[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Johnny Alien]

Plus I just picked up a Saluki. Just waiting on it to ship to me.

On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 9:12:42 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:

> I would have bid but I don't think it would be a great fit size wise.  
> Shame because it went low!
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 4:34:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Bid on it, Johnny! I love the color, I have a soft spot for early 
>> solid-color Rivs with the barely visible speared Rivendell decal..very 
>> monochrome and anti-flash. Also love the period "from the catalogue" parts: 
>> Phil 6-speed rear hub and Suntour front, stem shifters. It doesn't get any 
>> more early Riv than this! 
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:19:47 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>
>>> 55 makes sense based on the photos.  I was looking at the size in the 
>>> "specifics" section.
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:15:23 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards 
 this is a 55 or 56cm frame. 

 Joe Bernard

 On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

> It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
> couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:
>
>> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very 
>> nice early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  
>> I've 
>> got one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great 
>> gravel, bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with 
>> racks, 
>> bags and a nice history.
>>
>>
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Johnny Alien]

I would have bid but I don't think it would be a great fit size wise.  
Shame because it went low!

On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 4:34:03 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Bid on it, Johnny! I love the color, I have a soft spot for early 
> solid-color Rivs with the barely visible speared Rivendell decal..very 
> monochrome and anti-flash. Also love the period "from the catalogue" parts: 
> Phil 6-speed rear hub and Suntour front, stem shifters. It doesn't get any 
> more early Riv than this! 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:19:47 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> 55 makes sense based on the photos.  I was looking at the size in the 
>> "specifics" section.
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:15:23 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards this 
>>> is a 55 or 56cm frame. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>>
 It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
 couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.

 On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:

> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very 
> nice early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  
> I've 
> got one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great 
> gravel, bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with 
> racks, 
> bags and a nice history.
>
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>


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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Steven Sweedler]

Agreed a beautiful All Rounder, nice find, Steve

On Tue, Jun 22, 2021 at 6:31 PM John in PDX  wrote:

> Agree, fairly low price for all included, and for an early model.  Here's
> one I've shared before, picked up last year around labor day.  Single color
> anti-flash...
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:44:51 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Sold for $1267 + 150 shipping. That's a CRAZY low price. Yikes!
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 1:34:03 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Bid on it, Johnny! I love the color, I have a soft spot for early
>>> solid-color Rivs with the barely visible speared Rivendell decal..very
>>> monochrome and anti-flash. Also love the period "from the catalogue" parts:
>>> Phil 6-speed rear hub and Suntour front, stem shifters. It doesn't get any
>>> more early Riv than this!
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:19:47 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>>
 55 makes sense based on the photos.  I was looking at the size in the
 "specifics" section.

 On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:15:23 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards
> this is a 55 or 56cm frame.
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I
>> couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:
>>
>>> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very
>>> nice early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  
>>> I've
>>> got one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great
>>> gravel, bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with 
>>> racks,
>>> bags and a nice history.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>>>
>>
>>> --
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> 
> .
>
-- 
Steven Sweedler
Plymouth, New Hampshire

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Joe Bernard]

Sold for $1267 + 150 shipping. That's a CRAZY low price. Yikes!



On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 1:34:03 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Bid on it, Johnny! I love the color, I have a soft spot for early 
> solid-color Rivs with the barely visible speared Rivendell decal..very 
> monochrome and anti-flash. Also love the period "from the catalogue" parts: 
> Phil 6-speed rear hub and Suntour front, stem shifters. It doesn't get any 
> more early Riv than this! 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:19:47 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> 55 makes sense based on the photos.  I was looking at the size in the 
>> "specifics" section.
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:15:23 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards this 
>>> is a 55 or 56cm frame. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>>
 It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
 couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.

 On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:

> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very 
> nice early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  
> I've 
> got one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great 
> gravel, bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with 
> racks, 
> bags and a nice history.
>
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Joe Bernard]

Bid on it, Johnny! I love the color, I have a soft spot for early 
solid-color Rivs with the barely visible speared Rivendell decal..very 
monochrome and anti-flash. Also love the period "from the catalogue" parts: 
Phil 6-speed rear hub and Suntour front, stem shifters. It doesn't get any 
more early Riv than this! 

Joe Bernard

On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:19:47 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

> 55 makes sense based on the photos.  I was looking at the size in the 
> "specifics" section.
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:15:23 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards this 
>> is a 55 or 56cm frame. 
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>
>>> It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
>>> couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:
>>>
 Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very 
 nice early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  I've 
 got one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great 
 gravel, bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with 
 racks, 
 bags and a nice history.


 https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

>>>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Johnny Alien]

55 makes sense based on the photos.  I was looking at the size in the 
"specifics" section.

On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 2:15:23 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards this 
> is a 55 or 56cm frame. 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:
>
>> It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
>> couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:
>>
>>> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very nice 
>>> early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  I've got 
>>> one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great gravel, 
>>> bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with racks, bags 
>>> and a nice history.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Joe Bernard]

The description says 54cm C-to-C ST, 57 TT. By Riv sizing standards this is 
a 55 or 56cm frame. 

Joe Bernard

On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 10:10:14 AM UTC-7 Johnny Alien wrote:

> It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
> couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.
>
> On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:
>
>> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very nice 
>> early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  I've got 
>> one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great gravel, 
>> bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with racks, bags 
>> and a nice history.
>>
>>
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder, early on on eBay

[Johnny Alien]

It says 21" for the frame but that doesn't look like a 53cm frame.  I 
couldn't get info on standover too. Could be quite a deal though.

On Tuesday, June 22, 2021 at 11:40:06 AM UTC-4 John in PDX wrote:

> Perhaps outed already, but there is a poorly photographed, but very nice 
> early Riv All Rounder on ebay with about 6 hours to go at $850.  I've got 
> one, it's awesome, clearance for 2.0 x 26" tires at least, a great gravel, 
> bike packing bike with nimble handling.  This one comes with racks, bags 
> and a nice history.
>
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/114848850767?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder Stripped Down

[Patrick Moore]

Rivendell probably used what they called their "short horizontals;" those
were their stock dropout in the beginning; my 1999 Joe Starck had them, the
they rather severely limited the amount of axle movement. I had to file 2-3
mm off the back ends for chain takeup with the gears I wanted; fortunately
a very little bit of horizontal space allows a a great deal of tooth
difference. I did have them replaced in 2017 -- 2018? -- with long ones.

On Sat, Feb 15, 2020 at 11:46 AM Marty Gierke, Stewartstown PA <
martinpgie...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Good eye. Not much horizontal travel on this dropout, and I like to keep
> it all the way back to give the tire as much room as possible. Will also
> make cog-swapping easier should I want to do that, or even run a second
> front ring.
>
> On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 1:16:41 PM UTC-5, Benz, Sunnyvale, CA
> wrote:
>>
>> It looks like you have a horizontal dropout All-Rounder, so why the Paul
>> Melvin device?
>>
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> 
> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder Stripped Down

[Joe Bernard]

Indeed, those Melvins are great for doing a two-speed with a big and bailout 
ring. I'm going to set my custom up that way with a front derailer. That's a 
nice AR!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder Stripped Down

[Marty Gierke, Stewartstown PA]

Good eye. Not much horizontal travel on this dropout, and I like to keep it 
all the way back to give the tire as much room as possible. Will also make 
cog-swapping easier should I want to do that, or even run a second front 
ring. 

On Saturday, February 15, 2020 at 1:16:41 PM UTC-5, Benz, Sunnyvale, CA 
wrote:
>
> It looks like you have a horizontal dropout All-Rounder, so why the Paul 
> Melvin device?
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder Stripped Down

[Benz, Sunnyvale, CA]

It looks like you have a horizontal dropout All-Rounder, so why the Paul 
Melvin device?

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[Jason Fuller]

I agree that Grant's bikes have continued to be at least a decade ahead of 
their time, throughout history, which is impressive but also has surely had 
a negative effect on sales. The 650B bikes that Grant was building in the 
early 2000's are hugely marketable now, but Grant has moved on to stuff 
that is outside that "marketable zone" instead. I would be surprised if 
today's Rivs aren't more widely coveted in a decade, long after Grant is 
profiting from them. Those handful of people who are willing to trust 
Grant's vision (ie, most everyone here) get to ride well ahead of the 
trendy wave. 

That being said, I also feel that Grant's old priorities are just as valid 
as his new priorities, even if the execution is a touch more elegant today. 
Sometimes I want to ride a bike that is extremely nimble, like my '92 XO-1. 
Being fun to ride is as valid a desire as being safe, and while of course 
they are not mutually exclusive, sometimes you've gotta take a little from 
one side to give to the other. 



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[RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[Mike Packard]

@iamkeith

Is the video of Grant speaking at Rivelo available online? Would like to watch 
that.

Thanks
Mike in Austin

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[iamkeith]

On Friday, December 27, 2019 at 9:46:53 AM UTC-7, Connor wrote:
>
> I always thought the XOs and early All-Rounders were way ahead of their 
> time. Perhaps too far ahead of their time? Back then 28 mm tires were 
> considered huge for road bikes. How times have changed! Question for those 
> who have one: Do Rat Trap Pass tires fit? Thanks!
>

I think it's hit or miss as to whether Rat Trap Pass tires fit.  Since they 
were all built as one-offs, it depends on  the vintage, builder and frame 
size.  They happen to fit fine on my 1999 60cm double-joe, but fender 
clearance gets a wee bit tight at the bottom of the seatstay bridge.

I just this morning watched the talk Grant gave at Rivelo a few weeks ago 
regarding the hillibikes.   He said something again along lines about the 
earliest Rivendells being not as mature or refined.  Although he says he's 
still proud of them, it almost sounded apologetic.  I never quite get that 
humbleness.   Or the resistance to building bigger bikes with small, 
funny-proportioned wheels.. My All Rounder probably doesn't ride a smooth 
or climb as well or handle trails as, say, a new MIT Atlantis  with longer 
chainstays  and slacker headtube and every other refinement but, no matter 
how many bikes I acquire, it's still the bike I always choose to grab for 
ride that is road based - rather asphalt or dirt.  The small wheels feel 
exactly the way I imagine a road bike is supposed to feel.




