[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
...and they replied right away (impressive). They said Chris has a couple meetings in the upcoming month or so with potential manufacturers, but that they do not hold out much hope that anything will come of it. They have not found a manufacturer yet who was willing to tool up for a high end freewheel since the demand forecasts are nowhere near sufficient to justify it (they threw the number 50,000 pieces a year out there). On Feb 15, 1:38 pm, William wrote: > I went ahead and emailed VO to see if they've put freewheels on the > roadmap. The last serious mention of it was last summer when they > said it was NOT on the roadmap to make a quality freewheel (although > they did say 'if' a couple times). Here's a quote: > > "Frankly, there is no good reason to use freewheels over cassettes on > new bikes, other than a certain retro-cool factor." > > So there you go. Chris K also said in the same blog post that your > best bet is to buy old suntour or european ones, and that the IRD ones > they tried selling weren't good enough. Since they make and sell new > freewheel hubs, it seems like a natural extension, provided they are > well-made. > > On Feb 15, 12:51 pm, Garth wrote: > > > The IRD FW's failing have nothing to do with the lube or cleaning > > them. It's a well known issue they've had since they began making > > them. They keep claiming to have fixed the problems with each version, > > now up to Mark IV. > > I don't think it's a coincidence Riv stopped selling them . > > Harris Cycles still does, IRD made "new" ones last summer, the Mark > > IV. If they're still failing , Harris Cycles would here about it. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
I went ahead and emailed VO to see if they've put freewheels on the roadmap. The last serious mention of it was last summer when they said it was NOT on the roadmap to make a quality freewheel (although they did say 'if' a couple times). Here's a quote: "Frankly, there is no good reason to use freewheels over cassettes on new bikes, other than a certain retro-cool factor." So there you go. Chris K also said in the same blog post that your best bet is to buy old suntour or european ones, and that the IRD ones they tried selling weren't good enough. Since they make and sell new freewheel hubs, it seems like a natural extension, provided they are well-made. On Feb 15, 12:51 pm, Garth wrote: > The IRD FW's failing have nothing to do with the lube or cleaning > them. It's a well known issue they've had since they began making > them. They keep claiming to have fixed the problems with each version, > now up to Mark IV. > I don't think it's a coincidence Riv stopped selling them . > Harris Cycles still does, IRD made "new" ones last summer, the Mark > IV. If they're still failing , Harris Cycles would here about it. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
The IRD FW's failing have nothing to do with the lube or cleaning them. It's a well known issue they've had since they began making them. They keep claiming to have fixed the problems with each version, now up to Mark IV. I don't think it's a coincidence Riv stopped selling them . Harris Cycles still does, IRD made "new" ones last summer, the Mark IV. If they're still failing , Harris Cycles would here about it. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
All this discussion continues to highlight the fact that there is no high-end multigear freewheel currently in manufacture. That's unfortunate. White Industries makes the high end one- and two-speed freewheels. If somebody made a bombproof $100 - $200 6, 7, or 8 speed freewheel, there would be customers for them. On Feb 15, 11:45 am, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hi! > > I should clarify... my bike is in a garage at night, but it isn't heated. It > isn't warm at all. That much is certain. I imagine if the nightly low outside > is 0, it's probably 5-15 in the garage. And of course it's out in elements > throughout the day, patiently awaiting my return for my ride home. My recent > problems only started when we had a series of days with highs in the > single-digits/teens in a row (sluggish freewheeling), and became problematic > (constant freewheeling) when the temperature came back up above freezing. > > I have checked the back of my recent quick-failing IRD freewheel (on the > large cog). It is marked with an "M3", meaning it's a "Mark III", the version > that is basically known to be problematic. I purchased it new from a store > within the past couple months, which is well after the "Mark IV" freewheels > were already available. Mark IV freewheels have no particular reputation for > failure that I'm aware of. > > So... be careful out there. The "Mark III" freewheels are still floating > around out there. And (call me crazy) I still have hope that with the Mark IV > freewheels and going forward (someone said there's a new version expected > this summer?) there'll be no particular cause for concern. > > I do intend to try to resurrect the recent failure. It'll be informative, > anyway. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > - Bill wrote: > > My bike rests in the comfort of a warm garage, and that might make all > > the difference. Plan B for me was going to be to have a second set of > > wheels with a cassette rear shod with the Hakkas for the winter slop, > > and use the Phils with Jack Browns during the fairer weather. Instead > > I blew the wheel budget on a go-fast bike project that's still in > > progress, so for now I'll be swapping the Hakkas and JBs depending on > > current weather conditions and forecasts. > > > I waffled for a long time on the freehub vs. cassette choice, and also > > on Bullmouse vs. Moustache bars. By being out of stock RBW decided > > the bar issue for me. > > > This is my first season for winter biking and it's been an absolute > > blast - once I mastered the temperature management issues. Wool > > works. > > > Cheers, > > Bill > > Columbus, Ohio > > > On Feb 15, 6:33 am, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Hi, Bill! Excellent to hear! > > > > I'm curious... does your bike stay outside? > > > > Mine is outside virtually 24/7. One thing I'm contemplating is bringing > > > the wheel inside on cold (sub-freezing? single-digit?) nights just to > > > give it a chance to warm up/dry out. Unfortunately it'll still be outside > > > all day. > > > > I do love the Moustache bars! Bullmoose bars are also great for the > > > Hakkapeliita-style terrain. > > > > Yours, > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > P.S. > > > Let mine be a cautionary tale... if you try a non-IRD freewheel, really > > > look closely at the cog and chain clearance. > > > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 8:59 PM, Bill wrote: > > > > > I've been riding my Sam Hillborne six days a week since last summer > > > > with a Phil-Rivy rear hub and IRD freewheel. It has racked up > > > > considerable mileage commuting through show, slush, slop, salt down to > > > > single digit temperatures and I've had absolutely zero problems with > > > > anything. FWIW, the bike with moustache bars and studded Nokian > > > > Hakkapeliitas has proven to be an ideal winter steed. I went the Phil- > > > > Rivy-freewheel route for the very same reasons you did and have no > > > > regrets at all. I expect a different freewheel will eventually be the > > > > ticket. Good luck. > > > > > On Feb 14, 9:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > wrote: > > > >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component > > > >> in the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle > > > >> is so over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle > > > >> simply isn't likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > > > >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile > > > >> of compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built > > > >> wheel. So reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub > > > >> when compared to a Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable > > > >> component of the wheel than a strengthened axle. > > > > >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. > > > >> One of my failed wheels. > > > > >> Yours, > > > >> Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > > > Can you (or
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Hi! I should clarify... my bike is in a garage at night, but it isn't heated. It isn't warm at all. That much is certain. I imagine if the nightly low outside is 0, it's probably 5-15 in the garage. And of course it's out in elements throughout the day, patiently awaiting my return for my ride home. My recent problems only started when we had a series of days with highs in the single-digits/teens in a row (sluggish freewheeling), and became problematic (constant freewheeling) when the temperature came back up above freezing. I have checked the back of my recent quick-failing IRD freewheel (on the large cog). It is marked with an "M3", meaning it's a "Mark III", the version that is basically known to be problematic. I purchased it new from a store within the past couple months, which is well after the "Mark IV" freewheels were already available. Mark IV freewheels have no particular reputation for failure that I'm aware of. So... be careful out there. The "Mark III" freewheels are still floating around out there. And (call me crazy) I still have hope that with the Mark IV freewheels and going forward (someone said there's a new version expected this summer?) there'll be no particular cause for concern. I do intend to try to resurrect the recent failure. It'll be informative, anyway. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean - Bill wrote: > My bike rests in the comfort of a warm garage, and that might make all > the difference. Plan B for me was going to be to have a second set of > wheels with a cassette rear shod with the Hakkas for the winter slop, > and use the Phils with Jack Browns during the fairer weather. Instead > I blew the wheel budget on a go-fast bike project that's still in > progress, so for now I'll be swapping the Hakkas and JBs depending on > current weather conditions and forecasts. > > I waffled for a long time on the freehub vs. cassette choice, and also > on Bullmouse vs. Moustache bars. By being out of stock RBW decided > the bar issue for me. > > This is my first season for winter biking and it's been an absolute > blast - once I mastered the temperature management issues. Wool > works. > > Cheers, > Bill > Columbus, Ohio > > On Feb 15, 6:33 am, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: > > Hi, Bill! Excellent to hear! > > > > I'm curious... does your bike stay outside? > > > > Mine is outside virtually 24/7. One thing I'm contemplating is bringing the > > wheel inside on cold (sub-freezing? single-digit?) nights just to give it a > > chance to warm up/dry out. Unfortunately it'll still be outside all day. > > > > I do love the Moustache bars! Bullmoose bars are also great for the > > Hakkapeliita-style terrain. > > > > Yours, > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > P.S. > > Let mine be a cautionary tale... if you try a non-IRD freewheel, really > > look closely at the cog and chain clearance. > > > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 8:59 PM, Bill wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've been riding my Sam Hillborne six days a week since last summer > > > with a Phil-Rivy rear hub and IRD freewheel. It has racked up > > > considerable mileage commuting through show, slush, slop, salt down to > > > single digit temperatures and I've had absolutely zero problems with > > > anything. FWIW, the bike with moustache bars and studded Nokian > > > Hakkapeliitas has proven to be an ideal winter steed. I went the Phil- > > > Rivy-freewheel route for the very same reasons you did and have no > > > regrets at all. I expect a different freewheel will eventually be the > > > ticket. Good luck. > > > > > On Feb 14, 9:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > wrote: > > >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component > > >> in the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is > > >> so over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply > > >> isn't likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > > > >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > > >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > > >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared > > >> to a Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel > > >> than a strengthened axle. > > > > >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One > > >> of my failed wheels. > > > > >> Yours, > > >> Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > > > >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > > >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > > >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the pe
