Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
James, Everybody, Can you please let me know your impressions as to why those dogs died? What is it that silver in this amount would do? And what if it's ionic silver in this amount? Also, does anyone know where I can get the fine, particulate silver? As with other forms of silver I'm thinking about using this to saturate ceramic water filters. Reid James Holmes wrote, Please note folk, 3.8 g. Is the TOXIC dose, NOT the lethal dose. Dogs (don't remember the weight) were killed with 1 gram of fine metal powder injected. Not intentionally; they were trying to create a blood problem to study. It is in John Hill's book. Who would ever want to get anywhere that, and how could you do it even if 10 times the required dose was administered? -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSMike M.'s process questions...
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60431.html Re: CSMike M.'s process questions... From: Mike Monett Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 22:40:16 Sorry, Mike. It rained last night and mold spores are everywhere. The headaches make it difficult to catch my mistakes before posting. I wrote: Since both electrodes have the same area, I use either one to calculate the wetted area. Please change to: Since both electrodes have the same area, I use either one to calculate the current density. I can't believe I made so many mistakes today. Tomorrow should be better. But thanks very much for taking an interest in this, Mike. Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60419.html Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux From: Robert Berger Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:00:10 Mike, Look at my data plot. I don't run 335 uA continually. The current starts out at 2.64 ma or 66 uA/sqin. and builds until the regualto cuts in at 12.6 ma. running in 2 gallons of 4 ppm CS. This was a reprocessed lot as stated. I guess I could order in the silver for this experiment. I'll think about it. Ole Bob Hey Bob, that's great! You will find this system is quite different from what you are used to. Your LM117 regulator won't go down to 335 uA. A LM134 would work better, but there's no need to complicate things just to take a look. You may be using a 24V doorbell transformer to supply the DC. If so, you should get about 34 to 36 Volts. Here's my notes from the last run: Sun Jun 15, 2003, 06:13:45 pm Started run. Quit at midnight Sun Jun 15, 2003, 06:13:25 pm 6.43V 323uA Sun Jun 15, 2003, 07:23:51 pm 2.598 322uA Sun Jun 15, 2003, 08:29:35 pm 2.200 321uA Sun Jun 15, 2003, 09:48:25 pm 1.754 322Ua Sun Jun 15, 2003, 10:27:32 pm 1.632 321uA Sun Jun 15, 2003, 11:58:56 pm 1.501 333uA Mon Jun 16, 2003, 12:17:11 am 1.483 335uA Tiny bit on anode rods. Make them the cathode next time. You can see the voltage dropped quite rapidly at first, then gradually decreased. This is the familiar 1/t curve where most of the change occurs at the beginning. The reason for the increase at the end is the line voltage changed when everyone turned off the lights and tv and went to bed. The tv draws high current at the peak of the cycle, which flattens the peak. When this effect is removed, the peak voltage increases and my rectifier/filter shows a 4% increase in DC voltage. That's OK. After the first hour, the voltage across the cell was about 2V or less. If you have 34V available, then all you need is a resistor to set the current. The value is R = E / I = (34 - 2) / 335e-6 = 95522.388 ohms A 100K is a common standard value. It will probably have 5% tolerance. That's OK. The current will be slightly low at the beginning, then asymptotically approach the final value. When you integrate it over time, there will be a small error but not enough to change the results significantly. You can use the integrated value to calculate the ppm. 400 millitres should be a good volume to try. It won't take so long. I'm thrilled that you might give this a try. Thanks! Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSquestions
Hi all, want to rephrase my question re drug addiction. I want to know for one recovering from the effects would CS help in any way. Thank you, leslie3...@yahoo.com __ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Seasilver Bust. The Regulation of Products Generally
Tobacco products are represented by 25% of the population. The 75% of the population thinks it's OK to tax them in self defense since another majority, that includes some of the 25%, thinks it's their moral duty to pay for other peoples errors in judgement. That's the tyranny of the masses aka democracy, and social engineering at work. Ode At 01:58 PM 6/18/2003 -0500, you wrote: Tobacco products bring in tax dollars, they will never be outlawed. Jim C Creel wrote: Dear Bob, You said: Right on. With all the evidence on tobacco why weren't the tobacco companies treated the same way. They are allowed to pay damages and raise their prices to get it back. Knowing that their addict customers will still be there. I'm not an advocate of Seasilver. I just believe in equal treatment. ** This is really not relevant. I agree with what you say about things that are allowed to exist that are harmful to people, but we're not talking about a substance here that is necessarily harmful (Sea Silver), we're talking about a company misrepresenting a product. There are plenty of other examples we can come up with like this - for instance, the pharmaceutical industry. But this doesn't mean that everything sahould be overlooked because some things are. My biggest issue with Sea Silver is not it's poor performance, it's that the company repeatedly refused to divulge the amounts of the various nutrients they claim are in their product. I called numerous times letting them know that I had a client base of hundreds of people who take my recommendations seriously. They claimed that because it is all natural the amounts vary. I suggested that they must have done some tests on the product that showed ingredients and the range of amounts of each. They admitted they did but again refused to divulge this. Not everyone is as insistent on details as I am. So who knows what others who use this product are getting. They could be paying $40 for a bottle that contains no more nutrients than a Flintstone's vitamin. Regards, Catherine -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
