Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/25/2007 11:34:07 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ah, I see what you're talking about now... The Focus Confirmation Indicator in the Pentax DSLRs is the green LED at the bottom of the screen, outside the image area. The Focus Point Overlay in the Pentax DSLRs are the red LED points that light up on the screen itself, in conjunction with the FCI, when AF has locked in. With manual focus lenses, if the overlay is enabled, the center one only will always light when the FCI is lit. The operation of the Focus Point Overlay in Pentax DSLRs is independent of the focusing screen. Canon DSLRs use small protrusions or depression on the focusing screen itself to provide the light point, so they require that a focusing screen have these bits in place to operate. Godfrey You got it. Guess I just had to be clearer. Much better explanation than mine too. LOL. Not surprisingly. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 25, 2007, at 11:16 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Huh, focus confirmation in the viewfinder. I can't speak on this, > really, > because I am now realizing I don't known exactly when it happens > and when it > doesn't. Anyway, on the Canon 300D the 7 auto focus points are > drawn on the > view finder screen. With a Katseye replacement screen for it and > the XT, XTi, > those auto focus points will no longer flash. Evidentially somehow > some of the > wiring is in the viewfinder screen itself. Not wiring, per se, I > guess, but > something that connects to something else in the camera. On the > Canon 40D, > that I looked at recently, it's different because they offer > replacement screens > for it, which means they have moved some the connections off the > viewfinder > itself, and confirmation of auto focus is only reflected in the > viewfinder. > Truthfully mainly when I notice this with the 300D is when I move > an autofocus > point, say I want it to be off center, one on the side. It may > just be > confirming where the point is. > > Not having picked up a K10D and looked through its viewfinder, I > can't say > anything about that. But in the K100D, there is a flash on the > screen for > confirmation of auto focus as well in some situations. Although in > it's case, the > auto focus points are not drawn on the screen. > > This is something one who mainly manual focuses may not be > familiar with. > And I am probably describing it all wrong. However, on the KatsEye > page they > are up front and above board about the auto focus points not > flashing on their > replacement screens for the above Canon cameras. > > I am really wishing someone else here would jump in instead of me and > describe it more accurately and better. But considering the Canon > usage on this > list, not likely. :-) > > Anyway, it's not in the LCD it's in the viewfinder itself. Ah, I see what you're talking about now... The Focus Confirmation Indicator in the Pentax DSLRs is the green LED at the bottom of the screen, outside the image area. The Focus Point Overlay in the Pentax DSLRs are the red LED points that light up on the screen itself, in conjunction with the FCI, when AF has locked in. With manual focus lenses, if the overlay is enabled, the center one only will always light when the FCI is lit. The operation of the Focus Point Overlay in Pentax DSLRs is independent of the focusing screen. Canon DSLRs use small protrusions or depression on the focusing screen itself to provide the light point, so they require that a focusing screen have these bits in place to operate. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/25/2007 9:45:41 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Pentax cameras don't know or care who's screen you've put in it as long as it fits (L-W-T). They continue to operate blissfully as they should, though on some older bodies (e.g. MX) a change of screen brightness will result in a slight shift in light metering. Regards, Bob... Sounds good. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/25/2007 10:40:06 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Focus-confirmation LEDs are what I ASSuMEd she was talking about -Charles Huh, focus confirmation in the viewfinder. I can't speak on this, really, because I am now realizing I don't known exactly when it happens and when it doesn't. Anyway, on the Canon 300D the 7 auto focus points are drawn on the view finder screen. With a Katseye replacement screen for it and the XT, XTi, those auto focus points will no longer flash. Evidentially somehow some of the wiring is in the viewfinder screen itself. Not wiring, per se, I guess, but something that connects to something else in the camera. On the Canon 40D, that I looked at recently, it's different because they offer replacement screens for it, which means they have moved some the connections off the viewfinder itself, and confirmation of auto focus is only reflected in the viewfinder. Truthfully mainly when I notice this with the 300D is when I move an autofocus point, say I want it to be off center, one on the side. It may just be confirming where the point is. Not having picked up a K10D and looked through its viewfinder, I can't say anything about that. But in the K100D, there is a flash on the screen for confirmation of auto focus as well in some situations. Although in it's case, the auto focus points are not drawn on the screen. This is something one who mainly manual focuses may not be familiar with. And I am probably describing it all wrong. However, on the KatsEye page they are up front and above board about the auto focus points not flashing on their replacement screens for the above Canon cameras. I am really wishing someone else here would jump in instead of me and describe it more accurately and better. But considering the Canon usage on this list, not likely. :-) Anyway, it's not in the LCD it's in the viewfinder itself. HTH, Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 25, 2007, at 10:49 AM, Adam Maas wrote: >> BTW, I've sold my DS bodies now so both the LL-60 and my custom Katz >> Eye are for sale to anyone who wants them. >> > > I might be interested in one of those screens for my DS, what > customization did you have done to the Katz screens? The Katz Eye screen I had made has no focusing aids, reticle horizontal/vertical scribings, and crop markings approximating 3:4 format proportions. The center is plain and unencumbered. Here's a diagram: http://homepage.mac.com/godders/custom-focus-screen-DS.jpg Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > On Oct 24, 2007, at 12:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> I don't want the split prism as much as grid lines, my horizons >> are often >> off. Often way off. And it seems to only way to get grid lines, at >> this point >> in time, is with a Katz Eye. And they only offer grid lines with a >> split prism >> screen. > > Marnie, > > If you call Rebecca Katz, you can have a screen made without the > split prism and with whatever grid lines you want. > > I had a custom Katz Eye screen made for the *ist DS with no split > screen, 3:4 crop marks and horizontal/vertical reference lines. Loved > it, liked it more than the LL-60 from Pentax as I felt that had way > too many busy lines and markings on it. > > Godfrey > > BTW, I've sold my DS bodies now so both the LL-60 and my custom Katz > Eye are for sale to anyone who wants them. > Godfrey, I might be interested in one of those screens for my DS, what customization did you have done to the Katz screens? -Adam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 25, 2007, at 12:16, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > I still don't know what Marnie meant when she asked about the > "flashing" ... ??? > Focus-confirmation LEDs are what I ASSuMEd she was talking about -Charles -- Charles Robinson - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
The metering in the Pentax DSLRs reads off the screen, so screen brightness and 'scatter' still affect exposure calibration. My custom screen for the *ist DS causes meter calibration in the K10D to underexpose by 0.7 EV. I still don't know what Marnie meant when she asked about the "flashing" ... ??? Godfrey On Oct 25, 2007, at 9:40 AM, Bob Blakely wrote: > Pentax cameras don't know or care who's screen you've put in it as > long as > it fits (L-W-T). They continue to operate blissfully as they > should, though > on some older bodies (e.g. MX) a change of screen brightness will > result in > a slight shift in light metering. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Pentax cameras don't know or care who's screen you've put in it as long as it fits (L-W-T). They continue to operate blissfully as they should, though on some older bodies (e.g. MX) a change of screen brightness will result in a slight shift in light metering. Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > In a message dated 10/25/2007 8:53:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > On Oct 25, 2007, at 7:58 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >>> I have the LL-60 screen in my D. I'd like to have a similar >>> screen in my >>> K10D. >> >> Quick question, does it still flash when it auto focuses? >> >> That seems to be the one major disadvantage of the KatsEye. (Well, >> not to >> all those manual focus people around here, but to me.) > > Huh? I don't know what you mean. > > Godfrey > > === > Okay, I am going to conclude that both the KatsEye and the Pentax > replacement screens flash when the camera auto focuses. > > On the Canon, this is not true. While one can have the auto focus points > on > the screen, they will not flash anymore. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/25/2007 8:53:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Oct 25, 2007, at 7:58 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> I have the LL-60 screen in my D. I'd like to have a similar >> screen in my >> K10D. > > Quick question, does it still flash when it auto focuses? > > That seems to be the one major disadvantage of the KatsEye. (Well, > not to > all those manual focus people around here, but to me.) Huh? I don't know what you mean. Godfrey === Okay, I am going to conclude that both the KatsEye and the Pentax replacement screens flash when the camera auto focuses. On the Canon, this is not true. While one can have the auto focus points on the screen, they will not flash anymore. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 25, 2007, at 9:58, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Quick question, does it still flash when it auto focuses? > > That seems to be the one major disadvantage of the KatsEye. (Well, > not to > all those manual focus people around here, but to me.) > Yes, it still flashes. Not sure what kind of weirdness is in play with the Canon bodies that disables this when the screen is replaced, but no such problem with the Pentax bodies. -Charles -- Charles Robinson - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Minneapolis, MN http://charles.robinsontwins.org -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 25, 2007, at 7:54 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> If you call Rebecca Katz, you can have a screen made without the >> split prism and with whatever grid lines you want. >> >> I had a custom Katz Eye screen made for the *ist DS with no split >> screen, 3:4 crop marks and horizontal/vertical reference lines. >> Loved >> it, liked it more than the LL-60 from Pentax as I felt that had way >> too many busy lines and markings on it. > > Interesting, Godfrey. They said they did customization on their > page, but I > wasn't sure how much. I believe the custom DS screen cost me about $135 or so, delivered. The Pentax LL-60 cost me $60 when I bought it, so the KE was a bit pricey ... but such is the price for a niche product and customization. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 25, 2007, at 7:58 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> I have the LL-60 screen in my D. I'd like to have a similar >> screen in my >> K10D. > > Quick question, does it still flash when it auto focuses? > > That seems to be the one major disadvantage of the KatsEye. (Well, > not to > all those manual focus people around here, but to me.) Huh? I don't know what you mean. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/24/2007 1:31:02 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have the LL-60 screen in my D. I'd like to have a similar screen in my K10D. Paul Quick question, does it still flash when it auto focuses? That seems to be the one major disadvantage of the KatsEye. (Well, not to all those manual focus people around here, but to me.) Marnie aka Doe ;-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/25/2007 7:35:52 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Marnie, If you call Rebecca Katz, you can have a screen made without the split prism and with whatever grid lines you want. I had a custom Katz Eye screen made for the *ist DS with no split screen, 3:4 crop marks and horizontal/vertical reference lines. Loved it, liked it more than the LL-60 from Pentax as I felt that had way too many busy lines and markings on it. Godfrey == Interesting, Godfrey. They said they did customization on their page, but I wasn't sure how much. Thanks, Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
When I'm working on a tripod, the Panasonic L1's Live View makes this a piece of cake: both rule of thirds and fine grid overlays are available on the LCD at the press of a button. I use a bubble level in the hot shoe too, but sometimes it is much much easier to have the overlay and a visual reference. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 24, 2007, at 12:19 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I don't want the split prism as much as grid lines, my horizons > are often > off. Often way off. And it seems to only way to get grid lines, at > this point > in time, is with a Katz Eye. And they only offer grid lines with a > split prism > screen. Marnie, If you call Rebecca Katz, you can have a screen made without the split prism and with whatever grid lines you want. I had a custom Katz Eye screen made for the *ist DS with no split screen, 3:4 crop marks and horizontal/vertical reference lines. Loved it, liked it more than the LL-60 from Pentax as I felt that had way too many busy lines and markings on it. Godfrey BTW, I've sold my DS bodies now so both the LL-60 and my custom Katz Eye are for sale to anyone who wants them. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I use a 21 LImited for some group photos. The camera's autofocus likes to back-focus this particular lens, and it's wide enough that it is hard to tell by sight exactly what is going on. I found the best solution seems to be to use hyper-focus where I set the lens distance scale and shoot at f5.6 or f8 with flash. The Katz-Eye focusing screen looks interesting, and I may try it out, but I'd prefer it to be a center patch of micro-prisms without the split image, such as the old K1000s have. The problem I have with the split image is that, at a glance, the center of the image looks sharp unless you notice that the edges are not lined up. The micro-prisms in the center make it obvious that something is wrong until you get it focused in. This is nice when working quickly. An even better idea, which I recommended to them, would be a micro-prism ring around a matte center spot. This leaves the center's exposure unaffected for spot metering and stopping down old lenses, since only the micro-prism ring would go dark, and yet you could use the ring to dial in the focus if needed. Brian -- Brian Dunn Photographic http://www.bdphotographic.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
All of my long range target scopes have a bubble level visable just under the field of view. Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "Tom C" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >I agree. It's probably a bell/whistle but a level indicator in the > viewfinder would be great. I think I was mistaken, in may be only the D3 > (not D300) that has a virtual horizon option on the LCD. > >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >>Level... the new Nikon D3/300 has a virtual horizon, almost like an >>artificial horizon aircraft guage, on the LCD. Unfortunately where it's >>really needed is in the viewfinder. I'd like to see that as standard >>equipment on DSLR's. With a post-exposure warning when the camera is >>tilted >>at button press. :-) >> >>A tripod of course helps with level and a bubble level on the hotshoe can >>also when shooting that way. >> >> >>Be nice if camera would warn when it's not level. I get so caught up with >>what I am shooting that I am often tipping when I am not aware of it. >> >>I got a hot shoe bubbler recently, just came, as an interim solution. But >>I >>can see real problems with that -- not that easy to line the bubble up >>and >>one has to take one's eye away from the viewfinder to do it. >> >>But in a pinch it may be a lot better than nothing. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I agree. It's probably a bell/whistle but a level indicator in the viewfinder would be great. I think I was mistaken, in may be only the D3 (not D300) that has a virtual horizon option on the LCD. Tom C. >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: pdml@pdml.net >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 17:56:07 EDT > >In a message dated 10/24/2007 1:30:17 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >Level... the new Nikon D3/300 has a virtual horizon, almost like an >artificial horizon aircraft guage, on the LCD. Unfortunately where it's >really needed is in the viewfinder. I'd like to see that as standard >equipment on DSLR's. With a post-exposure warning when the camera is >tilted >at button press. :-) > >A tripod of course helps with level and a bubble level on the hotshoe can >also when shooting that way. > >Tom C. > > >Be nice if camera would warn when it's not level. I get so caught up with >what I am shooting that I am often tipping when I am not aware of it. > >I got a hot shoe bubbler recently, just came, as an interim solution. But >I >can see real problems with that -- not that easy to line the bubble up and >one has to take one's eye away from the viewfinder to do it. > >But in a pinch it may be a lot better than nothing. > >Marnie aka Doe :-) > >- >Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. > > > > >** See what's new at http://www.aol.com > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Same problem. I can often use the AF points as a rough grid, assuming I remember to do it. >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/24/2007 5:56 PM >>> In a message dated 10/24/2007 1:30:17 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Level... the new Nikon D3/300 has a virtual horizon, almost like an artificial horizon aircraft guage, on the LCD. Unfortunately where it's really needed is in the viewfinder. I'd like to see that as standard equipment on DSLR's. With a post-exposure warning when the camera is tilted at button press. :-) A tripod of course helps with level and a bubble level on the hotshoe can also when shooting that way. Tom C. Be nice if camera would warn when it's not level. I get so caught up with what I am shooting that I am often tipping when I am not aware of it. I got a hot shoe bubbler recently, just came, as an interim solution. But I can see real problems with that -- not that easy to line the bubble up and one has to take one's eye away from the viewfinder to do it. But in a pinch it may be a lot better than nothing. