Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
With patience akin to a cat's, Mike C, on 1/30/2010 4:50 PM typed: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I'm running 1.1.18 for critical e-mails (job search, contact with medical practitioners) until MailNews isn't quite so twitchy in 2.0.x, and Karsten is able to unveil (Ta-dah!) Mnenhy for 2.0.x. In the meantime, I am using 2.0.x for 99% of my browsing, RSS feeds (which are very cool and to which I've become slightly addicted--I could never get RSS to work in 1.1.18), and newsgroups. Me likey 2.0.x--it haz a flavur -- -- /\ /\ | No amount of time can erase the ^o o^ D.K. Cat Kraft | memory of a good cat, and no amount -T- | of masking tape can ever totally ~ Lynnwood, WA | remove his fur from your couch. ___oOO___OOo___ |-- Leo Dworken ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
»Q« wrote: Trying to convince the SM team that it's so vitally important that they should do it won't do any good, since even if they came to agree with you, they*can't* do it; they don't have enough people to do it and they don't have the right skills to do it. As said in amny forums, when Mozilla has their head on something. No opinions by Users, make one whit of difference. they do only what they are interested in. (And, FWIW, you can have javascript in RSS feeds executed by SM.) That's because RSS is a form of Web Browsing. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 2/2/2010 12:30, Phillip Jones told the world: I really hope HJ gets inspired enough to do the migration. He is the _true father of tabbed browsing_ . So we all owe him a debt of gratitude. So, 1.1.18 it is then. :-/ ahh so that's the rascal that's responsible. Well, not quite. The concept of a tabbed interface apparently came from IBM, as part of their CUA project. The first browser with something similar to modern tabs was a development version of Opera. But they kinda sat on it for a while, the feature was not very well known -- it only came to their mainstream browser after others had reinvented it independently. Then, there was Netcaptor, which was a front-end for the IE engine, that brought it to the general public. A couple others (including Opera) followed suit. HJ, the author of Multizilla, was the one who brought it to the Mozilla project -- in the form of an extension. Dave Hyatt saw it, liked it, and wrote his own implementation (not taken from Multizilla) for the trunk Mozilla browser. So, if you want someone to blame (I personally would thank), there's quite a bunch of people. The guys at IBM and Opera for creating it, the guys at Netcaptor for spreading it around, HJ for showing it could work in a Mozilla product or Dave Hyatt for making it a core feature. lol, well good on them all then! But especially HJ. :) The suite was the first place I came across tabs, years before IE ever had them. I guess that was 2002. And Multizilla was one of the first extensions I tried. Been using it ever since. On a slightly different note. Is anyone else that's still using SM 1.1.18 having trouble with chat in facebook (FB)? It always give the error message: Facebook Chat Error Could not connect to Facebook Chat at this time. Also on FB, the top status update (write something) text box. I click in it and the mouse pointer changes to a text pointer, the box gets a bit larger, but no cursor appears, and I can't type anything in the box. The attach links work though. As does everything else on FB. It all works fine with Google Chrome. Suggestions anyone? (besides updating to 2.x that is! :) ) Cheers. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Nairda wrote: On a slightly different note. Is anyone else that's still using SM 1.1.18 having trouble with chat in facebook (FB)? It always give the error message: Facebook Chat Error Could not connect to Facebook Chat at this time. FB chat always has been flakey for me. I use SM 1117 and IE 8. Neither works very well. However... The new FB seems to be a lot better. They may have revised chat as well. Also on FB, the top status update (write something) text box. I click in it and the mouse pointer changes to a text pointer, the box gets a bit larger, but no cursor appears, and I can't type anything in the box. The attach links work though. As does everything else on FB. I think they renamed that to whats on your mind. SM 1117 never has worked very well with FB. I use IE 8 for FB and for all applications that have boxes and forms. It all works fine with Google Chrome. Suggestions anyone? (besides updating to 2.x that is! :) ) Cheers. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Nairda wrote: The suite was the first place I came across tabs, years before IE ever had them. I guess that was 2002. Cheers. TABS, the greatest innovation! I think I was using tabs even before 2002. With Avant Browser maybe year 2000? http://www.avantbrowser.com/ I use only Seamonkey and Avant (never IE) They both have GREAT features. Mike C PS: I'm still sticking with 1.1.18 for a while. