Re: OT: People and Their Bikes #3

[John Mustarde]

I have a few vintage bikes. Here's my 1964 Schwinn Super Sport light
weight, with the nicely made, very nimble fillet brazed frame, classy
chrome fork, and a well-worn Brooks saddle. I rescued this one from a
Goodwill store, in pristine condition, for twenty bucks.  

http://www.photolin.com/misc/64SS.jpg

The Super Sport model was near the top of the line, made along with
the Paramounts but about half their price, and way out of my price
range back in '64 when I was 13.  

Buying a good bike was a heady experience for me in 1964.  For years
my brother and had pieced together our balloon-tire coaster-brake
bikes from second hand parts and frames, building and re-building them
as we grew and wore them out.  We had nothing but disdain for the
fancy new bikes our friends owned, probably because we could not
afford to buy a bike new. 

The Sting Rays and other new bikes were considered sissy stuff, too
clean and dainty for us.  We would race our beaters around, lock up
the back tire, and see who could leave the longest skid mark on the
hot Texas asphalt, coming as close as possible to hitting the Sting
Ray sissies, who would cower in fear, afraid we would get their new
bikes dirty, or heaven forbid, scratched. Ha. Take that. 

But one fine day I headed off to the Toy Chest on Camp Bowie Boulevard
in Fort Worth.  They were a Schwinn dealer and well-stocked toy store,
years before anything like Toys-R-Us appeared, owned and operated by a
nice couple for many years.  I made several trips there, alone,
secretly admiring the beautiful new bikes in their showroom, the likes
of which I'd never dreamed of before.  

I couldn't stomach the idea of me actually buying a Sting Ray, which
to me was for silly kids, but there was this new thing - 5 and
10-speed derailer bikes - that completely caught my fancy.  I chose a
5-speed Collegiate in Radiant Coppertone, which was the best bike I
could afford.  Man, did that bike make my heart throb. 

The Toy Chest owner let me take it home for $20 down and the promise
of two more payments of $20 a month, on my own good word as a steadily
employed paper boy at age 13.  I even started taking care of it,
washing and waxing, taking care not to tear it up or leave it
unlocked. Talk about a big change in attitude.  

Several years later, after high school, my Collegiate went to a new
home, still in fine condition.  Then almost 25 years passed before I
bought another bike.  My interest was re-kindled, and now I have a
garage full of bikes.

And just to keep the topic on people, here's my better half
accompanying me to the pond on her nice little Giant hybrid mountain
bike.  

http://www.photolin.com/misc/linn06.jpg

--
John Mustarde
www.photolin.com

Re: Helmut Newton dead

[Pat White]

What a shocker!  He just turned 80 in 2001, and was still doing good work.
Helmut will be missed.  Was his wife June with him?

Pat White

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Bruce Dayton]

Shel,

I would say that we are in violent agreement then.  There are
certainly reasons to use flash, but what Boris was shooting was
severely affected by the flash.  My first choice is to not use flash,
but when the situation warrants it, I use it.  The shots Boris showed
were not the right situation.


Bruce



Friday, January 23, 2004, 7:59:14 PM, you wrote:

SB> Bruce ...

SB> Weddings are a different type of photography, Paul's product shots are different,
SB> too.  What Boris was trying to do, and what I was addressing, is different.  In
SB> such situations, and in such type of photography, flash is definitely a detriment.
SB> All the "naturalness" goes out of the photograph.
SB> Weddings are planned events, photographs MUST be produced, product shots are
SB> controlled events ... photos in pool halls, bars, and on the street just happen ...
SB> unless they have been set up, and that brings us back to photography being like
SB> weddings and product shots.  I don't want my people to look like a product, and I
SB> certainly don't want them to feel that way.  People at weddings expect flash; a
SB> lady quietly nursing her drink at the Hotsy Totsy club is gonna be really fried
SB> when that blast of light startles her, and I'll be a very sad photographer for
SB> being thrown out of the bar for disturbing the patrons.

SB> shel

SB> Bruce Dayton wrote:

>> Then there is all those times when the wedding is at noon and pictures
>> are right before or after.  Some of them can use fill flash - even in
>> the shade - to put a tiny catchlight in the eyes or to soften a harsh
>> shadow.  Of course, receptions tend to be quite dim.  There are shots
>> there that are required to take and without supplemntal (flash)
>> lighting, there would be some very unhappy clients.
>>
>> I agree that whenever possible, don't use flash and don't over do it,
>> but I have need for flash.

digital rebel for screw-mounts

[edwin]

at some point I'll figure out how to reply to a thread now that I'm 
getting PDML in digest format...

J.C (I think) suggested a Canon digital rebel to mount my SMC takumar
screw-mounts on, rather than waiting for a Pentax version of same.

I'll admit, I'd thought about that.  Looking at the specs for the
digital rebel, I felt I'd be giving up too much of the functionality
and control that I'm used to in a digital camera.  Now that might
be the case with any future Pentax $1000 DSLR too, but at the moment
the only Canon solution that I see as viable is the 10D and at that
price I might as well get the *istD for which I already have
screw-bayonet converters.  

If nothing else, the *istD will get cheaper at some point and I can
consider getting one then.  In the meantime, I'm paying off a 70-200
G ED IF AF-S VR (PDQ DSC DSO ETC) Nikkor.  All those letters do give
better performance, although if I get a chance I'll have to see how
it compares to my 85/1.8 SMC takumar which puts many modern lenses
to shame!

DJE

RE: how many?

[Cesar Matamoros II]

First shot on 14 October.

To date 2927.  Slowly catching up with my Optio S that has 3172.

César
Panama City, Florida

-- -Original Message-
-- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 9:03 PM
--
-- So, here's a poll:
-- How many shots so far with your *ist D?
--
-- I'm at 1565
--
-- I'm SURE I'm mid to low on the list.
--
-- Cory
--

Re: DIG: how many?

[mapson]

1570 in under 3 weeks shooting, some experiments around home, two afternoon
outings and one evening concert.


interesting to see how many people try to justify why they took so few 
photographs ;-)

I just checked. My score is 4564.  And I have only had the camera for 2 weeks!
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
(just kidding, I've had it for longer)
:-D
   (*)o(*) 
Robert
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Steve Jolly]

Shel Belinkoff wrote:
Now, with conventional B&W there's another way ... overexpose a stop or
more and then cut back on the development time.  That'll even out the
contrast, have the photos looking more natural, and keep your subjects more
relaxed.
I do that quite often... every time I shoot a roll of Delta 3200 in 
fact.  (The fact that the ME Super's internal metering only supports 
films up to 1600ASA has *nothing* to do with this, honest... ;-)

S

Re: BW digital printing solution?

[Rob Studdert]

On 23 Jan 2004 at 21:02, William Robb wrote:

> I read about a guy who was outputting digital files to some sort of
> transparency material as a negative, and then printing the result in a wet
> darkroom.
> I don't think it is possible to make B&W prints on an inkjet printer that
> will match the quality of a good (much less an excellent) wet print.

Pick up a cheap old Lino...

http://www.bostick-
sullivan.com/Technical_papers/digital%20info/dave_fokos/fokos.pdf

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

RE: I did it.

[Cesar Matamoros II]

And I do plan on taking it out tomorrow to shoot.  I have the 85/1.9 and
enjoy it, I am looking forward to trying out the 1.8.  And after what Paul
states below I am really anxious.  Too bad I missed out on the 120, but it
went to a good home...

I will be helping out at a 5k tomorrow morning.  I hope to get some nice
people shots.

Paul, I am positive you will enjoy the *ist D.  I know I am.
Beware of flash photography. I have found the best results by using a
meter - this is with the *ist D, D1X, and D1H.  For the most part TTL works
very well, there are instances where the camera metering is fooled.  I have
not sat down to figure out where, possibly where there is a lot of white in
the image.  I shot about 50 shots today and about a third was with the
AF500FTZ with no problems.  I have also used the AF280T and AF400T.

Doing well to stay up to date,

Cesar
Panama City, Florida

-- -Original Message-
-- From: Paul Stenquist [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2004 9:38 PM
--
-- Well, I sold about $1200 worth of screwmount lenses in the last few
-- days along with my Spotmatic Motor Drive, so I ordered an *ist D. My

-- (Cesar got the best piece of screw mount glass
-- I owned, --
-- the SMC 85/1.8 . List member  Bernd Scheffler got another of
-- the great
-- ones -- the 120/2.8. So some of my good screw mount glass is
-- still in
-- the PDML family. ) I  have saved a half dozen very nice M42
-- lenses, and
-- I can still fondle now and then, so the separation isn't total. But
-- it's time to move on. I'm looking forward to exploring the world of
-- digital with my very modern manual focus K lenses .
-- Paul Stenquist
-- (No longer a fondler)
--

Re: DIG: how many?

[mapson]

At 09:03 PM 23/01/2004 -0500, you wrote:
So, here's a poll:
How many shots so far with your *ist D?
I'm at 1565
just over 4500



   (*)o(*) 
Robert
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Shel Belinkoff]

Bruce ...

Weddings are a different type of photography, Paul's product shots are different,
too.  What Boris was trying to do, and what I was addressing, is different.  In
such situations, and in such type of photography, flash is definitely a detriment.
All the "naturalness" goes out of the photograph.
Weddings are planned events, photographs MUST be produced, product shots are
controlled events ... photos in pool halls, bars, and on the street just happen ...
unless they have been set up, and that brings us back to photography being like
weddings and product shots.  I don't want my people to look like a product, and I
certainly don't want them to feel that way.  People at weddings expect flash; a
lady quietly nursing her drink at the Hotsy Totsy club is gonna be really fried
when that blast of light startles her, and I'll be a very sad photographer for
being thrown out of the bar for disturbing the patrons.

shel

Bruce Dayton wrote:

> Then there is all those times when the wedding is at noon and pictures
> are right before or after.  Some of them can use fill flash - even in
> the shade - to put a tiny catchlight in the eyes or to soften a harsh
> shadow.  Of course, receptions tend to be quite dim.  There are shots
> there that are required to take and without supplemntal (flash)
> lighting, there would be some very unhappy clients.
>
> I agree that whenever possible, don't use flash and don't over do it,
> but I have need for flash.

