Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Eric Marth]

Alex, Lyle's build at the time he sold the Ram is one of my favorite 
bicycles I've ever seen. It's been fun to see the further mods you've made 
and watch as you've put it through big brevets and PBP! 

The current setup, paint and spec are superb! 

On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 9:50:15 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:

> Wow, thank you all for the overwhelming response and for sharing your 
> experience. I love the photos, keep 'em coming!
>
> Matt, thanks for the detail on the Tektros, I ordered a pair but also 
> decided to pull the trigger on Alex' Mafacs (thanks Alex!) to try out the 
> conversion.
>
> Here is what I'll try: 
> 1) New 700C RH tires - Bon Jon Pass in standard casings
> 2) Swap out Paul Racers Medium for MAFAC RAID and install 650b Wheels with 
> Loup Loup Pass tires or with Hetres (650x42) depending on what fits
>
> I'm not sure when, but I will get to it... I have too many half baked 
> projects at the moment, including my half-built Gallop on the stand right 
> now, a brakeless Wilbury that will lose its wheels soon and a MMM bubbe 
> with an Xtracycle that also needs a 650b conversion - I hope I can use the 
> Paul Racers directly on the canti posts, I'm not sure if the plate where 
> the bolt sits is removable.
>
> Thanks again to everyone and I'll report back.
>
> Max
> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 1:33:13 PM UTC-4 ber...@bernardduhon.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Careful with offset brake pad’s 
>> If tires are wide pad my rub on tire
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>> --
>> *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com  on 
>> behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
>> *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt 
>>  
>> I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe 
>> Pass tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for 
>> the toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads 
>> to get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be 
>> able to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.
>>
>> Toshi
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Alex, 
>>
>> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels, 
>> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad 
>> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you 
>> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset 
>> brake-pad holders.
>>
>> Evan
>> San Francisco
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/76ceb861-5af8-4416-a28f-f4b91f7d4afbn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Max Faingezicht]

Thanks Roberta, I had seen that thread and it's definitely adding to my
confusion ;)
People seem to mostly love their Lightning Bolts
Max

On Thu, Oct 26, 2023 at 12:11 PM Roberta  wrote:

> Here's a post on iBob.  Mark from Beacon,  NY reviews his new Lightning
> Bolt. You'll need to sign in as a member to read it:
> https://groups.google.com/g/internet-bob/c/nUQKRYSsyw8
>
> On Thursday, October 26, 2023 at 12:04:51 PM UTC-4 DavidP wrote:
>
>> Max - maybe I'm misunderstanding your intent, but while the Paul site
>> does suggest the Racers are designed for direct mounting (the center mount
>> adapter plate is optional),  direct mount centerpulls can't be used on
>> cantilever brake posts. For one the positioning for centerpull brake pivots
>> and cantilever brake posts is different (centerpull pivots are above the
>> rim, cantilever / v-brake posts are below the rim). These days there aren't
>> too many non-custom frames that have centerpull brake mounts, it's more
>> common to use centerpulls with a plate for central mounting like a standard
>> road caliper brake.
>>
>> -Dave
>>
>> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 9:50:15 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:
>>
>>> Wow, thank you all for the overwhelming response and for sharing your
>>> experience. I love the photos, keep 'em coming!
>>>
>>> Matt, thanks for the detail on the Tektros, I ordered a pair but also
>>> decided to pull the trigger on Alex' Mafacs (thanks Alex!) to try out the
>>> conversion.
>>>
>>> Here is what I'll try:
>>> 1) New 700C RH tires - Bon Jon Pass in standard casings
>>> 2) Swap out Paul Racers Medium for MAFAC RAID and install 650b Wheels
>>> with Loup Loup Pass tires or with Hetres (650x42) depending on what fits
>>>
>>> I'm not sure when, but I will get to it... I have too many half baked
>>> projects at the moment, including my half-built Gallop on the stand right
>>> now, a brakeless Wilbury that will lose its wheels soon and a MMM bubbe
>>> with an Xtracycle that also needs a 650b conversion - I hope I can use the
>>> Paul Racers directly on the canti posts, I'm not sure if the plate where
>>> the bolt sits is removable.
>>>
>>> Thanks again to everyone and I'll report back.
>>>
>>> Max
>>> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 1:33:13 PM UTC-4
>>> ber...@bernardduhon.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> Careful with offset brake pad’s
>>>> If tires are wide pad my rub on tire
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>>>> --
>>>> *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com  on
>>>> behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
>>>> *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt
>>>>
>>>> I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe
>>>> Pass tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for
>>>> the toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads
>>>> to get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be
>>>> able to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.
>>>>
>>>> Toshi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Alex,
>>>>
>>>> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels,
>>>> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad
>>>> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you
>>>> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset
>>>> brake-pad holders.
>>>>
>>>> Evan
>>>> San Francisco
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Roberta]

Here's a post on iBob.  Mark from Beacon,  NY reviews his new Lightning 
Bolt. You'll need to sign in as a member to read it:   
https://groups.google.com/g/internet-bob/c/nUQKRYSsyw8

On Thursday, October 26, 2023 at 12:04:51 PM UTC-4 DavidP wrote:

> Max - maybe I'm misunderstanding your intent, but while the Paul site does 
> suggest the Racers are designed for direct mounting (the center mount 
> adapter plate is optional),  direct mount centerpulls can't be used on 
> cantilever brake posts. For one the positioning for centerpull brake pivots 
> and cantilever brake posts is different (centerpull pivots are above the 
> rim, cantilever / v-brake posts are below the rim). These days there aren't 
> too many non-custom frames that have centerpull brake mounts, it's more 
> common to use centerpulls with a plate for central mounting like a standard 
> road caliper brake.
>
> -Dave
>
> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 9:50:15 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:
>
>> Wow, thank you all for the overwhelming response and for sharing your 
>> experience. I love the photos, keep 'em coming!
>>
>> Matt, thanks for the detail on the Tektros, I ordered a pair but also 
>> decided to pull the trigger on Alex' Mafacs (thanks Alex!) to try out the 
>> conversion.
>>
>> Here is what I'll try: 
>> 1) New 700C RH tires - Bon Jon Pass in standard casings
>> 2) Swap out Paul Racers Medium for MAFAC RAID and install 650b Wheels 
>> with Loup Loup Pass tires or with Hetres (650x42) depending on what fits
>>
>> I'm not sure when, but I will get to it... I have too many half baked 
>> projects at the moment, including my half-built Gallop on the stand right 
>> now, a brakeless Wilbury that will lose its wheels soon and a MMM bubbe 
>> with an Xtracycle that also needs a 650b conversion - I hope I can use the 
>> Paul Racers directly on the canti posts, I'm not sure if the plate where 
>> the bolt sits is removable.
>>
>> Thanks again to everyone and I'll report back.
>>
>> Max
>> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 1:33:13 PM UTC-4 
>> ber...@bernardduhon.com wrote:
>>
>>> Careful with offset brake pad’s 
>>> If tires are wide pad my rub on tire
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>>> --
>>> *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com  on 
>>> behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
>>> *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt 
>>>  
>>> I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe 
>>> Pass tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for 
>>> the toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads 
>>> to get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be 
>>> able to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.
>>>
>>> Toshi
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Alex, 
>>>
>>> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels, 
>>> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad 
>>> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you 
>>> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset 
>>> brake-pad holders.
>>>
>>> Evan
>>> San Francisco
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/91a2fbb6-a67a-4974-936e-41751ce9e6dcn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[maxcr]

Thanks David, that's helpful... you probably saved me some time futzing 
with the brakes to try and remove the plate.

The idea came from the comments on the the xtracycle 650b conversion post 
<https://groups.google.com/u/5/g/internet-bob/c/mPYtKXetIFM/m/r0DFL-OsAgAJ> 
I made on the i-bob list but maybe I misunderstood - they were saying I 
might be able to direct-mount the brake to the existing pivot posts and get 
the pads down to the 650B rim. Anyway, perhaps the only real options are 
Mafac raids which I've never seen IRL but have a set coming my way or to 
splurge with the Rene Herse centerpulls.

I'm still going to give it a shot to see if I can run a 650b in the back of 
that xtracycle, but for now the Ram conversion is happening first.

Max

On Thursday, October 26, 2023 at 12:04:51 PM UTC-4 DavidP wrote:

> Max - maybe I'm misunderstanding your intent, but while the Paul site does 
> suggest the Racers are designed for direct mounting (the center mount 
> adapter plate is optional),  direct mount centerpulls can't be used on 
> cantilever brake posts. For one the positioning for centerpull brake pivots 
> and cantilever brake posts is different (centerpull pivots are above the 
> rim, cantilever / v-brake posts are below the rim). These days there aren't 
> too many non-custom frames that have centerpull brake mounts, it's more 
> common to use centerpulls with a plate for central mounting like a standard 
> road caliper brake.
>
> -Dave
>
> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 9:50:15 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:
>
>> Wow, thank you all for the overwhelming response and for sharing your 
>> experience. I love the photos, keep 'em coming!
>>
>> Matt, thanks for the detail on the Tektros, I ordered a pair but also 
>> decided to pull the trigger on Alex' Mafacs (thanks Alex!) to try out the 
>> conversion.
>>
>> Here is what I'll try: 
>> 1) New 700C RH tires - Bon Jon Pass in standard casings
>> 2) Swap out Paul Racers Medium for MAFAC RAID and install 650b Wheels 
>> with Loup Loup Pass tires or with Hetres (650x42) depending on what fits
>>
>> I'm not sure when, but I will get to it... I have too many half baked 
>> projects at the moment, including my half-built Gallop on the stand right 
>> now, a brakeless Wilbury that will lose its wheels soon and a MMM bubbe 
>> with an Xtracycle that also needs a 650b conversion - I hope I can use the 
>> Paul Racers directly on the canti posts, I'm not sure if the plate where 
>> the bolt sits is removable.
>>
>> Thanks again to everyone and I'll report back.
>>
>> Max
>> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 1:33:13 PM UTC-4 
>> ber...@bernardduhon.com wrote:
>>
>>> Careful with offset brake pad’s 
>>> If tires are wide pad my rub on tire
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>>> --
>>> *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com  on 
>>> behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
>>> *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt 
>>>  
>>> I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe 
>>> Pass tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for 
>>> the toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads 
>>> to get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be 
>>> able to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.
>>>
>>> Toshi
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Alex, 
>>>
>>> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels, 
>>> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad 
>>> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you 
>>> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset 
>>> brake-pad holders.
>>>
>>> Evan
>>> San Francisco
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[DavidP]

Max - maybe I'm misunderstanding your intent, but while the Paul site does 
suggest the Racers are designed for direct mounting (the center mount 
adapter plate is optional),  direct mount centerpulls can't be used on 
cantilever brake posts. For one the positioning for centerpull brake pivots 
and cantilever brake posts is different (centerpull pivots are above the 
rim, cantilever / v-brake posts are below the rim). These days there aren't 
too many non-custom frames that have centerpull brake mounts, it's more 
common to use centerpulls with a plate for central mounting like a standard 
road caliper brake.