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: Nairda wrote: The suite was the first place I came across tabs, years before IE ever had them. I guess that was 2002. Cheers. TABS, the greatest innovation! I think I was using tabs even before 2002. With Avant Browser maybe year 2000? http://www.avantbrowser.com/ I use only Seamonkey and Avant (never IE) They both have GREAT features. Mike C PS: I'm still sticking with 1.1.18 for a while. Second - tabs rock! -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones schrieb: As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. An extension probably cannot change this, what it would need would be a thorough security review of the affected code. It's not about wanting or not wanting it, it's about being able to guarantee security. This seems to be a concept that a number of people here don't seem to grasp anyhow, or intentionally neglect. The concept missed is that's its OUR computer. No one is asking you to guarantee security or anything else, we just want the option of JS on a per-newsgroup or rss feed basis. I agree it should be turned off, I'm comfortable that the option to turn it on have all sorts of warnings, but you sound like a mix of Microsodft and a smothering mother, saying that you know whats best. It's one thing to to leave a feature out because it isn't in TB or FF, but to take away user choice is a different thing. No JS as a global option is a prudent choice, no way to turn it on in trusted environments is removal of a feature some of us find useful. People who ignore the warning and want it on either know what they are doing, or should be allowed to take themselves out of the gene pool. -- Bill Davidsen david...@tmr.com We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked. - from Slashdot ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I run 1.1.18 on machines which use forms heavily. The forms management in the 2.x Seamonkey is inconvenient (I'm being polite) when the same form is filled with a number of sets of data. -- Bill Davidsen david...@tmr.com We have more to fear from the bungling of the incompetent than from the machinations of the wicked. - from Slashdot ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Bill Davidsen wrote: Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones schrieb: As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. An extension probably cannot change this, what it would need would be a thorough security review of the affected code. It's not about wanting or not wanting it, it's about being able to guarantee security. This seems to be a concept that a number of people here don't seem to grasp anyhow, or intentionally neglect. The concept missed is that's its OUR computer. No one is asking you to guarantee security or anything else, we just want the option of JS on a per-newsgroup or rss feed basis. I agree it should be turned off, I'm comfortable that the option to turn it on have all sorts of warnings, but you sound like a mix of Microsodft and a smothering mother, saying that you know whats best. It's one thing to to leave a feature out because it isn't in TB or FF, but to take away user choice is a different thing. No JS as a global option is a prudent choice, no way to turn it on in trusted environments is removal of a feature some of us find useful. People who ignore the warning and want it on either know what they are doing, or should be allowed to take themselves out of the gene pool. Well stated. -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Bill Davidsen wrote: Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones schrieb: As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. An extension probably cannot change this, what it would need would be a thorough security review of the affected code. It's not about wanting or not wanting it, it's about being able to guarantee security. This seems to be a concept that a number of people here don't seem to grasp anyhow, or intentionally neglect. The concept missed is that's its OUR computer. No one is asking you to guarantee security or anything else, we just want the option of JS on a per-newsgroup or rss feed basis. I agree it should be turned off, I'm comfortable that the option to turn it on have all sorts of warnings, but you sound like a mix of Microsodft and a smothering mother, saying that you know whats best. It's one thing to to leave a feature out because it isn't in TB or FF, but to take away user choice is a different thing. 1) Think before you talk. RSS feeds actually allow JS even in the current setting, as they load WEB PAGES. 2) I'm not a code module owner for the message display pane or the docshell where this code is implemented, so all I can do is relay their decisions to you. We're not a top-down hierarchical organization, but a community where specific people and groups own and care about specific parts of the code, and they decide things like that with respect to the code they own. 3) While I could be persuaded to sell weapons, you could never get me to sell a weapon that has an actual switch for aiming the shoot explicitely on your foot, or any other part of yourself. Robert Kaiser ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Bill Davidsen wrote: Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones schrieb: As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. An extension probably cannot change this, what it would need would be a thorough security review of the affected code. It's not about wanting or not wanting it, it's about being able to guarantee security. This seems to be a concept that a number of people here don't seem to grasp anyhow, or intentionally neglect. The concept missed is that's its OUR computer. No one is asking you to guarantee security or anything else, we just want the option of JS on a per-newsgroup or rss feed basis. I agree it should be turned off, I'm comfortable that the option to turn it on have all sorts of warnings, but you sound like a mix of Microsodft and a smothering mother, saying that you know whats best. It's one thing to to leave a feature out because it isn't in TB or FF, but to take away user choice is a different thing. No JS as a global option