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
My bike rests in the comfort of a warm garage, and that might make all the difference. Plan B for me was going to be to have a second set of wheels with a cassette rear shod with the Hakkas for the winter slop, and use the Phils with Jack Browns during the fairer weather. Instead I blew the wheel budget on a go-fast bike project that's still in progress, so for now I'll be swapping the Hakkas and JBs depending on current weather conditions and forecasts. I waffled for a long time on the freehub vs. cassette choice, and also on Bullmouse vs. Moustache bars. By being out of stock RBW decided the bar issue for me. This is my first season for winter biking and it's been an absolute blast - once I mastered the temperature management issues. Wool works. Cheers, Bill Columbus, Ohio On Feb 15, 6:33 am, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hi, Bill! Excellent to hear! > > I'm curious... does your bike stay outside? > > Mine is outside virtually 24/7. One thing I'm contemplating is bringing the > wheel inside on cold (sub-freezing? single-digit?) nights just to give it a > chance to warm up/dry out. Unfortunately it'll still be outside all day. > > I do love the Moustache bars! Bullmoose bars are also great for the > Hakkapeliita-style terrain. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > P.S. > Let mine be a cautionary tale... if you try a non-IRD freewheel, really look > closely at the cog and chain clearance. > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 8:59 PM, Bill wrote: > > > > > > > > > I've been riding my Sam Hillborne six days a week since last summer > > with a Phil-Rivy rear hub and IRD freewheel. It has racked up > > considerable mileage commuting through show, slush, slop, salt down to > > single digit temperatures and I've had absolutely zero problems with > > anything. FWIW, the bike with moustache bars and studded Nokian > > Hakkapeliitas has proven to be an ideal winter steed. I went the Phil- > > Rivy-freewheel route for the very same reasons you did and have no > > regrets at all. I expect a different freewheel will eventually be the > > ticket. Good luck. > > > On Feb 14, 9:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in > >> the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so > >> over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't > >> likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to > >> a Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a > >> strengthened axle. > > >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One > >> of my failed wheels. > > >> Yours, > >> Thomas Lynn Skean > > >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > >>> those new fangled thangs. > > >>> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > > all else equal. > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > (Om ) > > As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > not-fully-tightened spacer. > > Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > >>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group > >>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subsc
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> Oh, and I'd never heard of that approach being implemented. But I've always > felt I'd be happy with 6 speeds, if they I dexed well with quality available > shifters. Agree. 6 speeds is plenty for most Illinois riding. On Feb 14, 9:57 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Oh, and I'd never heard of that approach being implemented. But I've always > felt I'd be happy with 6 speeds, if they I dexed well with quality available > shifters. Alas, I fear that any solution involving 6/9-speed-cassette usage > is even more esoteric than an IRD freewheel. And, in the end, I think my next > step, if I need to take one, is to drop the need for dishlessness and get a > Phil cassette wheel. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 9:06 PM, rperks wrote: > > > > > Thomas, > > Out of curiosity, where are you riding that it is so cold? If it is > > that cold and wet you may or may not have problems with diferent free > > hubs freezing up as well, it can and has happened. Some manufacturers > > go as far as selling their own greases / oils partially for these > > reasons. If money were not the object, and wheel strentght is > > paramount, you could look into some of the mountain bike single speed > > hubs: King, Hope and DT all have single speed free hubs that will let > > you run the back 6 cogs of a 9sp casette. These hubs all can be built > > up dishless, and will index as well since it is a casette. Each has > > some pros and cons, like stee vs Al freehub bodies, color options or > > disc brake hole to ignore, but worth a look. If I burn out on > > freewheels that is the direction I am heading. > > > Rob > > > On Feb 14, 6:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in > >> the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so > >> over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't > >> likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to > >> a Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a > >> strengthened axle. > > >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One > >> of my failed wheels. > > >> Yours, > >> Thomas Lynn Skean > > >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > >>> those new fangled thangs. > > >>> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > > all else equal. > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > (Om ) > > As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > not-fully-tightened spacer. > > Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > >>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group > >>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.-Hide quoted text > >>> - > > >> - Show quoted text - > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Hi, Bill! Excellent to hear! I'm curious... does your bike stay outside? Mine is outside virtually 24/7. One thing I'm contemplating is bringing the wheel inside on cold (sub-freezing? single-digit?) nights just to give it a chance to warm up/dry out. Unfortunately it'll still be outside all day. I do love the Moustache bars! Bullmoose bars are also great for the Hakkapeliita-style terrain. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean P.S. Let mine be a cautionary tale... if you try a non-IRD freewheel, really look closely at the cog and chain clearance. On Feb 14, 2011, at 8:59 PM, Bill wrote: > I've been riding my Sam Hillborne six days a week since last summer > with a Phil-Rivy rear hub and IRD freewheel. It has racked up > considerable mileage commuting through show, slush, slop, salt down to > single digit temperatures and I've had absolutely zero problems with > anything. FWIW, the bike with moustache bars and studded Nokian > Hakkapeliitas has proven to be an ideal winter steed. I went the Phil- > Rivy-freewheel route for the very same reasons you did and have no > regrets at all. I expect a different freewheel will eventually be the > ticket. Good luck. > > > On Feb 14, 9:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in >> the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so >> over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't >> likely to fail, even under the likes of me! >> >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a >> Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a >> strengthened axle. >> >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of >> my failed wheels. >> >> Yours, >> Thomas Lynn Skean >> >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? >> >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on >>> those new fangled thangs. >> >>> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean >> wrote: >> > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > all else equal. >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. (Om ) >> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the not-fully-tightened spacer. >> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore >> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group >>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
I've been riding my Sam Hillborne six days a week since last summer with a Phil-Rivy rear hub and IRD freewheel. It has racked up considerable mileage commuting through show, slush, slop, salt down to single digit temperatures and I've had absolutely zero problems with anything. FWIW, the bike with moustache bars and studded Nokian Hakkapeliitas has proven to be an ideal winter steed. I went the Phil- Rivy-freewheel route for the very same reasons you did and have no regrets at all. I expect a different freewheel will eventually be the ticket. Good luck. On Feb 14, 9:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in the > hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so > over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't > likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a > Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a > strengthened axle. > > And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of > my failed wheels. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > > > > > > > >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > >> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > >> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > >> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > > That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > > FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > > thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > > those new fangled thangs. > > > On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > >> On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > >> wrote: > > >>> Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > >>> all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > >>> IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > >>> all else equal. > > >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > >> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > >> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > >> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > >> skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > >> (Om ) > > >> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > >> fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > >> not-fully-tightened spacer. > > >> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
I get it; comparing different things. Thanks. On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in the > hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so > over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't > likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a > Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a > strengthened axle. > > And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of > my failed wheels. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > >>> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole >>> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle >>> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this >>> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? >> >> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with >> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always >> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on >> those new fangled thangs. >> >> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: >>> On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean >>> >>> wrote: >>> Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, all else equal. >>> >>> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole >>> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle >>> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this >>> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am >>> skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. >>> (Om ) >>> >>> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf >>> fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the >>> not-fully-tightened spacer. >>> >>> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
