I had included the IP ranges. The two ranges are
96.47.26.0/24 and 96.47.27.0/24.

And Jason we have submitted several tickets over the last few weeks but
have not gotten any feedback yet. When we are actually blocked and we
submit a ticket we are removed quickly but that’s really the only response
we have received.

 In the past they have been responsive but for some reason we haven’t
gotten a response from any of our tickets which is one reason why im
reaching out to see if anyone else is having similar issues.
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Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

[Jason Carter via mailop]

Go to Home | Proofpoint Dynamic Reputation - IP 
Lookup<https://ipcheck.proofpoint.com/> and put in your IP, then put in a 
ticket they will work with you on the issue.  I have never seen them not be 
responsive on tickets from the PDR lookup tool.

  If you have a Proofpoint customer you are sending to, they can put in a 
ticket on your behalf as well.
Home | Proofpoint Dynamic Reputation - IP 
Lookup<https://ipcheck.proofpoint.com/>
About Proofpoint ® Dynamic Reputation (PDR). Dynamic Reputation leverages 
Proofpoint's machine-learning driven content classification system to determine 
which IPs may be compromised to send spam (i.e. part of a botnet).
ipcheck.proofpoint.com


Jason Carter
IT Manager
Microsoft/Collaboration Services Infrastructure and Security
Information Technology Services  |  Florida State University
p  850.645.8069  |  w  its.fsu.edu<https://its.fsu.edu/>





From: mailop  on behalf of Michael Peddemors via 
mailop 
Sent: Monday, April 12, 2021 7:24 PM
To: mailop@mailop.org 
Subject: Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

Again, you would save everyone time if you actually posted the ranges
you are having trouble with..

On 2021-04-12 2:35 p.m., Zachary Sverdrup via mailop wrote:
> Hi All,
> We are running into an issue where two of our IP ranges are being
> randomly(we believe) listed at Proofpoint for the last 3-4 weeks. We
> have reviewed the client sending out of these ranges and have submitted
> a few tickets and emailed their postmas...@proofpoint.com
> <mailto:postmas...@proofpoint.com> email a few times with no response.
>
> About 60% of the time when we get these alerts we are checking within 5
> minutes on their site and they are not showing us as being blocked. We
> will get 15+ notifications in 10 minutes with not a single one actually
> being listed and then other times we will be listed briefly and then
> removed.
>
> We have gone through and reviewed multiple clients but cannot figure out
> why our entire ranges keep getting blocked. Has anyone seen this before
> or have any idea what we can do about this?
>
> Thank you,
>
> ___
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> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://list.mailop.org/listinfo/mailop__;!!PhOWcWs!izkVJPjYgklmao-woaSlABF6DQRmqlc3zvfhON_SantWct07L58j25M23Mpf83-rcQ$
>



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Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
Visit us at 
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  @linuxmagic
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info 
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Re: [mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

[Michael Peddemors via mailop]

Again, you would save everyone time if you actually posted the ranges 
you are having trouble with..


On 2021-04-12 2:35 p.m., Zachary Sverdrup via mailop wrote:

Hi All,
We are running into an issue where two of our IP ranges are being 
randomly(we believe) listed at Proofpoint for the last 3-4 weeks. We 
have reviewed the client sending out of these ranges and have submitted 
a few tickets and emailed their postmas...@proofpoint.com 
 email a few times with no response.


About 60% of the time when we get these alerts we are checking within 5 
minutes on their site and they are not showing us as being blocked. We 
will get 15+ notifications in 10 minutes with not a single one actually 
being listed and then other times we will be listed briefly and then 
removed.


We have gone through and reviewed multiple clients but cannot figure out 
why our entire ranges keep getting blocked. Has anyone seen this before 
or have any idea what we can do about this?


Thank you,

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Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.
Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca
"LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.

604-682-0300 Beautiful British Columbia, Canada

This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and intended
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[mailop] Proofpoint Block Issues

[Zachary Sverdrup via mailop]

Hi All,
We are running into an issue where two of our IP ranges are being
randomly(we believe) listed at Proofpoint for the last 3-4 weeks. We have
reviewed the client sending out of these ranges and have submitted a few
tickets and emailed their postmas...@proofpoint.com email a few times with
no response.

About 60% of the time when we get these alerts we are checking within 5
minutes on their site and they are not showing us as being blocked. We will
get 15+ notifications in 10 minutes with not a single one actually being
listed and then other times we will be listed briefly and then removed.

We have gone through and reviewed multiple clients but cannot figure out
why our entire ranges keep getting blocked. Has anyone seen this before or
have any idea what we can do about this?

Thank you,
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Joe Solano via mailop]

 

In regards to being unable to submit the Microsoft support form, it
failed for me in Chrome with the error "We're sorry, but something went
wrong on our end. Please try again later" BUT succeeded in good ole
fashioned Internet Explorer 11.

 

Joe 

 

 

From: "Scott Mutter via mailop"  

To: mailop@mailop.org 

Sent: Monday, June 29, 2020 8:40:23 AM 

Subject: Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150) 

 

> For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs --
each time it says (regardless of browser): 

> "We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again
later" 

> Anyone else experienced that? 

 

Same here. See my post to this list from June 10th - Subject: "Hotmail -
New Support Request form not working?" 

 

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 7:13 AM Sam Tuke via mailop < [
mailto:mailop@mailop.org | mailop@mailop.org ] > wrote: 

 

 

On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote: 

> On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote: 

>> Yep, fill out this 

>> form: [ http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866 |
http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866 ] 

 

For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs -- each
time it says (regardless of browser): 

 

"We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again
later" 

 

Anyone else experienced that? 

 

Sam. 

 

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[M. Omer GOLGELI via mailop]

JMRP is not dead.I recently received an email for an IP block that 2 years ago we announced under our ASN for a client and it was never submitted to JRMP or SNDS... So at least I know it's alive. Also I have seen many datacenters complaining about Microsoft blocking their whole ASN with hundreds of prefixes without giving any reason as well. So they recently retaliated...Whatever the reason is, or whether one is MS customer or not, this is yet another example of Microsoft quality jobs for perfecting things for themselves with petty excuses while breaking it for the whole world. On Jul 2, 2020 6:36 AM, Ted Hatfield via mailop  wrote:



On Wed, 1 Jul 2020, Warren Volz via mailop wrote:



> 

> On 06/30/2020 8:10 am, Adam Moffett via mailop wrote:

>

>   JMRP may not be dead, but I have haven't received anything from it in at least 8 months.  That's just as far

>   back as my "abuse" inbox goes. I don't actually know when we last received something from JMRP.  I believe you

>   that it still works for you, but apparently it doesn't work for some of us.  I used to get them fairly

>   routinely when people sent out their soccer club announcements and church newsletters and such (I presume

>   someone felt it easier to click the "report as spam" button than to unsubscribe from the church newsletter).

>    I'm sure those folk are still sending their newsletters, and I know we still sometimes have a problem with a

>   breached email account, but I don't get the JMRP messages anymore.

>

>   Meanwhile I'm still getting the S3150.  As of today it's been 8 days.  The response to my support ticket was

>   that our IP address was not eligible for mitigation.and I'm not even sure what that means.  I reviewed

>   logs and account statistics over this time period and I'm confident there's been no further spamming activity.

>    The last trouble was the one user on 6/22 who got phished and sent up to his daily limit of 200 messages.

>

>   I'd like to remain patient, but I'm starting to feel that this response is disproportionate to the original

>   issue.

> 

> Adam,

> 

> I just want to say that I feel your pain. We had a hacked account send >1k in messages to the MSFT infrastructure before

> it was disabled. As of now, I'm going back and forth with the support team to try and get our server removed from the

> block list.

> 

> -Warren

> 

> 

>



We had the same thing happen as well.  I had to route a number of hotmail 

and affilliated domains out via a seperate server until the block was 

eventually removed.



What made the whole process so frustrating was the lack of communication 

with MSFT.  No idea when the block would be removed, no actual data from 

them showing the problem, just we can't help you and please go away now.



A lot of small providers are doing their level best to be good netizens by 

implenting new email protocols, setting up tools to process dmarc and 

feedback loops, implementing dkim, spf, and dmarc for not just their 

domain but for all of their customer domains.  If you don't get it 

completely correct and keep it that way they could give a fat finger to 

assist you.  They send your email to junk because your not large enough to 

matter and finding someone to assist you usually has to be done via the 

mailop or nanog list because their front line tech support isn't geared to 

help you.



It is just so frustrating!



  -Ted
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Ted Hatfield via mailop]

On Wed, 1 Jul 2020, Warren Volz via mailop wrote:



On 06/30/2020 8:10 am, Adam Moffett via mailop wrote:

  JMRP may not be dead, but I have haven't received anything from it in at 
least 8 months.  That's just as far
  back as my "abuse" inbox goes. I don't actually know when we last 
received something from JMRP.  I believe you
  that it still works for you, but apparently it doesn't work for some of 
us.  I used to get them fairly
  routinely when people sent out their soccer club announcements and church 
newsletters and such (I presume
  someone felt it easier to click the "report as spam" button than to 
unsubscribe from the church newsletter).
   I'm sure those folk are still sending their newsletters, and I know we 
still sometimes have a problem with a
  breached email account, but I don't get the JMRP messages anymore.

  Meanwhile I'm still getting the S3150.  As of today it's been 8 days.  
The response to my support ticket was
  that our IP address was not eligible for mitigation.and I'm not even 
sure what that means.  I reviewed
  logs and account statistics over this time period and I'm confident 
there's been no further spamming activity.
   The last trouble was the one user on 6/22 who got phished and sent up to 
his daily limit of 200 messages.

  I'd like to remain patient, but I'm starting to feel that this response 
is disproportionate to the original
  issue.

Adam,

I just want to say that I feel your pain. We had a hacked account send >1k in 
messages to the MSFT infrastructure before
it was disabled. As of now, I'm going back and forth with the support team to 
try and get our server removed from the
block list.

-Warren





We had the same thing happen as well.  I had to route a number of hotmail 
and affilliated domains out via a seperate server until the block was 
eventually removed.


What made the whole process so frustrating was the lack of communication 
with MSFT.  No idea when the block would be removed, no actual data from 
them showing the problem, just we can't help you and please go away now.


A lot of small providers are doing their level best to be good netizens by 
implenting new email protocols, setting up tools to process dmarc and 
feedback loops, implementing dkim, spf, and dmarc for not just their 
domain but for all of their customer domains.  If you don't get it 
completely correct and keep it that way they could give a fat finger to 
assist you.  They send your email to junk because your not large enough to 
matter and finding someone to assist you usually has to be done via the 
mailop or nanog list because their front line tech support isn't geared to 
help you.


It is just so frustrating!

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Warren Volz via mailop]

On 06/30/2020 8:10 am, Adam Moffett via mailop wrote:


JMRP may not be dead, but I have haven't received anything from it in at least 8 months.  That's 
just as far back as my "abuse" inbox goes. I don't actually know when we last received 
something from JMRP.  I believe you that it still works for you, but apparently it doesn't work for 
some of us.  I used to get them fairly routinely when people sent out their soccer club 
announcements and church newsletters and such (I presume someone felt it easier to click the 
"report as spam" button than to unsubscribe from the church newsletter).  I'm sure those 
folk are still sending their newsletters, and I know we still sometimes have a problem with a 
breached email account, but I don't get the JMRP messages anymore.

Meanwhile I'm still getting the S3150.  As of today it's been 8 days.  The 
response to my support ticket was that our IP address was not eligible for 
mitigation.and I'm not even sure what that means.  I reviewed logs and 
account statistics over this time period and I'm confident there's been no 
further spamming activity.  The last trouble was the one user on 6/22 who got 
phished and sent up to his daily limit of 200 messages.

I'd like to remain patient, but I'm starting to feel that this response is 
disproportionate to the original issue.


Adam, 


I just want to say that I feel your pain. We had a hacked account send
1k in messages to the MSFT infrastructure before it was disabled. As of now, I'm going back and forth with the support team to try and get our server removed from the block list. 


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Adam Moffett via mailop]

-- Original Message --
From: "Jonathan Leroy - Inikup via mailop" 
To: "mailop" 
Sent: 6/30/2020 8:57:18 PM
Subject: Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)


Le mar. 30 juin 2020 à 16:11, Adam Moffett via mailop
 a écrit :

 JMRP may not be dead, but I have haven't received anything from it in at
 least 8 months.