is a prudent choice, no way to turn it on in trusted environments is removal of a feature some of us find useful. People who ignore the warning and want it on either know what they are doing, or should be allowed to take themselves out of the gene pool. While I agree 100% with your evaluation (particularly about culling the herd of idiots that compromise their own machine without knowing what they're doing), I can see the flip side of the argument. That idiot that enables JS and catches malware because of it is going to look for someone to blame other than him/herself. The likely target will be SM and the SM developers. So my suspicion is that SM is doing some defensive PR by not including the capability to read JS. They're avoiding the headline: SeaMonkey is insecure because it can enable JS. Nevermind the real cause: that idiot. Not justifying SM's position on this, but just speculating on the motive. Probably a business decision. BJ ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
In news:dqwdnzferonvpfhwnz2dnuvz_t6dn...@mozilla.org, Bill Davidsen david...@tmr.com wrote: Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones schrieb: As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. An extension probably cannot change this, what it would need would be a thorough security review of the affected code. It's not about wanting or not wanting it, it's about being able to guarantee security. This seems to be a concept that a number of people here don't seem to grasp anyhow, or intentionally neglect. The concept missed is that's its OUR computer. No one is asking you to guarantee security or anything else, we just want the option of JS on a per-newsgroup or rss feed basis. I agree it should be turned off, I'm comfortable that the option to turn it on have all sorts of warnings, but you sound like a mix of Microsodft and a smothering mother, saying that you know whats best. It's one thing to to leave a feature out because it isn't in TB or FF, but to take away user choice is a different thing. Releasing something that will run incoming javascript without any security model in place to the public (not just to *your* computer) would be so insanely irresponsible that you can't find any software vendor willing to do it. This isn't in the category of things that should be off by default because they're risky or things that should carry warnings because they're risky, it's firmly in the category of things nobody is ever going to release because they would be intentionally harming users. And since neither SeaMonkey nor Mozilla Messaging have the resources to implement a working security model for it, you're stuck. The options are to hire someone (expensive, since it will have to be a security expert) to do it or to convince Mozilla Messaging that it's so vitally important that they should drop other things to work on it. Trying to convince the SM team that it's so vitally important that they should do it won't do any good, since even if they came to agree with you, they *can't* do it; they don't have enough people to do it and they don't have the right skills to do it. (And, FWIW, you can have javascript in RSS feeds executed by SM.) -- »Q« /\ ASCII Ribbon Campaign \ / against html e-mailX http://asciiribbon.org/ / \ ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 1/2/2010 00:00, Phillip Jones told the world: Most Banks don't accept any and browser that has a version number of Version 1.x on anything. My bank Suntrust said the didn't accept a version one of any browser. I change the the user agent to add /not FireFox 2.0 would work just fine. As soon as I switched to SM I didn't have to use the altered UA string. I don't believe that to be the case. The site didn't refuse Seamonkey outright, but some essential features (like the on-screen keyboard used for logging on) simply didn't work. Try MrTech Extension and see if Multizalla works with forced compatibility. No, Multizilla is too big and complex -- it doesn't just add a localized feature, it replaces a large part of Seamonkey's UI. There's just too many places where it hooks into the old XPFE toolkit. The author was working on a Toolkit (Suiterunner) build, but he doesn't have much time for the project these days, so it is essentially stalled for the time being. I even tested the Suiterunner build a few months ago, but it's still too broken to be usable. I'm sorry to hear that Multizilla wont work in SM2.x, it's my favourite extension. If I have to drop it, I'll have to spend quite some time setting up preferences from scratch. It's literally years since I've has to do that. I really hope HJ gets inspired enough to do the migration. He is the true father of tabbed browsing. So we all owe him a debt of gratitude. So, 1.1.18 it is then. :-/ ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
