Re: [ubuntu-art] .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

Thorsten Wilms a écrit :
> On Thu, 2010-02-18 at 09:13 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>
>   
>> I'd rather think this is because Adobe has nothing to do with pdf 
>> anymore; I still think that no reference to an app should appear in a 
>> file icon if this app is not installed and meant to deal with this kind 
>> of files. I truly think that a file icon containing a "Adobe" logo means 
>> to the user: if I open this, it will be launched in Adobe Reader.
>> 
>
>
> I agree. However, it shouldn't be about what is installed. I'd say: a
> mime-type icon should, or rather may, only include or refer to an
> application icon, if that application is the only one that deals with
> that file-type (ability to open files in a text-editor or hex-viewer or
> similar doesn't count, of course).
>   
I totally agree. That means doc, xls, ppt files should not refer to Ms 
Office apps, neither should pdf refer to Adobe or psd to Photoshop -- ok 
the last one is the only that can entirely deal with psd, however some 
image viewers can render psd nicely and The Gimp can edit them to a 
certain extend (plus it seems strange to have a reference in Linux to an 
app that is not even available on this platform).

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Re: [ubuntu-art] .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

Kenneth Wimer a écrit :
>
> On Wednesday 17 February 2010 06:17:12 pm Vishnoo wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:44 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>
> > > Vishnoo a écrit :
>
> > > > On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:18 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>
> > > >> On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:04 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>
> > > >>>> On Wednesday 17 February 2010 07:38:23 am Merk wrote:
>
> > > >>>>>> I'm not asking why the OS X was directly copied instead of 
> either
>
> > > >>>>>> Windows one. I'm asking why any existing Word icon was 
> copied at
>
> > > >>>>>> all.
>
> > > >>>>>
>
> > > >>>>> It is a mimetype and as such needs to visually represent a 
> certain
>
> > > >>>>> type of file. It goes without saying that when everyone 
> associates
>
> > > >>>>> a certain look/letter/number with something they don't 
> search for
>
> > > >>>>> other visual metaphors. People expect certain things to look
>
> > > >>>>> certain ways ;)
>
> > > >>>>>
>
> > > >>>>> --
>
> > > >>>>> Ken
>
> > > >>>>
>
> > > >>>> Ok but it feels uncomfortable
>
> > > >>>
>
> > > >>> Thats really awesome. :)
>
> > > >>>
>
> > > >>> Then using those files types should be reduced rather than
>
> > > >>> complaining about the icon ;)
>
> > > >>
>
> > > >> Those filetypes are supported by OOo. No need to associate them to
>
> > > >> icons referencing to Ms applications not supported under Linux.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > The icon is used only when someone is saving the file to be MS 
> office
>
> > > > complaint.
>
> > > > Why cant we stop using that format , rather than nit-pick over 
> what one
>
> > > > has just chosen to continue to support?
>
> > > >
>
> > > >> As far as I
>
> > > >> know, there is no reference to Adobe in the pdf files icons.
>
> > > >
>
> > > > I'd suggest you check again ;)
>
> > >
>
> > > Ok well, you are right. And that is basically... lame. Evince is the
>
> > > default PDF reader, why should the icon be related to Adobe?
>
> >
>
> > There is a difference between PDF and Adobe / Evince. :)
>
> >
>
> > PDF is an _open_ Portable Document Format. and the logo isnt even been
>
> > used in full. ;)
>
> >
>
> > Adobe is a company with several apps and "Reader" , "Acrobat" is the pdf
>
> > reader and editor respectively. Note the adobe logo isnt used. Their
>
> > logo is different.
>
> >
>
> > Evince is an app too and not a format ...
>
> >
>
> > > Even under
>
> > > MacOSX the pdf files icons have no reference to the Adobe brand,
>
> >
>
> I think this is (mainly) due to the differences that Apple and Adobe 
> have had. In the past I have had problems using Adobe's PDF logo in 
> another icon set I worked on. They contacted us and told us to change 
> it. It is a slippery slope, you want to make it recognizable but yet 
> different enough to avoid legal problems.
>
> http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Icon_Design has some valuable 
> info, specifically http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/MimeType_Icons
>
> --
>
> Ken
>
I'd rather think this is because Adobe has nothing to do with pdf 
anymore; I still think that no reference to an app should appear in a 
file icon if this app is not installed and meant to deal with this kind 
of files. I truly think that a file icon containing a "Adobe" logo means 
to the user: if I open this, it will be launched in Adobe Reader.

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[ubuntu-art] .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:44 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
> Vishnoo a écrit :
> > On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:18 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
> >  
> >> On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:04 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
> >>
> >>>> On Wednesday 17 February 2010 07:38:23 am Merk wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>> I'm not asking why the OS X was directly copied instead of 
either Windows

> >>>>>> one.  I'm asking why any existing Word icon was copied at all.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> It is a mimetype and as such needs to visually represent a 
certain type of
> >>>>> file. It goes without saying that when everyone associates a 
certain
> >>>>> look/letter/number with something they don't search for other 
visual

> >>>>> metaphors. People expect certain things to look certain ways ;)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Ken
> >>>>>  
> >>>>>  
> >>>> Ok but it feels uncomfortable
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>> Thats really awesome. :)

> >>>
> >>> Then using those files types should be reduced rather than 
complaining

> >>> about the icon ;)
> >>>  
> >>>  
> >> Those filetypes are supported by OOo. No need to associate them 
to icons

> >> referencing to Ms applications not supported under Linux.
> >>
> >

> > The icon is used only when someone is saving the file to be MS office
> > complaint.
> > Why cant we stop using that format , rather than nit-pick over 
what one

> > has just chosen to continue to support?
> >
> >  
> >>  As far as I

> >> know, there is no reference to Adobe in the pdf files icons.
> >>
> >>
> >

> > I'd suggest you check again ;)
> >  
> Ok well, you are right. And that is basically... lame. Evince is the

> default PDF reader, why should the icon be related to Adobe?

There is a difference between PDF and Adobe / Evince.   :)

PDF is an _open_ Portable Document Format. and the logo isnt even been
used in full. ;)

Adobe is a company with several apps and "Reader" , "Acrobat" is the pdf
reader and editor respectively. Note the adobe logo isnt used. Their
logo is different.

Evince is an app too and not a format ...


Ok sorry obviously you widely misunderstood my point, maybe I was not 
clear enough in my previous mail. Of course, the icon for the pdf 
*filetype* is a reference to adobe; it is red/white with a big A in it 
-- see attached. That is not acceptable (nor is it to put a "ms word" or 
"ms powerpoint" logo in a *filetype* icon). The only thing the user has 
to know is that it is a pdf file, period. In MacOsX, the icon is like 
that (ok that's a .ps here, but it's the same for .pdf): 
http://www.entropy.ch/software/macosx/docs/openoffice-mac/temp-ps-file.png
Do you see a reference to Adobe Reader? No of course, because it is not 
the default reader. Putting a reference to Adobe makes the user think it 
will open with Adobe when double-clicking on the file.


The problem is the same for the psd file icon (attached): why putting a 
Photoshop logo? The user only has to know it is an image, with the psd 
extension. The photoshop logo is a nonsense here.


(You can try asking the evince developers if they think it is a good 
idea to have icons for *pdf filetype* referencing to Adobe by default in 
Ubuntu, I'm pretty sure what the answer will be. Same with OpenOffice 
developers and doc, xls and ppt files icons.)


Cheers,

François


In short there shouldn't be in ANY icon of ANY filetype whatsoever that 
carries a reference to an *app which is not installed on the system*.



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[ubuntu-art] Re : .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:44 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
> Vishnoo a écrit :
> > On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:18 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
> >  
> >> On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:04 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
> >>
> >>>> On Wednesday 17 February 2010 07:38:23 am Merk wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>> I'm not asking why the OS X was directly copied instead of 
either Windows

> >>>>>> one.  I'm asking why any existing Word icon was copied at all.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> It is a mimetype and as such needs to visually represent a 
certain type of
> >>>>> file. It goes without saying that when everyone associates a 
certain
> >>>>> look/letter/number with something they don't search for other 
visual

> >>>>> metaphors. People expect certain things to look certain ways ;)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Ken
> >>>>>  
> >>>>>  
> >>>> Ok but it feels uncomfortable
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>> Thats really awesome. :)

> >>>
> >>> Then using those files types should be reduced rather than 
complaining

> >>> about the icon ;)
> >>>  
> >>>  
> >> Those filetypes are supported by OOo. No need to associate them 
to icons

> >> referencing to Ms applications not supported under Linux.
> >>
> >

> > The icon is used only when someone is saving the file to be MS office
> > complaint.
> > Why cant we stop using that format , rather than nit-pick over 
what one

> > has just chosen to continue to support?
> >
> >  
> >>  As far as I

> >> know, there is no reference to Adobe in the pdf files icons.
> >>
> >>
> >

> > I'd suggest you check again ;)
> >  
> Ok well, you are right. And that is basically... lame. Evince is the

> default PDF reader, why should the icon be related to Adobe?

There is a difference between PDF and Adobe / Evince.   :)

PDF is an _open_ Portable Document Format. and the logo isnt even been
used in full. ;)

Adobe is a company with several apps and "Reader" , "Acrobat" is the pdf
reader and editor respectively. Note the adobe logo isnt used. Their
logo is different.

Evince is an app too and not a format ...


Ok sorry obviously you widely misunderstood my point, maybe I was not 
clear enough in my previous mail. Of course, the icon for the pdf 
*filetype* is a reference to adobe; it is red/white with a big A in it 
-- see attached. That is not acceptable (nor is it to put a "ms word" or 
"ms powerpoint" logo in a *filetype* icon). The only thing the user has 
to know is that it is a pdf file, period. In MacOsX, the icon is like 
that (ok that's a .ps here, but it's the same for .pdf): 
http://www.entropy.ch/software/macosx/docs/openoffice-mac/temp-ps-file.png
Do you see a reference to Adobe Reader? No of course, because it is not 
the default reader. Putting a reference to Adobe makes the user think it 
will open with Adobe when double-clicking on the file.


The problem is the same for the psd file icon (attached): why putting a 
Photoshop logo? The user only has to know it is an image, with the psd 
extension. The photoshop logo is a nonsense here.


(You can try asking the evince developers if they think it is a good 
idea to have icons for *pdf filetype* referencing to Adobe by default in 
Ubuntu, I'm pretty sure what the answer will be. Same with OpenOffice 
developers and doc, xls and ppt files icons.)


Cheers,

François








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Re: [ubuntu-art] .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

Vishnoo a écrit :
> On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:18 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>   
>> On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:04 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>> 
>>>> On Wednesday 17 February 2010 07:38:23 am Merk wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>>> I'm not asking why the OS X was directly copied instead of either Windows
>>>>>> one.  I'm asking why any existing Word icon was copied at all.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> It is a mimetype and as such needs to visually represent a certain type 
>>>>> of 
>>>>> file. It goes without saying that when everyone associates a certain 
>>>>> look/letter/number with something they don't search for other visual 
>>>>> metaphors. People expect certain things to look certain ways ;)
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Ken
>>>>>   
>>>>>   
>>>> Ok but it feels uncomfortable 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> Thats really awesome. :)
>>>
>>> Then using those files types should be reduced rather than complaining
>>> about the icon ;)
>>>   
>>>   
>> Those filetypes are supported by OOo. No need to associate them to icons 
>> referencing to Ms applications not supported under Linux.
>> 
>
> The icon is used only when someone is saving the file to be MS office
> complaint. 
> Why cant we stop using that format , rather than nit-pick over what one
> has just chosen to continue to support?
>
>   
>>  As far as I 
>> know, there is no reference to Adobe in the pdf files icons.
>>
>> 
>
> I'd suggest you check again ;) 
>   
Ok well, you are right. And that is basically... lame. Evince is the 
default PDF reader, why should the icon be related to Adobe? Even under 
MacOSX the pdf files icons have no reference to the Adobe brand, this is 
a non-sense. Why not give a Quicktime icon to .mov files in that case? 
And even a IE icon to every HTML file? It is simply stupid.