-Dave

On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 9:50:15 PM UTC-4 maxcr wrote:

> Wow, thank you all for the overwhelming response and for sharing your 
> experience. I love the photos, keep 'em coming!
>
> Matt, thanks for the detail on the Tektros, I ordered a pair but also 
> decided to pull the trigger on Alex' Mafacs (thanks Alex!) to try out the 
> conversion.
>
> Here is what I'll try: 
> 1) New 700C RH tires - Bon Jon Pass in standard casings
> 2) Swap out Paul Racers Medium for MAFAC RAID and install 650b Wheels with 
> Loup Loup Pass tires or with Hetres (650x42) depending on what fits
>
> I'm not sure when, but I will get to it... I have too many half baked 
> projects at the moment, including my half-built Gallop on the stand right 
> now, a brakeless Wilbury that will lose its wheels soon and a MMM bubbe 
> with an Xtracycle that also needs a 650b conversion - I hope I can use the 
> Paul Racers directly on the canti posts, I'm not sure if the plate where 
> the bolt sits is removable.
>
> Thanks again to everyone and I'll report back.
>
> Max
> On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 1:33:13 PM UTC-4 ber...@bernardduhon.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Careful with offset brake pad’s 
>> If tires are wide pad my rub on tire
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>> --
>> *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com  on 
>> behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
>> *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
>> *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt 
>>  
>> I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe 
>> Pass tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for 
>> the toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads 
>> to get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be 
>> able to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.
>>
>> Toshi
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:
>>
>> Hi Alex, 
>>
>> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels, 
>> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad 
>> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you 
>> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset 
>> brake-pad holders.
>>
>> Evan
>> San Francisco
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/0f3e2a62-ac9f-474c-80a8-5de0f7597957n%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[maxcr]

Wow, thank you all for the overwhelming response and for sharing your 
experience. I love the photos, keep 'em coming!

Matt, thanks for the detail on the Tektros, I ordered a pair but also 
decided to pull the trigger on Alex' Mafacs (thanks Alex!) to try out the 
conversion.

Here is what I'll try: 
1) New 700C RH tires - Bon Jon Pass in standard casings
2) Swap out Paul Racers Medium for MAFAC RAID and install 650b Wheels with 
Loup Loup Pass tires or with Hetres (650x42) depending on what fits

I'm not sure when, but I will get to it... I have too many half baked 
projects at the moment, including my half-built Gallop on the stand right 
now, a brakeless Wilbury that will lose its wheels soon and a MMM bubbe 
with an Xtracycle that also needs a 650b conversion - I hope I can use the 
Paul Racers directly on the canti posts, I'm not sure if the plate where 
the bolt sits is removable.

Thanks again to everyone and I'll report back.

Max
On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 1:33:13 PM UTC-4 ber...@bernardduhon.com 
wrote:

> Careful with offset brake pad’s 
> If tires are wide pad my rub on tire
>
>
>
>
> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
> --
> *From:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com  on 
> behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
> *To:* rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com 
> *Subject:* Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt 
>  
> I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe 
> Pass tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for 
> the toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads 
> to get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be 
> able to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.
>
> Toshi
>
>
> On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:
>
> Hi Alex, 
>
> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels, 
> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad 
> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you 
> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset 
> brake-pad holders.
>
> Evan
> San Francisco
>
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
>  
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
> .
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com
>  
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
> .
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/17175514-50a4-4e15-8837-22ec4f3cc38cn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Bernard Duhon]

Careful with offset brake pad’s
If tires are wide pad my rub on tire




Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com  on 
behalf of Toshi Takeuchi 
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2023 12:02:58 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
Subject: Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe Pass 
tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for the toe 
overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads to get a 
little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be able to be 
combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.

Toshi


On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E. 
mailto:evanellio...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi Alex,

Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels, Tektro 
R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad holders on 
the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you need a bit more 
reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset brake-pad holders.

Evan
San Francisco



--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 
rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 
rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com<https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/SA1PR17MB5491A85F7CD0E079D20D4168CDDEA%40SA1PR17MB5491.namprd17.prod.outlook.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Toshi Takeuchi]

I concur with Evan.  I had a 54 cm 650b Ram with 54 mm Hetre/Baby Shoe Pass
tires and SKS fenders.  It was as good as my custom bike, except for the
toe overlap and dynamo wiring. I used thin profile V-brake style pads to
get a little extra reach with the Tektro R559.  That strategy may be able
to be combined with the offset brake-pad holders if needed.

Toshi


On Sun, Oct 22, 2023 at 9:16 AM Evan E.  wrote:

> Hi Alex,
>
> Here for your reference is a photo of my Rambouillet with 650b wheels,
> Tektro R559 brakes, and Pari-Moto 650b x 42 tires. I used offset brake-pad
> holders on the rear caliper to get a tad more reach. If it turns out you
> need a bit more reach on your bike, let me know. I still have those offset
> brake-pad holders.
>
> Evan
> San Francisco
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9769df2-3b01-4616-8036-b25209c1009an%40googlegroups.com
> 
> .
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAGB59xxyAHSM%2BbuB%3DeKo84iqT%3DUUKSG2J42OQ7HvewE7Ck0k2A%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Conway Bennett]

I have a Crust Canti-Lightning Bolt, and it's one of the best bikes I've 
ever ridden.  The most similar bike I have had to the Ram is two 
Quickbeams, first in a 60, then in a 58--I've sold them both, but I would 
be unlikely to part ways with the Lightning Bolt unless I upgraded somehow 
(e.g., Jeff Lyon).  I think the thing about the Lightning Bolt is that is 
so different than my 650b Hunqapillar that I split my time with--its like 
going from supportive hiking boots to a pair Vans.  They are both 
comfortable, just very different from one another.  Because of my 
experience with the Lightning Bolt, I have been getting more into go fast 
solo rides, and I will probably try to buy the next 59 Canti-Romulus that 
comes up for sale.
On Wednesday, October 25, 2023 at 10:04:18 AM UTC-5 RBW Owners Bunch wrote:

> I have been daydreaming about going the opposite direction from the OP. I 
> currently have a v1 lightning bolt that i use for my rambl-y weekend rides 
> and a more recent canti romanceur i use for commuting. I also have a recent 
> sam i use for commuting and errands. i'm thinking about selling the 
> romanceur and, in turn, keeping an eye out for a ram. but i would probably 
> keep it 700c. who knows. 
>
> On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 3:45:48 PM UTC-7 RBW Owners Bunch wrote:
>
>> 
>>
>> I recently picked up a 59 Romulus on the list.  I always thought of the 
>> Romulus as the "cheaper Panasonic version of the Rambouillet".  I bought 
>> it, stripped it to the bones, and built it back up in my own idiosyncratic 
>> way.  I built it with 700x38 Gravel King Slicks.  For oddball reasons I 
>> won't get into, I'm not riding it on any "rides" of any distance, but I did 
>> ride it around the block and it felt weird, and unlike any Rivendell I had 
>> ridden before.  It radically understeered.  It was a bad weird, and I 
>> normally am not sensitive to this kind of thing.  I swapped the tires out 
>> for 700x32 Rene Herse Stampede Pass, and shazam, it felt like a normal 
>> bike, like a Rivendell.  
>>
>> This was two around the block test rides.  I have not reverted to the 38s 
>> to see if the bad-weird repeated.  I have not tried 38mm knobbies to see if 
>> it has to do with pneumatic trail and a huge slick contact patch.  Once my 
>> weirdo reasons for not riding it are lifted, then I'll get out on it more 
>> and form a relationship.  I love my build and will give it a VERY thorough 
>> shake down before forming any real lasting opinions.
>>
>> 
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 7:38:09 AM UTC-7 RBW Owners Bunch wrote:
>>
>>> I'll chime in here that my 650b'd Ram is one of my favorite riding bikes 
>>> in the stable. I always want to max out tire width as much as possible and 
>>> was disappointed that 700x35 tires with fenders didn't fit. I had a 650b 
>>> wheelset and tried 650bx42 and that fit great with room to spare. I've been 
>>> riding that configuration for a few months now.
>>>
>>> It looked like room enough to go one tire size higher (sans fenders). 
>>> Thanks to a fellow lister I had some 650bx48 Rene Herse Switchback Hill 
>>> Tires waiting for me at home yesterday after a long weekend away. This 
>>> morning I swapped em out and they seem to fit just fine. Super excited to 
>>> try this out later this week! 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 5:49:36 AM UTC-5 iamkeith wrote:
>>>
 Alex, your modified Ram is outstanding.  Probably the most nicest, 
 modified Rivendell I've ever seen.

 This whole thread inspired me to wrap up a few things on my own 650b 
 conversion project, an RB-1, and to ride my Ram one last time this 
 weekend.  (It's supposed to start snowing this weekend, so season's over 
 I'm affraid).

 Interesting thing about the Ram, that strikes me every time, is how 
 comfortable or "plush" it feels, despite only having 33.33 tires.  I don't 
 understand why.  When it was new, it made "normal" road bikes, with 23 to 
 28mm tires look positively silly.  As the rest of the industry has caught 
 up and embraced fatter tires, the Ram now "looks' outdated next to a lot 
 of 
 other, newer bikes I saw.  My own tendency is almost always to choose 
 something with fatter tires, too.  But as I said, I'm struck every time by 
 how well it rides and how relevant it still is.  I don’t think I'll ever 
 sell it, even if I have to be "prompted" to ride it once in a while.  I 
 think if I ever felt differently, I'd now consider Alex's example.