NoOp wrote: On 02/01/2010 06:10 PM, Robert Kaiser wrote: Philip Chee wrote: On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. I meant Java as a plugin. And then, even Java in total is decreasing. Maybe people just don't want to do business with Oracle, the creator and home of Java (yes, it is now) or it's just that the language is useless enough - make your own judgments. Robert Kaiser I think that perhaps you need to go back on vacation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) Perhaps you mean Sun Microsystems; soon to be Oracle. So I reckon that we'll just shut down OpenOffice.org and other FOSS programs that depend upon Java for the wizards et al? How about javascorehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) and multiple other Java based programs that I use on a regular basis? http://kb.mozillazine.org/Java Isn't Joomla(?) a version of Java? -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Nairda wrote: MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 1/2/2010 00:00, Phillip Jones told the world: Most Banks don't accept any and browser that has a version number of Version 1.x on anything. My bank Suntrust said the didn't accept a version one of any browser. I change the the user agent to add /not FireFox 2.0 would work just fine. As soon as I switched to SM I didn't have to use the altered UA string. I don't believe that to be the case. The site didn't refuse Seamonkey outright, but some essential features (like the on-screen keyboard used for logging on) simply didn't work. Try MrTech Extension and see if Multizalla works with forced compatibility. No, Multizilla is too big and complex -- it doesn't just add a localized feature, it replaces a large part of Seamonkey's UI. There's just too many places where it hooks into the old XPFE toolkit. The author was working on a Toolkit (Suiterunner) build, but he doesn't have much time for the project these days, so it is essentially stalled for the time being. I even tested the Suiterunner build a few months ago, but it's still too broken to be usable. I'm sorry to hear that Multizilla wont work in SM2.x, it's my favourite extension. If I have to drop it, I'll have to spend quite some time setting up preferences from scratch. It's literally years since I've has to do that. I really hope HJ gets inspired enough to do the migration. He is the _true father of tabbed browsing_ . So we all owe him a debt of gratitude. So, 1.1.18 it is then. :-/ ahh so that's the rascal that's responsible. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Phillip Jones wrote: NoOp wrote: On 02/01/2010 06:10 PM, Robert Kaiser wrote: Philip Chee wrote: On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. I meant Java as a plugin. And then, even Java in total is decreasing. Maybe people just don't want to do business with Oracle, the creator and home of Java (yes, it is now) or it's just that the language is useless enough - make your own judgments. Robert Kaiser I think that perhaps you need to go back on vacation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) Perhaps you mean Sun Microsystems; soon to be Oracle. So I reckon that we'll just shut down OpenOffice.org and other FOSS programs that depend upon Java for the wizards et al? How about javascorehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) and multiple other Java based programs that I use on a regular basis? http://kb.mozillazine.org/Java Isn't Joomla(?) a version of Java? No, Joomla is a open source CMS (http://www.joomla.org/) Mark -- http://www.masadsign.nl/logout/ ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Interviewed by CNN on 2/2/2010 12:30, Phillip Jones told the world: I really hope HJ gets inspired enough to do the migration. He is the _true father of tabbed browsing_ . So we all owe him a debt of gratitude. So, 1.1.18 it is then. :-/ ahh so that's the rascal that's responsible. Well, not quite. The concept of a tabbed interface apparently came from IBM, as part of their CUA project. The first browser with something similar to modern tabs was a development version of Opera. But they kinda sat on it for a while, the feature was not very well known -- it only came to their mainstream browser after others had reinvented it independently. Then, there was Netcaptor, which was a front-end for the IE engine, that brought it to the general public. A couple others (including Opera) followed suit. HJ, the author of Multizilla, was the one who brought it to the Mozilla project -- in the form of an extension. Dave Hyatt saw it, liked it, and wrote his own implementation (not taken from Multizilla) for the trunk Mozilla browser. So, if you want someone to blame (I personally would thank), there's quite a bunch of people. The guys at IBM and Opera for creating it, the guys at Netcaptor for spreading it around, HJ for showing it could work in a Mozilla product or Dave Hyatt for making it a core feature. -- MCBastos This message has been protected with the 2ROT13 algorithm. Unauthorized use will be prosecuted under the DMCA. -=-=- ... BOFH excuse #314: You need to upgrade your VESA local bus to a MasterCard local bus. *Added by TagZilla 0.066.2 running on Seamonkey 2.0.2 * http://xsidebar.mozdev.org/modifiedmailnews.html#tagzilla ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - and that Java runs in its own binary as a plugin and so it's the Java Runtime developers' job to make things secure, while JavaScript runs inside SeaMonkey itself and so it's our job to care. Robert Kaiser ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
