Re: [OSM-talk] TomTom is thumping us
* John Sturdy [2012-05-29 09:15 +0100]: > The nearest they make to an accurate point is "classification of > footpaths as roads" --- I don't think I've seen any of those, but I > have found quite a few "unclassified roads" that look more like > "tracks" on Bing (and have adjusted them accordingly where confident > of it). I don't know if this is what they're talking about, but the TIGER data in the US has more than a few footways, particularly wider, paved ones, recorded as roads, which got imported into OSM as highway=residential. (There are a lot of logging roads, 4x4 trails, and similarly difficult-to-travel things also classified highway=residential.) I fix them as I find them, naturally, but it's a flaw in the TIGER dataset (which I still think we're better off having imported). -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- "Londo, are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?" "The universe is already mad. Anything else would be redundant." -- Vir and Londo (Babylon 5, "Dust to Dust") --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Import guidelines review
* Tirkon [2012-06-06 21:11 +0200]: > Worst Fixer wrote: > >It means that we must revert things like TIGER and CanVec. Am I right? > > I think fundamentally you are right with this point. My impression is > that many people at OSM regret these imports - in fact the longer they > are involved in the project. I can only speak for myself, but I'm happy that TIGER was imported. I grumble about its quality problems and quirks all the time, usually while I'm fixing them, but I think the US is much better off with that import than it would have been without it. I've only been here for a couple of years, so maybe I haven't been around long enough to regret it, but I probably wouldn't have gotten started with OSM if the TIGER-imported framework hadn't already made it reasonably useful to start with. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- The universe is complex, but it's usefully complex. -- Larry Wall --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSMF Board & auto industry / What's the story?
* Maarten Deen [2012-08-09 14:55 +0200]: > Just curious: what is the current legal stand on mixing OSM with > proprietary information? Let's say I want to use the OSM map and I > have bought a proprietary list of POI's. Am I allowed to combine > this, convert this to my proprietary format and distribute this, > only giving credit? As I understand it (and, of course, legal-talk@ is that way -->), under the ODbL, if you mix your own data into OSM data and distribute the result, you must give any users access to your mixed database and license that database to them under the ODbL (or give them your POI list and whatever programs are necessary to mix the two datasets). You have to provide this data in a reasonably-accessible format. CC-BY-SA is similar in broad terms (you must license the mixed database to the user under CC-BY-SA), but lacks the details more specific to datasets, like the reasonable-format requirement. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Legal in OSM reimplementation project
* john whelan [2012-08-16 14:58 -0400]: > Could some consideration be given to grandfathering, ie if your existing > use of our data is non profit or government and you are not supplying our > data to third parties then you are permitted to continue to use the data as > if it was CC-by-SA. This would avoid the problem of delays whilst approval > is obtained once more. I would presume that anyone who needs time to put the license change into effect would continue to work off the last CC-BY-SA planet file (or the last pre-redaction CC-BY-SA planet file), without consuming updates of course, until they're ready to work with ODbL data. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] obsolete TIGER-tags
* Mike N [2012-11-20 13:58 -0500]: > I also remove reviewed when I have verified the geometry and general > road type, although others use the reviewed flag as a a sign that it has > been verified on the ground. Yeah, I only remove the tiger:reviewed tag once I've verified both the geometry and the name. If I've only verified the geometry (i.e. I haven't yet done a ground survey there), I change it to tiger:reviewed=position. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] a license violation?
* Robin Paulson [2013-01-02 23:41 +1300]: > i was looking for unusual uses of osm data, and found this: > > http://store.axismaps.com/product/boston-blue > > osm is mentioned on the web site, but not on the poster itself. I have their DC poster and I'm pretty sure there's an attribution at the bottom of the poster. It's at home and I'm not, so I'll have to wait until this evening to check it out. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Osm2pgsql/TileMill - how to detect whether way is in a route?