I used to ride in wet and freezing weather with Sunrace freewheelsnot with a Phil hub (Suzues) and with friction shifters...why index, it just complicates things ? Never had a problem either. Lube gels at low temps and dirt gets into the innards in the heat requiring a good flushing to free them up on occasion. I had planned to go with a Phil hub and a freewheel making a symmetrical wheel but chose to go with a cassette system for now. I'm all for simplicity if attainable. The Phil cassette hub looks inviting but expensive. On Feb 14, 12:08 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Well, I hate to ask... but... > > 1) Do you ride regularly in wet weather? > 2) Do you ride regularly in cold (sub-freezing? sub-zero?) weather? > 3) Do you have a Phil Wood hub nominally intended for an IRD freewheel? > 4) Are you using modern Shimano 8-speed shifters (e.g. the 8-speed bar-ends > sold by RBW) in index mode? > > If all of those answers are true, then our situations are comparable. Yeah! > I'll definitely look into the Sunrace freewheels, since if I recall correctly > they're quite inexpensive. Otherwise, I wonder if you *would* have problems > if they were all true. > > I'll look into them anyway since they're $13 each. I'll buy one. If it works > and lasts 2000 miles including next winter, I'd buy a two dozen more and > replace them every 1500-1750 miles. $325 for 7-8 years of riding. That'd > work. :) > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > - SISDDWG wrote: > > I've been using Sunrace freewheels for several years and I've had no > > issues with them - none, zero. They shift fine and seem to last quite > > a long time. > > > On Feb 14, 5:28 am, Seth Vidal wrote: > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 11:57 PM, james wrote: > > > > fwiw I've also had one ird freewheel fail on me entirely and the one > > > > i'm using right now 'freezes' when the weather gets cold. i > > > > appreciate the info on the cold and the grease, but i would like to > > > > know also if there are other good freewheels that run about > > > > 13-32/34... i could only find cheap ones i trusted less than the ird, > > > > but now i'm not so sure... > > > > I've never used them but I wonder how the sunrace ones are? > > > >http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=31292&;... > > > > For $19 - cheap enough to try one out and find out if they are awful or > > > good. > > > > -sv > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Oh, and I'd never heard of that approach being implemented. But I've always felt I'd be happy with 6 speeds, if they I dexed well with quality available shifters. Alas, I fear that any solution involving 6/9-speed-cassette usage is even more esoteric than an IRD freewheel. And, in the end, I think my next step, if I need to take one, is to drop the need for dishlessness and get a Phil cassette wheel. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean On Feb 14, 2011, at 9:06 PM, rperks wrote: > Thomas, > Out of curiosity, where are you riding that it is so cold? If it is > that cold and wet you may or may not have problems with diferent free > hubs freezing up as well, it can and has happened. Some manufacturers > go as far as selling their own greases / oils partially for these > reasons. If money were not the object, and wheel strentght is > paramount, you could look into some of the mountain bike single speed > hubs: King, Hope and DT all have single speed free hubs that will let > you run the back 6 cogs of a 9sp casette. These hubs all can be built > up dishless, and will index as well since it is a casette. Each has > some pros and cons, like stee vs Al freehub bodies, color options or > disc brake hole to ignore, but worth a look. If I burn out on > freewheels that is the direction I am heading. > > Rob > > > On Feb 14, 6:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in >> the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so >> over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't >> likely to fail, even under the likes of me! >> >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a >> Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a >> strengthened axle. >> >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of >> my failed wheels. >> >> Yours, >> Thomas Lynn Skean >> >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: >> >> >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? >> >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on >>> those new fangled thangs. >> >>> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean >> wrote: >> > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > all else equal. >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. (Om ) >> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the not-fully-tightened spacer. >> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore >> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group >>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Lots of guys in the MTB world have been running the above mentioned SS freehubs for years and think poeople like us are nuts for using freewheels to achieve dishlessness. Also, surefire way to revive an IRD hub http://www.interlocracing.com/faq_warr.html send it back for a new one, they need to know if their stuff is failing Rob On Feb 14, 7:57 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Oh, and I'd never heard of that approach being implemented. But I've always > felt I'd be happy with 6 speeds, if they I dexed well with quality available > shifters. Alas, I fear that any solution involving 6/9-speed-cassette usage > is even more esoteric than an IRD freewheel. And, in the end, I think my next > step, if I need to take one, is to drop the need for dishlessness and get a > Phil cassette wheel. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 9:06 PM, rperks wrote: > > > > > Thomas, > > Out of curiosity, where are you riding that it is so cold? If it is > > that cold and wet you may or may not have problems with diferent free > > hubs freezing up as well, it can and has happened. Some manufacturers > > go as far as selling their own greases / oils partially for these > > reasons. If money were not the object, and wheel strentght is > > paramount, you could look into some of the mountain bike single speed > > hubs: King, Hope and DT all have single speed free hubs that will let > > you run the back 6 cogs of a 9sp casette. These hubs all can be built > > up dishless, and will index as well since it is a casette. Each has > > some pros and cons, like stee vs Al freehub bodies, color options or > > disc brake hole to ignore, but worth a look. If I burn out on > > freewheels that is the direction I am heading. > > > Rob > > > On Feb 14, 6:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in > >> the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so > >> over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't > >> likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to > >> a Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a > >> strengthened axle. > > >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One > >> of my failed wheels. > > >> Yours, > >> Thomas Lynn Skean > > >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > >>> those new fangled thangs. > > >>> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > > all else equal. > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > (Om ) > > As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > not-fully-tightened spacer. > > Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > >>> -- > >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > >>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > >>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > >>> For more options, visit this group > >>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.-Hide quoted text > >>> - > > >> - Show quoted text - > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this gr
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Wheaton, IL. The -13 was a local minimum for this season. A couple years ago it hit -20. That's not wind chill. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean On Feb 14, 2011, at 9:06 PM, rperks wrote: > Thomas, > Out of curiosity, where are you riding that it is so cold? If it is > that cold and wet you may or may not have problems with diferent free > hubs freezing up as well, it can and has happened. Some manufacturers > go as far as selling their own greases / oils partially for these > reasons. If money were not the object, and wheel strentght is > paramount, you could look into some of the mountain bike single speed > hubs: King, Hope and DT all have single speed free hubs that will let > you run the back 6 cogs of a 9sp casette. These hubs all can be built > up dishless, and will index as well since it is a casette. Each has > some pros and cons, like stee vs Al freehub bodies, color options or > disc brake hole to ignore, but worth a look. If I burn out on > freewheels that is the direction I am heading. > > Rob > > > On Feb 14, 6:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: >> That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in >> the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so >> over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't >> likely to fail, even under the likes of me! >> >> So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of >> compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So >> reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a >> Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a >> strengthened axle. >> >> And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of >> my failed wheels. >> >> Yours, >> Thomas Lynn Skean >> >> On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: >> >> >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? >> >>> That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with >>> FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always >>> thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on >>> those new fangled thangs. >> >>> On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean >> wrote: >> > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > all else equal. >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. (Om ) >> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the not-fully-tightened spacer. >> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore >> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group >>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Well, upon close inspection I notice what appears to be a new chip in the paint on the interior of the drive-side dropout. So... the Shimano freewheel isn't going to work for me as is. But it was close enough to wonder if other brands would work. It might even be reasonable to make the Shimano work with the addition of a spacing washer on the hub axle. I will likely *not* do this; I don't want to "re-space" the frame. Oh well... I'll give the IRD revival techniques a shot. If they work, I'll likely be happy with that if I can develop a reliable maintenance pattern. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean Begin forwarded message: > From: Thomas Lynn Skean > Date: February 14, 2011 3:45:50 PM CST > To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel > experiences? > Reply-To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > > Hi, all. > > I hope this isn't a duplicate... I thought I already responded but I can't > find evidence of it in my e-mail... anyway... > > Thanks so much for digging up that post. > > I am *definitely* going to have to try the Shimano again. Too many people > think it should work. I know it didn't work for me. But I wonder if there was > some other, transient issue... > > debris? (I looked for it but saw none)... > > wheel not seated in drop-out properly? (I looked for this and did not see > it... and, interestingly, though it didn't "turn" well in either direction, > it did shift perfectly!)