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Bruce Dayton]

Hello Shel,

Then there is all those times when the wedding is at noon and pictures
are right before or after.  Some of them can use fill flash - even in
the shade - to put a tiny catchlight in the eyes or to soften a harsh
shadow.  Of course, receptions tend to be quite dim.  There are shots
there that are required to take and without supplemntal (flash)
lighting, there would be some very unhappy clients.

I agree that whenever possible, don't use flash and don't over do it,
but I have need for flash.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce



Friday, January 23, 2004, 6:42:20 PM, you wrote:

SB> Well, Bill, I suppose one can argue that it's OK to do that, but I'd
SB> disagree in principle, especially with B&W work.  If y'gotta use flash,
SB> then the light's not right for the subject.  Move the subject, move the
SB> camera, think of a different composition.  This is for human subjects, of
SB> course.  And there are definitely situations where fill flash will destroy
SB> a mood ...  There's certain times of the day when the light enhances the
SB> act and the art of photography, and there are times of the day that you
SB> should take your camera inside, make notes on what you shot earlier, have a
SB> cool drink, change your film, have a cool drink, brush the morning dust off
SB> your lenses, have a cool drink, and then head out in the late afternoon and
SB> continue making photographs.

SB> Now, with conventional B&W there's another way ... overexpose a stop or
SB> more and then cut back on the development time.  That'll even out the
SB> contrast, have the photos looking more natural, and keep your subjects more
SB> relaxed.  Whoops!  Hardly anyone does any of that these days. So much
SB> easier with color neg film, a flash, and a quick trip to the one hour lab.
SB> No more cool drinks during mid day ... that's the biggest loss 

SB> I'm a bit of an odd duck here ... never used a flash, don't own a flash,
SB> can't see any reason to do so.  The only flash here is the one built into
SB> my digicam ...

SB> shel

SB> Bill Owens wrote:

>> > How true. When you don't have to think about exposure, you stop
>> > thinking about light. When you stop thinking about light, you produce
>> > crap. I didn't look at the photos in question, so I can't comment on
>> > that. But I agree that an on camera flash is almost never the right
>> > solution.
>>
>> Maybe sometimes as fill flash in bright sun outdoors?
>>
>> Bill

Re: how many?

[Christian Skofteland]

I'm not sure because my D was swapped out due to issues with the DOF
preview  The current one is up to 1149 and the previous one, before it
was traded in, had about 1800 or so.  Let's put it at ~2500 - 3000.

Christian Skofteland
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


- Original Message - 
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 9:03 PM
Subject: DIG: how many?


> So, here's a poll:
> How many shots so far with your *ist D?
>
> I'm at 1565
>
> I'm SURE I'm mid to low on the list.
>
> Cory
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.566 / Virus Database: 357 - Release Date: 1/22/2004
>

Re: DIG: how many?

[Rob Studdert]

On 23 Jan 2004 at 21:03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> So, here's a poll:
> How many shots so far with your *ist D?
> 
> I'm at 1565
> 
> I'm SURE I'm mid to low on the list.

1570 in under 3 weeks shooting, some experiments around home, two afternoon 
outings and one evening concert.



Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: Fuji Mini Lab

[William Robb]

- Original Message - 
From: "Herb Chong"
Subject: Re: Fuji Mini Lab


> that's not dye diffusion alone. dye sublimation printers are perfectly
> capable of printing direct positives. i don't think there is a negative
step
> anywhere.

Pictography machines are not dye sublimation.
They expose a doner sheet which then is sandwiched with a reciever sheet and
a small amount of nearly dry processing chemistry. The image develops, and
what doesn't develop transfers from the doner to the reciever.
Like I said, it is very much like a peel apart Polaroid process, so close
that I think there must be an agreement between the two companies.

William Robb

Re: does anyone have experience with high speed freezing the action photograp...

[David Mann]

Bob W wrote:

I'm speaking from a position of almost total ignorance here, but
surely a bullet is travelling 2 or 3 times faster than sound? Over the
short distances involved is it really possible to do this?
I would have thought a light or electric trigger would be better.
e.g. fit the trigger or the hammer of the gun with an electrical gizmo
to fire the flash.
A couple of years ago I started working on plans to build an electronic 
flash trigger which could be light or sound triggered, with a 
presettable delay before firing the flash.  I decided it was too much 
effort just to satisfy my curiosity so I shelved it before actually 
building anything.

I guess that if you're firing a gun then the triggering sound would be 
the gun itself, rather than the sound of the bullet hitting the target. 
 Otherwise you'd have to muffle the muzzle :)

Another way to do it would be to have the bullet break a laser beam on 
its way to the target, with an electronic delay to firing the flash (as 
I envisaged for my design).

Cheers,

- Dave

http://www.digistar.com/~dmann/

Re: BW digital printing solution?

[William Robb]

- Original Message - 
From: "J. C. O'Connell"
Subject: BW digital printing solution?


> What is the current simplest solution for doing
> HIGH QUALITY B&W digital prints. I'd like to be
> able to do 13" wide prints like my epson 1280,
> but create BW prints that look like wet prints, something
> the standard 1280 & inks CANT DO. Not even close.

I read about a guy who was outputting digital files to some sort of
transparency material as a negative, and then printing the result in a wet
darkroom.
I don't think it is possible to make B&W prints on an inkjet printer that
will match the quality of a good (much less an excellent) wet print.

William Robb

Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[John Coyle]

Actually, Herb, it isn't too bad!  At one time my sister-in-law's father
worked for Technicolour in the UK, and we could get substantial amounts of
film for no cost from him (don't know whether he had to pay for it).  My
brother and I both used it, and the quality was fine.  The only drawback was
that it could only be processed by Technicolour, and of course it came back
unmounted.

John Coyle
Brisbane, Australia

- Original Message - 
From: "Herb Chong" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2004 10:23 AM
Subject: Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?


> would you want to use movie film in your 35mm film camera?
>
> Herb
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Paul Stenquist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 4:23 PM
> Subject: Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?
>
>
> > I wouldn't bet on that. Pro shooter swtill use lots of medium and large
> format
> > film. And most movies are still shot on 35mm film. It will continue to
be
> > available until there is no substantial demand. And that won't happen
> until
> > digital resolution doubles or triples.
>
>

Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[Herb Chong]

yes, i know. that i why i asked.

Herb...
- Original Message - 
From: "Bill Owens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 7:32 PM
Subject: Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?


> > would you want to use movie film in your 35mm film camera?
> > 
> > Herb
> 
> A lot of people did! Remember Seattle Film Works?

Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[Bill Owens]

> would you want to use movie film in your 35mm film camera?
> 
> Herb

A lot of people did! Remember Seattle Film Works?

Bill

Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[Herb Chong]

if you go to the Photo Marketing Association's web site
(http://www.pmai.org) and download some of the public access reports, you
will see the numbers, at least to the end of 2002.

Herb

- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?


> The demand is going down and it's the pro segment of the market where
> it's dropping fastest. Point & shoots and disposables are the big market
> and film for these kind of cameras is going to survive longest.
>
> That's demonstrably untrue *now*. 6 megapixels replace 35mm in most
> situations and MF in some. Full-frame 10+ megapixels is better than 35mm
> and the equal of MF in most situations.

Helmut Newton dead

[Lasse Karlsson]

Helmut Newton died today, Friday, in a car crash in Hollywood.
Apparently he lost control of his car and crashed into a wall.

Lasse

Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[Herb Chong]

would you want to use movie film in your 35mm film camera?

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "Paul Stenquist" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 4:23 PM
Subject: Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?


> I wouldn't bet on that. Pro shooter swtill use lots of medium and large
format
> film. And most movies are still shot on 35mm film. It will continue to be
> available until there is no substantial demand. And that won't happen
until
> digital resolution doubles or triples.

Re: Good database for wedding clients?

[Mark Roberts]

Chris Brogden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>I showed her DeskTop Set (http://www.desktopset.com/), which a brilliant
>PDMLer (I forget who) recommended.  

Ooh! That were me!

>She loved the program, and at $19.95 it's a lot more reasonable than Act!  
>Looks like she's got a winner.

I've been using it since about 1995 (when it was $99.00!) and found it
to be excellent.


>On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, tom wrote:
>
>> I forget who posted this originally...did your friend make a choice?
>>
>> I've been playing with Outlook Business Contact Manager for a few days now
>> and it absolutely sucks.
>>
>> I may try ACT! again as a PDMLer told me offline that he's been using it
>> forever. Logically I can't see how it caused my problems, though the
>> coincidence makes me nervous.
>>
>> tv


-- 
Mark Roberts
Photography and writing
www.robertstech.com

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Herb Chong]

shoot at the same rate in film and you will end up paying a lot more. it's
the initial cost. film gets you one roll at a time.

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "Shel Belinkoff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D


> Hey, if the cards are such a good deal, if shooting digital
> is such a good deal, there should be no hesitancy in getting
> as many cards as you can afford and shooting at the highest
> resolution possible.  And of course, if need be, some kind
> of portable storage device to hold the image information.
> Maybe I'm obtuse, but it sure seem that the comments in this
> thread are counter to the comments made by some of the same
> people in the earlier thread.

Re: Fuji Mini Lab

[Herb Chong]

that's not dye diffusion alone. dye sublimation printers are perfectly
capable of printing direct positives. i don't think there is a negative step
anywhere.

Herb
- Original Message - 
From: "William Robb" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 10:00 AM
Subject: Re: Fuji Mini Lab


> Something Herb wrote tweaked a memory for me about the image quality of
the
> Pictrostat. The image is produced by dye diffussion, where a "negative" is
> exposed, and them a Polaroid type of dye migration process is used to
> develop the final print.
> This process does diffuse the image somewhat, so they are not as sharp as
> they could be.

Completely OT - request from any MIDI experts

[Cotty]

This is so off-topic, please delete immediately - unless you are into
making music and using Macs.

Does anyone use Macintosh computers hooked up to MIDI devices like
keyboards, and use sequencing software to record?