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Re: [ubuntu-art] .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

On Wed, 2010-02-17 at 17:04 +0100, François Degrave wrote:
>> On Wednesday 17 February 2010 07:38:23 am Merk wrote:
>> 
>>>> I'm not asking why the OS X was directly copied instead of either Windows
>>>> one.  I'm asking why any existing Word icon was copied at all.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> It is a mimetype and as such needs to visually represent a certain type of 
>>> file. It goes without saying that when everyone associates a certain 
>>> look/letter/number with something they don't search for other visual 
>>> metaphors. People expect certain things to look certain ways ;)
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ken
>>>   
>> Ok but it feels uncomfortable 
>> 
>
> Thats really awesome. :)
>
> Then using those files types should be reduced rather than complaining
> about the icon ;)
>   
Those filetypes are supported by OOo. No need to associate them to icons 
referencing to Ms applications not supported under Linux. As far as I 
know, there is no reference to Adobe in the pdf files icons.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] .doc, .xls, etc icons in Humanity Update

[François Degrave]

On Wednesday 17 February 2010 07:38:23 am Merk wrote:
>> I'm not asking why the OS X was directly copied instead of either Windows
>> one.  I'm asking why any existing Word icon was copied at all.
>> 
>
> It is a mimetype and as such needs to visually represent a certain type of 
> file. It goes without saying that when everyone associates a certain 
> look/letter/number with something they don't search for other visual 
> metaphors. People expect certain things to look certain ways ;)
>
> --
> Ken

Ok but it feels uncomfortable to use the "w" of "Ms Word" for OOo Word 
Processor, the "p" of "Ms Powerpoint" for OOo impress etc. The proper 
color -- blue for the word processor, orange for impress, green for calc 
-- together with an explicit icon is far sufficient in my opinion.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] zgeg themes

[François Degrave]

> just to propose the inclusion in the repository of the zgegblog themes
>
> http://francois.vogelweith.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=3&Itemid=14
>
> all themes are already packaged.
>
> Max
I definitely agree; those themes are gorgeous.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave 0.7 Alpha 1

[François Degrave]

Kevin Soviero a écrit :
> Is it just me, or does the word Dust, come to mind?
>
> (Not that I'm bad mouthing your theme, i love the Dust theme, so this 
> is just icing on the cake for me.)
Sorry, NewWave is older than Dust! Maybe you should ask: "Does the word 
NewWave come to mind?" when seeing Dust...

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Another Question

[François Degrave]

Salane Ashcraft a écrit :
> What is the deadline or inclusion in the OS? 
*August 28*
  * First call for artwork inclusion

*September 11*
  * Second call for artwork inclusion

*Septembre 25*
  * Artwork inclusion deadline

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Icons

[François Degrave]

> that said, why not post them to gnome-look and get some feedback from
> users? maybe they'll be a hit.
>   
I have to say I agree with you, and that's why I already proposed to 
make two different "projects" -- of course linked in some way -- for the 
theme and the icons.

Plus, it is not really politically clever to impose an icon set with the 
theme. *That's obviously a good point* to have a related icon set -- 
which could _possibly_ be used with the theme since they were developed 
in the same spirit -- but they shouldn't come both at once, because in 
that case they could be both rejected at once.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Icons

[François Degrave]

>
>
> Maybe I'm the only one, but I don't like them at all. They have
> nothing in common with the folders for example (the gradient is
> far different) -- the first ones we made, adapted directly from
> Elementary Icons were much more adapted to the theme, imo. Also,
> they don't have a common gradient while it is obvious that the
> light should come from the same point. And I don't see the point
> with brown; everything else is gray or orange.
>
> Sorry for the bad comment... My goal is only to have a really
> consistent theme at the end.
>
> Cheers,
>
> François
>
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>
>
> according to gimp, brown is a dark orange
>
That's right, but not everyone has Gimp implemented in the head :D


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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Icons

[François Degrave]

2008/5/28 fruchtschwert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Am Sonntag, den 25.05.2008, 16:17 +0300 schrieb Anton Kerezov:
> > В 14:56 +0200 на 25.05.2008 (нд), Mario Viviani написа:
> > > Mario V.
> > > > Il giorno sab, 24/05/2008 alle 20.54 -0300, spg76 ha scritto:
> > > > 2008/5/24 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > > > > I've made some changes to a dozen of icons (I attach a pack). The
> > > > > difference is in color contrast and in removed gloss form some
> icons.
> > > > > What do you think?
> > > > >
> > > > Hi, I think they look good. The one that I like the most it's the
> > > > mail-send icon.
> >
> > The restart icon is not as good as I wanted. If you include them please
> > leave it aside.
> >
> > > >
> > > > > P.S.
> > > > > I'm still wondering how change or remake the reload icon. Any
> ideas?
> > > > >
> > > > > Anton
> > > > >
> > > > I can make a few alternatives if you want and then we can choose
> which
> > > > way is the best.
> > > > Also, I've made alternate versions of some actions icons. You can
> > > > check them out at
> > > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/sebastianporta/tags/actions/ and you
> can
> > > > see it on a screenshot at
> > > > http://img355.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pantallazo1dy8.png
> >
> > The icons are good but I think they stand a little bit unfinished. Try
> > to use outline wit some matching color (not black) so that the user can
> > better visually see where the icon ends.
> >
> > When you are done upload the changes ;)
> >
> > Anton
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Hey,
>
> first of all, I want to compliment sebastian for the great brown
> navigation-icons. I think we should keep them like that ..
>
>
Maybe I'm the only one, but I don't like them at all. They have nothing in
common with the folders for example (the gradient is far different) -- the
first ones we made, adapted directly from Elementary Icons were much more
adapted to the theme, imo. Also, they don't have a common gradient while it
is obvious that the light should come from the same point. And I don't see
the point with brown; everything else is gray or orange.

Sorry for the bad comment... My goal is only to have a really consistent
theme at the end.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave : buttons

[François Degrave]

2008/5/25 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 18:43 +0200 на 25.05.2008 (нд), Giuseppe Pennisi написа:
> > Il giorno dom, 25/05/2008 alle 18.32 +0200, François Degrave ha scritto:
> > >
> > >
> > > 2008/5/25 Giuseppe Pennisi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> > > François Degrave ha scritto:
> > > > Hi!
> > > >
> > > > I worked quite a lot on this! The lifts are not totally
> > > finished yet.
> > > >
> > >
> > > Good Work. And Very Nicebut...
> > > ...allow the engine it?
> > >
> > > I don't know, but if that actually exists:
> > > http://www.silvestre.com.ar/wp-content/uploaded/dark-tech.png
> > > then it must be possible...
> > >
> > It's just a mockup. I don't know if we can find an engine that can make
> > this. Unfortunately.
> >
> > Giuseppe P.
>
> It is possible to make this with the pixmap engine. Here are the
> results:
>
> http://img164.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=36311_Buttons_122_688lo.jpg
>
> Unfortunately there are some weak points of this not being part of the
> engine:
>1. I cannot set the default button image (the one that is pressed
> upon
> Enter)


>2. If we change the buttons we have to change the radiobuttons and
> checks as well. See in firefox.


Ok, I can make some. Could you make the font white on the pressed buton
instead of bold?


I guess Giuseppe is right about the pixmap engine and that's really a pity.
If we cannot make an interface look exactly like an initial mockup, and if
we always have to give up such or such thing, it becomes basically
impossible to make something that looks really new in Gnome.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave : buttons, progress bars and lifts

[François Degrave]

2008/5/25 Giuseppe Pennisi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> François Degrave ha scritto:
> > Hi!
> >
> > I worked quite a lot on this! The lifts are not totally finished yet.
> >
> Good Work. And Very Nicebut...
> ...allow the engine it?


I don't know, but if that actually exists:
http://www.silvestre.com.ar/wp-content/uploaded/dark-tech.png
then it must be possible...
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave : buttons, progress bars and lifts

[François Degrave]

2008/5/25 François Degrave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

>
>
> 2008/5/25 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>> В 16:58 +0200 на 25.05.2008 (нд), François Degrave написа:
>> > Hi!
>> >
>> > I worked quite a lot on this! The lifts are not totally finished yet.
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>>
>> Excellent but can you give me clear png files (without text on them) so
>> that I can make a preview in the theme. The size is 74x26 px.
>>
>> Anton
>
>
> There is a shadow behind all the buttons except the pressed one. Should
> they be included in the png or there is a way of putting them in the theme?
>

I mean, does the entire png image have to be 74x26 or only the button
(without the shadow - in that case the shadow is out of 74x26).
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave : buttons, progress bars and lifts

[François Degrave]

2008/5/25 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 16:58 +0200 на 25.05.2008 (нд), François Degrave написа:
> > Hi!
> >
> > I worked quite a lot on this! The lifts are not totally finished yet.
> >
> > Cheers,
>
> Excellent but can you give me clear png files (without text on them) so
> that I can make a preview in the theme. The size is 74x26 px.
>
> Anton


There is a shadow behind all the buttons except the pressed one. Should they
be included in the png or there is a way of putting them in the theme?
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[ubuntu-art] New Wave progress bar

[François Degrave]

Hi!

Here is a proposition for the progress bar. I finished the buttons too;
should I send them in png format?

Cheers,

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave graphical guidelines

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 15:38 +0200 на 22.05.2008 (чт), François Degrave написа:
>   
>> Because we need to work all together in a single direction, without
>> losing efforts for useless things, I took some time today and
>> yesterday to write the graphical guidelines for New Wave.
>>
>> Could you please read them carefully? Here they are:
>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=graphical_guidelines.pdf
>> 
>
> I agree that we need such king of guidelines but they need to me more
> definite. Although I generally like the text I do not agree with some
> points:
>
>   1. Taskbar/Windows consistency - That is not true. The taskbar is
> really different from the title bar and the menus of an application
> because there you have program shortcuts and status icons that change
> over time.
>   
Ok, but currently the windows and the taskbar do not seem to be part of 
a whole. They look too different to have a nice visual effect. And it is 
true that the taskbar has more functionalities than a menubar, but the 
"menu part" of the taskbar should certainly have the same look as a menubar.

>   5. Selected Menu Items - The colors you picked are a bit brighter thank
> they should be IMO. I know that you want to make the theme look more
> orange but this is not the way to do it. We should rather do the widgets
> more orangish.
>   
You are right. We can try different things, it was just a proposition.
> One more thing about 7. Buttons. Could you make the mockups of selected
> and hovered buttons so that I can make a pixmap privew.
>   
I'll do that asap.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave graphical guidelines

[François Degrave]

2008/5/22 Étienne Bersac <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Salut François,
>
> The document is very good, but looks more like an exposé than a set of
> guidelines. For example, the choice of colour is "hardcoded" in
> guidelines. You should provide a complete palette, but let us choose the
> color during the design process. For example, i find the orange of
> highlighted item too bright so that it's not easy to read the text.
>
> Keep up the good work, we definitely needs direction :)
>
> Regards,
> Étienne.
>

You are right. I'll add a general remark about the fact that this choice of
colors is not mandatory but just a proposition.