... > > some interference between derailer and freewheel? (didn't notice it, but > didn't look for it explicitly)... > > worst would be interference between small cog and chainstay (definitely > looked for it and it was not there... but if its presence (or its absence > when I looked) resulted from the wheel not being seated properly it might've > shifted around during use... oh well, if that was the problem, there'll be > evidence on the chainstay... crap!) > > Frankly, there are things do poorly with my bike: servicing loose-ball > bearings, mounting tight tires come to mind. But taking out and re-mounting > the rear wheel is definitely one of the things I generally do well, simply > from lots of experience. Replacing broken wheels (never damaged during > replacement), replacing wheels to switch to/fro studded tires in winter... > I've also repaired the odd flat (which I have sometimes caused by trying to > remove a way-too-tight studded tire from a poorly-sized or very > loosely-tensioned rim). I'm pretty good with rear wheel mounting. So I'll be > particularly annoyed with myself if it turns out I botched it on *this > particular* occasion. > > Obviously my overall problem (one many of us on the list share, I believe) is > not having 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 52 weeks a year to mess around with > and ride my bicycle. Then I would be much more likely to take the tim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Thomas, Out of curiosity, where are you riding that it is so cold? If it is that cold and wet you may or may not have problems with diferent free hubs freezing up as well, it can and has happened. Some manufacturers go as far as selling their own greases / oils partially for these reasons. If money were not the object, and wheel strentght is paramount, you could look into some of the mountain bike single speed hubs: King, Hope and DT all have single speed free hubs that will let you run the back 6 cogs of a 9sp casette. These hubs all can be built up dishless, and will index as well since it is a casette. Each has some pros and cons, like stee vs Al freehub bodies, color options or disc brake hole to ignore, but worth a look. If I burn out on freewheels that is the direction I am heading. Rob On Feb 14, 6:20 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in the > hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so > over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't > likely to fail, even under the likes of me! > > So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of > compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So > reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a > Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a > strengthened axle. > > And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of > my failed wheels. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > > > >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > >> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > >> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > >> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > > That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > > FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > > thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > > those new fangled thangs. > > > On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > >> On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > >> wrote: > > >>> Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > >>> all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > >>> IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > >>> all else equal. > > >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > >> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > >> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > >> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > >> skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > >> (Om ) > > >> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > >> fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > >> not-fully-tightened spacer. > > >> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
That strength-comparison is based on the axle being the weak component in the hub. With Phil hubs (and some others too, I'd guess) the axle is so over-built that even in the case of the freewheel the axle simply isn't likely to fail, even under the likes of me! So the idea is that uneven spoke tension rises to the top of the pile of compromises one would like to mitigate/eliminate in the built wheel. So reduced dish, as available with an IRD-style Phil FW hub when compared to a Phil cassette hub, becomes a more valuable component of the wheel than a strengthened axle. And yes, I have bent a Shimano axle and ruined a Deore hub that way. One of my failed wheels. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean On Feb 14, 2011, at 7:57 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole >> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle >> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this >> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > those new fangled thangs. > > On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: >> On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean >> >> wrote: >> >>> Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted all >>> implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood IRD-style >>> FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, all else equal. >> >> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole >> point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle >> is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this >> fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am >> skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. >> (Om ) >> >> As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf >> fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the >> not-fully-tightened spacer. >> >> Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> Cassette hub --> less likely to break an axle > Dishless wheel --> less likely to break a spoke One of the reasons MaxiCar hubs are built around solid axles and I built the Campy hubs around solid E.A.I. axles. On Feb 14, 8:05 pm, William wrote: > All other things being equal, a cassette hub offers a far stronger > axle, because the axle is supported in more places and closer to the > frame dropouts. Bent or broken axles are essentially non-existent on > even the cheapest cassette hubs. Among freewheel hubs, I know of few > that are stronger than Phil. The number of people in the world that > can bend or break the axle on a Phil FW hub is small. > > All other things being equal a dishless wheel offers more equal spoke > tension left vs right. That's one of the reasons 130 and 135 > developed and why 145 and 160 are on tandems (and there are other > reasons). > > Cassette hub --> less likely to break an axle > Dishless wheel --> less likely to break a spoke > > On Feb 14, 5:57 pm, JoelMatthews wrote: > > > > > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > > > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > > > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > > > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > > That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > > FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > > thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > > those new fangled thangs. > > > On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > wrote: > > > > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > > > > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > > > > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > > > > all else equal. > > > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > > > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > > > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > > > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > > > skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > > > (Om ) > > > > As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > > > fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > > > not-fully-tightened spacer. > > > > Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
All other things being equal, a cassette hub offers a far stronger axle, because the axle is supported in more places and closer to the frame dropouts. Bent or broken axles are essentially non-existent on even the cheapest cassette hubs. Among freewheel hubs, I know of few that are stronger than Phil. The number of people in the world that can bend or break the axle on a Phil FW hub is small. All other things being equal a dishless wheel offers more equal spoke tension left vs right. That's one of the reasons 130 and 135 developed and why 145 and 160 are on tandems (and there are other reasons). Cassette hub --> less likely to break an axle Dishless wheel --> less likely to break a spoke On Feb 14, 5:57 pm, JoelMatthews wrote: > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? > > That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with > FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always > thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on > those new fangled thangs. > > On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > wrote: > > > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted > > > all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood > > > IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, > > > all else equal. > > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > > skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > > (Om ) > > > As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > > fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > > not-fully-tightened spacer. > > > Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? That is what I have heard as well. Obviously I have no problem with FW hubs - I've never even owned a set of cassette hubs - but always thought maybe I was giving up some strength to the people riding on those new fangled thangs. On Feb 14, 5:59 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted all > > implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood IRD-style > > FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, all else equal. > > Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole > point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle > is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am > skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. > (Om ) > > As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf > fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the > not-fully-tightened spacer. > > Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> In spite of that appeal, I remain open to the idea that all of my old wheel > problems would have been basically solved with a 36-hole Phil Wood/Synergy > O/C cassette wheel (I have and sometimes use two XT/Synergy O/C wheels, > having had only minor and probably-solved issues) or a 40-hole Phil Wood/Dyad > cassette wheel. In use I prefer the Dyad rim; it's easier to mount the tires > I use. And one person-who-knows said the 40-spoke wheel would be stronger, > despite the additional dish (there's no O/C Dyad and there's no 40-hole O/C > Synergy). Kind of hard to pick between those rims! I have 2 sets of 700 wheels. One set are 40h Dyads built around MaxiCar hubs. The other are 36h Synergy (o/c rear) built around some vintage Campagnolo hubs Peter Weigle modified. (If this weather holds I will have a link to some pictures of those wheels and the bike they roll this weekend.) Obviously both hubs are freewheel. On Feb 14, 5:46 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hi! > > - JoelMatthews wrote: > > > I still do not understand the desire to buy a new 135 freewheel hub. > > PW along with many other companies make perfectly fine casette hubs in > > that size. > > Wheel strength. > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted all > implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood IRD-style FW > hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, all else equal. > They didn't say "you need this wheel"... they didn't say "only it will > work"... they basically said it would be non-trivially stronger. I even now > have zero reason to doubt those folks or that assertion in particular. My