 On Thursday, October 19, 2023 at 11:38:16 AM UTC-6 Applegate wrote:

> Hey Max,
>
> I sort of love this dilemma. As much as my platonic ideal of a bike 
> has been shaped by Jan Heine, featuring skinny, thin-wall tubing and a 
> flat 
> top tube, I will definitely back a 650b Ram. I would wholeheartedly 
> recommend MAFAC Raids (or go all-in with the Compass/Rene Herse updates). 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Drew Henson]

I have been daydreaming about going the opposite direction from the OP. I 
currently have a v1 lightning bolt that i use for my rambl-y weekend rides 
and a more recent canti romanceur i use for commuting. I also have a recent 
sam i use for commuting and errands. i'm thinking about selling the 
romanceur and, in turn, keeping an eye out for a ram. but i would probably 
keep it 700c. who knows. 

On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 3:45:48 PM UTC-7 RBW Owners Bunch wrote:

> 
>
> I recently picked up a 59 Romulus on the list.  I always thought of the 
> Romulus as the "cheaper Panasonic version of the Rambouillet".  I bought 
> it, stripped it to the bones, and built it back up in my own idiosyncratic 
> way.  I built it with 700x38 Gravel King Slicks.  For oddball reasons I 
> won't get into, I'm not riding it on any "rides" of any distance, but I did 
> ride it around the block and it felt weird, and unlike any Rivendell I had 
> ridden before.  It radically understeered.  It was a bad weird, and I 
> normally am not sensitive to this kind of thing.  I swapped the tires out 
> for 700x32 Rene Herse Stampede Pass, and shazam, it felt like a normal 
> bike, like a Rivendell.  
>
> This was two around the block test rides.  I have not reverted to the 38s 
> to see if the bad-weird repeated.  I have not tried 38mm knobbies to see if 
> it has to do with pneumatic trail and a huge slick contact patch.  Once my 
> weirdo reasons for not riding it are lifted, then I'll get out on it more 
> and form a relationship.  I love my build and will give it a VERY thorough 
> shake down before forming any real lasting opinions.
>
> 
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 7:38:09 AM UTC-7 RBW Owners Bunch wrote:
>
>> I'll chime in here that my 650b'd Ram is one of my favorite riding bikes 
>> in the stable. I always want to max out tire width as much as possible and 
>> was disappointed that 700x35 tires with fenders didn't fit. I had a 650b 
>> wheelset and tried 650bx42 and that fit great with room to spare. I've been 
>> riding that configuration for a few months now.
>>
>> It looked like room enough to go one tire size higher (sans fenders). 
>> Thanks to a fellow lister I had some 650bx48 Rene Herse Switchback Hill 
>> Tires waiting for me at home yesterday after a long weekend away. This 
>> morning I swapped em out and they seem to fit just fine. Super excited to 
>> try this out later this week! 
>>
>>
>> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 5:49:36 AM UTC-5 iamkeith wrote:
>>
>>> Alex, your modified Ram is outstanding.  Probably the most nicest, 
>>> modified Rivendell I've ever seen.
>>>
>>> This whole thread inspired me to wrap up a few things on my own 650b 
>>> conversion project, an RB-1, and to ride my Ram one last time this 
>>> weekend.  (It's supposed to start snowing this weekend, so season's over 
>>> I'm affraid).
>>>
>>> Interesting thing about the Ram, that strikes me every time, is how 
>>> comfortable or "plush" it feels, despite only having 33.33 tires.  I don't 
>>> understand why.  When it was new, it made "normal" road bikes, with 23 to 
>>> 28mm tires look positively silly.  As the rest of the industry has caught 
>>> up and embraced fatter tires, the Ram now "looks' outdated next to a lot of 
>>> other, newer bikes I saw.  My own tendency is almost always to choose 
>>> something with fatter tires, too.  But as I said, I'm struck every time by 
>>> how well it rides and how relevant it still is.  I don’t think I'll ever 
>>> sell it, even if I have to be "prompted" to ride it once in a while.  I 
>>> think if I ever felt differently, I'd now consider Alex's example.
>>>
>>> On Thursday, October 19, 2023 at 11:38:16 AM UTC-6 Applegate wrote:
>>>
 Hey Max,

 I sort of love this dilemma. As much as my platonic ideal of a bike has 
 been shaped by Jan Heine, featuring skinny, thin-wall tubing and a flat 
 top 
 tube, I will definitely back a 650b Ram. I would wholeheartedly recommend 
 MAFAC Raids (or go all-in with the Compass/Rene Herse updates). I have a 
 couple pairs of Raids I'm reconditioning with brass bushings/washers and 
 could probably ship one your way for a reasonable fare. Not the point of 
 me 
 posting though.

 I had a V1 XL Canti Bolt for 14 months, using it for randonneuring as 
 well as some gravel rides and mixed terrains touring (with smallish front 
 panniers on a lowrider rack). It was nice to look at and often felt great, 
 but it never really fit me (too long of top tube, seemingly resolved in 
 current geometry). I think I put just over 4k miles on it in that 
 timespan, 
 which is probably the fastest mileage rate of any of my bikes to date.

 However, I also got a 62 (so 60 C–C, as it would happen) Rambouillet 
 about the same time, and the connection felt deeper, sooner. It was 
 stripped to the bare steel and was sporting an eccentric genius 650b 
 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Bill Lindsay]

I recently picked up a 59 Romulus on the list.  I always thought of the 
Romulus as the "cheaper Panasonic version of the Rambouillet".  I bought 
it, stripped it to the bones, and built it back up in my own idiosyncratic 
way.  I built it with 700x38 Gravel King Slicks.  For oddball reasons I 
won't get into, I'm not riding it on any "rides" of any distance, but I did 
ride it around the block and it felt weird, and unlike any Rivendell I had 
ridden before.  It radically understeered.  It was a bad weird, and I 
normally am not sensitive to this kind of thing.  I swapped the tires out 
for 700x32 Rene Herse Stampede Pass, and shazam, it felt like a normal 
bike, like a Rivendell.  

This was two around the block test rides.  I have not reverted to the 38s 
to see if the bad-weird repeated.  I have not tried 38mm knobbies to see if 
it has to do with pneumatic trail and a huge slick contact patch.  Once my 
weirdo reasons for not riding it are lifted, then I'll get out on it more 
and form a relationship.  I love my build and will give it a VERY thorough 
shake down before forming any real lasting opinions.



Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 7:38:09 AM UTC-7 RBW Owners Bunch wrote:

> I'll chime in here that my 650b'd Ram is one of my favorite riding bikes 
> in the stable. I always want to max out tire width as much as possible and 
> was disappointed that 700x35 tires with fenders didn't fit. I had a 650b 
> wheelset and tried 650bx42 and that fit great with room to spare. I've been 
> riding that configuration for a few months now.
>
> It looked like room enough to go one tire size higher (sans fenders). 
> Thanks to a fellow lister I had some 650bx48 Rene Herse Switchback Hill 
> Tires waiting for me at home yesterday after a long weekend away. This 
> morning I swapped em out and they seem to fit just fine. Super excited to 
> try this out later this week! 
>
>
> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 5:49:36 AM UTC-5 iamkeith wrote:
>
>> Alex, your modified Ram is outstanding.  Probably the most nicest, 
>> modified Rivendell I've ever seen.
>>
>> This whole thread inspired me to wrap up a few things on my own 650b 
>> conversion project, an RB-1, and to ride my Ram one last time this 
>> weekend.  (It's supposed to start snowing this weekend, so season's over 
>> I'm affraid).
>>
>> Interesting thing about the Ram, that strikes me every time, is how 
>> comfortable or "plush" it feels, despite only having 33.33 tires.  I don't 
>> understand why.  When it was new, it made "normal" road bikes, with 23 to 
>> 28mm tires look positively silly.  As the rest of the industry has caught 
>> up and embraced fatter tires, the Ram now "looks' outdated next to a lot of 
>> other, newer bikes I saw.  My own tendency is almost always to choose 
>> something with fatter tires, too.  But as I said, I'm struck every time by 
>> how well it rides and how relevant it still is.  I don’t think I'll ever 
>> sell it, even if I have to be "prompted" to ride it once in a while.  I 
>> think if I ever felt differently, I'd now consider Alex's example.
>>
>> On Thursday, October 19, 2023 at 11:38:16 AM UTC-6 Applegate wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Max,
>>>
>>> I sort of love this dilemma. As much as my platonic ideal of a bike has 
>>> been shaped by Jan Heine, featuring skinny, thin-wall tubing and a flat top 
>>> tube, I will definitely back a 650b Ram. I would wholeheartedly recommend 
>>> MAFAC Raids (or go all-in with the Compass/Rene Herse updates). I have a 
>>> couple pairs of Raids I'm reconditioning with brass bushings/washers and 
>>> could probably ship one your way for a reasonable fare. Not the point of me 
>>> posting though.
>>>
>>> I had a V1 XL Canti Bolt for 14 months, using it for randonneuring as 
>>> well as some gravel rides and mixed terrains touring (with smallish front 
>>> panniers on a lowrider rack). It was nice to look at and often felt great, 
>>> but it never really fit me (too long of top tube, seemingly resolved in 
>>> current geometry). I think I put just over 4k miles on it in that timespan, 
>>> which is probably the fastest mileage rate of any of my bikes to date.
>>>
>>> However, I also got a 62 (so 60 C–C, as it would happen) Rambouillet 
>>> about the same time, and the connection felt deeper, sooner. It was 
>>> stripped to the bare steel and was sporting an eccentric genius 650b build, 
>>> courtesy of @shredportals Lyle. I rode it as a be-basketed commuter and 
>>> overnighter, and knew the fit and ride quality was something I wanted to 
>>> hold onto. I asked Erik Billings for a small litany of BQ-rando-style frame 
>>> modifications (fork re-rake and all), and got new paint and decals from 
>>> Rick Stefani. It's now replaced my Crust Canti Lightning Bolt as my 
>>> midcentury French cosplay randonneuring bike, and I was very happy with the 
>>> more upright fit when I rode it for Paris–Brest–Paris.
>>>
>>> This is all subjective and fit-oriented, etc, but I support 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[MoVelo]

I've been running my blue Ram with 650bx42 with fenders and can agree with 
Michael that it is a sublime ride. Very stable and comfy. Good on gravel 
and multi-use paths. Not super fast but reasonable. Plus P50 fenders fit 
well with great coverable.