Cheers,

François
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[ubuntu-art] New Wave graphical guidelines

[François Degrave]

Hi!

Because we need to work all together in a single direction, without losing
efforts for useless things, I took some time today and yesterday to write
the graphical guidelines for New Wave.

Could you please read them carefully? Here they are:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=graphical_guidelines.pdf

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] UDS Report.

[François Degrave]

Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
> nothlit ha scritto:
>   
>> I'm at UDS, and after speaking with kwwii, and _MMA_, I have written a
>> few notes, as well as some personal thoughts. This is mostly for the
>> planning process itself, but I am sending it to the list so everyone
>> is clued in as well :).
>> Things we discussed:
>>
>> Dark theme, and incompatibilities from programs with hard coded
>> values. In terms of this, the current plan is to push a dark theme
>> into Ibex ASAP so people can begin to file bugs against the
>> applications in question.
>>
>> [...cut...] 
>>
>> 
>
> If my opinion is worth, I totally agree with your opinion.
> About Dark-Theme, if choose this I think is better to make an
> alternative clear theme (or not dark theme), because a dark theme may be
> aggressive for some people.
I think that if we make a theme having the advantages of both dark and 
light themes -- with dark bars and light contain, like New Wave -- it 
won't be mandatory to make a light equivalent. Dark themes are annoying 
when everything is dark, but it is not the case here.

Cheers,

François

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[ubuntu-art] Ibex SVG

[François Degrave]

Hi!

I was playing with InkScape and I made the shadow of an Ibex but I don't
think I will do anything else with it. So maybe you guys will want to use
it.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave: Revisions

[François Degrave]

Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
> Il giorno mar, 20/05/2008 alle 15.38 +0300, Anton Kerezov ha scritto:
>   
>> Hi Giuseppe,
>>
>> I want to ask you why don't you make new revisions but overwrite mine's.
>> For example I created rev 7 and today I see rev 7 and 8 on your name.
>> Did you first update you repository (bzr update)? That is necessary to
>> take all the changes others have made. Or maybe you do commit and then
>> update? If that is the case you should do update before you start any
>> work on the theme and then after you finished commit the changes.
>>
>> Anton
>>
>>
>> 
> Hi Anton,
>
> I think my problem is Olive. It crashing and not work correctly in my
> system (don't tell me why because I don't know).
> I'm come back to use terminal...simple and rock.
>
> Giuseppe P.
>
> ps: what you think about menu proposal? I think we might move in this
> way and insert it in branch.
This white menu item is definitely better. We should use it, even if 
that means we have to file bugs to Mozilla and harass them to correct 
them quick. We have to use a minimum of different colors for the 
taskbars, that's also why we use monochromatic status icons.

The shadow of the menu is not a problem to me, it adds a gradient on the 
white (so it looks like the menu item is still a part of the taskbar).

Now if you don't mind, it would also be nice to have a look to the 
gradients inside the windows, as it was depicted on the last mockups I 
made. Anton is right, it will need to be computed at runtime because we 
ignore the size of the toolbar -- so my last proposition wasn't a solution.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave - Proposal

[François Degrave]

Bharat Varma a écrit :
> On Tue, May 20, 2008 at 12:28 PM, François Degrave <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote:
>
>
>
> 2008/5/20 Nick Russell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>>:
>
> I think its much better like this, especially the white.
>
>
> That's exactly what I proposed in the very beginning (see mockup),
> and I re-proposed in my screenshot with all the comments (see
> http://img174.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=04028_Capture_122_1178lo.jpg)
> but apparently it is a problem for the firefox menu (since the
> color of the font cannot change when the menu item is selected,
> the white font on a white bg is unreadable). Maybe that's
> something we can correct because it looks really important to me.
>
>
> I agree with Francisco. Having a greyish GTK makes the theme a bit 
> depressing for general audience. They wouldn't care if it is a 
> technical issue. Would a slight orangish hue instead of pure white help ?
I'm not sure adding orange there is a good idea... Well, we can try but 
I don't feel it.

However, the proposition for a New Wave mailing list is not bad at all 
-- but in that case we should try keeping posting sometimes on this one 
to show we are still alive, and to give interest to other people.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave: Nautilus sidebar and Icons

[François Degrave]

2008/5/18 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 13:24 +0200 на 18.05.2008 (нд), Giuseppe Pennisi написа:
> > Il giorno dom, 18/05/2008 alle 10.33 +0200, François Degrave ha scritto:
> > > Hi!
> > >
> > > I think that something that looks really bad in the current theme is
> > > the side bar in Nautilus.
> > >
> http://img147.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=08902_Capture2_122_887lo.jpg
> > > Do you think it is something possible to implement? Anton? Giuseppe?
> > > Others?
> > >
> > Yes,
> > this not like to me, too. But the problem is the menubar. Infact, when I
> > add a border to left and right of the frame I see it in the menubar,
> > too.
>
> Well probably we can but only for the sidebar. A gradient cannot be
> applied in the toolbar and location bar because we don't know if the
> user is using them (gradient will look unfinished). As far as the
> sidebar I will further investigate how to set it's bg color.
>

Hi!

There is a way of doing that avoids those problems. An since it is easier to
explain it with an image, here it is:
http://img157.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=98647_NewWave-Sidebar_122_767lo.jpg

What do you think about it?

Cheers,

François
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[ubuntu-art] New Wave: Nautilus side bar

[François Degrave]

Hi!

I think that something that looks really bad in the current theme is the
side bar in Nautilus. Here is a proposition of what we could do with it
(that's a really rough mockup -- it is just for the concept):
http://img147.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=08902_Capture2_122_887lo.jpg (I
know I already posted it, but I got no answer and I think it is quite
important).

Do you think it is something possible to implement? Anton? Giuseppe? Others?

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave (icon theme)

[François Degrave]

2008/5/17 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 11:28 + на 17.05.2008 (сб), fruchtschwert написа:
> > pushed to launchpad :-)
> >
> > @Sebastian
> >
> > Changed my icon proposals to use the orange colors you are using.
> > I pushed them into a seperate directory of the "devel.icons"
> launchpad-branch.
> >
> > Hope, this is fine for you ..
> >
> > In the next days, I will probably try to modify some other icons.
> > I noticed, that you are using a hard disk for the computer-icon.
> > What do you think of using the monitor, like in the
> "change-resolution"-icon. One could also change the color to orange.
> > Maybe I can also look for good icons in other sets .. which license
> should the icons use, so that we can include them ?
> >
> > But now I should do some other work ;-)
>
> Nice work Martin! Sebastian and you should try to integrate your icons
> instead of making them alternative. This is definitely a good icon
> theme.
>
> Anton
>

Hi!

I like the icons very much, but I'd like to ask you not to make *everything*
orange. For example, imo, "cancel" and "accept" icons should be respectively
red and green, "warning" should be red, etc. If everything becomes orange,
it will lost a lot of visual information, and it will become graphically
really poor.

I would even say that a large majority of the icons should have a proper
color adapted to their meaning; only folders and some other icons should be
orange.


Also, shouldn't we have a look at the palette for the icons? Maybe we should
try different hues for orange (more red or more yellow) and see which one
looks the most modern -- I'll try something like that today.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave (icon theme)

[François Degrave]

2008/5/16 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 14:53 -0300 на 16.05.2008 (пт), spg76 написа:
> > Anton, did you receive my message with the theme?
> > I'm asking you because the one I send you have some problems with
> > simlinks (i.e. the paste icons). I have an updated version, if you
> > want I can upload it to Launchpad (altough I don't know how and if I'm
> > allowed to do it).
>
> I didn't received it. I think you are a member of the New Wave Team so
> you should be able to push revisions( the icon stuff) in the branch
> devel.icons:
>
> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-new-wave/anton/devel.icons
>
> You should have bzr installed and make the icons main folder a
> repository ([EMAIL PROTECTED] bzr init). I advise you to have a look at the
>
> https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntustudio-icon-theme
>
> If you find any difficulties do not hesitate to write.
>
> Anton
>

Hi guys!

I  re-made the taskbar icons which already existed and created others. Here
they are:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=taskbar_icons_v0.2.zip

Do I have to put them on launchpad? If it's the case, I'll do that tomorrow.

Cheers,

François

NewWave Powaaa!
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Re: [ubuntu-art] Tabs

[François Degrave]

> Here is a comparison between Vista, Mac and ubuntu current tabs:
> http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/5594/pantallazo1io9arthp1.png
> The orange bar over ubuntu's tabs is ugly. Can this be changed?.
I think Vista ones are far worst. Maybe it is possible to find something 
more original, but I'm not sure it is a priority -- it will be 
considered, though.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Can you? It would be great! One more thing can you change the Nautilus
icon with smth more appropriate? And could you use different tones of
range (darker, lighter) or even combinations of dark and light grey so
that the theme to look more vivid.
  


Have you seen the svg I made or home folder (with the gray home)? I 
attached it in a previous message. And here it is again.



В 22:25 +0200 на 14.05.2008 (ср), François Degrave написа:

I still do  not understand why the font is PINK  in the menubar, 



My intent was it to be light orange (different color because this is not
a standard menu, right?). Moreove it is in the back so its colors should
not be so intensive. So I will change it if it seems so PINK.
  
Sorry for the PINK in uppercase, I didn't mean to look upset :-) 
But it is right it looks a bit too pink :-P . And IMO adding another 
color than gray/black render things visually less simple and clean.

and I still prefer the selected menu in (nearly) white with a black
font (mostly because, that way, the selected item looks like the
continuation of the menu itself -- there are even ways to improve this
effect, I'll post a mockup soon to see if it's technically possible
with the new Murrine engine). See the png image attached for a quick
comparison.



Here is why I don't make it so bright. (If we make the text darker it
will be darker in unselected menus too so we don't have much of a
choice):

http://img168.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=45704_NewWave_test_11_122_867lo.jpg
That's a pity, because it looks much more clean when we have less 
colors, and I particularly like the feel that the menu button and the 
menu itself are in a single piece. Do you think it won't be possible to 
have that font color change when the menu is selected in Firefox? Can 
the use of Murrine change anything? Or is it possible to change that in 
Firefox configuration?


Good work anyway, this theme is on his way and it's the best one I've 
seen until now.


Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Yann Dìnendal a écrit :
>
> I still do  not understand why the font is PINK  in the menubar,
> and I still prefer the selected menu in (nearly) white with a
> black font (mostly because, that way, the selected item looks like
> the continuation of the menu itself -- there are even ways to
> improve this effect, I'll post a mockup soon to see if it's
> technically possible with the new Murrine engine). See the png
> image attached for a quick comparison.
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> François
>
>
> You are right, it is nicer with your colors, and more pleasant to read.
>
> I'm glad you like it.
> I replaced the gnome icon with the Ubuntu logo and I include the
> taskbar icons as you suggest.
> I also modified some other icons (mostly actions and status icons):
> http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pantallazo1io9.png
> If you want I can send you the theme, so you (and everyone who want)
> can test it and send me some feedback.
> I'll work on the theme later and inform you on the progress.
> --
> Seba (AKA spg76)
> http://www.ubuntu-ar.org 
>
>
> nice ! By the way, looking at this screenshot, I was thinking this 
> theme is getting better and better, but still lack some brown/orange, 
> and it gave me this idea to improve it a bit : have the windows' 
> bottom orange like the tabs' top : 
> http://yann.universfantastiques.org/ubuntu/new-wave-test-windows-bottom.png. 
> What do you think ?
> Sorry, it's not a complete mockup... I'm not an artist and it would 
> take me some time to make the other windows bottom orange... But you 
> get the idea with this little window.
>
> --
> Yann Dìnendal
I think it is not a bas idea at all. I'm not sure the hue of the orange 
is perfectly appropriate, but it looks like a good thing to try.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

>
>
>
> My feeling is that the most common icons to appear in the taskbar (aside
> from those you've made) are Tracker, Pidgin, Evolution Calendar alert,
> Rhythmbox, Remote Desktop, Transmission, Package Manager and Bluetooth. I
> realise some of these are applications, but I think it will ruin the unity
> of the theme if some taskbar icons are monochrome and others not.
>
>
I'm not sure it is mandatory to have monochromic icons for applications. I
think we can just have them for "information icons", such as sound level,
network status, battery level, available updates, alerts, maybe bluetooth...
If we make icons just for 'some' applications, it will really look bad if
the user adds "unexpected" ones in the notification area.

About orange: I totally agree with you, and that was my intention to choose
an orange icon theme, and have some orange controls.

There is still mch work to go, but I think we go a good direction.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

So, I didn't get any reaction. What do you think about this:
http://img147.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=08902_Capture2_122_887lo.jpg

I know the widgets are not in there, this mockup is pretty rough but the
side bar looks much better IMO.
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

2008/5/13 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 20:42 +0200 на 13.05.2008 (вт), François Degrave написа:
> > Hi everybody!
> >
> >
> > I have some remarks about the current theme, and that is easier for me
> > to show it directly on a picture. So here it is:
> > http://img174.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=04028_Capture_122_1178lo.jpg
> >
> > Reactions and answers about that are welcome!
> >
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > François
>
> Well all is good. But some things I consider are not good. Example is
> the very light  (contrasting) selected menu. Why do we need it so
> bright? The way you use menus is that. You need a function in the menus
> > find the menu you want > click it and look its contents not the part
> you just clicked. That is why I've made them like that grey bg and white
> fg. Besides Firefox cannot render the menus in the way you are showing.
>
>
I like this color for the select menu, because this way the menu popping out
looks like a continuation of the menu selected. I think that visually it is
way much better than a darker color.
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Another really rough mockup for a nautilus window: 
http://img147.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=08902_Capture2_122_887lo.jpg

I think this side bar doesn't look good at all in the current theme. 
Like this it's a bit better.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 20:42 +0200 на 13.05.2008 (вт), François Degrave написа:
>   
>> Hi everybody!
>>
>>
>> I have some remarks about the current theme, and that is easier for me 
>> to show it directly on a picture. So here it is:
>> http://img174.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=04028_Capture_122_1178lo.jpg
>>
>> Reactions and answers about that are welcome!
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> François
>> 
>
> Well all is good. But some things I consider are not good. Example is
> the very light  (contrasting) selected menu. Why do we need it so
> bright? The way you use menus is that. You need a function in the menus
>   
>> find the menu you want > click it and look its contents not the part
>> 
> you just clicked. That is why I've made them like that grey bg and white
> fg. Besides Firefox cannot render the menus in the way you are showing.
>
> Next: the dotted line around selected items should (I agree ) totally be
> replaced by smth else like the glow we have in the Aurora theme.
>
> The taskbar underligh cannot be made right now. It is the job of the
> theme engine to make it.
>
> The selected item in menus should be gradient (no gloss) and should look
> (or just be) transparent.
>
> The dotted separator is also handled by the engine.
>
> Widgets with light bg that should be dark just need better GNOME
> integration. That's the devs work. Same for the desktop switcher.
>
> What file do you want to edit to get the separator different appearance?
> The .c source code or gtkrc?
>
> Anton
I thought this separator was just an image. But I guess that would have 
been too simple... If there is a C file to edit, I can but I don't know 
which ones -- I haven't used my C skills for a long time, but I guess 
that's not something hard to do!

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Hi everybody!


I have some remarks about the current theme, and that is easier for me 
to show it directly on a picture. So here it is:
http://img174.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=04028_Capture_122_1178lo.jpg

Reactions and answers about that are welcome!


Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

>
> > > I'm currently trying the HumanElephant one, and it is not bad at all -
> > > not perfect, but much better than Human. I think we should keep an
> > > orange one (less shiny, though) else we won't have any chance to
> > > integrate orange in the theme, and then it won't even be considered
> > > for default.
>
> I agree. You can even make your own icon theme with more modernistic and
> elegant icons (not the comic old ones) based on existing one. Thus we
> can much more easily integrate the icons we want.
>

Ok, I'm not against it. However, creating an icon theme  from scratch is
quite a big job, and I'm not sure I have enough time for that. And I'm not
really trained at using Inkscape for creating SVG images (icons should
really be vector images). Maybe I can just make png's of them -- or a part
of them, just to give the direction -- and then ask a "Inkscape guy" to
translate everything. But that means making the job twice...

I don't know. Maybe we could begin with searching for good candidates for
the icon theme and then modify them -- color, shape of such or such icon --
to fit our desires. So if a you have some time to kill on gnome looks, don't
hesitate!

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

François Degrave a écrit :
> Anton Kerezov a écrit :
>> В 14:13 +0200 на 12.05.2008 (пн), François Degrave написа:
>>  
>>> Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
>>>
>>>> Very nice. I think that i's the right way.
>>>> gp
>>>>   
>>> Hi!
>>>  I don't know why, Giuseppe, but I can't install your Metacity 
>>> theme. It just looks like on the capture attached. Do you know what 
>>> would be my mistake - I clicked on "Install", and chose New 
>>> Wave_0.4.2.tar.gz? I'm still on Gutsy, does it affect anything?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> François
>>> 
>>
>> The metacity theme should be installed together with your gtk theme. If
>> it doesn't appear as installed you should try clicking on Personnaliser
>> and choose it from there. By the way do you have the clearlooks engine
>> installed because what I see is the default gtk theme. Or if it appeared
>> this way after you switched to New Wave then there is an error in the
>> gtkrc (though on my PC there is nothing wrong with it. I downloaded it
>> from the site). Please try to delete the theme and install it again.
>>
>> The gnome-logout.png icon is better looking now.
>>
>> Can somebody help with the icon theme integration? Or just give me
>> hints?
>>
>> Anton
> I'm currently trying the HumanElephant one, and it is not bad at all - 
> not perfect, but much better than Human. I think we should keep an 
> orange one (less shiny, though) else we won't have any chance to 
> integrate orange in the theme, and then it won't even be considered 
> for default.
But I still haven't managed to change sound and nm icons.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 14:13 +0200 на 12.05.2008 (пн), François Degrave написа:
>   
>> Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
>> 
>>> Very nice. I think that i's the right way.
>>> gp
>>>   
>> Hi!
>>  I don't know why, Giuseppe, but I can't install your Metacity theme. It 
>> just looks like on the capture attached. Do you know what would be my 
>> mistake - I clicked on "Install", and chose New Wave_0.4.2.tar.gz? I'm 
>> still on Gutsy, does it affect anything?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> François
>> 
>
> The metacity theme should be installed together with your gtk theme. If
> it doesn't appear as installed you should try clicking on Personnaliser
> and choose it from there. By the way do you have the clearlooks engine
> installed because what I see is the default gtk theme. Or if it appeared
> this way after you switched to New Wave then there is an error in the
> gtkrc (though on my PC there is nothing wrong with it. I downloaded it
> from the site). Please try to delete the theme and install it again.
>
> The gnome-logout.png icon is better looking now.
>
> Can somebody help with the icon theme integration? Or just give me
> hints?
>
> Anton
I'm currently trying the HumanElephant one, and it is not bad at all - 
not perfect, but much better than Human. I think we should keep an 
orange one (less shiny, though) else we won't have any chance to 
integrate orange in the theme, and then it won't even be considered for 
default.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :

I've sort of fixed this. Just made the normal menus to have colors
similar to these in firefox and the main menu: White text on gray bg not
black text on grey bg.

http://img11.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=34764_NewWave_test_09_122_966lo.jpg 



New theme pack is uploaded at the wiki that contains the fix file.

Anton
I see the shutdown icon in the bar looks a bit fat and blurry. I'll 
try to make something better. Btw, I made some for the battery level.


Cheers,

François

Please try this one and tell me if it's better. I guess it is, and I'll 
remake the others the same way.
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> I've sort of fixed this. Just made the normal menus to have colors
> similar to these in firefox and the main menu: White text on gray bg not
> black text on grey bg.
>
> http://img11.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=34764_NewWave_test_09_122_966lo.jpg
>
> New theme pack is uploaded at the wiki that contains the fix file.
>
> Anton
I see the shutdown icon in the bar looks a bit fat and blurry. I'll try 
to make something better. Btw, I made some for the battery level.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Hi!

Here are the first taskbar icons (added on the wiki):
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=taskbar_icons.zip

If you have any remark/question/request about color/size/shape please don't
hesitate. Also, I don't really know what others are missing (a bluetooth
one? Network warning?...) so please tell me which ones I should make.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
> François Degrave ha scritto:
>   
>>> The transparency of the titlebar for metacity is due because of the
>>> compiz setup.
>>> IMHO it's not bad. However, fundamentally, if compiz is enabled the
>>> people can to use Emarald, right?
>>> Fundamentally Metacity is for those who can not use Emerald.
>>> (Otherwise we can change the compiz setup)
>>>   
>> That's nice, but I just find it quite disappointing that we lose this 
>> "all-in-one" effect for the menu bar and task bar on inactive windows. 
>> We really should ask -- or write -- a patch for Metacity to have 
>> different menu bars on inactive and active windows, to keep this "solid" 
>> feeling.
>>
>> 
> Yes, is true. It is disappointing but I don't know if it's only a
> Metacity problem, indeed (as you can see) if Compiz not enabled the
> problem is not present.
> Perhaps changing (some) the compiz settings the problem can be fixed.
> If that's possible it cane be a workaround.
>
> I will try to solve the problem or with compiz (if this is possible) or 
> writing (or asking :D )a patch for metacity. 
>   
Btw, it is better to try to make the menu bar the same color as the 
window bar rather than removing the transparency of the window bar. The 
transparency can stay if the menu bar is the continuation of the window bar.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

> ps: Can I insert the metacity + gtkrc theme in wiki? I applied only
> little patch to the style of metacity-frame because it (the color) must
> be the same of the style of menubar. Mark the gtkrc file as
> NewWave_Alpha6? I don't touch AUTHORS, Compiz, etc.. files!!!

No problem, that's fine for me!