> On Saturday, November 23, 2019 at 5:29:59 PM UTC-8, Steven Sweedler wrote:
>>
>> The Pro’s Closet is selling a 26” wheeled AR on ebay
>>
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rivendell-All-Rounder-Gravel-Bike-Medium-Steel-26-Suntour-CX-5000-7-Speed/383280968408?hash=item593d5372d8:g:VBsAAOSwkbxd2G7o
>> Steve
>>
>> -- 
>> Steven Sweedler
>> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[Benz, Sunnyvale, CA]

On Friday, December 27, 2019 at 8:46:53 AM UTC-8, Connor wrote:
>
> I always thought the XOs and early All-Rounders were way ahead of their 
> time. Perhaps too far ahead of their time? Back then 28 mm tires were 
> considered huge for road bikes. How times have changed! Question for those 
> who have one: Do Rat Trap Pass tires fit?
>

Don’t know about XOs, but RTP fatties fit fine on my All Rounder. :)

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[Patrick Moore]

THey certainly won't fit on the '93 (canti), let alone '92 (caliper) XO-1.
And I doubt they'll fit on the All Rounder. For a nice budget ride
(alternative to 26" all road custom), consider a nice NORBA-type very late
'80s or very early '90s (pre-susp-fork) high quality hardtail. I "all
roundered" several of these, long before, alas, the Rat Trap Pass, and they
work very nicely with the right top tube, stem, and bar (I used upjutters
and various drop bars).

The XOs and All Rounder were ahead of their time, looking back from today's
gravel bikes, but they were also call-backs to an earlier period of 650B
fat tire all rounders and 700C all rounders with fatter tires; IOW a
throwback compared to the then-20 mm tire road fashion (I know; I once
installed 19 mm tires on my Falcon.)

I am now in fat-tire all rounder heaven with my custom 700C X 60/650B X 70
Matthews, but there is much to be said for 2 or 2 1/2" wide 559 wheels --
they are much more nimble compared to almost 30" tall fatties, IME, tho'
the tall wheels do roll over small bumps and soft spots better.

On Fri, Dec 27, 2019 at 9:46 AM Connor  wrote:

> I always thought the XOs and early All-Rounders were way ahead of their
> time. Perhaps too far ahead of their time? Back then 28 mm tires were
> considered huge for road bikes. How times have changed! Question for those
> who have one: Do Rat Trap Pass tires fit? Thanks!
>
> On Saturday, November 23, 2019 at 5:29:59 PM UTC-8, Steven Sweedler wrote:
>>
>> The Pro’s Closet is selling a 26” wheeled AR on ebay
>>
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rivendell-All-Rounder-Gravel-Bike-Medium-Steel-26-Suntour-CX-5000-7-Speed/383280968408?hash=item593d5372d8:g:VBsAAOSwkbxd2G7o
>> Steve
>>
>> --
>> Steven Sweedler
>> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>>
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> .
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---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[Connor]

I always thought the XOs and early All-Rounders were way ahead of their 
time. Perhaps too far ahead of their time? Back then 28 mm tires were 
considered huge for road bikes. How times have changed! Question for those 
who have one: Do Rat Trap Pass tires fit? Thanks!

On Saturday, November 23, 2019 at 5:29:59 PM UTC-8, Steven Sweedler wrote:
>
> The Pro’s Closet is selling a 26” wheeled AR on ebay
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rivendell-All-Rounder-Gravel-Bike-Medium-Steel-26-Suntour-CX-5000-7-Speed/383280968408?hash=item593d5372d8:g:VBsAAOSwkbxd2G7o
> Steve
>
> -- 
> Steven Sweedler
> Plymouth, New Hampshire
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder on ebay

[Jason Fuller]

Ug it's the perfect size for me, and it's basically my ideal 
commuter bike.  But I am nowhere near done paying off the Hillborne I 
bought only a month ago! 

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Oh I disagree about the derailer: it's pretty, it matches the vintage of the 
frame and it's derailing! No one will ever know I'm not shifting it 

You're boosting your Quickbeam? Excellent choice! Email me when you get a 
chance k, I'd like to hear about the motor and whatnot. 

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

['Abcyclehank' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Joe,
Much approved.  Only issue is that is to nice of a derailer to only serve as 
bling. Enjoy the gravel; enjoy the non-e Riv.  
Going to E-bike one of my Rivendells today; making an E-Ent.
Will let you know how it goes!  

Ryan “influenced by Joe’s e-converting bikes” Hankinson 
West Michigan

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[j.schwartz]

Bonus points for the Schrader valves!


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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Steven Sweedler]

I have RTP by Compass/RH, both regular and Extra light that measure 52 mm
wide, on Cliffhangers they go out to 55, my 2.35 Big Apples measure 58 mm
wide on Sun Rhyno Lite rims. Steve

On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 7:43 PM Kellie  wrote:

> I have 2.35 RTP on my Waterford Atlantis, and fenders!
>
> On Sunday, September 29, 2019 at 10:14:36 AM UTC-7, Jake P wrote:
>>
>> Craig, Joe,
>>
>> Confirm what sie tires yall are squeezing on these bikes? I can't seem to
>> fit anything larger than a 2.1
>>
>> Craig, those look like RTPs?? Suprised to see they fit!
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 1:50:23 AM UTC-5, Craig Montgomery
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> They were considered semi-custom. Grant had me take a bunch of
>>> measurements before we decided on the proper sizing. For example I got a
>>> shortened top tube. You could also choose length of head tube extension.
>>>
>>> [image: 1 Last minute check and set up.JPG]
>>>
>>>
>>> Craig in Tucson
>>>
>>> On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 11:32:36 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:

 Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack,
 and before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet
 carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops
 anymore.

 I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't
 match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm
 Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe
 this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv?

 Joe Bernard
 Novato CA.

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Steven Sweedler
Plymouth, New Hampshire

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Kellie]

I have 2.35 RTP on my Waterford Atlantis, and fenders!

On Sunday, September 29, 2019 at 10:14:36 AM UTC-7, Jake P wrote:
>
> Craig, Joe,
>
> Confirm what sie tires yall are squeezing on these bikes? I can't seem to 
> fit anything larger than a 2.1
>
> Craig, those look like RTPs?? Suprised to see they fit!
>
>
> On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 1:50:23 AM UTC-5, Craig Montgomery wrote:
>>
>> They were considered semi-custom. Grant had me take a bunch of 
>> measurements before we decided on the proper sizing. For example I got a 
>> shortened top tube. You could also choose length of head tube extension.
>>
>> [image: 1 Last minute check and set up.JPG]
>>
>>
>> Craig in Tucson
>>
>> On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 11:32:36 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
>>> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, 
>>> and before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
>>> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
>>> anymore. 
>>>
>>> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
>>> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
>>> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
>>> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv? 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>> Novato CA.  
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Yes indeed, Jake, I already chopped an inch off. Partially to stretch the reach 
a bit and partially to get those maddening flared ends off..my cromoly Boscos 
are a bit oversized and getting levers and grips on there was a project! 

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Jake P]

Wild!

BTW - I've found with my Boscos, they got much more comfortable when I
trimmed them down 3/4s an inch, and angled them a bt furhter down. The
top tube of my A/R is just too short to comfortable rock all 9(?) inches of
that back sweep! Really thinking about rocking some billies next. *Just
food for thought! LOVE that blue though!*

On Tue, Oct 8, 2019 at 7:44 AM Christopher Cote <
christopherjamesc...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Judas!
>
> Sorry, couldn't help myself, haha. Very nicely done. That's the classiest
> electric motorcycle with pedals anyone will ever see. Enjoy!
>
> Chris
>
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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Jim D Massachusetts]

Thanks Joe. Will look forward to some future ride 
descriptionsJim DMassachusetts

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Jim: The cost at the moment is high, all I'm seeing on searches is $1749, which 
is full price. I've seen them as low as $1400 this summer, though, so keep an 
eye out. I got mine used. (Keep in mind the whole motor-and-battery system is 
in the hub, a lot of low-price hub kits out there list motor and battery prices 
separately).

It's a torque-sensing pedal assist system which reacts to how hard you press 
the pedals. The best way to describe it is levels of tailwind: If you very 
lightly pedal, you'll get a light tailwind; mash the pedals and the wind gets 
much bigger. It's a nice experience because it feels like regular cycling, just 
augmented. 

This cycling experience can be modulated with the power settings, too. There's 
Zero, Eco, Standard and Turbo. I mostly ride in Standard which is a fair amount 
of boost on rolling terrain, but not like a giant motor hammering you down the 
road. I was out a while today, and into strong headwinds and up hills I just 
stayed in Standard and hammered the pedals..I worked up a bit of a sweat. Turbo 
I reserve for traffic when I would rather lead the cars than squeeze between 
them, or near the end of a ride when I'm tired and just want to blast home. 
Range is about 25-30 miles if I stay away from Turbo; I can easily kill the 
battery in 10 miles if I blast it the whole way..so I don't do that!

The nifty thing about this kit over others on the market is it's all 
self-contained, there's no looking for a place to mount the battery, no wires 
strung all over the frame. It's all in the wheel: you flip a switch on the 
wheel itself, then adjust power settings from the app on your phone (I have a 
Quad Lock mount on the bars). The app shows speed, power level and battery 
level; plus records the whole trip including a map trace of the ride. 

I'm very happy with it. I've owned more powerful (like stupid power up to 
40mph, this one tops out at 25) mid-drive kits that are quite the project to 
install and are kinda insane to ride..this one is more manageable for me as a 
cycling experience. A drawback is all the weight is in the back, it can feel a 
little odd until you get adapted. Also, I don't look forward to wrangling it 
off the bike to fix a flat, so I run a tough and heavy Schwalbe back there. My 
first attempt at flat fixing would be to pull the tube from the side of the rim 
and see if I can get the hole patched, but if push comes to shove I can flip 
the bike over and pull the wheel..I carry a 15mm PDW "butter knife" wrench for 
the axle nuts. 

I hope that's clear enough, holler if you have any more questions.  



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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Jim D Massachusetts]

Could you share a bit about how the wheel works and what it 
costs?Jim DMassachusetts

On Monday, October 7, 2019 at 7:21:34 PM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> It's electric! 
>
> On Sunday, September 29, 2019 at 11:47:40 AM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
> > Jake, I have 2.0 with fenders. I think 2.3 without is about the limit at 
> the fork, maybe a smidge more in the rear. That's a pretty A/R!
>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Christopher Cote]

Judas!