I have a few questions I'd like to ask..

Off list please!

email me direct:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Many thanks (going to bed now will respond later),




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: Fuji Mini Lab

[Butch Black]

They are similar to the free standing Aladdins found in a lot of minilabs,
they may actually use the same paper. You could try a couple images to see
if you are happy with the results. The results are good, but not quite as
snappy as a good frontier print. They also are a bit more finicky to set up
and keep running well, a donor change almost always is a noticeable color
shift requiring a calibration. It's also the size of one of those self serve
copiers found in Staples etc. not really what I would call portable. Moving
it around would not be a great idea. It would take two men minimum to lift
into a truck and I think things would go out of adjustment with constant
movement.

What is your need anyway? A Frontier 330 will take up to 8" paper so if you
don't need 10" prints and can live with the slower speed it's about 60-70%
the price of the 370. However, if you're not going to run a minimum of 20-30
rolls a day through it you will have problems keeping your chemistry good.
If what you need is a portable or semi-portable unit for making enlargements
I would go with an Epson 2200 or 4000. That, with a fast computer would cost
you between $2500-$4000 US, the print costs would be less then the
Pictography and it would be portable(ish).

If you do try to find an Aladdin to look at the prints, make sure it's a
free standing one. Some are hooked directly to a Frontier.

Butch

Each man had only one genuine vocation - to find the way to himself.

Hermann Hesse (Demian)

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Bill D. Casselberry]

 
 "Lewis Matthew" wrote:
> 
> >>From: graywolf 

> >>Remember, B&W photography is all about light and shadow,

> >Isn't this a rather restricted interpretation? Aren't line and form of
> >considerable significance?

;^)  only if line & form make a significant emphasis of 
existing light & shadow - otherwise they're distractions!

Bill

-
Bill D. Casselberry ; Photography on the Oregon Coast

http://www.orednet.org/~bcasselb
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-

RE: I did it.

[Bill Sawyer]

Thanks, Steve. That was submitted to the PUG a couple of years ago. 

-Original Message-
From:   Steve Desjardins [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent:   January 23, 2004 12:54 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:RE: I did it.

Bill, the first deer is really good.


Steven Desjardins
Department of Chemistry
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, VA 24450
(540) 458-8873
FAX: (540) 458-8878
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Bill Owens]

You're probably right, but I've had no problems with either pre-set white
balance or manual white balance.

Bill


> There is a big point to RAW besides extra resolution that you might
> get from avoiding compression artificacts.  RAW saves 12 bits of data
> per pixel (instead of 8) and the data hasn't been run through the
> white balance or exposure code yet.  As a result you can make sweeping
> white balance changes and better exposure changes than you can make to
> a JPEG file.
>
> alex
>
>

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Rob Studdert]

On 23 Jan 2004 at 8:06, Shel Belinkoff wrote:

> It looks pretty good to me  how does this quality
> compare
> with that from the istd?

Hi Shel,

It's pretty difficult to make anything more than a speculative assessment given 
that a side-by-side comparison can't be made especially considering that one 
camera has a fixed lens. Also I can only really compare it to best quality JPEG 
out of the *ist D as I have only shot a handful of lower Q JPEG images during 
my first day with the camera.

The Sony in camera post process definitely applies a great deal more sharpening 
than the *ist D at the minimum sharpening setting. There is also more colour 
noise visible in the white areas of the note than I would expect from *ist D 
image (even at medium JPEG Q). The high contrast edges show some obvious 
aliasing (likely a product of the heavy sharpening). There is some chromatic 
distortion visible on the edges  too but it's not bad. I guess it would print 
quite well as is but I'd expect the output of the *ist D would be more refined.

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: K-m42 alignment

[Bill D. Casselberry]

Familie Scheffler wrote:

> The focus scale doesn't line up correctly with the K-mount-body 
> but I think it's because I use a Hama M42-PK adapter. I have 
> just ordered a Pentax-brand one -  wait and see. (Infinity focus
> seems to be ok.)
 
This misalignment is normal and of no consequence, as long
as the lens is all the way threaded in infinity focus will
be fine. To assure dead top center for the lens markings
would require a very precise starting cut of the adapter
threads adjusted to a matching standard on the male threads
of all m42 lenses to bring them tight to the mount w/ the
aligner mark at top dead center. A bit of cosmetic overkill
when all that is necessary is a tight mounting.

Bill

-
Bill D. Casselberry ; Photography on the Oregon Coast

http://www.orednet.org/~bcasselb
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Shel Belinkoff]

Hi Boris ... Flash sucks ... the second photo is not
diminished as much by the use of flash as the first due to the
way the scene is naturally light.  I think Tom made the
comment about B&W photography being about light and shadow,
and I agree with his comment.  Actually, I pretty much agree
with everything Tom said.

And while this may not apply directly to what you were trying
to say with your photos, one of the greatest pool photos I
ever saw was taken using just the single light over the pool
table.  A lot of the scene was lost in underexposure, but the
movement of the cue ball, the slash of the pool cue, the
stroke of the shooter's hands, and just enough detail to know
that there was someone connecting all these elements, made for
a very powerful photograph.  Mostly just the highlights were
captured, and because of the slow shutter speed, the movement
of all the elements gave the photograph a real sense of
"aliveness" and of being there.

Don't be afraid to lose shadow detail, especially when you've
got a strong or interesting subject to work with.  As Tom
said, B&W photography is just as much about emotion (perhaps
more) as it is about capturing lots of detail.  If you haven't
already, look at the work of W. Eugene Smith.  Many, if not
most, of his most famous and powerful photographs use the
shadows to their advantage.  B&W can be evocative ... try to
take advantage of that.

kind regards,

shel belinkoff


Boris Liberman wrote:

> Hi!
>
> Here are the links again:
>
> http://boris.isra-shop.com/local/50/black-ball.jpg
>
> and this one:
>
> http://boris.isra-shop.com/local/50/portrait-with-beer.jpg
>
> Thanks!
>
> Boris

Re: OT: People and Their Bikes #3

[frank theriault]

I think that's just camera shake, Cotty.  

-frank

"The optimist thinks this is the best of all possible worlds.  The pessimist 
fears it is true."  -J. Robert Oppenheimer




From: Cotty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

>http://urbancaravan.com/images/bike_couriers_life.JPG

How does he do that? How does he get that vibrancy and life into his
pics? I want some.


Cheers,
  Cotty
___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk
_
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.  
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RE: 18MP vs Kodachrome

[J. C. O'Connell]

buy a rebel digital. you can mount takumars on it no
problem with a simple, non optical adapter ring.
JCO


   J.C. O'Connell   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://jcoconnell.com


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 5:47 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: 18MP vs Kodachrome


Somebody was hoping that an 18MP digital camera would come along before
Kodachrome went away.  A date of 2 years was suggested as the date of
Kodachrome's demise.  (I'm not sure I agree here, although if I were Kodak
I'd probably have killed it already).  It was also suggested that it was
unlikely that we'd see an 18MP DSLR within two years.

I'm REALLY not sure about that.  Canon's EOS1D at 11MP and Kodak's N14 at
14MP (both real, non-interpolated resolution) are about a year old.
Nikon's D1x with 5.5MP of partially-interpolated resolution is maybe three
years old and overdue for replacement.   Supposing Nikon puts out a
"D2X" at 10-12MP of real resolution at PMA this year (A lot of Nikon guys
are really hoping to see that).  Canon and Kodak may well answer with
higher-resolution DSLRs which would put them in 18MP turf within 2 years.

I'm not expecting to see an 18MP DSLR from PENTAX anytime soon, because
with current technology such a camera from any manufacturer is going
to cost about $10,000 and Pentax, unlike N and C, doesn't appear to have
a lot of users who routinely spend that kind of money on their gear.
What I'd love to see and more reasonably expect to see from Pentax
in the next year or so is a "baby" *istD to compete with the Canon digital
rebel and forthcoming Nikon D70 at the $900 price point.

I've got this collection of SMC Takumars, see, and they won't mount on
my Nikon digitals because the full-aperture metering lug bumps into the
glass element necessary to get proper infinity focus with Pentax lenses
on a Nikon camera.  I can't really justify a *istD at $1500 but somehow a
sub-$1000 pentax DSLR looks affordable.

Of course if Kodachrome hangs on another 20 years, I can still shoot
my Spotmatics...

DJE

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Rob Studdert]

On 23 Jan 2004 at 17:31, Steve Desjardins wrote:

> I also shoot ***L (*ist D for highest quality/res jpeg).  It's easily
> sufficient unto the task.  If I need better, I can switch to Tiff or Raw
> on the fly.  To be honest, however, unless I'm also using a tripod there
> probably isn't much point.

I've found RAW to be an advantage WRT brightness range and shadow detail in 
some specific instances (ie hand held low light shooting) however I can 
generally get away with saving JPEG in camera. I really can't see any clear 
advantage in saving TIFF in camera.

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: BW digital printing solution?

[Lukasz Kacperczyk]

> The new HP printers do a good job on B&W; they have
> light grey inks to make them an 8-color printer.  B&W
> on them uses ONLY black/grey inks; no color cast.

Actually, there is some very slight color cast - namely, a green/olive cast.
But that, of course, varies with the paper you use, just like you use
different papers in the darkroom for different effects. The printer (I have
a HP 7660 - a 6-color printer that also uses the 59 cartridge) prionts
beautifuly on matte papers, but, since matte papers are porous and not
swellable, they don't offer the stability I'd like to be able to achieve :-(

I like the results on the Ilford Galerie Classic Pearl best (they're
supposed to have a longevity of around 30 years accoring to Livick, about on
par with the HP papers, but Ilford media are half the price of the OEM
papers here, so it's a no-brainer for me).

regards,
Lukasz

  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
===
 www.fotopolis.pl
===
 internetowy magazyn o fotografii

RE: Good database for wedding clients?