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
> I upgraded Metacity to fix the active\inactive window.
>
> With compiz not enabled Metacity theme is displayed in this way:
>
> http://img123.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacityzoomjm5.png
>
> http://img177.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacityfullscrexk5.png
>
>
> With compiz enabled Metacity theme is displayed in this way:
>
> http://img177.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacitycompizzoyi5.png
>
> http://img504.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacitycompizfumr1.png
>
> The transparency of the titlebar for metacity is due because of the
> compiz setup.
> IMHO it's not bad. However, fundamentally, if compiz is enabled the
> people can to use Emarald, right?
> Fundamentally Metacity is for those who can not use Emerald.
> (Otherwise we can change the compiz setup)
That's nice, but I just find it quite disappointing that we lose this 
"all-in-one" effect for the menu bar and task bar on inactive windows. 
We really should ask -- or write -- a patch for Metacity to have 
different menu bars on inactive and active windows, to keep this "solid" 
feeling.

But except that, I'm everyday a little more confident in this theme, it 
looks really nice and clean.

François

PS: I'll finish the monochromic icons for the taskbar tomorrow (no time 
for yesterday neither today).

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

>> I'm not against this little highlight, but I find really strange it
>> is 
>> on the left side.
>>
>> 
> Sure, it's strange.
> But the effect was not wanted but it was a mistake.
> I'm sorry, but before maybe I explained evil. :-)
>
> gp
Ok! But finally, I think I like it when it is on top (same image as before):
http://img241.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=50876_newwavemetacity2fz2_122_459lo.jpg


That's possible to implement? I guess yes, since it is possible to put 
one on the left side...
If you like it too, go for it.

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

>>  The thing
>> that bothered me was the thin 1px highlight at the left side if the
>> titlebar. 
>> If we can continue that line in the menubar it'll be ok but
>> right now we can't :(
>>
>> 
> Hopefully, because the idea is very nice.
>
> gp
I'm not against this little highlight, but I find really strange it is 
on the left side. Would it be better on the top, like this:
http://img241.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=50876_newwavemetacity2fz2_122_459lo.jpg

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Metacity

[François Degrave]

>
> That's really nice! Good job. Could you just try to remove the shadow
> behind the title bar? And could you show us how the inactive windows look?


Sorry, I didn't  mean "the shadow behind  the title bar", but "behind the
title of the window bar" -- no shadow behind the font thus. That's not the
same thing! Sorry for the confusion.

Also, do you think it would be possible to add a really light gradient in
the light gray part of the window? Here is what I mean:
http://img218.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=38875_newwavemetacity2fz2_122_381lo.jpg
That makes it really better, imo.

Cheers again,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Metacity

[François Degrave]

Giuseppe Pennisi a écrit :
> I'm trying to make a metacity theme for New Wave Theme.
>
> At moment it's my work:
> http://img169.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacity1cv1.png
>
> http://img116.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacitypressedbf1.png
>
> http://img181.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newwavemetacity2fz2.png
>
> As a starting point I used Human Rounded Metacity.
>
> gp
That's really nice! Good job. Could you just try to remove the shadow 
behind the title bar? And could you show us how the inactive windows look?
We can probably begin to think about controls. We'll have to try 
different things, and I'll probably mock something up this week-end.
We can also improve the taskbar, particularly the monochromic icons -- 
which are already made, but I don't have them here at work.


Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Poll

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 21:42 +0200 на 07.05.2008 (ср), François Degrave написа:
>   
>> Anton Kerezov a écrit :
>> 
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>> As you may have read François and I are wondering what direction the
>>> New Wave theme to go on:
>>>
>>> Either this way:
>>> http://img172.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=74539_NewWave_test_07_122_995lo.jpg
>>> (the taskbar should be one idea lighter, I think)
>>>
>>> that is closer to:
>>> http://bradwjensen.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-Theme-Mockup-Dark-67903127
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Or that way:
>>> http://img216.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=53445_NewWave_test_06.1_122_211lo.jpg
>>>
>>> This one allows you to see my Idea of having content drop shadow on the
>>> menubar and it further drops shadow on the taskbar resulting in layered
>>> view:
>>> http://img185.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=53446_NewWave_test_06.2_122_383lo.jpg
>>>
>>>
>>> Anton
>>>   
>> Please don't forget that if the engine enables separation between 
>> active/inactive window borders - as does Metacity -, the theme look 
>> something like that:
>>
>> http://img37.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=89174_NewWave_Dark_n_Light_122_859lo.jpg
>>
>> That would make things far less aggressive!
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> François
>>
>> 
>
> I think we should develop the widgets' themeing and then offer the theme
> in these two variants. Thus everybody will enjoy the thing he likes
> more. Besides we can always make the darker - lighter :) 
>
> Everybody: you can still express opinion on the topic. The poll is not
> over.
>
>
> Anton 

Really good idea. If we can still easily have both, let's do it! It will 
be easier to judge with the final result.

Cheers again,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Poll

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> Hello everyone,
>
> As you may have read François and I are wondering what direction the
> New Wave theme to go on:
>
> Either this way:
> http://img172.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=74539_NewWave_test_07_122_995lo.jpg
> (the taskbar should be one idea lighter, I think)
>
> that is closer to:
> http://bradwjensen.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-Theme-Mockup-Dark-67903127
>
>
>
> Or that way:
> http://img216.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=53445_NewWave_test_06.1_122_211lo.jpg
>
> This one allows you to see my Idea of having content drop shadow on the
> menubar and it further drops shadow on the taskbar resulting in layered
> view:
> http://img185.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=53446_NewWave_test_06.2_122_383lo.jpg
>
>
> Anton

Please don't forget that if the engine enables separation between 
active/inactive window borders - as does Metacity -, the theme look 
something like that:

http://img37.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=89174_NewWave_Dark_n_Light_122_859lo.jpg

That would make things far less aggressive!

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

> Yes, ok, I will try to make a Metacity theme. :-)
>   
Nice! Good idea.
> Back to speak of the NewWave Theme, 
> I tried to invert the gradient in the window decorator + menubar and remove 
> separator from ToolBar.
>
> http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mynewwave1cc9.png
>
> http://img176.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mynewwave2ww6.png
>
> What you think of it?
>   
That looks a bit strange, because it removes the feeling you can 
actually "touch" the windows, that it is made of something real. Here it 
just looks like squares coloured with gradient. Anton has a strong "3D 
image" in mind of what a window is -- or was if it existed in the real 
world --, and I have my own, but I really can't imagine how would those 
windows look like in the real world. However that's only my personal 
opinion!

Cheers,

François


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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

>> Did you try with FreeSans in size 11 (btw, is it available in many 
>> alphabets?). And is it possible to remove the ugly shadow behind it?
>> 
>
> I've done it and it looks blurrier compared to other sans fonts.
>
>   
Ok, no problem. Liberation looks not bad.
>   
>   
>> Ok, maybe it is possible to make the 4px bar the same color than the 
>> rest of the window -- this, we would have both the windows in one piece 
>> *and* the possibility to resize downwards.
>> 
>
> I don't understand what you mean. Isn't it like the link above? In it
> you can see the Liberation fonts in use for titlebars.
>
>   
I mean: could it be possible to keep the bottom border 4px large, but 
make it "invisible" by giving it the same color than the rest just over it?
>
> About the understanding of my concept imagine that the menubar and
> titlebar are background(bg) and the rest of the window is
> foreground(fg). Thus the fg is dropping shadow on the bg and that is why
> the gradient look like that.
>
> Here's the test you requested:
> http://img172.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=74539_NewWave_test_07_122_995lo.jpg
That looks so nice to me - so does the title font! I love it. What a 
pity you don't like it as well...
But maybe I'm wrong, I think we should definitely ask others what they 
think about it.

Nice work anyway!

Cheers,

François



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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Gianmarco Leone a écrit :
> Il giorno mer, 07/05/2008 alle 15.15 +0200, Giuseppe Pennisi ha scritto:
>   
>> Il giorno mer, 07/05/2008 alle 10.58 +0100,
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto:
>> 
>>> Date: Tue, 06 May 2008 21:22:33 +0300
>>> From: Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> Subject: Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave
>>> To: Discussion on Ubuntu artwork 
>>> Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain
>>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> I finally figured out how to implement the unfocused windows. I
>>> actually
>>> did not implement anything it was all there in Compiz-Fusion, a
>>> plug-in
>>> called trailfocus. The results were quite good for me and I think that
>>> we made another step up to out target image in the wiki.
>>>
>>> Preview: 
>>> http://img238.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=97606_NewWave_test_05_122_454lo.jpg
>>>
>>> The plug-in though has to be polished a bit but I think right know is
>>> pretty good.
>>>
>>> Any comments?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Anton
>>>
>>>   
>> Very Nice.
>> I think that it's the right way to make the new theme for Intrepid.
>>
>> If I want to try the theme, where can I download it?
>>
>> But this theme is only for Compiz ?
>>
>> gp 
>> 
> Very nice theme, but...who should I bride to have the min/max/close
> buttons like in the new fedora 9 theme? (Nodoka). I find it more
> serious/elegant
>   
Do you have a link where we can see them?

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 12:01 +0200 на 07.05.2008 (ср), François Degrave написа:
>   
>> I tried your theme today. It is great! However, I have some suggestions. 
>> In 
>> http://img154.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=58872_NewWave_suggestions_122_1120lo.jpg
>>  , I modified the main things I noticed; I don't know if it is technically 
>> possible to implement!
>>
>> 1) The gradient of the windows bar looks quite strange, because it is 
>> applied only in the inferior half of the bar (the menubar), not on the 
>> total width. Would it be possible to make it like on the image?
>> 
> Probably. 
> I think you don't imagined what I have. Here is my concept for widows:
>
> http://img15.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=65723_lAYERS_122_730lo.jpg
>
> 1. Wndows contents
> 2. Menu and titlebar behind
> 3. Background below all
>
> So if we make the entire area with gradient this feeling (for me) will
> disappear. :(
>   
Ok, I did not see it this way, and I'm still not sure I can :-D   
I see the window bar less flat, more rounded and over the rest of the 
window -- that makes sense since menus pop up over everything. That's a 
difference of view, I think we should ask others to be sure we make the 
right choice...

>> 2) The font with a shadow in the bar looks very outdated. I suggest we 
>> use a font without a shadow. The one you see in this image ("Totem Video 
>> Player") is Free Sans, without any transformation.
>> 
>
> Well I havent yet thought of fonts. If you have any idea of what may be
> good for title (and available in many languages) just give it to me and
> I will put it there.
>
>   
Did you try with FreeSans in size 11 (btw, is it available in many 
alphabets?). And is it possible to remove the ugly shadow behind it?

>> 4) The icons for closing, minimize, etc. are not bad, but I don't like 
>> the one at the left (in Metacity, this one is the icon of the 
>> application used. We should keep this).
>> 
>
> You are right. I will make it.
>
>   
>> The ones at the right are nice but we should -- maybe, not sure -- apply to 
>> them a light gradient, to 
>> make them really "part" of the bar. You can also try other icons (I put 
>> an example of a simple cross).
>> 
>
> Will think for that later. Lets make the engine and the other parts work
> together first.
>   
Ok, go on.
>
>   
>> 5) Could it be possible to make the down corners as round as the top 
>> ones? Also, could you let me see how it looks without the thin dark gray 
>> line of the bottom?
>> 
>
> The reason of this gray line is that at 1px the window cannot be resized
> downwards. So I made the bottom border 4px as 3 of them gray to match
> the titlebar. There is workaround to make them like the bg but the
> borderline should become darker even on unfocused windows to hide a bug
> in emerald. I like the old version because it is more stylish.
>
> But here we go:
> http://img225.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=65740_NoGreyline_122_529lo.jpg
>   
Ok, maybe it is possible to make the 4px bar the same color than the 
rest of the window -- this, we would have both the windows in one piece 
*and* the possibility to resize downwards.
>   
>> 6) Still the thing about not active windows... Too bad we cannot make 
>> the top bar/menu bar really flat, the whole window in the same piece. 
>> Inactive windows of the current default theme of Ubuntu look a bit like 
>> that.
>> 
>
> I know what you have in mind but it can't be done.
>   
Too bad... Do you think it will be possible in the engine? I hope so, 
that's something that could look really nice --  independent drop shadow 
settings for active and inactive windows also, btw.
>
>   
>> 7) Don't know if it is possible but it would be great if we could also 
>> apply a really light gradient on the entire light gray window, like in 
>> the initial mockup.
>> 
>
> It is probably possible but then my concept (as I showed in 1.)) will be
> lost.
>   
Ok... If that's really easy to do, could you please just try it? As you 
wish...