* Steve Bennett [2013-03-19 10:52 +1100]: > One way to fudge this is to render the way, then render the route > relation over the top, obscuring it. But that doesn't work if you want > to use line smoothing (eg, line-smooth:0.6). The route relation will > form a smooth bezier curve the intersection of two ways, but the way > rendering will form a sharp point. > > So I'm just wondering if there is a way around this - some setting in > osm2pgsql, some SQL magic I could play with. I do something very similar with my highway shield rendering, which is driven by route relations. I go through the planet_osm_rels table that's created by osm2pgsql's slim mode, which is considered cheating in some circles. My rendering has code at https://launchpad.net/osm-shields , but the meat of what you're interested in is the following two functions: -- osm2pgsql stores tags in PostgreSQL arrays, where even-numbered array -- members are tags and odd-numbered members are the tags' values. This -- is a convenience function to go through such an array and retrieve the -- value for a given tag. CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION osm_get_tag_value(tags TEXT[], tag TEXT) RETURNS TEXT IMMUTABLE RETURNS NULL ON NULL INPUT LANGUAGE plpgsql AS $$ DECLARE tag_index INTEGER; BEGIN SELECT i INTO tag_index FROM (SELECT generate_subscripts(tags, 1) AS i) AS indices WHERE i % 2 = 1 AND tags[i] = tag; RETURN tags[tag_index + 1]; END; $$; CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION shields_get_route_memberships(planet_osm_rels.id%TYPE) RETURNS fullref[] STABLE RETURNS NULL ON NULL INPUT COST 5000 LANGUAGE SQL AS $$ SELECT shields_replace_groups(array_agg(ROW(shields_sanitize_text(network), shields_sanitize_text(ref))::fullref)) FROM (SELECT osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'route') route, UPPER(osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'network')) network, UPPER(COALESCE(NULLIF(osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'ref'), ''), osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'name'))) AS ref FROM planet_osm_rels WHERE parts && ARRAY[$1] AND parts[way_off:array_upper(parts, 1)] && ARRAY[$1]) AS ref_inner WHERE route = 'road' AND network IS NOT NULL AND ref IS NOT NULL; $$; There's a lot of shield-rendering-specific code in there. A more succinct query might be the following (where $1 is the OSM ID of the way for which you want to determine route membership): SELECT * FROM (SELECT osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'route') route, osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'network') network, osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'ref') ref, osm_get_tag_value(tags, 'name') name FROM planet_osm_rels WHERE parts && ARRAY[$1] AND parts[way_off:array_upper(parts, 1)] && ARRAY[$1]) AS ref_inner WHERE route IS NOT NULL; Obviously, you can add your own parameters in the statement. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] RFC updated: OSM Attribution Mark (was: contributor mark)
* Alex Barth [2013-04-22 08:40 -0400]: > 2. A completely redesigned mark, containing the letters "OSM" I like it. Definitely more distinctive and specific to OSM than the hammer icon. > 3. A completely redesigned `/copyright` page, the page the mark links to. > It is much closer to today's `/copyright` I think the new copyright page is very nice looking and presents its data well, but I, personally, still find it a little confusing in that there are very few visual cues that you can scroll down. My first impression (as with the previous copyright page) is that it's just a pretty attribution page that serves merely to write out the word "OpenStreetMap". All of the additional information is below the bottom of the page and I didn't find it obvious that there would be anything down there. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Admin borders/separate database
* Paul Johnson [2013-11-05 09:18 -0600]: > On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 8:05 AM, Janko Mihelić wrote: > > The problem is, some admin borders are supposed to be glued to roads or > > rivers, and they change when the flow of a road or river changes. How do > > you deal with that? > > Well, historically, the border doesn't move. It depends. In some cases, it doesn't move. In other cases, if the course of the river changes gradually by natural means (i.e. not someone digging a new channel for it), the boundary is considered to move with it. There's also the consideration that people might improve OSM's river or road data over time. If a boundary is glued to a road, but that road is poorly-aligned in OSM, the user who improves its accuracy should be updating both the road and the boundary. Personally, I think that OSM's ball-of-mud approach to data is one of its strengths and separating out its data into layers would be more of a negative than dealing with all of the issues that come from mingling administrative boundaries with everything else. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike
* Alex Barth [2014-03-13 10:26 -0400]: > http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/lxbarth/diary/21221 This is really similar to the discussions that periodically happen in the open source software community over whether share-alike licenses like the GPL or open-use licenses like the 3-clause BSD license are better. I usually end up on the side of share-alike for reasons best summed up by a friend of mine who once said, "The GPL restricts your freedom to be evil. The BSD license doesn't." I think that if your goal is to have as many people as possible using your data, you're best off choosing open-use or public domain licensing. (Richard Weait and I chose to go with CC0 and PDDL for the data in the shield rendering so as to allow for as much variance of reuse as possible. Similarly, it makes sense for US federal government data, because their mandate is to be as useful to US citizens as possible.) If, however, you want to foster a community around a larger scale project, I think share-alike is a better path to take. If OSM switched to public domain licensing today, there would almost certainly be more people using and benefiting from today's OSM data. Google in particular would probably make OSM data part of its data; they already merge numerous public domain datasets into their proprietary dataset. That would make Google the better choice for a lot of people than plain OSM data, and you can even edit Google's data through their Map Maker program. From there, I suspect that Map Maker would attract more people that might otherwise have ended up contributing to OSM, which would hurt community growth and benefit Google at the expense of all the other OSM data consumers. In my opinion, the single biggest thing that makes OSM valuable is the community of people contributing to it, and the license on the data needs to reinforce that community, not allow proprietary data uses to splinter it. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- lately my mania has been mega-lo-mein-ia, which is to say i believe the plate of noodles is larger than i am. -- elysse --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Talk-us] OpenStreetMap Isn't All That Open, Let's Change That and Drop Share-Alike