I am running a 650bx48 on the front with plenty of room, I believe i'd have 
to further dimple the chain stays to fit that on the rear. I don't like 
what the fatter tire up front did to the handling so I'm thinking I'll 
switch it back to the 42. 

I was able to run 700x35's without fenders but had to retreat to 32's to 
fit the fenders in there.

Michael-I am curious what the true width of those Switchback Hill tires is. 
My experience with RH 650b's is that they seem to run narrow but that could 
be the A23 rims.

James Poulson
Missouri

On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 9:38:09 AM UTC-5 Michael Ullmer wrote:

> I'll chime in here that my 650b'd Ram is one of my favorite riding bikes 
> in the stable. I always want to max out tire width as much as possible and 
> was disappointed that 700x35 tires with fenders didn't fit. I had a 650b 
> wheelset and tried 650bx42 and that fit great with room to spare. I've been 
> riding that configuration for a few months now.
>
> It looked like room enough to go one tire size higher (sans fenders). 
> Thanks to a fellow lister I had some 650bx48 Rene Herse Switchback Hill 
> Tires waiting for me at home yesterday after a long weekend away. This 
> morning I swapped em out and they seem to fit just fine. Super excited to 
> try this out later this week! 
>
>
> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 5:49:36 AM UTC-5 iamkeith wrote:
>
>> Alex, your modified Ram is outstanding.  Probably the most nicest, 
>> modified Rivendell I've ever seen.
>>
>> This whole thread inspired me to wrap up a few things on my own 650b 
>> conversion project, an RB-1, and to ride my Ram one last time this 
>> weekend.  (It's supposed to start snowing this weekend, so season's over 
>> I'm affraid).
>>
>> Interesting thing about the Ram, that strikes me every time, is how 
>> comfortable or "plush" it feels, despite only having 33.33 tires.  I don't 
>> understand why.  When it was new, it made "normal" road bikes, with 23 to 
>> 28mm tires look positively silly.  As the rest of the industry has caught 
>> up and embraced fatter tires, the Ram now "looks' outdated next to a lot of 
>> other, newer bikes I saw.  My own tendency is almost always to choose 
>> something with fatter tires, too.  But as I said, I'm struck every time by 
>> how well it rides and how relevant it still is.  I don’t think I'll ever 
>> sell it, even if I have to be "prompted" to ride it once in a while.  I 
>> think if I ever felt differently, I'd now consider Alex's example.
>>
>> On Thursday, October 19, 2023 at 11:38:16 AM UTC-6 Applegate wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Max,
>>>
>>> I sort of love this dilemma. As much as my platonic ideal of a bike has 
>>> been shaped by Jan Heine, featuring skinny, thin-wall tubing and a flat top 
>>> tube, I will definitely back a 650b Ram. I would wholeheartedly recommend 
>>> MAFAC Raids (or go all-in with the Compass/Rene Herse updates). I have a 
>>> couple pairs of Raids I'm reconditioning with brass bushings/washers and 
>>> could probably ship one your way for a reasonable fare. Not the point of me 
>>> posting though.
>>>
>>> I had a V1 XL Canti Bolt for 14 months, using it for randonneuring as 
>>> well as some gravel rides and mixed terrains touring (with smallish front 
>>> panniers on a lowrider rack). It was nice to look at and often felt great, 
>>> but it never really fit me (too long of top tube, seemingly resolved in 
>>> current geometry). I think I put just over 4k miles on it in that timespan, 
>>> which is probably the fastest mileage rate of any of my bikes to date.
>>>
>>> However, I also got a 62 (so 60 C–C, as it would happen) Rambouillet 
>>> about the same time, and the connection felt deeper, sooner. It was 
>>> stripped to the bare steel and was sporting an eccentric genius 650b build, 
>>> courtesy of @shredportals Lyle. I rode it as a be-basketed commuter and 
>>> overnighter, and knew the fit and ride quality was something I wanted to 
>>> hold onto. I asked Erik Billings for a small litany of BQ-rando-style frame 
>>> modifications (fork re-rake and all), and got new paint and decals from 
>>> Rick Stefani. It's now replaced my Crust Canti Lightning Bolt as my 
>>> midcentury French cosplay randonneuring bike, and I was very happy with the 
>>> more upright fit when I rode it for Paris–Brest–Paris.
>>>
>>> This is all subjective and fit-oriented, etc, but I support trying a 
>>> 650b conversion on your Ram first. It might just be the ticket for great 
>>> joy; if nothing else, then you have a 650b wheelset for your next bike? The 
>>> most ideal is if you could *somehow* have both built up and in your 
>>> possession at the same time, for some fun back-to-back testing.
>>>
>>> Anyway, here are some pics. Yes, I re-sold 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[iamkeith]

Alex, your modified Ram is outstanding.  Probably the most nicest, modified 
Rivendell I've ever seen.

This whole thread inspired me to wrap up a few things on my own 650b 
conversion project, an RB-1, and to ride my Ram one last time this 
weekend.  (It's supposed to start snowing this weekend, so season's over 
I'm affraid).

Interesting thing about the Ram, that strikes me every time, is how 
comfortable or "plush" it feels, despite only having 33.33 tires.  I don't 
understand why.  When it was new, it made "normal" road bikes, with 23 to 
28mm tires look positively silly.  As the rest of the industry has caught 
up and embraced fatter tires, the Ram now "looks' outdated next to a lot of 
other, newer bikes I saw.  My own tendency is almost always to choose 
something with fatter tires, too.  But as I said, I'm struck every time by 
how well it rides and how relevant it still is.  I don’t think I'll ever 
sell it, even if I have to be "prompted" to ride it once in a while.  I 
think if I ever felt differently, I'd now consider Alex's example.

On Thursday, October 19, 2023 at 11:38:16 AM UTC-6 Applegate wrote:

> Hey Max,
>
> I sort of love this dilemma. As much as my platonic ideal of a bike has 
> been shaped by Jan Heine, featuring skinny, thin-wall tubing and a flat top 
> tube, I will definitely back a 650b Ram. I would wholeheartedly recommend 
> MAFAC Raids (or go all-in with the Compass/Rene Herse updates). I have a 
> couple pairs of Raids I'm reconditioning with brass bushings/washers and 
> could probably ship one your way for a reasonable fare. Not the point of me 
> posting though.
>
> I had a V1 XL Canti Bolt for 14 months, using it for randonneuring as well 
> as some gravel rides and mixed terrains touring (with smallish front 
> panniers on a lowrider rack). It was nice to look at and often felt great, 
> but it never really fit me (too long of top tube, seemingly resolved in 
> current geometry). I think I put just over 4k miles on it in that timespan, 
> which is probably the fastest mileage rate of any of my bikes to date.
>
> However, I also got a 62 (so 60 C–C, as it would happen) Rambouillet about 
> the same time, and the connection felt deeper, sooner. It was stripped to 
> the bare steel and was sporting an eccentric genius 650b build, courtesy of 
> @shredportals Lyle. I rode it as a be-basketed commuter and overnighter, 
> and knew the fit and ride quality was something I wanted to hold onto. I 
> asked Erik Billings for a small litany of BQ-rando-style frame 
> modifications (fork re-rake and all), and got new paint and decals from 
> Rick Stefani. It's now replaced my Crust Canti Lightning Bolt as my 
> midcentury French cosplay randonneuring bike, and I was very happy with the 
> more upright fit when I rode it for Paris–Brest–Paris.
>
> This is all subjective and fit-oriented, etc, but I support trying a 650b 
> conversion on your Ram first. It might just be the ticket for great joy; if 
> nothing else, then you have a 650b wheelset for your next bike? The most 
> ideal is if you could *somehow* have both built up and in your possession 
> at the same time, for some fun back-to-back testing.
>
> Anyway, here are some pics. Yes, I re-sold the Waterford Homer you sold me 
> (great bike though—don't try to 650b that one) Good luck with your process 
> here!
>
> Alex
> Berkeley, CA
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/87f948e7-3df6-456c-9c1a-2a2c67b7b97bn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Evan E.]

Oops. I meant Max, not Alex. 



-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/5f5e9f73-3879-4a7b-9f0e-433dcfe9a75cn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Max Faingezicht]

Hey Alex,

Thanks for sharing your experience! PBP, im so jealous, glad you got to do
it.

I’m definitely going to give the 650b conversion a shot. Given that the LB
frames are getting low on inventory I’m tempted to buy one and just hold on
to it, but funds are low as is my wife’s patience! But I agree that back to
back rides is the only way to really know.

I’m sorry to hear you moved on from the AHH, was it not what you expected
in terms of weight/speed? Or just not a perfect fit?

Also, I’m interested in the Mafacs, do you have any more details/pics?

Thanks again
Max

On Oct 19, 2023, at 1:38 PM, Applegate  wrote:

Hey Max,

I sort of love this dilemma. As much as my platonic ideal of a bike has
been shaped by Jan Heine, featuring skinny, thin-wall tubing and a flat top
tube, I will definitely back a 650b Ram. I would wholeheartedly recommend
MAFAC Raids (or go all-in with the Compass/Rene Herse updates). I have a
couple pairs of Raids I'm reconditioning with brass bushings/washers and
could probably ship one your way for a reasonable fare. Not the point of me
posting though.

I had a V1 XL Canti Bolt for 14 months, using it for randonneuring as well
as some gravel rides and mixed terrains touring (with smallish front
panniers on a lowrider rack). It was nice to look at and often felt great,
but it never really fit me (too long of top tube, seemingly resolved in
current geometry). I think I put just over 4k miles on it in that timespan,
which is probably the fastest mileage rate of any of my bikes to date.