>   
>> 8) In the bar -- both windows bar and task bar (particularly the 
>> taskbar, in fact) --, I'd like to see a light (not too light, though) 
>> gray internal border. Here is what I mean: 
>> 
> http://img202.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=59378_NewWaveDetail_122_241lo.jpg
>   
>> But that's really a detail, no? :-)
>> 
>
> Taskbar:
> Right now this is not possible (widgets overlap the line) but we can
> possibly implement it in the engine.
> Titlebar:
> If we want that menu to be dark too there is no way of doing this now,
> thus the rest depends on the engine. In it these effects can be done (at
> least I think so).
I'll be patient! In any case, I think you're doing a great job. Carry 
on, I'm sure you could reach a real killer-theme.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave and other things

[François Degrave]

Oliver Morgan a écrit :
> Hi,
>
> I'm completely new to all of this - so please give me some leeway if I  
> say anything dumb!
>
> I like new wave - it certainly is beginning to look like a complete  
> system. I just wondered that is looked very OSXy with Vista-type  
> transparencies. I just mean to say it isn't very groundbreaking. Maybe  
> this isn't the right place to ask this but with the proliferation of  
> the glassy look and transparencies I just wondered if we should think  
> about it all from the ground up a bit.
>
> I mean I get that inactive windows gain some translucence but why?  
> Wouldn't it be better if we made alerts appear with a translucent  
> background - they are not working windows but notices - so making them  
> translucent makes them not interfere so much
>
> Also I wondered about title bars. There is more real-estate left-to- 
> right than top-and-bottom. What if windows stacked that way and title  
> bars were at the left (maybe the top panel and bottom panels left and  
> right too).  This would also make stacked menus expand in one  
> direction (if you see what I mean).
>
> Are these sorts of changes possible - can I mock things like this up  
> or is it a waste of time?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Oliver
Hi Oliver!

I don't really see what you mean, maybe you can mock it up. But if you 
want the bar to be on the left, I see two problems:

1) If the names are written vertically it becomes really annoying to 
read and not user friendly at all;
2) If you want the menu titles to be written horizontally on the left, 
you lose a huge amount of place.

But maybe I have a wrong image in mind...

Cheers,

François



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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 12:01 +0200 на 07.05.2008 (ср), François Degrave написа:
>   
>> Anton Kerezov a écrit :
>> 
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> I finally figured out how to implement the unfocused windows. I actually
>>> did not implement anything it was all there in Compiz-Fusion, a plug-in
>>> called trailfocus. The results were quite good for me and I think that
>>> we made another step up to out target image in the wiki.
>>>
>>> Preview: 
>>> http://img238.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=97606_NewWave_test_05_122_454lo.jpg
>>>
>>> The plug-in though has to be polished a bit but I think right know is
>>> pretty good.
>>>
>>> Any comments?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Anton
>>>   
>> Hi Anton!
>>
>>
>> I tried your theme today. It is great! However, I have some suggestions. 
>> In http://www/~fde/NewWave_suggestions.jpg , I modified the main things 
>> I noticed; I don't know if it is technically possible to implement!
>>
>> 
>
> The url redirects to www.com . Is it correct or I'm doing smth wrong?
>
> When I see the images I could comment on the rest of the email.
>
>   

That's strange... Can you copy/paste the addresses in your browser? I 
know we have some problems with servers here today, so here are two news 
links:

http://img154.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=58872_NewWave_suggestions_122_1120lo.jpg

http://img202.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=59378_NewWaveDetail_122_241lo.jpg

Cheers,

François


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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> Hi
>
> I finally figured out how to implement the unfocused windows. I actually
> did not implement anything it was all there in Compiz-Fusion, a plug-in
> called trailfocus. The results were quite good for me and I think that
> we made another step up to out target image in the wiki.
>
> Preview: 
> http://img238.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=97606_NewWave_test_05_122_454lo.jpg
>
> The plug-in though has to be polished a bit but I think right know is
> pretty good.
>
> Any comments?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Anton
Hi Anton!


I tried your theme today. It is great! However, I have some suggestions. 
In http://www/~fde/NewWave_suggestions.jpg , I modified the main things 
I noticed; I don't know if it is technically possible to implement!

1) The gradient of the windows bar looks quite strange, because it is 
applied only in the inferior half of the bar (the menubar), not on the 
total width. Would it be possible to make it like on the image?

2) The font with a shadow in the bar looks very outdated. I suggest we 
use a font without a shadow. The one you see in this image ("Totem Video 
Player") is Free Sans, without any transformation.

3) I'm not sure about the transparency on the bar of the active window. 
Maybe we should keep it solid.

4) The icons for closing, minimize, etc. are not bad, but I don't like 
the one at the left (in Metacity, this one is the icon of the 
application used. We should keep this). The ones at the right are nice 
but we should -- maybe, not sure -- apply to them a light gradient, to 
make them really "part" of the bar. You can also try other icons (I put 
an example of a simple cross).

5) Could it be possible to make the down corners as round as the top 
ones? Also, could you let me see how it looks without the thin dark gray 
line of the bottom?

6) Still the thing about not active windows... Too bad we cannot make 
the top bar/menu bar really flat, the whole window in the same piece. 
Inactive windows of the current default theme of Ubuntu look a bit like 
that.

7) Don't know if it is possible but it would be great if we could also 
apply a really light gradient on the entire light gray window, like in 
the initial mockup.

8) In the bar -- both windows bar and task bar (particularly the 
taskbar, in fact) --, I'd like to see a light (not too light, though) 
gray internal border. Here is what I mean: 
http://www/~fde/NewWaveDetail.png
But that's really a detail, no? :-)

Ok, that's all for the moment!

I got an answer to my request in Compiz forum:
http://forum.compiz-fusion.org/showthread.php?p=56943#post56943

It seems they are working on a new window manager, but I fear it won't 
be ready soon...

Cheers,

François




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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

Anton Kerezov a écrit :
> В 16:27 +0200 на 05.05.2008 (пн), François Degrave написа:
>
>   
>> Just an idea: do 
>> you think it would be possible to put a shadow only under the active 
>> window? That would make it really different from the others, "on top" of 
>> everything (like when you pick a paper among a big bunch of papers on 
>> your desk, and lift it up to read it).
>> 
>
> I think that at the moment Emerald does not support shadows separation
> for active/inactive windows but as pretty much everything else is
> separated I think we can ask the devs to implement it if possible.

I posted a feature request for that on the compiz-fusion forum. 
Hopefully someone will answer it...

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave

[François Degrave]

> I've made a newer version of New Wave that has darker taskbar and window
> handlers. I've also added a small gradient for the menubars so that they
> look as if they are in the back. Also changed border thickness and color
> esp. for François. To be honest I liked better the old one.
>
> old:
> http://img180.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=33720_NewWave_test_02_122_484lo.jpg
>
> new:
> http://img28.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=88676_NewWave_test_03_122_1054lo.jpg
>
>
>   
>> 2. Why fg/bg[ACTIVE] doesn't work for the menubar? Is it the engine's
>> fault?
>>
>> 
>
> I mean ... can I color the File menu element on the titlebar in gray
> just like the main menu? I think Who can help?
>
> What version of the theme do you like more? The darker with thinner
> borders or the greyish with bigger borders?
>
> Anton
>   
Hi Anton!

Nice work, this new version begins to have a nice look! Just an idea: do 
you think it would be possible to put a shadow only under the active 
window? That would make it really different from the others, "on top" of 
everything (like when you pick a paper among a big bunch of papers on 
your desk, and lift it up to read it).

I don't like the color for the selected element in the menu - a lil' too 
pink for me - but I don't have any other idea yet...

Also, I find the top bar merged with the menubar on inactive windows 
quite classy. Do you think we could give it a try for active windows? 
And then we could try making inactive windows as "neutral" as possible 
-- i.e. like they didn't have any volume -- with the menubar, the topbar 
and the rest of the window all attached together with the same color (a 
bit like on the mockup I made, but with the menubar in addition). To go 
into details, it could also be nice to make the thin line around 
inactive windows a little less black, more gray.

That's all for the moment!

Cheers,

François




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Re: [ubuntu-art] ubuntu-art Digest, Vol 35, Issue 13

[François Degrave]

Nicholas Kraak a écrit :
> NewWave seems to be coming along nicely. However I'm still not sure 
> about the grey against the white, the grey looks lovely by itself but 
> against that white it just feels a little strange. What I do like 
> though is the non-rounded corners, rounded corners are so old now.
>
> Regards,
> -Nicholas
In fact, I do like really slightly rounded corners, not totally sharp. 
On the image I uploaded, the rounding is only 2 pixels. Could it be 
possible to try that?

Also, it would be nice to:
- try windows with no border (only a thin black line, like on the 
screenshot), only the top bar;
- narrow the top bar of windows, which is currently a bit too large 
(to my liking);
- try using something a bit darker, with more contrast in the 
gradient for windows and taskbar  - by the way, is there gradient in the 
taskbar?
- maybe try other fonts? I know that's a bit adventurous, but why not?

I added shadow under the active window on the screenshot. I think that 
could be enough to distinguish them from inactive ones.

I like the gray menu bar in windows, but maybe it would be worth trying 
other things. I'll test that a soon as possible.

Many thanks for your work Anton,
Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Ideas

[François Degrave]

Michael McKinley wrote:
> On Sun, May 4, 2008 at 5:51 AM, José Luis Ricón <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>   
>> IMHO, Intrepid theme should have:
>> 1.Borderless windows
>> 2.Integrated window decorator(MacOSX style/KDE 4)
>> 3. New Wave style menus,they look k00l.
>> 4. A new style of buttons.
>>
>>
>> ;:)
>> 
>
> I'm not a huge fan of *completely* borderless windows.  While it works
> fine when the windows have shadows, on computers that don't support
> Compiz, it can be hard to tell where the windows start and end.  I do
> like the idea of the integrated window decorator.  One thing that I
> would add to your list is monochromatic notification area icons.  It
> looks elegant, and is one of the things that really caught be eye in
> mockups like New Wave and Union.
>
> I'm not exactly sure what you mean by the New Wave-style menus.  If
> you mean that the highlight/selection effect in the menubar blends
> into the menu itself, then I like it too.  Otherwise, could you please
> clarify?
>   
He means that one: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave
which has monochromatic notification area icons!