* Florian Lohoff [2014-03-16 10:38 +0100]: > On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 11:03:41AM -0400, Phil! Gold wrote: > > I suspect that Map Maker would attract more people that might > > otherwise have ended up contributing to OSM, which would hurt > > community growth and benefit Google at the expense of all the other > > OSM data consumers. > > But this is technically impossible. Either you take OSM and the flow of > changes of contributers for a certain area, or you take some snapshot > and let your community edit it by cutting off the OSM stream. Google appears to do both, probably because they've gotten really good at data conflation. They already pull data from multiple datasets, including proprietary data like Telenav's, public domain data from governments and such, and restricted use data from local governments, and then they integrate GMM contributions on top of that amalgamation. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- A funny symbol that I can't read has just been input. Continue, and I'll forget that it ever happened. -- TeX error message --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] stop deleting abandoned railroads
* Martin Koppenhoefer [2015-08-21 09:22 +0200]: > railway=dismantled means there is no railway currently but there are clear > traces / remains of a railway (because if there weren't we would not put it > in Osm). Just for clarity: railway=abandoned (per the wiki and my understanding of things) is for when there remain traces of a railway whose rails are no longer present. railway=dismantled (and its synonym, railway=razed) was introduced to cover the case where people wanted to tag the path of a former railway where no traces of the railway remain (e.g. because the area was completely leveled to may way for a subdivision or mall). (Reasons for using railway=dismantled usually amount to, "The railway=abandoned traces on either side of the leveled area make the former presence of a railway a ground truth (because you wouldn't just have a gap in a railway) so the railway=dismantled way bridges that gap in the OSM database.") -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Brillineggiava, ed i tovoli slati girlavano ghimbanti nella vaba; i borogovi eran tutti mimanti e la moma radeva fuorigraba. -- Lewis Carroll, "Jabberwocky" --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] River boundaries , not Post code areas
* John Smith [2010-04-05 23:35 EDT]: > On 6 April 2010 13:19, Liz wrote: > > Particularly on the River Murray, where the southern bank is defined as the > > boundary. > > I thought that's why the boundary should move, the river moving means > the border moves, doesn't it? I can't speak to this specific river, but I've done some research on this topic recently, inspired by the question of what to do when administrative boundaries run along other ways (roads, rivers, etc.). It seems to be generally accepted that, absent any specific negotiations to the contrary, when a boundary is defined by a river, the gradual change of the river's course over time also causes the boundary to move. On the other hand, when a river's course changes abruptly (from a flood, or from a man-made diversion, for example), the border remains where it was before the change. An example of the latter is Carter Lake, Iowa in the US. A flood in 1877 moved the Missouri River, which serves as the boundary between Iowa and Nebraska, onto the opposite side of the town. The court system eventually ruled that because the change in the river's path was abrupt, the borders remained where they were before the flood, and the town remained in the state of Iowa. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- TeX has found at least one bug in every Pascal compiler it's been run on, I think, and at least two in every C compiler. -- Donald Knuth --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] What's good accuracy for a GPS unit?
Hopefully this isn't too off-topic for the list. If it is, sorry. I use a Palm Pre for recording GPS traces. Once it's warmed up, it normally reports an accuracy of 3 meters, which seems to fit reasonably with what I've seen when overlaying my traces on the Yahoo WMS tiles (although sometimes traces where I was driving in the same place at different times can diverge by 4 to 5 meters). What I'm curious about is how well the Pre's accuracy compares to other GPS units. I've read that GPS units with WAAS (for I am in the US) can get results with less than one meter of imprecision, but in a survey of GPS unit accuracy online I only found reports of "3 meters or less". What's the typical degree of accuracy you get with your GPS unit? -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- "Yeah, I'm gonna have to go with Dead Boy on this one." "Could you *not* call me that?" -- Xander and Angel (Buffy the Vampire Slayer, "Lie to Me") --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Using destination_sign relations for complex exit ramps?
I've been trying to figure out how to tag some moderately complex exit ramp systems when a single motorway_junction doesn't seem adequate. An email to the newbies list led to an IRC discussion that led to a solution that I like, so I wanted to present it here to see what other people think and possibly what other people have done in similar situations. As background, most highway exits are simple and a motorway_junction with a ref= for the exit number captures all the important information about the exit. That approach works best, though, if there's only one destination from the exit. I know several places where the reality is slightly more complicated than that. One example is the exit from westbound I-70 in Maryland (in the US) onto I-695[0]; there is one ramp from I-70 with exit number 91 that splits a short while later into exits 91A (I-695 southbound) and 91B (I-695 northbound). I want to be able to capture all of that information in OpenStreetMap so that a theoretical routing agent can say, e.g., "Take exit 91 to the right, then take exit 91A to the left." [0]: I-70 westbound exit 91 http://osm.org/go/ZZd8vPYT The IRC discussion pointed out that this falls more or less into the same domain as the destination_sign relation. The only thing it's missing is the exit number. What I think would work would be to use the destination_sign relation with the destination= tag containing the target road (I-695, in my example), possibly extended with other destinations from the signs in order of increasing distance (so exit 91A might have "destination=I-695; Glen Burnie; Washington"); and the ref= tag containing the exit number (so exit 91A would have "ref=91A"). I'd like to know what other people think about this idea. What other approaches have people used for my situation? One person on IRC suggested that ref= on the destination_sign relation sould be the ref of the destination road, but I think it makes more sense to have it as the exit number (perhaps there could be a destination_ref= tag). Are there any opinions one way or the other on that? -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Steal this tagline. I did. --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using destination_sign relations for complex exit ramps?