However, I also got a 62 (so 60 C–C, as it would happen) Rambouillet about
the same time, and the connection felt deeper, sooner. It was stripped to
the bare steel and was sporting an eccentric genius 650b build, courtesy of
@shredportals Lyle. I rode it as a be-basketed commuter and overnighter,
and knew the fit and ride quality was something I wanted to hold onto. I
asked Erik Billings for a small litany of BQ-rando-style frame
modifications (fork re-rake and all), and got new paint and decals from
Rick Stefani. It's now replaced my Crust Canti Lightning Bolt as my
midcentury French cosplay randonneuring bike, and I was very happy with the
more upright fit when I rode it for Paris–Brest–Paris.

This is all subjective and fit-oriented, etc, but I support trying a 650b
conversion on your Ram first. It might just be the ticket for great joy; if
nothing else, then you have a 650b wheelset for your next bike? The most
ideal is if you could *somehow* have both built up and in your possession
at the same time, for some fun back-to-back testing.

Anyway, here are some pics. Yes, I re-sold the Waterford Homer you sold me
(great bike though—don't try to 650b that one) Good luck with your process
here!

Alex
Berkeley, CA

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the
Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit
https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/3mZh306jY8Q/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to
rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/6f0b021b-6184-4d64-a847-323f80c321f2n%40googlegroups.com

.




-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAN5P1LuxfM2JtKmsnnihdLjtQbof40iFodjkvN3EywniLieJfg%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

That sounds similar to a prior time they still had discontinued 1" 
threadless Grand Rando canti forks in the ivory color still listed on the 
site for an extended period.  They currently still have the newer disc 
Grand Rando 1" threadless forks still listed but also out of stock.  So 
yeah, seems they are often just slow to update the online shop with full 
removal of discontinued items and they got me a few times with sale items 
such as a drive side only NOS Ritchey triple crank arm in 177.5mm that was 
listed for something like $10 (that I excitedly thought I'd add to cart as 
a back-up for my own 177.5 set) and some proto tall stack 26.0 threadless 
stems only to find they were gone but lingered on the site for quite a 
while.

Brian Cole

On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 2:44:22 PM UTC-4 Garth wrote:

> Coal Bee Rye Anne,  I was going to mention the Soma low trail fork too, 
> but then I checked the stock and it's still not in stock and hasn't been 
> for at least the 8-9 months I have been checking. The disc version is in 
> stock however, so I doubt it has anything to do with supply issues for the 
> threaded versions. It seems there are some items or sizes of items they no 
> longer stock but aren't deleted from the system for whatever reason. I 
> found this out by emailing them as the availability of an item. 
>
>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a077ffed-43f1-4437-aca4-3f211e727d24n%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[MoVelo]

I've owned both the Ram and Rawland Nordavinden. I sold the Rawland and 
still have the Ram. The Rawland was nice but the Ram is soo much nicer 
in every way. 

Just my humble opinion

James Poulson


On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 5:33:31 PM UTC-5 Garth wrote:

> So it appears Max the Rawland is actually 59cm, center to top, 57.5mm 
> center to center. So it's just shy of your Ram. Not an issue. I compared 
> the two and if someone asked me if it's a suitable fit based on their 
> comparable Ram size, I'd have to say yes. 
>
> The Ram is a mere 13mm higher in stack height, center of the BB to the 
> horizontal center-top of the head tube. 
> The reach is within 3mm, so negligible . 
> The Rawland has a 1/2 degree steeper seat tube angle, which accounts for 
> like 6-7mm more forward placement of the top center of the seat tube in 
> relation to the center BB, but I recall you don't have your saddles slammed 
> all the way back so you have plenty of room on the rails. 
>
> Head tube angles are the same 73d and the upsloping TT is within 1/2d. 
> BB drop is within 2mm. 
> The Rawland link says it's 35mm max tire, 700c. That's a perfectly "fat" 
> road tire. 
> The trail though is only 29mm, that's 70mm of fork rake ! Wow. 
>
>  
> https://rawlandcycles.blogspot.com/2012/07/nordavinden-geometry-and-specifications.html
>
> Bikeinsights doesn't have images for the two frames, but the numbers alone 
> tells the story. 
>
>
> https://bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=5c1bfbe96aaa140017a7c684,5c55ee6e40d7a00017e4e2d

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/0f48e50e-deef-45c8-b033-8e1399e83217n%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Garth]

So it appears Max the Rawland is actually 59cm, center to top, 57.5mm 
center to center. So it's just shy of your Ram. Not an issue. I compared 
the two and if someone asked me if it's a suitable fit based on their 
comparable Ram size, I'd have to say yes. 

The Ram is a mere 13mm higher in stack height, center of the BB to the 
horizontal center-top of the head tube. 
The reach is within 3mm, so negligible . 
The Rawland has a 1/2 degree steeper seat tube angle, which accounts for 
like 6-7mm more forward placement of the top center of the seat tube in 
relation to the center BB, but I recall you don't have your saddles slammed 
all the way back so you have plenty of room on the rails. 

Head tube angles are the same 73d and the upsloping TT is within 1/2d. 
BB drop is within 2mm. 
The Rawland link says it's 35mm max tire, 700c. That's a perfectly "fat" 
road tire. 
The trail though is only 29mm, that's 70mm of fork rake ! Wow. 

 
https://rawlandcycles.blogspot.com/2012/07/nordavinden-geometry-and-specifications.html

Bikeinsights doesn't have images for the two frames, but the numbers alone 
tells the story. 

https://bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=5c1bfbe96aaa140017a7c684,5c55ee6e40d7a00017e4e2d

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/08833ae9-aef8-49a1-8e5b-8ff7fc58a8cbn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[MCT]

Max,

If the nut goes into the brake bridge or fork it is recessed.  If the nut 
sits on the brake bridge or fork, then it is nutted.

Matt in OKC

On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 4:36:23 PM UTC-5 maxcr wrote:

> Stephen,
>
> I just saw the R559 on VO, thanks for the tip, at $38 it's worth it even 
> if I end up reverting back to my 700 setup.
>
> If I were to go down the R559 path, do I need recessed mount or the 
> traditional nylock nutted mount for the Ram? I never know these things.
>
> Thanks
> Max
>
> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 11:11:48 PM UTC-4 Stephen wrote:
>
>> You would probably need Paul Racers, or some other long reach caliper 
>> like the tektro r559 (which is on major sale at velo orange right now i 
>> think). The medium racers would theoretically fit 700c rims on the ram.
>>
>> Sounds like a good plan Max. I feel like I tend to get caught up 'chasing 
>> the dragon', always wanting, unrelenting bike desire. Switching things up 
>> on the current bike tends to scratch the itch for me, at least for a little 
>> while.
>>
>> cheers,
>>
>> Stephen
>>
>> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 10:37:15 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:
>>
>>> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>>>
>>> Jock
>>>
>>> [image: RAMB.png]
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>>
 I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
 Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from 
 my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, 
 with 
 stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a 
 bike 
 that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
 exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
 stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.

 But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.

 On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
 wrote:

> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>
>
> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
> review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS 
> who 
> owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike 
> he’s 
> ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>
> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to 
> make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and 
> the Ram which would be the one to go? 
>
> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds 
> with no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
> although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>
> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I 
> don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about 
> the 
> LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few 
> options 
> on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in 
> the 
> middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying 
> weight 
> or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>
> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to 
> replace my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I 
> can 
> get a more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though 
> I 
> love it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from 
> my 
> Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>
> Thanks for your thoughts
>
> Max
>
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
> .
>


 -- 

 -
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

 -

 Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
 services.


 -

 *When thou didst not, savage,*

 *Know thine own meaning, but wouldst 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[maxcr]

Stephen,

I just saw the R559 on VO, thanks for the tip, at $38 it's worth it even if 
I end up reverting back to my 700 setup.

If I were to go down the R559 path, do I need recessed mount or the 
traditional nylock nutted mount for the Ram? I never know these things.

Thanks
Max

On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 11:11:48 PM UTC-4 Stephen wrote:

> You would probably need Paul Racers, or some other long reach caliper like 
> the tektro r559 (which is on major sale at velo orange right now i think). 
> The medium racers would theoretically fit 700c rims on the ram.
>
> Sounds like a good plan Max. I feel like I tend to get caught up 'chasing 
> the dragon', always wanting, unrelenting bike desire. Switching things up 
> on the current bike tends to scratch the itch for me, at least for a little 
> while.
>
> cheers,
>
> Stephen
>
> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 10:37:15 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:
>
>> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>>
>> Jock
>>
>> [image: RAMB.png]
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
>>> Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from 
>>> my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, with 
>>> stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a bike 
>>> that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
>>> exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
>>> stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.
>>>
>>> But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
 become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust


 I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
 review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS 
 who 
 owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s 
 ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.

 Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to 
 make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and 
 the Ram which would be the one to go? 

 How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with 
 no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
 although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.

 Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I 
 don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the 
 LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few 
 options 
 on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in 
 the 
 middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying 
 weight 
 or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
 occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.

 The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace 
 my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a 
 more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love 
 it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my 
 Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.

 Thanks for your thoughts

 Max


 -- 
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
 Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
 To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
 an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
 To view this discussion on the web visit 
 https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
 .

>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> -
>>> Patrick Moore
>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
>>> services.
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> *When thou didst not, savage,*
>>>
>>> *Know thine own meaning, but wouldst gabble like*
>>>
>>> *A thing most brutish, I endowed thy purposes*
>>>
>>> *With words that made them known.*
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>>
>> To view this 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[maxcr]

Thanks again for the latest comments. I realized I had a mistake on the 
650b tires I have to try out, they are Loup Loup Pass not Bon Jon Pass 
tires.

Coal Bee Rye Anne, new tires for the Ram is an easy first step and probably 
the way to go. I hadn't considered my 180 cranks might be a problem if I go 
with a 650b wheel conversion and I really don't want to swap out the 
cranks. I had found a couple of used Bon Jon Pass but in standard casing 
for $100 and I'm wondering if it's worth trying those or should I splurge 
for new ones with the extra light casing to make the difference/contrast a 
bit more stark?

Patrick from an old thread 
 
FullyLugged 
said: "The Ram came as a complete with 32mm Panaracer Pasela tires.  It 
will also fit fenders with this tire.  Without fenders, the Pasela 1 1/2" 
fits easily. This applies to both the 622 and 559 rim editions, EXCEPT for 
the early orange batch that came in with the rear brake bridge in too low. 
 The 622 converts nicely to 584 with bigger tires and the 559 can also run 
571 wheels with smaller max tire sizes."