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] New Wave Theme

[François Degrave]

>
>
> >  Unfortunately I have to admit that I don't have a slightest idea of how
> >  to code a theme but I do know to code in C so I can learn it over time.
> >  Is there a theme we will base New Wave or we will have to make a new
> >  theme engine like clearlooks, murrine and aurora? I think the theme we
> >  are trying to make is very close to clearlooks so we can make a fork
> and
> >  implement our own theme style (the buttons shape & color, the other
> >  widgets).
> >
> >  I would like to ask the ppl from the list if they could help with the
> >  decision on the engine problem (esp. Troy, and Who).
> >
>
> Well, I would say a few things first:
> The energy that is required to generate a new theme engine is pretty
> high. Before you start I would be sure that the style you are aiming
> for is not available from one of the newer engines (esp. Murrine -
> which is very configurable and also supports transparency as that
> theme requires).
> Before doing ANY work on a new style like that, get some more design
> done - the single image isn't really enough to know how the theme is
> going to hold together, what is going to make it *work* as a theme.
> This sort of area is where Troy's advice is great, and there are
> certainly many others on the list more able to comment on design
> theory than me!
>
> Techincally, it looks like you could get a lot of what you want with
> Murrine and a custom metacity. If you know a lot of C and have some
> time to get to grips with a theme engine, tweaking it as you like
> should be possible: but like I say - be sure you know where you're
> going... Get  a .gtkrc that gets a theme engine as close as possible
> to your desired look before you start hacking. Then do some review of
> the design before you go too far: is it usable? Does it feel nice to
> use? Etc. Then you can move forward into making the engine do a bit
> more.
>
> On the other hand, braver people than I would use the pixbuff engine:
> It allows you to define all the elements of a theme with images.
> Performance isn't crazy-good, but it isn't crazy-bad either. To my
> knowledge, pixbuf isn't doing alpha yet (on the other hand - you could
> well find during your usability testing that alpha isn't the way you
> really want to take things.). With pixbuff the key is to look at an
> existing theme, and build your one from there.
>
> As far as usability testing goes, pixbuf can be a good way to beta
> test styles: A single GTKRC can use multiple engines (this isn't
> advisable in a final theme, as you take a memory hit...) so if, for
> example, clearlooks did everything except the scrollbars the way you
> wanted you could test JUST the scrollbars using images and the pixbuff
> engine, using clearlooks for all else. Then, if you really like it,
> patch clearlooks to get what you want. If your code is good and your
> change is optional, you might be able to get your code upstream to be
> able to avoid having to maintain a branch...
>
> That's a bit of a theming braindump - hope it makes sense.
>
> You can use gtkperf to benchmark themes (in a fairly basic way)
>
> Happy design.
> Who
>
>
Hi!

Maybe that's a good theme to start from:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/ComicGel

It is not that far from that:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave

It has no glow, it uses transparency... I think there are not so many things
to change to get it done: first of all the taskbars, their buttons, icons
and menus (that will be the most difficult part I guess), then make the
windows less rounded, changes theirs buttons and colors (find a way of
removing the border on unselected ones). Its icons are really not bad, we
should try them, and also try making them gray/black like on the last
screenshot (
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=ubuntu_intrepidDARK.png
).

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New page on the Wiki

[François Degrave]

2008/5/3 Hylke Bons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

>
> I don't like the black very much (why do we need to follow Windows in
> everything? first the gloss, now the Vistaish black, even the gradient
> is almost the same).
>
> However, I LOVE the wallpaper, it gives the feeling of freedom to me and
> that's what Linux is all about! :)
> Do you have larger sizes around?
>
> Maybe we can make more variations of it, with different landscapes and
> colors that are installed by default.
>
> Hylke
>
>
Hi Hylke,

I didn't do this thing with Vista in mind at all. I just thought about the
orange/black palette that was requested for Hardy - and that's still the
case for Intrepid, I think. The gradient is more apple-like than Vistaish
(it has not this "shiny" glass effect), but in black. Please just keep in
mind that those elements should be, IMO, color neutral, i.e. gray (light or
dark, see OSX Tiger and Leopard) or black. Making a shiny orange taskbar
would just make us all blind - and another color combined with the Ubuntu
orange would just make us puke all around our desk.

The wallpaper is this one: http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/33466586/
Many other (good) vector wallpapers can be found here:
http://news.deviantart.com/article/28138/
However, I didn't find it in a higher resolution. You should ask the author
- by the way, if its response is positive, I'm interested too. Also, if you
want to submit this image for the next release, you should inform yourself
about the license it uses, and maybe ask the author to choose one which
would allow us to redistribute it.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] New page on the Wiki

[François Degrave]

2008/5/3 Anton Kerezov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> В 18:40 +0200 на 03.05.2008 (сб), François Degrave написа:
> > Hi everyone!
> >
> > I created a new page on the wiki with a mockup representing what I'd
> > like Ubuntu to look like in the (near) future:
> > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave
> >
> > Enjoy!
> >
> > François
>
> Hi there,
>
> I do enjoy the theme very much and would like to join your theme team -
> New Wave.
>
> Best regards,
> Anton
>
>
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>

Hi Anton!

Thank you for your interest. Unfortunately, my skills for theme creation are
really limited - in fact, I never created one, and I'm only able to make
pretty images like the one you have seen. However, feel free to create and
lead a new theme team if you feel like it. Of course, I would be happy to
help in anything you need  - as long as it is not beyond my competence!

Cheers,

François
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[ubuntu-art] New page on the Wiki

[François Degrave]

Hi everyone!

I created a new page on the wiki with a mockup representing what I'd like
Ubuntu to look like in the (near) future:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave

Enjoy!

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] ubuntu-art Digest, Vol 35, Issue 6

[François Degrave]

2008/5/3 Nicholas Kraak <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Who cares about top posting? Why don't we get back to work.* :)
> *
> Has anyone come up with anything yet? I thought the discovery theme posted
> yesterday was absolutely brilliant.
>
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>
>
Hi!

I made this mockup today:
http://www.info.fundp.ac.be/~fde/ubuntu_intrepid.jpg

It is not complete, and I'm not sure if the icons are the best choice, but
this is pretty close to what I'd like Ubuntu to look like, especially the
taskbars.

And most of all, I would like the next Ubuntu to avoid using a UGLY GLASSY
EFFECT on everything. That looks already old! The water effect was cool 5 or
6 years ago, but now it is time to move on.

Cheers,

François
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Re: [ubuntu-art] Random Thoughts on Mail Burst

[François Degrave]

>> I thought it was said during the Hardy process that the Intrepid theme would
>> be worked on from Hardy to Intrepid (as Hardy theme has not changed a
>> lot)... So why don't we continue the work instead of forgetting everything
>> that has be done every 6 months ? There have been some wonderful mockups
>> proposed, we should work on them !
>> Some good concepts :
>>
>>- Gelatin
>>
>>
>> 
>>- Dark mockup
>>
>>- Günther Beyer's work :
>> hereand
>>
>> here
>>- Too human
>>
>> 
>>- 2D panel icons : this
>> threadand
>> this
>>
>> one(where
>> are the "2D icons in launchpad" ?)
>>- BasicIdeals
>> !
>>- 
>> Union!!
>>
>> What do you think ?
>> 
I think most of those ideas are heavy, and many things that should be 
color-neutral aren't. The only concept which could be used to start from 
is the "Gelatin" one, even if it should be slightly modified to match a 
black and orange palette IMO, like in the "Element" mockup: 
http://lassekongo83.deviantart.com/art/Elements-VS-82691770

As Sumit said, we should keep main theme elements such as 
dialogue/application backgrounds, menubars, and possibly titlebars 
color-neutral, but give scrollbars and buttons strong colors (Ubuntu 
colors? Orange?) so that they visually stand-out.




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Re: [ubuntu-art] STOP TOP POSTING!!!

[François Degrave]

Cory K. a écrit :
> François Degrave wrote:
>   
>> Top posting or down posting is a question that arises only when we 
>> misuse the tools we have; in that case, we use a *MAILING LIST* for 
>> something that requires a *FORUM*.
>>   
>> 
>
> I don't agree a forum is needed. Like you said. Don't misuse the tools.
> A forum is adding yet another place for people to follow. I personally
> won't make the effort. ML, IRC and wiki are enough.
>
> -Cory \m/
What I'd like is *to replace *this mailing list by a forum. In fact we 
use this list the same way we would use a forum: we have discussions, we 
propose ideas (which are often images). And many of us complain about 
the fact that we lose track of hundreds of ideas because *once a mail is 
read, it's forgotten by the majority*.

A forum is just more adapted for what we try to do.

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Re: [ubuntu-art] STOP TOP POSTING!!!

[François Degrave]

Cory K. a écrit :
> Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
>   
>> 2008/4/30 Cory K. <[EMAIL PROTECTED] >:
>>
>> Álvaro Medina Ballester wrote:
>> > 2008/4/30 saltedlight <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> 
>> > >>:
>> >
>> > ARE YOU ALL BLIND OR WHAT??? OR ARE YOU STUPID???
>> > IF YOU ARE NOT THEN
>> >
>> > STOP TOP POSTING!!!
>> >
>> > IS THIS SUCH A HARD THING TO DO???
>> >
>> > STOP TOP POSTING!!!
>> >
>> > I REALY DON'T CARE WHAT EMAIL CLIENT YOU USE; JUST DO WHAT
>> YOU HAVE TO
>> > DO TO POST AT THE BOTTOM OF THE MESSAGE!!!
>> >
>> > STOP TOP POSTING!!!
>> >
>> > --
>> > Sorin-Mihai Vârgolici
>> > 
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct
>>
>> Oh please. Don't go trying to invoke the toothless COC where you're
>> being just as rude by continuing to ignore the requests of the
>> majority
>> of the list.
>>
>> -Cory \m/
>>
>>
>> I think that this is because english is not my language, I still don't
>> know what does "top posting" means. I do always the same I did to
>> post, reply at gmail or from Apple Mail.
>>
>> You should consider that if I've always posted this way I don't know
>> if I'm doing something bad, so this is the reason why I haven't asked
>> anybody what "top posting" means. Now it seems that I'm doing that, so
>> please explain what it means.
>>
>> Anyway, I don't think that I should be stupid for that.
>> -- 
>> Álvaro. 
>> 
>
> Don't reply with your post above someone elses.
>
> Best example is:
>
> A: Top-posting.
> Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail?
>
> -Cory \m/
>
> PS: I'm moving your text when I reply.
>
>   

Top posting or down posting is a question that arises only when we 
misuse the tools we have; in that case, we use a *MAILING LIST* for 
something that requires a *FORUM*.

Therefore, if God and the Angels of the Paradise can hear me pray, 
please someone set up a forum where discussions could be easily read and 
ideas easily tracked. Amen.







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Re: [ubuntu-art] Intrepid Ibex

[François Degrave]

Hi Anton,


I think you are right from A to Z, and I also think that most of those 
problems could be solved if we used adapted tools to track new ideas, 
requests, new creations, etc. like a forum and a blueprints page.

For now, we should just pick a general goal which looks promising and 
work all together on this only goal. It's the only way of doing things 
if we hope making ambitious things for Ibex.