Sometimes reauthorizations are requested for some IP ranges in SNDS,
and Microsoft sends a validation email to the address shown in the
whois records for this CIDR.
If you have missed this email, you need to reauthorize your IP ranges in SNDS.


--
Jonathan Leroy



Interesting.  I'll check that out.


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Jonathan Leroy - Inikup via mailop]

Le mar. 30 juin 2020 à 16:11, Adam Moffett via mailop
 a écrit :
> JMRP may not be dead, but I have haven't received anything from it in at
> least 8 months.

Sometimes reauthorizations are requested for some IP ranges in SNDS,
and Microsoft sends a validation email to the address shown in the
whois records for this CIDR.
If you have missed this email, you need to reauthorize your IP ranges in SNDS.


--
Jonathan Leroy

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Adam Moffett via mailop]

JMRP may not be dead, but I have haven't received anything from it in at 
least 8 months.  That's just as far back as my "abuse" inbox goes. I 
don't actually know when we last received something from JMRP.  I 
believe you that it still works for you, but apparently it doesn't work 
for some of us.  I used to get them fairly routinely when people sent 
out their soccer club announcements and church newsletters and such (I 
presume someone felt it easier to click the "report as spam" button than 
to unsubscribe from the church newsletter).  I'm sure those folk are 
still sending their newsletters, and I know we still sometimes have a 
problem with a breached email account, but I don't get the JMRP messages 
anymore.


Meanwhile I'm still getting the S3150.  As of today it's been 8 days.  
The response to my support ticket was that our IP address was not 
eligible for mitigation.and I'm not even sure what that means.  I 
reviewed logs and account statistics over this time period and I'm 
confident there's been no further spamming activity.  The last trouble 
was the one user on 6/22 who got phished and sent up to his daily limit 
of 200 messages.


I'd like to remain patient, but I'm starting to feel that this response 
is disproportionate to the original issue.


-Adam


-- Original Message --
From: "Al Iverson via mailop" 
To: "mailop" 
Sent: 6/29/2020 12:13:30 PM
Subject: Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)


SNDS and JMRP are not dead.
We're receiving 35k-45k JMRP complaints daily.
We've got many hundreds of clients signed up for and accessing the
SNDS reputation data portal daily.
SNDS is buggy in places, but it's not dead.

Cheers,
Al Iverson


--
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Song a day! https://www.wombatmail.com
Deliverability! https://spamresource.com
And DNS Tools too! https://xnnd.com

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Hans-Martin Mosner via mailop]

Am 29.06.20 um 16:42 schrieb Michael Rathbun via mailop:
> On Mon, 29 Jun 2020 15:46:05 +0200, Hans-Martin Mosner via mailop
>  wrote:
>
>> Am 29.06.2020 13:16, schrieb Laura Atkins via mailop:
>>> On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that
>>> information with senders.
>>>
>>> laura
>>>
>> Sounds a bit like Kafka's "Der Prozess". Don't tell the defendant what 
>> he's being accused of...
> From the standpoint of those defending the castle from huge hordes of
> exploiters and looters, it's more like "Don't reveal details, like the exact
> location of all observation posts, the nature of your defenses and the
> strength of your force, to anybody not part of your efforts".

I fully sympathize with not letting spammers know what tricks you're using, and 
it's perfectly ok to give only vague
reasons in your SMTP error messages (although I prefer to be very clear, 
including wording to the effect of "I know who
you are, and I'll reject your mail regardless of the tricks you're trying on 
me".)

I would draw the line where someone identifies himself properly and brings a 
plausible explanation of events - "we only
acquired the IP range recently" can be checked and is pretty plausible. If 
someone contacts us about rejected mail they
can be pretty sure that I read their message and look into the matter.

Mail operators who refuse to accept mail from peer mail operators (not 
anonymous spammers) may find themselves in the
same boat pretty quickly, as they depend on getting their mail delivered to 
others as well. I've been on the verge of
rejecting mail from the Microsoft mail infrastructure with pretty scathing 
error messages due to their apparent
inactivity in getting a fix on hacked accounts more than once.

It wouldn't hurt them, I know, and when I correctly remember the way 
Microsoft-created mail software mutilates and hides
error messages my message would probably not even reach their customers.

Cheers,
Hans-Martin



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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

Might I also suggest that Microsoft needs a form or chat on their website
where other email server administrators can submit to
Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook mail server administrators.

I keep getting on chat explaining that Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook is
blocking one of our mail server IPs, and I keep getting responses "So,
you're using the outlook.com website, correct?"

The people that you get lucky enough to talk to at Microsoft have no clue
how Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook's mail servers actually work.  They can help
you click buttons, but that's about it.



On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 11:13 AM Al Iverson via mailop 
wrote:

> SNDS and JMRP are not dead.
> We're receiving 35k-45k JMRP complaints daily.
> We've got many hundreds of clients signed up for and accessing the
> SNDS reputation data portal daily.
> SNDS is buggy in places, but it's not dead.
>
> Cheers,
> Al Iverson
>
>
> --
> Al Iverson // Wombatmail // Chicago
> Song a day! https://www.wombatmail.com
> Deliverability! https://spamresource.com
> And DNS Tools too! https://xnnd.com
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[L. Mark Stone via mailop]

Same here. I can't get the "Submit" button to become active (using Firefox on a 
Mac). 

Regards, 
Mark 
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North America's Leading Zimbra VAR/BSP/Training Partner 
For Companies With Mission-Critical Email Needs 
Need more email security & compliance? Ask me about Mimecast! 



From: "Scott Mutter via mailop"  
To: mailop@mailop.org 
Sent: Monday, June 29, 2020 8:40:23 AM 
Subject: Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150) 

> For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs -- each time 
> it says (regardless of browser): 
> "We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again later" 
> Anyone else experienced that? 

Same here. See my post to this list from June 10th - Subject: "Hotmail - New 
Support Request form not working?" 

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 7:13 AM Sam Tuke via mailop < [ 
mailto:mailop@mailop.org | mailop@mailop.org ] > wrote: 


On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote: 
> On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote: 
>> Yep, fill out this 
>> form: [ http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866 | 
>> http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866 ] 

For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs -- each time it 
says (regardless of browser): 

"We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again later" 

Anyone else experienced that? 

Sam. 

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Paul Smith via mailop]

On 29/06/2020 13:08, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
> On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that 
information with senders.


And I understand the reasons for that.  But... can't you see how this 
turns into a "he said / she said" argument?


Without giving any message/sender/recipient details away (that the 
sending mail admin can't already see) they could give the ID of the 
message transaction


Their servers respond to the message with something like this:

250 2.6.0  [InternalId=1112312312313, 
Hostname=DB8EUR06HT227.eop-eur06.prod.protection.outlook.com] 1117027 
bytes in 0.520, 2096.624 KB/sec Queued mail for delivery -> 250 2.1.5


So, they could easily give out the "internalid" & "hostname" values 
without divulging any personal information about either the message 
sender or recipient or content, so there is no GDPR or data protection 
breach there. If the person they tell those to can use them to identify 
the message details, then that person could already have seen the 
message details. If not, then it tells them nothing.


Or, maybe, it's because Microsoft's lawyers know that their systems are 
a bit dodgy/arbitrary/random and don't want to risk all the problems 
being discovered?


--
Paul


--


Paul Smith Computer Services
Tel: 01484 855800
Vat No: GB 685 6987 53

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Michael Rathbun via mailop]

On Mon, 29 Jun 2020 15:46:05 +0200, Hans-Martin Mosner via mailop
 wrote:

>Am 29.06.2020 13:16, schrieb Laura Atkins via mailop:
>> On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that
>> information with senders.
>> 
>> laura
>> 
>
>Sounds a bit like Kafka's "Der Prozess". Don't tell the defendant what 
>he's being accused of...

From the standpoint of those defending the castle from huge hordes of
exploiters and looters, it's more like "Don't reveal details, like the exact
location of all observation posts, the nature of your defenses and the
strength of your force, to anybody not part of your efforts".

A particular spammer invested a good deal of effort in reverse-engineering the
things we had done to make sure that yesterday's onslaught was stopped at the
earliest possible moment.  We declined to cut his costs by letting him know
how his electronic used food was identified and properly disposed of.

If you are not a spammer, but see problems getting delivery, you might aim
your guns at the appropriate target (broadcasters of unsolicited email) rather
than the easy target (those who labour imperfectly to keep the 94% Scheißdreck
out of people's inboxes).

mdr (who has been one of those on the walls on several occasions)


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Hans-Martin Mosner via mailop]

Am 29.06.2020 13:16, schrieb Laura Atkins via mailop:

On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that
information with senders.

laura



Sounds a bit like Kafka's "Der Prozess". Don't tell the defendant what 
he's being accused of...


Cheers,
Hans-Martin

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

> For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs -- each
time it says (regardless of browser):
> "We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again later"
> Anyone else experienced that?

Same here.  See my post to this list from June 10th - Subject: "Hotmail -
New Support Request form not working?"

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 7:13 AM Sam Tuke via mailop 
wrote:

> On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote:
> > On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote:
> >> Yep, fill out this
> >> form:http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
>
> For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs -- each
> time it says (regardless of browser):
>
> "We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again later"
>
> Anyone else experienced that?
>
> Sam.
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Sam Tuke via mailop]

On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote:
> On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote:
>> Yep, fill out this 
>> form:http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866

For weeks I haven't been able to submit the form to remove RBLs -- each time it 
says (regardless of browser):

"We're sorry, but something went wrong on our end. Please try again later"

Anyone else experienced that?

Sam.

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

> On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that information
with senders.

And I understand the reasons for that.  But... can't you see how this turns
into a "he said / she said" argument?

Microsoft: "Your IP sent us spam, so we're blocking you."
Mail Server Admin: "I don't see any spam being sent, I don't see the IP on
any other blacklisting, can you prove it?"
Microsoft: "Uh... no... we can't detail that information - you just have to
trust us."
Microsoft: "Oh, and by the way, we're ignoring you now... so brownie points
for the whole trust thing!"

I guess if you block all incoming traffic on port 25 to your mail
servers... you're pretty much going to be guaranteed to stop all of your
users from receiving spam.

On Mon, Jun 29, 2020 at 6:16 AM Laura Atkins via mailop 
wrote:

> On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that information
> with senders.
>
> laura
>
>
>
> On 29 Jun 2020, at 06:18, Esteban Fonseca via mailop 
> wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> Has anyone ever had success getting feedback from Microsoft ? Stuff like
> what caused the block, and when, things that may help you nail down the
> issue ? We've got new IPs assigned by our ISP and they were blocked since
> they were assigned to us, meaning that it was not us (my company)  who
> caused the block, but they still say the IPs don't qualify for mitigation.
>
> Thanks a lot,
> Esteban.
>
>
> On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote:
>
>
> On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote:
>
> Yep, fill out this form:http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
> Wait a few days for a reply.
> First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response.
> Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers.
> You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly.
> They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show
> them the data.
> Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP
> qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within
> 48-72 hours.
>
>
>
> And this process does work.   Takes a few days and a few emails back and
> forwards.
>
> Our corporate email server IPv4 address got blocked at hotmail recently.
> Nothing received from the junk mail reporting system.
>
> It is slightly frustrating, because I'd like to know what we did wrong.
> I'd be the first to change something if we were.
>
> Maybe we did nothing wrong and just tripped a rate limit, filter or
> keyword or something.
>
> Tim Bray
>
>
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>
>
> --
> Having an Email Crisis?  We can help! 800 823-9674
>
> Laura Atkins
> Word to the Wise
> la...@wordtothewise.com
> (650) 437-0741
>
> Email Delivery Blog: https://wordtothewise.com/blog
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Laura Atkins via mailop]

On the advice of their lawyers Microsoft doesn’t share that information with 
senders. 

laura 



> On 29 Jun 2020, at 06:18, Esteban Fonseca via mailop  
> wrote:
> 
> Hello all,
> 
> Has anyone ever had success getting feedback from Microsoft ? Stuff like what 
> caused the block, and when, things that may help you nail down the issue ? 
> We've got new IPs assigned by our ISP and they were blocked since they were 
> assigned to us, meaning that it was not us (my company)  who caused the 
> block, but they still say the IPs don't qualify for mitigation.
> 
> Thanks a lot,
> Esteban.
> 
> 
> On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote:
>> 
>> On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote: 
>>> Yep, fill out this form:http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866 
>>>  
>>> Wait a few days for a reply. 
>>> First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response. 
>>> Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers. 
>>> You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly. 
>>> They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show 
>>> them the data. 
>>> Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP 
>>> qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within 
>>> 48-72 hours. 
>> 
>> 
>> And this process does work.   Takes a few days and a few emails back and 
>> forwards. 
>> 
>> Our corporate email server IPv4 address got blocked at hotmail recently.   
>> Nothing received from the junk mail reporting system. 
>> 
>> It is slightly frustrating, because I'd like to know what we did wrong.   
>> I'd be the first to change something if we were. 
>> 
>> Maybe we did nothing wrong and just tripped a rate limit, filter or keyword 
>> or something. 
>> 
>> Tim Bray 
>> 
>> 
>> ___ 
>> mailop mailing list 
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>>  
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-- 
Having an Email Crisis?  We can help! 800 823-9674 

Laura Atkins
Word to the Wise
la...@wordtothewise.com
(650) 437-0741  

Email Delivery Blog: https://wordtothewise.com/blog 







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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Esteban Fonseca via mailop]

Hello all,

Has anyone ever had success getting feedback from Microsoft ? Stuff like
what caused the block, and when, things that may help you nail down the
issue ? We've got new IPs assigned by our ISP and they were blocked since
they were assigned to us, meaning that it was not us (my company)  who
caused the block, but they still say the IPs don't qualify for mitigation.