[Chris Brogden]

I showed her DeskTop Set (http://www.desktopset.com/), which a brilliant
PDMLer (I forget who) recommended.  She loved the program, and at $19.95
it's a lot more reasonable than Act!  Looks like she's got a winner.

chris


On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, tom wrote:

> I forget who posted this originally...did your friend make a choice?
>
> I've been playing with Outlook Business Contact Manager for a few days now
> and it absolutely sucks.
>
> I may try ACT! again as a PDMLer told me offline that he's been using it
> forever. Logically I can't see how it caused my problems, though the
> coincidence makes me nervous.
>
> tv

18MP vs Kodachrome

[edwin]

Somebody was hoping that an 18MP digital camera would come along before
Kodachrome went away.  A date of 2 years was suggested as the date of
Kodachrome's demise.  (I'm not sure I agree here, although if I were Kodak
I'd probably have killed it already).  It was also suggested that it was
unlikely that we'd see an 18MP DSLR within two years.

I'm REALLY not sure about that.  Canon's EOS1D at 11MP and Kodak's N14 at
14MP (both real, non-interpolated resolution) are about a year old.  
Nikon's D1x with 5.5MP of partially-interpolated resolution is maybe three
years old and overdue for replacement.   Supposing Nikon puts out a
"D2X" at 10-12MP of real resolution at PMA this year (A lot of Nikon guys
are really hoping to see that).  Canon and Kodak may well answer with
higher-resolution DSLRs which would put them in 18MP turf within 2 years.

I'm not expecting to see an 18MP DSLR from PENTAX anytime soon, because 
with current technology such a camera from any manufacturer is going
to cost about $10,000 and Pentax, unlike N and C, doesn't appear to have
a lot of users who routinely spend that kind of money on their gear.
What I'd love to see and more reasonably expect to see from Pentax
in the next year or so is a "baby" *istD to compete with the Canon digital 
rebel and forthcoming Nikon D70 at the $900 price point.  

I've got this collection of SMC Takumars, see, and they won't mount on
my Nikon digitals because the full-aperture metering lug bumps into the
glass element necessary to get proper infinity focus with Pentax lenses
on a Nikon camera.  I can't really justify a *istD at $1500 but somehow a 
sub-$1000 pentax DSLR looks affordable.

Of course if Kodachrome hangs on another 20 years, I can still shoot
my Spotmatics...

DJE  

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Shel Belinkoff]

Hi Boris ... while there may be numerous reasons to chose one photo over
another, your questions begs this little joke.

A nice Jewish mother gave her son two ties for his birthday.  Wanting to show
his appreciation for the gift, he wore one to dinner the next evening.  Upon
seeing the tie, his mother said, "So, what was wrong with the other one that
you didn't wear it."


> From: "Boris Liberman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> > Please, can you tell me what is wrong/has to be fixed with the first
> > one that made you not to chose it?

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Shel Belinkoff]

Hi Bob,

It comes up with the image in the editing software.
In IrfanView it comes up by clicking on
IMAGE > INFORMATION > EXIF

In Photoshop 7.0 it can be brought up using the file browser.

I didn't use the fine resolution because I forgot that
the camera was set on standard for some email stuff
I'd been doing earlier.  Usually, I never move from the
fine setting, so, naturally, I forgot to reset things.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Shel,
> Where did you get all that data on the Sony S85 image?
> Is it burried somewhere in the jpg?
> Why didn't you use a fine resolution jpg, as this is a lower quality one.
> Regards,  Bob S.

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Jostein]

- Original Message - 
From: "Boris Liberman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> Please, can you tell me what is wrong/has to be fixed with the first
> one that made you not to chose it?

Um...
Like Alan, I don't usually do people photography, so what counts for me is
the general impression more than the technicalities. To me it's something
about the expression of the guy. He seems engaged in conversation with
someone outside the frame over the ball he's pointing at. Hi face is frozen
in a moment where it's not possible for me to guess what he's saying or
thinking.

Jostein

RE: I did it.

[Bill Sawyer]

Wow, thank you!  I hope to scan/upload some recent stuff, including some
more of the cubs, this weekend.

-Original Message-
From:   P Kong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent:   January 22, 2004 11:44 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:RE: I did it.

At 07:12 PM 1/22/2004, Bill Sawyer wrote:
>Try the Zoo, too, Paul. The Wildlife Photo Exhibit is held over for another
>month, and they have 3 tiger cubs, about 6 months old now, who are
>enormously photogenic:
>
>http://groups.msn.com/wsawyerphotography/wildlife.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&Pho
t
>oID=136 (wish I were better at scanning.)

I just took a look at your gallery. You have some pretty awesome deer/fawn
shots there.

Pat in SF

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Rfsindg]

Shel,
Where did you get all that data on the Sony S85 image?
Is it burried somewhere in the jpg?
Why didn't you use a fine resolution jpg, as this is a lower quality one.
Regards,  Bob S.


[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> Hi Christian ... I think all you'd need to know is here.  Ti highlight your
> specific questions:
> 
>Exposures F 5.6 @ 1/40 second hand held
>ISO 100
>Focal length 13.90 mm (about 70mm "equivalent")
>No flash
> 
> What you see is a full sized section of a large sized, lowest rez
> JPEG straight from the camera.  No manipulation or alteration
> at all ... no "in camera sharpening," contrast correction, 
> nada ...
> 
> 
> 
> File: - B:\DCIM\100MSDCF\Dsc03963.jpg
> 
> ImageDescription -
> Make - SONY
> Model - CYBERSHOT
> Orientation - Top left
> XResolution - 72
> YResolution - 72
> ResolutionUnit - Inch
> DateTime - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
> YCbCrPositioning - Co-Sited
> ExifOffset - 218
> ExposureTime - 10/400 seconds
> FNumber - 5.60
> ExposureProgram - Aperture priority
> ISOSpeedRatings - 100
> ExifVersion - 210
> DateTimeOriginal - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
> DateTimeDigitized - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
> ComponentsConfiguration - YCbCr
> CompressedBitsPerPixel - 2 (bits/pixel)
> ExposureBiasValue - 0.00
> MaxApertureValue - F 2.00
> MeteringMode - Spot
> LightSource - Daylight
> Flash - Not fired
> FocalLength - 13.90 mm
> FlashPixVersion - 100
> ColorSpace - sRGB
> ExifImageWidth - 2272
> ExifImageHeight - 1704
> InteroperabilityOffset - 642
> FileSource - DSC - Digital still camera
> SceneType - A directly photographed image

Re: BW digital printing solution?

[Bruce Dayton]

The latest HP 8 color printer is reported to be the best B&W printer
out right now.  The HP 7960 - the two extra colors are dark and light
gray or some such.  Do some surfing and see what you can find out.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce



Friday, January 23, 2004, 1:59:26 PM, you wrote:

JCOC> What is the current simplest solution for doing
JCOC> HIGH QUALITY B&W digital prints. I'd like to be
JCOC> able to do 13" wide prints like my epson 1280,
JCOC> but create BW prints that look like wet prints, something
JCOC> the standard 1280 & inks CANT DO. Not even close.
JCOC> JCO
JCOC> 
JCOC>J.C. O'Connell   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://jcoconnell.com
JCOC> 

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[alex wetmore]

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Steve Desjardins wrote:
> I also shoot ***L (*ist D for highest quality/res jpeg).  It's easily
> sufficient unto the task.  If I need better, I can switch to Tiff or Raw
> on the fly.  To be honest, however, unless I'm also using a tripod there
> probably isn't much point.  I have one  Lexar 1GB card, 1 GB IBM
> microdrive and a 256 MB eFilm card. If I were going on a trip, I'd
> probably buy a few more 1 GB cards.

There is a big point to RAW besides extra resolution that you might
get from avoiding compression artificacts.  RAW saves 12 bits of data
per pixel (instead of 8) and the data hasn't been run through the
white balance or exposure code yet.  As a result you can make sweeping
white balance changes and better exposure changes than you can make to
a JPEG file.

alex

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Rob Studdert]

On 23 Jan 2004 at 7:04, Shel Belinkoff wrote:

> Hey, if the cards are such a good deal, if shooting digital
> is such a good deal, there should be no hesitancy in getting
> as many cards as you can afford and shooting at the highest
> resolution possible.  And of course, if need be, some kind
> of portable storage device to hold the image information.

I'm not complaining about the absolute cost of digital storage (it has saved me 
cash and will continue to do so) but more so about the relative cost of the 
highest capacity cards. I'd always prefer a few larger cards than a pocket full 
of little ones. 4GB cards are disproportionately expensive, next year they will 
be affordable.

Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT)  +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~distudio/publications/
Pentax user since 1986, PDMLer since 1998

Re: BW digital printing solution?

[Lon Williamson]

The new HP printers do a good job on B&W; they have
light grey inks to make them an 8-color printer.  B&W
on them uses ONLY black/grey inks; no color cast.  As
far as I know, they can't print as large as you want,
though.
J. C. O'Connell wrote:
What is the current simplest solution for doing
HIGH QUALITY B&W digital prints. I'd like to be
able to do 13" wide prints like my epson 1280,
but create BW prints that look like wet prints, something
the standard 1280 & inks CANT DO. Not even close.

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Steve Desjardins]

I also shoot ***L (*ist D for highest quality/res jpeg).  It's easily
sufficient unto the task.  If I need better, I can switch to Tiff or Raw
on the fly.  To be honest, however, unless I'm also using a tripod there
probably isn't much point.  I have one  Lexar 1GB card, 1 GB IBM
microdrive and a 256 MB eFilm card. If I were going on a trip, I'd
probably buy a few more 1 GB cards.

And that's something I really do like.  Everything that it can do (res,
storage, sensitivity, etc.) I can get anytime I need it.  Except that
tripod, of course. ;-)  


Steven Desjardins
Department of Chemistry
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, VA 24450
(540) 458-8873
FAX: (540) 458-8878
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 01/23/04 01:25PM >>>
On 23/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>Hey, if the cards are such a good deal, if shooting digital
>is such a good deal, there should be no hesitancy in getting
>as many cards as you can afford and shooting at the highest
>resolution possible.  And of course, if need be, some kind
>of portable storage device to hold the image information.
>Maybe I'm obtuse, but it sure seem that the comments in this
>thread are counter to the comments made by some of the same
>people in the earlier thread.
>
>So, what am I missing here, folks ;-))

Shel, I have never hidden the fact that I shoot large/fine jpeg. My
criteria for selecting a suitable resolution for the vast majority of
my
shooting were these:

What level of quality would be required to produce good inkjet prints
at
a maximum of 16"X11"?