On 1/30/2010 4:50 PM PT, Mike C typed: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I moved to v2.0.2 for speed and memory usage. I did have to sacrifice a few minor extensions (e.g., BugMeNot). -- I like ants, in chocolate. Crunch, hu. --unknown /\___/\ / /\ /\ \Phil./Ant @ http://antfarm.ma.cx (Personal Web Site) | |o o| | Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net \ _ / Nuke ANT from e-mail address: phi...@earthlink.netant ( ) or ant...@zimage.com Ant is currently not listening to any songs on his home computer. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Ant wrote: On 1/30/2010 4:50 PM PT, Mike C typed: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I moved to v2.0.2 for speed and memory usage. I did have to sacrifice a few minor extensions (e.g., BugMeNot). I'm solidly sticking with 1.1.18 because of the loss of Form Manager in 2.0 ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - and that Java runs in its own binary as a plugin and so it's the Java Runtime developers' job to make things secure, while JavaScript runs inside SeaMonkey itself and so it's our job to care. Robert Kaiser I though Java ran in a sandbox. when Java first come out it didn't and apple would even support it. After the sandbox treatment plus some other improvements Apple finally adopted Java. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. Phil -- Philip Chee phi...@aleytys.pc.my, philip.c...@gmail.com http://flashblock.mozdev.org/ http://xsidebar.mozdev.org Guard us from the she-wolf and the wolf, and guard us from the thief, oh Night, and so be good for us to pass. [ ]In chess always expect your opponent to make his best move. * TagZilla 0.066.6 ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Philip Chee wrote: On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. Phil I thought Java had been put is something called a sandbox (not an actual sandbox, a type of security measure to prevent it from doing something its not. Perhaps JavaScript could be as well. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Philip Chee wrote: On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. I meant Java as a plugin. And then, even Java in total is decreasing. Maybe people just don't want to do business with Oracle, the creator and home of Java (yes, it is now) or it's just that the language is useless enough - make your own judgments. Robert Kaiser ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
On 02/01/2010 06:10 PM, Robert Kaiser wrote: Philip Chee wrote: On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. I meant Java as a plugin. And then, even Java in total is decreasing. Maybe people just don't want to do business with Oracle, the creator and home of Java (yes, it is now) or it's just that the language is useless enough - make your own judgments. Robert Kaiser I think that perhaps you need to go back on vacation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) Perhaps you mean Sun Microsystems; soon to be Oracle. So I reckon that we'll just shut down OpenOffice.org and other FOSS programs that depend upon Java for the wizards et al? How about javascorehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) and multiple other Java based programs that I use on a regular basis? http://kb.mozillazine.org/Java ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
On 02/01/2010 06:47 PM, NoOp wrote: On 02/01/2010 06:10 PM, Robert Kaiser wrote: Philip Chee wrote: On Mon, 01 Feb 2010 16:12:13 +0100, Robert Kaiser wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. Actually, Java isn't more secure than JavaScript, it's just that Java isn't used that much any more - Really? Perhaps you should tell Google that because they seem to be using Java extensively. Example: Android. Even googlemail is written in Java. I meant Java as a plugin. And then, even Java in total is decreasing. Maybe people just don't want to do business with Oracle, the creator and home of Java (yes, it is now) or it's just that the language is useless enough - make your own judgments. Robert Kaiser I think that perhaps you need to go back on vacation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Java_(programming_language) Perhaps you mean Sun Microsystems; soon to be Oracle. So I reckon that we'll just shut down OpenOffice.org and other FOSS programs that depend upon Java for the wizards et al? How about Sorry, should have been: http://www.gromurph.org/javascore/ and multiple other Java based programs that I use on a regular basis? http://kb.mozillazine.org/Java Regarding security; there were some issues with Fx 3.0.x: http://secunia.com/secunia_research/2009-19/ and of course there are more recent issues: http://secunia.com/advisories/search/?search=java but none that I see in SeaMonkey of late: http://secunia.com/advisories/search/?search=seamonkey or Firefox: http://secunia.com/advisories/search/?search=firefox So unless you know something more about Java issues than the above, I wonder where your statements originate from. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? No overwhelming reason to use the new versions. I have no desire to use the latest and greatest O/S, broswer, or other software just to say that I am. I am not worried about security. I don't cruise the web. Not enough time in the day for that. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
»Q« schrieb: Mozilla Messaging inherited a lot of stuff from previous Mozilla Suite and Thunderbird developers, including a security model which hadn't been maintained for years and was no longer usable. And that the JavaScript we had in mailnews was a security problem had been known for quite some time before Mozilla Messaging came along and we knew that we couldn't ship a major version of SeaMonkey or Thunderbird with it, as we had no clear investigations that showed that JavaScripts in emails couldn't take over the client itself - which is a clear security problem as those JavaScripts are executed when you read HTML mail in 1.x and you only realize they are a problem when the attack has already been successful. Robert Kaiser ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Robert Kaiser wrote: »Q« schrieb: Mozilla Messaging inherited a lot of stuff from previous Mozilla Suite and Thunderbird developers, including a security model which hadn't been maintained for years and was no longer usable. And that the JavaScript we had in mailnews was a security