* Roy Wallace [2010-04-24 10:55 +1000]: > It may be just me, but using type=destination_sign + ref=91 seems to > imply that "91" is a property of the sign. That's a good point. Perhaps it would make more sense to have an exit_ref tag (and document it on the wiki?). > Doesn't an "exit" exist independently of the sign? If so, is there a > way to map it independently of a destination_sign? It does, but I don't see any better relation for it, and I don't feel comfortable enough with OpenStreetMap yet to want to start proposing new relations. What started me on this topic was one person on IRC saying that they'd used the destination_sign relation for exits before, so at least there's precedent. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Never pet a burning dog. -- Bart Callan --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using destination_sign relations for complex exit ramps?
* Roy Wallace [2010-04-28 17:52 +1000]: > On Tue, Apr 27, 2010 at 11:58 PM, Phil! Gold wrote: > >> Doesn't an "exit" exist independently of the sign? If so, is there a > >> way to map it independently of a destination_sign? > > > > It does, but I don't see any better relation for it > > What about similar to a turn_restriction relation? I.e. with a "from" > way, "via" node, and "to" way... > > You could use type=motorway_junction + ref=*, to be consistent with > the existing highway=motorway_junction tagging. Like I said, I don't feel entirely up to the task of suggesting additions to OSM's tagging schemes yet, but that sounds like the best idea so far, in terms of appropriateness to the actual data. I guess I'll wait a few days and see if anyyone has any other suggestions. If not, I'll start reading about the tagging proposal process on the wiki. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Time is nature's way of making sure that everything doesn't happen at once. Space is nature's way of making sure that everything doesn't happen to you. --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Russians at it again
* Kirill Bestoujev [2010-05-07 13:21 +0400]: > You did understand the text of the voting correctly. But once again: > this voting, as ANY OTHER VOTING on osm-wiki HAS NO POWER OF A RULE. > Anyone can map anything in any way he likes. No one in OSM can force > an osmer to stop mapping or to map in an other way. Do the people voting understand that? From the translated text, I get the impression that anyone who votes for it will have the assumption that they are voting to regulate other people's behavior, which could lead to problems later, particularly if someone sees the wiki page that says "no military mapping in Russia" and then deletes OSM data that looks like military mapping in Russia. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- I hate mornings. I know they hate me back, too. -- Joel Gluth --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] lazyweb: what linux-based wifi gps phone would you recommend
* John Smith [2010-05-19 09:32 +1000]: > On 19 May 2010 09:29, jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com > > our group in albania and kosovo is not just promoting and working on OSM and > > freedom of the maps, but also of software and knowledge, we promoting linux. > > If given a choice, we will choose to promote freedom. > > In which case your only options, to the best of my knowledge, are the > nokia n900 and the freerunner... Android phones are usually too locked > down to be considered free by most FLOSS groups... There's also the Palm Pre (or Pixi, but the Pre has nicer hardware). The phone is Linux based and doesn't require rooting or jailbreaking; just installing the Developer SDK gives you access to a root shell on the device. The drawback is that there still isn't a whole lot of software for the phone, though there are a few apps that use OSM data (mostly just rendered tiles, but there are alpha builds of Navit available). I'm not sure how much I'd recommend it--of the various smartphone platforms, it's both the most ambitious (multitasking, nice UI, well-integrated phone environment) and the slowest (the hardware isn't quite up to some of the tasks it's asked to do, and battery life is atrocious)--but it's probably one of the most open Linux-based phones short of the FreeRunner. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- No, being mentioned on my website doesn't necessarily disqualify you from getting a government job. -- vees --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Finding relation members in osm2pgsql PostGIS database?