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. !SIG:471fc13185181852754960! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/24/2007 1:30:17 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Level... the new Nikon D3/300 has a virtual horizon, almost like an artificial horizon aircraft guage, on the LCD. Unfortunately where it's really needed is in the viewfinder. I'd like to see that as standard equipment on DSLR's. With a post-exposure warning when the camera is tilted at button press. :-) A tripod of course helps with level and a bubble level on the hotshoe can also when shooting that way. Tom C. Be nice if camera would warn when it's not level. I get so caught up with what I am shooting that I am often tipping when I am not aware of it. I got a hot shoe bubbler recently, just came, as an interim solution. But I can see real problems with that -- not that easy to line the bubble up and one has to take one's eye away from the viewfinder to do it. But in a pinch it may be a lot better than nothing. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/24/2007 1:52:07 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And Rule o' thirds to boot. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/469572-REG/Pentax_38575_LL_80_AF_Divided _Matte.html == Cool. Thanks! The scale is tipping heavily in the K10D's favor. Although I can live without rule of thirds, but the lines are good. Marnie aka Doe - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Yes, but the edge comparison accuracy necessary is only to what can be resolved with lens and film. We seldom need to know if the object is at 50 feet or 55 feet. We can't place the barrel of the lens that accurately on most lenses. Look at any lens commonly used by most folks, including pros. Exactly how much rotation of the barrel do you think there is between 50 ft & 55 ft? - 100 ft & 110 ft? Exactly how much change would be made in the distance between the lens and the focal plane would we be talking about? We don't need the accuracy of a long base optical rangefinder - we're not calculating bullet drop here. The further away an object is, the less the need for super accurate distance measurement. So long as the aperture is sufficient for the split prism, focal length is generally irrelevant. No this is true for most of what I do. YMMV! Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > If your eye is exactly in the right place, and your lens is the right > focal > length, and the f-stop is correct, then a split image rangefinder is > fairly > accurate. Remember the offset is all but non-existent. It can not compare > in any > sense to a long base optical rangefinder, and compared to a ruler it is > problematic. I can say from personal experience that it is not accurate > enough > for an 85mm lens at 3 feet and f/2.0 when you want the subjects irises > razor > sharp every time. > > Bob Blakely wrote: >> If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have an >> improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the >> center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the ground >> glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. >> >> - Original Message - >> From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> >>> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >>> devices. >>> To me >>> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to >>> see >>> what I >>> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think >>> they >>> are. >>> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many >>> folks do >>> not trust their eye. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I know a divided matte focusing screen is available. I've seen it either on the Pentax web site or B+H's. Part # LL 80 - $44.95. Kenneth Waller http://tinyurl.com/272u2f - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen > In a message dated 10/24/2007 12:56:32 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the > K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only > ones > Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. > > I do like grid screens myself. > > -Adam > > > == > I am not aware that Pentax offers any replacement screens for the K10D. I > mean if someone can find a link that says that I would be quite happy to > hear > about it. KatsEye seems to be the only one doing it. > > Marnie aka Doe :-) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
And Rule o' thirds to boot. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/469572-REG/Pentax_38575_LL_80_AF_Divided_Matte.html [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > In a message dated 10/24/2007 12:56:32 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the > K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only > ones > Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. > > I do like grid screens myself. > > -Adam > > > == > I am not aware that Pentax offers any replacement screens for the K10D. I > mean if someone can find a link that says that I would be quite happy to > hear > about it. KatsEye seems to be the only one doing it. > > Marnie aka Doe :-) > > - > Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. > > > > > ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com > > -- The difference between individual intelligence and group intelligence is the difference between Harvard University and the Harvard University football team. -- P. J. O'Roark -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Because your eye is trying to focus on the image too. Then you have two different systems working against each other. The trick is to focus you eye on something distant then grab the first snap into focus on the ground glass. Try it, it works. There is another technique where you focus on the ground glass surface. You can fiddle to your hearts content if you can do that properly, but it is a skill that takes a while to learn. I was never good at it unless I had a scribe line to hold my eye focus which is why I like the grid screen. The snap focus one can be learned by most folks with a few minutes practice. Tom C wrote: > To each his own then. The intimation made (not by you) that people do not > know *how* to focus without a focusing aid though is absurd. > > It's obvious that when it appears that it's in focus it probably is. As far > as readjusting focus after one thinks they are there... what does it hurt > graywolf? If one achieved focus in the first place, then moved off and back > on just to confirm, then it's just as likely they achieved critical focus > the second time as well. > > Tom C. > >> From: Godfrey DiGiorgi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 10:00:48 -0700 >> >> On Oct 24, 2007, at 9:37 AM, graywolf wrote: >> >>> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >>> devices. To me >>> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want >>> to see what I >>> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to >>> think they are. >>> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how >>> many folks do >>> not trust their eye. >>> >>> In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a >>> ground glass >>> image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae >>> snaps into >>> focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has >>> time to try >>> to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found >>> that I get a >>> higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do >>> with autofocus. >>> That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and >>> you can >>> focus anywhere on the screen. >> I've replaced split image rangefinder focusing screens with a plain >> matte focusing screen in virtually every SLR I've owned since 1968 >> for exactly the same reason. I don't even like too many scribe >> markings near the center of the focusing screen, they get in the way. >> >> Godfrey > > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Level... the new Nikon D3/300 has a virtual horizon, almost like an artificial horizon aircraft guage, on the LCD. Unfortunately where it's really needed is in the viewfinder. I'd like to see that as standard equipment on DSLR's. With a post-exposure warning when the camera is tilted at button press. :-) A tripod of course helps with level and a bubble level on the hotshoe can also when shooting that way. Tom C. >From: Adam Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 15:55:53 -0400 > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > In a message dated 10/24/2007 11:28:39 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > >> Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller >and > >> aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if >that's a > >> requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. > >> > >> -Adam > > > > === > > I don't want the split prism as much as grid lines, my horizons are >often > > off. Often way off. And it seems to only way to get grid lines, at this >point > > in time, is with a Katz Eye. And they only offer grid lines with a >split prism > > screen. The split prism screen, well, shrug, I've gotten sort of used >to NOT > > having it (since Digital), but it would still be very nice for macro >work. > > I've never felt I focus manually as well without it as I did with it. > > > > Personally, I would like replacement screens, of all sorts, to >available on > > all upper and semi-upper DSLRs. Even mid-range DSLRs. > > > > Marnie aka Doe :-) > > > >The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the >K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only >ones Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. > >I do like grid screens myself. > >-Adam > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