Thanks a lot,
Esteban.


On 27/06/2020 5:54 am, Tim Bray via mailop wrote:


On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote:

Yep, fill out this form:http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
Wait a few days for a reply.
First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response.
Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers.
You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly.
They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show
them the data.
Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP
qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within
48-72 hours.



And this process does work.   Takes a few days and a few emails back and
forwards.

Our corporate email server IPv4 address got blocked at hotmail recently.
Nothing received from the junk mail reporting system.

It is slightly frustrating, because I'd like to know what we did wrong.
I'd be the first to change something if we were.

Maybe we did nothing wrong and just tripped a rate limit, filter or keyword
or something.

Tim Bray


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Roger Marquis via mailop]

Michael Orlitzky wrote:

 * Why won't Exchange follow the SMTP standards?
 * Why can't Outlook implement STARTTLS correctly?
 * Can Outlook finally support CalDAV and CardDAV?
 * How come all my mail comes through as winmail.dat?


Don't forget message body modifications that break DKIM and cause MS to silently
discard incoming messages.  Laura wrote about this almost 4 years ago:

yet we're still seeing it, as recently as last month.

There's also the fetching and embedding of URLs referenced (not included) in the
message body so MS can serve the content from their own servers without 
necessarily
checking whether that content is out of date.

All of this really should be a FAQ somewhere, so when your customer complains
that mail wasn't delivered (to MS/Outlook/Hotmail/...) you can point them to the
many potential reasons why.

Roger Marquis

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Tim Bray via mailop]

On 24/06/2020 23:03, Al Iverson via mailop wrote:

Yep, fill out this form:http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
Wait a few days for a reply.
First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response.
Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers.
You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly.
They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show
them the data.
Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP
qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within
48-72 hours.



And this process does work.   Takes a few days and a few emails back and 
forwards.


Our corporate email server IPv4 address got blocked at hotmail 
recently.   Nothing received from the junk mail reporting system.


It is slightly frustrating, because I'd like to know what we did 
wrong.   I'd be the first to change something if we were.


Maybe we did nothing wrong and just tripped a rate limit, filter or 
keyword or something.


Tim Bray


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[sivasubramanian muthusamy via mailop]

If a part of the ISP's network is on a spam list, and the mailop mail
server is on the  same IP block, there are two issues here, 1) the issue of
the difficulties in reaching out the filter (in this case Microsoft) and
other filters still unknown, and the lengthy process, if at all responsive,
of rectifying the false record. This is not easy.  2) How does one ask for
an IP address or a small block, as a new block that is not a part of, nor
in the vicinity of,  a contaminated block? Or if it is a reassigned IP
address, how does one ask the RIR / NIR to check the past history of the IP
address block that is being reassigned (like how to verify the service
history of a used car) ?



Sivasubramanian M 
6.inter...@gmail.com
twitter.com/shivaindia

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020 at 3:41 AM Al Iverson via mailop 
wrote:

> Yep, fill out this form: http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
> Wait a few days for a reply.
> First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response.
> Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers.
> You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly.
> They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show
> them the data.
> Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP
> qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within
> 48-72 hours.
> And that might even be true!
>
> Good luck.
>
> Cheers,
> Al Iverson
>
> On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 4:28 PM Adam Moffett via mailop
>  wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone have any insight into how we get onto (or off) a Microsoft
> block list?
> >
> > I started seeing these bounces around midnight on Tuesday:
> >
> > "550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [204.80.232.21] weren't sent.
> Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network
> is on our block list (S3150). You can also refer your provider to
> http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. "
> >
> > We don't have any current issues, but on Monday morning we did have a
> compromised customer account send 200 spam emails. 200 triggered a limit
> and they couldn't send any more.  Later in the morning we disabled the
> compromised account.  This would have been about 18 hours before we started
> seeing the bounces shown above.  I'm assuming this is related, but I don't
> know how I could have addressed the issue any faster, and I don't know why
> there would be such a delayed reaction from Microsoft's system.
> >
> > Does anyone know anything of interest about this?
> >
> >
> > -- Adam Moffett, Network Engineer
> > Plexicomm - Internet Solutions | www.plexicomm.net
> > Office: 1.866.759.4678 x104
> >
> > ___
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>
>
>
> --
> Al Iverson // Wombatmail // Chicago
> Song a day! https://www.wombatmail.com
> Deliverability! https://spamresource.com
> And DNS Tools too! https://xnnd.com
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Michael Rathbun via mailop]

On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 10:46:57 -0500, Scott Mutter via mailop
 wrote:

>But the real sucky part is - we're the ones that get blamed by our
>customers when Microsoft imposes such a strict block.  From our customers
>point of view - Microsoft is too large of a company to do any wrong, it
>can't be their fault.  I've really taken the step to just recommend folks
>not to use Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook for any of their email service because
>of these strict measures and lack of communication from
>Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook.  Maybe that turns customers off, but at this
>point I don't have a lot to lose - they're already pissed at us because
>Microsoft is blocking our server's IP address.

This is a realistic approach.  One of my clients has decided not to accept
signups from certain "public" services that have been especially problematic. 
There are, after all, cost/benefit decisions to be made on your end as well.

mdr
-- 
Fail-safe systems fail by failing to fail safe.


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

I'm definitely agitated with Microsoft/Hotmail/Live/Outlook at the moment
regarding an IP block.  But I'll also agree that I can see their point and
reason for being strict with their blocks.  They don't really care if
they're blocking legitimate mail from small time email servers.

But the real sucky part is - we're the ones that get blamed by our
customers when Microsoft imposes such a strict block.  From our customers
point of view - Microsoft is too large of a company to do any wrong, it
can't be their fault.  I've really taken the step to just recommend folks
not to use Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook for any of their email service because
of these strict measures and lack of communication from
Microsoft/Hotmail/Outlook.  Maybe that turns customers off, but at this
point I don't have a lot to lose - they're already pissed at us because
Microsoft is blocking our server's IP address.

On Thu, Jun 25, 2020 at 9:34 AM Adam Moffett via mailop 
wrote:

>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Michael Rathbun via mailop" 
> To: mailop@mailop.org
> Sent: 6/24/2020 10:28:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)
>
> >On 24 Jun 2020 21:50:13 -0400, John Levine via mailop 
> >wrote:
> >
> >>To point out the obvious, you're not their customer. Why should they
> >>care unless an actual customer complains?
> >
> >And the actual customers are the advertisers, not the persons using "free"
> >email services, and certainly not any entity sending email to those
> persons.
> >
> That's an excellent point.  It doesn't help with the blacklisting, but I
> think it drives to the point of why policy might be the way it is and
> why it might work for them as-is.  It doesn't hurt ad revenue if one of
> their users can't receive something from me, and it might help their ad
> revenue to keep the signal-to-noise ratio as high as possible.  So there
> may be an incentive on their end to be strict.
>
> I'm not saying I like it, but I think I can accept the reality of it.
>
> -Adam
>
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Adam Moffett via mailop]

-- Original Message --
From: "Michael Rathbun via mailop" 
To: mailop@mailop.org
Sent: 6/24/2020 10:28:17 PM
Subject: Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)


On 24 Jun 2020 21:50:13 -0400, John Levine via mailop 
wrote:


To point out the obvious, you're not their customer. Why should they
care unless an actual customer complains?


And the actual customers are the advertisers, not the persons using "free"
email services, and certainly not any entity sending email to those persons.

That's an excellent point.  It doesn't help with the blacklisting, but I 
think it drives to the point of why policy might be the way it is and 
why it might work for them as-is.  It doesn't hurt ad revenue if one of 
their users can't receive something from me, and it might help their ad 
revenue to keep the signal-to-noise ratio as high as possible.  So there 
may be an incentive on their end to be strict.


I'm not saying I like it, but I think I can accept the reality of it.

-Adam


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Michael Orlitzky via mailop]

On 2020-06-25 01:33, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
> 
> Just once, I'd love to get a response from Microsoft that explains why
> they're the only ones blocking an IP address.

When your customers can't send email to Microsoft or Gmail, they cancel
their account with you and move their email to Microsoft or Gmail.

  * Why won't Exchange follow the SMTP standards?
  * Why can't Outlook implement STARTTLS correctly?
  * Can Outlook finally support CalDAV and CardDAV?
  * How come all my mail comes through as winmail.dat?

All of these questions from the past 20 years have the same answer. It's
simply a novel method to outlaw not paying them.

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

That's true - I'm not a customer.  But who is a customer?  What is defined
as a customer?  Is a hotmail.com/live.com/outlook.com email user a
"customer"?  And if so... how do they contact a real live human being at
Microsoft to voice their concerns about Microsoft's unilateral IP blocking
of other mail servers?  The form referenced above is geared more towards
the administrators of those blocked servers who have to beg, plead, and
grovel for someone to remove their IP from being blocked by Microsoft.  Or
maybe you get the - "As previously stated, your IP(s) do not qualify for
mitigation at this time.  I do apologize, but I am unable to provide any
details about this situation since we do not have the liberty to discuss
the nature of the block." response even though the IP is not blocked any
where else (it has a 99 Sender Score) and wait out your time in SOL land.

Or is "customer" someone that pays for this service?

The joke has always been that hotmail.com/live.com/outlook.com/msn.com etc.
email addresses are the bottom feeders.  Because they either get inundated
with spam or Microsoft blocks the wrong IPs, holding them hostage
indefinitely and legitimate mail is not able to get sent through to these
email addresses.  When was the last time you got any correspondence from
an @hotmail.com address and thought "hey! that guy means business!"?

Just once, I'd love to get a response from Microsoft that explains why
they're the only ones blocking an IP address.  I mean, I've dealt with spam
incidents - probably much like the OP - for the past 20+ years and every
time, those spam messages go out to other mail servers, Yahoo, Gmail, any
of the ReturnPath users, Proofpoint, CBL - every where.  If a spam incident
is so unbelievably bad that it can never, ever be mitigated... it stands to
reason that the IP would show up in one of these other systems.  But if it
doesn't, and Microsoft is the only one blocking it... what does that tell
you?


On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 8:50 PM John Levine via mailop 
wrote:

> In article  glr4dc1zxleb6z6b+j2tjg+qzqpfmtcgji...@mail.gmail.com> you write:
> >
> >You would think a company like Microsoft would have a better solution to
> >all of this.
>
> To point out the obvious, you're not their customer. Why should they
> care unless an actual customer complains?
>
> R's,
> John
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Michael Rathbun via mailop]

On 24 Jun 2020 21:50:13 -0400, John Levine via mailop 
wrote:

>To point out the obvious, you're not their customer. Why should they
>care unless an actual customer complains?