own > history of consistently ruining wheels led me to think I wanted all the > non-trivial strength enhancement I could tolerate (didn't want a 48-spoke > wheel, didn't want a black rim). In the face of that history, those opinions, > *and* the fact that choosing a cassette wheel that would be comparably strong > meant an extra $200 right from the start... why *wouldn't* I desire a new 135 > freewheel hub? The money itself wasn't a problem. But compromising the > wheel's strength *and* paying real money to do it still seems silly. > > In hindsight, my desire (no matter how I came to have it) may have led me to > a poor choice. Freewheel issues certainly threaten my use of my current wheel > as anything other than a backup. It won't take too many more instances of a > surprise failure-to-catch as I enter traffic to make me *not* use that wheel > regularly. That'd be a shame... I've grown enamored of the elegance of a > low-dish wheel, of the isolation of the most important bearings on the bike > from the least important bearings on the bike, and of the notional simplicity > of servicing of a Phil Wood freewheel hub (haven't actually had to service it > yet). As well as the proven strength of the wheel, be it needed or not. > > In spite of that appeal, I remain open to the idea that all of my old wheel > problems would have been basically solved with a 36-hole Phil Wood/Synergy > O/C cassette wheel (I have and sometimes use two XT/Synergy O/C wheels, > having had only minor and probably-solved issues) or a 40-hole Phil Wood/Dyad > cassette wheel. In use I prefer the Dyad rim; it's easier to mount the tires > I use. And one person-who-knows said the 40-spoke wheel would be stronger, > despite the additional dish (there's no O/C Dyad and there's no 40-hole O/C > Synergy). > > In any case, I haven't given up on using the freewheel-based wheel yet. But > I'll decide over the next few months, since I would like to pick a > sustainable system and have it in place before I seriously pursue my next > Rivendell, which will probably be next year. At this point, a second 60cm > double-top-tube Hillborne is the front-runner. That bike just plain fits. > 62cm Hunqapillar and 60cm Bombadil are still in the running, though. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:59 PM, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > So what makes this > fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I meant, "stronger than the Phil cassette hub," of course. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 4:46 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > > Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted all > implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood IRD-style FW > hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, all else equal. Can you (or someone else) explain why this is so? I thought the whole point of the cassette hub design was greater strength because the axle is supported by bearings further out to the right. So what makes this fw hub stronger even than the Phil fw hub? I must admit that I am skeptical of this 3-person claim, but I am open to enlightenment. (Om ) As to Phil track hubs, I learned today that the bearings on my 2Xf fixed Phil are fine after almost 11K miles: the roughness was the not-fully-tightened spacer. Patrick "no dish, no worries" Moore -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Hi! - JoelMatthews wrote: > > I still do not understand the desire to buy a new 135 freewheel hub. > PW along with many other companies make perfectly fine casette hubs in > that size. Wheel strength. Generally, the 3-people-who-actually-know-these-things that I contacted all implied or stated outright that a wheel built around a Phil Wood IRD-style FW hub would be stronger than one built with a cassette hub, all else equal. They didn't say "you need this wheel"... they didn't say "only it will work"... they basically said it would be non-trivially stronger. I even now have zero reason to doubt those folks or that assertion in particular. My own history of consistently ruining wheels led me to think I wanted all the non-trivial strength enhancement I could tolerate (didn't want a 48-spoke wheel, didn't want a black rim). In the face of that history, those opinions, *and* the fact that choosing a cassette wheel that would be comparably strong meant an extra $200 right from the start... why *wouldn't* I desire a new 135 freewheel hub? The money itself wasn't a problem. But compromising the wheel's strength *and* paying real money to do it still seems silly. In hindsight, my desire (no matter how I came to have it) may have led me to a poor choice. Freewheel issues certainly threaten my use of my current wheel as anything other than a backup. It won't take too many more instances of a surprise failure-to-catch as I enter traffic to make me *not* use that wheel regularly. That'd be a shame... I've grown enamored of the elegance of a low-dish wheel, of the isolation of the most important bearings on the bike from the least important bearings on the bike, and of the notional simplicity of servicing of a Phil Wood freewheel hub (haven't actually had to service it yet). As well as the proven strength of the wheel, be it needed or not. In spite of that appeal, I remain open to the idea that all of my old wheel problems would have been basically solved with a 36-hole Phil Wood/Synergy O/C cassette wheel (I have and sometimes use two XT/Synergy O/C wheels, having had only minor and probably-solved issues) or a 40-hole Phil Wood/Dyad cassette wheel. In use I prefer the Dyad rim; it's easier to mount the tires I use. And one person-who-knows said the 40-spoke wheel would be stronger, despite the additional dish (there's no O/C Dyad and there's no 40-hole O/C Synergy). In any case, I haven't given up on using the freewheel-based wheel yet. But I'll decide over the next few months, since I would like to pick a sustainable system and have it in place before I seriously pursue my next Rivendell, which will probably be next year. At this point, a second 60cm double-top-tube Hillborne is the front-runner. That bike just plain fits. 62cm Hunqapillar and 60cm Bombadil are still in the running, though. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> IIRC, there is a few hundred dollars difference in cost. But then one has to wonder whether it would be better getting a Shimano Cassette for less than the PW FW - or perhaps a White Industries H3 Casette hub priced a little more than the PW FW hub but a lot less than the PW Cassette. On Feb 14, 4:07 pm, Allan in Portland wrote: > > I still do not understand the desire to buy a new 135 freewheel hub. > > PW along with many other companies make perfectly fine casette hubs in > > that size. > > IIRC, there is a few hundred dollars difference in cost. > > -Allan -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> I still do not understand the desire to buy a new 135 freewheel hub. > PW along with many other companies make perfectly fine casette hubs in > that size. IIRC, there is a few hundred dollars difference in cost. -Allan -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
With all the vintage hubs in my collection, I have never bothered looking at Riv's hubs page. I still do not understand the desire to buy a new 135 freewheel hub. PW along with many other companies make perfectly fine casette hubs in that size. The PW freewheel products page was not loading for me just now, but it appears from the main hub page that PW does make IRD specific freewheels from 120 up. I can understand a rider not wanting to spread the chainstays going with a PW and freewheel in that situation. However, if the IRD are not reliable, spreading chain stays is no big deal and would be my preference, unless the frame is a vintage Herse or something (and in that case, you may as well pop for a MaxiCar). On Feb 14, 2:50 pm, Minh wrote: > Here's an email from a few months ago, i believe it's a slight spacing > optimization on the IRD phil wood hubs that make them special, but > that you can use regular free-wheels as well. > > - > The whole IRD/Riv FW thing confuses everyone I've talked to about it. > The guys at PW were kind enough to explain the IRD specific hub > design > to me last year when I was deciding on hubs for another set of > wheels. > " Garth, > OK I spoke with our engineer for a little more feedback > on this IRD thing because > it is basically a little confusing to me a well, here's > the scoop. These IRD hubs were > a concept dreamed up by Rivendell which took our > standard > freewheel hubs and > moved the hub shell over to the drive side by about 2mm > for the IRD freewheels > which is supposed to help off set the wheel dishing > (Rivendell likes to build wheels > with a little dish as possible) as well as the chain > line > when an IRD freewheel is used. > When Rivendell commissioned these IRD hubs they asked > that they be an Rivy exclusive > and we agreed to this for one year. After the year had > expired (this year) our engineer and > General Manager thought it would be a good idea to offer > the hubs as part of our product line > for riders who may want to have minimal dishing when > using an IRD. > So long story short the IRD freewheels can in deed be > used with either one of our freewheel > hubs it just depends on how concerned you are about > eliminating some of the wheel dish. > Now you know as much as I do about the reasoning behind > the IRD option and I > hope it clears things up a little. > Thank You, > Mark > Phil Wood & Co. " > In the end, I decided not to get the "IRD" FW hubs from PW, just the > same regular touring hubs I've been using. > You can still use any brand of FW with the IRD/Riv hub, it will just > be closer to the chainstay how close depends on your frame. > You can use an IRD FW with any english threaded FW hub. > BTW, I've been hearing more reports of IRD failures, despite the > later > supposedly improved models. There's supposed to be a new batch this > summer. Yes . those that got a good one say "what's the problem, > mine's been fine ?" For those that didn't it rots. I've never > heard of any FW having so many problems as the IRD ones. If you need > a > 13-28 and can live with the awful black Shimano 28 cog, their FW's > are > still good. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Hi, all. I hope this isn't a duplicate... I thought I already responded but I can't find evidence of it in my e-mail... anyway... Thanks so much for digging up that post. I am *definitely* going to have to try the Shimano again. Too many people think it should work. I know it didn't work for me. But I wonder if there was some other, transient issue... debris? (I looked for it but saw none)... wheel not seated in drop-out properly? (I looked for this and did not see it... and, interestingly, though it didn't "turn" well in either direction, it did shift perfectly!)... some interference between derailer and freewheel? (didn't notice it, but didn't look for it explicitly)... worst would be interference between small cog and chainstay (definitely looked for it and it was not there... but if its presence (or its absence when I looked) resulted from the wheel not being seated properly it might've shifted around during use... oh well, if that was the problem, there'll be evidence on the chainstay... crap!) Frankly, there are things do poorly with my bike: servicing loose-ball bearings, mounting tight tires come to mind. But taking out and re-mounting the rear wheel is definitely one of the things I generally do well, simply from lots of experience. Replacing broken wheels (never damaged during replacement), replacing wheels to switch to/fro studded tires in winter... I've also repaired the odd flat (which I have sometimes caused by trying to remove a way-too-tight studded tire from a poorly-sized or very loosely-tensioned rim). I'm pretty good with rear wheel mounting. So I'll be particularly annoyed with myself if it turns out I botched it on *this particular* occasion. Obviously my overall problem (one many of us on the list share, I believe) is not having 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 52 weeks a year to mess around with and ride my bicycle. Then I would be much more likely to take the time necessary to notice all the little things before they become big things. And still have plenty of time to ride as much as I'm physically able. Bicycle nirvana! Cyclo-librium! True existence! If the Shimano freewheel can be made to work, I won't let an ugly-for-no-good-reason big cog stop me. Though if the Shimano actually works well, I'll definitely look at the Sunrace. I don't want a 10-tooth jump like the Shimano 14-34 Megarange (does that even work?). And the 7-speed Sunrace I can get easily has the same gearing (13-15-17-19-21-24-28) as the other Shimano 7-speed I can get easily... for a third less money. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean - Minh wrote: > Here's an email from a few months ago, i believe it's a slight spacing > optimization on the IRD phil wood hubs that make them special, but > that you can use regular free-wheels as well. > > > > - > The whole IRD/Riv FW thing confuses everyone I've talked to about it. > The guys at PW were kind enough to explain the IRD specific hub > design > to me last year when I was deciding on hubs for another set of > wheels. > " Garth, > OK I spoke with our engineer for a little more feedback > on this IRD thing because > it is basically a little confusing to me a well, here's > the scoop. These IRD hubs were > a concept dreamed up by Rivendell which took our > standard > freewheel hubs and > moved the hub shell over to the drive side by about 2mm > for the IRD freewheels > which is supposed to help off set the wheel dishing > (Rivendell likes to build wheels > with a little dish as possible) as well as the chain > line > when an IRD freewheel is used. > When Rivendell commissioned these IRD hubs they asked > that they be an Rivy exclusive > and we agreed to this for one year. After the year had > expired (this year) our engineer and > General Manager thought it would be a good idea to offer > the hubs as part of our product line > for riders who may want to have minimal dishing when > using an IRD. > So long story short the IRD freewheels can in deed be > used with either one of our freewheel > hubs it just depends on how concerned you are about > eliminating some of the wheel dish. > Now you know as much as I do about the reasoning behind > the IRD option and I > hope it clears things up a little. >Thank You, >Mark > Phil Wood & Co. " > In the end, I decided not to get the "IRD" FW hubs from PW, just the > same regular touring hubs I've been using. > You can still use any brand of FW with the IRD/Riv hub, it will just > be closer to the chainstay how close depends on your frame. > You can use an IRD FW with any english threaded FW hub. > BTW, I've been hearing more reports of IRD failures, despite the > later > supposedly improved models. There's supposed to be a new
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Here's an email from a few months ago, i believe it's a slight spacing optimization on the IRD phil wood hubs that make them special, but that you can use regular free-wheels as well. - The whole IRD/Riv FW thing confuses everyone I've talked to about it. The guys at PW were kind enough to explain the IRD specific hub design to me last year when I was deciding on hubs for another set of wheels. " Garth, OK I spoke with our engineer for a little more feedback on this IRD thing because it is basically a little confusing to me a well, here's the scoop. These IRD hubs were a concept dreamed up by Rivendell which took our standard freewheel hubs and moved the hub shell over to the drive side by about 2mm for the IRD freewheels which is supposed to help off set the wheel dishing (Rivendell likes to build wheels with a little dish as possible) as well as the chain line when an IRD freewheel is used. When Rivendell commissioned these IRD hubs they asked that they be an Rivy exclusive and we agreed to this for one year. After the year had expired (this year) our engineer and General Manager thought it would be a good idea to offer the hubs as part of our product line for riders who may want to have minimal dishing when using an IRD. So long story short the IRD freewheels can in deed be used with either one of our freewheel hubs it just depends on how concerned you are about eliminating some of the wheel dish. Now you know as much as I do about the reasoning behind the IRD option and I hope it clears things up a little. Thank You, Mark Phil Wood & Co. " In the end, I decided not to get the "IRD" FW hubs from PW, just the same regular touring hubs I've been using. You can still use any brand of FW with the IRD/Riv hub, it will just be closer to the chainstay how close depends on your frame. You can use an IRD FW with any english threaded FW hub. BTW, I've been hearing more reports of IRD failures, despite the later supposedly improved models. There's supposed to be a new batch this summer. Yes . those that got a good one say "what's the problem, mine's been fine ?" For those that didn't it rots. I've never heard of any FW having so many problems as the IRD ones. If you need a 13-28 and can live with the awful black Shimano 28 cog, their FW's are still good. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Well, I hate to ask... but... 1) Do you ride regularly in wet weather? 2) Do you ride regularly in cold (sub-freezing? sub-zero?) weather? 3) Do you have a Phil Wood hub nominally intended for an IRD freewheel? 4) Are you using modern Shimano 8-speed shifters (e.g. the 8-speed bar-ends sold by RBW) in index mode? If all of those answers are true, then our situations are comparable. Yeah! I'll definitely look into the Sunrace freewheels, since if I recall correctly they're quite inexpensive. Otherwise, I wonder if you *would* have problems if they were all true. I'll look into them anyway since they're $13 each. I'll buy one. If it works and lasts 2000 miles including next winter, I'd buy a two dozen more and replace them every 1500-1750 miles. $325 for 7-8 years of riding. That'd work. :) Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean - SISDDWG wrote: > I've been using Sunrace freewheels for several years and I've had no > issues with them - none, zero. They shift fine and seem to last quite > a long time. > > On Feb 14, 5:28 am, Seth Vidal wrote: > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 11:57 PM, james wrote: > > > fwiw I've also had one ird freewheel fail on me entirely and the one > > > i'm using right now 'freezes' when the weather gets cold. i > > > appreciate the info on the cold and the grease, but i would like to > > > know also if there are other good freewheels that run about > > > 13-32/34... i could only find cheap ones i trusted less than the ird, > > > but now i'm not so sure... > > > > I've never used them but I wonder how the sunrace ones are? > > > > http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=31292&;... > > > > For $19 - cheap enough to try one out and find out if they are awful or > > good. > > > > -sv > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
I've been using Sunrace freewheels for several years and I've had no issues with them - none, zero. They shift fine and seem to last quite a long time. On Feb 14, 5:28 am, Seth Vidal wrote: > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 11:57 PM, james wrote: > > fwiw I've also had one ird freewheel fail on me entirely and the one > > i'm using right now 'freezes' when the weather gets cold. i > > appreciate the info on the cold and the grease, but i would like to > > know also if there are other good freewheels that run about > > 13-32/34... i could only find cheap ones i trusted less than the ird, > > but now i'm not so sure... > > I've never used them but I wonder how the sunrace ones are? > > http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=31292&;... > > For $19 - cheap enough to try one out and find out if they are awful or good. > > -sv -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> I've been informed by a person with direct experience (to say the least) that > I could expect a 6-speed Suntour Winner or Winner Pro or a 7-speed Suntour > Winner "compact" freewheel to work on my wheel. I second the advice if this works for you. I have Winner Pros and am very happy with them. On Feb 14, 1:11 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hi! > > Well... okay. > > It's just that the Shimano freewheel I purchased from RBW doesn't work on my > wheel, which has a hub that is nominally for an IRD freewheel. > > There was plenty of room between the stay and the small cog. I didn't > cross-thread it or anything. It screwed on (and off, thank goodness) cleanly. > It just turned clunkily under any power. And the chain rested on the chain > stay when coasting. It wasn't completely frozen. But obviously it wasn't > functioning properly. And since all I did was screw it on, I don't think > there's anything else I could have done that would make it function properly. > > I guess there are many ways in which Shimano and IRD are substitutes for one > another. Just not on my wheel. > > I'm having deja vu... I once posted about my Sugino XD2 crank being > incompatible with my 107mm Velo-Orange bottom bracket (which I measured, just > to be sure). The several still-believed-by-me testimonials about using those > two products together didn't change the fact that if you tightened *my* crank > onto *my* VO BB's taper so that it was even approaching tight (and way less > than the spec'd torque), the crank would be in contact with the bottom > bracket's body. They were incompatible. > > I've been informed by a person with direct experience (to say the least) that > I could expect a 6-speed Suntour Winner or Winner Pro or a 7-speed Suntour > Winner "compact" freewheel to work on my wheel. Expensive. But not > unthinkable if it is spaced such that it indexes well. I suspect it is. I > wouldn't be happy getting just one; I'd need a "warm backup". > > But the maintenance path isn't clear to me. It seems I could maintain the > ratchet mechanism on one to last many thousands of miles (perhaps more miles > than I have in me... I'm riding about 100 miles/week). But wouldn't I expect > to need to replace at least some cogs every few thousand or so? If so, I'd > have to collect some cogs up front and make sure I can do that myself as > well. I don't know; I don't have any long-term experiences with freewheels in > general, let alone high-end ones. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > - omnigrid wrote: > > IRD freewheels are just Shimano-compatible freewheels, man. Nothing special. > > You dont need to use IRD...I wouldnt. > > > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 2:18 AM, Thomas Lynn Skean < > > thomaslynnsk...@comcast.net> wrote: > > > > Oh, and I should note that this IRD specificity is noted in the "hub > > > dimensions" document on Phil Wood's site. Where, interestingly, it > > > does *not* list the dimensions for the IRD-intended hubs. > > > > I should also add that I suspect that this IRD difference is actually > > > a modern usage by IRD of a standard which has been around for some > > > time, the "compact" freewheel. Can anyone confirm/deny/clarify? > > > > Insomniacally yours, > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > On Feb 14, 1:50 am, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > wrote: > > > > Hi. > > > > > It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with > > > the IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets > > > being spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe > > > there > > > are other differences as well. > > > > > In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when > > > I put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely > > > at all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't > > > think that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar > > > issues when first installed. > > > > > Yours, > > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > > On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > > > > > > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > > > > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > > > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews > > > wrote: > > > > > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > > > > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > > > > > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > > > > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > > > > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Hello, all! > > > > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on > > > a > > > > > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any > > > experience > > > > > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") > > > > > > 7- > > > > > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > > > > > first one