What was the trade-off between RAW and large/fine jpeg WRT how many
pics
would fit in a reasonable space of memory (CF cards).

Two test prints, side by side, illustrated to me that there was no
visible difference between RAW and large/fine jpeg, so the answer was
clear cut for me.

BTW, I have never said that shooting digital is a good deal. I have
always said that I have enjoyed it - it is a hobby, and as such I
don't
have to be able to justify the cost, like anyone doing it for money
would
have to. I've got half-gig cards and that's all I want to pay.

For me it's all about having fun and not justifying anything! LOL.




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps 
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk 

RE: BW digital printing solution?

[tom]

> -Original Message-
> From: J. C. O'Connell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> 
> What is the current simplest solution for doing HIGH QUALITY 
> B&W digital prints. 

FTP it to a lab that uses b/w paper.

tv

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Mark Roberts]

"Lewis Matthew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>>From: graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>>Remember, B&W photography is all about light and shadow,
>
>Isn't this a rather restricted interpretation? Aren't line and form of 
>considerable significance?

Not to mention flowers and kittens.
;-)

-- 
Mark Roberts
"Don't try outweird me, three-eyes. I get stranger things than you free with my 
breakfast cereal."
www.robertstech.com

BW digital printing solution?

[J. C. O'Connell]

What is the current simplest solution for doing
HIGH QUALITY B&W digital prints. I'd like to be
able to do 13" wide prints like my epson 1280,
but create BW prints that look like wet prints, something
the standard 1280 & inks CANT DO. Not even close.
JCO

   J.C. O'Connell   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://jcoconnell.com

3.5/24 SMC Pentax

[Raimo Korhonen]

What´s the general opinion of this lens?
I bought one quite cheaply, 50 Euros - the mount is strangely corroded but seems to 
work OK. 
All the best!
Raimo
Personal photography homepage at http://www.uusikaupunki.fi/~raikorho

Re: Papa Flash

[Otis Wright]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Mark,

Doc Edgerton was an early electrical engineer, in Dynamo Engineering I 
believe.  He developed the flash to help freeze the spinning machinery for a good 
look.  In the hall outside his lab there were some of his early photos, 
including Ariel Recon photos of Boston taken in the late '30's.  He loaded some flash 
tubes and capacitors in an airplane and took night shots of 4 or 9 square 
miles of Boston at a time.  

He was a remarkable individual with a great deal of curiosity who treated the 
students well.  He and his lab were remarkably open to undergraduates.  

One afternoon while helping Doc with a show at a local Hotel, the press 
showed up and suggested that I and another student stand back so that 
they could get some solo  shots of Doc with some of the gear on 
display.   What they got was shots WITH the students front and center 
and to do so they  were allowed to take some duplicates with the 
student's cameras as part of the deal.  Doc took a lot of interest and 
extremely  good care of those who worked with him.It all transpired 
very smoothly and comfortably -- no tension whatsoever -- as was Doc's 
style, and as I recall on that occasion there were no opportunities for 
any solo shots of Doc except those he offered to the students after the 
press left.  

I didn't take any courses from Doc.  Just worked in his lab.  However, 
no one had a more profound impact on my career other than maybe Jay 
Forrester.

In 
the '60's, he brought friends like Jaques Costeau around to show off his early 
underwater movies.

Costeau was visiting  in  '59 , and it was my impression then that he 
had there in earlier years.   Amongst many other things, we were working 
on camera sleds and sled-tracking sonar at the time--- as I recall.
 
   Cheers,
  Otis Wright

Regards,  Bob S.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Bob W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
 

Those were photos from Doc Edgerton's lab at MIT.
They used some good size flash tubes, and
I believe a microphone was used to trigger the flash.
 

Polaroid film and open the shutter, fire the gun,
which triggers the flash, and you see where the bullet is.
Then, adjust the microphone closer or farther away from the gun,
to get the bullet where you want it in the frame.
 

I'm speaking from a position of almost total ignorance here, but
surely a bullet is travelling 2 or 3 times faster than sound? Over the
short distances involved is it really possible to do this?
   

I don't know anything about the velocity of bullets, but even if they do
travel at Mach 3 all you'd have to do is position the target 3 feet from
the gun and the microphone 1 foot away and you'd be pretty much
synchronized.
 

I would have thought a light or electric trigger would be better.
e.g. fit the trigger or the hammer of the gun with an electrical gizmo
to fire the flash.
   

A microphone was deemed the easiest way to go: No attachments or
modifications to the gun; most equipment readily available off-the
shelf. Edgerton claims he got his first shot (the bullet going through
the apple, IIRC) on his first try. Clearly, this was a man not
unaccustomed to precise laboratory work!
 

RE: As usual: photo advise sought

[ernreed2]

Me too -- that was a SCARY sentence. (I think the answer is No, in this case, 
by the way.)

> Yes, I am glad that I saw the photo before I read that.
> 
> David Madsen
> mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> http://www.davidmadsen.com
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Chris Brogden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 11:10 AM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: As usual: photo advise sought
> 
> 
> On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Kostas Kavoussanakis wrote:
> 
> > Also, would the balls and face be in focus if shooting at f2?
> 
> 
> Now I'm scared to open this photo.  :)
> 
> chris
> 
> 

Re: does anyone have experience with high speed freezing the action photograp...

[Dag T]

På 23. jan. 2004 kl. 07.54 skrev mike wilson:

Bob W wrote:
I'm speaking from a position of almost total ignorance here, but
surely a bullet is travelling 2 or 3 times faster than sound? Over the
short distances involved is it really possible to do this?
It's possible to get bullets that travel at subsonic velocity.  They
make less noise. Even supersonic ones are not that fast, I think.
I think the trick is to put the acoustic trigger close to the gun.  The 
resulting electronic signals travel much faster than sound and may 
trigger the flash before the bullet reach the target.

By the way, I have seen photos of supersonic bullets WITH shock waves 
(polarization effects), so they do not have to rely on slow bullets for 
these photos.

DagT

FS Friday/Diiopters

[Clive Evans]

Whoops
I've just looked, these are
+1
+2
and+3
$ 10 apiece!
Clive
Antibes
France

Microdrives

[Brian Dipert]

The old 340 GByte drives had a nasty tendency to lockup with the read
head/arm partially in-between its normal operation and park positions. This
happened to me personally; the 1 GByte replacement hasn't exhibited this
phenomenon (yet) but plummeting flash prices have found me not using the
Microdrive much, either.

You can tell this has happened by the audible and multiple 'clicking' noises
the drive makes when you stick it in the slot and it attempts to spin up for
the first five or so seconds; it'll eventually give up and you'll get system
error messages relating to an inability to access it. There is a way to at
least temporarily fix this, and I kid you not..put the drive on a
CompactFlash expansion harness or in a PCMCIA adapter, or in some system
slot that gives you physical access to its bottom edge, then gently tap on
the bottom left corner during the spin-up attempt cycle (if you wait too
long, it won't work, you'll need to remove and reinsert the drive then try
again). An IBM (then, now Hitachi) marketing VP told me this during a
face-to-face meeting at CES a few years back. And it works.

You Microdrive users may want to file this away for future reference. It's
not a matter of 'if' as much as it's a matter of 'when' ;-)
==
Brian Dipert
Technical Editor: Mass Storage, Memory, Multimedia, PC Core Logic and
Peripherals, and Programmable Logic
EDN Magazine: http://www.edn.com
5000 V Street
Sacramento, CA   95817
(916) 454-5242 (voice), (617) 558-4470 (fax)
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Visit me at http://www.bdipert.com

FS Frday/Dome F803

[Clive Evans]

ShelShel
Yes, couldn't wait for real one, and found a REALLY NICE copy here in
Paris, they are labelled MEKKO and are much nicer than the ones I have seen
on Ebay, it comes complete with a hard bottom padded insert that takes
three lenses  or MX/Leica size bodies with lenses mounted, I initially
intended to have a voigtlander bessa+lens each end and a 21 and 85mm in the
centre compartment.
Two good pockets on the front and the big flap also has two pockets on the
outside and one on the inside.
Also a pocket on the back...
There is a really heavy duty shoulder pad and a separate hand carry strap
and waist belt [for thin people!]
Actually much better made than the last domke I saw!
So I brought two of these[always buy two, you never know ehn you may see
another one] from Paris two weeks ago, very pleased, and three days later
my wife gave me a brand new Billingham Hadley for my
birthday.what could I do?
Some pix here .
Clive

RE: why does first curtain sync still exist?

[josvdh]

Thanks for the answers!

Agree with Cotty that it could be usefull to have leading blur (due to first
curtain sync) to suggest that the movement was backwards.

Donot agree with Christian,also with second curtain sync, blur can be
avoided by using highest speed and/or balancing flash and ambient lighting.

The reasoning of Tom is in priciple true, but will depend on the camera: if
the highest speed with flash sync has some reserve and the minimum delay
between the first curtain trigger pulse and the second curtain pulse is
sufficient short, the second curtain sync will have the same maximum speed.

Agree fully with the example of Steve about getting the decissive moment at
night photography.
This example triggered me also for the case of stroboflash ( the wellknown
examples of jumping ballet dancer, frozen five times during a jump) here
first curtain flash is essential!

Re: does anyone have experience with high speed freezing the action photograp...

[Bob W]

Hi,

> But wouldn't large(ish) calibre bullets make a mess of what you're trying
> to photograph - depending on subject, of course? If it was an egg, for
> instance, wouldn't an air gun pellet make a more interesting shot than a
> .22 round?

there are some interesting examples here of someone shooting eggs, balloons
and stuff indoors with a pellet gun:
http://www.bmumford.com/photo/ballistics/

using this timing device:
http://www.bmumford.com/photo/camctlr.html

-- 
Cheers,
 Bob

RE: FS Friday: ball head, KM

[Amita Guha]

> > Bogen/Manfrotto 486 compact ball head, used a couple
>
> I'm interested.  Is it a quick release style?  Would
> it be too small for 2021 legs?