problem had been known for quite some time before Mozilla Messaging came along and we knew that we couldn't ship a major version of SeaMonkey or Thunderbird with it, as we had no clear investigations that showed that JavaScripts in emails couldn't take over the client itself - which is a clear security problem as those JavaScripts are executed when you read HTML mail in 1.x and you only realize they are a problem when the attack has already been successful. Robert Kaiser As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Phillip Jones schrieb: As I said, It ain't going to happen, Unless someone comes up with an extension to add it back. And that not going to pass with the mozilla big-wigs. They don't want it. An extension probably cannot change this, what it would need would be a thorough security review of the affected code. It's not about wanting or not wanting it, it's about being able to guarantee security. This seems to be a concept that a number of people here don't seem to grasp anyhow, or intentionally neglect. Robert Kaiser ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
In news:akednwps0eoyjfjwnz2dnuvz_o2dn...@mozilla.org, Rufus n...@home.com wrote: »Q« wrote: Innews:7ladndjm6tmkd_nwnz2dnuvz_sydn...@mozilla.org, Phillip Jonespjon...@kimbanet.com wrote: But Mozilla hears something about javascript could be dangerous, and banned ten minutes later. Go figure. What you've posted is very misleading. They didn't hear something about javascript could be dangerous, they know what javascript can and can't do. And they spent (wasted, IMO) a *lot* more than ten minutes working on the problem before giving up on it. Mozilla Messaging inherited a lot of stuff from previous Mozilla Suite and Thunderbird developers, including a security model which hadn't been maintained for years and was no longer usable. The options were to spend a lot of time and effort to design and implement a new security model or to take out javascript. They started down the first road only to realize it was a lot more time and effort than anticipated. One of the best things about SM though, was that it allowed the user to make their own decision(s) in most cases when it came to security. That was one of the major features I use to tout to other people about it, and really helpful if one is in a situation where there are security protocols already in place outside of SM itself. Sad to see that the user no longer gets to make their own decision... The user was *never* allowed to make the kind of decision I was talking about -- there's never been the option to run javascript in an unrestricted context or any option anywhere near as awful as that one would be. -- »Q« /\ ASCII Ribbon Campaign \ / against html e-mailX http://asciiribbon.org/ / \ ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I was hoping this thread would be kind of a polling just to get a handle on the numbers of v1.1.18 users vs v2.x users. (Not a full blown argument on Java.) ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C schrieb: I was hoping this thread would be kind of a polling just to get a handle on the numbers of v1.1.18 users vs v2.x users. Judging from the page hits on the SeaMonkey German website, about 45% of the SeaMonkey user base have migrated to 2.0.x by January of 2010. Given that 10% of all hits with any of the suites is still Mozilla suite, 3.5 years after the end-of-life version was reased, migration to the new SeaMonkey versions is quite fast in comparison. Of course, this only includes German-language users, which seem to be about 25% of our user base, judging by 1.x update notification requests, and it only covers those that have not changed their default home page. Still, with 2 million page hits, almost 93% of which come from Mozilla and SeaMonkey suites, and 75% of which go to the default start page of German suite builds, the numbers from there give some good pointers. Robert Kaiser ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I'm still with 1.1 because Form Manager didn't make it into 2.0. The ability to fill in entire web forms (however imperfectly) is something I can't live without. As 1.1 ages, those of us in the same boat may have to reconsider, but hopefully by then someone will have created an add-on with that functionality. And before someone snippily responds write it yourself -- I would try if I had the slightest clue how ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I was hoping this thread would be kind of a polling just to get a handle on the numbers of v1.1.18 users vs v2.x users. (Not a full blown argument on Java.) Its JavaScript not Java. Java is pretty secure now. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Interviewed by CNN on 31/1/2010 00:26, Phillip Jones told the world: Anyway it won't fly, everyone's mind is made up. Would be an interesting feature to create an extension that would put it back. But probably wouldn't get approval from the head big-wigs. Personally, I don't understand all the complaints about not having Javascript in mail. I don't see the point of having any type of active code in mail, except for creating: 1- Stupid annoying Incredimail-like fluff 2- Privacy-violating stuff, like messages that phone home when you read them 3- Viruses P.s.: I'm not a big-wig. I'm not even a little-wig. I'm not a developer, nor involved in any way with the Mozilla project or the Seamonkey council beyond having filed a couple bugs. And, by the way, I am one of those old farts that think HTML e-mail was a very bad idea. -- MCBastos This message has been protected with the 2ROT13 algorithm. Unauthorized