This "Human Elements" package of themes - see 
http://www.mail-archive.com/ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com/msg05412.html - 
is a extremely good starting point in my opinion, possibly coupled with 
auto-updating  svg wallpapers -  see 
http://www.mail-archive.com/ubuntu-art@lists.ubuntu.com/msg05429.html


Cheers,

François


> Hello Pitr, everybody.
>
> You certainly can upload stuff but I think almost all of us can do that
> (no offence Pitr). The real problem is that we do not have a goal. No
> one is telling: "We have to make a new Ubuntu theme ... It should
> have ... It is not advisable the following ..." and so on. In fact I've
> been reading this mailing list from Ubuntu 7.04 till now and nothing new
> really happened. Just ideas, mockups, new ideas ... Now they are all
> buried on some hard to find place and we are starting to reinvent the
> wheel again, unfortunately. 
>
> But the hope dies last, you know. I hope that we will really have some
> progress this year because the LTS is released and now we have more room
> for experiments that before. So let's do it :)
>
> Best regards, 
> Anton
>
>
> В 10:03 -0400 на 28.04.2008 (пн), Pitr T. написа:
>   
>>  Good morning, all.
>>  
>>  I'm a bit new to this, but I'd like to help with the art projects in
>> any way I can. I do some graphic design, but so far nothing
>> professional. The Ubuntu desktops have been quite calming and, of
>> course, Human, but there aren't many variations of them. At least
>> not on the base installation.
>>  
>>  I think that more official background designs would be interesting
>> for another release; maybe patterns from nature, like the classic
>> Windows clouds, or incorporating photographs of animals. I know it's
>> easy to add new ones as a user, but if there were more which fit the
>> 'human' theme, and more customization, I think that quite a few other
>> people would make the switch to Ubuntu. 
>>  
>>  François Degrave's Elements design intrigues me. The Greek Elements
>> incorporated into Ubuntu would make for quite an interesting
>> design. Anton Kerezov's idea for a transparent background is also
>> quite interesting, but I personally would use PNG
>> transparencies. I think that the two soft lines used in the beige
>> background of Breezy Badger could make for a good overlay on other
>> colors as well, but other transparencies would also be good.
>>  
>>  I have recently been working on alternate theme packages for other
>> non-linux operating systems, including Mac and Windows 98. They aren't
>> appropriate for Ubuntu, (i. e. "Emo", which was done for a friend of
>> mine), but I think that some alternate Computer and Home Folder icons
>> from my archives could match Ubuntu's themes well. I could upload some
>> sets of .png icons if anybody is interested in working on icons.
>> 
>
>
>   


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Re: [ubuntu-art] Wiki - argument mapping

[François Degrave]

Don't you think a blueprints page (possibly coupled with a corresponding
forum) would be particularly adapted for those kind of things?

2008/4/25 Sumit Agarwal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Just saw this MIT Center for Collective Intelligence tutorial on
> 'argument mapping'. Could be *very* helpful in the Ubuntu wiki for
> moving ahead on new designs, issues, and solutions. This certainly isn't
> just applicable for the art team, but we could test the technique and
> hopefully prove it for use in a larger context.
> Here's the video:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2w2WBCn7ug
> The concept is fairly simple and common-sense, but good. The basic idea
> is that discussion should be structured according to *type* and
> *content* of post, rather than by time. Post type:
> -Issue
> -Idea (a way to resolve an issue)
> -Pro (advantage of an idea)
> -Con (disadvantage of an idea)
>
> Each issue may have multiple ideas. Each idea may have its own issues.
> Ideas may have pro's and con's, but issues may not.
>
> -Sumit
>
> P.S. I think this might help us focus on solving *issues* rather than
> generating a list of different ideas that we think are cool but aren't
> necessarily addressing any problems with Ubuntu. We can still have all
> those same ideas, but now at least we'll be able to place them alongside
> like ideas that are directed at the same issue (and maybe we'll realize
> that these ideas address issues we didn't even think of!)
>
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Re: [ubuntu-art] Itrepid theme inspiration ?

[François Degrave]

That sounds extremely good to me! Let's give that idea a try, I think 
none of the Ubuntu users will regret it.

>
> The visual style I have mentioned is called 'Elements' and it has 4 
> variations - Fire (the one you can see in the link), Water, Air and 
> Earth.
>
> Fire - Orange, the default visual style
> Water - Blue
> Air - Grey
> Earth - Green
>
> We have Human Looks now. Imagine from Intrepid, we call our theme 
> "Human Elements". From the different themes I have seen based on 
> Murrine and Clearlooks, this appears possible.
>


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Re: [ubuntu-art] Itrepid theme inspiration ?

[François Degrave]

Hi,

I think nobody will blame you for using this screenshot which is, in my 
humble opinion, a really good example of how the black/orange theme for 
the next cycle should look like.

It reminds me of this one:
http://mossblaser.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-8-04-GUI-Design-Idea-72574609
but even better.

I also take advantage of this mail to repeat my opinion, which is that 
such a theme would be particularly nice if the colors of
controls/windows/system icons were parametrisable (see
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-art/2008-February/005171.html).

Cheers,

François

Bharat Varma wrote :
> Hi, 
>
> I am only an end-user of Ubuntu and I know squat about UI / UI 
> guidelines or even how to present what I have in mind using Gimp etc. 
> Could never understand how to use Gimp either :)
>
> But I would like to draw attention to a visual style I have 
> encountered for Windows. I have used this myself (love it !!!) and I 
> believe this visual style is close to what the original hardy 
> guidelines suggested 
> in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/HardyDesign
>
> http://lassekongo83.deviantart.com/art/Elements-VS-82691770
>
> If there is anyone who can take a look at the visual style above, it 
> would be great.
>
> I didn't know if it was okay to put screenshots of a Windows OS in the 
> /alternate link on ubuntu site. If it is, I will take permission from 
> the author and do that. If it is okay to include those screenshots as 
> attachments to this mailing list, I can do that too.
>
> Bharat Varma
> -- 
> d-_-b 


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Re: [ubuntu-art] Compiz desktop switcher color

[François Degrave]

I mean like this: http://www.info.fundp.ac.be/~fde/resize_white.png

François Degrave wrote :
> That's right. If that's not possible, maybe those colors should simply 
> be white or gray - it would fit any theme.
>
> Matthew McGowan a écrit :
>   
>> Piotr Zaryk wrote:
>>   
>> 
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I noticed that the compiz desktop switcher (the one that appears in 
>>> the middle of the screen while switching desktops) has a lightblue 
>>> colour both in Gutsy and Hardy. I think it should be filled with 
>>> #EFEBE7 to suit Ubuntu default theme. It shouldn't be too difficult. 
>>> What do yo think?
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Regards,
>>> Zaryk 
>>> 
>>>   
>> Ideally, shouldn't compiz select these colours based on the current 
>> theme in use?
>>
>> Regards
>> Matthew
>>
>>   
>> 
>
>
>   


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Re: [ubuntu-art] Compiz desktop switcher color

[François Degrave]

That's right. If that's not possible, maybe those colors should simply 
be white or gray - it would fit any theme.

Matthew McGowan a écrit :
> Piotr Zaryk wrote:
>   
>> Hello,
>>
>> I noticed that the compiz desktop switcher (the one that appears in 
>> the middle of the screen while switching desktops) has a lightblue 
>> colour both in Gutsy and Hardy. I think it should be filled with 
>> #EFEBE7 to suit Ubuntu default theme. It shouldn't be too difficult. 
>> What do yo think?
>>
>> -- 
>> Regards,
>> Zaryk 
>> 
>
> Ideally, shouldn't compiz select these colours based on the current 
> theme in use?
>
> Regards
> Matthew
>
>   


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Re: [ubuntu-art] A simple, elegant theme using existing OSS themes and CC artwork, achievable by the User Interface Freeze

[François Degrave]

Hi!
Ok, you're right: it seems easy to achieve, it is not new, and obviously 
not revolutionary, to such a point that it just looks really old, even 
more than the current theme. I'd rather go for a new fresh and modern theme.

Cheers,

François

Mike McCana wrote:
> Rather than create an all new, revolutionary theme, I promise combining an
> appropriate existing icon theme, engine, and creative commons licensed
> artwork.
>
> See:
>
> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Hardy/Alternate/Tango,_Flow,_and_Glossy
>
> Mike

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Re: [ubuntu-art] Black and orange theme

[François Degrave]

Hi everyone!

I found an interesting black/orange theme (even if here it is a little 
too red), which has the great advantage to leave the text zones in light 
colors. This one would be particularly nice if the colors of 
controls/windows/system icons were parametrisable (see 
https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-art/2008-February/005171.html).

Here is the mockup : 
http://mossblaser.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-8-04-GUI-Design-Idea-72574609

Unfortunately, I haven't managed to contact the author yet.

Cheers,

François

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Re: [ubuntu-art] hardy artwork

[François Degrave]

I really like this wallpaper too : modern, clean,... everything we could 
expect from a wallpaper! I think it would be nice if the login screen 
shared the same colors as the wallpaper, or even the same design.

I quickly made a really rough mockup of it : 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Hardy/Alternate/Fela_Kuti_Login

Cheers,

François

Dylan McCall a écrit :
> Going by the page's revision history, we can see that the Wiki page's 
> author (and I would bet the talented artist here) is "nothlit".
>
> https://launchpad.net/~nothlit 
>
> Bye,
> -Dylan McCall
>
> On Sat, Feb 2, 2008 at 9:42 AM, Sumit Chandra Agarwal 
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> > wrote:
>
> I really love everything about it. No other wallpaper quite says
> "Ubuntu
> is different" from Mac and Vista like this image does. Its
> gender-neutral, hip, and there's a certain wonderful whimsical
> forward-looking emotion captured in that upturned face.
> If Hardy does adopt this, and it is successful, it could also set a
> blueprint for future wallpapers as stylized paintings (with the
> stylization gradually changing to match current cultural styles)
> of the
> release-name-animal.
>
> I hope I'm not getting too excited here,
> -Sumit
> P.S. I wish we knew who the artist was so we could get them on the
> list!
>
> Sav vas wrote:
> > I love it (Fela Kuti). This could very much be the hip wallpaper of
> > hardy, to get away from those "default lines" in the background :)
> >
> >
>
>
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[ubuntu-art] hardy artwork

[François Degrave]

>
> Hi all,
>
> This mail attempts to clear up some issues in the art direction for Hardy 
> Ubuntu. As already stated we will not be changing things radically. Here are 
> some of the things I would like to see changed and some possible ideas for 
> them.
>
> 1) Wallpaper: Ideally dark and mysterious yet modern, clear and clean
> a) It should use the palette (in a previous post, email me if you missed 
> it)
Hi,

For the wallpaper, you should check this one : 
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Hardy/Alternate/Autumn_Reflections_Wallpaper?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=autumnreflectionsHD.jpg

It looks really clean and modern, and it matches the palette.

Cheers,

fde

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[ubuntu-art] Parametrisable colors for window borders, system icons and controls

[François Degrave]

Hi everyone,

I think a new theme which would provide Ubuntu a fresher look would be 
really useful. However, orange - and brown - are not always the colors 
people prefer, and even if it was the case, most people like to change 
the look of the system after a while.

I would suggest the whole theme should be parametrisable. The user 
should be able to choose (within 3 clicks...) not only the color of the 
window borders, but also the color of the system icons and controls.

For the moment, the problem is that in order to change the look of the 
system, the user has to choose another theme than Human (which is the 
most clean one, but not parametrisable), and then search the internet 
for icon themes that would match his desires, when parametrisable colors 
for windows, system icons and controls would make that task easy as can be.

Cheers,

François

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