I think my orange one has the rear brake bridge limitation though. 

Garth, thanks for your comments and I think you might be spot on. Maybe I 
need to try something "radically" different only to find out that what I 
had is what I always wanted, or perhaps that a completely different flavor 
is fun to change things up. Oh and I am aware of the front load 
"requirement" of low trail bikes and was planning to run either a BagsxBird 
front bag with a Shovel Research Rod Steward or a Nitto front rack with a 
basket on it. As for trying a different fork on the Ram, I don't think I 
want to go in that direction - thanks for the thought though. Also, thanks 
for sending over the Nordavinden. Hard to tell with fit, I'm no pro and 
always find it hard to find a good fit given my long legs for my height. I 
think the XL is probably a better size for my 90.5 pbh but I could probably 
make that 58 fit with stem/saddle adjustments. I'm just unsure I'm ready to 
start investigating and learning about another brand. If I buy something, 
I'm pretty set on the Crust LB.

What's clear to me now is that I should sell or trade the Ram just yet. I 
have limited time these days, so we'll see when I get around to making some 
of the changes we've discussed.

Max


On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 3:44:10 PM UTC-4 Garth wrote:

> Max, While I initially thought trying out different forks or tires may 
> satisfy, I think it's entirely possible your just "branded out" on the 
> Rivendell design and the so-called "handling" characteristics, whatever the 
> heck that means if anything. You know, like too many chocolate bars from 
> the same factory ! 
>
> So I'd be inclined to say yeah, try a whole new take on "the bicycle" from 
> someone else, and in doing so you just might find you see and experience 
> the Riv's you have in a different way, or be inspired to change something 
> about how they're fitted. I wouldn't necessarily sell the Ram unless/until 
> you were sure you like whatever frame you got. Even then, after trying 
> something else, it may spark something creative to do with Ram. Maybe the 
> bars, maybe your positioning, who's to say at this point. I know I'm set to 
> put some  low positioned Zipp XPLR drop bars on my Bombadil with a narrow 
> road saddle. Since going back to low drop bars on my Franklin custom, 
> getting a nice narrow road saddle and moving it very far forward from where 
> it had been, when I hop on the Bomba it feels awkward and unrideable the 
> way it's setup currently. How you're positioned on a bike can have quite an 
> effect on how it feels and handles. 
>
> I can't say the Crust frame you mentioned in good choice for you or not as 
> I know nothing of them. Also, it's been mentioned here how low trail bikes 
> like a front load of some kind, I assume you knew this and are okay with it 
> ?  Also, you needn't get a low trail bike for a completely different 
> handing/ride/fun experience. The difference between my Bomba and Franklin 
> are so totally different, and the Franklin is very much in the "neutral" 
> handling category with a much higher BB, which is my preference. Yes, I 
> feel a little more "atop" of the frame and I like it that way, it's like 
> sitting atop a fine race horse, hell yeah, giddy up and go horsey !  In 
> that vein, in a relative whim after working out the specs I bought a VO 
> Rando frame during it's presale. I can't speak to how it rides as it's 
> still in the box, but I look forward to hopping on that race horse too :)  
> Point being, there's lots of chocolate bar factories to choose from ! 
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Garth]

Hey Max, does this fit you ? I just saw it on Bike Recyclery for $599. 
https://bikerecyclery.com/58cm-l-rawland-nordavinden-frameset-navy-chris-king-nothreadset-700c-barely-ridden-near-mint/


-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/5794a06d-9fe3-41fe-a8e2-0a749e537f5dn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Garth]

Max, While I initially thought trying out different forks or tires may 
satisfy, I think it's entirely possible your just "branded out" on the 
Rivendell design and the so-called "handling" characteristics, whatever the 
heck that means if anything. You know, like too many chocolate bars from 
the same factory ! 

So I'd be inclined to say yeah, try a whole new take on "the bicycle" from 
someone else, and in doing so you just might find you see and experience 
the Riv's you have in a different way, or be inspired to change something 
about how they're fitted. I wouldn't necessarily sell the Ram unless/until 
you were sure you like whatever frame you got. Even then, after trying 
something else, it may spark something creative to do with Ram. Maybe the 
bars, maybe your positioning, who's to say at this point. I know I'm set to 
put some  low positioned Zipp XPLR drop bars on my Bombadil with a narrow 
road saddle. Since going back to low drop bars on my Franklin custom, 
getting a nice narrow road saddle and moving it very far forward from where 
it had been, when I hop on the Bomba it feels awkward and unrideable the 
way it's setup currently. How you're positioned on a bike can have quite an 
effect on how it feels and handles. 

I can't say the Crust frame you mentioned in good choice for you or not as 
I know nothing of them. Also, it's been mentioned here how low trail bikes 
like a front load of some kind, I assume you knew this and are okay with it 
?  Also, you needn't get a low trail bike for a completely different 
handing/ride/fun experience. The difference between my Bomba and Franklin 
are so totally different, and the Franklin is very much in the "neutral" 
handling category with a much higher BB, which is my preference. Yes, I 
feel a little more "atop" of the frame and I like it that way, it's like 
sitting atop a fine race horse, hell yeah, giddy up and go horsey !  In 
that vein, in a relative whim after working out the specs I bought a VO 
Rando frame during it's presale. I can't speak to how it rides as it's 
still in the box, but I look forward to hopping on that race horse too :)  
Point being, there's lots of chocolate bar factories to choose from ! 

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/547be304-01b0-47a9-80f7-9d9a1a3a3e67n%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Garth]

Coal Bee Rye Anne,  I was going to mention the Soma low trail fork too, but 
then I checked the stock and it's still not in stock and hasn't been for at 
least the 8-9 months I have been checking. The disc version is in stock 
however, so I doubt it has anything to do with supply issues for the 
threaded versions. It seems there are some items or sizes of items they no 
longer stock but aren't deleted from the system for whatever reason. I 
found this out by emailing them as the availability of an item. 


-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/79d452dd-fa1a-4df2-ab78-d84cdd93146fn%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[John Dewey]

PS: Supple Vitesse @ 33mm also fit quite well. Just enough wiggle room to 
make me comfortable.



On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 8:53:29 AM UTC-7 John Dewey wrote:

> Well, Patrick, I just took a closer look at mine and I think it just 
> might. Of course, a lot depends on the rim. I have Open Pro on mine, with 
> 32mm Conti 5000s and 45mm SKS mudguards / fenders. Not lots of room to 
> spare, mind you, but the fit is just about perfect. So take off the fenders 
> and install 38mm tires I think might be a good swap.
>
> Jock
>
> On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 7:57:21 AM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> One more remark, FWIW, and not to discourage you from a 650B conversion: 
>> The Ram handled very nicely with 700C 32 mm tires; expect a slight 
>> reduction in diameter and an increase in width and a decrease in pressure 
>> to have effects on handling. Trail and flop #s might also change a bit 
>> depending on the width of the new tires.
>>
>> The Bon Jon Passes might be the best option.
>>
>> Question to all: Can a Ram, at least the second gen blue Rams, take 38s? 
>> Mine took 31s with fenders, just, so it might take 38s; but my Riv custom 
>> with single pivot takes 39s, crowding at chainstays -- ~2 mm clearance per 
>> side with 39 mm actual tire -- rather than under brake or crown.
>>
>> Again, FWIW.
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 17, 2023 at 8:37 PM John Dewey  wrote:
>>
>>> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>>>
>>> Jock
>>>
>>> [image: RAMB.png]
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>>
 I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
 Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from 
 my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, 
 with 
 stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a 
 bike 
 that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
 exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
 stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.

 But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.

 On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
 wrote:

> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>
>
> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
> review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS 
> who 
> owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike 
> he’s 
> ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>
> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to 
> make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and 
> the Ram which would be the one to go? 
>
> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds 
> with no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
> although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>
> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I 
> don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about 
> the 
> LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few 
> options 
> on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in 
> the 
> middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying 
> weight 
> or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>
> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to 
> replace my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I 
> can 
> get a more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though 
> I 
> love it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from 
> my 
> Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>
> Thanks for your thoughts
>
> Max
>
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
> .
>


 -- 

 -
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

 -

 Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[John Dewey]

Well, Patrick, I just took a closer look at mine and I think it just might. 
Of course, a lot depends on the rim. I have Open Pro on mine, with 32mm 
Conti 5000s and 45mm SKS mudguards / fenders. Not lots of room to spare, 
mind you, but the fit is just about perfect. So take off the fenders and 
install 38mm tires I think might be a good swap.

Jock

On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 7:57:21 AM UTC-7 Patrick Moore wrote:

> One more remark, FWIW, and not to discourage you from a 650B conversion: 
> The Ram handled very nicely with 700C 32 mm tires; expect a slight 
> reduction in diameter and an increase in width and a decrease in pressure 
> to have effects on handling. Trail and flop #s might also change a bit 
> depending on the width of the new tires.
>
> The Bon Jon Passes might be the best option.
>
> Question to all: Can a Ram, at least the second gen blue Rams, take 38s? 
> Mine took 31s with fenders, just, so it might take 38s; but my Riv custom 
> with single pivot takes 39s, crowding at chainstays -- ~2 mm clearance per 
> side with 39 mm actual tire -- rather than under brake or crown.
>
> Again, FWIW.
>
> On Tue, Oct 17, 2023 at 8:37 PM John Dewey  wrote:
>
>> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>>
>> Jock
>>
>> [image: RAMB.png]
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
>>> Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from 
>>> my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, with 
>>> stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a bike 
>>> that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
>>> exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
>>> stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.
>>>
>>> But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
 become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust


 I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
 review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS 
 who 
 owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s 
 ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.

 Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to 
 make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and 
 the Ram which would be the one to go? 

 How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with 
 no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
 although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.

 Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I 
 don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the 
 LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few 
 options 
 on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in 
 the 
 middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying 
 weight 
 or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
 occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.

 The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace 
 my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a 
 more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love 
 it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my 
 Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.