use will be prosecuted under the DMCA. -=-=- ... BOFH excuse #247: Due to Federal Budget problems we have been forced to cut back on the number of users able to access the system at one time. (namely none allowed) *Added by TagZilla 0.066.2 running on Seamonkey 2.0.2 * http://xsidebar.mozdev.org/modifiedmailnews.html#tagzilla ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Interviewed by CNN on 30/1/2010 22:50, Mike C told the world: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I miss exactly *one* thing about 1.1.x: Multizilla. Yes, it's a pretty *BIG* thing. Still, that's not enough to make me go back. Better standards support (which means I can use my bank from SM now), the Add-On Manager, more add-ons and updated versions of some I already used... the new DownThemAll by itself is worth the upgrade. -- MCBastos This message has been protected with the 2ROT13 algorithm. Unauthorized use will be prosecuted under the DMCA. -=-=- ... BOFH excuse #189: SCSI's too wide. *Added by TagZilla 0.066.2 running on Seamonkey 2.0.2 * http://xsidebar.mozdev.org/modifiedmailnews.html#tagzilla ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 30/1/2010 22:50, Mike C told the world: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I miss exactly *one* thing about 1.1.x: Multizilla. Yes, it's a pretty *BIG* thing. Still, that's not enough to make me go back. Better standards support (which means I can use my bank from SM now), the Add-On Manager, more add-ons and updated versions of some I already used... the new DownThemAll by itself is worth the upgrade. Most Banks don't accept any and browser that has a version number of Version 1.x on anything. My bank Suntrust said the didn't accept a version one of any browser. I change the the user agent to add /not FireFox 2.0 would work just fine. As soon as I switched to SM I didn't have to use the altered UA string. Try MrTech Extension and see if Multizalla works with forced compatibility. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 31/1/2010 00:26, Phillip Jones told the world: Anyway it won't fly, everyone's mind is made up. Would be an interesting feature to create an extension that would put it back. But probably wouldn't get approval from the head big-wigs. Personally, I don't understand all the complaints about not having Javascript in mail. I don't see the point of having any type of active code in mail, except for creating: 1- Stupid annoying Incredimail-like fluff 2- Privacy-violating stuff, like messages that phone home when you read them 3- Viruses P.s.: I'm not a big-wig. I'm not even a little-wig. I'm not a developer, nor involved in any way with the Mozilla project or the Seamonkey council beyond having filed a couple bugs. And, by the way, I am one of those old farts that think HTML e-mail was a very bad idea. Well I am an Old fart myself , But I think HTML is greatest thing since Sliced Bread. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 31/1/2010 00:26, Phillip Jones told the world: Anyway it won't fly, everyone's mind is made up. Would be an interesting feature to create an extension that would put it back. But probably wouldn't get approval from the head big-wigs. Personally, I don't understand all the complaints about not having Javascript in mail. I don't see the point of having any type of active code in mail, except for creating: 1- Stupid annoying Incredimail-like fluff 2- Privacy-violating stuff, like messages that phone home when you read them 3- Viruses P.s.: I'm not a big-wig. I'm not even a little-wig. I'm not a developer, nor involved in any way with the Mozilla project or the Seamonkey council beyond having filed a couple bugs. And, by the way, I am one of those old farts that think HTML e-mail was a very bad idea. Can depend on the newsgroup - in my case, I'm into computer animation and I'd like to have the ability to enable javascript to view such script-driven postings if/as required. -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Phillip Jones wrote: MCBastos wrote: Interviewed by CNN on 30/1/2010 22:50, Mike C told the world: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I miss exactly *one* thing about 1.1.x: Multizilla. Yes, it's a pretty *BIG* thing. Still, that's not enough to make me go back. Better standards support (which means I can use my bank from SM now), the Add-On Manager, more add-ons and updated versions of some I already used... the new DownThemAll by itself is worth the upgrade. Most Banks don't accept any and browser that has a version number of Version 1.x on anything. My bank Suntrust said the didn't accept a version one of any browser. I change the the user agent to add /not FireFox 2.0 would work just fine. As soon as I switched to SM I didn't have to use the altered UA string. Try MrTech Extension and see if Multizalla works with forced compatibility. I don't think trying to force in MultiZilla is a good idea at all. It is/was a hige extension, almost a new application unto itself. I can't imagine it working on the new SM, but I could imagine it breaking everything. Lee ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? 