This whole argument is nonsensical. All of us are prone to misfocus with and without a focusing aid because we're not robots. And even AF misfocuses. It's a preference. My Brownie Hawkeye was always in focus. Also had a nice big negative and exposure was bangon 99% of the time. Tom C. >From: graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 16:14:44 -0400 > >If your eye is exactly in the right place, and your lens is the right focal >length, and the f-stop is correct, then a split image rangefinder is fairly >accurate. Remember the offset is all but non-existent. It can not compare >in any >sense to a long base optical rangefinder, and compared to a ruler it is >problematic. I can say from personal experience that it is not accurate >enough >for an 85mm lens at 3 feet and f/2.0 when you want the subjects irises >razor >sharp every time. > > >Bob Blakely wrote: > > If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have >an > > improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the > > center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the >ground > > glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. > > > > Regards, > > Bob... > > > > "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." > > -Jean Luc Godard > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >devices. > >> To me > >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to >see > >> what I > >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think >they > >> are. > >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many > >> folks do > >> not trust their eye. > > > > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I have the LL-60 screen in my D. I'd like to have a similar screen in my K10D. Paul -- Original message -- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > In a message dated 10/24/2007 12:56:32 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the > K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only > ones > Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. > > I do like grid screens myself. > > -Adam > > > == > I am not aware that Pentax offers any replacement screens for the K10D. I > mean if someone can find a link that says that I would be quite happy to > hear > about it. KatsEye seems to be the only one doing it. > > Marnie aka Doe :-) > > - > Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. > > > > > ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I thought my point was obvious. Tom C. >From: graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 16:03:57 -0400 > >They sold billions of plastic cameras with a single element lens too. So >what is >your point? > >In the case of my MX's back then they sold them with a split image screen >so >they could sell me a plain ground glass screen for another $35. > > >Tom C wrote: > > Yeah I guess you're right. Those millions of SLR's sold with split >prism > > screens in the 60's, 70's, 80's all had them for no good reason. > > > > Tom C. > > > > > >> From: graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen > >> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:37:23 -0400 > >> > >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >devices. > >> To me > >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to >see > >> what I > >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think >they > >> are. > >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many >folks > >> do > >> not trust their eye. > >> > >> In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a ground >glass > >> image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae snaps >into > >> focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has time >to > >> try > >> to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found >that I > >> get a > >> higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do with > >> autofocus. > >> That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and you >can > >> focus anywhere on the screen. > >> > >> > >> > >> Tom C wrote: > >>> I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It > >> would > >>> appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a > >> focusing > >>> aid for manual focus was no longer important. > >>> > >>> I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in > >> the > >>> ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use > >> the > >>> split screen to get it razor sharp. > >>> > >>> No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. > >>> > >>> Tom C. > >>> > >>> > >>>> From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>>> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >>>> To: > >>>> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen > >>>> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:26:17 -0400 > >>>> > >>>> Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen >is > >>>> lacking. Either that or my eyes are. > >>>> > >>>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> > >>>> In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > >>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > >>>> My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my > >>>> backup > >>>> K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing > >>>> with > >>>> it. and comparing it to the main. > >>>> > >>>> Regards, > >>>> Bob... > >>>> > >>>> === > >>>> I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the > >>>> K10D. And > >>>> I want a split screen too. > >>>> > >>>> Marnie aka Doe :-) > >>>> > >>>> - > >>>> Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ** See what's new at > >>>> http://www.aol.com > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >>>> PDML@pdml.net > >>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above >and > >>>> follow the directions. > >>>> > >>>> !SIG:471e544485184412021166! > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >>>> PDML@pdml.net > >>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above >and > >>>> follow the directions. > >>> > >>> > >> -- > >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> PDML@pdml.net > >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and > >> follow the directions. > > > > > > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
If your eye is exactly in the right place, and your lens is the right focal length, and the f-stop is correct, then a split image rangefinder is fairly accurate. Remember the offset is all but non-existent. It can not compare in any sense to a long base optical rangefinder, and compared to a ruler it is problematic. I can say from personal experience that it is not accurate enough for an 85mm lens at 3 feet and f/2.0 when you want the subjects irises razor sharp every time. Bob Blakely wrote: > If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have an > improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the > center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the ground > glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. > > Regards, > Bob... > > "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." > -Jean Luc Godard > > - Original Message - > From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. >> To me >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see >> what I >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they >> are. >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many >> folks do >> not trust their eye. > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > In a message dated 10/24/2007 12:56:32 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the > K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only > ones > Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. > > I do like grid screens myself. > > -Adam > > > == > I am not aware that Pentax offers any replacement screens for the K10D. I > mean if someone can find a link that says that I would be quite happy to > hear > about it. KatsEye seems to be the only one doing it. > > Marnie aka Doe :-) > http://www.pentaxslr.com/accessories The K10D grid screen is the LL-80 -Adam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/24/2007 12:56:32 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only ones Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. I do like grid screens myself. -Adam == I am not aware that Pentax offers any replacement screens for the K10D. I mean if someone can find a link that says that I would be quite happy to hear about it. KatsEye seems to be the only one doing it. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