And the actual customers are the advertisers, not the persons using "free"
email services, and certainly not any entity sending email to those persons.

Perceived excess spam drives out the eyes for the adverts, and abandoned
accounts that still receive spam (accounting for perhaps 80% of the total
infrastructure cost) will be put to use to reduce the total theft-of-service
load the system endures...

Everyone concerned is getting close to the best that can be expected.

mdr (who has been there and seen that)
-- 
 "There are no laws here, only agreements."  
-- Masahiko


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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[John Levine via mailop]

In article  
you write:
>
>You would think a company like Microsoft would have a better solution to
>all of this.

To point out the obvious, you're not their customer. Why should they
care unless an actual customer complains?

R's,
John

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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

You would think a company like Microsoft would have a better solution to
all of this.

Once you get blocked by Microsoft it's a 6 week race (because they'll only
reply about once a week) to plow through all of the crud replies they send
you, to actually getting something accomplished.  Except, after 6 weeks all
of your clients have left you, so it's kind of pointless.

Factor in also that they tend to block IPs for no apparent reason.  I'd be
curious to know if your IP address is listed with any other major
blacklisting services, SpamHaus, Spamcop, etc.  Or did your abuse incident
only send spam out to Microsoft controlled email servers?

On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 5:03 PM Al Iverson via mailop 
wrote:

> Yep, fill out this form: http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
> Wait a few days for a reply.
> First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response.
> Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers.
> You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly.
> They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show
> them the data.
> Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP
> qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within
> 48-72 hours.
> And that might even be true!
>
> Good luck.
>
> Cheers,
> Al Iverson
>
> On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 4:28 PM Adam Moffett via mailop
>  wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone have any insight into how we get onto (or off) a Microsoft
> block list?
> >
> > I started seeing these bounces around midnight on Tuesday:
> >
> > "550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [204.80.232.21] weren't sent.
> Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their network
> is on our block list (S3150). You can also refer your provider to
> http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. "
> >
> > We don't have any current issues, but on Monday morning we did have a
> compromised customer account send 200 spam emails. 200 triggered a limit
> and they couldn't send any more.  Later in the morning we disabled the
> compromised account.  This would have been about 18 hours before we started
> seeing the bounces shown above.  I'm assuming this is related, but I don't
> know how I could have addressed the issue any faster, and I don't know why
> there would be such a delayed reaction from Microsoft's system.
> >
> > Does anyone know anything of interest about this?
> >
> >
> > -- Adam Moffett, Network Engineer
> > Plexicomm - Internet Solutions | www.plexicomm.net
> > Office: 1.866.759.4678 x104
> >
> > ___
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>
>
>
> --
> Al Iverson // Wombatmail // Chicago
> Song a day! https://www.wombatmail.com
> Deliverability! https://spamresource.com
> And DNS Tools too! https://xnnd.com
>
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Re: [mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Al Iverson via mailop]

Yep, fill out this form: http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=614866
Wait a few days for a reply.
First reply might just be a "we're routing your ticket" response.
Second reply might be useful, or it might be completely bonkers.
You might have to calmly state your case repeatedly.
They might say they see nothing wrong. Stick to your guns and show
them the data.
Eventually, after a number of replies, they'll say that the IP
qualifies for mitigation and that the block will be rescinded within
48-72 hours.
And that might even be true!

Good luck.

Cheers,
Al Iverson

On Wed, Jun 24, 2020 at 4:28 PM Adam Moffett via mailop
 wrote:
>
> Does anyone have any insight into how we get onto (or off) a Microsoft block 
> list?
>
> I started seeing these bounces around midnight on Tuesday:
>
> "550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [204.80.232.21] weren't sent. Please 
> contact your Internet service provider since part of their network is on our 
> block list (S3150). You can also refer your provider to 
> http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. "
>
> We don't have any current issues, but on Monday morning we did have a 
> compromised customer account send 200 spam emails. 200 triggered a limit and 
> they couldn't send any more.  Later in the morning we disabled the 
> compromised account.  This would have been about 18 hours before we started 
> seeing the bounces shown above.  I'm assuming this is related, but I don't 
> know how I could have addressed the issue any faster, and I don't know why 
> there would be such a delayed reaction from Microsoft's system.
>
> Does anyone know anything of interest about this?
>
>
> -- Adam Moffett, Network Engineer
> Plexicomm - Internet Solutions | www.plexicomm.net
> Office: 1.866.759.4678 x104
>
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Al Iverson // Wombatmail // Chicago
Song a day! https://www.wombatmail.com
Deliverability! https://spamresource.com
And DNS Tools too! https://xnnd.com

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[mailop] Microsoft Block list (S3150)

[Adam Moffett via mailop]

Does anyone have any insight into how we get onto (or off) a Microsoft 
block list?


I started seeing these bounces around midnight on Tuesday:

"550 5.7.1 Unfortunately, messages from [204.80.232.21] weren't sent. 
Please contact your Internet service provider since part of their 
network is on our block list (S3150). You can also refer your provider 
to http://mail.live.com/mail/troubleshooting.aspx#errors. "


We don't have any current issues, but on Monday morning we did have a 
compromised customer account send 200 spam emails. 200 triggered a limit 
and they couldn't send any more.  Later in the morning we disabled the 
compromised account.  This would have been about 18 hours before we 
started seeing the bounces shown above.  I'm assuming this is related, 
but I don't know how I could have addressed the issue any faster, and I 
don't know why there would be such a delayed reaction from Microsoft's 
system.


Does anyone know anything of interest about this?


-- Adam Moffett, Network Engineer
Plexicomm - Internet Solutions | www.plexicomm.net
Office: 1.866.759.4678 x104
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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Luis E. Muñoz via mailop]

On 26 Feb 2020, at 14:18, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:


[⋯] Do any DNS resolvers actually cache
data for the period stated in the TTL these days?


Many do. If you're operating a recursive for any sizable user 
population, you want to minimize the response time. Having the response 
in your local cache is actually as fast as you can get. Then again, with 
long TTLs comes the longevity of errors. This is why public resolvers 
have heuristics / buttons to forget data ahead of time or trigger a 
refresh.


I've seen some studies that compare large recursive resolver 
performance, that left me with the impression that at some sites, the 
resolvers are resource-starved. I wouldn't think this is a deliberate 
stance, as it degrades the quality perception of customers.


If you look at gmail.com it's TTL is 300 seconds - now... granted that 
IP
address is not used to actually connect to mail server to send out 
mail,

it's just the IP address for the front facing gmail.com.


Likely, they need to be able to point to a wholly different anycast node 
on a whim, or don't want you to carry a cached response when roaming 
between networks. I would not consider any large sender as a good 
example of the discussion on this context, because with that scale, come 
very specific challenges.


Many of the infrastructure elements I manage have sub-1d TTLs in their 
DNS records except for things like TLSA records and such. In our case, 
this is to ensure that changes can be deployed quickly. This of course 
comes with the price that we will disappear much faster from the DNS if 
we manage to screw up our geo-diverse name servers.


I definitely would subscribe to the notion that TTL should not matter 
for

this.  But should and does are two different things.


+1

-lem

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Luis E. Muñoz via mailop]

On 26 Feb 2020, at 13:53, Lyle Giese via mailop wrote:

Don't know if ATT looks at this but I know they used to.  The TTL for 
the A record for server.divebums.com is 900 seconds.  If checking 
this parameter, it was recommended that this be at least 12 hrs or 
43,200 seconds.  The theory was that 900 seconds indicated it was on 
a dynamic ip address.


I've seen that criteria used in the past in a DNS blacklist. TBH, I 
haven't seen this mentioned anywhere else in relation to deciding 
whether an IP address is static or not. In particular, there are many 
reasons you might want to have a short TTL – geo load balancing is 
just one of them.


I would tend to think that an organization doing that is trying very 
hard to be "static", as in "being there to receive your email" :-)


-lem

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

I really wouldn't think TTL would be a determining factor - at least if it
is I'd argue against it being such.  Do any DNS resolvers actually cache
data for the period stated in the TTL these days?  Too long of a TTL, I
think resolvers will flush it out before then anyway.  Maybe 900 is too
short, but I'd argue that looking at TTL isn't a good way to determine
spammyness.

If you look at gmail.com it's TTL is 300 seconds - now... granted that IP
address is not used to actually connect to mail server to send out mail,
it's just the IP address for the front facing gmail.com.

If you look at Yahoo, one of their sending IPs - 98.137.65.31 - resolves to
sonic315-55.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com. and
sonic315-55.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com. has a TTL of 1800 seconds.
Obviously, 1800 is larger than 900, but enough to worry about?

I definitely would subscribe to the notion that TTL should not matter for
this.  But should and does are two different things.

On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 3:53 PM Lyle Giese via mailop 
wrote:

> Don't know if ATT looks at this but I know they used to.  The TTL for the
> A record for server.divebums.com is 900 seconds.  If checking this
> parameter, it was recommended that this be at least 12 hrs or 43,200
> seconds.  The theory was that 900 seconds indicated it was on a dynamic ip
> address.
>
> Good luck!
>
> Lyle Giese
>
> LCR Computer Services, Inc.
> On 2020-02-26 15:25, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
>
> I know this will come as a complete and absolute shock to most everyone
> here.
>
> It's been 15 days since I originally posted this on this list.  I was told
> to wait about a week to let them "weed" out all of the clutter AT likely
> gets from this abuse address... so I waited 2 weeks.
>
> The shocking part... it's still blocked.  And I haven't received a peep
> from AT other than the canned response I got on February 10th (16 days
> ago).
>
> So basically all I've done is wasted 16 days waiting for a response or
> resolution.
>
> And yet people wonder why I have zero faith in the way any of these "big"
> mail providers address disputes to their clandestine blacklisting and
> blocking process.
>
> Am I suppose to wait another decade or two for a response or resolution
> from AT regarding this?
>
> For what it's worth - the IP address in this particular case
> is 192.158.224.5 - I would very much love for someone to tell me what is
> wrong with this IP address and why AT is blacklisting it.  What services
> do you all recommend to go to to check the reputation of a mail server's IP
> address?  I've been using Senderscore, Senderbase, Proofpoint, Symantec,
> Spamhaus, Spamcop - this IP address comes up clean at all of those places -
> but I guess those aren't good sources to double check with?
>
> I'm open to suggestions on how I'm suppose to handle this and what I need
> to do to resolve this.  Apparently checking the IP's reputation at those
> sites isn't good enough.  And apparently sending an email to
> abuse_...@abuse-att.net is not good enough.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 9:50 AM Scott Mutter via mailop 
> wrote:
>
>> Anybody from AT able to check a couple of abuse tickets for me?
>>
>> AT is blocking one of our servers, I sent messages on February 8th and
>> February 10th to abuse_...@abuse-att.net but have not heard anything
>> back - other than the canned response - and the IP is still blocked.
>>
>> The rejection notice says to email abuse_...@abuse-att.net but I'm not
>> sure if that is still valid.
>>
>> Ticket numbers are:
>>
>> 020820-180048-39537-00
>> 021020-164333-46154-00
>>
>> I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse requests -
>> but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid requests from the
>> invalid requests.
>>
>> If abuse_...@abuse-att.net is no longer valid, then perhaps the
>> rejection notice needs to be updated.
>>
>>
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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Lyle Giese via mailop]

Don't know if ATT looks at this but I know they used to.  The TTL for 
the A record for server.divebums.com is 900 seconds.  If checking this 
parameter, it was recommended that this be at least 12 hrs or 43,200 
seconds.  The theory was that 900 seconds indicated it was on a dynamic 
ip address.


Good luck!

Lyle Giese

LCR Computer Services, Inc.

On 2020-02-26 15:25, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
I know this will come as a complete and absolute shock to most 
everyone here.


It's been 15 days since I originally posted this on this list.  I was 
told to wait about a week to let them "weed" out all of the clutter 
AT likely gets from this abuse address... so I waited 2 weeks.


The shocking part... it's still blocked.  And I haven't received a 
peep from AT other than the canned response I got on February 10th 
(16 days ago).


So basically all I've done is wasted 16 days waiting for a response or 
resolution.


And yet people wonder why I have zero faith in the way any of these 
"big" mail providers address disputes to their clandestine 
blacklisting and blocking process.