I wonder if it was the silver or the powder that killed the dogs? Sounds like something similar to injecting radiator stop leak. Ode At 11:48 PM 6/18/2003 -0600, you wrote: Please note folk, 3.8 g. Is the TOXIC dose, NOT the lethal dose. Dogs (don't remember the weight) were killed with 1 gram of fine metal powder injected. Not intentionally; they were trying to create a blood problem to study. It is in John Hill's book. Who would ever want to get anywhere that, and how could you do it even if 10 times the required dose was administered? -Original Message- From: Trem [mailto:t...@silvergen.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 8:19 PM To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux Hi Jason, As I said earlieram I missing something. Thanks for pointing out the reason it isn't a no brainer. Remember, I'm just a designer and not a physician. Although if it was an animal I owned, I'd probably try it since the critter would probably be a goner if something wasn't tried. Too bad they don't have any animals with SARS to try it on. That would produce some definitive results just as trying it on a human would. The thing in your post that bothers me is this. Why is distilled water poisonous if is composed of H20 and has no impurities? It would be pure by definition if distilled or deionized wouldn't it? Or is it that a small amount of water is too much for the body to assimilate? I don't think so since it is used in injections all the time. What is a pyrogen? And why would that be in properly distilled water? Of course silver is incredibly potent. That's the reason for using it. But as Jim just pointed out, the lethal dose is 3.8 grams. I'm talking about using tenths or hundredths of milligrams, not grams. Regards, Trem - Original Message - From: Jason Eaton ey...@cox.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 7:03 PM Subject: Re: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux Trem: There are quite a few factors you are not accounting for: 1. Distilled water injected into the bloodstream can cause shock leading to death. The Sol must be titrated properly; it must be prepared properly. 2. A product that is not certified pyrogen free can easily cause death in someone who is already sick. It is not enough that a sol be sterile, it cannot have any endotoxin or any substances that may induce a immune response. 3. Silver injected into the bloodstream is incredibly potent. If an MD does not have the experience in this, hesitation can certainly be understandable. 4. Any of the above, if done by an MD, may easily constitute criminal malpractice. In the US, such an MD without proper justification could easily do federal time. Best Regards, Jason - Original Message - From: Trem t...@silvergen.com To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 6:17 PM Subject: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux Hi Catherine, I may be missing something here. If so, please excuse me. If deionized or distilled water is used in injections and silver is benign, why is it not a no brainer to inject properly made CS intravenously as a trial protocol? It seems that it would be immediately known to the casual observer if the patient was getting any better since silver works so quickly. It also seems to me the blood titer would show a decrease in SARS almost immediately which would be the definitive answer. If one used a mix of standard CS which is normally composed of 70-90% ions and the remainder being colloids, it would cover the bases of which is effective since both would be circulating in the system. It wouldn't matter which did the job of they were to see a decrease in viral load and/or the patient responded favorably. Mikes idea of using predominantly ionic silver which his process seems to produce doesn't carry as much weight with me as he seems to think it does. An ion is an ion and the ions he produces cannot be any different than an ion any device produces. The major difference can only be the ratio of ions to particles and the size of the particles. If the mix is made using a good process, it will always be crystal clear indicating the colloids are within the small range of being colorless. As Bob Lee once pointed out there are about 1.41252 X 10+18 atoms in one teaspoon of CS made to 20+ PPM. I would think it wouldn't take too much in an intravenous solution to see some dramatic results. And let's remember, an IV of distilled water isn't going to do any damage so why wouldn't someone try this just to see if it works? Or as I said earlier, is there something I missed. Best regards, Trem I became involved with this group and actually had the opportunity to present CS to them during a conference
RE: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
Dogs excreted approximately 90% of an inhaled dose of metallic silver
particles in the feces within 30 days of exposure. {Phalen and Morrow 1973}
The only way those metallic silver particles could have been excreted via
feces from the lungs of the dogs is to pass through the blood stream.