Sorry, couldn't help myself, haha. Very nicely done. That's the classiest 
electric motorcycle with pedals anyone will ever see. Enjoy!

Chris

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Craig Montgomery]

Yo Jake, I'm running RTP's. What are they, 2.3's? And there's still plenty
of room. Using VO 60mm fenders and they are about even with the edges of
the RTP's. I was running 650x42 Hetres and Gravel Kings but wanted to try a
fatter tire. First experiment was with 47mm Switchback Hills. They fit but
there was about 2-3 mm distance from the top of the tire to the seat stay
bridge. Deal breaker. Arizona monsoons are no fun without fenders. It's too
bad RTP's and Natchez Pass tires are the only good ones offered in 559. If
Jan ever decides to discontinue tires in this size we're screwed. See what
happens when you get spoiled.

Craig in Tucson

On Sun, Sep 29, 2019 at 10:14 AM Jake P  wrote:

> Craig, Joe,
>
> Confirm what sie tires yall are squeezing on these bikes? I can't seem to
> fit anything larger than a 2.1
>
> Craig, those look like RTPs?? Suprised to see they fit!
>
>
> On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 1:50:23 AM UTC-5, Craig Montgomery wrote:
>>
>> They were considered semi-custom. Grant had me take a bunch of
>> measurements before we decided on the proper sizing. For example I got a
>> shortened top tube. You could also choose length of head tube extension.
>>
>> [image: 1 Last minute check and set up.JPG]
>>
>>
>> Craig in Tucson
>>
>> On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 11:32:36 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
>>> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack,
>>> and before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet
>>> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops
>>> anymore.
>>>
>>> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't
>>> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm
>>> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe
>>> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv?
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>> Novato CA.
>>>
>>> --
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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Jake, I have 2.0 with fenders. I think 2.3 without is about the limit at the 
fork, maybe a smidge more in the rear. That's a pretty A/R!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Greg J]

Congrats!  That's my holy grail Riv also -- and exactly my size!

If you want to see the original catalogs/paraphernalia from those years, 
and are in Oakland/Berkeley, stop by sometime.  I have a bunch!  

Greg/Oakland

On Thursday, September 26, 2019 at 10:17:42 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Oh, first ride report: Light, maneuverable but tracks straight and true, 
> super fun. It's a Rivendell!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Oh, first ride report: Light, maneuverable but tracks straight and true, super 
fun. It's a Rivendell!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

https://photos.app.goo.gl/66TU9Ue4aGPijKyu9

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Ryan, I was just thinking that thought yesterday. A few months ago I had sold 
my MIT Atlantis frame and it was looking - for health reasons - like that 
Rivbikes chapter was closing. Then stuff happened and I saw that mid-stepover 
custom on Riv's site and plopped my deposit down..now this! 

It's going to be cool after all these years to have two lugged Rivs with 
"Rivendell" on the downtube (never had that before), and they're kinda bookends 
on RBW's 25th Anniversary. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

['Abcyclehank' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Joe,
I think this is the bees knees and an amazing score.  Funny how bikes come in 
sets like waves.  Unless that is something you and I just have in common with 
our ocean like brains searching for the perfect ride.  Looking forward to see 
the New Custom coming down the pipe for you.  Someday soon I could see myself 
with only 2 multi-geared Rivs.  I will always have my Quickbeam and the 
Hubbuhubbuh though.

Sincerely,
Ryan Hankinson
West Michigan 

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Thanks, Addison! I've always admired your A/R, it's gorgeous. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

['jeffrey kane' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Yep Mark -- perfectly stated and well understood. And yet, we fawn all over 
the simple Grant appointed 26" wide clearance level top tube model when it 
shows up. It feels like an ethos thing to me. I realize that the Atlantis 
got the nod for it ... but clearly, the All Rounder (and even the Hunq) 
still tug at the heart strings around here. 

On Wednesday, September 25, 2019 at 8:34:51 AM UTC-4, Mark Roland wrote:
>
> More than half the Riv lineup consists of all-rounders in various 
> configurations, including the Atlantis in 26" for many years. I would say 
> these bikes represent the design evolution of the all-rounder as 
> interpreted by G. Petersen.
>
> On Wed, Sep 25, 2019, 7:37 AM 'jeffrey kane' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com > wrote:
>
>> I've never understood why the All-Rounder doesn't have a permanent place 
>> in the line up. 
>>
>> On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 2:32:36 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
>>> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, 
>>> and before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
>>> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
>>> anymore. 
>>>
>>> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
>>> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
>>> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
>>> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv? 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>> Novato CA.  
>>>
>>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Addison Wilhite]

Indeed...I stopped by Riv a few years ago and test rode a Hunqapillar.
Loved it but realized I was pretty much riding my Allrounder which I've
written about extensively and posted here.  Of all of the early riv models
it strikes me as the most quintessentially Rivendell.  Nice find Joe!

http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/2013/01/rivendell-allrounder-jack-of-all.html


And the most recent configuration:
http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/2019/07/the-new-rivendell-configuration-and.html


Addison Wilhite, M.A.

Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 

*“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*

Educator: Professional Portfolio 

Blogger: Reno Rambler 



On Wed, Sep 25, 2019 at 5:34 AM Mark Roland 
wrote:

> More than half the Riv lineup consists of all-rounders in various
> configurations, including the Atlantis in 26" for many years. I would say
> these bikes represent the design evolution of the all-rounder as
> interpreted by G. Petersen.
>
> On Wed, Sep 25, 2019, 7:37 AM 'jeffrey kane' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> I've never understood why the All-Rounder doesn't have a permanent place
>> in the line up.
>>
>> On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 2:32:36 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
>>> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack,
>>> and before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet
>>> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops
>>> anymore.
>>>
>>> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't
>>> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm
>>> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe
>>> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv?
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>> Novato CA.
>>>
>>> --
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>> .
>>
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> .
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Mark Roland]

More than half the Riv lineup consists of all-rounders in various
configurations, including the Atlantis in 26" for many years. I would say
these bikes represent the design evolution of the all-rounder as
interpreted by G. Petersen.

On Wed, Sep 25, 2019, 7:37 AM 'jeffrey kane' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> I've never understood why the All-Rounder doesn't have a permanent place
> in the line up.
>
> On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 2:32:36 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack,
>> and before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet
>> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops
>> anymore.
>>
>> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't
>> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm
>> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe
>> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv?
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>> Novato CA.
>>
>> --
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

['jeffrey kane' via RBW Owners Bunch]

I've never understood why the All-Rounder doesn't have a permanent place in 
the line up. 

On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 2:32:36 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, and 
> before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
> anymore. 
>
> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv? 
>
> Joe Bernard
> Novato CA.  
>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Benz, Sunnyvale, CA]

On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 9:30:16 AM UTC-7, John H. wrote:
>
> Beautiful build. I've been thinking about running Campy ergo's of that 
> generation on my Sam. What's the jtek/cassette setup you have? How's it 
> shifting?
>

I don't know about Joe's build, but Campagnolo Ergopowers can usually be 
paired with Shimano non-Dyna-Sys rear derailleurs to shift cassettes that 
are N-2 speeds. For example, 10-speed Ergopowers with pretty much 
any non-Dyna-Sys Shimano rear derailleur will shift Shimano/SRAM 8-speed 
cassettes. 11-speed Ergopowers will also work with the same derailleurs to 
shift 9-speed Shimano/SRAM cassettes. No JTEK necessary.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

John: It's Campy 10 to Shimano 9. It shifted fine in the stand, but I didn't 
actually ride it. The shifters are off the bike now and someone's already 
offered to buy them, I can sell you the Jtek thingy if you want. 

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[John H.]

Beautiful build. I've been thinking about running Campy ergo's of that 
generation on my Sam. What's the jtek/cassette setup you have? How's it 
shifting?

John in Cambridge

On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 2:32:36 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, and 
> before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
> anymore. 
>
> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv? 
>
> Joe Bernard
> Novato CA.  
>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[John H.]

Beautiful build. I was thinking of running a similar shimergo setup on my Sam. 
What jtek + cassette combo are you running?

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[DHans]

The colors are awesome Joe. The matching colored seat post is classy.


On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 3:57:58 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Thanks, Hugh! It's a Holy Grail Riv for sure, especially to find one I can 
> fit. It's quite astonishingly light, I wasn't expecting that. It's going to 
> be fun!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Ooh, I've never seen that chart before. Yes, 52cm C-to-T, and a more accurate 
TT measurement does show 54.5. Nice sleuthing! 

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Benz, Sunnyvale, CA]

On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 11:32:36 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, and 
> before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
> anymore. 
>
> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv?
>

Are you measuring your ST C-T? I got my geometry data from here 
.
 
It appears that you get a choice of two TT lengths (see 5th column from 
left).

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Geez, I just noticed I have the QR lever on the wrong side on the front wheel. 
How many decades have I been working on bikes??

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[REC (Roberta)]

It's beautiful, Joe.  I cannot wait to see what your finished bike will 
look like and how you like this new electrified version.  I'm sure it will 
be MAH-velous!

On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 2:32:36 AM UTC-4, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, and 
> before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
> anymore. 
>
> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv? 
>
> Joe Bernard
> Novato CA.  
>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Paul: It's a very dark blue. I need to finish the build and get some pics in 
sunlight to show it. 

Rich S: Yep, still have a custom coming. This one is going to get a Copenhagen 
Wheel, the custom will be my non-juiced Riv.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[RichS]

Joe, this is a rare bird, especially since it has a 52 seat tube. Nice find 
- congratulations!

You still have a custom in the works? 

Best,
Rich in ATL



On Tuesday, September 24, 2019 at 9:54:40 AM UTC-4, Paul Richardson wrote:
>
> very handsome indeed.  love that blue.  thanks for sharing.
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Paul Richardson]

or if it's black i love the black.  i'm looking again and i can't really 
tell!  great color!!!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Paul Richardson]

very handsome indeed.  love that blue.  thanks for sharing.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Joe Bernard]

Thanks, Hugh! It's a Holy Grail Riv for sure, especially to find one I can fit. 
It's quite astonishingly light, I wasn't expecting that. It's going to be fun!