Nope, it's not quick release. According to B&H, it fits any Bogen
tripod. It was too big to work with my monopod; that's why I'm selling
it.

Re: Papa Flash

[Robert Gonzalez]

I love the display in the hallway.  His water going "up hill" trick was 
amazing.

rg

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Mark,

Doc Edgerton was an early electrical engineer, in Dynamo Engineering I 
believe.  He developed the flash to help freeze the spinning machinery for a good 
look.  In the hall outside his lab there were some of his early photos, 
including Ariel Recon photos of Boston taken in the late '30's.  He loaded some flash 
tubes and capacitors in an airplane and took night shots of 4 or 9 square 
miles of Boston at a time.  

He was a remarkable individual with a great deal of curiosity who treated the 
students well.  He and his lab were remarkably open to undergraduates.  In 
the '60's, he brought friends like Jaques Costeau around to show off his early 
underwater movies.

Regards,  Bob S.

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Bob W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Those were photos from Doc Edgerton's lab at MIT.
They used some good size flash tubes, and
I believe a microphone was used to trigger the flash.

Polaroid film and open the shutter, fire the gun,
which triggers the flash, and you see where the bullet is.
Then, adjust the microphone closer or farther away from the gun,
to get the bullet where you want it in the frame.
I'm speaking from a position of almost total ignorance here, but
surely a bullet is travelling 2 or 3 times faster than sound? Over the
short distances involved is it really possible to do this?


I don't know anything about the velocity of bullets, but even if they do
travel at Mach 3 all you'd have to do is position the target 3 feet from
the gun and the microphone 1 foot away and you'd be pretty much
synchronized.

I would have thought a light or electric trigger would be better.
e.g. fit the trigger or the hammer of the gun with an electrical gizmo
to fire the flash.


A microphone was deemed the easiest way to go: No attachments or
modifications to the gun; most equipment readily available off-the
shelf. Edgerton claims he got his first shot (the bullet going through
the apple, IIRC) on his first try. Clearly, this was a man not
unaccustomed to precise laboratory work!

Re: AF 400T and *ist D?

[Bruce Dayton]

Hello Paul,

Having 2 AF400T's myself, I can vouch for the fact that it can be used
in TTL.  There seems to be a bit of the unevenness in exposure that
has been mentioned.  It seems to be more of an issue with digital
rather than this particular combination.  TV and others have mentioned
it in regards to other cameras and brands.  My results have been as good
as using the AF360FGZ with the *istD.  I use a Lumiquest softbox on
mine and a Stoboframe Pro-RL bracket.  Overall, it is just fine.  I
have not tried it with K or M lenses however.

-- 
Best regards,
Bruce



Friday, January 23, 2004, 6:10:17 AM, you wrote:

PS> Can the AF 400T flash be used with the *ist D. Can it be used in TTL
PS> mode? Can it be used in TTL mode with K or M lenses?
PS> Paul

Re: Q: Interchangeable screen for SFXn

[Rfsindg]

Kostas,

The split screen can help you get a specific item/area in precise focus, but I find 
the ground glass matte image most useful in judging static compositions.  Use the 
depth of field preview as well.

Regards,  Bob S.


[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

> On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > If you want the aide, use the beep or visual focus confirmation in the finder.
> 
> I am not sure it's as good as the split screen for macro, which is why
> I am priming the ME Super for this (but it's not TTL flash and thus
> does not exploit the capabilities of the 080C). Just to clarify: the
> split (and any) screen is not incompatible with AF, just 
> deemed unnecessary, right?
> 
> Many thanks (to Frantisek for his detailed answer too).
> 
> Kostas

Re: OT: People and Their Bikes #3

[cbwaters]

You know, I've a shot online with my kids and their bikes...:
http://community.webshots.com/photo/93489626/94582233SJySpG

Cory

- Original Message - 
From: "Mark Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 7:32 PM
Subject: Re: OT: People and Their Bikes #3


> "frank theriault" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> >Ok, frank.  Focus.  This time hit "edit", then "paste".  Do not hit
"send"
> >until you're all done...
> >
> >Part of an ongoing series I'm trying to put together as you'll likely
know
> >if you saw the first couple of installments):
> >
> >http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2069017
>
> Hey, I just discovered that I *do* have a photo of a bike:
> http://www.robertstech.com/eefc/pages/7D204129.htm
>
> -- 
> Mark Roberts
> Photography and writing
> www.robertstech.com
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.564 / Virus Database: 356 - Release Date: 1/19/2004

Re: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[Mark Roberts]

"tom" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>I got the same thing, it would seem they should have sent thing out about 2
>years ago.

I would *expect* the pro films to go away sooner than the consumer-grade
stuff.

-- 
Mark Roberts
Photography and writing
www.robertstech.com

AW: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[keller.schaefer]

Here are some Euros (worth slightly more...)
*ist D and F 1.4/50, about the same scale, *** JPEG: 

http://www.mynetcologne.de/~nc-kellersv2/euros.jpg

Sven



-Ursprungliche Nachricht-
Von: Shel Belinkoff [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Gesendet: Freitag, 23. Januar 2004 17:07
An: PDML
Betreff: Unretouched and unmanipulated 


http://home.earthlink.net/~digisnaps/unretouched.html
388K JPEG

This is a section of an image taken by the Sony DSC-S85.
Largest size JPEG but on standard quality instead of finest
quality. No sharpening, no manipulation of any sort -
straight
from the camera. Taken with macro mode.

It looks pretty good to me  how does this quality
compare
with that from the istd?

shel

RE: As usual: photo advise sought

[David Madsen]

Yes, I am glad that I saw the photo before I read that.

David Madsen
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.davidmadsen.com

-Original Message-
From: Chris Brogden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 11:10 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: As usual: photo advise sought


On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Kostas Kavoussanakis wrote:

> Also, would the balls and face be in focus if shooting at f2?


Now I'm scared to open this photo.  :)

chris

Re: does anyone have experience with high speed freezing the actionphotograp...

[mike wilson]

Hi,

Cotty wrote:

> But wouldn't large(ish) calibre bullets make a mess of what you're trying
> to photograph - depending on subject, of course? If it was an egg, for
> instance, wouldn't an air gun pellet make a more interesting shot than a
> .22 round? Not my cup of tea, just procrastinating. I filmed some police
> marksmen recently on an indoor range letting off handguns and it scared
> the daylights out of me. Sorta like when you're standing close to the
> edge of a tall building and you think 'hmm, I could just end it all right
> now and leap off'

I've got almost a whole wasted film of a group of people watching
Chieftain tanks fire, at Lulworth range.  Every time one let off,
everyone in the group lifted off the ground.  I couldn't control my own
reactions enough to get the shot of them levitating.  I just wanted to
_leave_, right now!  They were a good 50 yards away and pointing in the
opposite direction.  Lord preserve anyone who gets in front of one.

mike

Re: why does first curtain sync still exist?

[Cotty]

On 23/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>Dear Group,
>Why are new camera's still equiped with first and second curtain sync?
>Is there any use for first curtain sync?
>Just curious...
>
>Greetings, Jos

Could be useful to shoot fill flash on a car going backwards?




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: FS Friday: ball head, KM

[John M Bailey]

--- Amita,

I'm interested.  Is it a quick release style?  Would
it be too small for 2021 legs?

> Bogen/Manfrotto 486 compact ball head, used a couple

Thanks,



=
jmb `:^)

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Cotty]

On 23/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>Hey, if the cards are such a good deal, if shooting digital
>is such a good deal, there should be no hesitancy in getting
>as many cards as you can afford and shooting at the highest
>resolution possible.  And of course, if need be, some kind
>of portable storage device to hold the image information.
>Maybe I'm obtuse, but it sure seem that the comments in this
>thread are counter to the comments made by some of the same
>people in the earlier thread.
>
>So, what am I missing here, folks ;-))

Shel, I have never hidden the fact that I shoot large/fine jpeg. My
criteria for selecting a suitable resolution for the vast majority of my
shooting were these:

What level of quality would be required to produce good inkjet prints at
a maximum of 16"X11"?

What was the trade-off between RAW and large/fine jpeg WRT how many pics
would fit in a reasonable space of memory (CF cards).

Two test prints, side by side, illustrated to me that there was no
visible difference between RAW and large/fine jpeg, so the answer was
clear cut for me.

BTW, I have never said that shooting digital is a good deal. I have
always said that I have enjoyed it - it is a hobby, and as such I don't
have to be able to justify the cost, like anyone doing it for money would
have to. I've got half-gig cards and that's all I want to pay.

For me it's all about having fun and not justifying anything! LOL.




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: PUG vs AutoPug

[Cotty]

On 23/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>I have tried to do some ping scans and stuff. Within the IP range that
the PUG
>server resides, it's just that particular address that doesn't respond.
>From this side it looks like it's something on the local server that has
>failed...
>
>Jostein

Hi mate, just tried it and not a sausage. 1800 GMT Friday.




Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: does anyone have experience with high speed freezing the action photograp...

[mike wilson]

Hi,

Tom Reese wrote:

> I will try to do this in daylight with flash equipment set relatively close
> to the target for maximum power. My camera will be a bit further away with a
> telephoto lens (I don't want splattered fruit all over my lens!). I thought
> I'd stop the lens down to f/22 and shoot at maximum flash synch speed.
> Hopefully, the flash duration will be short enough to freeze the bullet and
> the small aperture will minimize the daylight exposure on the film. At 700
> fps a bullet travels 5.6 feet in 1/125th of a second so I have to eliminate
> daylight as a light source. This may require a box with the flashes poking
> through holes in the side. A flash duration of 1/50,000 of a second would
> give me bullet movement of .168". That might be the best I can reasonable
> expect. I don't know what the shortest possible duration of my flash
> equipment is. I have an AF400FTZ and a METZ 50 MZ-5. They can supposedly be
> operated together. Hopefully the combination in TTL mode will give me the
> short flash duration that I will need to make this work.