They sold billions of plastic cameras with a single element lens too. So what is your point? In the case of my MX's back then they sold them with a split image screen so they could sell me a plain ground glass screen for another $35. Tom C wrote: > Yeah I guess you're right. Those millions of SLR's sold with split prism > screens in the 60's, 70's, 80's all had them for no good reason. > > Tom C. > > >> From: graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:37:23 -0400 >> >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. >> To me >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see >> what I >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they >> are. >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many folks >> do >> not trust their eye. >> >> In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a ground glass >> image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae snaps into >> focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has time to >> try >> to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found that I >> get a >> higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do with >> autofocus. >> That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and you can >> focus anywhere on the screen. >> >> >> >> Tom C wrote: >>> I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It >> would >>> appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a >> focusing >>> aid for manual focus was no longer important. >>> >>> I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in >> the >>> ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use >> the >>> split screen to get it razor sharp. >>> >>> No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. >>> >>> Tom C. >>> >>> >>>> From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>> To: >>>> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >>>> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:26:17 -0400 >>>> >>>> Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is >>>> lacking. Either that or my eyes are. >>>> >>>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> >>>> In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >>>> My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my >>>> backup >>>> K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing >>>> with >>>> it. and comparing it to the main. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Bob... >>>> >>>> === >>>> I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the >>>> K10D. And >>>> I want a split screen too. >>>> >>>> Marnie aka Doe :-) >>>> >>>> - >>>> Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ** See what's new at >>>> http://www.aol.com >>>> >>>> -- >>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>> PDML@pdml.net >>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>>> follow the directions. >>>> >>>> !SIG:471e544485184412021166! >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>>> PDML@pdml.net >>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>>> follow the directions. >>> >>> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. > > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > In a message dated 10/24/2007 11:28:39 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >> Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller and >> aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's a >> requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. >> >> -Adam > > === > I don't want the split prism as much as grid lines, my horizons are often > off. Often way off. And it seems to only way to get grid lines, at this > point > in time, is with a Katz Eye. And they only offer grid lines with a split > prism > screen. The split prism screen, well, shrug, I've gotten sort of used to NOT > having it (since Digital), but it would still be very nice for macro work. > I've never felt I focus manually as well without it as I did with it. > > Personally, I would like replacement screens, of all sorts, to available on > all upper and semi-upper DSLRs. Even mid-range DSLRs. > > Marnie aka Doe :-) > The Pentax LL-60 screen for the D/DS has grid lines, I'm pretty sure the K10D has a similar screen available. The DL and K1x0D series are the only ones Pentax has chosen not to offer screens for. I do like grid screens myself. -Adam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I'm probably splitting hairs Adam. :-) Actually I've considered dead-on focus to be important in every shot. That's what I shoot for, dead-on focus at the crtical spot, with understanding of DOF. Tom C. >From: Adam Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 14:32:15 -0400 > >Tom, > >Note I never said that you can't take in focus images with a split image >screen. You are responding to something I didn't say. > >I said they're less accurate for wide lenses, and dead-on focus merits a >matte screen and a magnifier (LF technique in other words). Of course, with >35mm, dead-on focus is only really an issue for macro work, which often >involves... magnifiers to determine critical focus. > >-Adam > >Tom C wrote: > > Shoot, I guess I'll have to tell that to all my in focus photos I took >from > > 1990 to 1997. :-) > > > > If there's one thing this list seems to have the propensity for, it's > > arguing about the right way to do something when there is more than one > > right way. > > > > What does anyone care if I like split prism screens for focusing? And >what > > do I care if you don't? :-) > > > > Tom C. > > > >> From: Adam Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen > >> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:49:36 -0400 > >> > >> Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller >and > >> aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's >a > >> requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. > >> > >> -Adam > >> > >> > >> Bob Blakely wrote: > >>> If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have > >> an > >>> improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the > >>> center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the > >> ground > >>> glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> Bob... > >>> > >>> "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a >reflection." > >>> -Jean Luc Godard > >>> > >>> - Original Message - > >>> From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> > >>> > >>>> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing > >> devices. > >>>> To me > >>>> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to > >> see > >>>> what I > >>>> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think > >> they > >>>> are. > >>>> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many > >>>> folks do > >>>> not trust their eye. > >>> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> PDML@pdml.net > >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and > >> follow the directions. > > > > > > > > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/24/2007 11:28:39 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller and >aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's a >requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. > >-Adam === I don't want the split prism as much as grid lines, my horizons are often off. Often way off. And it seems to only way to get grid lines, at this point in time, is with a Katz Eye. And they only offer grid lines with a split prism screen. The split prism screen, well, shrug, I've gotten sort of used to NOT having it (since Digital), but it would still be very nice for macro work. I've never felt I focus manually as well without it as I did with it. Personally, I would like replacement screens, of all sorts, to available on all upper and semi-upper DSLRs. Even mid-range DSLRs. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Remember Frank's tag line: "Sharpness is a bourgeois concept." -Henri Cartier-Bresson Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. > To me > they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see > what I > am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they > are. > Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many > folks do > not trust their eye. > > In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a ground glass > image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae snaps into > focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has time to > try > to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found that I > get a > higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do with > autofocus. > That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and you > can > focus anywhere on the screen. > > Tom C wrote: >> I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It >> would >> appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a >> focusing >> aid for manual focus was no longer important. >> >> I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in >> the >> ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use the >> split screen to get it razor sharp. >> >> No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. >> >>> From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >>> Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is >>> lacking. Either that or my eyes are. >>> >>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >>> My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my >>> backup >>> K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing >>> with >>> it. and comparing it to the main. >>> >>> I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the >>> K10D. And >>> I want a split screen too. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Even though I am in the camp that prefers the matte with no other focusing aids, here is my take on what happened. For most people, learning to use the split image is probably easier and more comforting to use. So in the glory days, all cameras came with that as standard. Those who preferred something else could buy and install that screen. When AF and slow zooms became the norm, one big problem with a split image is that it blacks out after about 5.6 or so - this can cause problems with slow lenses (the most commonly purchased). On top of that, the main AF sensor in most cameras is in the same spot which could cause problems for the sensor. So the easiest thing for the manufacturers to do was to take out the focusing aids and let the masses use AF instead. That is where we are today. The better models are allowing for changing of screens just like in the past for those who prefer some other screen. This is all my conjecture and is not based upon any hard fact or knowledge. -- Bruce Wednesday, October 24, 2007, 11:15:40 AM, you wrote: TC> Shoot, I guess I'll have to tell that to all my in focus photos I took from TC> 1990 to 1997. :-) TC> If there's one thing this list seems to have the propensity for, it's TC> arguing about the right way to do something when there is more than one TC> right way. TC> What does anyone care if I like split prism screens for focusing? And what TC> do I care if you don't? :-) TC> Tom C. >>From: Adam Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >>Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:49:36 -0400 >> >>Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller and >>aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's a >>requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. >> >>-Adam >> >> >>Bob Blakely wrote: >> > If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have >>an >> > improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the >> > center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the >>ground >> > glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. >> > >> > Regards, >> > Bob... >> > >> > "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." >> > -Jean Luc Godard >> > >> > - Original Message - >> > From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > >> > >> >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >>devices. >> >> To me >> >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to >>see >> >> what I >> >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think >>they >> >> are. >> >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many >> >> folks do >> >> not trust their eye. >> > >> > >> >> >> >>-- >>PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>PDML@pdml.net >>http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Tom, Note I never said that you can't take in focus images with a split image screen. You are responding to something I didn't say. I said they're less accurate for wide lenses, and dead-on focus merits a matte screen and a magnifier (LF technique in other words). Of course, with 35mm, dead-on focus is only really an issue for macro work, which often involves... magnifiers to determine critical focus. -Adam Tom C wrote: > Shoot, I guess I'll have to tell that to all my in focus photos I took from > 1990 to 1997. :-) > > If there's one thing this list seems to have the propensity for, it's > arguing about the right way to do something when there is more than one > right way. > > What does anyone care if I like split prism screens for focusing? And what > do I care if you don't? :-) > > Tom C. > >> From: Adam Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >> Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:49:36 -0400 >> >> Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller and >> aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's a >> requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. >> >> -Adam >> >> >> Bob Blakely wrote: >>> If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have >> an >>> improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the >>> center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the >> ground >>> glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Bob... >>> >>> "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." >>> -Jean Luc Godard >>> >>> - Original Message - >>> From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> >>> >>>> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >> devices. >>>> To me >>>> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to >> see >>>> what I >>>> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think >> they >>>> are. >>>> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many >>>> folks do >>>> not trust their eye. >>> >> >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. > > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Exactly my feelings as well. -- Bruce Wednesday, October 24, 2007, 9:37:23 AM, you wrote: g> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. To me g> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see what I g> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they are. g> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many folks do g> not trust their eye. g> In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a ground glass g> image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae snaps into g> focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has time to try g> to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found that I get a g> higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do with autofocus. g> That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and you can g> focus anywhere on the screen. g> Tom C wrote: >> I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It would >> appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a focusing >> aid for manual focus was no longer important. >> >> I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in the >> ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use the >> split screen to get it razor sharp. >> >> No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. >> >> Tom C. >> >> >>> From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> To: >>> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >>> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:26:17 -0400 >>> >>> Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is >>> lacking. Either that or my eyes are. >>> >>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> >>> In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >>> My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my >>> backup >>> K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing >>> with >>> it. and comparing it to the main. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Bob... >>> >>> === >>> I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the >>> K10D. And >>> I want a split screen too. >>> >>> Marnie aka Doe :-) >>> >>> - >>> Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ** See what's new at >>> http://www.aol.com >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> PDML@pdml.net >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>> follow the directions. >>> >>> !SIG:471e544485184412021166! >>> >>> >>> -- >>> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >>> PDML@pdml.net >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >>> follow the directions. >> >> >> -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Shoot, I guess I'll have to tell that to all my in focus photos I took from 1990 to 1997. :-) If there's one thing this list seems to have the propensity for, it's arguing about the right way to do something when there is more than one right way. What does anyone care if I like split prism screens for focusing? And what do I care if you don't? :-) Tom C. >From: Adam Maas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:49:36 -0400 > >Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller and >aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's a >requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. > >-Adam > > >Bob Blakely wrote: > > If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have >an > > improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the > > center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the >ground > > glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. > > > > Regards, > > Bob... > > > > "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." > > -Jean Luc Godard > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >devices. > >> To me > >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to >see > >> what I > >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think >they > >> are. > >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many > >> folks do > >> not trust their eye. > > > > > > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 24, 2007, at 10:00 AM, Tom C wrote: > Yeah I guess you're right. Those millions of SLR's sold with split > prism > screens in the 60's, 70's, 80's all had them for no good reason. They had them for good reason, Tom: they made it faster to achieve close approximate focus. But there was never a "one size fits all" optical focusing aid that works as well as a matte screen. That's why Nikon offered as many as 30 different focusing screens with optical aids for the Nikon F line back in the '60s and '70s, with big charts to say which one to use with what lenses for what situations. Instructions for use of a focusing screen with a focusing aid always recommended that critical focus be done with the surrounding fine-matte-ground focusing surface, unless the particular screen was not equipped with any and was designed entirely to support focusing speed and brightness instead of critical accuracy. Only the matte screens (and there were three or four of those) were on the "compatible and recommended" list for all lenses. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Split images are less accurate with wider lenses, the shift is smaller and aligning less precise. No split image is dead-on accurate and if that's a requirement, a matte screen and a magnifier are the way to go. -Adam Bob Blakely wrote: > If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have an > improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the > center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the ground > glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. > > Regards, > Bob... > > "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." > -Jean Luc Godard > > - Original Message - > From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. >> To me >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see >> what I >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they >> are. >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many >> folks do >> not trust their eye. > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: > On Oct 24, 2007, at 9:37 AM, graywolf wrote: > >> Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing >> devices. To me >> they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want >> to see what I >> am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to >> think they are. >> Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how >> many folks do >> not trust their eye. >> >> In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a >> ground glass >> image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae >> snaps into >> focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has >> time to try >> to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found >> that I get a >> higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do >> with autofocus. >> That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and >> you can >> focus anywhere on the screen. > > I've replaced split image rangefinder focusing screens with a plain > matte focusing screen in virtually every SLR I've owned since 1968 > for exactly the same reason. I don't even like too many scribe > markings near the center of the focusing screen, they get in the way. > > Godfrey > Ditto. -Adam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