No mention made of particle size...probably finely ground dust.
Ode
At 11:03 AM 6/19/2003 -0600, you wrote:
Hi Marshall,
I agree. The organs were loaded. I don't think the report spoke of
vascular occlusion tho, but I have only read a synopsis.
A silver colloid will be excreted too, according to our friend and former
list participant Roger Altman's study [with a population of one, himself].
Metallic silver will probably not be excreted.
When you calculate the amount of water you would have to drink to get a dose
of 3.8 grams, with 10 ppm sol, the water will be toxic before the silver.
Should the need arise I would not hesitate to self-administer via IV the
silver that I make. How much bacteria can fall in during the brief time
that I pour the DW or before I put the lid on the generator? Not enough to
Herx. And there will certainly be no live ones there.
Got 4 million? Then you can prove that CS is not pyrogenic and get it FDA
approved.
JOH
-Original Message-
From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 8:31 AM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
I don't see how injecting fine metal power of any kind has any relation to
the amount of that metal being toxic. I would think that metal power would
very effectively block up the blood vessels, and once you block the vessels
to the brain or heart death would certainly follow. Toxcitiy could be
totally different for a colloid, or compound.
Marshall
James Holmes wrote:
Please note folk, 3.8 g. Is the TOXIC dose, NOT the lethal dose.
Dogs (don't remember the weight) were killed with 1 gram of fine metal
powder injected. Not intentionally; they were trying to create a
blood problem to study. It is in John Hill's book. Who would ever want
to get anywhere that, and how could you do it even if 10 times the
required dose was administered?
-Original Message-
From: Trem [mailto:t...@silvergen.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 8:19 PM
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS
Redux
Hi Jason,
As I said earlieram I missing something. Thanks for pointing out
the reason it isn't a no brainer. Remember, I'm just a designer and
not a physician. Although if it was an animal I owned, I'd probably
try it since the critter would probably be a goner if something wasn't
tried. Too bad they don't have any animals with SARS to try it on.
That would produce some definitive results just as trying it on a
human would.
The thing in your post that bothers me is this. Why is distilled
water poisonous if is composed of H20 and has no impurities? It would
be pure by definition if distilled or deionized wouldn't it? Or is it
that a small amount of water is too much for the body to assimilate?
I don't think so since it is used in injections all the time.
What is a pyrogen? And why would that be in properly distilled water?
Of course silver is incredibly potent. That's the reason for using
it. But as Jim just pointed out, the lethal dose is 3.8 grams. I'm
talking about using tenths or hundredths of milligrams, not grams.
Regards,
Trem
- Original Message -
From: Jason Eaton ey...@cox.net
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 7:03 PM
Subject: Re: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS
Redux
Trem:
There are quite a few factors you are not accounting for:
1. Distilled water injected into the bloodstream can cause shock
leading
to
death. The Sol must be titrated properly; it must be prepared
properly.
2. A product that is not certified pyrogen free can easily cause
death in someone who is already sick. It is not enough that a sol
be sterile, it cannot have any endotoxin or any substances that may
induce a immune response.
3. Silver injected into the bloodstream is incredibly potent. If
an MD does not have the experience in this, hesitation can certainly
be understandable.
4. Any of the above, if done by an MD, may easily constitute
criminal malpractice. In the US, such an MD without proper
justification could easily do federal time.