Am I suppose to wait another decade or two for a response or 
resolution from AT regarding this?


For what it's worth - the IP address in this particular case 
is 192.158.224.5 - I would very much love for someone to tell me what 
is wrong with this IP address and why AT is blacklisting it.  What 
services do you all recommend to go to to check the reputation of a 
mail server's IP address?  I've been using Senderscore, Senderbase, 
Proofpoint, Symantec, Spamhaus, Spamcop - this IP address comes up 
clean at all of those places - but I guess those aren't good sources 
to double check with?


I'm open to suggestions on how I'm suppose to handle this and what I 
need to do to resolve this.  Apparently checking the IP's reputation 
at those sites isn't good enough.  And apparently sending an email to 
abuse_...@abuse-att.net  is not good 
enough.




On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 9:50 AM Scott Mutter via mailop 
mailto:mailop@mailop.org>> wrote:


Anybody from AT able to check a couple of abuse tickets for me?

AT is blocking one of our servers, I sent messages on February
8th and February 10th to abuse_...@abuse-att.net
 but have not heard anything back
- other than the canned response - and the IP is still blocked.

The rejection notice says to email abuse_...@abuse-att.net
 but I'm not sure if that is still
valid.

Ticket numbers are:

020820-180048-39537-00
021020-164333-46154-00

I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse
requests - but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid
requests from the invalid requests.

If abuse_...@abuse-att.net  is no
longer valid, then perhaps the rejection notice needs to be updated.


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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Michael Peddemors via mailop]

host 192.158.224.5
5.224.158.192.in-addr.ARPA domain name pointer server.divebums.com

host -t TXT divebums.com
divebums.com descriptive text "v=spf1 ip4:192.158.224.5 
ip4:174.36.50.170 ip4:192.110.160.37 +ip4:168.235.104.229 
ip4:192.158.224.5 a mx -all"


NetRange:   192.158.224.0 - 192.158.231.255
CIDR:   192.158.224.0/21
NetName:H4Y-IPV4-BLK2
NetHandle:  NET-192-158-224-0-2
Parent: VIVID-HOSTING-2 (NET-192-158-224-0-1)
NetType:Reallocated
OriginAS:   AS397373, AS17216
Organization:   H4Y Technologies LLC (HTL-33)
RegDate:2014-08-07
Updated:2019-04-16
Comment:http://www.iwfhosting.net
Comment:http://www.h4y.us
Comment:Standard NOC hours are 24/7
Ref:https://rdap.arin.net/registry/ip/192.158.224.0


OrgName:H4Y Technologies LLC

Well, the hosting provider should be able to help.  Ask them to provide 
you with 'rwhois' listing for your IP Address, so that you have clear 
operational authority, and transparency, and so people can see when you 
started using the IP Address.


"Assumming" that your mailing list software is set up correctly to only 
be a confirmed double opt-in, you 'should' find that most abuse teams 
will be very responsive.


Many of them lurk on this list as well of course, but this list isn't 
for 'ranting' (most of the time).  More flies with honey and all that.


Be nice in your ask, and you will see faster responses usually, try not 
to make the request sound like a 'bit** fest'..


Posting this once more.. More people need to read it.

https://www.m3aawg.org/sites/default/files/m3aawg-blocklist-help-bp-2018-02.pdf




On 2020-02-26 1:25 p.m., Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
I know this will come as a complete and absolute shock to most everyone 
here.


It's been 15 days since I originally posted this on this list.  I was 
told to wait about a week to let them "weed" out all of the clutter AT 
likely gets from this abuse address... so I waited 2 weeks.


The shocking part... it's still blocked.  And I haven't received a peep 
from AT other than the canned response I got on February 10th (16 days 
ago).


So basically all I've done is wasted 16 days waiting for a response or 
resolution.


And yet people wonder why I have zero faith in the way any of these 
"big" mail providers address disputes to their clandestine blacklisting 
and blocking process.


Am I suppose to wait another decade or two for a response or resolution 
from AT regarding this?


For what it's worth - the IP address in this particular case 
is 192.158.224.5 - I would very much love for someone to tell me what is 
wrong with this IP address and why AT is blacklisting it.  What 
services do you all recommend to go to to check the reputation of a mail 
server's IP address?  I've been using Senderscore, Senderbase, 
Proofpoint, Symantec, Spamhaus, Spamcop - this IP address comes up clean 
at all of those places - but I guess those aren't good sources to double 
check with?


I'm open to suggestions on how I'm suppose to handle this and what I 
need to do to resolve this.  Apparently checking the IP's reputation at 
those sites isn't good enough.  And apparently sending an email to 
abuse_...@abuse-att.net  is not good enough.




On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 9:50 AM Scott Mutter via mailop 
mailto:mailop@mailop.org>> wrote:


Anybody from AT able to check a couple of abuse tickets for me?

AT is blocking one of our servers, I sent messages on February 8th
and February 10th to abuse_...@abuse-att.net
 but have not heard anything back -
other than the canned response - and the IP is still blocked.

The rejection notice says to email abuse_...@abuse-att.net
 but I'm not sure if that is still
valid.

Ticket numbers are:

020820-180048-39537-00
021020-164333-46154-00

I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse
requests - but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid
requests from the invalid requests.

If abuse_...@abuse-att.net  is no
longer valid, then perhaps the rejection notice needs to be updated.


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Visit us at http://www.linuxmagic.com @linuxmagic
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info http://www.wizard.ca
"LinuxMagic" a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.

Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

I know this will come as a complete and absolute shock to most everyone
here.

It's been 15 days since I originally posted this on this list.  I was told
to wait about a week to let them "weed" out all of the clutter AT likely
gets from this abuse address... so I waited 2 weeks.

The shocking part... it's still blocked.  And I haven't received a peep
from AT other than the canned response I got on February 10th (16 days
ago).

So basically all I've done is wasted 16 days waiting for a response or
resolution.

And yet people wonder why I have zero faith in the way any of these "big"
mail providers address disputes to their clandestine blacklisting and
blocking process.

Am I suppose to wait another decade or two for a response or resolution
from AT regarding this?

For what it's worth - the IP address in this particular case
is 192.158.224.5 - I would very much love for someone to tell me what is
wrong with this IP address and why AT is blacklisting it.  What services
do you all recommend to go to to check the reputation of a mail server's IP
address?  I've been using Senderscore, Senderbase, Proofpoint, Symantec,
Spamhaus, Spamcop - this IP address comes up clean at all of those places -
but I guess those aren't good sources to double check with?

I'm open to suggestions on how I'm suppose to handle this and what I need
to do to resolve this.  Apparently checking the IP's reputation at those
sites isn't good enough.  And apparently sending an email to
abuse_...@abuse-att.net is not good enough.



On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 9:50 AM Scott Mutter via mailop 
wrote:

> Anybody from AT able to check a couple of abuse tickets for me?
>
> AT is blocking one of our servers, I sent messages on February 8th and
> February 10th to abuse_...@abuse-att.net but have not heard anything back
> - other than the canned response - and the IP is still blocked.
>
> The rejection notice says to email abuse_...@abuse-att.net but I'm not
> sure if that is still valid.
>
> Ticket numbers are:
>
> 020820-180048-39537-00
> 021020-164333-46154-00
>
> I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse requests -
> but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid requests from the
> invalid requests.
>
> If abuse_...@abuse-att.net is no longer valid, then perhaps the rejection
> notice needs to be updated.
>
>
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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Andrew C Aitchison via mailop]

On 12/02/2020 16:47, Andrew C Aitchison via mailop wrote:


Does this fly, or am I missing something critical ?
If you block for content or black-listed host and there is a DMARC
reporting address report the appropriate details to the DMARC
reporting address(es) ?

OK, I haven't thought through when to use the connecting IP address
and when the sending domain to determine where to send reports.



On Wed, 12 Feb 2020, Steve Atkins via mailop wrote:

Assuming you're a bad actor - and, statistically, you are


Given that most (is it still >90%) email is spam,
by that argument why are you accepting *any* external email ?


how does my explaining to you how my mail filters identified
your mail as unwanted, and what you should modify to avoid
those filters benefit my users?


I'm not suggesting you report the individual filter scores.

If operators like Scott can see the spam their users are sending then
complaining when it is not being received they can educate their users.
That way your users will receive wanted mail and only wanted mail 
from Scott's users.


Laura suggests that no one reads DMARC reports.
Maybe nearly so, but the information Scott wants
would be be in his hands should he choose to look,
and he *is* looking for places to look.

--
Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK
and...@aitchison.me.uk

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Laura Atkins via mailop]

> On 12 Feb 2020, at 16:47, Andrew C Aitchison via mailop  
> wrote:
> Maybe other blacklists isn't a good indicator.  But if the IP is not
>> listed in Spamhaus, Spamcop, Sorbs, Proofpoint, Symantec (lately I'm
>> having more issues with Symantec, so I'm not sure how reliable it is
>> anymore), and if the IP has a solid Senderscore and a good
>> reputation at Senderbase, and I'm literally just not seeing any
>> malicious activity on the server ... what else am I suppose to
>> check?
> 
> Does this fly, or am I missing something critical ?
> If you block for content or black-listed host and there is a DMARC
> reporting address report the appropriate details to the DMARC
> reporting address(es) ?

That isn’t going to work. In many cases, DMARC is handled by a 3rd party 
processor. In nearly all cases, DMARC is handled by automation and the raw mail 
is never seen by a human. 

laura

-- 
Having an Email Crisis?  We can help! 800 823-9674 

Laura Atkins
Word to the Wise
la...@wordtothewise.com
(650) 437-0741  

Email Delivery Blog: https://wordtothewise.com/blog 







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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Steve Atkins via mailop]

On 12/02/2020 16:47, Andrew C Aitchison via mailop wrote:


Does this fly, or am I missing something critical ?
If you block for content or black-listed host and there is a DMARC
reporting address report the appropriate details to the DMARC
reporting address(es) ?

OK, I haven't thought through when to use the connecting IP address
and when the sending domain to determine where to send reports.

Assuming you're a bad actor - and, statistically, you are - how does my 
explaining to you how my mail filters identified your mail as unwanted, 
and what you should modify to avoid those filters benefit my users?


Cheers,
  Steve


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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Andrew C Aitchison via mailop]

On Wed, 12 Feb 2020, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:


Look, I understand it's a thin line battling spam and abusive
behavior from mail servers.  I've pleaded with many blacklist
operators to give me details as to why they are blacklisting one of
our servers.  I can probably count on 1 hand how many times I've
gotten information from them in the 20+ years I've been doing this.
And I get it.  If I'm a spammer and you disclose what is causing the
IP to be blacklisted, then I'll change my tactics to get around that
method.

But you've also got to see it from the other perspective.  If I'm
not seeing any activity to indicate that the IP is sending out
spam... how do you expect me to stop whatever activity is causing
you to blacklist the server (I'm assuming you're blocking it because
of some type of activity... surely you're not blocking it just
because you can)?

Maybe other blacklists isn't a good indicator.  But if the IP is not
listed in Spamhaus, Spamcop, Sorbs, Proofpoint, Symantec (lately I'm
having more issues with Symantec, so I'm not sure how reliable it is
anymore), and if the IP has a solid Senderscore and a good
reputation at Senderbase, and I'm literally just not seeing any
malicious activity on the server ... what else am I suppose to
check?


Does this fly, or am I missing something critical ?
If you block for content or black-listed host and there is a DMARC
reporting address report the appropriate details to the DMARC
reporting address(es) ?

OK, I haven't thought through when to use the connecting IP address
and when the sending domain to determine where to send reports.

--
Andrew C. Aitchison Kendal, UK
and...@aitchison.me.uk

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Bill Cole via mailop]

On 12 Feb 2020, at 7:02, Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop wrote:


Dnia 12.02.2020 o godz. 11:25:39 Laura Atkins via mailop pisze:
Right, but the way around, for bad behavior one should have and 
provide

data to prove it.



Why?


Isn't it obvious?

If you are accusing someone of any behaviour, you should have at least 
some
evidence to back up your words. Otherwise, it's just arbitrary 
assumption.


I wonder why someone would ever ask such question as you asked.


Experience.