You will need to _eliminate_ daylight.  At least, effectively.  You will
be working with an open shutter - trying to synch the shutter as well as
the flash is going to drive you potty.  The _flash_ acts as the
shutter.  Minimum delay between triggering and exposing.  Otherwise you
will have to trigger the shutter at some point early in the bullet's
trajectory, hoping that, by the time the shutter has opened and the
flash has gone off, the bullet is somewhere in the frame.  It will be
complete and utter guesswork.  As you will have to open the shutter and
then trigger the apparatus, extraneous light needs to be removed.

TTL flash will probably not work unless you can arrange a completely
white background, close to the plane of focus.  It keeps going until it
is satisfied that there is enough exposure.  Manual flash will have a
fixed duration - the lower energy manual outputs of flashes like the
AF400T and one of the old, auto/manual third party beasts whose name I
forget at the moment will be ideal, as they will be shorter.  _One_
flash, to be sure of not getting multiple exposures.  Then arrange
backgrounds/apertures until you get a suitable combination that exposes
properly.

One thought - a piece of dowel, of the same diameter as the barrel and
long enough to reach the target, can be inserted to give you something
to focus to for when you are trying "before and after" shots.

Ideally, you should search for some links to get circuits for high speed
flash assemblies.  I suspect that ordinary equipment is not going to
make it.  To get enough illumination, it will have to fire for too long.


Strikes me as ideal work for digital.


Certainly will be interested to see the results.

mike

RE: I did it.

[Steve Desjardins]

Bill, the first deer is really good.


Steven Desjardins
Department of Chemistry
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, VA 24450
(540) 458-8873
FAX: (540) 458-8878
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Chris Brogden]

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Kostas Kavoussanakis wrote:

> Also, would the balls and face be in focus if shooting at f2?


Now I'm scared to open this photo.  :)

chris

Re: Researching which media to use for my new *ist D

[Cotty]

On 22/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>A. The MicroDrives, if so which brand as I've seen and IBM and maybe one 
>other.
>OR
>B. CF, I've seen that these have some of Accelaration feature which the 
>*ist D has support for.

Personally I wouldn't touch a microdrive. CF all the way for me. They say
that dropping one shouldn't damage it inside, but I'm not going to test
that theory out with my storage. Stands to reason that something with
moving parts inside might be more susceptible to damage..



Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: I did it.

[Cotty]

On 22/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>Well, I sold about $1200 worth of screwmount lenses in the last few 
>days along with my Spotmatic Motor Drive, so I ordered an *ist D.


Paul, I would be very interested to read your comments after a week with
the camera, and especially after a few big prints...

Good luck,



Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: does anyone have experience with high speed freezing the action photograp...

[Cotty]

On 23/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>> I'd have thought a fairly simple switch activated mechanically by the
>> movement of the trigger would be a lot easier.
>>
>> -- 
>> Cheers,
>>  Bob
>>


>Probably an air rifle pellet would still be in the barrel if you used a this
>method.
>
>Bill
>

But wouldn't large(ish) calibre bullets make a mess of what you're trying
to photograph - depending on subject, of course? If it was an egg, for
instance, wouldn't an air gun pellet make a more interesting shot than a
.22 round? Not my cup of tea, just procrastinating. I filmed some police
marksmen recently on an indoor range letting off handguns and it scared
the daylights out of me. Sorta like when you're standing close to the
edge of a tall building and you think 'hmm, I could just end it all right
now and leap off'





Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

FS Friday: ball head, KM

[Amita Guha]

One last time before these go on ebay...

Bogen/Manfrotto 486 compact ball head, used a couple of times but
looks/works like new. $30

KM with a 50mm f/2 and a flaky meter. $40

I take personal checks and Paypal.

Amita

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Shel Belinkoff]

It's back in circulation already  

Christian wrote:

> what about the 20?
>
> ;-)

RE: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[tom]

I got the same thing, it would seem they should have sent thing out about 2
years ago.

tv 

> -Original Message-
> From: Rob Brigham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 12:20 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?
> 
> Just got this from kodak.  They obviously want to know how 
> many pros are taking up digital and how fast they are 
> abandoning film.  I guess now they have planned dropping many 
> of the consumer films, they are looking at the better ones too!
> 
> Don't know if people will be able to access the questionnaire 
> by the link here, but if so then perhaps we should all tell 
> them we want to keep using film!!
> 
> 
> 
> Dear Valued Customer, 
> KODAK PROFESSIONAL Imaging Solutions is undertaking an 
> important survey among Professionals to better understand 
> where you obtain your hard copy output, your needs for output 
> services and how various providers satisfy those needs.
> 
> By answering this 15-minute questionnaire 
> (http://kodak.prq0.com/apps/redir.asp?link=XbgdcadjCE,Zcdghjba
eaDC&o
> id=UdfieCA&iclitemid=XbfbjjbbCH&tid=WbfeiecCE&uid=
> 000134
> 7145) we will be able to work on new solutions to better meet 
> your needs. Look for the results of this survey in an 
> upcoming issue of ProPass 
> (http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/member/ProPass/pr
> oPassIndex
> .jhtml).
> 
> WHAT'S THIS SURVEY ABOUT?
> We want to learn about your business so we can provide 
> products and services that better meet your needs.
> 
> HOW LONG WILL IT TAKE?
> This survey will take approximately 15 minutes.
> 
> WHAT ABOUT CONFIDENTIALITY?
> All survey answers are confidential. No sales calls will be 
> initiated because you answered this survey.
> 
> Your opinion is extremely important to guide our new product 
> development efforts. Thank you in advance for your help.
> 
> Click here to access the survey.
> 
> Sincerely,
> KODAK PROFESSIONAL Imaging Solutions
> 
> P.S. Please respond no later than Friday January 30th, 2004.
> 
> (c) Eastman Kodak Company, 2004.
> 
>  
> 
> 

RE: PUG vs AutoPug

[Adelheid v. K.]

I've tried to reach Igor, but the whole server is down, so no mails to him
are possible either.
I am sure they know that the server is down and are working on it.
I think the hardware crashed. And since they are a nonprofit organisation it
will take time to reestablish the service. 
Moving to another site is not so easy, since I don't really want to pay for
it.
And my own website has not enough space or bandwidth.
Furthermore I don't have the same rights on my website as I have on the
komkon server.

Cheers
Adelheid

 

-Original Message-
From: William Robb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Freitag, 23. Januar 2004 15:53
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: PUG vs AutoPug


- Original Message -
From: "Jostein"
Subject: Re: PUG vs AutoPug


> I have tried to do some ping scans and stuff. Within the IP range that the
PUG
> server resides, it's just that particular address that doesn't respond.
> From this side it looks like it's something on the local server that has
> failed...

Have either you or Adelheid contacted Igor?
It appears that the Komkon server itself is down, not just our little part
of it.

William Robb

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[Kostas Kavoussanakis]

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, graywolf wrote:

> 4. More subtilely the shot lacks the dynamic look that would indicate the
> intensity to go with his expression. Also he is obviously has his attention on
> something out of the frame but no indication of what.

The first bit I don't understand, but did not expect to anyway. For
the second, I thought he was asking if this is where you put the black
ball. No?

> light. Being young and healthy you can probably hold 50mm down to about 1/8
> second with a bit of practice, certainly f2 @ 1/15th which I think would have
> worked in there.

I am not Boris, but I am about his age and I am sure you are joking
here, particularly for an upright. 1/30 is my absolute limit (perhaps
the "practice" bit is my problem). Also, would the balls and face be
in focus if shooting at f2?

> Is this helpful?

To me, very. I also want to ask (you) what you think about the fact
that the pillar on the left goes a lot towards the right. Such details
in my pictures fob me off uprights. It is something that I do not
understand about perspective and focal length.

Kostas

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Shel Belinkoff]

Here's the full file should you have need for it:

http://home.earthlink.net/~digisnaps/20s.jpg


> Hi Christian ... I think all you'd need to know is here.  To highlight your
> specific questions:
>
> Exposures F 5.6 @ 1/40 second hand held
> ISO 100
> Focal length 13.90 mm (about 70mm "equivalent")
> No flash
>
> What you see is a full sized section of a large sized, lowest rez
> JPEG straight from the camera.  No manipulation or alteration
> at all ... no "in camera sharpening," contrast correction, nada ...

Re: FS Friday

[Shel Belinkoff]

So, this is not a real Domke, but an imitation ... correct?


> Brand new Domke F803 black bag [copy] [...] $65
>

Re: OT: Adelheid's email address

[Cotty]

On 22/1/04, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:

>Wow, Jerome, are you in for a suprise at GFM.
>
>Hint: Adelheid's not a he. She is however a very nice person.

I was gonna say!



She's a lovely lady - and a German with a good sense of humour to boot...


Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)   |  People, Places, Pastiche
||=|  www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Christian]

what about the 20?

;-)
Christian

- Original Message - 
From: "Shel Belinkoff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: "Christian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated


> Hi Christian ... I think all you'd need to know is here.  Ti highlight
your
> specific questions:
>
> Exposures F 5.6 @ 1/40 second hand held
> ISO 100
> Focal length 13.90 mm (about 70mm "equivalent")
> No flash
>
> What you see is a full sized section of a large sized, lowest rez
> JPEG straight from the camera.  No manipulation or alteration
> at all ... no "in camera sharpening," contrast correction, nada ...
>
>
>
> File: - B:\DCIM\100MSDCF\Dsc03963.jpg
>
> ImageDescription -
> Make - SONY
> Model - CYBERSHOT
> Orientation - Top left
> XResolution - 72
> YResolution - 72
> ResolutionUnit - Inch
> DateTime - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
> YCbCrPositioning - Co-Sited
> ExifOffset - 218
> ExposureTime - 10/400 seconds
> FNumber - 5.60
> ExposureProgram - Aperture priority
> ISOSpeedRatings - 100
> ExifVersion - 210
> DateTimeOriginal - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
> DateTimeDigitized - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
> ComponentsConfiguration - YCbCr
> CompressedBitsPerPixel - 2 (bits/pixel)
> ExposureBiasValue - 0.00
> MaxApertureValue - F 2.00
> MeteringMode - Spot
> LightSource - Daylight
> Flash - Not fired
> FocalLength - 13.90 mm
> FlashPixVersion - 100
> ColorSpace - sRGB
> ExifImageWidth - 2272
> ExifImageHeight - 1704
> InteroperabilityOffset - 642
> FileSource - DSC - Digital still camera
> SceneType - A directly photographed image

Kodak examining pro-usage of film too?