Best Regards,
Jason
- Original Message -
From: Trem t...@silvergen.com
To: silver-list@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 6:17 PM
Subject: CSRe: [sillver_list] Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS
Redux
Hi Catherine,
I may be missing something here. If so, please excuse me. If
deionized
or
distilled water is used in injections and silver is benign, why is
it
not
a
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
I don't see how doing the salt test can display any quantitive results unless the exact amount of salt were known and the exact amount of precipitate. It might be a useful addition to looking at the TE with a laser, but like looking at TE, there's no way to really communicate what heavy or Lite Strong/weak is in a meaningful manner. Just how milky is very milky? Opinion based on observation is always personal and relative. Interpretation will have to be broad based. Sometimes when two people are looking at the very same item in the same room in the same light from the same angle, even then they argue. Faradays calculations could give a theoretical maximum PPM. I would agree that if a lab test went over that max, something could be amiss. There are many things that could account for a result under the calculated PPM. Not everything is visible and available to the eyeball. Ode At 05:44 PM 6/19/2003 -0400, you wrote: url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60387.html Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux From: M. G. Devour Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2003 04:27:53 I may have missed it, but, Mike, have you had analyses done yet to determinethe ionic/particulate ratio and total silver concentration? Mike, Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention. No, I have not sent anything to a lab. I agree with Ken: Welcome to the wonderful world of infallable science where no two labs can agree on anything and no two processes even come close. A PWT only reads ions for sure...maybe correctly and maybe not. Depends on what lab results you compare the readings to. http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60223.html However, I have asked Robert to make the same thing and let us know his results. In the final analysis, what we are looking for is consistency and repeatability. Three feet of 12 ga wire cut in half should give about 3.8 square inches of wetted area for the anode and cathode. I run at 335 uA, so the current density is around 87 uA/sq. in. With medium quality dw, a current regulator would be nice, but is not needed. A simple resistor to 12 Volts or more should regulate the current to 20% or better. This is good enough. It will repeat the same curve as long as the dw is the same. If we use 1/2 litre of water or so, all we need is to calculate the time needed to reach a target ppm. Here's the equations and results for 425 millilitres of dw on my system: I = 335e-6 ; current in Amperes k = 107.88 / 96500 ; electrochemical equivalent of silver lt = 0.425 ; liters ppm = 20 ; desired ppm C = I * sec ; Coulombs gm = lt * ppm / 1000 ; grams of silver deposited sec = (lt * ppm) / (1000 * k * I) hrs = sec / 3600 Solution I = +0.000335000 k = +0.0011179274611 lt = +0.42500 ppm = +20. C = +7.6033555802744 sec = +22696.583821714 gm = +0.00850 hrs = +6.3046066171429 Six hours might seem a long time compared to current practise, but as long as the production rate exceeds the consumption rate, it really doesn't matter how long it takes. If you only need a mouthful every three or four days, 1/2 litre should serve a small family for a week. One advantage of the long brew time is you don't have to worry about going shopping and returning an hour late. The cs will be a bit stronger, but you won't have to throw it out as you would with higher current densities. Very little black crud is deposited on the electrodes. I get a bit on the anode and none on the cathode. The cs is crystal clear, and nothing plates out on the glass containing it. So you don't have to spend time cleaning with H2O2. The salt test is excellent confirmation of the strength. From the dissociation of salt in water: NaCl(s) + H2O ---gt; Na(+)(aq) + Cl(-)(aq) A silver ion reacts with a chlorine ion to form silver chloride: Ag(+)(aq) + Cl(-)(aq) ---gt; AgCl(s) The silver chloride is insoluble in water and precipitates out as a white solid. This creates a dispersion that indicates the strength of the cs. At 20 ppm calculated, the effect is quite strong. So, anyone with a dvm and some salt should be able to duplicate these results fairly well. Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSquestions
There has been much success reported with Abogain [sp?] Long term heroin addicts etc have been 'cured' with no withdrawls. Unfortunately it is illegal in the USA, being a hallucingen, and you have to go to Amsterdam. Believe it or not, in the early days of research, remission from addictions were a common side effect during LSD sessions. Apparently the experience un-hard-wires the brain...resets the computer. But...computers are easily reprogrammed. For the change to be permanent, the environment must change as well. Many cured people returned to their addictions within 6 weeks after returning home. Ode At 06:34 PM 6/19/2003 -0700, you wrote: I was wondering if anyone knew procedures and results on recovering drug addicts and alcoholics. Mainly prescription pain pills (Lorcet 10/650) which has done more damage that anything else I know. Thanks, leslie3...@yahoo.com __ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSMike M.'s process questions...