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Hi! Well... okay. It's just that the Shimano freewheel I purchased from RBW doesn't work on my wheel, which has a hub that is nominally for an IRD freewheel. There was plenty of room between the stay and the small cog. I didn't cross-thread it or anything. It screwed on (and off, thank goodness) cleanly. It just turned clunkily under any power. And the chain rested on the chain stay when coasting. It wasn't completely frozen. But obviously it wasn't functioning properly. And since all I did was screw it on, I don't think there's anything else I could have done that would make it function properly. I guess there are many ways in which Shimano and IRD are substitutes for one another. Just not on my wheel. I'm having deja vu... I once posted about my Sugino XD2 crank being incompatible with my 107mm Velo-Orange bottom bracket (which I measured, just to be sure). The several still-believed-by-me testimonials about using those two products together didn't change the fact that if you tightened *my* crank onto *my* VO BB's taper so that it was even approaching tight (and way less than the spec'd torque), the crank would be in contact with the bottom bracket's body. They were incompatible. I've been informed by a person with direct experience (to say the least) that I could expect a 6-speed Suntour Winner or Winner Pro or a 7-speed Suntour Winner "compact" freewheel to work on my wheel. Expensive. But not unthinkable if it is spaced such that it indexes well. I suspect it is. I wouldn't be happy getting just one; I'd need a "warm backup". But the maintenance path isn't clear to me. It seems I could maintain the ratchet mechanism on one to last many thousands of miles (perhaps more miles than I have in me... I'm riding about 100 miles/week). But wouldn't I expect to need to replace at least some cogs every few thousand or so? If so, I'd have to collect some cogs up front and make sure I can do that myself as well. I don't know; I don't have any long-term experiences with freewheels in general, let alone high-end ones. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean - omnigrid wrote: > IRD freewheels are just Shimano-compatible freewheels, man. Nothing special. > You dont need to use IRD...I wouldnt. > > > > On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 2:18 AM, Thomas Lynn Skean < > thomaslynnsk...@comcast.net> wrote: > > > Oh, and I should note that this IRD specificity is noted in the "hub > > dimensions" document on Phil Wood's site. Where, interestingly, it > > does *not* list the dimensions for the IRD-intended hubs. > > > > I should also add that I suspect that this IRD difference is actually > > a modern usage by IRD of a standard which has been around for some > > time, the "compact" freewheel. Can anyone confirm/deny/clarify? > > > > Insomniacally yours, > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > > > On Feb 14, 1:50 am, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Hi. > > > > > > It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with > > the IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets > > being spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe there > > are other differences as well. > > > > > > In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when > > I put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely > > at all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't > > think that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar > > issues when first installed. > > > > > > Yours, > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > > > On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > > > > > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > > > > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews > > wrote: > > > > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > > > > > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > > > > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > > > > > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > > > > > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > wrote: > > > > > Hello, all! > > > > > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on > > a > > > > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any > > experience > > > > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > > > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > > > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > > > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > > > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > > > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > > > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > > > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > > > > > It had ju
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
IRD freewheels are just Shimano-compatible freewheels, man. Nothing special. You dont need to use IRD...I wouldnt. On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 2:18 AM, Thomas Lynn Skean < thomaslynnsk...@comcast.net> wrote: > Oh, and I should note that this IRD specificity is noted in the "hub > dimensions" document on Phil Wood's site. Where, interestingly, it > does *not* list the dimensions for the IRD-intended hubs. > > I should also add that I suspect that this IRD difference is actually > a modern usage by IRD of a standard which has been around for some > time, the "compact" freewheel. Can anyone confirm/deny/clarify? > > Insomniacally yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > On Feb 14, 1:50 am, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: > > Hi. > > > > It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with > the IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets > being spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe there > are other differences as well. > > > > In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when > I put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely > at all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't > think that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar > issues when first installed. > > > > Yours, > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > > > > > > > > > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > > > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews > wrote: > > > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > > > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > > > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > > > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > > > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > wrote: > > > > Hello, all! > > > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on > a > > > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any > experience > > > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > > > > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > > > > related. > > > > > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > > > > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > > > > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > > > > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > > > > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > > > > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > > > > > Yours, > > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > > -- > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > . > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > > For more options, visit this group athttp:// > groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > > > -- > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > . > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > > For more options, visit this group athttp:// > groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
> Technically the IRD freewheels are not user-serviceable. If anyone has hints > as to how to get into the innards of an IRD freewheel without destroying > them, I'd love to hear them. This is not IRD specific, so I have no idea if the instructions are any good for IRD, but here.s some info from bikeforums.net on servicing a freewheel. http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/707342-Build-a-long-freewheel-Photo-heavy I have a small collection of freewheels because I don't own a casette hub wheel and want to keep my bikes running forever. I'm currently running IRD on two bikes. The old FWs are the spares when I can't find anything else. One IRD freewheel has maybe 1000 miles on it without problem, the other has only a few miles, also without trouble. I haven't tried the rebuild process yet, but will before long. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Guess I ned to get out more as I had no idea there were IRD freewheel specific hubs. Seems counterintuitive to me. All my multigear bikes have freewheels as I use vintage hubs. While I have a pretty good store of NOS freewheels, I was happy to see IRD coming out with a new line of freewheels, as it at once assured supply and took pressure off the price of NOS freewheels. Riding on vintage hubs is not for everyone. There are plenty of us out there, however. Not surprisingly really, as a well maintained hub can last many years. Much as I like my vintage freewheel hubs, the need for a new freewheel hubs escapes me. Cassette freewheels are in fact easier to use and maintain. Seems to me those buying new but not wanting 10 or 11 cogs in the back would be better served looking for nos 7 - 9 cog cassettes to put on a modern cassett hub than buying an all new freewheel set up. On Feb 14, 7:51 am, rperks wrote: > The difference between the touring and IRD as far as I know is in the > spacers or endcaps, this was published somewhere in the iBOB archives > in the last two years. As for the specs from phil, they are in a slow > process of fixing their published data, call them and they are great > on the phone. The threading is the same, english standard. If you > freewheel is truly binding, that is weird. is it rubbing anywhere, > back of the freewheel against the hub flange? or at the stays? As > for break in there should not need to be much, unsless you again have > frozen grease problems. > > Rob > > On Feb 13, 11:50 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: > > > > > Hi. > > > It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with the > > IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets > > being spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe > > there are other differences as well. > > > In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when I > > put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely at > > all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't think > > that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar issues > > when first installed. > > > Yours, > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > > > > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews > > > wrote: > > > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > > > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > > wrote: > > > > Hello, all! > > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > > > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > > > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > > > > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > > > > related. > > > > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > > > > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > > > > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > > > > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > > > > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > > > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > > > > Yours, > > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > -- > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > > For more options, visit this group > > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > > -- > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > > For more options, visit this group > > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