 Thanks for your thoughts

 Max


 -- 
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
 Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
 To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
 an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
 To view this discussion on the web visit 
 https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
 .

>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> -
>>> Patrick Moore
>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
>>> services.
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> *When thou didst not, savage,*
>>>
>>> *Know thine own meaning, but wouldst gabble like*
>>>
>>> *A thing most brutish, I endowed thy purposes*
>>>
>>> *With words that made them known.*

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

Grrr - darn auto correct and typos - should have read  *"I considered 
grabbing a Soma Champs Elysees road fork during ONE OF Soma’s frequent 
sales."*

On Wednesday, October 18, 2023 at 10:27:08 AM UTC-4 Coal Bee Rye Anne wrote:

> It might be worth trying alternative 700c tires in the Ram’s current state 
> first, especially if you can find second hand extra lights to compare 
> before switching out brakes, etc.  Not to discourage your conversion (I 
> would never discourage bike experimentation!) but just thinking that’s a 
> simpler initial change or first step before doing a full conversion with 
> more component changes.
>
> I was similarly low trail curious and opportunistically picked up a Crust 
> LB disc fork for my single speed road bike when Crust HQ was briefly local 
> to me in NJ and very close to my workplace.  This is the v1 disc 1-1/8 
> threadless thru axle version.  I ended up just keeping this bike 700x33 
> after finding an affordable 700c 12mm thru axle disc wheel to use with 
> existing tires.  I noticed less difference in handling between forks than I 
> did in eliminating toe overlap and the difference in brake feel.  
> Obviously, handling preferences are highly subjective and beyond the scope 
> of your query so no further comment on that.  But I will say that the 
> overlap and a desire for front loading is mostly what made me want to try a 
> longer offset fork to begin with, as I found the existing toe overlap 
> rather annoying when doing low speed maneuvers on our shared and 
> occasionally busy multiuse trails while riding as fixed gear.  I also 
> wanted to be able to use this more as a utility bike as opposed to just a 
> stripped down fun bike.  Sadly, this one is now sidelined with an injury 
> with repairs still undetermined.
>
> I enjoyed riding this bike fixed in the colder months so going with the 
> disc fork and brakeless in the rear offered other benefits with 
> mud/snow/debris clearance and less parts to accumulate grime.  I considered 
> grabbing a Soma Champs Elysees road fork during be if Soma’s frequent 
> sales.  This would have worked with my existing rim brakes and QR & bolt on 
> wheels but I didn’t really want shiny chrome and the Crust fork offered a 
> variety of front rack mount options.
>
> Soma does offer 1” threadless low trail conversion forks, if you actually 
> wanted to test low trail on the Ram without going full custom.  I think 
> they were sold out in the 1” options last I recall but maybe they will 
> restock soon?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 18, 2023, Garth  wrote:
>
>> There have been riders known to have a separate low trail fork made for 
>> their Rivendell. One from the likes of Jack of Franklin Frames namesake 
>> could be an option as he doesn't charge silly prices for such things. I'd 
>> keep it 700c myself as I don't see a wider tire on a road bike adding 
>> anything but more weight and air resistance. In full disclosure I never 
>> bought into the sales promotions for either 650b or wider tires than 
>> necessary for a given surface. 
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 11:53:32 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> My understanding of this stuff is the r559 works for 650b conversions 
>>> that started with short-reach calipers. Ram came with medium-reach and need 
>>> a rally long arm to reach 650b rims. I don't think r559 or Medium Racer 
>>> will do it, the long Racers might. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 8:11:48 PM UTC-7 Stephen wrote:
>>>
 You would probably need Paul Racers, or some other long reach caliper 
 like the tektro r559 (which is on major sale at velo orange right now i 
 think). The medium racers would theoretically fit 700c rims on the ram.

 Sounds like a good plan Max. I feel like I tend to get caught up 
 'chasing the dragon', always wanting, unrelenting bike desire. Switching 
 things up on the current bike tends to scratch the itch for me, at least 
 for a little while.

 cheers,

 Stephen

 On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 10:37:15 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:

> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>
> Jock
>
> [image: RAMB.png]
>
> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  
> wrote:
>
>> I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
>> Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but 
>> from 
>> my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, 
>> with 
>> stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a 
>> bike 
>> that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
>> exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
>> stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.
>>
>> But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Garth]

There have been riders known to have a separate low trail fork made for 
their Rivendell. One from the likes of Jack of Franklin Frames namesake 
could be an option as he doesn't charge silly prices for such things. I'd 
keep it 700c myself as I don't see a wider tire on a road bike adding 
anything but more weight and air resistance. In full disclosure I never 
bought into the sales promotions for either 650b or wider tires than 
necessary for a given surface. 


On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 11:53:32 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> My understanding of this stuff is the r559 works for 650b conversions that 
> started with short-reach calipers. Ram came with medium-reach and need a 
> rally long arm to reach 650b rims. I don't think r559 or Medium Racer 
> will do it, the long Racers might. 
>
> Joe Bernard 
>
> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 8:11:48 PM UTC-7 Stephen wrote:
>
>> You would probably need Paul Racers, or some other long reach caliper 
>> like the tektro r559 (which is on major sale at velo orange right now i 
>> think). The medium racers would theoretically fit 700c rims on the ram.
>>
>> Sounds like a good plan Max. I feel like I tend to get caught up 'chasing 
>> the dragon', always wanting, unrelenting bike desire. Switching things up 
>> on the current bike tends to scratch the itch for me, at least for a little 
>> while.
>>
>> cheers,
>>
>> Stephen
>>
>> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 10:37:15 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:
>>
>>> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>>>
>>> Jock
>>>
>>> [image: RAMB.png]
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>>
 I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
 Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from 
 my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, 
 with 
 stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a 
 bike 
 that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
 exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
 stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.

 But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.

 On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
 wrote:

> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>
>
> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
> review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS 
> who 
> owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike 
> he’s 
> ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>
> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to 
> make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and 
> the Ram which would be the one to go? 
>
> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds 
> with no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
> although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>
> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I 
> don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about 
> the 
> LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few 
> options 
> on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in 
> the 
> middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying 
> weight 
> or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>
> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to 
> replace my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I 
> can 
> get a more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though 
> I 
> love it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from 
> my 
> Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>
> Thanks for your thoughts
>
> Max
>
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
> .
>


 -- 

 -
 Patrick Moore
 Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Joe Bernard]

My understanding of this stuff is the r559 works for 650b conversions that 
started with short-reach calipers. Ram came with medium-reach and need a 
rally long arm to reach 650b rims. I don't think r559 or Medium Racer 
will do it, the long Racers might. 

Joe Bernard 

On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 8:11:48 PM UTC-7 Stephen wrote:

> You would probably need Paul Racers, or some other long reach caliper like 
> the tektro r559 (which is on major sale at velo orange right now i think). 
> The medium racers would theoretically fit 700c rims on the ram.
>
> Sounds like a good plan Max. I feel like I tend to get caught up 'chasing 
> the dragon', always wanting, unrelenting bike desire. Switching things up 
> on the current bike tends to scratch the itch for me, at least for a little 
> while.
>
> cheers,
>
> Stephen
>
> On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 10:37:15 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:
>
>> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>>
>> Jock
>>
>> [image: RAMB.png]
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The 
>>> Ram is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from 
>>> my experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, with 
>>> stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a bike 
>>> that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
>>> exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
>>> stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.
>>>
>>> But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
 become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust


 I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
 review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS 
 who 
 owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s 
 ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.

 Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to 
 make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and 
 the Ram which would be the one to go? 

 How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with 
 no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
 although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.

 Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I 
 don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the 
 LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few 
 options 
 on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in 
 the 
 middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying 
 weight 
 or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
 occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.

 The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace 
 my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a 
 more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love 
 it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my 
 Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.

 Thanks for your thoughts

 Max


 -- 
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
 Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
 To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
 an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
 To view this discussion on the web visit 
 https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
 .

>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>>> -
>>> Patrick Moore
>>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
>>> services.
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> *When thou didst not, savage,*
>>>
>>> *Know thine own meaning, but wouldst gabble like*
>>>
>>> *A thing most brutish, I endowed thy purposes*
>>>
>>> *With words that made them known.*
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>>
>> To view this discussion on 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Stephen]

You would probably need Paul Racers, or some other long reach caliper like 
the tektro r559 (which is on major sale at velo orange right now i think). 
The medium racers would theoretically fit 700c rims on the ram.

Sounds like a good plan Max. I feel like I tend to get caught up 'chasing 
the dragon', always wanting, unrelenting bike desire. Switching things up 
on the current bike tends to scratch the itch for me, at least for a little 
while.

cheers,

Stephen

On Tuesday, October 17, 2023 at 10:37:15 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:

> Well, I totally agree with Patrick.
>
> Jock
>
> [image: RAMB.png]
>
> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 7:42 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The Ram 
>> is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from my 
>> experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, with 
>> stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a bike 
>> that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
>> exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
>> stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.
>>
>> But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.
>>
>> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
>>> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>>>
>>>
>>> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s 
>>> review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS who 
>>> owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s 
>>> ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>>>
>>> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to make 
>>> room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and the 
>>> Ram which would be the one to go? 
>>>
>>> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with 
>>> no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
>>> although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>>>
>>> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I don’t 
>>> want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the LB? Or 
>>> about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few options on the 
>>> more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in the middle 
>>> a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying weight or to 
>>> go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
>>> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>>>
>>> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace 
>>> my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a 
>>> more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love 
>>> it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my 
>>> Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>>>
>>> Thanks for your thoughts
>>>
>>> Max
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> -
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>> -
>>
>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
>> services.
>>
>>
>> -
>>
>> *When thou didst not, savage,*
>>
>> *Know thine own meaning, but wouldst gabble like*
>>
>> *A thing most brutish, I endowed thy purposes*
>>
>> *With words that made them known.*
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgtL9PMdwC5ngbKTzF0bK1UrieTRUAuqkv-ghuep9tJrWA%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Max Faingezicht]