To each his own then. The intimation made (not by you) that people do not know *how* to focus without a focusing aid though is absurd. It's obvious that when it appears that it's in focus it probably is. As far as readjusting focus after one thinks they are there... what does it hurt graywolf? If one achieved focus in the first place, then moved off and back on just to confirm, then it's just as likely they achieved critical focus the second time as well. Tom C. >From: Godfrey DiGiorgi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 10:00:48 -0700 > >On Oct 24, 2007, at 9:37 AM, graywolf wrote: > > > Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing > > devices. To me > > they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want > > to see what I > > am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to > > think they are. > > Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how > > many folks do > > not trust their eye. > > > > In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a > > ground glass > > image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae > > snaps into > > focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has > > time to try > > to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found > > that I get a > > higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do > > with autofocus. > > That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and > > you can > > focus anywhere on the screen. > >I've replaced split image rangefinder focusing screens with a plain >matte focusing screen in virtually every SLR I've owned since 1968 >for exactly the same reason. I don't even like too many scribe >markings near the center of the focusing screen, they get in the way. > >Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
If you have a split image scree that is not dead on accurate, you have an improperly designed and/or manufactured screen. It would mean that the center line where the prisms cross is not in the same plane as the ground glass's frost. FYI, I believe they are "optical" plastic now. Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "graywolf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. > To me > they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see > what I > am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they > are. > Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many > folks do > not trust their eye. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Yeah I guess you're right. Those millions of SLR's sold with split prism screens in the 60's, 70's, 80's all had them for no good reason. Tom C. >From: graywolf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 12:37:23 -0400 > >Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. >To me >they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see >what I >am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they >are. >Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many folks >do >not trust their eye. > >In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a ground glass >image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae snaps into >focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has time to >try >to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found that I >get a >higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do with >autofocus. >That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and you can >focus anywhere on the screen. > > > >Tom C wrote: > > I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It >would > > appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a >focusing > > aid for manual focus was no longer important. > > > > I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in >the > > ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use >the > > split screen to get it razor sharp. > > > > No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. > > > > Tom C. > > > > > >> From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> To: > >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen > >> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:26:17 -0400 > >> > >> Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is > >> lacking. Either that or my eyes are. > >> > >>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> > >> In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > >> My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my > >> backup > >> K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing > >> with > >> it. and comparing it to the main. > >> > >> Regards, > >> Bob... > >> > >> === > >> I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the > >> K10D. And > >> I want a split screen too. > >> > >> Marnie aka Doe :-) > >> > >> - > >> Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ** See what's new at > >> http://www.aol.com > >> > >> -- > >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> PDML@pdml.net > >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and > >> follow the directions. > >> > >> !SIG:471e544485184412021166! > >> > >> > >> -- > >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > >> PDML@pdml.net > >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and > >> follow the directions. > > > > > > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 24, 2007, at 9:37 AM, graywolf wrote: > Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing > devices. To me > they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want > to see what I > am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to > think they are. > Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how > many folks do > not trust their eye. > > In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a > ground glass > image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae > snaps into > focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has > time to try > to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found > that I get a > higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do > with autofocus. > That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and > you can > focus anywhere on the screen. I've replaced split image rangefinder focusing screens with a plain matte focusing screen in virtually every SLR I've owned since 1968 for exactly the same reason. I don't even like too many scribe markings near the center of the focusing screen, they get in the way. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Just to give the other point of view, I hate split image focusing devices. To me they are annoying, right in the middle of the picture where I want to see what I am looking at, and they are not as accurate as you guys seem to think they are. Plain ground glass with grid is my choice. It is interesting how many folks do not trust their eye. In my opinion that is because they do not know how to focus a ground glass image. The trick is to trust that first instant when the imagae snaps into focus. If you start fiddling the focus back and forth your eye has time to try to adjust itself, and you will never get right. I have always found that I get a higher percentage of properly focused images that way than I do with autofocus. That method has a couple of other advantages; it is very quick, and you can focus anywhere on the screen. Tom C wrote: > I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It would > appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a focusing > aid for manual focus was no longer important. > > I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in the > ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use the > split screen to get it razor sharp. > > No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. > > Tom C. > > >> From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> To: >> Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >> Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:26:17 -0400 >> >> Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is >> lacking. Either that or my eyes are. >> >>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> >> In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >> My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my >> backup >> K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing >> with >> it. and comparing it to the main. >> >> Regards, >> Bob... >> >> === >> I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the >> K10D. And >> I want a split screen too. >> >> Marnie aka Doe :-) >> >> - >> Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. >> >> >> >> >> ** See what's new at >> http://www.aol.com >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. >> >> !SIG:471e544485184412021166! >> >> >> -- >> PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >> PDML@pdml.net >> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >> follow the directions. > > > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I 3rd or 4th it. I've missed the split prism screen since my MX. It would appear that when AF came along, it was arbitrarily decided that a focusing aid for manual focus was no longer important. I used to, when starting out, take a steak knife with me and jam it in the ground, wherever, at the point I wanted critical focus. I'd then use the split screen to get it razor sharp. No need to ruin a shot because of missed focus. We're all fallible. Tom C. >From: "Steve Desjardins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List >To: >Subject: Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen >Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:26:17 -0400 > >Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is >lacking. Either that or my eyes are. > > >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> >In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my >backup >K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing >with >it. and comparing it to the main. > >Regards, >Bob... > >=== >I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the >K10D. And >I want a split screen too. > >Marnie aka Doe :-) > >- >Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. > > > > >** See what's new at >http://www.aol.com > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. > >!SIG:471e544485184412021166! > > >-- >PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List >PDML@pdml.net >http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net >to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and >follow the directions. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Me too. I have a few MF lenses I really like and that Matte screen is lacking. Either that or my eyes are. >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 10/23/2007 3:59 PM >>> In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my backup K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing with it. and comparing it to the main. Regards, Bob... === I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the K10D. And I want a split screen too. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions. !SIG:471e544485184412021166! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
In a message dated 10/23/2007 10:04:47 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my backup K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing with it. and comparing it to the main. Regards, Bob... === I would be interested, now the price is down, I've been eyeing the K10D. And I want a split screen too. Marnie aka Doe :-) - Warning: I am now filtering my email, so you may be censored. ** See what's new at http://www.aol.com -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
My Katz Eye Split prism screen just arrived. I'll install it in my backup K10D tonight and give you a report after a couple of days of playing with it. and comparing it to the main. Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "Bob Blakely" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >I ordered a couple. I'll let you know how they work out once I've had a > chance to play with them. I have two K10Ds, so I'll put the Katz Eye in > one > and compare it with the other. I have two 77mm's now, so I'll just test > them > side by side using the control software provided by Pentax. They'll fire > at > the same time under the same conditions. > > - Original Message - > From: "Cory Papenfuss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> On Tue, 16 Oct 2007, P. J. Alling wrote: >> >>> It probably interfers with spot metering more than anything else. >>> >>> Steve Desjardins wrote: >>>> >>>> While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to >>>> remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure where >>>> I heard this. >>>> >>>> http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the-Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html >>>> >> ... and stop-down metering with old lenses. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
I ordered a couple. I'll let you know how they work out once I've had a chance to play with them. I have two K10Ds, so I'll put the Katz Eye in one and compare it with the other. I have two 77mm's now, so I'll just test them side by side using the control software provided by Pentax. They'll fire at the same time under the same conditions. Regards, Bob... "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." -Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "Cory Papenfuss" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > On Tue, 16 Oct 2007, P. J. Alling wrote: > >> It probably interfers with spot metering more than anything else. >> >> Steve Desjardins wrote: >>> While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to >>> remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure where >>> I heard this. >>> >>> http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the-Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html >>> >>> > ... and stop-down metering with old lenses. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Tue, 16 Oct 2007, P. J. Alling wrote: > It probably interfers with spot metering more than anything else. > > Steve Desjardins wrote: >> While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to >> remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure where >> I heard this. >> >> http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the-Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html >> >> ... and stop-down metering with old lenses. -- * * Cory Papenfuss, Ph.D., PPSEL-IA * * Electrical Engineering* * Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University * * -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
Not when in focus... Regards, Bob... “Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection.” –Jean Luc Godard - Original Message - From: "P. J. Alling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> It probably interfers with spot metering more than anything else. Steve Desjardins wrote: > While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to > remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure where > I heard this. > > http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the-Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
It probably interfers with spot metering more than anything else. Steve Desjardins wrote: > While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to > remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure where > I heard this. > > http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the-Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html > > -- Remember, it’s pillage then burn. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
"But most people who use focusing aids like these screens anyway. I find the K10D's standard screen works very well for me. When it doesn't, I do a digital preview with the JPEG settings at default and use magnification to check critical focus." I do this as well. I've set the dial to jump directly to 12x magnification. I've just always liked split prisms. Maybe I'm compensating for my lack of a Leica. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Re: Katz Eye Split prism screen
On Oct 16, 2007, at 11:56 AM, Steve Desjardins wrote: > While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to > remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure > where > I heard this. > > http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the- > Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html I have a customized Katz Eye screen for the *ist DS ... no focusing aid, my own custom pattern of lines and crop markings. Loved it on the *ist DS so I tried it out in the K10D. Unfortunately, it produced consistent underexposure of about -0.7EV in the K10D where the standard screen has proven to be almost exactly accurate all the time, so I put the standard K10D screen back. When I talked with Rebecca Katz about it, she mentioned that the K10D's standard screen is tuned differently from the *ist DS screen, to direct more light at the ocular. That means the metering sensors are calibrated to a different curve based on the characteristics of the standard screen. I don't know how well the ones they sell for the K10D work by comparison. Those who I've heard getting them for any of the Pentaxes with the split image rangefinder focusing aids occasionally say that the spot metering patter readings are off with some lenses. This is because the metering sensor is not exactly aligned with the optical center of the focusing aids, and how that pair of prisms behaves with a given lens and the metering sensor is not consistent as a result. But most people who use focusing aids like these screens anyway. I find the K10D's standard screen works very well for me. When it doesn't, I do a digital preview with the JPEG settings at default and use magnification to check critical focus. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
Katz Eye Split prism screen
While I'm think of it, does anyone have one of these? I seem to remember that is created some metering problems, but I'm not sure where I heard this. http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/item--Katz-Eye-Focusing-Screen-for-the-Pentax-K10D--prod_K10D.html -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