Mike D. A #12 ga. wire is 0.0808 dia X 3.1416 x18 = 4.569 sq.in. Need to take off sum for outside connection. Why use silver for cathode? Ole Bob -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSRe: Seasilver Bust. The Regulation of Products Generally
...The 75% of the population thinks it's OK to tax them in self defense since another majority, that includes some of the 25%, thinks it's their moral duty to pay for other peoples errors in judgement... ?? jr -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSCS RE Cheap PM Tester
In the interest of maintaining the thread, I will keep the current subject heading intact although it is totally irrelevant to this post. I just wanted to quote myself again... You don't always get what you pay for, but you pay for what you get. Me ;^)) _ Re: CSCS RE Cheap PM Tester From: Jack Dayton (view other messages by this author) Date: Sun, 8 Jun 2003 17:54:22 Harold MacDonald 6/7/03 8:13 PM re: cheap meters My favourite saying and belief over the years is,[which has proven true many times] ;A poor man can not afford to buy anything cheap ] Think about it. Harold ** Think about Byron's Law.. There is nothing that some man can't make a little cheaper, and sell for a little less. And the person who considers price alone, is this mans lawful prey. Jack Walt Disney was afraid of mice . -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSTissue regeneration
Hi EIS'ers, I presume that all of the members of this list have visited Dr. A. B. Fick's web site www.silvelon.con, and seen the remarkable regeneration of tissue through the use of his silverlon bandage. If not shame on you!!! Now for a personal real life account of tissue regeneration. One of my daughters-in-law had both breast removed due to cancer, and as the healing process started one of her nipples turned black. The doctors told her that it was dead and she would loose it. Having seen the pictures of Dr Fick's work and had been using CS for some time, she started her own protocol for healing. She submerged the affected nipple in a small cup of CS for 15 minutes three times everyday. She also keep the bandages moist with CS, all during the healing process. After three weeks the black nipple fell off and there in its place was a brand new pink nipple. The doctors were amazed and the regeneration. Many times we belittle the value of the product that we make. Sincerely, Ole Bob -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSquestions
Dear Ken, You said: There has been much success reported with Abogain [sp?] Long term heroin addicts etc have been 'cured' with no withdrawls. ** In all fairness, there have been very mixed reports about this. Some people feel they're worse off for having done it. It's a crapshoot. IMO, this method is patterned on the allopathic magic pill myth and should be avoided. Regards, Catherine -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
Paula writes: I am completely puzzled by your utter reliance on a test (salt test) that is so completely subjective and not at all measured, controlled, or precise and your attitude towards ole Bob's lab equipment and multiple cross checks and tests by others (real lab tests, real calibrated equipment, much more repeatable even if somewhat variable). And your reliance on calculations and equations that as far as I can tell from your posts do not make any allowance for any variables in the distilled water. You amaze me. Hehe. Personalities are the *fun* part of all this, dontcha know? GRIN Seriously, Paula highlights for me the one objection Mike M. has made to the others' efforts that I have not yet seen a solid answer to, and I'd *like* to see that answer. I'm talking about his contention that some of Bob's samples show higher silver content than is theoretically possible from the number of Coulombs of electrons passed through the cell. So far the only answer has been, We've made hundreds of measurements and cross checked with each other. Now that is a good enough answer as far as it goes, and I do not believe that Bob and the others are wrong. But *somebody* had better figure out just what's being missed. What assumptions are wrong behind Mike's calculations? What part of the computation is wrong. Or what part of the data? Or assumption behind all of the measurements? What say ye, oh silvan sayers of sooth? Be well, Mike D. (who's signed his posts 'Mike D.' since the last time another 'Mike' was active on the forum...) [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@eskimo.com] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSMike M.'s process questions...
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60442.html Re: CSMike M.'s process questions... From: Robert Berger Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 06:26:38 Mike D. A #12 ga. wire is 0.0808 dia X 3.1416 x18 = 4.569 sq.in. Need to take off sum for outside connection. Why use silver for cathode? Ole Bob You need to be able to swap the electrodes to equalize wear. As you mention, some of the 18 inches is used under the mounting screws and to give clearance between the screws and the top of the water. Let's say this takes 1.5 inch: 0.0808 * pi * 15 = 3.807 square inches. You can get it up to 3.9 sq. in. if you really squeeze things, but it is not really necessary. It has a negligible effect on the current density: 3.9/3.8 = 1.026 Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Seasilver Bust. The Regulation of Products Generally
Ode Coyote 6/20/03 4:06 AM That's the tyranny of the masses aka democracy, and social engineering at work. * A pure democracy could be the worst form of tyranny. What, you don't agree? Consider this example. We live in a small town of 100 people,all adults, 55 are male and 45 are female. Now what do you think would result? Equity? Not likely. Jack -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSquestions
Leslie6/20/03 12:39 AM Hi all, want to rephrase my question re drug addiction. I want to know for one recovering from the effects would CS help in any way. Thank you, leslie3...@yahoo.com ** If the addict believed completely that it would, then yes, it seems very probable that recovery would occur. The mind is a very powerful tool. Jack -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60440.html Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux From: Ode Coyote Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 06:17:19 I don't see how doing the salt test can display any quantitive results unless the exact amount of salt were known and the exact amount of precipitate. Try it. Excess salt is invisible, so all you need is enough to ensure every silver ion is captured. Three shakes is usually enough for about 1 inch of cs. More may be needed for high concentration or greater quantity. The test merely confirms that silver ions are present, and it gives a rough guide of the strength. If you compare dw made at 1.4 mA/sq.in. with dw made at 87 uA/sq.in., there is a dramatic difference with the same number of Coulombs transferred. It might be a useful addition to looking at the TE with a laser, but like looking at TE, there's no way to really communicate what heavy or Lite Strong/weak is in a meaningful manner. Just how milky is very milky? You have to try it and see. There are many ways to describe it. First is how does it take for the dispersion to appear. A weak cs will take five minutes or more. The dispersion is pale blue and you have to get the light just the right way to see it. As the cs gets stronger, the dispersion appears much faster. At 20 ppm calculated, the response is immediate, and you can see white clouds and wisps like fog growing up from the bottom of the glass. After mixing, the dispersion is still transparent and you can see objects behind the glass. At 50 ppm calculated, the dispersion is like a miniature explosion as soon as the first salt crystal hits the water. The dispersion is like skim milk. It is difficult to see objects behind the glass. Opinion based on observation is always personal and relative. Interpretation will have to be broad based. Sometimes when two people are looking at the very same item in the same room in the same light from the same angle, even then they argue. Sometimes, two labs give different results on the same tests. To quote from someone's previous post: Welcome to the wonderful world of infallable science where no two labs can agree on anything and no two processes even come close. A PWT only reads ions for sure...maybe correctly and maybe not. Depends on what lab results you compare the readings to. http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60223.html Yes, personal observation is fallible when items are very similar. But there is no question about the ability to tell the difference between cs made at 1.4 mA/sq.in. and the same number of Coulombs transferred at 87 uA/sq.in. It's like the difference between dropping a tennis ball and a bowling ball on your foot. That is a personal observation, but I think everyone can identify which one they would prefer. Faradays calculations could give a theoretical maximum PPM. I would agree that if a lab test went over that max, something could be amiss. There are many things that could account for a result under the calculated PPM. Not everything is visible and available to the eyeball. Yes, I agree completely. Any deposit of black residue is a sign particles are being made. This reduces the amount of ions available. But as you point out, not everything is visible. I have tried three different methods of stirring, and had poor results with each one. They seemed to give the same results in the salt test, but had little effect on the cavities or shingles. One sample even formed a small shiny flake of silver in the bottom of the glass when it was placed in the refrigerator. I have never seen this before - I used to store my cs in the fridge. Since stirring seemed to reduce the effectiveness of the cs, and it gave such odd results, I have abandoned stirring. BTW - I checked to see if the 87 uA/sq.in. cs was stable in the fridge. Yes, it is perfectly stable. Ode Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: Seasilver Bust. The Regulation of Products Generally
I agree that is the inherent evil in democracy of a large collective. Worse evils occur when that is expressed towards the outside. I see the problem as a true consensus. Almost all the time Majority Rule Minority Right is not upheld. The minority do not accept the conditions and work to sabotage the rules. With a consensus form of government (used successfully in at least one Native American group -don't recall which, at least until the time of guns and roses U.S. Imperialism) . This form requires no action to be taken until all members agreed. Reluctant members agreed to go along for the good of the community, was recognized and respected for their positions. This became community pride where each individual contributed AND prevented the Majority from abuses AND Minority sabotage. This principle can be seen today in most workplaces. Regardless of the rules, regulations or law if the workers (or bosses) do not believe (whatever) there is destined a certain amount of failure. Where there IS agreement anything can/is accomplished. The value of a democracy for those that seek power is that no one is accountable. The ebb and flow of politics makes some feel good for a while and others upset for awhile, with never a change in the power structure. The ancient Chinese believed that the best ruler (emperor) was the one that the common people did not even know the name of. Ed Kasper, LAc, sunny Santa Cruz, CA -Original Message- From: Jack Dayton [mailto:jack...