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder

[Hugh Smitham]

That's a beauty Joe.

On Monday, September 23, 2019 at 11:32:36 PM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Here's the first shots of my new-to-me A/R sans front fender and rack, and 
> before I upright it with Boscos. It's a bummer I can't use those sweet 
> carbon Campy brifters, but alas my arthritic wrists won't put up with drops 
> anymore. 
>
> I'm curious about the sizing. The early Reader geometry chart doesn't 
> match it at all, this one has a 52cm ST, 55cm TT, which mimics the 52cm 
> Bstone XO-1. Based on the serial number (what I can see of it) I believe 
> this was built in 1997, did Waterford ever do custom A/Rs for Riv? 
>
> Joe Bernard
> Novato CA.  
>
>

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder at the Beach

[Marty Gierke, Stewartstown PA]

It’s a Pletscher indeed. Drilled a center hole and it matched up nicely to the 
brake bridge, which had a squared center detail. Nitto draw bolts and struts 
replaced the OEM riveted struts and allowed the rack to sit dead level. I could 
file a bit off the underside where the now absent spring clip sat, but there’s 
room for the Big Bens, so I’ll probably just leave it. For me, it’s the curve 
at the front that sort of follows the tire that makes it feel just right. The 
front rack may not be needed at all, but it looks good, and you never know. 

Marty

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder at the Beach

['John Hawrylak' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Marty

I always found it windy in 1 direction on route 1 and was glad to have a 
lower gear going into the wind.  Nice picture of the new bridge. 

Is the rack the Plestcher model S you modified for Nitto drawbolt and 
mounting the front to rack mounts???   Sure looks good on the bcak, height 
adjusted to get it nice and close.

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[L. J. Charlton]

Thanks Justin, but I am 55 years old and live in the hills of Pittsburgh.  
I don't think a single speed will work for me.  Thanks for the offer, 
though.
 

On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 8:57:45 PM UTC-4, justin...@gmail.com wrote:

 Still got a SimpleOne here...

 On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 6:32:18 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote: 

  Ken,  I definitely will not drop $3k on this frame.  Like I wrote above 
 that amount buys me a new bike.  My take-away from some of the comments 
 above was that I could manage a 59cm given my 89 PBH.  Thanks for the 
 repost of the custom build.  It is tempting but also a half cm smaller.  
 Patience is a virtue, I guess...  Maybe someone else here will offer 
 something.
  
 Larry  



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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Deacon Patrick]

You might well be surprised, LJ! I live int he Colorado mountains and 
absolutely love my QB. One gear from up, one for down (and the occasional 
semi-flat bit). I was surprised how rapidly I adapted to handling climbs. 
As my only bike? No. But what a blast they are! The simplicity is wondrous.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Thursday, September 4, 2014 5:25:03 AM UTC-6, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 Thanks Justin, but I am 55 years old and live in the hills of Pittsburgh.  
 I don't think a single speed will work for me.  Thanks for the offer, 
 though.
  

 On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 8:57:45 PM UTC-4, justin...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

 Still got a SimpleOne here...

 On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 6:32:18 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote: 

  Ken,  I definitely will not drop $3k on this frame.  Like I wrote 
 above that amount buys me a new bike.  My take-away from some of the 
 comments above was that I could manage a 59cm given my 89 PBH.  Thanks for 
 the repost of the custom build.  It is tempting but also a half cm 
 smaller.  Patience is a virtue, I guess...  Maybe someone else here will 
 offer something.
  
 Larry  



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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[John Stowe]

LJ,

You might also check Andrew's new yard sale posting: 
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rbw-owners-bunch/aPxa-ASFMgQ/OWb-UruVChgJ

He's selling a 61cm longlow-ish frame for $1400, but the saddle height he 
lists is lower than mine, and I also have an 89 PBH. If I were in the 
market now it might be gone already!

-John

On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 9:32:18 AM UTC-4, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 Ken,  I definitely will not drop $3k on this frame.  Like I wrote above 
 that amount buys me a new bike.  My take-away from some of the comments 
 above was that I could manage a 59cm given my 89 PBH.  Thanks for the 
 repost of the custom build.  It is tempting but also a half cm smaller.  
 Patience is a virtue, I guess...  Maybe someone else here will offer 
 something.
  
 Larry  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Johan Larsson]

The headtube looks about the same as my 59 cm Bridgestone XO-1. The 
All-rounder is more or less a refined XO-1. I might very well be wrong, but 
I think they have the same geometry, give or take a few millimeters. I have 
a pbh of 91 cm, 188 cm tall, and the XO-1 is a tad too small for my taste 
and needs, especially if I want to use the mustache bar and that even with 
a mtb riser stem, but I imagine it would be a good size for most people. If 
you are like most people and not like me, that All-rounder is probably just 
the right size for you... Too me, the All-rounder is quite different from 
every other model that have followed. I see it as a 
mtb-singletrail-commuter-hybrid do-it-all, not a commuter-touring-city-bike 
do-it-all like the Atlantis for example, and it's sizing is more mtb-like - 
smaller frame that is, compared to a road bike.

Johan Larsson,
Sweden



On Monday, September 1, 2014 5:10:22 PM UTC+2, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 I was perusing the bikes for sale at Mt. Airy bikes (DC area) and 
 unexpectedly came across this:  
 http://bike123.com/used_bikes/used_sbikesview.php?ID=3804

 I've been longing for a Riv but haven't seen one that said, Buy me. 
  This does.  But I have two questions before I give them a call:

 1.  Solely from talking to other bike shops it seems the proprietor has a 
 reputation over-pricing his used bikes.  With the understanding that 
 various regions and markets value bikes differently, what would be a 
 reasonable price for a 1995 All Rounder on the east coast?

 2.  I can't for the life of me find a sizing chart for the All Rounder.  I 
 have a 59 PBH.  Reading this http://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=41, 
 which is very general, indicates that I could fit a 59cm but it would be on 
 the small side.  Any help with sizing would be appreciated.

 Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

 Larry  

http://www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[L. J. Charlton]

Ken,  I definitely will not drop $3k on this frame.  Like I wrote above 
that amount buys me a new bike.  My take-away from some of the comments 
above was that I could manage a 59cm given my 89 PBH.  Thanks for the 
repost of the custom build.  It is tempting but also a half cm smaller.  
Patience is a virtue, I guess...  Maybe someone else here will offer 
something.
 
Larry  

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

['Tony McG' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Larry,

I also have an 89cm PBH @ 6' tall.  I ride a 61 Atlantis, 59 San Marcos, 60 
LHT, and 60 Santana Noventa.  They all fit well, but the Atlantis is my 
favorite.  I bought it last Summer off of this list, like new and 
completely built (w/o wheels or saddle) as I would have for myself for 
$2000.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[justinaugust]

Still got a SimpleOne here...

On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 6:32:18 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 Ken,  I definitely will not drop $3k on this frame.  Like I wrote above 
 that amount buys me a new bike.  My take-away from some of the comments 
 above was that I could manage a 59cm given my 89 PBH.  Thanks for the 
 repost of the custom build.  It is tempting but also a half cm smaller.  
 Patience is a virtue, I guess...  Maybe someone else here will offer 
 something.
  
 Larry  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Jim M.]

I've talked to them about a few bikes. I thought they were a bit high, but 
not egregiously so. $1200 would be a screaming deal, IMHO. Given that it's 
a rare bike and less expensive than a new Riv, paying your birth year $19xx 
would not be a bad deal.

jim m
wc ca

On Monday, September 1, 2014 8:10:22 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 I was perusing the bikes for sale at Mt. Airy bikes (DC area) and 
 unexpectedly came across this:  
 http://bike123.com/used_bikes/used_sbikesview.php?ID=3804

 I've been longing for a Riv but haven't seen one that said, Buy me. 
  This does.  But I have two questions before I give them a call:

 1.  Solely from talking to other bike shops it seems the proprietor has a 
 reputation over-pricing his used bikes.  With the understanding that 
 various regions and markets value bikes differently, what would be a 
 reasonable price for a 1995 All Rounder on the east coast?

 2.  I can't for the life of me find a sizing chart for the All Rounder.  I 
 have a 59 PBH.  Reading this http://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=41, 
 which is very general, indicates that I could fit a 59cm but it would be on 
 the small side.  Any help with sizing would be appreciated.

 Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

 Larry  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[L. J. Charlton]

Yes, a typo.  I have an 89 PBH.  I'll see if I can edit the original post 
to avoid confusing others.  Thank you.  

On Monday, September 1, 2014 12:40:41 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 What is your actual PBH.  Your PBH is not 59.  That has to be a typo. 
  What is it really?

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[L. J. Charlton]

I know I said this dealer was known for asking above-market prices (and as 
was said here, that's his prerogative) but this is ridiculous.  I will copy 
his response verbatim:
 

 Thanks for the inquiry and interest.  Great choice.

Because we are willing and able to furnish any bike with a choice of 
component changes both major and minor, pricing is most flexible.

We can upgrade to any special need or even 'de tune' in the case of a 
price-based decision and lower level of investment.

As currently built we have this listed at $3200.

That's not much more than Waterford and Rivendell get for a bare frame and 
fork these days

If it were smaller it would have disappeared long ago and would have been 
priced higher, though I might have been tempted to hoard it in the personal 
livery

 

If you can appreciate a great opportunity and are a little impulsive, get 
us a small deposit before we close out the third quarter at the end of this 
month and our bean counter will show her appreciation for taking it off 
inventory and make a nice contribution of $200 

Like an even greater opportunity and feeling little more impulsive?

pay and take it by the end of the month and I will match her offer

 

Please let me know when you can visit so I can have it here to see

As currently built is with no front or rear derailleur or chain.  Add 
those items and I'd be up the the cost of a brand new AAH.  Okay, he 
offered to knock $400 off so we're really at $2800 plus the cost of the 
added hardware.  So it's the equivalent of a new Sam.   Still, I think I'll 
pass...  (Should I tell him?)