2.0.2 worked for me from the beginning. I cannot imagine going back No Addons Manager, no RSS feeds? I could live with an extension for RSS, but being able to manage extensions and themes easily is very much worth the 2.0.2 upgrade for me. Lee ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I've upgraded my MacBook Pro and a couple of the other machines around the house to the 2.x.x series, but I'm sticking with 1.1.18 on my Intel iMac, which is my primary home machine. I don't use plugins or add-ons as I've always found the suite to do pretty much what I need right out of the box. Reasons? I'm just not all that thrilled by the loss of some of the user choices I have with 1.1.18 (like being able to select Javascript for Mail/News and not the browser), interface changes, and/or the new default theme. If I had it to do over I'd probably have put the 2.x.x series on my iMac for a look and left 1.1.18 on my MacBook, mainly because of those stupid tiny 2.x.x buttons being harder to target on a laptop with a track pad, but now that I've done it I'll leave it... ...unless I choose to just go back all the way around - I do have a backup of my old 1.1.18 Mozilla folder, and I could always just duplicate the install from my iMac. There are some things I like about the 2.x.x suite - like being able to drag and drop to arrange my newgroup listings, and tabbed Mail/News, but what I don't like doesn't quite balance with what I do like, on the whole. But I'll continue to watch, wait, and hope...for a while. I also get the impression that the 2.x.x suite is working a lot better for people on Macs than it is on PCs...far fewer upgrade issues. At least, that's what it seems like from what I've read here. -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I'm sticking with 1.1.18 because I have the choice of using Javascript for mail and newsgroups. I'm hoping that in future versions a choice would be available as it is presently with 1.1.18 M ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
M wrote: Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I'm sticking with 1.1.18 because I have the choice of using Javascript for mail and newsgroups. I'm hoping that in future versions a choice would be available as it is presently with 1.1.18 M Won't happen. Funny IE Foist Active-X upon its users. And it is far, far more dangerous, than than JavaScript can pretend to be. But you don' t see MS banning Active-X, from IE. But Mozilla hears something about javascript could be dangerous, and banned ten minutes later. Go figure. Anyway it won't fly, everyone's mind is made up. Would be an interesting feature to create an extension that would put it back. But probably wouldn't get approval from the head big-wigs. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
Mike C wrote: I'm sticking with v1.1.18 because of the add ons (mainly RoboForm). I'd be curious to see how many of you are also sticking with v1.1.18 for the time being. Reasons?? I'm sticking with v1.1.18 for now at least. Because of the add ons, mainly MultiZilla, which (btw Lee) gives you an extension manager among lots of other things. I have tried 2.x on a few occasions, but each time within a day, I've done a system restore to a point just before the 2.x install. I lose too many settings and options that (as far as could find), only MZ provides. FF/TB is on all our other systems. Not that I use any of them very often, but my better half does. Maybe I'll have another look after a few more 2.x versions have been released. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
In news:7ladndjm6tmkd_nwnz2dnuvz_sydn...@mozilla.org, Phillip Jones pjon...@kimbanet.com wrote: But Mozilla hears something about javascript could be dangerous, and banned ten minutes later. Go figure. What you've posted is very misleading. They didn't hear something about javascript could be dangerous, they know what javascript can and can't do. And they spent (wasted, IMO) a *lot* more than ten minutes working on the problem before giving up on it. Mozilla Messaging inherited a lot of stuff from previous Mozilla Suite and Thunderbird developers, including a security model which hadn't been maintained for years and was no longer usable. The options were to spend a lot of time and effort to design and implement a new security model or to take out javascript. They started down the first road only to realize it was a lot more time and effort than anticipated. -- »Q« /\ ASCII Ribbon Campaign \ / against html e-mailX http://asciiribbon.org/ / \ ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: 1.1.18 or 2.x ?? (curious)
»Q« wrote: Innews:7ladndjm6tmkd_nwnz2dnuvz_sydn...@mozilla.org, Phillip Jonespjon...@kimbanet.com wrote: But Mozilla hears something about javascript could be dangerous, and banned ten minutes later. Go figure. What you've posted is very misleading. They didn't hear something about javascript could be dangerous, they know what javascript can and can't do. And they spent (wasted, IMO) a *lot* more than ten minutes working on the problem before giving up on it. Mozilla Messaging inherited a lot of stuff from previous Mozilla Suite and Thunderbird developers, including a security model which hadn't been maintained for years and was no longer usable. The options were to spend a lot of time and effort to design and implement a new security model or to take out javascript. They started down the first road only to realize it was a lot more time and effort than anticipated. One of the best things about SM though, was that it allowed the user to make their own decision(s) in most cases when it came to security. That was one of the major features I use to tout to other people about it, and really helpful if one is in a situation where there are security protocols already in place outside of SM itself. Sad to see that the user no longer gets to make their own decision...and also to hear the inherited part - bringing us back to the appearance of code sharing, and all those conspiracy theories. But I get the process... -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