Thanks to everyone who chimed in and for the couple of people that sent me private messages. I really appreciate your thoughts and experience.You’ve convinced me to give a 650b conversion a try. Since I plan to ride mostly without much of a load the Ram might actually be the better option to begin with. Perhaps my high-ish pressure 33.3 jack browns need to be swapped for wider, lower pressure and more supple 650b’s to get to Ram nirvana - I think it’s worth a shot. I’ll borrow the light 650b with extra light bon jon pass tires from my Wilbury and report back.Now let me be lazy as this has probably already been discussed a million times in older threads: should I use a set of Paul Racers or the Racers medium for the conversion? Or is something else recommended? (I already have Paul’s there). Any other tips or things to watch out for before I end up with two half built frames?Btw, I do love the bike, the orange paint and the lugs, but as always perhaps I was chasing imaginary greener pastures that won’t come from new frames but from appreciating and riding the amazing bikes I already own.Thanks againMaxPS. I’m still low trail / planing curious and want to test ride an LB at some pointOn Oct 17, 2023, at 1:50 AM, Joe Bernard  wrote:I've owned a Ram and Romulus (basically the same frame) and both rode great unloaded. I briefly had a Lightning Bolt Disc which I greatly regret selling, I agree that it's kinda bizarre without a load on the front. Very twitchy, it didn't feel safe to me. Joe Bernard On Monday, October 16, 2023 at 9:47:34 PM UTC-7 Josiah Anderson wrote:I don't think of the Lightning Bolt as a no-load bike and would not recommend it as such. I occasionally ride mine that way, but it's not ideal because it gets really light in the front end. Where it shines is carrying a front load while still handling like a race bike. If you want that, I really like my Lightning Bolt and would recommend one, and I think it rides as well and is at least very close to as fast as the best race bikes. But if what you want aesthetically is a stripped down go-fast bike, a Lightning Bolt is not the bike for the job IMO. A Malocchio might be better, or a Nordavinden for the low trail if you can find one. I've never ridden a Rambouillet, but I've ridden a whole lot of 70s and 80s road bikes and sport tourers, which are supposedly what the Ram was based on.Josiah Anderson Missoula, MT (And no, my frame is not bent, it's just weird distortion haha).Le dim. 15 oct. 2023 à 8:13 PM, Max Faingezicht  a écrit :Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust


I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s review in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS who owns one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s ever ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.

Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to make room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and the Ram which would be the one to go? 

How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.

Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I don’t want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the LB? Or about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few options on the more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in the middle a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying weight or to go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.

The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.

Thanks for your thoughts

Max


-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com.




-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/3mZh306jY8Q/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Joe Bernard]

I've owned a Ram and Romulus (basically the same frame) and both rode great 
unloaded. I briefly had a Lightning Bolt Disc which I greatly regret 
selling, I agree that it's kinda bizarre without a load on the front. Very 
twitchy, it didn't feel safe to me. 

Joe Bernard 

On Monday, October 16, 2023 at 9:47:34 PM UTC-7 Josiah Anderson wrote:

> I don't think of the Lightning Bolt as a no-load bike and would not 
> recommend it as such. I occasionally ride mine that way, but it's not ideal 
> because it gets really light in the front end. Where it shines is carrying 
> a front load while still handling like a race bike. If you want that, I 
> really like my Lightning Bolt and would recommend one, and I think it rides 
> as well and is at least very close to as fast as the best race bikes. But 
> if what you want aesthetically is a stripped down go-fast bike, a Lightning 
> Bolt is not the bike for the job IMO. A Malocchio might be better, or a 
> Nordavinden for the low trail if you can find one. I've never ridden a 
> Rambouillet, but I've ridden a whole lot of 70s and 80s road bikes and 
> sport tourers, which are supposedly what the Ram was based on.
>
> Josiah Anderson 
> Missoula, MT 
>
> (And no, my frame is not bent, it's just weird distortion haha).
>
> Le dim. 15 oct. 2023 à 8:13 PM, Max Faingezicht  a 
> écrit :
>
>> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
>> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>>
>>
>> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s review 
>> in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS who owns 
>> one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s ever 
>> ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>>
>> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to make 
>> room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and the 
>> Ram which would be the one to go? 
>>
>> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with 
>> no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
>> although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>>
>> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I don’t 
>> want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the LB? Or 
>> about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few options on the 
>> more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in the middle 
>> a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying weight or to 
>> go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
>> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>>
>> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace 
>> my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a 
>> more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love 
>> it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my 
>> Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>>
>> Thanks for your thoughts
>>
>> Max
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
>> .
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/13406fb0-decd-4091-b131-e99b20687b30n%40googlegroups.com.

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Stephen]

Hey Max,

I currently have a Ram, and used to have a SS Breakaway lighting bolt. Ram 
in ~62 or 63, LB in xl. I really liked both, but let the LB go because I 
was just trying to thin things out. Its not a perfect comparison tubeset 
wise, because they used beefier stuff on the breakaway versions, but i 
think the geometry is supposed to be the same, I rode it with 650b x 42 
tires w fenders, fairweather 'for cruise'. The handling on the LB is 
definitely 'quicker' than the ram, or other rivs. It was most noticeable 
when I had been riding riv geometry for a bit and then switched back, but 
when I road the LB exclusively I quickly got used to it. As I write this 
I'm thinking about how much I liked the bike and miss it a little bit. It 
was light (ish), and springy (though that may have been tires).  650 b felt 
quick. to accelerate. I had some difficulty achieving my preferred 
handlebar height since I cut the steerer too low and the level top tube. 
Wish I had set it up with drop bars while I had it, but was in a little bit 
of an anti drop phase. I'm starting to ramble.

Both bikes are awesome, but the rambouillet might be one of my all time 
favorites right now. Maybe I just wasn't a singlespeed guy. It is really 
nice to have a bike that handles differently than riv's in my opinion, fun 
to ride different things. If I were you I'd try to be patient and see if I 
could find someone to let me try theirs out, or try to land a used deal on 
crust classifieds. 

best,

stephen
On Sunday, October 15, 2023 at 10:42:13 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

> I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The Ram 
> is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from my 
> experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, with 
> stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a bike 
> that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram, 
> exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line 
> stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.
>
> But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.
>
> On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht  
> wrote:
>
>> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve 
>> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>>
>>
>> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s review 
>> in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS who owns 
>> one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s ever 
>> ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>>
>> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to make 
>> room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and the 
>> Ram which would be the one to go? 
>>
>> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with 
>> no racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB 
>> although I could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>>
>> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I don’t 
>> want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the LB? Or 
>> about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few options on the 
>> more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in the middle 
>> a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying weight or to 
>> go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the 
>> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>>
>> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace 
>> my jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a 
>> more spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love 
>> it: feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my 
>> Gallop or even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>>
>> Thanks for your thoughts
>>
>> Max
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> -
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
> -
>
> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
> services.
>
>
> -
>
> *When thou didst not, savage,*
>
> *Know thine own meaning, but wouldst gabble like*
>
> *A thing most brutish, I 

Re: [RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Patrick Moore]

I caution selling a proven nice Ram to buy a speculative nice LB. The Ram
is a very nice handling sport-tourer (I use the term lightly, but from my
experience with a 2nd gen blue Ram it rode very nicely unladen and, with
stiff racks, handled modestly heavy loads with sufficient aplomb for a bike
that is principally meant as a road bike. The Ram, or at least my Ram,
exhibits that signature Grant handling quality: unerring straight line
stability with "intuitive" turn-in; not twitchy, not sluggish.

But yah pays yer money and yah makes yer choice.

On Sun, Oct 15, 2023 at 8:13 PM Max Faingezicht 
wrote:

> Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve
> become very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust
>
>
> I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s review
> in BQ (thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS who owns
> one I think it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s ever
> ridden and he’s got some nice rides to compare.
>
> Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to make
> room for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and the
> Ram which would be the one to go?
>
> How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with no
> racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB although I
> could straddle an XL for a more French fit.
>
> Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I don’t
> want to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the LB? Or
> about the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few options on the
> more burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in the middle
> a wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying weight or to
> go single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the
> occasional gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.
>
> The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace my
> jack browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a more
> spirited feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love it:
> feel, color, weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my Gallop or
> even my Wilbury to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.
>
> Thanks for your thoughts
>
> Max
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com
> .
>


-- 
-
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
-

Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing
services.

-

*When thou didst not, savage,*

*Know thine own meaning, but wouldst gabble like*

*A thing most brutish, I endowed thy purposes*

*With words that made them known.*

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CALuTfgtL9PMdwC5ngbKTzF0bK1UrieTRUAuqkv-ghuep9tJrWA%40mail.gmail.com.

[RBW] Considering trading my Ram for a Lightning Bolt

[Max Faingezicht]

Recently I’ve been getting low trail curious or more specifically I’ve become 
very interested in the Lightning Bolt canti frame from Crust


I’ve read some reviews in the 650b and Bob groups, also read Jan’s review in BQ 
(thanks Eric!) and after speaking with a friend at the LBS who owns one I think 
it’s a worthy option. He said it’s the most fun bike he’s ever ridden and he’s 
got some nice rides to compare.

Sadly the deal at home is that one has to go out (Ram or Gallop) to make room 
for a new bike. Anyone here has experience with both the LB and the Ram which 
would be the one to go? 

How would it compare with my orange Ram (the lightest of my builds with no 
racks and 33.33 tires)? I have a 60 Ram and would buy a large LB although I 
could straddle an XL for a more French fit.

Im interested in hearing your impressions other than trail which I don’t want 
to get into a discussion about. What do you love/hate about the LB? Or about 
the Ram? I should also mention that I have quite a few options on the more 
burly side of things in my quiver: hunqa, bomba and more in the middle a 
wilbury. This is not a bike that I plan to use for carrying weight or to go 
single track riding. It’s mostly a road / pavement bike with the occasional 
gravel. I would use 42’s RH on it.

The other alternative I could try is getting RH extra lights to replace my jack 
browns on the Ram to give it another shot and see if I can get a more spirited 
feel. So far, it’s been a great bike but even though I love it: feel, color, 
weight, setup… I don’t think it’s far enough from my Gallop or even my Wilbury 
to make it the go-fast, no racks bike for me.

Thanks for your thoughts

Max


-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW 
Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/B9CF3D73-49EF-4FAA-AC9F-E305320C04FF%40gmail.com.