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Michael Hammer]

I'm the original owner of a Waterford All-Rounder, so a couple of comments:

   - According to my paperwork from the time, there were 3 sizes in the 
   range of interest, 55.5, 58 and 61.  The bike for sale looks more like a 61 
   than a 58, primarily based on the headtube.  
   - My bike is a 55.5, the spec sheet says the TT is 57.5 but it feels 
   longer than my '92 RB-1 in 57.5 that also has a 57.5 top tube. I have a 
   10mm shorter stem on the AR.   The 58 has a 58.5 top tube, the 61 a 60.5 
   TT.  Grant recommended the 55.5 size for me; I'm 5-10+, normal proportions, 
   and, I think, 89 cm PBH.
   - My headtube is about 170mm; the build sheet called for a 15mm 
   extension, which looks about right.  

Let me know if you want any other geometry numbers.  I could post the sheet 
with road, AR and mountain geometries if folks are interested.  

On Monday, September 1, 2014 8:10:22 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 I was perusing the bikes for sale at Mt. Airy bikes (DC area) and 
 unexpectedly came across this:  
 http://bike123.com/used_bikes/used_sbikesview.php?ID=3804

 I've been longing for a Riv but haven't seen one that said, Buy me. 
  This does.  But I have two questions before I give them a call:

 1.  Solely from talking to other bike shops it seems the proprietor has a 
 reputation over-pricing his used bikes.  With the understanding that 
 various regions and markets value bikes differently, what would be a 
 reasonable price for a 1995 All Rounder on the east coast?

 2.  I can't for the life of me find a sizing chart for the All Rounder.  I 
 have a 59 PBH.  Reading this http://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=41, 
 which is very general, indicates that I could fit a 59cm but it would be on 
 the small side.  Any help with sizing would be appreciated.

 Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

 Larry  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Cyclofiend Jim]

Ha!

Well, as we used to say in retail, he's pretty proud of that... ;^)

You are buying a frame and fork.  Yeah, there are some wheels and other 
bits attached, but those are likely to be swapped out.

Honestly, for that specific offering, I'd have trouble paying more than 
$8-900.  For what he's asking, I could easily buy a new Atlantis frame, 
then build it up out of parts new and used.

Unless it's a spectacularly spotless, and totally unique, I'd be thinking 
half the price of a new one .

Alright... on to the short work week!

- Jim / cyclofiend.com

On Tuesday, September 2, 2014 5:08:03 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 I know I said this dealer was known for asking above-market prices (and as 
 was said here, that's his prerogative) but this is ridiculous.  I will copy 
 his response verbatim:
  

  Thanks for the inquiry and interest.  Great choice.

 Because we are willing and able to furnish any bike with a choice of 
 component changes both major and minor, pricing is most flexible.

 We can upgrade to any special need or even 'de tune' in the case of a 
 price-based decision and lower level of investment.

 As currently built we have this listed at $3200.

 That's not much more than Waterford and Rivendell get for a bare frame and 
 fork these days

 If it were smaller it would have disappeared long ago and would have been 
 priced higher, though I might have been tempted to hoard it in the personal 
 livery

  

 If you can appreciate a great opportunity and are a little impulsive, get 
 us a small deposit before we close out the third quarter at the end of this 
 month and our bean counter will show her appreciation for taking it off 
 inventory and make a nice contribution of $200 

 Like an even greater opportunity and feeling little more impulsive?

 pay and take it by the end of the month and I will match her offer

  

 Please let me know when you can visit so I can have it here to see

 As currently built is with no front or rear derailleur or chain.  Add 
 those items and I'd be up the the cost of a brand new AAH.  Okay, he 
 offered to knock $400 off so we're really at $2800 plus the cost of the 
 added hardware.  So it's the equivalent of a new Sam.   Still, I think I'll 
 pass...  (Should I tell him?)


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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[cyclotourist]

Mr. Fiend is in charge of the voices, but may I politely add in my best
Edna Krabappel voice: Ha!

And Chief Wiggum: Move along, nothing to see here.


It's been an Every Simpsons Ever sort of a week.

Cheers,
David

it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal





On Tue, Sep 2, 2014 at 5:08 AM, L. J. Charlton larrycharl...@gmail.com
wrote:

 I know I said this dealer was known for asking above-market prices (and as
 was said here, that's his prerogative) but this is ridiculous.  I will copy
 his response verbatim:


  Thanks for the inquiry and interest.  Great choice.

 Because we are willing and able to furnish any bike with a choice of
 component changes both major and minor, pricing is most flexible.

 We can upgrade to any special need or even 'de tune' in the case of a
 price-based decision and lower level of investment.

 As currently built we have this listed at $3200.

 That's not much more than Waterford and Rivendell get for a bare frame and
 fork these days

 If it were smaller it would have disappeared long ago and would have been
 priced higher, though I might have been tempted to hoard it in the personal
 livery



 If you can appreciate a great opportunity and are a little impulsive, get
 us a small deposit before we close out the third quarter at the end of this
 month and our bean counter will show her appreciation for taking it off
 inventory and make a nice contribution of $200

 Like an even greater opportunity and feeling little more impulsive?

 pay and take it by the end of the month and I will match her offer



 Please let me know when you can visit so I can have it here to see

 As currently built is with no front or rear derailleur or chain.  Add
 those items and I'd be up the the cost of a brand new AAH.  Okay, he
 offered to knock $400 off so we're really at $2800 plus the cost of the
 added hardware.  So it's the equivalent of a new Sam.   Still, I think I'll
 pass...  (Should I tell him?)

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Ken Yokanovich]

As others have said, the price seems high and given your PBH measurement it 
sounds like it might be too small.  If you are prepared to spend that kind 
of coin, I would recommend that you work with the good folks at Rivendell 
 to help set you up with the best combination of bike for the budget in the 
right size.  

If you should decide that 59 is your size and you have your heart set on a 
custom, there was a Goodrich built custom for sale here on the list not too 
far back $1,675 shipped.
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rbw-owners-bunch/oih_BiG3yP0/DreZ5TKLPRMJ  
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/rbw-owners-bunch/oih_BiG3yP0/DreZ5TKLPRMJ I 
would suspect that the frame is still for sale, there's an add for the same 
frame/fork still on Minneapolis Craigslist.  

On Monday, September 1, 2014 10:10:22 AM UTC-5, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 I was perusing the bikes for sale at Mt. Airy bikes (DC area) and 
 unexpectedly came across this:  
 http://bike123.com/used_bikes/used_sbikesview.php?ID=3804

 I've been longing for a Riv but haven't seen one that said, Buy me. 
  This does.  But I have two questions before I give them a call:

 1.  Solely from talking to other bike shops it seems the proprietor has a 
 reputation over-pricing his used bikes.  With the understanding that 
 various regions and markets value bikes differently, what would be a 
 reasonable price for a 1995 All Rounder on the east coast?

 2.  I can't for the life of me find a sizing chart for the All Rounder.  I 
 have a 59 PBH.  Reading this http://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=41, 
 which is very general, indicates that I could fit a 59cm but it would be on 
 the small side.  Any help with sizing would be appreciated.

 Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

 Larry  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Cyclofiend Jim]

Hey there Larry - 

Re: your second point - I'm guessing you mean you have a 89 cm  PBH?  That 
would put you in the 59 cm frame range.That's a pretty safe guess for 
the frame size on that model.  

From those photos, it honestly looks a little bigger than a 59 - the 
perspective of the images may be playing a trick on my eyes, but that head 
tube looks a little long for a 59.  Also, the saddle would be a take-off 
for me (and it doesn't look expensive).  And it may be the resolution of 
the photo, but I cannot really see a rear or front derailleur on that, so 
it looks like you are just getting the frame. 

The A/R is close to an Atlantis, in terms of geometry, if that helps in 
sizing.  There are about five A/R's posted in the Gallery, if that helps:

http://www.cyclofiend.com/cc/cc-maker.html#rivendell

And some more early model background here:
http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/gen1/


What is he asking for it?

best of luck!

- Jim

On Monday, September 1, 2014 8:10:22 AM UTC-7, L. J. Charlton wrote:

 I was perusing the bikes for sale at Mt. Airy bikes (DC area) and 
 unexpectedly came across this:  
 http://bike123.com/used_bikes/used_sbikesview.php?ID=3804

 I've been longing for a Riv but haven't seen one that said, Buy me. 
  This does.  But I have two questions before I give them a call:

 1.  Solely from talking to other bike shops it seems the proprietor has a 
 reputation over-pricing his used bikes.  With the understanding that 
 various regions and markets value bikes differently, what would be a 
 reasonable price for a 1995 All Rounder on the east coast?

 2.  I can't for the life of me find a sizing chart for the All Rounder.  I 
 have a 59 PBH.  Reading this http://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=41, 
 which is very general, indicates that I could fit a 59cm but it would be on 
 the small side.  Any help with sizing would be appreciated.

 Thanks in advance for any help you can offer.

 Larry  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[lungimsam]

 Once I called them about an Atlantis. He said I could have it for a 
 birthday price - which is you pay what the year of your birth is. He said 
 I could also bring as old a person as I wanted with me and he'd give it to 
 me for that price.


So if he is charging more than the year of your birth, ask for the 
birthyear price. He might agree and you'll save a few bucks.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[lungimsam]

 

 Once I emailed them about an Atlantis they had. I think they still have 
 it. I did not buy it.

 
The shop owner said I could have it for a birthday price, same price as 
your birth year. So if you were born in 1954, then you will pay $1954.

He said I could bring the oldest person with me that I could find and he'd 
give it to me for their birthday price.

So if he's charging more than your birthyear, ask for the birthday price.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[lungimsam]

Hey y'all,
Maybe you can clue me in. But how does a bike maintain such a high value 
when it is used and 19 years old?
I'm not saying its not worth it, because I don't really know the value of 
these things.
I know its a Waterford Rivendell, so its top quality. But it is used and 19 
years old. And no one knows how old the components are and what the bike 
has been through.

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[RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Ryan]

Frame was probably $1300 new. Actually, cyclotourist's estimate might not 
be totally out-of-line. That was a top-quality frame, and I don't think 
there are thousands of A/R's around. They were a small-batch production 
frame

Now when you start getting into the customs built by JS or CG with the JB 
paint job, things can add up in a hurry

On Monday, September 1, 2014 3:21:14 PM UTC-5, lungimsam wrote:

 Hey y'all,
 Maybe you can clue me in. But how does a bike maintain such a high value 
 when it is used and 19 years old?
 I'm not saying its not worth it, because I don't really know the value of 
 these things.
 I know its a Waterford Rivendell, so its top quality. But it is used and 
 19 years old. And no one knows how old the components are and what the bike 
 has been through.