@harbornet.com] Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 9:42 AM To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSRe: Seasilver Bust. The Regulation of Products Generally Ode Coyote 6/20/03 4:06 AM That's the tyranny of the masses aka democracy, and social engineering at work. * A pure democracy could be the worst form of tyranny. What, you don't agree? Consider this example. We live in a small town of 100 people,all adults, 55 are male and 45 are female. Now what do you think would result? Equity? Not likely. Jack --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.488 / Virus Database: 287 - Release Date: 6/5/2003 -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60449.html Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux From: Mike Monett Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 10:06:48 I forgot another very important observation on the salt test. Another measure is how long it takes for the dispersion to settle. A weak dispersion will remain pale blue for a long time. 20 ppm calculated will settle to the bottom in a few days. The water will become clear. I didn't keep the 50 ppm calculated dispersion long enough to tell how long it takes to settle. I assume it would settle rapidly. These are qualitative indications, to be sure. It might be difficult to tell the difference between 20 ppm and 21 ppm calculated dispersions unless you put them side by side. But if you can get a repeatable and predictable process, that's all that is needed. A lady just wrote and mentioned she was waiting to fire up her Silverpuppy until she got her Hanna and found good quality dw. I told her to go buy different brands and make some with each one. Do the salt test and cover the glass with saran wrap to prevent evaporation. When she was done, put the glasses side by side and compare the dispersions. Keep the brands that gave the strongest dispersion. Then place her Silverpuppy in service and start getting some use from it. Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
Mike, I am completely puzzled by your utter reliance on a test (salt test) that is so completely subjective and not at all measured, controlled, or precise and your attitude towards ole Bob's lab equipment and multiple cross checks and tests by others (real lab tests, real calibrated equipment, much more repeatable even if somewhat variable). And your reliance on calculations and equations that as far as I can tell from your posts do not make any allowance for any variables in the distilled water. You amaze me. paula -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Seasilver Bust. The Regulation of Products Generally
A democracy is two Wolves and a Lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Jim Jack Dayton wrote: Ode Coyote 6/20/03 4:06 AM That's the tyranny of the masses aka democracy, and social engineering at work. * A pure democracy could be the worst form of tyranny. What, you don't agree? Consider this example. We live in a small town of 100 people,all adults, 55 are male and 45 are female. Now what do you think would result? Equity? Not likely. Jack -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
M. G. Devour wrote: Paula writes: I am completely puzzled by your utter reliance on a test (salt test) that is so completely subjective and not at all measured, controlled, or precise and your attitude towards ole Bob's lab equipment and multiple cross checks and tests by others (real lab tests, real calibrated equipment, much more repeatable even if somewhat variable). And your reliance on calculations and equations that as far as I can tell from your posts do not make any allowance for any variables in the distilled water. You amaze me. Hehe. Personalities are the *fun* part of all this, dontcha know? GRIN Seriously, Paula highlights for me the one objection Mike M. has made to the others' efforts that I have not yet seen a solid answer to, and I'd *like* to see that answer. I'm talking about his contention that some of Bob's samples show higher silver content than is theoretically possible from the number of Coulombs of electrons passed through the cell. So far the only answer has been, We've made hundreds of measurements and cross checked with each other. I can think of only two ways you could get more silver atoms in the water than the number of electrons used in the production. First if by chance we are all wrong about the silver always leaving the wire as ions. If by chance they could leave as clumps of atoms, that could explain it. The other way is if electrolysis is not being used. That is, if an arc is present, then we are not talking about electrolysis at all, but either evaporation or sputtering, both of which can remove far more silver from the electrode than the number of electrons. Marshall -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSNew to CS
Hello, Please help, I am new to the board. I was wondering if anyone would take some time with me to advise the estimated amount of CS that I should start taking. I have had this bacterial / yeast infection for a year now and it is really taking over what life I have left. I just purchased CS, brand name Granny's at 25+ ppm.I had a stool analysis done back in January that said I had a severe dysbiosis problem and that the bacteria Citrobacter freundii was very high and I believe it now has rooted deep into my colon. I would appreciate any help you could give me. I take 2 capsules of acidophilus every morning for the past 4 to 5 months, don't eat anything with sugar and very few carbos a day. I drink a lot of distilled water, but nothing has helped. I'm hoping the experience on this board might help direct me. Thank you Debbie Has anyone gone to a colon therapist for a treatment along with CS?