I've got a PostGIS database created and maintained with osm2pgsql. For some of the Mapnik rendering I'm doing, I'd like to see whether ways belong to relations. (Specifically, whether a highway=* way is a member of a route=road relation.) I've been able to look in the planet_osm_rels table for relation membership, but the members are stored in an array, and searching those arrays for membership, even on a bbox-restricted subset, is really slow. Is there any way to do this faster? If not, I suppose I can file a feature request against osm2pgsql for an indexed relation membership table. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Last Rule of Politics: Kingdoms are good. Empires are evil. -- Console Role Playing Game Clichés, item 74 --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
* Juan Lucas Domínguez Rubio [2010-06-24 01:34 -0700]: > Another question: after exporting the whole planet (recently) to > Postgres, what is the size of the largest table created (which I presume > will take up 80% of the whole DB)? I can't speak for the whole planet.osm file (so this might be useless), but I have (roughly) an extract of the United States. The largest table, planet_osm_ways, is 50 GB. The next-largest table, planet_osm_nodes, is 21 GB. After that is planet_osm_line at 8 GB. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Last night I met upon the stair A little man who wasn't there. He wasn't there again today. I think he's from the NSA! --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] wiki down ?
* Grant Slater [2010-06-29 06:44 +0100]: > All fixed now. > Squid fell over during a backup when disk space became tight. It acts > as cache for wiki and some of the mapnik tiles. It seems that tiles still aren't rendering; munin shows the renderd queue is empty. Is something still broken there? -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Education is a better safeguard of liberty than a standing army. -- Edward Everett ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Candidacy] AGM Foundation 2010 - Girona
* David Earl [2010-07-05 10:38 +0100]: > Addresses are a bit different because its a whole different level of > detail. But because you don't think its fun doesn't mean others > don't enjoy it (or even do it because it is enjoyable). I did my > village to see what it would take, but in general I took the view > that I wanted to get complete street level / poi coverage for the > area reasonably within my reach before I started on the next level > of detail down. Interestingly, I don't gather a lot of POIs when surveying, because I'm usually not going to be returning to the survey areas to keep the POIs up to date. On the other hand, I try to scrupulously record all addresses, because in my opinion those have longer lifetimes than, say, your average strip mall shop. (This, of course, only reinforces the recurring theme of "OSM is different things to different people". As does the fact that I've been taking a break from surveying by mapping all the power lines in my state.) -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- /me pats his two indy's lovingly, don't listen to those nasty sun enthuasists boys, their machines are a dull nasty grey, not a nice pretty blue colour like you two. -- Greg McCarroll --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Tag name vs operator
* David Murn [2010-07-13 18:34 +1000]: > If the big logo on the sign out the front says Texasco, then that should > be the operator. No, if the big sign says Texaco, than the name should at least include "Texaco". But that particular Texaco is being operated by someone else (i.e. not the global Texaco corporation), so the person or company that owns and operates that Texaco location is what should go in the operator field. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- If your advisors ask, "Why are you risking everything on such a mad scheme?" do not proceed until you have a response that satisfies them. -- Evil Overlord's Handbook, entry 61 --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] How can the US get its stuff together? (was Re: Response to A critique of OpenStreetMap)
* Richard Fairhurst [2010-10-14 10:47 -0700]: > I think you could largely sum up his criticisms in two broad headings: > >1. US OSM contributors need to get their shit together >2. European maps don't look like American ones I'm trying to see what sort of consensus exists on some of the issues from 41 latitude's post. I've sent an email to the talk-us list[0] asking for feedback and discussion. I encourage anyone who's interested, particulary people who map in the US, to contribute to the discussion on that list. [0]: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-us/2010-October/004361.html -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Relying on the government to protect your privacy is like asking a peeping tom to install your window blinds. -- _Decrypting the Puzzle Palace_, John Barlow --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Proposal for additional Mapnik power=tower icons
* John Goodman [2010-10-17 11:54 -0400]: > I propose using a 5x5 icon at zoom levels 16 and 15, and a 3x3 icon > at zoom level 14. Simulated examples of the proposed look is shown > here: > > http://www.qlam.com/power_tower_proposal.png I think that's definitely an improvement. It feels more like zooming in on the features, and it both deemphasises the towers at lower zoom levels and better represents multiple towers in close proximity. (I've mapped a lot of places where multiple lines run in parallel with matching sets of towers, but the display at lower zoom levels looks very ragged because of the avoidance of overlapping symbols.) -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- HANDLE WITH EXTREME CARE: This Product Contains Minute Electrically Charged Particles Moving at Velocities in Excess of Five Hundred Million Miles Per Hour. -- Journal of Irreproducable Results, v36 #1 --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [josm-dev] Bing imagery now available in JOSM
* Iván Sánchez Ortega [2010-12-02 00:30 +0100]: > A question, however: for WMS layers, would it be possible to automatically > change the resolution of the loaded tiles, in a way similar to the slippymap > tiles? This would be great as a default behavior, but it would be nice to have an option (on the layer's right-click menu, maybe?) to disable auto-zooming. I sometimes use the USGS's DRG WMS, which changes the topo maps that it shows you based on the zoom level. I occasionally have to use that WMS zoomed out a bit because the layer it would give me at the zoom level where I'm working would be wrong. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- The artist deals with what cannot be said in words. The artist whose medium is fiction does this _in words_. The novelist says in words what cannot be said in words. -- Ursula K. Le Guin --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] protocol for adding buildings using aerial imagery?