It has been true for many years that the overwhelming majority of 
previously unfamiliar mail sources which cannot be readily associated 
with any existing positive reputation information are going to engage in 
purely bad behavior. Surprisingly, this MAY be finally changing, if a 
very recent trend holds up. New bad actors have mostly stopped appearing 
in the past ~month. That is not long enough to counteract decades of 
zombie hordes.


The overwhelming majority of people walking along my street are entirely 
harmless and basically good people. I still lock my doors at night, 
because I'm pretty sure that nearly any person who would attempt to 
enter my house without explicit permission during a time when they would 
expect me to be asleep is actively up to no good.


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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

* On  Wed, Feb 12  5:03AM Laura Atkins  said :
> 
> > On 11 Feb 2020, at 17:01, Scott Mutter via mailop  wrote:
> > 
> > Well... I guess my thought is, if it takes them a week to weed through all 
> > of their requests... maybe there's a better way to optimize this?  Or maybe 
> > they need more personnel manning these positions?
> 
> > 
> > Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But it 
> > is also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like AT) 
> > appear to block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean on all 
> > blacklists and SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in play I'd 
> > be more apt to understand and investigate who is sending out spam on this 
> > server.  But it's just AT blocking it.
> 
> 
> Public blacklists and senderscore are an incredibly limited and, in my 
> experience, pretty useless way to determine your mail is fine. I’ve had 
> hundreds of sales inquiries over the years from folks who admit to me they 
> are spamming. Yet, they will have Senderscores >90 and no public blocklists.
> 
> Lack of negative data does not indicate good behavior. 
> 
> laura 
> 

Look, I understand it's a thin line battling spam and abusive behavior from 
mail servers.  I've pleaded with many blacklist operators to give me details as 
to why they are blacklisting one of our servers.  I can probably count on 1 
hand how many times I've gotten information from them in the 20+ years I've 
been doing this.  And I get it.  If I'm a spammer and you disclose what is 
causing the IP to be blacklisted, then I'll change my tactics to get around 
that method.

But you've also got to see it from the other perspective.  If I'm not seeing 
any activity to indicate that the IP is sending out spam... how do you expect 
me to stop whatever activity is causing you to blacklist the server (I'm 
assuming you're blocking it because of some type of activity... surely you're 
not blocking it just because you can)?

Maybe other blacklists isn't a good indicator.  But if the IP is not listed in 
Spamhaus, Spamcop, Sorbs, Proofpoint, Symantec (lately I'm having more issues 
with Symantec, so I'm not sure how reliable it is anymore), and if the IP has a 
solid Senderscore and a good reputation at Senderbase, and I'm literally just 
not seeing any malicious activity on the server ... what else am I suppose to 
check?

I'm actually not totally against default deny ... which if AT is really not 
seeing any bad behavior and is just blocking it because they can, they may be 
doing a default deny.  But my issue is, if it's default deny... why on earth 
does it take a week to clear it?  Can you not optimize that to where you 
confirm-opt-in a postmaster@ email address to clear the default deny... and 
then you have an email address to send abuse reports!

I also don't mean to be picking solely on AT at the moment.  They're not the 
only ones that do things like this.  They're just the one I'm having issues 
with right now.  I've had similar issues with Hotmail, Yahoo, AOL, Verizon, etc 
in the past.

And like I said, I get it... it's a thin line.  But there's got to be some way 
that these providers and legitimate mail server operators can communicate and 
determine why a blacklisting is happening so that that activity can be stopped. 
 And if no such activity is happening, then why are you blacklisting it?

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Jaroslaw Rafa via mailop]

Dnia 12.02.2020 o godz. 11:25:39 Laura Atkins via mailop pisze:
> > Right, but the way around, for bad behavior one should have and provide
> > data to prove it. 
> 
> 
> Why? 

Isn't it obvious?

If you are accusing someone of any behaviour, you should have at least some
evidence to back up your words. Otherwise, it's just arbitrary assumption.

I wonder why someone would ever ask such question as you asked.
-- 
Regards,
   Jaroslaw Rafa
   r...@rafa.eu.org
--
"In a million years, when kids go to school, they're gonna know: once there
was a Hushpuppy, and she lived with her daddy in the Bathtub."

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Johann Klasek via mailop]

On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 11:25:39AM +, Laura Atkins wrote:
> 
> > On 12 Feb 2020, at 11:15, Johann Klasek via mailop  
> > wrote:
> > 
> > On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 10:03:52AM +, Laura Atkins via mailop wrote:
> >>> On 11 Feb 2020, at 17:01, Scott Mutter via mailop  
> >>> wrote:
> > [..]
> >>> Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But 
> >>> it is also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like 
> >>> AT) appear to block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean 
> >>> on all blacklists and SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in 
> >>> play I'd be more apt to understand and investigate who is sending out 
> >>> spam on this server.  But it's just AT blocking it.
> >> 
> >> 
> >> Public blacklists and senderscore are an incredibly limited and, in my 
> >> experience, pretty useless way to determine your mail is fine. I???ve had 
> >> hundreds of sales inquiries over the years from folks who admit to me they 
> >> are spamming. Yet, they will have Senderscores >90 and no public 
> >> blocklists.
> >> 
> >> Lack of negative data does not indicate good behavior. 
> > 
> > Right, but the way around, for bad behavior one should have and provide
> > data to prove it. 
> 
> 
> Why? 

I would regard it as simply unfair to block purely arbitrary, without any
reason ...  If one has the attitude to block then they have to
provide mechanisms to handle disputes on this which really works.



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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Laura Atkins via mailop]

> On 12 Feb 2020, at 11:15, Johann Klasek via mailop  wrote:
> 
> On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 10:03:52AM +, Laura Atkins via mailop wrote:
>>> On 11 Feb 2020, at 17:01, Scott Mutter via mailop  wrote:
> [..]
>>> Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But it 
>>> is also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like AT) 
>>> appear to block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean on all 
>>> blacklists and SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in play I'd 
>>> be more apt to understand and investigate who is sending out spam on this 
>>> server.  But it's just AT blocking it.
>> 
>> 
>> Public blacklists and senderscore are an incredibly limited and, in my 
>> experience, pretty useless way to determine your mail is fine. I???ve had 
>> hundreds of sales inquiries over the years from folks who admit to me they 
>> are spamming. Yet, they will have Senderscores >90 and no public blocklists.
>> 
>> Lack of negative data does not indicate good behavior. 
> 
> Right, but the way around, for bad behavior one should have and provide
> data to prove it. 


Why? 

laura 

-- 
Having an Email Crisis?  We can help! 800 823-9674 

Laura Atkins
Word to the Wise
la...@wordtothewise.com
(650) 437-0741  

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Johann Klasek via mailop]

On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 10:03:52AM +, Laura Atkins via mailop wrote:
> > On 11 Feb 2020, at 17:01, Scott Mutter via mailop  wrote:
[..]
> > Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But it 
> > is also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like AT) 
> > appear to block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean on all 
> > blacklists and SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in play I'd 
> > be more apt to understand and investigate who is sending out spam on this 
> > server.  But it's just AT blocking it.
> 
> 
> Public blacklists and senderscore are an incredibly limited and, in my 
> experience, pretty useless way to determine your mail is fine. I???ve had 
> hundreds of sales inquiries over the years from folks who admit to me they 
> are spamming. Yet, they will have Senderscores >90 and no public blocklists.
> 
> Lack of negative data does not indicate good behavior. 

Right, but the way around, for bad behavior one should have and provide
data to prove it. 

Johann


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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Laura Atkins via mailop]

> On 11 Feb 2020, at 17:01, Scott Mutter via mailop  wrote:
> 
> Well... I guess my thought is, if it takes them a week to weed through all of 
> their requests... maybe there's a better way to optimize this?  Or maybe they 
> need more personnel manning these positions?

> 
> Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But it 
> is also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like AT) 
> appear to block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean on all 
> blacklists and SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in play I'd be 
> more apt to understand and investigate who is sending out spam on this 
> server.  But it's just AT blocking it.


Public blacklists and senderscore are an incredibly limited and, in my 
experience, pretty useless way to determine your mail is fine. I’ve had 
hundreds of sales inquiries over the years from folks who admit to me they are 
spamming. Yet, they will have Senderscores >90 and no public blocklists.

Lack of negative data does not indicate good behavior. 

laura 


-- 
Having an Email Crisis?  We can help! 800 823-9674 

Laura Atkins
Word to the Wise
la...@wordtothewise.com
(650) 437-0741  

Email Delivery Blog: https://wordtothewise.com/blog 







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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Jerry Cloe via mailop]

Last time I shot something to it, response was almost a full week.
 
-Original message-
From:Scott Mutter via mailop 
Sent:Tue 02-11-2020 11:06 am
Subject:Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?
To:mailop@mailop.org; 
* On  Tue, Feb 11 11:19AM Ken O'Driscoll via mailop  said :
> On Tue, 2020-02-11 at 10:50 -0500, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
> > I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse
> > requests - but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid
> > requests from the invalid requests.
> > 
> > If abuse_...@abuse-att.net is no longer valid, then perhaps the
> > rejection notice needs to be updated.
> 
> It's still valid and they do respond. But as you correctly surmise,
> they are very busy answering tickets from non-customers so patience is
> required. I'd typically give a request at least a week before poking
> them again.
> 
> Ken.

Well... I guess my thought is, if it takes them a week to weed through all of 
their requests... maybe there's a better way to optimize this?  Or maybe they 
need more personnel manning these positions?

Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But it is 
also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like AT) appear to 
block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean on all blacklists and 
SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in play I'd be more apt to 
understand and investigate who is sending out spam on this server.  But it's 
just AT blocking it.

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

* On  Tue, Feb 11 11:19AM Ken O'Driscoll via mailop  said :
> On Tue, 2020-02-11 at 10:50 -0500, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
> > I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse
> > requests - but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid
> > requests from the invalid requests.
> > 
> > If abuse_...@abuse-att.net is no longer valid, then perhaps the
> > rejection notice needs to be updated.
> 
> It's still valid and they do respond. But as you correctly surmise,
> they are very busy answering tickets from non-customers so patience is
> required. I'd typically give a request at least a week before poking
> them again.
> 
> Ken.

Well... I guess my thought is, if it takes them a week to weed through all of 
their requests... maybe there's a better way to optimize this?  Or maybe they 
need more personnel manning these positions?

Your statement is certainly valid, and I don't mean to sound whiny.  But it is 
also frustrating when providers (usually large providers, like AT) appear to 
block an IP for... no apparent reason.  The IP is clean on all blacklists and 
SenderScore is 99.  If there were other factors in play I'd be more apt to 
understand and investigate who is sending out spam on this server.  But it's 
just AT blocking it.

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Re: [mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Ken O'Driscoll via mailop]

On Tue, 2020-02-11 at 10:50 -0500, Scott Mutter via mailop wrote:
> I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse
> requests - but maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid
> requests from the invalid requests.
> 
> If abuse_...@abuse-att.net is no longer valid, then perhaps the
> rejection notice needs to be updated.

It's still valid and they do respond. But as you correctly surmise,
they are very busy answering tickets from non-customers so patience is
required. I'd typically give a request at least a week before poking
them again.

Ken.


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[mailop] AT Block - abuse_...@abuse-att.net still valid?

[Scott Mutter via mailop]

Anybody from AT able to check a couple of abuse tickets for me?

AT is blocking one of our servers, I sent messages on February 8th and 
February 10th to abuse_...@abuse-att.net but have not heard anything back - 
other than the canned response - and the IP is still blocked.

The rejection notice says to email abuse_...@abuse-att.net but I'm not sure if 
that is still valid.

Ticket numbers are:

020820-180048-39537-00
021020-164333-46154-00

I suppose it's possible that AT is just inundated with abuse requests - but 
maybe there is a better way to weed out the valid requests from the invalid 
requests.

If abuse_...@abuse-att.net is no longer valid, then perhaps the rejection 
notice needs to be updated.


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Re: [mailop] Trendmicro "BLOCK-SEND-ER"

[Stefano Bagnara]

On Tue, 20 Nov 2018 at 16:20, Laura Atkins  wrote:
> Are you able to deliver mail to any other trendmicro.eu hosted domain?
> If so, this isn’t a trendmicro issue, it’s an individual company deciding to 
> block specific senders.
> Asking each company to unbock / whitelist you is about your only choice.