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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder available - help me before it disappears

[Eric Platt]

Seems to me discussion on this bike has come up a couple of times on the
list. While the bike looks big, am pretty sure it's the 26 wheels
contributing.  My Surly LHT has a 58cm frame and 26 wheels and looks
similar.

Also will agree with the general price suggestion by Cyclotourist.

Eric Platt
St. Paul, MN


On Mon, Sep 1, 2014 at 3:27 PM, Ryan ryter...@mts.net wrote:

 Frame was probably $1300 new. Actually, cyclotourist's estimate might not
 be totally out-of-line. That was a top-quality frame, and I don't think
 there are thousands of A/R's around. They were a small-batch production
 frame

 Now when you start getting into the customs built by JS or CG with the JB
 paint job, things can add up in a hurry


 On Monday, September 1, 2014 3:21:14 PM UTC-5, lungimsam wrote:

 Hey y'all,
 Maybe you can clue me in. But how does a bike maintain such a high value
 when it is used and 19 years old?
 I'm not saying its not worth it, because I don't really know the value of
 these things.
 I know its a Waterford Rivendell, so its top quality. But it is used and
 19 years old. And no one knows how old the components are and what the bike
 has been through.

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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Addison Wilhite]

I like the nicely written history of the AR.  As the proud owner of a late
90s era Allrounder I'd like to throw this out there for some evidence of
just how aptly it is named.  I've had loads of fun on this bike and also
been meticulous about keeping it in good shape so 15 years on it looks
remarkably like new.  Touring, roadish, monster cross, commuting, it does
an amazing job.  I just did a query on my blog of all the posts about my
all rounder so there should be various links on the left hand side.

http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/search?q=allrounder

cheers,


Addison Wilhite, M.A.

Academy of Arts, Careers and
Technologyhttp://www.washoecountyschools.org/aact/


*“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*

Educator: Professional Portfolio http://addisonwilhite.blogspot.com/

Blogger: Reno Rambler http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/

Bicycle Advocate: Regional Transportation Commission, Bicycle Pedestrian
Advisory Committeehttp://www.rtcwashoe.com/public-transportation-22-124.html



On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 4:50 PM, rcnute rcn...@hotmail.com wrote:

 Not really surprising but my XO-1 felt totally different than my Atlantis.
  They really are their own beasts though of course XO-1 is the granddaddy.

 Ryan


 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 4:20:28 PM UTC-8, Ryan wrote:

 Wow 2 ! X0-1's in one spot. I've only ever seen 1 other X0-1 in
 Winnipeg...a fellow who's a friend of mine...My 20 year-old X0-1 still gets
 lots of compliments. I'd never get rid of it,

 I bought the A/R to be the ne plus ultra X0-1 because I liked the design
 of the original X0-1 so much. Once I got it I hardly rode any of my other
 bikes.

 so I guess I'm the owner of the great-great and great grandfather of the
 SH and AHH.

 And, Mr.Warren and Mr. Cyclofiend, your encyclopaedic knowledge of all
 things Rivendell is impressive.

 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 5:06:20 PM UTC-6, James Warren wrote:


 That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with
 dummy levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/



 On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:

 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/

 ~mike



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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Addison Wilhite]

Or perhaps this jack of all trades post is the best place to go with
photos of nearly every incarnation of the AR.

http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/2013/01/rivendell-allrounder-jack-of-all.html

Regards,


Addison Wilhite, M.A.

Academy of Arts, Careers and
Technologyhttp://www.washoecountyschools.org/aact/


*“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*

Educator: Professional Portfolio http://addisonwilhite.blogspot.com/

Blogger: Reno Rambler http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/

Bicycle Advocate: Regional Transportation Commission, Bicycle Pedestrian
Advisory Committeehttp://www.rtcwashoe.com/public-transportation-22-124.html



On Sun, Jan 19, 2014 at 7:27 AM, Addison Wilhite
addisonwilh...@gmail.comwrote:

 I like the nicely written history of the AR.  As the proud owner of a late
 90s era Allrounder I'd like to throw this out there for some evidence of
 just how aptly it is named.  I've had loads of fun on this bike and also
 been meticulous about keeping it in good shape so 15 years on it looks
 remarkably like new.  Touring, roadish, monster cross, commuting, it does
 an amazing job.  I just did a query on my blog of all the posts about my
 all rounder so there should be various links on the left hand side.

 http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/search?q=allrounder

 cheers,


 Addison Wilhite, M.A.

 Academy of Arts, Careers and 
 Technologyhttp://www.washoecountyschools.org/aact/


 *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*

 Educator: Professional Portfolio http://addisonwilhite.blogspot.com/

 Blogger: Reno Rambler http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/

 Bicycle Advocate: Regional Transportation Commission, Bicycle Pedestrian
 Advisory Committeehttp://www.rtcwashoe.com/public-transportation-22-124.html



 On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 4:50 PM, rcnute rcn...@hotmail.com wrote:

 Not really surprising but my XO-1 felt totally different than my
 Atlantis.  They really are their own beasts though of course XO-1 is the
 granddaddy.

 Ryan


 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 4:20:28 PM UTC-8, Ryan wrote:

 Wow 2 ! X0-1's in one spot. I've only ever seen 1 other X0-1 in
 Winnipeg...a fellow who's a friend of mine...My 20 year-old X0-1 still gets
 lots of compliments. I'd never get rid of it,

 I bought the A/R to be the ne plus ultra X0-1 because I liked the design
 of the original X0-1 so much. Once I got it I hardly rode any of my other
 bikes.

 so I guess I'm the owner of the great-great and great grandfather of the
 SH and AHH.

 And, Mr.Warren and Mr. Cyclofiend, your encyclopaedic knowledge of all
 things Rivendell is impressive.

 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 5:06:20 PM UTC-6, James Warren wrote:


 That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with
 dummy levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/



 On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:

 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/

 ~mike



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 jimcw...@earthlink.net

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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[James Warren]

I may have a good memory for weird little things which leads to 1,000 words, 
but Addison's pictures really tell the All Rounder story. Awesome:


http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/2013/01/rivendell-allrounder-jack-of-all.html?q=allrounder


And as to the OP's question about which current models are closest to the All 
Rounder, here are pictures of my own Hillborne and Atlantis answering that 
question. Those two models are closest to the AR even though the current 
Hillborne has sidepulls. The canti-Hillbornes were very similar to an Atlantis 
- just a little bit less clearance. My sidepull one still fits 700x43 no 
problem, probably with no room for a fender:


http://www.flickr.com/photos/46035786@N07/sets/72157625850005210/


http://www.flickr.com/photos/46035786@N07/7587346416/in/set-72157630614961962



On Jan 19, 2014, at 7:27 AM, Addison Wilhite wrote:

 I like the nicely written history of the AR.  As the proud owner of a late 
 90s era Allrounder I'd like to throw this out there for some evidence of just 
 how aptly it is named.  I've had loads of fun on this bike and also been 
 meticulous about keeping it in good shape so 15 years on it looks remarkably 
 like new.  Touring, roadish, monster cross, commuting, it does an amazing 
 job.  I just did a query on my blog of all the posts about my all rounder 
 so there should be various links on the left hand side.
 
 http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/search?q=allrounder
 
 cheers,
 
 
 Addison Wilhite, M.A. 
 
 Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology 
 
 “Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”
 
 Educator: Professional Portfolio
 
 Blogger: Reno Rambler 
 
 Bicycle Advocate: Regional Transportation Commission, Bicycle Pedestrian 
 Advisory Committee
 
 
 
 
 On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 4:50 PM, rcnute rcn...@hotmail.com wrote:
 Not really surprising but my XO-1 felt totally different than my Atlantis.  
 They really are their own beasts though of course XO-1 is the granddaddy.
 
 Ryan
 
 
 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 4:20:28 PM UTC-8, Ryan wrote:
 Wow 2 ! X0-1's in one spot. I've only ever seen 1 other X0-1 in Winnipeg...a 
 fellow who's a friend of mine...My 20 year-old X0-1 still gets lots of 
 compliments. I'd never get rid of it,
 
 I bought the A/R to be the ne plus ultra X0-1 because I liked the design of 
 the original X0-1 so much. Once I got it I hardly rode any of my other bikes.
 
 so I guess I'm the owner of the great-great and great grandfather of the SH 
 and AHH.
 
 And, Mr.Warren and Mr. Cyclofiend, your encyclopaedic knowledge of all things 
 Rivendell is impressive. 
 
 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 5:06:20 PM UTC-6, James Warren wrote:
 
 That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with dummy 
 levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:
 
 
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/
 
 
 
 On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:
 
 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO  
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/
 
 ~mike
 
 
 
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 For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
 
 James Warren
 jimcw...@earthlink.net
 
 - 700x55
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[qwerty]

I don't think it's been mentioned, but towards the end of the lifespan
of the AR, it morphed a bit from the original/XO style.  I recall
ordering my AR back in late summer of 2000, and at that time,
discussing my deliberations with Grant about going with the AR or
waiting a short while for an Atlantis.  At that time, the design for a
AR in my size (60cm) was for a 700c wheel size.  It was also to be
built by Curt Goodrich.  Grant said there wouldn't be all that much
difference in the two, but having the custom Goodrich build, fit,
lugs, etc, would make the bike more unique and special.  Once again,
I'm glad I listened to Grant's advice, and my AR is the best bike I've
ever ridden.  When I periodically go though my mental downsizing
exercise, the AR is always at the top of my list for keepers.

Mike G.

On 1/19/14, James Warren jimcwar...@earthlink.net wrote:

 I may have a good memory for weird little things which leads to 1,000 words,
 but Addison's pictures really tell the All Rounder story. Awesome:


 http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/2013/01/rivendell-allrounder-jack-of-all.html?q=allrounder


 And as to the OP's question about which current models are closest to the
 All Rounder, here are pictures of my own Hillborne and Atlantis answering
 that question. Those two models are closest to the AR even though the
 current Hillborne has sidepulls. The canti-Hillbornes were very similar to
 an Atlantis - just a little bit less clearance. My sidepull one still fits
 700x43 no problem, probably with no room for a fender:


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/46035786@N07/sets/72157625850005210/


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/46035786@N07/7587346416/in/set-72157630614961962



 On Jan 19, 2014, at 7:27 AM, Addison Wilhite wrote:

 I like the nicely written history of the AR.  As the proud owner of a late
 90s era Allrounder I'd like to throw this out there for some evidence of
 just how aptly it is named.  I've had loads of fun on this bike and also
 been meticulous about keeping it in good shape so 15 years on it looks
 remarkably like new.  Touring, roadish, monster cross, commuting, it does
 an amazing job.  I just did a query on my blog of all the posts about my
 all rounder so there should be various links on the left hand side.

 http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/search?q=allrounder

 cheers,


 Addison Wilhite, M.A.

 Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology

 “Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”

 Educator: Professional Portfolio

 Blogger: Reno Rambler

 Bicycle Advocate: Regional Transportation Commission, Bicycle Pedestrian
 Advisory Committee




 On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 4:50 PM, rcnute rcn...@hotmail.com wrote:
 Not really surprising but my XO-1 felt totally different than my Atlantis.
  They really are their own beasts though of course XO-1 is the
 granddaddy.

 Ryan


 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 4:20:28 PM UTC-8, Ryan wrote:
 Wow 2 ! X0-1's in one spot. I've only ever seen 1 other X0-1 in
 Winnipeg...a fellow who's a friend of mine...My 20 year-old X0-1 still
 gets lots of compliments. I'd never get rid of it,

 I bought the A/R to be the ne plus ultra X0-1 because I liked the design
 of the original X0-1 so much. Once I got it I hardly rode any of my other
 bikes.

 so I guess I'm the owner of the great-great and great grandfather of the
 SH and AHH.

 And, Mr.Warren and Mr. Cyclofiend, your encyclopaedic knowledge of all
 things Rivendell is impressive.

 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 5:06:20 PM UTC-6, James Warren wrote:

 That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with
 dummy levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/



 On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:

 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/

 ~mike



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 jimcw...@earthlink.net

 - 700x55






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[RBW] Re: All rounder

[Chris Lampe 2]

I'm enjoying this thread as it allows me to learn about yet another 
Rivendell that was long gone by the time I discovered RBW.  

I am just enthralled with 55mm Big Apples on 26 rims and now I'm setting 
my long-term sights on a good bike to utilize that combo.   Right now I've 
got them on my old 1995 Trek 730 hybrid (a 700c bike) and it's an absolute 
blast to ride!  The problem is.no brakes, for obvious reasons.  I have 
a cheap aftermarket fork on it and I'm seriously considering having the 
canti studs moved to accommodate brakes for 26 wheels.  The geometry of 
this bike is surprisingly close to the Riv All-Rounder and I can see why 
people love those All-Rounders so much.   The geometry is fairly nimble yet 
the wide tires give it a surprising amount of stability.   Sort of 
oxy-moronic in it's handling.   In contrast, my 700c bike with 40mm Duremes 
feels twitchy and unstable.  

The XO-1 seems to sporty for my tastes and the Atlantis seems a bit too 
slanted toward touring but the All-Rounder sounds just about perfect for 
what I'm looking for in a bike.  

 

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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[James Warren]

Another little detail is that the name All Rounder only had definition in a 
capital-letter sense in the time before the bikes marked Rivendell were 
considered custom.

The very first Riv offerings in the 90's (Road, All-Rounder, the rare Mountain, 
and later the Longlow) were all their fanciest frames and all had standard 
geometry charts. They were not custom.

The All Rounder, non-custom bike had a geometry chart that eventually said 700C 
for the bigger sizes, 26 inch for the smaller sizes (59 cm being the cutoff I 
think.) There were set sizes and it wasn't advertised to be customizable.

Then came the Atlantis, and that's really when the 
Rivs-with-fun-names-on-the-downtube-that-didn't-say-Rivendell started to become 
the norm. Sometime around this, Grant announced that the bikes called Rivendell 
are all considered custom now and it became clear that there would be two tiers 
of Riv frame offereings.

Henceforth with the fancier pure Rivendells, you could still get something that 
met all the characteristics of an all rounder but there was now no geometry 
chart to give it that name as a model name. And as a custom, I'm guessing the 
wheel-size was determined on a case-by-case basis (with some limitations 
imposed by Rivendell.)

So all-rounders still exist in the same way that Bombadils still exist. (You 
have to be willing to go custom.)

-Jim W.


On Jan 19, 2014, at 10:46 AM, Chris Lampe 2 wrote:

 I'm enjoying this thread as it allows me to learn about yet another Rivendell 
 that was long gone by the time I discovered RBW. 
 
 I am just enthralled with 55mm Big Apples on 26 rims and now I'm setting my 
 long-term sights on a good bike to utilize that combo.   Right now I've got 
 them on my old 1995 Trek 730 hybrid (a 700c bike) and it's an absolute blast 
 to ride!  The problem is.no brakes, for obvious reasons.  I have a cheap 
 aftermarket fork on it and I'm seriously considering having the canti studs 
 moved to accommodate brakes for 26 wheels.  The geometry of this bike is 
 surprisingly close to the Riv All-Rounder and I can see why people love those 
 All-Rounders so much.   The geometry is fairly nimble yet the wide tires give 
 it a surprising amount of stability.   Sort of oxy-moronic in it's handling.  
  In contrast, my 700c bike with 40mm Duremes feels twitchy and unstable. 
 
 The XO-1 seems to sporty for my tastes and the Atlantis seems a bit too 
 slanted toward touring but the All-Rounder sounds just about perfect for what 
 I'm looking for in a bike. 
 
  
 
 
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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Bruce Herbitter]

Rivs have always undergone fairly frequent change. Part of that is a 
result of the production scheme (all fab is outsourced, which leads to 
changes in price and availability) and part is due to new ideas 
occurring to the designer or being brought to his attention. As he has 
often said, the RBW ethos stays in every bike they make. I don;t think 
any of them is a bad bike or a Edsel of the bike world. Some are 
better suited to some riders or conditions than others.


Tailwinds




On 1/19/2014 1:20 PM, James Warren wrote:


Another little detail is that the name All Rounder only had definition 
in a capital-letter sense in the time before the bikes marked 
Rivendell were considered custom.


The very first Riv offerings in the 90's (Road, All-Rounder, the rare 
Mountain, and later the Longlow) were all their fanciest frames and 
all had standard geometry charts. They were not custom.


The All Rounder, non-custom bike had a geometry chart that eventually 
said 700C for the bigger sizes, 26 inch for the smaller sizes (59 cm 
being the cutoff I think.) There were set sizes and it wasn't 
advertised to be customizable.


Then came the Atlantis, and that's really when the 
Rivs-with-fun-names-on-the-downtube-that-didn't-say-Rivendell started 
to become the norm. Sometime around this, Grant announced that the 
bikes called Rivendell are all considered custom now and it became 
clear that there would be two tiers of Riv frame offereings.


Henceforth with the fancier pure Rivendells, you could still get 
something that met all the characteristics of an all rounder but there 
was now no geometry chart to give it that name as a model name. And as 
a custom, I'm guessing the wheel-size was determined on a case-by-case 
basis (with some limitations imposed by Rivendell.)


So all-rounders still exist in the same way that Bombadils still 
exist. (You have to be willing to go custom.)


-Jim W.



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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Christopher Chen]

And that's the ticket Bruce!

I agree with the Riv philosophy that choice doesn't always equal good; that
if some disaster happened and you could only have one bike for the rest of
your life, you'd be perfectly happy with a Riv, no matter if it's a AR,
custom, Atlantis...

I mean that's the point, right? Every bike except the Roadeo is
deliberately versatile.

Of course since we have choices those questions will always rise up, but at
some point you gotta just ride.


On Sun, Jan 19, 2014 at 11:46 AM, Bruce Herbitter bruce.herbit...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Rivs have always undergone fairly frequent change. Part of that is a
 result of the production scheme (all fab is outsourced, which leads to
 changes in price and availability) and part is due to new ideas occurring
 to the designer or being brought to his attention. As he has often said,
 the RBW ethos stays in every bike they make. I don;t think any of them is a
 bad bike or a Edsel of the bike world. Some are better suited to some
 riders or conditions than others.

 Tailwinds





 On 1/19/2014 1:20 PM, James Warren wrote:


 Another little detail is that the name All Rounder only had definition in
 a capital-letter sense in the time before the bikes marked Rivendell were
 considered custom.

 The very first Riv offerings in the 90's (Road, All-Rounder, the rare
 Mountain, and later the Longlow) were all their fanciest frames and all had
 standard geometry charts. They were not custom.

 The All Rounder, non-custom bike had a geometry chart that eventually
 said 700C for the bigger sizes, 26 inch for the smaller sizes (59 cm being
 the cutoff I think.) There were set sizes and it wasn't advertised to be
 customizable.

 Then came the Atlantis, and that's really when the
 Rivs-with-fun-names-on-the-downtube-that-didn't-say-Rivendell started to
 become the norm. Sometime around this, Grant announced that the bikes
 called Rivendell are all considered custom now and it became clear that
 there would be two tiers of Riv frame offereings.

 Henceforth with the fancier pure Rivendells, you could still get
 something that met all the characteristics of an all rounder but there was
 now no geometry chart to give it that name as a model name. And as a
 custom, I'm guessing the wheel-size was determined on a case-by-case basis
 (with some limitations imposed by Rivendell.)

 So all-rounders still exist in the same way that Bombadils still exist.
 (You have to be willing to go custom.)

 -Jim W.


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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Patrick Moore]

That is certainly a lot prettier than any XO I've seen! Nice color.

My late '94 (ordered; delivered early '95) road custom was built around the
AR design, but with geometry tweaked and tubing and lugs all road spec'd --
I was segueing from a roadified XO-1.

On Sun, Jan 19, 2014 at 8:27 AM, Addison Wilhite
addisonwilh...@gmail.comwrote:



 http://reno-rambler.blogspot.com/search?q=allrounder

 cheers,




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[RBW] Re: All rounder

[jinxed]

From an All Rounder owner...the closest current model would be the 
Atlantis. Others may correct me, but I believe it is the direct descendant 
of the AR.