* Erin Korris [2010-12-27 16:02 -0800]: > I am wondering if there is a rule to follow when tracing buildings using > aerial > imagery. On the default, Yahoo imagery, the buildings are slightly displaced > so > in addition to the roof you can see the foundation of certain sides of the > building. Should this be ignored and the building drawn based on the roof? Buildings should be drawn based on their shape and position at ground level.[1] If the roof is flat, you can often just trace the roof then drag the outline to where the building meets the ground. Otherwise, you can usually see half the building's sides, so you can use those to get placement for the outline. [1] That rule of thumb works most of the time, but sometimes you just have to use your best judgement. e.g. the Baltimore Convention Center's second floor is narrower than its first, but the building is on a hill and the increased width of the lower level is not apparent at one end of the building because the second floor is at ground level. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- I cheat for holidays. -- Laura, on eating meat. --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Turn left restriction on two way highways
* Alan Mintz [2010-12-29 09:16 -0800]: > You should map the exceptions (where left-turn IS allowed). +1 > Don't know what to call them instead of no_left_turn. Maybe > left_turn or left_turn_allowed. One of the nice things about the turn restriction relation is that the first part of each restriction type is either "no" or "only", which makes parsing them very simple. I would suggest that any expansions be named similarly (and probably discussed on tagging@, anyway), so something like "allowed_left_turn". -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Hey, he shouldn't step out of my pentagram just like that, eh? -- Famous Last Words, #1692 --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] What phones do OSMers have?
* Steve Coast [2011-01-03 09:14 -0800]: > I'm curious. So here's a little survey I have a Palm Pre, so I answered "Palm", but I'll not there's a world of difference between the older PalmOS and their current OS, WebOS. > Specifically I'm wondering if everyone has androids because we're all open > source nuts or if it's more balanced? Only the data will show. I got the Palm Pre because it's the most open platform I've seen short of OpenMoko, though I keep considering switching to Android for the greater variety of apps. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- heh, linux cash register. 'The only downside is that beer always rings up as free.' -- seen on #megazeux --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] What phones do OSMers have?
* andrzej zaborowski [2011-01-04 08:49 +0100]: > AFAIK Maemo, Palm's Webos and Android are all about the same level of > "open", i.e. linux-based but including some closed source drivers or > libraries. I don't know much about Maemo phones, but Palm has a more open approach to the OS than most (maybe all) Android manufacturers. Apps for Android are limited to the Java environment that Android provides and accessing the OS requires jailbreaking the phone, which most manufacturers don't like. Palm (now HP) allows access to the base OS as a policy, although the code for their UI is still proprietary. Mostly, what I like about having a Palm phone is not having to jailbreak it in order to do (more or less) whatever I want to it. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- It didn't take very much reductio to get right down to absurdum from where you started. -- Mike Jones --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Nominatim & US places
* Greg Troxel [2011-01-03 22:19 -0500]: > Richard Welty writes: > > this is why i suggested adding a "centroid" tag to the boundary relations > > as a way to convey the place that is by convention considered the > > "center" of town. > > The word centroid seems best avoided. It has a well established > geometrical meaning and that isn't what we mean. admin_centre seems > fine for boundaries with admin_level tags. Or just traditional_center > for any boundary relation. The boundary relation[0] has roles for both admin_centre and label, though I don't know how many renderers are using them currently. For some reason, a lot of places (including the US) seem to have standardized on using multipolygons instead of boundary relations for administrative boundaries. I'm still not sure why, since the boundary relation seems to me to be a better fit for the data. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- One man's constant is another man's variable. -- A.J. Perlis --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] New tool in Potlatch 2 for areas that share a way
* char...@cferrero.net [2011-01-31 07:40 +]: > I've noticed, however, that Osmarender doesn't render islands which > are multipolygons (but Mapnik does). Osmarender can be weird with multipolygons. I know from mentions on IRC that Tiles@Home splits up OSM data in chunks the size of a single z12 tile, so multipolygons larger (or wider or longer) than a z12 tile can mess up its rendering. In particular, if osmarender can't see all the bounds of a riverbank multipolygon, it'll do things like rendering the entire tile full of water. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- "You're Hells Angels, then? What chapter are you from?" REVELATIONS, CHAPTER SIX. -- _Good Omens_, Neil Gaiman and Terry Pratchett --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Extracting a BBOX from an osm change file
* Rodolphe Quiedeville [2011-03-11 13:39 +0100]: > I want to know if changes files from > planet.openstreetmap.org/hourly-replicate/ are useful for a BBOX. My > first idea wass to to this with osmosis, if someone give me a hint. You can't apply a bbox to a change file. Change files basically contain the IDs of changed objects and their current properties. Notably, they do not contain the old properties of the objects, so osmosis cannot tell in all cases whether an object should be considered to be in or out of the bbox. If you're using osm2pgsql, you just have to apply the full change files. You can syill use osm2pgsql's bbox, which will restrict the data in the rendering tables (but the tables for slim mode will gradually accumulate data from outside the bbox that will only go away if you do a dump and fresh reload from a planet extract). -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- One can measure the importance of a scientific work by the number of earlier publications rendered superfluous by it. -- David Hilbert --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licensing Working Group