We are not getting that error from every trendmicro.eu hosted domain,
but only a few of them (very few).
The first company (few weeks ago) replied that they didn't have
anything special configured to refuse our email and that they simply
used an "aggressive" level for filtering (I don't know what are the
configuration options for their users), so they added our IPs/domains
to their whitelist.
I'm waiting for a reply from the second domain postmaster@ address.

Stefano

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Re: [mailop] Trendmicro "BLOCK-SEND-ER"

[Laura Atkins]

> On 20 Nov 2018, at 14:32, Stefano Bagnara  wrote:
> 
> The same recipient correctly receives the same content from another IP
> (from Gmail).
> 
> I'm in touch with the domain postmaster, but this happened with
> another domain and a different IP some weeks ago and they manually
> whitelisted us, so this new error make me think there's something else
> I should take care.

Are you able to deliver mail to any other trendmicro.eu hosted domain? If so, 
this isn’t a trendmicro issue, it’s an individual company deciding to block 
specific senders. Asking each company to unbock / whitelist you is about your 
only choice. 

laura

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Laura Atkins
Word to the Wise
la...@wordtothewise.com
(650) 437-0741  

Email Delivery Blog: https://wordtothewise.com/blog 







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[mailop] Trendmicro "BLOCK-SEND-ER"

[Stefano Bagnara]

Is there anyone from Trendmicro or someone with suggestions about how
to deal with this error?
554 5.7.1 : Recipient address rejected: BLOCK-SEND-ER.
(in reply to the RCPT TO:)

The target email domain is hosted on in.hes.trendmicro.eu

I've looked up the sender IP (a shared IP: 213.171.189.7) in the
TrendMicro reputation service
(https://www.ers.trendmicro.com/reputations) and the result is
"Unlisted in the spam sender list", "Listed in: None".

The same recipient correctly receives the same content from another IP
(from Gmail).

I'm in touch with the domain postmaster, but this happened with
another domain and a different IP some weeks ago and they manually
whitelisted us, so this new error make me think there's something else
I should take care.

Stefano

-- 
Stefano Bagnara
Apache James/jDKIM/jSPF
VOXmail/Mosaico.io/VoidLabs

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[mailop] Laposte block issues

[Lindani Tshabangu via mailop]

Thank you Anne,

Luckily they replied and confirmed an issue on their side which they
quickly resolved.

*Kind regards*



Lindani Tshabangu
Deliverability EMEA | GROUPON

ltshaba...@groupon.com

On Fri, Dec 1, 2017 at 10:18 AM, Marsh, Anne-Sophie <
anne-sophie.ma...@epsilon.com> wrote:

> Hi Lindani,
>
> We didn't experience any particular issues at LaPoste yesterday.
>
> Hope you managed to hear back from their postmaster team,
>
> Anne-Sophie Marsh, Sr Email Deliverability Manager - Epsilon
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: mailop [mailto:mailop-boun...@mailop.org] On Behalf Of
> mailop-requ...@mailop.org
> Sent: 01 December 2017 08:41
> To: mailop@mailop.org
> Subject: mailop Digest, Vol 122, Issue 1
>
> Send mailop mailing list submissions to
> mailop@mailop.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> mailop-requ...@mailop.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> mailop-ow...@mailop.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
> "Re: Contents of mailop digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>1. Laposte block issues (Lindani Tshabangu)
>2. Re: Just so everyone knows ... (Al Iverson)
>3. Truncate listing (Alexander Teklenburg)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 13:49:38 +
> From: Lindani Tshabangu <ltshaba...@groupon.com>
> To: mailop <mailop@mailop.org>
> Subject: [mailop] Laposte block issues
> Message-ID:
> <CAG1HZVezHk7R6tP0wkLHcGGzAZKn2Cx2c+BK8A-r=PuvqVkWcw@mail.
> gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Good day,
>
> Is anyone experiencing difficulties in sending mail to Laposte today? We
> have not been able to deliver successfully so far and have not heard back
> from their postmaster.
>
> *Kind regards*
>
> 
>
> Lindani Tshabangu
> Deliverability EMEA | GROUPON
>
> ltshaba...@groupon.com
> -- next part --
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>
> --
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 10:29:12 -0500
> From: Al Iverson <aiver...@wombatmail.com>
> To: "mailop@mailop.org" <mailop@mailop.org>
> Subject: Re: [mailop] Just so everyone knows ...
> Message-ID:
> 

[mailop] Laposte block issues

[Marsh, Anne-Sophie]

Hi Lindani,

We didn't experience any particular issues at LaPoste yesterday.

Hope you managed to hear back from their postmaster team,

Anne-Sophie Marsh, Sr Email Deliverability Manager - Epsilon


-Original Message-
From: mailop [mailto:mailop-boun...@mailop.org] On Behalf Of 
mailop-requ...@mailop.org
Sent: 01 December 2017 08:41
To: mailop@mailop.org
Subject: mailop Digest, Vol 122, Issue 1

Send mailop mailing list submissions to
mailop@mailop.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
mailop-requ...@mailop.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
mailop-ow...@mailop.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: 
Contents of mailop digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Laposte block issues (Lindani Tshabangu)
   2. Re: Just so everyone knows ... (Al Iverson)
   3. Truncate listing (Alexander Teklenburg)


--

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 13:49:38 +
From: Lindani Tshabangu <ltshaba...@groupon.com>
To: mailop <mailop@mailop.org>
Subject: [mailop] Laposte block issues
Message-ID:
<CAG1HZVezHk7R6tP0wkLHcGGzAZKn2Cx2c+BK8A-r=puvqvk...@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Good day,

Is anyone experiencing difficulties in sending mail to Laposte today? We have 
not been able to deliver successfully so far and have not heard back from their 
postmaster.

*Kind regards*



Lindani Tshabangu
Deliverability EMEA | GROUPON

ltshaba...@groupon.com
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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 10:29:12 -0500
From: Al Iverson <aiver...@wombatmail.com>
To: "mailop@mailop.org" <mailop@mailop.org>
Subject: Re: [mailop] Just so everyone knows ...
Message-ID:

[mailop] Laposte block issues

[Lindani Tshabangu via mailop]

Good day,

Is anyone experiencing difficulties in sending mail to Laposte today? We
have not been able to deliver successfully so far and have not heard back
from their postmaster.

*Kind regards*



Lindani Tshabangu
Deliverability EMEA | GROUPON

ltshaba...@groupon.com
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Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[John Cenile]

Just to update you all, Matt Heffelfinger was very helpful and has
identified (and rectified) the problem.

Thanks again Matt.

On 14 October 2017 at 11:03, Webb, Nic via mailop <mailop@mailop.org> wrote:

> FWIW, I will vouch for Matt. We’ve collaborated on several issues and I
> would say he’s one of the Good Guys™.
>
>
>
> -Nicolas Webb
>
> Email Postmaster
>
> AWS Messaging and Targeting (SES, SMS, Mobile)
>
>
>
> *From: *mailop <mailop-boun...@mailop.org> on behalf of Matthew T
> Heffelfinger <mheffelfin...@godaddy.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 9:32 PM
> *To: *"mailop@mailop.org" <mailop@mailop.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List
>
>
>
> John, I was forwarded this message from someone else that was already on
> this list, so apologies if this doesn’t come thru correctly, as I just
> joined the list and don’t have the actual thread to reply to.
>
>
>
> I’m Matt Heffelfinger, I run the inbound and outbound MTAs for GoDaddy’s
> workspace product (secureserver.net). Luckily, I’m just the guy you need
> to get ahold of.
>
>
>
> It appears that your IP(s) are on one of our blacklists, and your
> connections are being blocked in the banner phase. If you can provide your
> IPs to me, I can look into why they were blocked, and see if I can unblock
> them.  If you called our customer support about this issue, and they told
> you they can’t do anything about it, please provide your information, as
> I’d like to reach out to their leadership to provide them with better
> training. An internal ticket should have been opened and forwarded to the
> correct team to get the IP(s) unblocked.  * A note, I will be out of the
> office tomorrow as it’s the last day of my son’s fall break, but I should
> be able to forward the info to another member of my team.  Please send the
> IPs to mh(at)godaddy.com
>
>
>
> I admit that the help page is not entirely helpful, however it’s far above
> what it used to be. Unfortunately, the blacklist that I believe your IP is
> in does not get checked by the unblock.secureserver.net site, but I
> believe it should be changed to. I also notice that the actual rejection
> message you are receiving is not listed on the help page. I’ll add that to
> the backlog to get remedied.
>
>
>
> ---
>
> As for Bill’s comment:
>
>
>
> “GoDaddy has NEVER had a collegial or even sustained presence in
> any broadly accessible online community of email professionals. Or in any
> of the more selective communities I'm familiar with. They are not
> a competent and well-intentioned member of the Internet community.
> They exist and we must deal with them but they are not "us" in any
> meaningful sense.
>
>
>
> I sincerely hope someone from GoDaddy stands up to dispute that. I
> think it is as likely as The Rapture.”
>
>
>
> I’m here now. I’ve actively been attending/participating in M3AAWG for the
> last 4 years. I try to pride myself with trying to make the email world a
> better place by stopping as much spam as I possibly can from leaving our
> environments, as well as protecting our customers from any from the outside
> world.
>
>
>
> I’ll try not to take anything personal, as I agree that some of our
> departments don’t think what’s the best thing for the internet, but I try
> to, and I try to convince them to as well.  With enough prodding, anything
> can be possible.
>
>
>
>
>
> Matt Heffelfinger
>
> Email Systems Engineer
> *GoDaddy*
> mheffelfin...@godaddy.com
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* mailop [mailto:mailop-boun...@mailop.org] *On Behalf Of *John
> Cenile
> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 11, 2017 8:12 PM
> *To:* mailop@mailop.org
> *Subject:* [mailop] GoDaddy Block List
>
>
>
> Hi all,
>
>
>
> We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" servers
> have been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:
>
>
>
> addr...@domain.com
>
> host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
>
> SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
>
> 554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
>
> refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted <http://x.co/rblbounce>
>
>
>
> When trying to unblock our IP by going to https://unblock.secureserver.
> net/, all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is
> obviously wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support
> (we're not a direct customer), and they have no idea why we're getting
> these bounce backs, and basically said there's nothing they can do.
>
>
>
> Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact

Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[Webb, Nic via mailop]

FWIW, I will vouch for Matt. We’ve collaborated on several issues and I would 
say he’s one of the Good Guys™.

-Nicolas Webb
Email Postmaster
AWS Messaging and Targeting (SES, SMS, Mobile)

From: mailop <mailop-boun...@mailop.org> on behalf of Matthew T Heffelfinger 
<mheffelfin...@godaddy.com>
Date: Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 9:32 PM
To: "mailop@mailop.org" <mailop@mailop.org>
Subject: Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

John, I was forwarded this message from someone else that was already on this 
list, so apologies if this doesn’t come thru correctly, as I just joined the 
list and don’t have the actual thread to reply to.

I’m Matt Heffelfinger, I run the inbound and outbound MTAs for GoDaddy’s 
workspace product (secureserver.net). Luckily, I’m just the guy you need to get 
ahold of.

It appears that your IP(s) are on one of our blacklists, and your connections 
are being blocked in the banner phase. If you can provide your IPs to me, I can 
look into why they were blocked, and see if I can unblock them.  If you called 
our customer support about this issue, and they told you they can’t do anything 
about it, please provide your information, as I’d like to reach out to their 
leadership to provide them with better training. An internal ticket should have 
been opened and forwarded to the correct team to get the IP(s) unblocked.  * A 
note, I will be out of the office tomorrow as it’s the last day of my son’s 
fall break, but I should be able to forward the info to another member of my 
team.  Please send the IPs to mh(at)godaddy.com

I admit that the help page is not entirely helpful, however it’s far above what 
it used to be. Unfortunately, the blacklist that I believe your IP is in does 
not get checked by the unblock.secureserver.net site, but I believe it should 
be changed to. I also notice that the actual rejection message you are 
receiving is not listed on the help page. I’ll add that to the backlog to get 
remedied.