[Rob Brigham]

Just got this from kodak.  They obviously want to know how many pros are
taking up digital and how fast they are abandoning film.  I guess now
they have planned dropping many of the consumer films, they are looking
at the better ones too!

Don't know if people will be able to access the questionnaire by the
link here, but if so then perhaps we should all tell them we want to
keep using film!!



Dear Valued Customer, 
KODAK PROFESSIONAL Imaging Solutions is undertaking an important survey
among Professionals to better understand where you obtain your hard copy
output, your needs for output services and how various providers satisfy
those needs.

By answering this 15-minute questionnaire
(http://kodak.prq0.com/apps/redir.asp?link=XbgdcadjCE,ZcdghjbaeaDC&o
id=UdfieCA&iclitemid=XbfbjjbbCH&tid=WbfeiecCE&uid=000134
7145) we will be able to work on new solutions to better meet your
needs. Look for the results of this survey in an upcoming issue of
ProPass
(http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/member/ProPass/proPassIndex
.jhtml).

WHAT'S THIS SURVEY ABOUT?
We want to learn about your business so we can provide products and
services that better meet your needs.

HOW LONG WILL IT TAKE?
This survey will take approximately 15 minutes.

WHAT ABOUT CONFIDENTIALITY?
All survey answers are confidential. No sales calls will be initiated
because you answered this survey.

Your opinion is extremely important to guide our new product development
efforts. Thank you in advance for your help.

Click here to access the survey.

Sincerely,
KODAK PROFESSIONAL Imaging Solutions

P.S. Please respond no later than Friday January 30th, 2004.

(c) Eastman Kodak Company, 2004.

 

FS Friday

[Clive evans]

Hi all

FA 28-80 f£.5-4.5 macro zoom exc. condition [ex Rob Studdert!]  $
80

49mm rectangular clip on hood for 35mm and 28mm wide angles [case]  $
20

Me super winder , works great, batter tray won't stay in  
$ 20

mx/me super diopters +1 +2 +1.5 $ 10 each

Brand new Domke F803 black bag [copy] with inserts and shoulder pad 
[ideal not a a camera bag bag!] $ 65

Brand new Billingham VG 420 black bag [Billingham's new digital bag]$
75
[take a look  at  www. billingham.co.uk... venture gear 420]

Shiping will be at cost,paypal is fine

Will all go on Ebay w/c 2nd if not sold,email me off list if interested, I
am travelling until Wednesday 28th [shoot in Venice] and will reply then.

Clive
Antibes
France

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Shel Belinkoff]

  Well, truth is, I am looking for a reason to buy it ...

Kostas Kavoussanakis wrote:

>
> I thought you would be thanking me for giving you another reason to
> buy it, Shel. I was just trying to help you make the decision.
>

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Shel Belinkoff]

Hi Christian ... I think all you'd need to know is here.  Ti highlight your
specific questions:

Exposures F 5.6 @ 1/40 second hand held
ISO 100
Focal length 13.90 mm (about 70mm "equivalent")
No flash

What you see is a full sized section of a large sized, lowest rez
JPEG straight from the camera.  No manipulation or alteration
at all ... no "in camera sharpening," contrast correction, nada ...



File: - B:\DCIM\100MSDCF\Dsc03963.jpg

ImageDescription -
Make - SONY
Model - CYBERSHOT
Orientation - Top left
XResolution - 72
YResolution - 72
ResolutionUnit - Inch
DateTime - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
YCbCrPositioning - Co-Sited
ExifOffset - 218
ExposureTime - 10/400 seconds
FNumber - 5.60
ExposureProgram - Aperture priority
ISOSpeedRatings - 100
ExifVersion - 210
DateTimeOriginal - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
DateTimeDigitized - 2004:01:22 14:10:09
ComponentsConfiguration - YCbCr
CompressedBitsPerPixel - 2 (bits/pixel)
ExposureBiasValue - 0.00
MaxApertureValue - F 2.00
MeteringMode - Spot
LightSource - Daylight
Flash - Not fired
FocalLength - 13.90 mm
FlashPixVersion - 100
ColorSpace - sRGB
ExifImageWidth - 2272
ExifImageHeight - 1704
InteroperabilityOffset - 642
FileSource - DSC - Digital still camera
SceneType - A directly photographed image


Christian wrote:

> I'll test it when I get home tonight.
>
> BTW, what were the f-stop, (sorry for this... but I don't know how else to
> word it...) 35mm focal length equivalent and ISO setting?  Did you use
> flash?  A tripod or copy stand? Is the section full-size? Is that a new 20
> or an old one?  Better yet, why don't you mail it to me so we can eliminate
> the subject as a possible variable? ;-)
>
> It's very nice. (there's my comment)
>
> Christian

Re: Flash and the *ist D?

[Sylwester Pietrzyk]

on 23.01.04 17:53, David Sprinkle at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
> My experience with the *istD and the AF360 has been more of
> problem. With the FA20-35 I'm getting 2 stop underexposure
> with the lens at 23mm or less and close to normal exposure
> above that. I've seen erratic under and over exposure with
> my FA50 and the AF360. I've had better results with the
> AF240FT. 
It sometimes happen, that exposure is not perfect in P-TTL mode. One thing
that I noticed, is that it doesn't like too much white in photos -
underexposure is then almost guaranteed - I use (+) compensation then. And
of course, latitude of digital is more similar to slide film rather than
forgiving negative. That's a reason for not so perfect exposure with flash
all the time. If you make you feel better, my friend made many photos during
christmass 2003 with his EOS 10D and 550 EX flash and had similar to my
results - some photos happened even to be more badly underexposed.
After all, it is usually quite easy to correct highlights via levels in
graphics software.

> The AF360 was in P-TTL mode when I got these results. Does
> anybody get the flash confirmation in the viewfinder with
> AF360? I don't but I do see it with the AF240.
No, I don't get flash confirmation when in P-TTL too, but it is here in TTL
mode.

-- 
Best Regards
Sylwek

Re: As usual: photo advise sought

[graywolf]

OK, 1. You did not have the camera level. If it was the subject would have been 
leaning slightly forward into the frame, as it is he is leaning back slightly 
and it give the view a teetery feeling almost with out knowing why. If you had 
errored in the other direction it would not have been so bad, as that is the way 
you unconsciously expect him to be leaning.

2. As in the other shot, you did not think of where the flash was going to throw 
the shadow. If you can not avoid a flash shadow it is usually best to arrange it 
to be on the far side of the subject. Or to make it a bold part of the 
composition, but he is too close to the wall to do that in this instance.

3. The crop is to low in this particular photo you would be better off with more 
table and less air above the subjects head.

4. More subtilely the shot lacks the dynamic look that would indicate the 
intensity to go with his expression. Also he is obviously has his attention on 
something out of the frame but no indication of what.

Remember, B&W photography is all about light and shadow, unlike color 
photography where you want to avoid deep shadows most of the time. I believe you 
have a fast lens (f2?), you should have been able to shoot these available 
light. Being young and healthy you can probably hold 50mm down to about 1/8 
second with a bit of practice, certainly f2 @ 1/15th which I think would have 
worked in there. All those rules you find in books have to do with being safe, 
you kind of have to push the limits sometimes if you want great photos.

Is this helpful?

--

Boris Liberman wrote:
Please, can you tell me what is wrong/has to be fixed with the first
one that made you not to chose it?


--
graywolf
http://graywolfphoto.com
"You might as well accept people as they are,
you are not going to be able to change them anyway."

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Kostas Kavoussanakis]

On Fri, 23 Jan 2004, Shel Belinkoff wrote:

> C'mon ... there are enough istd shooters on this list to provide some sort
> of comparison, or certainly a comment or two.

I thought you would be thanking me for giving you another reason to
buy it, Shel. I was just trying to help you make the decision.

Kostas (not a trace of the word "right" above :-)

Flash and the *ist D?

[David Sprinkle]

My experience with the *istD and the AF360 has been more of
problem. With the FA20-35 I'm getting 2 stop underexposure
with the lens at 23mm or less and close to normal exposure
above that. I've seen erratic under and over exposure with 
my FA50 and the AF360. I've had better results with the
AF240FT. 

The AF360 was in P-TTL mode when I got these results. Does 
anybody get the flash confirmation in the viewfinder with 
AF360? I don't but I do see it with the AF240.



Dave



> Not having tried an AF360, I would have to say probably not all flash
> units are created the same. ;)
>

Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated

[Christian]

I'll test it when I get home tonight.

BTW, what were the f-stop, (sorry for this... but I don't know how else to
word it...) 35mm focal length equivalent and ISO setting?  Did you use
flash?  A tripod or copy stand? Is the section full-size? Is that a new 20
or an old one?  Better yet, why don't you mail it to me so we can eliminate
the subject as a possible variable? ;-)

It's very nice. (there's my comment)

Christian

- Original Message - 
From: "Shel Belinkoff" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: Unretouched and unmanipulated


> C'mon ... there are enough istd shooters on this list to provide some sort
> of comparison, or certainly a comment or two.  If macro mode is
> inappropriate for some reason (it just happened to be what was handy at
> the moment my curiosity was piqued) another photo could be substituted,
> perhaps a portrait or an architectural shot, or whatever.
>
> shel
>

Re: why does first curtain sync still exist?

[Christian]

- Original Message - 
From: "josvdh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


> Dear Group,
> Why are new camera's still equiped with first and second curtain sync?
> Is there any use for first curtain sync?

To freeze action without a trailing blur.  

Christian