* Steve Doerr [2011-03-23 11:52 +]: > I'm still waiting for an official request for users to sign up to > the new terms. Have I missed one? I can't find the announcement, but you can voluntarily accept the new license and Contributer Terms on your account page (which can be accessed from: http://openstreetmap.org/user/terms ). We're not yet at the mandatory relicensing phase of the process; the implementation plan on the wiki[0] indicates that they're working on wording for the Contributor Terms and discussing the relicensing with data donors before moving on to the mandatory phase. [0] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Open_Data_License/Implementation_Plan -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- I would be content if my children grew up to be the kind of people who think decorating consists mostly of building enough bookshelves. -- Anna Quindlen --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licensing Working Group
* Simon Poole [2011-03-23 13:03 +0100]: > Am 23.03.2011 12:52, schrieb Steve Doerr: > >I'm still waiting for an official request for users to sign up to > >the new terms. Have I missed one? > > No you haven't. I thought I'd seen an announcement for the voluntary relicensing (the phace of the ODBL transition in which we presently find ourselves), so I checked back through my archives, and found that it was announced on this list on 12 August 2010. http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2010-August/052853.html -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- I never understood people who don't have bookshelves. -- George Plimpton --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Default policy on automated edits
* Serge Wroclawski [2011-05-21 11:49 +0100]: > I was recently having a discussion about the role of automated imports > and other automated edits to our dataset. > > I think we need a simple, concise position statement on the issue. > > This video concisely summarizes my view on the issue and I suggest we > adopt it as our official default policy: > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tb2Pzl1U0sY You posted this at about the same time I found and was considering an import of landuse data for Baltimore City. Unfortunately for me, the quality of the city's shapefile data was not at all up to the quality standard of OpenStreetMap, which only adds support to your position. I wrote a little about this on my diary: http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/asciiphil/diary/13891 -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- By policy, LISP has never really catered to mere mortals. And, of course, mere mortals have never really forgiven LISP for not catering to them. -- Larry Wall --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] low resource osm xapi instance
* Robin Paulson [2011-05-24 11:31 +1200]: > this is my query: > http://open.mapquestapi.com/xapi/api/0.6/relation[route=bus][ref=010][bbox=-174.327,-37.236,175.324,-36.519] Everything I've read about XAPI and JXAPI has said that only one predicate is supported, aside from the bbox predicate. It's possible that you're getting all the bus routes within that bbox. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- One of the great skills in using any language is knowing what not to use, what not to say. ... There's that simplicity thing again. -- Ron Jeffries --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] level_crossing, leveled
* Richard Weait [2011-05-25 15:10 -0400]: > HI all, > > What should be done with a level_crossing, when trains may cross no longer? I usually have the disused raily intersect the road but don't tag a level_crossing on the intersection. In some cases (where the tracks have been torn up rather than just paved over), I'll split the railway into three pieces and tag the part that crosses the road as abandoned rather than disused. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- When you say "I wrote a program that crashed Windows", people just stare at you blankly and say "Hey, I got those with the system, *for free*". -- Linus Torvalds --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Extract a polygon into a polygon filter file format
* Frederik Ramm [2011-08-26 15:33 +0200]: > I think it is only logical to group all ways making up the border > with country A in one relation, and those making up the border with > country B in another, and so on. Why is this so logical? The exact same data can be derived from the intersection of the sets of elements in the two countries' (single-level) border relations. It seems to me that because both shcmes can satisfy the use case, the preferable approace would be the simpler one, which I see as being the single-relation approach. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Serious error. All shortcuts have disappeared, Screen. Mind. Both are blank. --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] High Road - pre-cooked Postgres views for rendering OSM roads
* Michal Migurski [2011-09-07 09:13 -0700]: > This kind of thing [joining roads with similar names] really needs to be > applied all-at-once to a large dataset, because it can really mess with > tile boundaries when done at render-time. I'd be interested in any view-based solutions people have come up for merging road names. I've tried three different approaches that all fall short one way or another. I can generate an auxilary table with the merged geometries, but that won't be updated by the minutely updates. I've tried setting up recursive queries to spider their way along the extents of connected identically-named roads, but that gets really slow and I never got it working quite right. What I've settled on is running an ST_Collect() across all the ways in the current metatile's bbox, but that, as you note, makes for a lot of artifacts at tile boundaries. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Sometimes I wonder if cows are really free. -- Bucky Menchaca --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Who's using the torrents?