The difference between the touring and IRD as far as I know is in the spacers or endcaps, this was published somewhere in the iBOB archives in the last two years. As for the specs from phil, they are in a slow process of fixing their published data, call them and they are great on the phone. The threading is the same, english standard. If you freewheel is truly binding, that is weird. is it rubbing anywhere, back of the freewheel against the hub flange? or at the stays? As for break in there should not need to be much, unsless you again have frozen grease problems. Rob On Feb 13, 11:50 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hi. > > It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with the > IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets being > spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe there are > other differences as well. > > In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when I > put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely at > all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't think > that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar issues when > first installed. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > > > > > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Hello, all! > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > > > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > > > related. > > > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > > > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > > > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > > > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > > > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > > > Yours, > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 11:57 PM, james wrote: > fwiw I've also had one ird freewheel fail on me entirely and the one > i'm using right now 'freezes' when the weather gets cold. i > appreciate the info on the cold and the grease, but i would like to > know also if there are other good freewheels that run about > 13-32/34... i could only find cheap ones i trusted less than the ird, > but now i'm not so sure... > I've never used them but I wonder how the sunrace ones are? http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=31292&category=402 For $19 - cheap enough to try one out and find out if they are awful or good. -sv -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Thomas, I'm not sure what "really" cold is (live in the south), but I have a new Shimano freewheel on my Atlantis and it's worked great so far. Friday's commute to work was 19 degrees, the one prior to that was in the low 20s with several inches of snow. Today, a more typical low 50s :-) These haven't been out there a long time so I don't have a ton of miles on them (I purchased several from my LBS), but so far so good. Using it on a Phil Wood/RBW touring hub :-) Angus On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hello, all! > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > speed freewheel hub? > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > related. > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Oh, and I should note that this IRD specificity is noted in the "hub dimensions" document on Phil Wood's site. Where, interestingly, it does *not* list the dimensions for the IRD-intended hubs. I should also add that I suspect that this IRD difference is actually a modern usage by IRD of a standard which has been around for some time, the "compact" freewheel. Can anyone confirm/deny/clarify? Insomniacally yours, Thomas Lynn Skean On Feb 14, 1:50 am, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hi. > > It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with the > IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets being > spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe there are > other differences as well. > > In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when I > put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely at > all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't think > that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar issues when > first installed. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > > > > > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > > wrote: > > > Hello, all! > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > > > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > > > related. > > > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > > > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > > > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > > > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > > > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > > > Yours, > > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group > > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Hi. It seems that Phil Wood has created a hub specifically to be used with the IRD freewheel. I think it has to do with the IRD freewheel's sprockets being spaced more closely than, say, the Shimano freewheel's. Or maybe there are other differences as well. In any case, there is some significant difference in something. For when I put the RBW-sold Shimano freewheel on my hub, it does not "coast" freely at all. Now, maybe there's supposed to be a break-in period. But I don't think that's what this is. The IRD freewheels I've used had no similar issues when first installed. Yours, Thomas Lynn Skean On Feb 13, 2011, at 6:31 PM, omnigrid wrote: > Phil Wood IRD hub? > > I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: > > Hello, all! > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > > related. > > > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > > > Yours, > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
Phil Wood IRD hub? I think you maybe confused. IRD is a company or brand. On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: > I have no experience at all with IRD. > > On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting > bike I have a Suntour Winner. > > Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. > > On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: > > Hello, all! > > > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > > speed freewheel hub? > > > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > > related. > > > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > > > Yours, > > Thomas Lynn Skean > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
i've had reasonable success with boeshield when tenacious didn't work. Spray in the boeshield, and let it do the magic. Less lubrication, sure, but I'm not too worried about it. Through some tenacious in after a few days if it worries you, but I'm maybe 2k out on such a treatment with the freewheel on my city bike. It's been saved, as far as I can tell. Cheers, erik On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 8:57 PM, james wrote: > fwiw I've also had one ird freewheel fail on me entirely and the one > i'm using right now 'freezes' when the weather gets cold. i > appreciate the info on the cold and the grease, but i would like to > know also if there are other good freewheels that run about > 13-32/34... i could only find cheap ones i trusted less than the ird, > but now i'm not so sure... > > james > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- oakland, ca bikenoir.blogspot.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
fwiw I've also had one ird freewheel fail on me entirely and the one i'm using right now 'freezes' when the weather gets cold. i appreciate the info on the cold and the grease, but i would like to know also if there are other good freewheels that run about 13-32/34... i could only find cheap ones i trusted less than the ird, but now i'm not so sure... james -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/freewheels.html Scroll down to lubricating frewheels, something like phil tenacious oil or thick gear oil should work pretty well. A little goes a long way, so take it slow or look forward to cleaning off your spokes and maybe the walls too. I have done this on the IRD units with mixed success. I had a Mk 2 model that should have failed in theory, but went strong for a very long time. I had a Mk 3 on another bike and the bearings went to crap and got all rough after about a year, IRD recently sent me two new ones as replacements. The new ones are silky smooth, but have a little more play than I was used to, time will tell. Even though they have their quirks I still love how silent the freewheels are. On my weekend ride I crossed paths with a few groups of other roadies. When they would coast the noise was shockingly loud, swarms of bees mixed with a whole deck of baseball cards slapping through the spokes crazy loud. While waiting for my replacement wheels I looked into my other options for byulding a dishless wheel and decided the price and noise are not worth it. Rob On Feb 13, 5:54 pm, "Thomas Lynn Skean" wrote: > Hi! > > I haven't tried that. But then again, I have no way to re-introduce grease > into the freewheel after I've flushed it with solvent. So earlier (before I > had any *complete* failures) I was reluctant to do anything like that. > Technically the IRD freewheels are not user-serviceable. If anyone has hints > as to how to get into the innards of an IRD freewheel without destroying > them, I'd love to hear them. > > Interestingly, my latest failure was happened *after* the temperature rose > from -13 to +33 within 5 days. And the first failure happened as the > temperature was dropping but was not yet super cold. Perhaps it has something > to do with "passing through" the freezing/melting point of any water that may > have gotten into the freewheel. > > In any case, there's no harm in futzing around with a non-funtioning > freewheel; it risks nothing but time. So I do intend to pursue getting a look > at the insides of one as time allows. > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > > > - Original Message - > From: Jason Hartman > To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 7:29 PM > Subject: Re: [RBW] Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel > experiences? > > Have you tried flushing the non working freewheels with solvent? > > It's pretty common for freewheels and even freehubs to stop > working when they get really cold. The grease solidifies and > keeps the pawls from catching. > > Jay Hartman > > On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 5:45 PM, Thomas Lynn Skean > wrote: > > Hello, all! > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > speed freewheel hub? > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > related. > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group > athttp://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message bec
[RBW] Re: Phil Wood "IRD" FW hub and/or Shimano freewheel experiences?
I have no experience at all with IRD. On my camper bike I use a Shimano Megarange FW. On my more sporting bike I have a Suntour Winner. Picked up both from the eBay NOS store. No problems with either. On Feb 13, 4:45 pm, Thomas Lynn Skean wrote: > Hello, all! > > Does anyone have any experience using the "Shimanopore" freewheel on a > Phil Wood "IRD" 7-speed freewheel hub? Does anyone have any experience > using the "Shimanopore" freewheel with a "normal" (i.e. non-"IRD") 7- > speed freewheel hub? > > I've had to replace three IRD 7-speed freewheels in 7 months. The > first one (13-28) lasted a couple thousand miles but then started to > fail to catch within a reasonable amount of rotation. The next one > (non-mega 13-32) didn't work at all; the small cog was broken. The > next one (non-mega 13-32) lasted only a few hundred miles before > starting to "freeze" (introducing top-of-the-stay slack) and then, > within a week or so, began to fail to catch like the first one. > > It had just gotten cold when the first one failed. It has just been > *really* cold when the third one failed. I don't know if that's > related. > > If these freewheels typically last only a couple thousand mikes, I'll > be disappointed but I'll deal. If there's an alternative freewheel > like the Shimano I'll use those. If fteewheels are just this > inconsistent and I can't find an alternative freewheel arrangement, > I'll switch to a cassette system ASAP and move on. > > Anybody have any insights / info / suggestions? > > Yours, > Thomas Lynn Skean -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