---
As for Bill’s comment:

“GoDaddy has NEVER had a collegial or even sustained presence in any broadly 
accessible online community of email professionals. Or in any of the more 
selective communities I'm familiar with. They are not a competent and 
well-intentioned member of the Internet community. They exist and we must deal 
with them but they are not "us" in any meaningful sense.

I sincerely hope someone from GoDaddy stands up to dispute that. I think it is 
as likely as The Rapture.”

I’m here now. I’ve actively been attending/participating in M3AAWG for the last 
4 years. I try to pride myself with trying to make the email world a better 
place by stopping as much spam as I possibly can from leaving our environments, 
as well as protecting our customers from any from the outside world.

I’ll try not to take anything personal, as I agree that some of our departments 
don’t think what’s the best thing for the internet, but I try to, and I try to 
convince them to as well.  With enough prodding, anything can be possible.


Matt Heffelfinger
Email Systems Engineer
GoDaddy
mheffelfin...@godaddy.com<mailto:mheffelfin...@godaddy.com>


From: mailop [mailto:mailop-boun...@mailop.org] On Behalf Of John Cenile
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2017 8:12 PM
To: mailop@mailop.org
Subject: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

Hi all,

We have started having issues where GoDaddy's 
"secureserver.net<http://secureserver.net>" servers have been blocking mail 
from some of our IP addresses:

addr...@domain.com<mailto:addr...@domain.com>
host smtp.secureserver.net<http://smtp.secureserver.net> [68.178.213.203]
SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
554 
p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net<http://p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net>
 bizsmtp Connection
refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted <http://x.co/rblbounce>

When trying to unblock our IP by going to https://unblock.secureserver.net/, 
all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is obviously wrong. 
I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support (we're not a direct 
customer), and they have no idea why we're getting these bounce backs, and 
basically said there's nothing they can do.

Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue? There's 
three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which send a total of 
around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely doesn't warrant us 
rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.

Thanks.

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Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[Angelina via mailop]

Hey John,

>From what I can tell, it looks like you are temporarily blocked due to
"content judged to be spam" or "for attempting to mail too many invalid
recipients".

If this is still occurring, Id recommend taking a look at those two things
and if it all checks out or the above (the response being incorrect), you
can submit a request to be unthrottled here:
https://unblock.secureserver.net/


As far as the complaints towards GoDaddy themselves, I will say they are
not the company they were even five years ago. I'm not sure if they have
any members on this mailing list, but I know quite a few members from their
deliverability departments (from the receiving and sending sides) and they
all are active members at M3AAWG and great, intelligent individuals who do
their best.

Yeah, the company itself may historically not have a great reputation, but
as a former employee, I know things have certainly changed for the better.

Hope you're able to figure this out!

Best,
Angelina

On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Bill Cole <
mailop-20160...@billmail.scconsult.com> wrote:

> On 11 Oct 2017, at 20:12, John Cenile wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>>
>> We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" servers
>> have been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:
>>
>> addr...@domain.com
>> host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
>> SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
>> 554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
>> refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted 
>>
>
> Don't you just love when the text of a 5xx message has an URL for a
> pagethat is entirely unhelpful?
> No?
> Hmmf...
>
> When trying to unblock our IP by going to https://unblock.secureserver.n
>> et/,
>> all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is obviously
>> wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support (we're
>> not a direct customer), and they have no idea why we're getting these
>> bounce backs, and basically said there's nothing they can do.
>>
>
> Yeah, GoDaddy is the poster child for "You get what you pay for, *OR
> LESS*."
>
> The text: "SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection"
> implies (depending on your MTA software) that this is text that is received
> instead of the usual introductory banner. i.e. I get:
>
> # telnet 68.178.213.203 25
> Trying 68.178.213.203...
> Connected to p3plibsmtp03-v01.prod.phx3.secureserver.net.
> Escape character is '^]'.
> 220 p3plibsmtp03-02.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp ESMTP server ready
>
>
> The first message you get appears to be
>
>  554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
> refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted 
>
> Instead of the expected '220' line.
>
> THIS IS NOT NORMAL.
>
> Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue?
>>
>
> You're new here, yes?
>
> GoDaddy has NEVER had a collegial or even sustained presence in any
> broadly accessible online community of email professionals. Or in any of
> the more selective communities I'm familiar with. They are not a competent
> and well-intentioned member of the Internet community. They exist and we
> must deal with them but they are not "us" in any meaningful sense.
>
> I sincerely hope someone from GoDaddy stands up to dispute that. I think
> it is as likely as The Rapture.
>
> There's three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which send
>> a total of around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely doesn't
>> warrant us rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.
>>
>
> GoDaddy email being broken is like 192.* blocks having routing problems.
> It just IS.
>
> You may need to "open the kimono" to get useful help here or from anyplace
> GoDaddy isn't present, like *ANYWHERE*. In other words:
>
> 1. Who is "us," ke-mo sah-bee?
> 2. What are the three slanderously besmirched IP addresses?
>
> Content doesn't matter. You're being shunned by IP before HELO/EHLO so
> they seem to think that something is really evil about those IPs. Maybe
> they are (or were) right. Don't be shy: many of us have been there. We
> understand.
>
>
> --
> Bill Cole
> b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
> (AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
> Currently Seeking Paying Work: https://linkedin.com/in/billcole
>
>
> ___
> mailop mailing list
> mailop@mailop.org
> https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
>



-- 
Angelina Hagan
Trust and Safety Officer
[image: BombBomb | Face to Face with more people, more often]
E: deliv...@bombbomb.com
W: BombBomb.com 
[image: BombBomb | Face to Face with more people, more often]

___

Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[Bill Cole]

On 11 Oct 2017, at 20:12, John Cenile wrote:


Hi all,

We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" 
servers

have been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:

addr...@domain.com
host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted 


Don't you just love when the text of a 5xx message has an URL for a 
pagethat is entirely unhelpful?

No?
Hmmf...

When trying to unblock our IP by going to 
https://unblock.secureserver.net/,
all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is 
obviously
wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support 
(we're

not a direct customer), and they have no idea why we're getting these
bounce backs, and basically said there's nothing they can do.


Yeah, GoDaddy is the poster child for "You get what you pay for, *OR 
LESS*."


The text: "SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection" 
implies (depending on your MTA software) that this is text that is 
received instead of the usual introductory banner. i.e. I get:


# telnet 68.178.213.203 25
Trying 68.178.213.203...
Connected to p3plibsmtp03-v01.prod.phx3.secureserver.net.
Escape character is '^]'.
220 p3plibsmtp03-02.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp ESMTP server 
ready



The first message you get appears to be

 554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection 
refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted 


Instead of the expected '220' line.

THIS IS NOT NORMAL.


Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue?


You're new here, yes?

GoDaddy has NEVER had a collegial or even sustained presence in any 
broadly accessible online community of email professionals. Or in any of 
the more selective communities I'm familiar with. They are not a 
competent and well-intentioned member of the Internet community. They 
exist and we must deal with them but they are not "us" in any meaningful 
sense.


I sincerely hope someone from GoDaddy stands up to dispute that. I think 
it is as likely as The Rapture.


There's three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which 
send
a total of around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely 
doesn't

warrant us rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.


GoDaddy email being broken is like 192.* blocks having routing problems. 
It just IS.


You may need to "open the kimono" to get useful help here or from 
anyplace GoDaddy isn't present, like *ANYWHERE*. In other words:


1. Who is "us," ke-mo sah-bee?
2. What are the three slanderously besmirched IP addresses?

Content doesn't matter. You're being shunned by IP before HELO/EHLO so 
they seem to think that something is really evil about those IPs. Maybe 
they are (or were) right. Don't be shy: many of us have been there. We 
understand.



--
Bill Cole
b...@scconsult.com or billc...@apache.org
(AKA @grumpybozo and many *@billmail.scconsult.com addresses)
Currently Seeking Paying Work: https://linkedin.com/in/billcole

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Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[Matt Vernhout]

Have you tried slowing down how fast you send mail? It’s possible you’re temp 
blocked, unblocked, temp blocked, unblocked, etc... 

~
Matt

> On Oct 11, 2017, at 22:29, John Cenile  wrote:
> 
> We have, we've checked both MXToolbox (not listed at all, on any RBLs it 
> checks), as well as directly with Spamhaus, not listed on their 3 either.
> 
> We've seen these messages for over 4 days now, so if it is temporary, their 
> unblock page should say that or give you the option to actually unblock the 
> IP.
> 
>> On 12 October 2017 at 11:54, Matt Vernhout  wrote:
>> The error codes seem to indicate a temporary block based on your sending 
>> speeds. Or possibly your IP is listed on one of the RBLs that they use. Have 
>> you checked it against the rbls listed on the error pages? 
>> 
>> ~
>> Matt
>> 
>>> On Oct 11, 2017, at 20:12, John Cenile  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" servers 
>>> have been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:
>>> 
>>> addr...@domain.com
>>> host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
>>> SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
>>> 554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
>>> refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted  
>>> 
>>> When trying to unblock our IP by going to 
>>> https://unblock.secureserver.net/, all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked 
>>> at this time", which is obviously wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on 
>>> the phone to their support (we're not a direct customer), and they have no 
>>> idea why we're getting these bounce backs, and basically said there's 
>>> nothing they can do.
>>> 
>>> Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue? 
>>> There's three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which send 
>>> a total of around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely doesn't 
>>> warrant us rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> mailop mailing list
>>> mailop@mailop.org
>>> https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
> 
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Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[John Cenile]

We have, we've checked both MXToolbox (not listed at all, on any RBLs it
checks), as well as directly with Spamhaus, not listed on their 3 either.

We've seen these messages for over 4 days now, so if it is temporary, their
unblock page should say that or give you the option to actually unblock the
IP.

On 12 October 2017 at 11:54, Matt Vernhout  wrote:

> The error codes seem to indicate a temporary block based on your sending
> speeds. Or possibly your IP is listed on one of the RBLs that they use.
> Have you checked it against the rbls listed on the error pages?
>
> ~
> Matt
>
> On Oct 11, 2017, at 20:12, John Cenile  wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" servers
> have been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:
>
> addr...@domain.com
> host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
> SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
> 554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
> refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted 
>
> When trying to unblock our IP by going to https://unblock.secureserver.
> net/, all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is
> obviously wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support
> (we're not a direct customer), and they have no idea why we're getting
> these bounce backs, and basically said there's nothing they can do.
>
> Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue?
> There's three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which send
> a total of around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely doesn't
> warrant us rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.
>
> Thanks.
>
> ___
> mailop mailing list
> mailop@mailop.org
> https://chilli.nosignal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mailop
>
>
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Re: [mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[Matt Vernhout]

The error codes seem to indicate a temporary block based on your sending 
speeds. Or possibly your IP is listed on one of the RBLs that they use. Have 
you checked it against the rbls listed on the error pages? 

~
Matt

> On Oct 11, 2017, at 20:12, John Cenile  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" servers have 
> been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:
> 
> addr...@domain.com
> host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
> SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
> 554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
> refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted  
> 
> When trying to unblock our IP by going to https://unblock.secureserver.net/, 
> all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is obviously 
> wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support (we're not 
> a direct customer), and they have no idea why we're getting these bounce 
> backs, and basically said there's nothing they can do.
> 
> Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue? 
> There's three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which send a 
> total of around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely doesn't 
> warrant us rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
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[mailop] GoDaddy Block List

[John Cenile]

Hi all,

We have started having issues where GoDaddy's "secureserver.net" servers
have been blocking mail from some of our IP addresses:

addr...@domain.com
host smtp.secureserver.net [68.178.213.203]
SMTP error from remote mail server after initial connection:
554 p3plibsmtp03-04.prod.phx3.secureserver.net bizsmtp Connection
refused. x.x.x.x is blacklisted 

When trying to unblock our IP by going to https://unblock.secureserver.net/,
all it says is "x.x.x.x is not blocked at this time", which is obviously
wrong. I've spent just over 2 hours on the phone to their support (we're
not a direct customer), and they have no idea why we're getting these
bounce backs, and basically said there's nothing they can do.

Is someone from GoDaddy able to contact me to help resolve this issue?
There's three IP addresses that have been blocked, all three of which send
a total of around 150 emails per day to GoDaddy, so it definitely doesn't
warrant us rotating IP addresses because your system is broken.

Thanks.
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