* ant [2011-09-08 21:13 +0200]: > I'm curious about how this is utilized. Have you ever used the > torrents? Do you use them regularly? Do you seed? I use them regularly. I use the RSS feed to auto-download the torrent files and then seed them until the next week's files are out. It's kind of convenient to always have a recent planet file on hand, even though my main use of the data is via a minutely-updated PostGIS database. I'd be really happy if there were torrents for the PBF files, too; they're a lot faster for me to process. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln256%Pln256/snlbx]sb3135071790101768542287578439snlbxq'|dc --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Who's using the torrents?
* Jaak Laineste [2011-09-19 14:14 +0300]: > 2011/9/8 Phil! Gold : > > * ant [2011-09-08 21:13 +0200]: > >> I'm curious about how this is utilized. Have you ever used the > >> torrents? Do you use them regularly? Do you seed? > > > > I use them regularly. I use the RSS feed to auto-download the torrent > > files and then seed them until the next week's files are out. It's kind > > of convenient to always have a recent planet file on hand, even though my > > main use of the data is via a minutely-updated PostGIS database. > > How exactly do you do it - can you share the scripts? I use FlexGet[0] to monitor the RSS feed[1] and automatically download new torrent files. [0] http://flexget.com/ [1] http://osm-torrent.torres.voyager.hr/files/rss.xml Here's my FlexGet config.yaml: feeds: osm-planets: rss: http://osm-torrent.torres.voyager.hr/files/rss.xml accept_all: yes transmission: host: localhost port: 9091 username: username password: password I use transmission as my BitTorrent client. If you use a different program, you'll have to change that a little, but FlexGet has plugins for most of the major ones. > I could also create regular copy of pbf (from > http://download.bbbike.org/osm/planet/ for example, or with osmosis) > there to share it via bittorrent, if someone gives specific bittorrent > instructions for Ubuntu. The script used to make the current torrents[0] is probably the best place to start, though that doesn't help if you're not familiar with shell scripting. I'll see if I can tweak it and then write some general instructions about using it. [0] http://osm-torrent.torres.voyager.hr/files/create_new_planet_torrent.sh -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- The Very Big Stupid is a thing which breeds by eating The Future. Have you seen it? It sometimes disguises itself as a good-looking quarterly bottom line, derived by closing the R&D department. -- Frank Zappa --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] tile rendereing total space
* ciprian niculescu [2012-01-09 16:30 +0100]: > Nice thread on space, but what about inode number, on my server i get fast > to 100% inode used. > So what filesystems do you use, in what cluster config. XFS (as Grant noted) and JFS both do well with large numbers of allocated inodes. ReiserFS doesn't appear to have an inode limit at all, but I tend to avoid it these days, mostly for reasons of personal experience: I've had disk failures that damaged XFS, JFS, and ReiserFS filesystems, and have had the best experiences recovering data from damaged JFS filesystems. I'm not sure what you mean by "cluster config", but I keep my tiles (for very low-demand usage) in an LVM logical volume that sits on a RAID1 physical volume. I don't do any disk spanning tricks for them. My PostgreSQL rendering database, however, spans four 10k RPM disks in a RAID0 configuration. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Let's call it an accidental feature. -- Larry Wall --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Road cores and casings on standard Mapnik rendering
* Frederik Ramm [2012-01-20 09:16 +0100]: > So then I stuck them into this table: > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/images/0/02/Difference_in_Core-Casing.PNG That is an excellent reference. Thanks! > The "motorway" and "motorway_link_" are the strangest as they are > smaller than all but a few roads of lower status than them. I don't know for certain but I figured this was because motorways are almost always in pairs and the thinness is a compensation for that doubling. > Finally the order in which they render has links render very early, > rather than just before there similarly named road (i.e. motorway_link > to motorway). I think the links should render before all roads residential and up (possibly before service, too); IMHO, you get better-looking results that way. > The main issue with this is in flyover junctions where roads don't > flow nicely into one another; but there are other reasons also. There are some issues with bridge rendering at the moment, in particular that _link roads on bridges are *not* rendered as early as non-bridge _link roads. I've a mind to sort out the things about layered rendering that bother me at the upcoming DC hack weekend and then submit a patch. Can you give an example of a junction that doesn't look good to you? > In conclusion: The answer to this is a bit opinionated so there > isn't really one, but the suggestion I would make is that either all > roads bar maybe residential and service should be the same size with > the same casing More prominent roads should be wider, I think, but the casings should be consistent, yes. > maybe oneday having lanes= taken into consideration. My opinion is that lanes= would be better for a specialized rendering, rather than the "main" map, because I think road thickness should be correlated to road prominence, and using lanes= could lead to inversions of that rule in places. One of my favorite renderings is TopOSM: http://toposm.com/us/index.html Its rules are very consistent and I like its progression of road widths. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Sendmail may be safely run set-user-id to root. -- Eric Allman, "Sendmail Installation Guide" --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