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[RBW] Re: All rounder

[Cyclofiend Jim]

Yes - that is the generally accepted pedigree:

B'stone XO
begat
Rivendell A/R
begat
Rivenedell Atlantis
begat
Rivendell Sam Hillborne (canti)

- J


On Saturday, January 18, 2014 10:55:23 AM UTC-8, jinxed wrote:

 From an All Rounder owner...the closest current model would be the 
 Atlantis. Others may correct me, but I believe it is the direct descendant 
 of the AR.


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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Patrick Moore]

But isn't the Atlantis designed much more for loads and off road terrain?
The XOs -- certainly the XO-1 -- were certainly more road biased than dirt
biased, John Stamstead notwithstanding.

It seems to me that the Sam Hill is much more genetically similar to the
XOs than the Atlantis, as far as I understand the Atlantis.


On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 12:09 PM, Cyclofiend Jim
cyclofi...@earthlink.netwrote:

 Yes - that is the generally accepted pedigree:

 B'stone XO
 begat
 Rivendell A/R
 begat
 Rivenedell Atlantis
 begat
 Rivendell Sam Hillborne (canti)

 - J


 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 10:55:23 AM UTC-8, jinxed wrote:

 From an All Rounder owner...the closest current model would be the
 Atlantis. Others may correct me, but I believe it is the direct descendant
 of the AR.

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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[James Warren]

That's too Biblical. Needs to be more Elfish.: - )



On Jan 18, 2014, at 11:09 AM, Cyclofiend Jim wrote:

 Yes - that is the generally accepted pedigree:
 
 B'stone XO
 begat
 Rivendell A/R
 begat
 Rivenedell Atlantis
 begat
 Rivendell Sam Hillborne (canti)
 
 - J
 
 
 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 10:55:23 AM UTC-8, jinxed wrote:
 From an All Rounder owner...the closest current model would be the Atlantis. 
 Others may correct me, but I believe it is the direct descendant of the AR.
 
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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Cyclofiend Jim]

Just tracing the lineage, which is of course influenced by the other 
branches. GP has stated a number of times that the A/R stemmed from the 
XO.  (And around the Bay Area, spotting XO's on the trails was not an 
outlier, but at that time, seeing an MB with drop bars wasn't odd either...)

The Atlantis was a production version of the A/R - by moving it to Toyo 
they could produce them in greater numbers.  As with all the designs, it 
got refined a bit in the process.  The Mountain and A/R went away with the 
Atlantis replacing both (though the Mountain was never really made in any 
kind of quantity).

And you ended up with Ramouillet as the road-but-trails-worthy and the 
Atlantis as the trails-but-road-ready setups. Clearly delineated from one 
another, but with the ability (touted in all of the literature for both) to 
tune to your needs and desires.

I remember when the Atlantis came out, it seemed at the time to be more of 
a rough-stuff touring rig to me.  But at the time, my perspective was 
skewed by late-90s mtb technology.  When I finally realized that putting a 
hinge in the middle of a frame was not aligned with my riding needs, style 
or technique, it struck me as much more of an off-road machine.

Refs:

http://cyclofiend.com/rbw/atlantis

http://cyclofiend.com/rbw/rambouillet

- J
On Saturday, January 18, 2014 11:17:01 AM UTC-8, Patrick Moore wrote:

 But isn't the Atlantis designed much more for loads and off road terrain? 
 The XOs -- certainly the XO-1 -- were certainly more road biased than dirt 
 biased, John Stamstead notwithstanding.

 It seems to me that the Sam Hill is much more genetically similar to the 
 XOs than the Atlantis, as far as I understand the Atlantis.


 On Sat, Jan 18, 2014 at 12:09 PM, Cyclofiend Jim 
 cyclo...@earthlink.netjavascript:
  wrote:

 Yes - that is the generally accepted pedigree:

 B'stone XO
 begat
 Rivendell A/R
 begat
 Rivenedell Atlantis
 begat
 Rivendell Sam Hillborne (canti)

 - J


 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 10:55:23 AM UTC-8, jinxed wrote:

 From an All Rounder owner...the closest current model would be the 
 Atlantis. Others may correct me, but I believe it is the direct descendant 
 of the AR.

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[RBW] Re: All rounder

[Mike Schiller]

twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO 
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/

~mike


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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[James Warren]

That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with dummy 
levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:


http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/



On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:

 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO  
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/
 
 ~mike
 
 
 
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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[Ryan]

Wow 2 ! X0-1's in one spot. I've only ever seen 1 other X0-1 in 
Winnipeg...a fellow who's a friend of mine...My 20 year-old X0-1 still gets 
lots of compliments. I'd never get rid of it,

I bought the A/R to be the ne plus ultra X0-1 because I liked the design of 
the original X0-1 so much. Once I got it I hardly rode any of my other 
bikes.

so I guess I'm the owner of the great-great and great grandfather of the SH 
and AHH.

And, Mr.Warren and Mr. Cyclofiend, your encyclopaedic knowledge of all 
things Rivendell is impressive. 

On Saturday, January 18, 2014 5:06:20 PM UTC-6, James Warren wrote:


 That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with 
 dummy levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/



 On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:

 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO  
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/

 ~mike



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 jimcw...@earthlink.net javascript:

 - 700x55




  


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Re: [RBW] Re: All rounder

[rcnute]

Not really surprising but my XO-1 felt totally different than my Atlantis. 
 They really are their own beasts though of course XO-1 is the granddaddy.

Ryan

On Saturday, January 18, 2014 4:20:28 PM UTC-8, Ryan wrote:

 Wow 2 ! X0-1's in one spot. I've only ever seen 1 other X0-1 in 
 Winnipeg...a fellow who's a friend of mine...My 20 year-old X0-1 still gets 
 lots of compliments. I'd never get rid of it,

 I bought the A/R to be the ne plus ultra X0-1 because I liked the design 
 of the original X0-1 so much. Once I got it I hardly rode any of my other 
 bikes.

 so I guess I'm the owner of the great-great and great grandfather of the 
 SH and AHH.

 And, Mr.Warren and Mr. Cyclofiend, your encyclopaedic knowledge of all 
 things Rivendell is impressive. 

 On Saturday, January 18, 2014 5:06:20 PM UTC-6, James Warren wrote:


 That was a fun ride in March of 2010. There were two orange XO-1's with 
 dummy levers on mustache bars, yet modified from the stock setup:


 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4512459117/in/photostream/



 On Jan 18, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mike Schiller wrote:

 twins from a different time?  my Hillborne and an XO  
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/25671211@N02/4513103792/

 ~mike



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 jimcw...@earthlink.net

 - 700x55




  


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder with Midge bar UPDATE

[Ron Mc]

hi Jinxed - beautiful set up.  I have an old road bike frame project in the 
mill.  Can you measure drop on your bars for me?  The 345mm overall drop 
listed by on-one for these bars makes no sense.  Thanks

On Friday, March 15, 2013 7:15:01 PM UTC-5, jinxed wrote:

 OK. So after some excellent and insightful RBW list input I went ahead and 
 ordered the OnOne Midge bars some Cane Creek levers, and some Kenda MTB 
 tires.

 My immediate goal was to alter the hand positions. I've been pretty 
 content with the mustache bar set up, but have come to really enjoy the 
 flats and wide sram hoods of my cross bike. My default position on the 
 m-bars was basically on the very ends with my palms hanging over the bar 
 end shifters. I thought adding the closer brake position and the flats of a 
 more traditional drop bar would be a welcome change.

 As soon as the bars came in, I was happy I made the purchase, even if they 
 dont remain on the Rivendell. Right out of the box they looked 
 interestingly comfortable. NICE wide top flat section, short reach, tight 
 and short drop. They flair but not out of control. I had heard the drop 
 section was short, and it is, but to me seemed perfect. 

 I got them installed with a vacant stem so I wouldnt have to completely 
 disassemble my M-bar set up. The stem is a little too long, but the short 
 reach on the bar still pulled the levers back vs the m-bar. I set up the 
 Midge essentially parallel with the ground with the drops pointing down. 
 The levers then become a nice flat extension of the bar and make for some 
 good hand placement real estate! The flair on the midge is restrained 
 enough to still use the tops of the lever hoods. This is what I was looking 
 for.

 I also wanted to add some knobbage to the marathonesque bonty tires I was 
 using without going full on 2.1 mtb. I am VERY happy I ran across the Kenda 
 Klimax 1.9 tires. They were exactly what I wanted. Good enough knobs to hit 
 some aggressive singletrack, but civilized on the pavement.

 So now in V.3.0 I took to the road so to speak. I did a nice meandering 
 30+ mile ride in mixed terrain to get some initial impressions. The extra 
 width and positions of the bars were very welcome in varying conditions. 
 Having the flats gave a nice upright comfortable cruising placement and 
 then the wide hoods were awesome in the dirt. I was so impressed with the 
 feel off road, I would consider these on my dedicated mtb. The drops worked 
 surprisingly well on the couple steep dirt climbs I encountered too. I had 
 quick access to the shifters without having to move away from reaching the 
 brakes. So overall I think this is a positive change.

 I will say this however...when you ride a 700c CX bike and a 29er 
 MTB...jumping on a 26 feels SO SLUGGISH. I kept checking to see if my 
 brakes were dragging! I kept wondering if I could shoehorn a 650b in there 
 and get some brakes to work! The AR is an awesome bike, but I will say that 
 my old too small Bleriot felt loads more efficient.

 Here is a beautiful shot of the garage door with the newly altered bike 
 obscuring the view.

 http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8531/8561112128_8bc9a3e879_b.jpg


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[RBW] Re: All Rounder with Midge bar UPDATE

[Ron Mc]

also, is anyone using a Soma Road 1 bar?  tried a search with no luck

On Wednesday, April 17, 2013 8:20:11 AM UTC-5, Ron Mc wrote:

 hi Jinxed - beautiful set up.  I have an old road bike frame project in 
 the mill.  Can you measure drop on your bars for me?  The 345mm overall 
 drop listed by on-one for these bars makes no sense.  Thanks



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Re: [RBW] Re: All Rounder with Midge bar UPDATE

[Steven Frederick]

On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 10:53 PM, Mike Schiller
mikeybi...@rocketmail.comwrote:


 and I certainly agree with you on hardtail 29ers... after going through a
 few full suspension bikes, a well designed 29er is the best MTB no question!


Eh, I don't find them to be all that, personally.  They do seem to work
well for the people they work well for tho...

Steve

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