CSRe: Returned email
Hi Mike Monet, Why are my attempts to email you directly returned as not deliverable? I use the heading on your posts 3hg01m...@sneakemail.com Curious, what is being hidden? Ole Bob -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Returned email
CSRe: Returned email From: Robert Berger Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 14:43:49 Hi Mike Monett, Why are my attempts to email you directly returned as not deliverable? I use the heading on your posts 3hg01m...@sneakemail.com Curious, what is being hidden? Ole Bob Hi Bob, The problem is lower case L looks like a 1. Try clicking on mailto: 3hg0lm...@sneakemail.com I wish it were that easy to hide from spammers:) Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60456.html Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux From: Marshall Dudley Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 13:42:31 I can think of only two ways you could get more silver atoms in the water than the number of electrons used in the production. First if by chance we are all wrong about the silver always leaving the wire as ions. If by chance they could leave as clumps of atoms, that could explain it. Hi Marshall, That would earn you a Nobel Prize if you could figure out how to do it. The electrodes would wear down faster, and electroplating would require less current. The aluminum refining industry would lay gold at your feet - electricity is expensive:) A brief trip through google produced many references to Faraday's laws. Here's one: Faraday's investigations into the nature of electricity also led him to formulate new scientific laws. For example, he determined that in electrolysis the mass of a substance deposited or dissolved at the electrode will be proportional to the amount of charge that passes through the solution - this became the first law of electrolysis. http://www.enc.org/features/calendar/unit/0,1819,196,00.shtm Faraday's work eventually led to the discovery of the electron: http://www.nidlink.com/~jfromm/history/electrons.htm OT, but Faraday was recognized by his peers as one of the most important scientists of the time. Here's a beautiful article by Hemholtz in 1881: http://dbhs.wvusd.k12.ca.us/Chem-History/Helmholtz-1881.html I think his work pretty well established that one electron accounts for one ion, and his laws are on pretty solid ground. Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSBoring List
Dear Mike (D.), Well, the Silverlist has gotten so darn boring these last few months. The Mo` Power guys basically run it, and we little folk who get by just fine with the simply-made CS are left in the lurch. More often that not, nowadays, I run through the list of messages with the delete button held down. We used to brag on new grandbabies, or wish happy birthday, or whatever it was that is important to us. None of that happens anymore. Therefore, to save my sanity (and time), dear Mike, please drop me off. Bye bye. Marshalee PS, I still tell folks about CS, and I do give them the Silverlist addy, but I now warn them that they might not find anything interesting here. sigh... -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
url: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60453.html Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux From: sol Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2003 11:04:08 Mike, I am completely puzzled by your utter reliance on a test (salt test) that is so completely subjective and not at all measured, controlled, or precise and your attitude towards ole Bob's lab equipment and multiple cross checks and tests by others (real lab tests, real calibrated equipment, much more repeatable even if somewhat variable). And your reliance on calculations and equations that as far as I can tell from your posts do not make any allowance for any variables in the distilled water. You amaze me. paula Hi Paula, Thanks. Sometimes I amaze me also:) The salt test is a qualitative test that merely confirms what we already know through Faraday's Laws: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60449.html http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m60452.html I believe Mike D. answered your second concern. For the last concern, good dw is specified to have less than 1 ppm of impurities. At 20 ppm calculated, this is less than 0.5% error. It is not possible to fill the glass that accurately, so I don't worry about it. Best Regards, Mike Monett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
...At 20 ppm calculated, this is less than 0.5% error. That's the whole point right there---calculated. Isn't that how NASA lost the $125M Mars Climate Orbiter a couple years ago? jr -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux
Hey Mike, Welcome to the Non-Euclidean CS Universe. - Original Message - From: jrowl...@nctimes.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 6:37 PM Subject: CSRe: Nebulizing CS for SARS Redux ...At 20 ppm calculated, this is less than 0.5% error. That's the whole point right there---calculated. Isn't that how NASA lost the $125M Mars Climate Orbiter a couple years ago? jr -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. Instructions for unsubscribing may be found at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSRe: FTC seizes Seasilver
Dear Mr. Holmes, Why worry about defending the compound against a raid on the drug manufacturing and distribution operations when a simple act like changing the label and stopping the absurd advertising practices might work even better? PS - Please accept my apologies for second guessing your sarcasm. Best Regards, Andrew Scott From: James Holmes Message Dear Mr. ADS(the 1st) I did not intend to be sarcastic. You would think that they would have had time to prevent the raid in that period of time, unless they thought they had done enough to comply and were misled. Strange scene; perhaps we will learn more soon. JOH -Original Message- From: ascottsil...@aol.com [mailto:ascottsil...@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2003 12:30 AM To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSRe: FTC seizes Seasilver Dear Mr. Holmes, While I appreciate your sarcasm, I don't understand the point you are trying to make. Could you please elaborate? Regards, ADS (the 1st) From: James Holmes OHthat's quite different. JOH -Original Message- From: ascottsil...@aol.com In all fairness, the Fed's did give them 14 months to change their labeling and advertising practices before they came down on them. Andy
CSRe:CSBoring List
We will miss you Marshalee. Andy (^_^)
